Russia Says Its Businesses Can Steal Patents From Anyone In 'Unfriendly' Countries (washingtonpost.com) 256
Russia has effectively legalized patent theft from anyone affiliated with countries "unfriendly" to it, declaring that unauthorized use will not be compensated. The Washington Post reports: The decree, issued this week, illustrates the economic war waged around Russia's invasion of Ukraine, as the West levies sanctions and pulls away from Russia's huge oil and gas industry. Russian officials have also raised the possibility of lifting restrictions on some trademarks, according to state media, which could allow continued use of brands such as McDonald's that are withdrawing from Russia in droves. The effect of losing patent protections will vary by company, experts say, depending on whether they have a valuable patent in Russia. The U.S. government has long warned of intellectual property rights violations in the country; last year Russia was among nine nations on a "priority watch list" for alleged failures to protect intellectual property. Now Russian entities could not be sued for damages if they use certain patents without permission.
The patent decree and any further lifting of intellectual property protections could affect Western investment in Russia well beyond any de-escalation of the war in Ukraine, said Josh Gerben, an intellectual property lawyer in Washington. Firms that already saw risks in Russian business would have more reason to worry. "It's just another example of how [Putin] has forever changed the relationship that Russia will have with the world," Gerben said. Russia's decree removes protections for patent holders who are registered in hostile countries, do business in them or hold their nationality.
The Kremlin has not issued any decree lifting protections on trademarks. But Russia's Ministry of Economic Development said last week that authorities are considering "removing restrictions on the use of intellectual property contained in certain goods whose supply to Russia is restricted," according to Russian state news outlet Tass, and that potential measures could affect inventions, computer programs and trademarks. The ministry said the measures would "mitigate the impact on the market of supply chain breaks, as well as shortages of goods and services that have arisen due to the new sanctions of western countries," Tass stated. Gerben said a similar decree on trademarks would pave the way for Russian companies to exploit American brand names that have halted their business in Russia. He gave a hypothetical involving McDonald's, one of the latest global giants to suspend operations in Russia under public pressure.
The patent decree and any further lifting of intellectual property protections could affect Western investment in Russia well beyond any de-escalation of the war in Ukraine, said Josh Gerben, an intellectual property lawyer in Washington. Firms that already saw risks in Russian business would have more reason to worry. "It's just another example of how [Putin] has forever changed the relationship that Russia will have with the world," Gerben said. Russia's decree removes protections for patent holders who are registered in hostile countries, do business in them or hold their nationality.
The Kremlin has not issued any decree lifting protections on trademarks. But Russia's Ministry of Economic Development said last week that authorities are considering "removing restrictions on the use of intellectual property contained in certain goods whose supply to Russia is restricted," according to Russian state news outlet Tass, and that potential measures could affect inventions, computer programs and trademarks. The ministry said the measures would "mitigate the impact on the market of supply chain breaks, as well as shortages of goods and services that have arisen due to the new sanctions of western countries," Tass stated. Gerben said a similar decree on trademarks would pave the way for Russian companies to exploit American brand names that have halted their business in Russia. He gave a hypothetical involving McDonald's, one of the latest global giants to suspend operations in Russia under public pressure.
Ok, one question... (Score:2)
...have Russian companies, especially the ones government/russian-mob connected, ever cared?
Because it seems that both Russia and China have the same rules, which are basically "government doesn't care as long as you pay your bribes."
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Chinas issues with patent/copyright abuse are mostly small scale manufacturers who sell junk on aliexpress. The big ticket manufacturers, your Foxconns of the world, know that pissing all over western client companies is a losing strategy. Reputation is important and chinas struggled with that and knows that Goodwill is more than just a tangible, its the key to growth.
This is where I think this is going to backfire on Russia. Russia are to some extent a manufacturing nation like china. It *needs* good will
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they do now, but at one point the bigguns were the little companies getting contract work then fucking right off to make "copies" of the stuff they were contracted to make under their own shadow brands
source, read up on the personal computer industry from 1980 to 2000
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they do now, but at one point the bigguns were the little companies getting contract work then fucking right off to make "copies"
That has happened all over the world. The US cared nothing about copyright or patents until they had enough of their own, and therefore lobbyists.
Look at why Hollywood exists.
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Of course, Foxconn is known for making other people's stuff (e.g. Apple), so patents don't concern them terribly.
