India Shuts Down Internet Once Again, This Time In Assam and Meghalaya (techcrunch.com) 66
An anonymous reader quotes a report from TechCrunch: India maintained a shutdown of the internet in the states of Assam and Meghalaya on Friday, now into 36 hours, to control protests over a controversial and far-reaching new citizen rule. The shutdown of the internet in Assam and Meghalaya, home to more than 32 million people, is the latest example of a worrying worldwide trend employed by various governments: preventing people from communicating on the web and accessing information.
On Thursday, India's president Ram Nath Kovind approved the Citizenship Amendment Bill, a day after the country's Parliament passed it. The law offers a path to Indian citizenship for non-Muslim minorities from three neighboring countries (Afghanistan, Pakistan and Bangladesh) -- not for the country's own Muslim minority. Shortly after the bill was passed, protests broke out in the streets in the northeastern states of Assam and Meghalaya, where residents have long been concerned about immigration from the aforementioned nations. In Meghalaya, texting services have been suspended, too. To contain the situation, the Indian government sent in troops and shut down the internet -- a measure that the United Nations has condemned in the past, calling it a violation of human rights.
On Thursday, India's president Ram Nath Kovind approved the Citizenship Amendment Bill, a day after the country's Parliament passed it. The law offers a path to Indian citizenship for non-Muslim minorities from three neighboring countries (Afghanistan, Pakistan and Bangladesh) -- not for the country's own Muslim minority. Shortly after the bill was passed, protests broke out in the streets in the northeastern states of Assam and Meghalaya, where residents have long been concerned about immigration from the aforementioned nations. In Meghalaya, texting services have been suspended, too. To contain the situation, the Indian government sent in troops and shut down the internet -- a measure that the United Nations has condemned in the past, calling it a violation of human rights.
It's how you control your people (Score:4, Insightful)
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Ironically, India has shown us, in the past, a way to manage fascist governments. Look up Gandhi. He did it with no internet or telephones, just mostly word of mouth and telegrams. When a society is all on the same page, communication is FAST between common people. But in most of the westernized countries in the world, this aspect of the society being on the same page is COMPLETELY lacking. Methinks it's on purpose.
Re: (Score:2)
For every Ghandi, how many failed revolutionaries died in prison?
Re: (Score:2)
You're looking at it in the wrong way. People were already dying, and for worse reasons than political protest - they were being starved of their rights to freely grow food and all sorts of other issues. See, what you have to think of is this:
For every Gandhi, how many free people are there?
Re: (Score:2)
Government across the world just flip a switch, and can wipe out opposition to any government. The populations of most nations, do not have the means to fight back.
SpaceX Starlink other satellite megaconstellations planned by Amazon and others offer a way to change this dynamic. Countries who want to shut off Internet service to their populations will, of course, try to apply pressure to get the satellite service operators to disable service in their region as well, but I think they'll have an uphill battle. Truly totalitarian states will probably attempt to ban the receiving equipment, but nominally free countries like India won't be able to justify that.
Re: (Score:2)
Re: It's how you control your people (Score:2)
That would only make people madder. Last I checked we still had revolutions without cell phones or internet. Pretty sure Paul Revere never owned a cell phone, though I could be wrong. It is a short term stability recipe for sudden collapse. One that doesnâ(TM)t end well tor anyone, especially for the leadership.
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Sure they can justify it, in the same exact way that encryption bans and backdoors are justified already: playing on the fear terrorists, extremists, pedophiles etc. And we already know that it works.
So they won't ban the equipment outright. They will pass a law requiring any such equipment to comply with government blacklists, and then everything that doesn't do so will become illegal contraband. That only extremists could possibly want to possess, so anybody who complains about it, must be one.
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Sure they can justify it, in the same exact way that encryption bans and backdoors are justified already: playing on the fear terrorists, extremists, pedophiles etc. And we already know that it works.
The difference is that the countries that want to be able to shut off the Internet are not the countries where the satellite service is based.
So they won't ban the equipment outright. They will pass a law requiring any such equipment to comply with government blacklists, and then everything that doesn't do so will become illegal contraband.
I'm not sure they'll be able to do either. I think the equipment will be pretty standard stuff, used for all sorts of things. Just attach a different dish and update the software-controlled radio firmware.
