


RFID Cards to Include Tin Foil Hats? 248
An anonymous reader writes "The tinfoil hat finally gains government approval. From the story: 'Wrap an RFID chip [of the US passport] inside a Faraday cage, and the electromagnetic waves from the chip reader can't get in and activate the chip. The State Department says it may use the principle to give travelers an added sense of security. No, there won't be rolls of aluminum foil included with every passport. Instead, the passport cover may include a network of wires woven into the fabric. Fold the passport shut, and there's your Faraday cage. Even Schneier agrees that a properly shielded passport cover should solve the problem. He wonders why this wasn't included in the original plans for the new passports. 'It took a bunch of criticism before they even mentioned it,' Schneier said. And he hopes the anti-snooping technology is thoroughly tested before the new passports are introduced next spring.'" We've also seen this suggested in the past.
Wow.... (Score:5, Funny)
Wow.
Re:Wow.... (Score:3, Funny)
Hell doesn't freeze over.... (Score:2)
Re:Wow.... (Score:2)
Re:Wow.... (Score:3, Insightful)
Let me get this straight... (Score:4, Funny)
Re:Let me get this straight... (Score:5, Informative)
Re:Let me get this straight... (Score:3, Informative)
Re:Let me get this straight... (Score:2)
from the site:
Actual garment has left breast pocket with interior pen-tab.
Somehow I don't think a shirt with built in pocket protector thingy would look quite as stylish (not that it doesn't already look like something from JC Penny or Montgomery Wards).
And where do I click to get a picture of "Jim" without a shirt?
this is the internet. finding shirtless "J
Oh Man. (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Oh Man. (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Oh Man. (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Oh Man. (Score:3, Funny)
These wires in the Passports are made of the same material that they use as inpurities in Tin Foil, because it increases the signal of brain-control and person-tracking beams.
Re:Oh Man. (Score:3, Funny)
Density of metallic fibres required to block RFID (Score:3, Funny)
Re:Density of metallic fibres required to block RF (Score:5, Interesting)
The frequencies [hightechaid.com] used by RFID at the most are 5.8GHz. That equates to about
In my book, that means about, oh, two strands per inch.
Re:Density of metallic fibres required to block RF (Score:3, Funny)
Modifying the cover of your passport already?
Re:Density of metallic fibres required to block RF (Score:2, Informative)
RFID is usually at 13.56 MHz, although they can operate in several different bands.
I can assure you that ALL shielding has only "so much" effectiveness. Since Schneier is not an RF geek, he may not know this.
Any wire mesh the gummint puts in will NOT prevent reading at quite a distance with the proper equipment.
How about lead-plates? (Score:2)
It may make your passport fairly heavy but I seem to remember that encasing something in thick lead tends to shield it from radiation of various sorts.
Any use here?
Some useful advice (Score:5, Funny)
In addition, if you fashion two antennas on the top of your hat instead of the usual one, it increases the effectiveness by an additional 37 percent.
(+5 Misinformative)
Just remember though... (Score:3, Funny)
Re: Some useful advice (Score:3, Funny)
Re: Some useful advice (Score:2)
Wasn't that Freud's Law?
Re:Moderators please, DO YOUR JOB (Score:3, Funny)
Re:Moderators please, DO YOUR JOB (Score:2)
I apologize for that age related barb. You are correct, that was excessive.
I note from your response, that you seems to be mistaking my post for someone else's. I have never repled to one of your posts before. Please note that ANYONE can reply to a post as "Anonymous Coward." You can too.
Please relax. Do not take the vitriolic slashdot posts personally - they truly are not. Judging by your fairly high UID, your account is relatively new. I assume that you are younger than the ave
Stocks ... (Score:5, Funny)
I call BS (Score:2)
This guy is an imposter. He is no more Brit than I am.
Still too invasive (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Still too invasive (Score:2)
Re:Still too invasive (Score:2)
Re:Still too invasive (Score:5, Interesting)
This isn't a trivial concern. People with dual citizenship are at risk in some countries. If you're a citizen of country X leaving country X, you may not want the security people to know that you're carrying a US passport. You may have no choice but to carry it, but making it metallic practically guarantees that you'll have to show it to security. Of course the same thing applies if other countries use RFID tags with metallic shielding.
Re:Still too invasive (Score:3, Informative)
Re:Still too invasive (Score:2)
In fact, this is one of the first travel tips you'll read in any Frommer's guide.
Re:Still too invasive (Score:2)
RFID in passports is a dangerous idea anyway (Score:5, Informative)
Re:RFID in passports is a dangerous idea anyway (Score:3, Insightful)
A standard PDF417 barcode contains about 1kB of data in 35 x 9mm. That's 315mm^2. My passport has a useful printable area of roughly 9600mm^2. That means that a single passport-page-sized 2D barcode could hold roughly 30kB.
Of course, anyone can print barcodes. But then, relying on the inaccessibility of RFID programming and reading equipment is security through obscurity at its worst.
Some technology clarifications (Score:2)
It may take some time for RFID readers and writers to be commercially available, but it will happen, just as anyone today can buy magnetic card equipment.
