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The Courts

ADT Sues Amazon's Ring Over Use of Blue Octagon Logo (cnet.com) 83

Posted by msmash from the tussle-continues dept.
ADT, a home security company in the United States with over 6 million customers, is suing Amazon's Ring, alleging that the DIY home security company is copying ADT's logo and profiting from customer trust associated with it. From a report: ADT has asked a federal judge in Florida to order Ring to stop using its blue, octagonal signs and to pay unspecified compensation to the security company. In the complaint, ADT said it asked Ring to stop copying its blue octagon logo in 2016, after which the Amazon-owned company removed the blue color from its sign, but kept the octagon shape. In late March, upon releasing a new outdoor siren, Ring added the blue back to its advertising materials. ADT also said in the complaint that it owns 12 trademarks for the shape, color and look of its blue, octagonal sign.
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ADT Sues Amazon's Ring Over Use of Blue Octagon Logo More

ADT Sues Amazon's Ring Over Use of Blue Octagon Logo

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  • In response, Amazon could buy ADT and turn their former headquarters into a designated Amazon drivers' drive-through trucker bomb dropoff facility, demoting ADT's CEO to dropoff lane custodian.

    • nope, google bought stake in ADT so the war is on. Looking at the logos, I think ADT will kick Amazon's ass up and down the courtroom too.

      • Re:In response (Score:5, Interesting)

        by cusco ( 717999 ) <brian.bixby@gmail . c om> on Tuesday April 27, 2021 @03:11PM (#61320764)

        I was shocked when Google actually paid money to be associated with the most dismal installers in the entire physical security industry. I've done physical security for 15 years now and can only think of a handful of small companies that are worse than ADT's staff. They specialize in residential and retail installs, and the only way to make money doing that is to haphazardly slap in substandard equipment and skip off to your next site. They frequently don't even **test** the stuff before leaving.

        The 911 dispatchers that I know say that their customer alarms are the absolute lowest priority of anything, kids smoking dope in the park are quite literally a higher priority since the false alarm rate on ADT installs is in the upper-90s. (Admittedly most home alarm systems aren't a lot better, but ADT is pretty much the worst.)

        • Serious question -- who do you recommend, if anyone, from the large nationwide security vendors?
          • I actually recommend DIY to /. I used Geoarm to buy the stuff and hook it up. I was stunned at how much I had been overpaying with ADT. Like 3X for worse service. The great thing about DIY is you can configure all the options yourself. Every window is now its own zone, whereas with ADT it was one zone for any window in the house. In a way ADT's horrible service was their undoing. I'd noticed the smoke detector flash pattern was different. I've no idea how long it had been broken, but it blew me away ADT did

            • Re: (Score:2)

              by c-A-d ( 77980 )

              I've got a hub6 device monitoring an alarm system. It hits my phone with notifications whenever the system is armed, disarmed, or is triggered.

              ADT was a severe disappointment when I was dealing with them. They were unresponsive to our needs and there were some other unsundry activities that left a bad taste in my mouth.

          • Re: (Score:3)

            by cusco ( 717999 )

            Possibly Convergint, as long as you have a PM who keep harassing them to stay on schedule. Prosegur and Securitas tend to be good though pricey, security isn't something you should be looking for the lowest bidder on anyway. Tycho, Johnson Controls, and Stanley tend to be competent but unimaginative, don't ask for anything complex and they'll generally do a good job. Henry Brothers and Netronix are both a toss-up, with outstanding staff in some cities and drooling morons in others. Cochrane is cheap but

        • It's not about associating, it's about having a foot in the door. When you get involved in the stock market, ethics become very expensive.

          • Re: (Score:2)

            by cusco ( 717999 )

            But there are several publicly traded security companies out there which are head and shoulders better than ADT. Securitas, Stanley, Tycho, Johnson Controls all come to mind immediately. That they picked ADT seems to indicate to me that they're just interested in getting their Nest hardware to be included in ADT's typical home installation (it would probably be the highest quality item in the entire system). The real money is in the commercial installations not homes, which ADT is effectively shut out of

            • tyco security is ADT (just the big business side) and the techs are more likely to be union.
              ADT does small business / retail but things like chase bank branches use tyco.

              • Re: (Score:2)

                by cusco ( 717999 )

                Ah, wasn't aware that they bought Tycho's security operations, haven't been paying much attention to the business the last few years. They bought the high-end VAR that I used to work for too, and ruined it.

        • I worked at an ADT call center as a dispatcher for a few years in undergrad. I calculated the false positive rate for alarms, as the data was available on the internal network, and I had a lot of free time as phones rang. The false positive rate was over 99.99 percent.

          The worst was during hurricane season, as we'd call and report fire alarms as current events, despite the alarms actually going off several hours prior, but delayed due to the extreme volume of false alarms. Affected areas were not depriorit

    • If you read the article (which you clearly didn't), you'd see Google already bought into ADT for $400M.

    • The CEO gets a sweet golden parachute, buys 2 vacation homes - one in Hawaii and another in Vail, Colorado.