Brands won't matter, IP will (Score:2)
The brands won't matter. Brands are just reputation. No one in Russia is going to think the Russia McDonald's has anything to do with the real one. When Russian McDonald's have food poisoning, it will not affect the reputation of the real McD. Vice Versa also.
That said, McDonalds is really a real estate company, and they are going to end up losing all their Russian Real estate. (They own the property and make most of the money renting it to the 'franchisee'). That's a big hit to them.
IP on the other h
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Russia already steals IP all over the world. Fortunately, it does so very poorly, and their local "analogs" of foreign technology are without exception garbage. So, nothing new here, other than they are stating openly what they have been doing all along (and not hiding much anyway).
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A lot of software patents in games are bullshit that have held back the industry anyway. Frankly we need an IP reset as nothing ever reaches the public domain anymore.
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So much better then patents for monopolistic corporations. They get the patent and copyright the crap out of everything related, then it gets locked down for 120 YEA
Re: Brands won't matter, IP will (Score:2)
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MacDonald's is a trademark, not a patent, for what it matters. They've had DonMak for years anyhow, right? (And now I'm surprised to find that DonMak only dates from 2017, in Ukraine!)
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Presumably it's a trademark licensed to a Russian subsidiary which Putin may take for himself.
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McDonalds might change tack and say "hey, we're not closing, we're just moving"... then sell up their properties, and vanish.
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Of course McDonalds probably borrowed the money from a Russian bank, so if McDonald's gets screwed on this, that may end up filtering back to a Russian bank rather than McDonalds U.S.
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"IP on the other hand is going to hit the world hard. Russia will be copying IP from all over the world, stealing technology left and right. That is real damage."
No, it isn't. IP doesn't really exist.
So, kid gloves are off entirely, now? (Score:4, Interesting)
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Russia not even going to pretend they're anything other than criminals?
Considering Russia is deliberately [cbsnews.com] targeting hospitals [thehill.com] in Ukraine, as well as targeting the "safe" corridors for people to evacuate cities being shelled, there is no pretense. They're criminals.
I know Ukrainian special forces have said they will get rid of any artillery personnel they come across, but at this point, with the deliberate destruction of Ukraine's infrastructure, the targeting of civilians and Putin's vow to exterminate the
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That would be amusing, if true. How would they have paid I wonder.
I'm not seeing any "exiting of prejudices" lately (Score:2)
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Solving your own issues while blaming others isn't something that's mutually exclusive, you know.
Whataboutism in its finest form.
Chip fabs and getting future hardware (Score:2)
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Get your authentic Russian-made Intel i9 CPU. Now with complete 386 opcodes!
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Chip fabs require a lot of capital. I don't think investors are keen on new ventures in Russia right now. The Russian oligarchs have stashed their loot in secret offshore accounts. What the Russian pirate state is saying is that they don't want to do business with the rest of the world. Well fine, if that is what you want. It probably won't be pleasant for the people of Russia.
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There's only a couple of companies who know how to make the equipment to make state of the art chips.... and they won't be selling any to Russia.
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While I agree with you, why would China sell very cheap to Russia, when they can sell to most other countries at higher prices?
Just because they're buddies? They're buddies based on economic reasons and geography, the latter being a good argument until the former goes to shit.
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While I agree with you, why would China sell very cheap to Russia, when they can sell to most other countries at higher prices? Just because they're buddies? They're buddies based on economic reasons and geography, the latter being a good argument until the former goes to shit.
Remember we're talking about IP and patents here. Selling to other countries gets impounded at the port. Selling cheap to Russia is still better than nothing.
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And after that...? Is he going to eventually nuke Ukraine?
They still won't surrender.
Ukraine is not an autocracy, and even if Zelensky is captured or killed, Ukraine cannot be brought under Russia's control in entirety simply by installing Putin's puppets in key positions.
This is a war that Russia cannot possibly win.
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Just so you know, this is how the world has always been. We didn't start the fire. It was always burning [youtube.com].
The idea that it can be any different is extremely radical, and implementation is difficult. But give peace a chance [youtube.com].
Re:Someone... (Score:4, Insightful)
Just keep telling yourself, "Go back to sleep, it was all just a dream", that's how I make it through the day.
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The same Javelin missiles that are now used to destroy Russian tanks in Ukraine.
Correct, Trump tried to block the delivery of missiles the US Congress sent to Ukraine which are exactly the missiles that they need most now. Think what would happen if Trump had succeeded in blocking those deliveries.