Incorrect and misinformed summary (Score:3, Informative)
The muslim minority in Hindu majority India is unaffected.
The bill only aims to give shelter to persecuted non-muslims in neighoring Islamic countries. Incoming illegal muslim immigramts are excluded because they are not the ones fleeing persecution in their Islsmic countries. Whereas people from other religions: Hindu, Christian, Buddhist etc in Neighboring barbaric Islamic lands bave been systematically decimated and are the ones fleeing into India that this bill gives shelter to.
It is exactly this kind o
Re:Incorrect and misinformed summary (Score:5, Informative)
The muslim minority in Hindu majority India is unaffected.
Not true. Many native-born Muslims in Assam are affected because their parents were migrants.
Non-muslims in the same situation have a path to citizenship. Muslims are deprived of citizenship. Since they were born in India, they have no right to citizenship in any other country and are stateless.
India is violating international law by stripping Indian-born people of citizenship.
India is also building internment camps in Assam and Meghalaya. They already have tens of thousands of Kashmiris confined in camps. Their internment camp population may soon exceed that of the Xinjiang camps in China.
The BJP party is the moral equivalent of the KKK. India is heading down an ugly path of hate, intolerance, discrimination, and sectarian violence.
Re:Incorrect and misinformed summary (Score:4, Interesting)
As per US citizenship laws, anyone born on US soil or to US parents is automatically a citizen. In India, you have to be born to Indian parents to become a citizen. Your birth location is irrelevant. What this means is that, if your parents are foreigners and you are born in India - you are a foreigner. FWIW, this is the norm in most countries, including most western countries. The US model is actually the exception to the norm.
I remain unaware of any international law that says that the US system is right and moral while the other systems are wrong or immoral.
As of now, native-born muslims, hindus, christians, parsis etc. born of immigrant parents are regarded in India as foreigners. For example, in Delhi, there is a large refugee camp of Hindus and Sikhs who came from Afghanistan during Taliban rule - they and their children are regarded as foreigners by law even today.
What this bill does is that it allows Hindu, Parsi, Christian, Sikh and Buddhist refugees from Pakistan, Afghanistan, and Bangladesh to easily become citizens of India. The assumption is that Muslims in Pakistan, Afghanistan and Bangladesh cannot be harassed on the basis on religion because they are the majority. And historically, these nations have harassed their minorities (Bangladesh to a far lesser extent, tbh).
So if Muslims from these nations are migrating to India, it is because they are economically motivated to do so. I remain unaware of any nation that welcomes or permits economically motivated refugees.
In short, India is actually doing a little bit of the opposite - India is allowing religious minorities from other nations to claim refuge and giving them citizenship.
Rather than discourage this bill, I would encourage an enhanced version of this bill - i would urge that the categories be expanded from just religious minorities to ethnic, sexual, or subreligion (Ahmadiyyas, Shias) minorities.
About tens of thousands of Kashmiri's in jails - the best number I have is 4000. https://www.france24.com/en/20... [france24.com] .716% of the population is in jail.
This is out of a population of 12.5 million. That is 0.032% of the population. Compare with America where
Lastly, internment camps in Assam and Meghalaya are figments of imagination - people see them as the only possibility for the Muslim migrants, who do not qualify for citizenship. But that is driven by the State High Court, which is far more independent from the legislature and the executive than the US court systems (because the judges are selected by a collegium of other judges and neither the legislature nor the executive have any say in this) https://www.news18.com/news/in... [news18.com]
Hopefully, that clarifies some or all of your concerns.
Re: Incorrect and misinformed summary (Score:2)
Did yoy forget the mosque was raised by Islamic invading hoardes where the ancient Hindu temple used to stand?
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India is violating international law by stripping Indian-born people of citizenship.
Are they being stripped of citizenship, or not granted one?
It sounds like you're implying that being born on the territory of a country automatically entitles one to its citizenship under international law. Which is not the case - there are far more countries where citizenship is either inherited or granted via naturalization, than those that, like US, grant it automatically.
Nor does the fact that they're born in India means that they have no right to citizenship in any other country - even countries that p
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It is exactly this kind of misinformation that the Internet is susceptible to, and causes real misinformed violence that need to be stopped.
You heard it here folks. If you don't agree with BJP propoganda, your voice should be shut down.