First, these aren't RFIDs, they're contactless smart cards (the difference is one of degree, not type, but important nonethelesss). And contactless smart card reader/writers are already commercially available, and cost between $70 and $200.
However, the chips are not just passive data stores, like a magnetic stripe or a barcode, they're microprocessor
Risk assessment despite technology clarifications (Score:2)
Re:Still too invasive (Score:2, Interesting)
Metal detectors don't like non-ferrous metals.
Re:Still too invasive (Score:2)
Does the US Govt assume that every other govt will always be friendly to US citizens?
Does this make sense when about half the world seriously hates the US right now?
Re:Still too invasive (Score:4, Funny)
Re:Still too invasive (Score:2)
As much as a love living in America, we do have more stupid, fat, annoying, loud, conformist retards than any other landmass in the world. Sad.
Re:Still too invasive (Score:2)
Re:Still too invasive (Score:2, Interesting)
Re:Still too invasive (Score:2)
I'm not exactly sure what you're talking about. At least in the US airports I've been to, they've never, ever looked inside my wallet except for the x-ray, which pretty much reveals a chunk of metal. That is, I don't hold on to my wallet when I go throug the detectors beause I'm not supposed to. Also I figured out that if I don't set off any alarms the first time (take off those shoes) they won't bother me at all on the other side
Re:Still too invasive (Score:2)
Actually tinfoil is not such a big issue. My wallet is lin
Re:Still too invasive (Score:2)
Mu metal is the shielding of choice (Score:2, Interesting)
Re:Mu metal is the shielding of choice (Score:4, Insightful)
You're not trying to stop a static magnetic field (there's no need) -- you're trying to stop a electromagnetic wave, and stopping either part of it (electric or magnetic) will do it.
Re:Mu metal is the shielding of choice (Score:2)
That's a little bit hard to find. What about metal from Atlantis, hyperborea or Lemuria?
WTF is mu metal?
Re:Mu metal is the shielding of choice (Score:2, Informative)
Mumetal
[f. mu (l being conventionally used to denote permeability) + metal n. (and a.).]
The proprietary name of an alloy of iron that contains approximately 75 to 78 per cent nickel, 4 to 6 per cent copper, and 1 1/2 to 2 per cent chromium by weight and is a useful material for transformer cores and magnetic shields because of its high permeability...
First cited use: 1924 Trade Marks Jrnl. 16 Apr. 858 Mumetal. Metallic alloys, unwrought or partly
How to kill a biometric spy chip (Score:3, Informative)
Re:How to kill a biometric spy chip (Score:2)
Re:Microwave it (Score:2)
Call me suspicious... (Score:3, Interesting)
Make my tinfoil hat a beanie with a propellor, please. Or maybe a fedora...
Re:Call me suspicious... (Score:2)
Orbital Mind Control Lasers (Score:5, Funny)
I for one welcome our new RFID overlords.
wait a minute... (Score:2)
Re:wait a minute... (Score:2)
Sorry, THEY made me say it!!! Get Help! Ge...
Please, disregard the previous statement. Move along. There is no such thing as MK-Ultra. Forget I said anything. It's nothing.
Really.
So... (Score:4, Interesting)
Re:So... (Score:2)
Um, this is the job of the government? Get a pouch and wear it around your neck.
Re:So... (Score:2)
Re:So... (Score:2)
That is the most... werid... non-argument against RFID I've ever seen. How is RFID facilitating this? Theives can do this with current passports. The statement about the sense of security lies in the screening/authentication of people - NOT in the physical security of the passport.
And I have never had to present ID for boarding the plane - just slide the e-ticket in the reade
Re:So... (Score:2)
Re:So... (Score:2)
Passports already contain enough information to present a problem if stolen. Adding biometrics may increase the damage that can be done if the passport is stolen, but this is true however the biometric inforamtion is encoded.
As far as using strong encryption on the
Big Brother is Watching (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Big Brother is Watching (Score:2)
You're paranoid.
I don't think the government has any interest in tracking people. And I don't say that because I think the government wants to do no wrong, but that this doesn't seem to be a requirement of any evil plans. I don't think a part of the Bush agenda includes tracking some slashdotter around. Bush has been reelected and I think all he wants to do now is make people feel safe and secure in his presidency. Remember, he's got to pass the torch to somebody on his way out.
Re:Big Brother is Watching (Score:2)
Ok, you don't live in the UK but this is exactly [guardian.co.uk] what you are saying they aren't thinking about.
They also want to bring in ID cards in the UK.. and then people wonder why were a little paranoid.
Other things they have done in the last couple of years include,
Detailing someone for an unlimited period without charge.
Removal of the right to trail by jury so some crimes.
Removal of the double jeopardy rule, where you can't be tried twice for the same crime.
B
Re:Big Brother is Watching (Score:2)
And I don't think it's up to governments to sort out the problems. The people should get their shit together and solve their own problems. The government should just make sure the laws in place to protect them are enforced.
1/2 solved? (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:1/2 solved? (Score:2)
fingerprints, as well as your retinal scan
(and perhaps even your DNA sequence) MIGHT
just be a good thing. Both illegal immigration
AND identity theft have gone up since 9-11-2001.