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He delayed the funding. There's no evidence he intended to permanently block it. In any case, nobody particularly though Russia was about to invade, or they would have sent 5 billion dollars. Certainly Biden didn't, until too late.
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He delayed the funding. There's no evidence he intended to permanently block it.
The evidence is in the fact that he asked for a quid-pro-quo. There's no point in asking if you are later just going to give it, which is exactly what turned out to be true when congress acted to force his hand. There's definitely no evidence that he had an intention of supporting the delivery of the weapons, which was the implication of the grandparent posting I was replying to. Trump gets absolutely no credit here.
In any case, nobody particularly though Russia was about to invade, or they would have sent 5 billion dollars. Certainly Biden didn't, until too late.
I'm still honestly surprised Putin did this. He has been a reasonably rational actor up to
Re:Someone... (Score:5, Interesting)
Putin made multiple spectacular miscalculations in his invasion of Ukraine... er I mean, "special police action." They thought Zelensky's government was corrupt as Putin's, that Russia's military wasn't a moldy paper tiger, that the west would hang Ukraine out to dry, and that Putin would be praising his new puppet state by the next day.
Instead they've lost as many men and tanks and planes, and far more supply trucks, in two weeks as the Soviets did in 10 years of occupying Afghanistan. The invasion is stalled as the Ukranian people refuse to surrender to Russian Hitler, and Russia's economy is now roughly one month from complete collapse to preindustry.
Because he blew past every option that was offered to deescalate the situation in pursuit of his insane delusions of recreating the Russian Empire, Putin has now backed himself into a corner (with nobody but himself to blame) because there is NO way this does not end humiliatingly for him:
A) They turn tail and leave and admit they can't even successfully take over an adjacent nation with no defensible terrain that's a quarter their population
B) They continue wasting lives and material until their economy collapses completely, then A
C) Putin escalates to a war of murder-terror against Ukraine's civilian population (see what his goons did to Aleppo for an example), Zelensky surrenders to save millions of lives, and Russia is economically destroyed by the cost of occupying a nation where no Russian can ever turn their back on anything
D) Putin is insane enough to escalate the war into attacking a NATO country, and the combined air forces of America and Europe wipe his ability to wage war, his palaces and his nuke launchers out and make a point of killing him exactly like Ghadaffi, in the way he most feared. Unfortunately, enough of his nukes still work to murder hundreds of millions of innocent people.
E) The Russian people drag him out of a hole and hopefully kill him exactly like Ghadaffi
Even now, based on the news coming out of Mariupol, he's choosing C so far.
But he's fucked up too big time to recover. He's cost way too many rich & powerful Russians way too much money, for one. His latest economic moves, which are a true case study in leaving no bridge unburnt, are his final carte blanche for his goons to steal everything to buy time while he tries to plan an escape, most likely.
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"They thought Zelensky's government was corrupt as Putin's,"
Putin was right on one of the four, but that's not enough, and it is the least important n the list.
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Where's the evidence that "Zelensky's government " is corrupt... not just elements in the general government aparatus, but Zelensky's government specifically?
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If Zelensky's government were as corrupt as Putin's then Zelensky and his pals would have stolen all the money needed for maintenance of military equipment, and then Putin would have superiority (equipment in same condition, but much more of it) and rolled right over Ukraine. That is clearly not the case.
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Even now, based on the news coming out of Mariupol, he's choosing C so far.
The way things are going, his army might not last long enough to succeed at C. Reports are they've already lost 10% of their invasion force after two weeks.
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That's a very good analysis.
Putin is fucked, he knows it but won't admit it. The big question is not really whet HE will do next, it's whether people under him would continue following his orders or not. And by that, I specifically mean those who actually have the power to start a nuclear war.
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He might not know it. People would sooner knock him off than tell him the truth.
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Literally, what in the actual fuck is going on in this world ?
Clown world is getting cancelled. One of your enemies (yes, that's a thing, surprise!) grew tired of pretending to be legitimate peers with their productive, rational rivals and went kinetic. In the process they're messing up the Potemkin façade we're all required to pretend to believe in. Those, such as yourself, that went way past pretending and guzzled all the Kool-Aid are suffering a bout of reality just now.
If you're fortunate China will imagine the time to fulfill their ambitions has come an
Other countries can retaliate (Score:2)
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For instance, from the 2021 WIPO report on IP statistics, only 20% of Russian Federation patent applications were from foreign nationals, compared to 55% in the US.