Re: Incorrect and misinformed summary (Score:2)
If one were to listen to all the critics who spoke against the bill in Parliament and outside it, there was almost no empathy for those persecuted by three Islamic states in our neighbourhood. Their main objection to the bill was, âoehow could Muslims be excluded from its ambit?â Suddenly, people who never spoke up for Shias or Ahmadiyyas and Hazaras discovered that they were the real oppressed peoples in the sub-continent. How dare Hindus fight for the rights of other Hindus?
https://swarajyamag.c [swarajyamag.com]
Re: (Score:1)
Re: Incorrect and misinformed summary (Score:2)
If muslims cant get their act together and stop massacaring their own kin, why hold non Islamic countries responsible?
Stop the Islamic narbarism first.
Re: Incorrect and misinformed summary (Score:2)
If one were to listen to all the critics who spoke against the bill in Parliament and outside it, there was almost no empathy for those persecuted by three Islamic states in our neighbourhood. Their main objection to the bill was, âoehow could Muslims be excluded from its ambit?â Suddenly, people who never spoke up for Shias or Ahmadiyyas and Hazaras discovered that they were the real oppressed peoples in the sub-continent. How dare Hindus fight for the rights of other Hindus?
https://swarajyamag.c [swarajyamag.com]
Re: Incorrect and misinformed summary (Score:2)
If one were to listen to all the critics who spoke against the bill in Parliament and outside it, there was almost no empathy for those persecuted by three Islamic states in our neighbourhood. Their main objection to the bill was, âoehow could Muslims be excluded from its ambit?â Suddenly, people who never spoke up for Shias or Ahmadiyyas and Hazaras discovered that they were the real oppressed peoples in the sub-continent. How dare Hindus fight for the rights of other Hindus?
https://swarajyamag.c [swarajyamag.com]
Re: Incorrect and misinformed summary (Score:2)
If one were to listen to all the critics who spoke against the bill in Parliament and outside it, there was almost no empathy for those persecuted by three Islamic states in our neighbourhood. Their main objection to the bill was, âoehow could Muslims be excluded from its ambit?â Suddenly, people who never spoke up for Shias or Ahmadiyyas and Hazaras discovered that they were the real oppressed peoples in the sub-continent. How dare Hindus fight for the rights of other Hindus?
https://swarajyamag.c [swarajyamag.com]
Color revolutions (Score:5, Insightful)
Govts around the world have learnt the lessons of the Color revolutions. The Internet can be used to bring down almost any govt. Especially if education levels are not very high people fall prey to social media propaganda more easily. Major countries around the world are creating systems to insulate the population from external influences on demand.
Re: Color revolutions (Score:1)
...high people fall prey to social media propaganda more easily.
So do the illiterate but I suppose weed helps...
Re: (Score:3, Interesting)
After what happened to Libya which went from having a lifestyle higher than the US to total Mad Max revolutions yeah so called freedom to consume corporate media is too high a price to pay. Life under Gaddafi was better than Americans living under Obama but you would never realize that if all you wtched was CNN, youtube,facebook and twitter
No one cares. (Score:1)
Same everywhere (Score:2, Informative)
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There is only one way to deal with an armed citizenry. A better-armed military. And most tyrants have one.
Fun fact: the military is part of the armed citizenry. This is why banana-republic dictators-for-life have concentric circle of better-equipped, more-trusted military units, each there to deal with the next circle out. Of course, the result is a military that sucks at actually fighting a war, and so sometimes the dictator is eliminated by an external threat instead.
The American Revolution began not with a bunch of hunting rifles*, but with a full array of military equipment snuck out of armories by soldie
Not really (Score:2)
What you _can_ do is terrorism with the goal of provoking an over reaction from the gov't that leads to the overthrow. But history's taught us that ends with nothing but a change of masters.
All I'm saying is this: Don't count on your 2nd amendment to save democracy. The time to do it is now. And, well, we've got a guy [independent.co.uk] opening talking [timesofisrael.com]
Re: Not really (Score:1)
..but by the early 1900s a standing army could put down any rebellion
Nope, not even close. Hell, private ownership of machine guns wasn't even regulated until '35.
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"maybe in the 1700s (big maybe), but by the early 1900s a standing army could put down any rebellion you can possible mount with civilian arms, tactics and supply chains."