      Even without the hand job of a contract, he also typically has a ton of stock, so he gets rich off the buyout.

  • Looks at the linked to picture. (Score:5, Insightful)

    by slack_justyb ( 862874 ) on Tuesday April 27, 2021 @02:53PM (#61320672)

    Looked at the ring logo [cnet.com] and the ADT logo [fandom.com]. Yeah, that's going to be a slam dunk trademark case for ADT.

    after which the Amazon-owned company removed the blue color from its sign, but kept the octagon shape. In late March, upon releasing a new outdoor siren, Ring added the blue back to its advertising materials.

    Oh yeah, that's a really dumb move to remove it and then add it back. In trademark that's a sign you realized you goofed, tried to undo your goof, and then realized "nah fuck it" and goofed again but on purpose this time. I mean Amazon could have gone through the process the first time to invalidate the claims, but seeing how they didn't, it's a bit too little, too late.

    All that said, I'm sure whatever ADT wins is literally pocket change that Bezos found in between his couch cushions. I can't image any Judge thinking this warranted major recompense. Well at least major in Amazon terms.

    • Looked at the ring logo [cnet.com] and the ADT logo [fandom.com]. Yeah, that's going to be a slam dunk trademark case for ADT.

      after which the Amazon-owned company removed the blue color from its sign, but kept the octagon shape. In late March, upon releasing a new outdoor siren, Ring added the blue back to its advertising materials.

      Oh yeah, that's a really dumb move to remove it and then add it back. In trademark that's a sign you realized you goofed, tried to undo your goof, and then realized "nah fuck it" and goofed again but on purpose this time. I mean Amazon could have gone through the process the first time to invalidate the claims, but seeing how they didn't, it's a bit too little, too late.

      All that said, I'm sure whatever ADT wins is literally pocket change that Bezos found in between his couch cushions. I can't image any Judge thinking this warranted major recompense. Well at least major in Amazon terms.

      It could have been an honest mistake. Perhaps some marketing drone at Amazon, who hadn't been in marketing in 2016, looked at the octagon and thought (not realizing he was remembering ADT) that it would look better if it was blue. Nobody in Legal caught it, so it was done.

      • Nobody in Legal caught it, so it was done

        I mean that can happen. Won't work as a viable defense in court, but they could totally go with that story. Honest mistakes can still be punished.

        • Nobody in Legal caught it, so it was done

          I mean that can happen. Won't work as a viable defense in court, but they could totally go with that story. Honest mistakes can still be punished.

          Even though this won't be a defense in court, Amazon might try to use it in the court of public opinion. A low-level person in marketing will be sent back down to the floor to do the picking and packing that the automation can't yet handle.

          • Amazon might try to use it in the court of public opinion

            OH! OH! Okay, yeah. Absolutely. I see what we're saying now.

      • That's not the way it works.

        No one makes a major brand change like that with it being vetted by the folks in Legal. Which, amazingly, they approved.

        Ring is going to be hammered into the ground like a tent peg over this.

        • That's not the way it works.

          No one makes a major brand change like that with it being vetted by the folks in Legal. Which, amazingly, they approved.

          Ring is going to be hammered into the ground like a tent peg over this.

          We, as outsiders, cannot know how the dynamics work at Amazon. In a construction company that I heard about, the job of the Legal department was to get the government out of the way so the Building Stuff department could earn money. The Legal department could not tell the Building Stuff department to defer a job because they hadn't gotten the right permits--it was assumed that Legal would get the permits in time for the scheduled construction to begin.

          I also heard about a marketing company who found, thro

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by edis ( 266347 )

        It can't be honest mistake, when you choose hexagon + blue + home security theme + these matching significant established business with the same patented visuals.
        Shouldn't be in court, nor public.

    • Re: (Score:2, Informative)

      by mindwhip ( 894744 )

      Actually its not. Trademarks are on the entire registered mark, not on individual components. Either there has to be substantial similarity or significant confusion.

      They are similar but not substantially similar. The font and text are obviously and significantly different and the shade of blue is noticeably different too. In addition you generally can't trademark basic shapes so the fact they are both octagons in itself is not sufficient for infringement.

      As for confusion this can be difficult to prove a

      • The first registered trademark in the United Kingdom is for Bass Brewery and is primarily a red equilateral triangle. There is accompanying text but basic shapes have been in trademarks as long as trademarks have existed. In this case, a video doorbell is definitely in the domain of home security so even though the font and text are different I think ADT will have an easy time making a case for customer confusion (even if no company would really want to be confused/associated with ADT)

      • This is the right take. There are plenty of security signs on the market that are octogon in shape. I'm not sure of ADTs past litigation history related to this or existing case law. I honesly don't see how they win this considering the shade of blue, the font and case of each letter, text position, and not being an acronym.
    • How would anyone confuse a logo that says "ring" with a logo that says "ADT"?

  • I agree (Score:4, Funny)

    by backslashdot ( 95548 ) on Tuesday April 27, 2021 @02:54PM (#61320676)

    It makes sense, thieves may mistake the ring logo for ADT and skip the house thinking the residents are broke boomers. ADT should get paid for that.