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It's a bit one-sided though. Russia doesn't have a huge amount of valuable IP.
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It's a bit one-sided though. Russia doesn't have a huge amount of valuable IP.
Probably, but at least it would set back efforts by Russia to expand it and protect its IP as well as destroy the value of trademarks for brands trying o go global if all of a sudden their marks were no longer protected. But yea, it'd be largely symbolic. The real value perhaps would be in the asymmetric nature of the impact. The rest of the world would still enforce the patents and trademarks, so exporting products would be difficult if not impossible; while Russia could not prevent anyone from using th
In other words... (Score:2)
Paris Convention and PCT (Score:4, Funny)
Gosh Deja Vu! (Score:3)
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My first thought.
Said this before... (Score:2)
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That is a simple minded view. Where do you think Ukraine is getting their armaments? Do you think they are donated? For the West this is about money. For Europe there is additional interest for security. This quarter sales to Ukraine are going to be amazing not to mention the profits from rebuilding Ukraine which will come at a later date.
Mutually Assured Destruction (Score:2)
If anyone is surprised by this, then you really need to go back and relearn history, especially how MAD came about.
There was a reason why MAD during Cold War has the words "Mutually Assured" in it. When you back a country as big as Russia into a corner with nothing left to lose, you can be sure that *your side* would also be destroyed together. Is Europe ready to have Russia cut off *all* exports, including gas and wheat? That's what Europe is asking for when they joined to ban Russia from SWIFT and star
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Hey, when Russia can't get their money from export, why would they continue to export stuff?
If you are not trading, I am not sure money exists at all. What good is all that oil and gas if you can't sell it? The Russian economy is about to implode. The so-called oligarchs have sucked the capital out of the country, and put it into property in London, and fancy yachts. If these assets are seized, as is threatened, Russian wealth goes poof. It is a pity that Russia is governed by greedy pirates, but what can I do about it?
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When you back a country as big as Russia into a corner with nothing left to lose
The trouble is Russia is backing itself into a corner.
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It's all about cost. One country by itself does not hold all the resources of the world. I am sure prices will rise and profits/greed will provide all the resources required to sustain Europe. As new supply chains are created prices will drop, probably not to the level before, but they surely will drop. If Russia somehow ends this and trade returns to "normal", if that can be said, cost of oil will drop. Ukraine will need to rebuild physically, Russia will need to rebuild financially. It's going to be a boo
Plus ca change, plus c'est la meme chose (Score:2)
"Russia Says Its Businesses Can Steal Patents From Anyone In 'Unfriendly' Countries
So how is this any different from what Russia been doing for years? If they're going to make it work, though, they'll have to up their game to match China at stealing Western (and Japanese) innovations.
Putin says he is not afraid of the Pentagon (Score:2)
But now he has pissed off American IP lawyers. Russia to be broken up into tiny pieces and auctioned off in 3..2..1.
China and Russia (Score:2)
Loot loot toot toot (Score:2)
Now we can wAr3z all Russian software with no guilt. Yay!
Re: Loot loot toot toot (Score:2)
Incoming... a revolution in DRM (Score:2)
This just sounds like it is going to revitalize DRM, be it hardware e-Fuses, or justification for locking down devices on the pretext of keeping the Russians out. It may even cause more WIPO/DMCA laws to get passed, which feel great for lawmakers, but won't address the problem at hand.
Bad idea, for Russian companies... (Score:2)
Unless Putin succeeds in getting everybody incinerated, there will come a day when Putin is gone (not asserting any violence or anything... he could simply kick off from old age some day) and the Russian people will likely want to be re-connected to the rest of the world, but the rest of the world will view them as IP thieves in a world where IP is increasingly vital and valued. It's also possible that those Russian companies might spend years building themselves up on stolen IP and be so dependent upon it
Fair enough (Score:3)
I think we should scrap patents anyway.
One more step... (Score:2)
It's a shame really (Score:3)
The international community should no longer recognize the current Russian government as legitimate and remove them from the UN Security council. At a minimum, the UN Charter should be revised to revoke permanent security council membership if enough countries vote to approve the motion.
Yes, Russians should and will pay a very high price, including reparations to rebuild everything they are destroying, but the Russian people deserve better than this. They are burning bridges that cannot be rebuilt for generations.