Do send that memo to the Afghans. They beat the British (soundly!), outlasted the Soviet Union, and are on their way to outlasting the US. Kamikaze attacks are impossible to completely negate and remarkably economical at they don't require extrication and leave no one to interrogate.
You don't have to defeat an enemy in peer combat to wear
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The tyrants have arms too. Their arms are bigger. The only way the armed citizenry are going to overthrow a government is to fight dirty - assassinations and guerrilla tactics. At which point the only difference between terrorist and revolutionary is that revolutionaries win and get to write the history books afterwards.
India (Score:1)
Not the internet, some NGO, the UN, a think tank...
Should India want grant citizenship to people from countries like Afghanistan, Pakistan and Bangladesh
Illegal migrants now in India should not expect free citizenship..
Two immigrant parents = stateless until age 12 (Score:2)
India practices hereditary citizenship, not citizenship based on place of birth. One parent must be a citizen of India, [wikipedia.org] and the other must at least not be an illegal immigrant If someone is born in India to two immigrants, even legal immigrants, then the child is stateless, a citizen of no country, until age 12.
Re: (Score:1)
Re: (Score:2)
Which of the following are you claiming?
A. The right to a nationality is not a human right, despite its appearance in the UN Convention on the Rights of the Child which India ratified in 1992.
B. The right to a nationality is a human right, and India has the right to deny a nationality, instead obliging some other sovereign state to recognize this right by granting a nationality.
Re: (Score:2)
The child is not necessarily stateless - they can (and sometimes even automatically do) acquire citizenship of some other country from one or both their parents.
vasudhaiva kutumbakam (Score:1)
Re: (Score:1)
Re: vasudhaiva kutumbakam (Score:2)
Sure, but they are also declaring millions of people (mostly Muslims, dalits, etc) who were born in India or moved there during the Partition and have lived there their whole lives, as non-citizens. Even though they have no citizenship anywhere else. And let's not even talk about the latest sham decision involving the Babri mosque. Let's face it, the BJP hates Muslims and would expel them all if they could.
Re: (Score:1)
Re: vasudhaiva kutumbakam (Score:2)
If one were to listen to all the critics who spoke against the bill in Parliament and outside it, there was almost no empathy for those persecuted by three Islamic states in our neighbourhood. Their main objection to the bill was, âoehow could Muslims be excluded from its ambit?â Suddenly, people who never spoke up for Shias or Ahmadiyyas and Hazaras discovered that they were the real oppressed peoples in the sub-continent. How dare Hindus fight for the rights of other Hindus?
https://swarajyamag.c [swarajyamag.com]
Incorrect and misinformed summary. (Score:5, Informative)
The muslim minority in Hindu majority India is unaffected.
The bill only aims to give shelter to persecuted non-muslims in neighoring Islamic countries. Incoming illegal muslim immigramts are excluded because they are not the ones fleeing persecution in their Islsmic countries. Whereas people from other religions: Hindu, Christian, Buddhist etc in Neighboring barbaric Islamic lands bave been systematically decimated and are the ones fleeing into India that this bill gives shelter to.
It is exactly this kind of misinformation that the Internet is susceptible to, and causes real misinformed violence that need to be stopped.
Re: Incorrect and misinformed summary. (Score:2)
https://www.indiatoday.in/indi... [indiatoday.in]
Ad hoc network? (Score:2)
I was wondering if there was an easy to set up (i.e. viral software that could be easily distributed person to person) mesh network that could be rolled out when the government blocks the Internet.
It seems to me that there is a place for a mesh ad hoc network that could be easily set up to permit the people on the ground to communicate.
I know there are mesh networks. Is there something that could be easily rolled out by non technical people quickly in these situations?
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There have been a few attempts to set up something like that. The problem is always the same: You need mass participation, and good luck getting the busy masses to learn about something like that. By the time they might actually need it, it's too late.
Great Firewall of China (Score:2)
India needs to buy the Great Firewall of China tech from China to protect the Indian internet from harmful influences.
India is most racist country in the World (Score:2)
Who's your buddy? (Score:2)
Ham radio because... (Score:2)
Works for me (Score:2)
They are obviously incompetent since my Internet is working just fine, thank-you very much!
ANY belief that promotes violence... (Score:1)
Punishable by a violent execution!