  • SOP for Amazon (Score:5, Insightful)

    by smooth wombat ( 796938 ) on Tuesday April 27, 2021 @03:00PM (#61320710) Journal

    Amazon has been caught red-handed numerous times directly copying someone else's product then pushing the Amazon version.

    And now they're deliberately using someone else's trademarked symbol.

    This is on top of having their warehouse workers piss in a bottle or else get dinged on their pay for the length of time it takes to walk to and from the bathroom.

    And yet, people think they're the best thing since sliced bread even though they complain about Amazon's business practices. Just goes to show hypocrisy runs rampant and outrage is faux.

    • Well people's first loyalty is to wide product selection, fast delivery, and low cost. Nobody can beat amazon on those .. sure a lot of places can ship you stuff overnight ..what does that cost? Also, do they have as wide a product selection? Sure you can google a product and find 10 different vendors for it, but then you have to sign up on some shady website and that's a pain. As an aside, Google could have become amazon but they F'd up badly in how they tried to do it. Is it really worth wading through go

  • If I was Amazon, I'd change it to a heptagon.

    We all know 7 is the best.

    Think about it... 7-Elevens. 7 dwarves.

    7, man. That's the number.

    7 chipmunks twirlin' on a branch, eatin' lots of sunflowers on my uncle's ranch. You know that old children's tale from the sea. It's like you're dreamin' about Gorgonzola cheese when it's clearly Brie time, baby.

  • Amazon? Blue octagonal logo? (Score:3)

    by arielCo ( 995647 ) on Tuesday April 27, 2021 @03:09PM (#61320750)

    The joke writes itself. [imgur.com]

  • ADT and customers (Score:4, Interesting)

    by MooseTick ( 895855 ) on Tuesday April 27, 2021 @03:13PM (#61320774) Homepage

    Ah, ADT, the company whose system was in the house I bought and when I accidentally set the alarm off said they couldn't assist me in turning the 115db siren off on a 105F Summer day while I had a newborn, unless I gave them my credit card and renewed a subscription to their service. Then, had an employee visit my house 4 months later saying they hadn't heard from my home system (who I had snipped every wire 4 months prior) to see if anything was wrong. If there had been something wrong, they could likely have found our bloated rotting corpses.

  • give people the games they deserve. Corp Vs Corp Kumite.

  • Why are companies allowed to trademark color and geometric shapes in the first place? Who knew that we could sell out parts of geometry to the highest bidder! /s

    This is almost as retarded as The Red Cross trying to claim they own the trademark to a) red, and b) cross, when they symbols / crests have been used for over a thousand years prioer.

    • You're missing the "trade" in "trademark". A trademark is only relevant within the scope of what you do. So, I can start Apple Denim, but I can't start Apple Electronics.

      I can use a generic blue octagon as the logo for my Hot Yoga Training program, but I can't use it for my Advanced Protection Security Certification program.

      In this case, this blue octagon is an obvious ploy to look like the ADT protected stickers ADT spent years pimping so that criminals associate it with "stop, you go no further".

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by bws111 ( 1216812 )

      We 'allow' trademarks precisely to eliminate the kind of BS Amazon is doing here. There is absolutely NO reason for them to use a blue octagon logo EXCEPT to try to confuse consumers.

      As for the Red Cross, they are not 'trying to claim' those symbols. Those symbols exclusively theirs, as specified by international treaty. And prior use has nothing to do with trademarks in any case.

  • I clicked through to see for myself and I immediately saw exactly what they're talking about. That's too close to even really buy the excuse it was an accident.

    • One says ring, the other says ADT. I think customers are not going to be confused. To me the purpose of using a trademark is so customers don't mistake your product for another. I find it hard that to believe that this would happen in any significant manner her.

  • cannot see how they can trademark the octagon shape since there is previous usages by cities and governments all over the world. The security sign is a stop sign warning users not to enter because it is protected by their security system. Octagon shaped, stop signs have been around longer than ADT. If Amazon is guilty, then so is ADT.

    • Re:previous use (Score:4, Informative)

      by bws111 ( 1216812 ) on Tuesday April 27, 2021 @05:25PM (#61321354)

      Trademarks are NOT PATENTS. There is no 'prior use' issue. Furthermore, trademarks (except in the special case of 'famous marks') only apply to a specific area of commerce. In this case, that area would be 'home security'. So, do you have any examples of any other company (the commerce part) selling home security services that uses a blue octagon as their logo? No? Then it is a perfectly valid trademark.

  • Friends don't let friends buy ADT.

    Shitty equipment, shitty service, and some of the most ham-handed 'installers' I've ever seen. They'll run wires on the outside of the house, without even a cut-detection loop. Total fools. Their signs might as well say, "Come on in and take our shit!"

    Those in the know will tell you that "ADT" stands for "Always Defective Technology".

  • "profiting from customer trust associated with it' https://www.deviantart.com/ash... [deviantart.com]

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