We do the same (Score:2)
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Sure they do. Eventually, be it tomorrow or 10-years from now, may well depend on how long Putin has left to live, but relations will likely normalize and then none of these companies are going to want to come back. Russia is a large country, but not in terms of population, so it's not like most companies would be losing a lot of revenue if they just never go back to Russia.
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eh maybe.
Russian companies that want to operate outside Russia (eg Yandex) aren't going to take the bait. But American and European companies that want to operate in Russia will just not invest there, because anything produced in Russia will be tainted. The same way much IP is tainted from China. You do not operate business in China, China operates your business, and the second you're no longer needed, it's stolen out from under you. See ARM.
Re:Understandable (Score:4, Interesting)
America has done the same thing.
We seized German patents and trademarks during WW1 and formalized the "theft" in the Treaty of Versailles.
Among the trademarks taken were "Aspirin" and "Heroin".
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Seems like a pretty comparable situation. Germany with much more IP at stake did not want to set a precedent by adopting policies as widespread but both sides did it. Given that these were major military efforts with the first semi-modern weapons it's pretty much inevitable that your enemy owns some of that IP so it makes sense at least for strategic purposes.
Re:Understandable (Score:5, Informative)
Not like they have anything to lose.
They're a member of WIPO, and this would violate several treaties, starting with the near-global Patent Cooperation Treaty [wikipedia.org].
By taking the action, they lose reciprocity globally for quite a few IP protections.
While the government itself may not care, Russian businesses will care quite a lot that their IP protections just vanished globally.
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While the government itself may not care, Russian businesses will care quite a lot that their IP protections just vanished globally.
IP protection of what? Unless you're a tin-pot dictator, when was the last time you bought anything that says "Made in Russia" on it?
That's snark, but it points out a real issue, there's not much that Russian companies could lose in terms of IP, or even just sales, outside Russia.
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IP protection of what? Unless you're a tin-pot dictator, when was the last time you bought anything that says "Made in Russia" on it?
Russia is not great at manufacturing but they have always had great scientists. Patents (ignoring "design patents" which are a different thing) don't protect finished products, they protect individual ideas that go into them. That's precisely where Russia could be benefiting.
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There's some good Russian software out there. Parallels virtualization came from Russia, though how much its developed there now I have no idea. Admittedly the list of Russian innovations is not particularly long, but there would be a lot of pissed off Russian entrepreneurs right about now.
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Well maybe not. I mean how were these Russian businesses expecting to get paid? In rubles? Some loss there, you may as well pay them in monopoly money. But then again, this IS Russia we're talking about...maybe they'll accept monopoly money if you replace uncle penny bags with Putin.
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If you could get paid in the US for your patent, then right now that would translate to truck loads of rubles and make you rich.
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Well... if they rip off Mickey Mouse, you may be right.
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Wrong (Score:2)
The notion that copying protected in intellectual property without authorization is not theft is based on the fallacy that the thing that might be getting copied is actually what is alleged as being stolen.
It isn't.
Copying IP without authorization steals some measure of value that the IP itself would have otherwise had.
With copyright, for instance, IP holders generally place some value on their own exclusive rights to control who might copy their works, and when someone decides to copy it without aut
Re:Wrong (Score:4, Interesting)
Copying IP without authorization steals some measure of value that the IP itself would have otherwise had.
The use of word "some" is the problem, you breathing takes some measure of value from me by using a fraction air from me. In the end what you can or can't copy is purely based on law set by politicians. It is a totally artificial value construct you don't use up an idea, even less so than the air that you breath. If they decide tomorrow to change it, it will not be stealing, that is exactly what Russia has done, they have the power to change any laws they want in their own country. Do you think the other countries are going to the proper channels in the WTO before applying sanctions.
If the west is "freezing" the assets of Russian citizens, isn't that stealing too? So if the west can choose to change its laws in order to take assets off Russia why can't Russia do the same. The only difference is that you and I think Russia deserves it while you don't think the west does.
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So what are you saying, Putin has drunk the Richard Stallman Kool Aid? Maybe he goes back to his quarters in the Kremlin, franticly coding elisp hacks for emacs.
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Sounds a bit conspiracy theory to me. I couldn't turn up that in Google.
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So negligence rather than malice.
Yeah, please go ahead and tell that face-to-face to the families of the 298 people killed in that event.
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All companies involved in US led sanctions should have their patents void. Every country that is not the lap dog of the US should be doing it.
US is empire is crumbling, and the US is in its thrashing about phase as a cornered beast is.
Are you all right? Should we call the nurse?
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