Every billion dollars that the government
wastes on a totally non-functional anti-ballistic
missile defense system is a billion dollars not
spent on improved border, seaport, and air cargo
security. (You don't really think that the crazy
lunatic running North Korea will launch 1 or 2
of his 8 bal
Re:1/2 solved? (Score:3, Insightful)
parent comment is part of the problem that
was expressed by Bush/Ashcroft/Tenet/Ridge --
"not a matter of IF there will be another
terrorist attack on USA soil, but of WHEN".
Let me just first say that I have absolutly no sympathy for the current US administration. Now that that's out of the way, the above statement is one of the few accurate truths coming out of this administration. If you believe otherwise, i.e. that there is a way to prevent all terrorist attacks
Re:1/2 solved? (Score:3, Insightful)
Name one illegal alien who has ever committed a terrorist act in the US.
"not a matter of IF there will be another terrorist attack on USA soil, but of WHEN"
True, but statistically irrelevant to your safety. Which of the following has killed more people in the US in the last five years:
a) Terrorism
b) Traffic accidents involving ice cream trucks?
Re:1/2 solved? (Score:3, Informative)
There was a case several years ago regarding
an illegal alien who had a habit of riding
freight trains all over the USA. Granted that
he is not a terrorist, but he is a psychopathic
serial murderer. He killed more US citizens
from California to Florida than the infamous
Metro DC sniper team. Many times he was
caught for vagrancy or petty crimes; sometimes
he was detained by INS and then deported. But
he kept crossing the border and committing these
murders because the proceeds made for easy
livin
Re:1/2 solved? (Score:2)
Re:1/2 solved? (Score:2)
Fatal flaw... (Score:4, Funny)
A flaw or a feature? (Score:2)
Really weird how one could choose to adopt this kind of technology (especially as -unlike a bar code- it is creating other risks for the holder) in the first place, under these circumstances...
So why have them? (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:So why have them? (Score:2)
What!? (Score:3, Insightful)
Note that NOT using RFID is not what they propose. It is really impressive to see how far they are willing to go in order to justify pushing corporate interest despite its lack of use. There is plenty of technological solutions that can do the job, they have to insist on the one that won't...
Why does it need to be RFID in the first place? (Score:3, Interesting)
Yeah...it's been suggested in the past alright... (Score:2)
And for the record, I am STILL enjoying the fearmongering groupthink very much, thanks.
hacks (Score:4, Funny)
Why not a bar code? (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:Why not a bar code? (Score:3, Informative)
Re:Why not a bar code? (Score:3, Insightful)
I disagree. 2-D barcodes can very easily be used to store information, rather than just a key to some seperate database. At a past employer, most parts had a 2-D barcode which, besides for encoding the serial number (i.e. key to an external database), encoded important part parameters. Often, these parts were sold in matched sets. Encoding the data on the part allowed the customer to choose a replacement part with the correct par
Re:Why not a bar code? (Score:2)
Misdirection? (Score:2, Interesting)
antennae (Score:2, Funny)
Two Problems (Score:3, Interesting)
2) Even with a Faraday cover, you will still need to take your passport out and open it. The would-be data thieves will simply hang around those places...airport check-ins, Immigration desks, hotels...etc
Still Not Secure (Score:5, Interesting)
American pulls out passport.
RFID snoopers who hang out nearby restaurant frequented by foreign tourists scoop up yet another id.
The best solution is to eliminate the stupid idea that you can send and receive vital information wirelessly.
However, baring that, somehow preventing the RFID from working unless you do something explicit to make it work should be sufficient. For example, the RFID chip won't send personally identifiying information unless it has a low voltage electrical contact that you can make by pressing a specifically marked spot in the passport marked "press here to activate wireless identification".
Use 2-D barcodes (Score:2)
My gut is tellimg me that the RFID manufacturers are lobbying the politicians. The malicious behavior is on the part of the RFID manufacturers who are desperate t
This is only part of a larger problem. (Score:3, Interesting)
So protect yourself for 10 years (Score:2)
By then, it might have been successfully fought, or there could be good tested workarounds to the problems.
Re:Writing RFID tags? (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Writing RFID tags? (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:disabling RFID chips (Score:2, Informative)
1. Some RFID chips (such as EPCglobal Gen2 [impinj.com] tags) have a kill password that can be issued to command erasure of the entire PROM, or otherwise totally disable the tag. Gen2 tags have a 32-bit kill password.
2. Virtually all RFID chips can be killed by subjecting them to strong RF radiation. This will induce a lethal voltage and blow out the internal circuitry. Some existing EAS systems [howstuffworks.com] use this technique to disable their tags.
Re:What exactly is Faraday cage? (Score:5, Funny)
Later, of course, Faraday discovered that the cage prevented electromagnetic waves with wavelengths greater than a quarter of the mesh size from escaping, and it is in this form that it has entered technical terminology.
This information brought to you by the Department for the Dissemination of Less than Reliable Data.
Re:Faraday probably didn't have much luck in love (Score:2)