New Zealand Travelers Refusing Digital Search Now Face $5000 Customs Fine (msn.com) 247
Travelers in New Zealand who refuse to hand over their phone or laptop passwords to Customs officials can now be slapped with a $5000 fine. From a report: The Customs and Excise Act 2018 -- which comes into effect today -- sets guidelines around how Customs can carry out "digital strip-searches." Previously, Customs could stop anyone at the border and demand to see their electronic devices. However, the law did not specify that people had to also provide a password. The updated law makes clear that travelers must provide access -- whether that be a password, pin-code or fingerprint -- but officials would need to have a reasonable suspicion of wrongdoing. "It is a file-by-file [search] on your phone. We're not going into 'the cloud.' We'll examine your phone while it's on flight mode," Customs spokesperson Terry Brown said. If people refused to comply, they could be fined up to $5000 and their device would be seized and forensically searched. Mr Brown said the law struck the "delicate balance" between a person's right to privacy and Customs' law enforcement responsibilities. "I personally have an e-device and it maintains all my records -- banking data, et cetera, et cetera -- so we understand the importance and significance of it."
Digital search? (Score:5, Funny)
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The term "digital search" is a bit ambiguous. (Prostate exam comes to mind) Is this really what search electronic devices is called?
The abstract above specifies what the digital search entails. Sorry, no digits on the prostate. I'm sure if you told them you had a bag of crack up your crack they might investigate- but it probably won't be from a pretty nurse.
Re: Digital search? (Score:5, Interesting)
I wipe my iphone before landing on a plane, and set it up as new. I do the same with my iPad. I have an external SSD that I use as a time capsule specifically for time capsule to quickly update and backup / restore. It's encrypted, so it won't show anything unless you know how to mount it (a simple offset).
When I'm through customs, I start restoring my laptop, then my iDevices. It's terribly inconvenient, and never been tested crossing the border back into the US, but I'm of Arab descent and I feel that if they want you, they will simply plant it or find SOMETHING you have done to break the law.
This is the sad state of "freedom" in the US these days. I'm a citizen (have been since birth) like my father before me.
Re: Digital search? (Score:3)
Cause nothing says "I'm a suspicious criminal" like coming off an intentional flight with an obviously used iPhone / iPad that has been reset to factory defaults.
They can still plant something on the device, which you could then prove was planted, however that requires you to disclose your backup method, which the police would take as evidence that you have something to hide and so would get a court order to access your backup, which they could then plant something in anyway.
So sure, you've reduced they lik
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Except they don't know that his device has been wiped until after they have decided he is guilty of being arab and decide to search him.
Re: Digital search? (Score:2)
Um, yeah, he said he did this because he is worried there gong to plant something on his device. Obviously that requires him to have already been targeted for additional search procedures, so I'm outlining why erasing your phone in such circumstances makes you look guilty of trying to hide something.
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The goal is to cast many nets. Each has a chance to catch something. None of them are effective on their own. Cumulatively, the system appears to be very effective.
Math is simple. Contrast the amount of hatred for US with amount of terrorism in US. The system as a whole is definitely working well.
Bomb detectors? (Score:3, Insightful)
Nicely put about the US but... Have you ever been to Mexico or Argentina? I've never seen a bomb detector in a McDonald's in my life. Mexico's said to be dangerous near the border, but in Mexico City I saw nothing like what you describe, not even in Acapulco. Also, Mexico's violence is predominantly related to drug traffic and plain old crime (kidnappings too).
Your description of Argentina is totally inaccurate too. Even though there were two terrorist incidents in the last 30 years to Jewish/Israeli target
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"like my father before me", an assassin...
Sorry, couldn't resist. :)
Re: Digital search? (Score:5, Interesting)
Relying to this top comment so more people see this.
As an NZ citizen I think this isn't a great development and understand why people in these comments are setting don't go to NZ and only take burner electronics with you etc.
What is missing, is that the border service currently only request searches of electronic devices about 500 times a year, total, across all border arrivals. That's a little over 1 per day across the whole country.
You have to be a suspect in the first place before they ask for your device. They don't expect the number to increase due to the new policy.
So yes, this is an unfortunate development and it'd be better if they didn't have these powers. However you have to be pretty damn "unlucky" to be targeted by this policy in the first place. 99.9999% of border crossers have nothing to worry about.
Re: Digital search? (Score:4, Insightful)
wanna bet those numbers increase?
- js.
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However, as an NZ citizen also, any time I return from overseas if a customs agent asks for my phone unlock I will be telling him no and contesting the $5,000 fine in court.
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Re: Digital vacuum? (Score:5, Informative)
It is important to keep in mind that NZ is a party to the "Five Eyes [wikipedia.org]" intelligence-sharing partnership (the others being the USA, Great Britain, Canada, and Australia). Why that's important is that the agreement between them specifies that any intelligence developed by any of the parties is made freely available to the others, both in regular summary reports, and in full, upon request.
What that means on a practical level is that any data NZ's Customs folks uncover in their search of arrivals' devices that they decide might be of interest to any one of their three national intelligence-gathering organizations is automagically rendered to them. They, in turn, make that data available to the other four signatories' national spies. As Edward Snowden's massive document dump revealed, a key goal of the alliance is to enable the signatories to thwart the limits their own laws place on surveillance and intelligence-gathering activities directed at their own citizens and legal residents. (Appropriately enough, the NZ Herald ran an in-depth report on the subject [nzherald.co.nz] in its March 5, 2015 edition. It makes for interesting reading, both because its viewpoint is a non-U.S. one, and because it traces the kind of egregious, systematic overreach that the port-of-entry personal electronics search policy TFS exemplifies specifically to the administration of NZ's National Party leader and (now-former) Prime Minister John Key [wikipedia.org].)
As an example of how the Five Eyes alliance enables its signatories' end-run around their own citizens' privacy protections, Snowden likes to point to a routine tactic that he, as an IT contractor for the NSA, personally witnessed every day: when an NSA analyst wants to look at the phone record metadata, web browsing history, email, and/or other "signals intercept" intelligence on a citizen of the USA who currently resides within its borders - which it is legally forbidden to do without first obtaining a FISA court warrant - he or she need only inform GCHQ (Britain's version of the NSA) of that desire. One of GCHQ's analysts then uses the spy tech that the NSA shares with GCHQ - often the exact same program the NSA person is running - to look up the requested record in GCHQ's database, and helpfully sends a copy of the results to his or her NSA counterpart.
Employing the narrowest possible interpretation of both countries' legal strictures, the search itself is not technically forbidden by U.S. law, because the actual surveillance and initial data acquisition was performed by GCHQ (albeit on the NSA's request), and that organization is not bound by U.S. statutes or Constitutional prohibitions on searches and seizures conducted without the shield of a judicial warrant. And the fact that GCHQ's analyst shared the results with the one from the NSA is, likewise, not illegal, for the same reason.
That kind of data sharing, which is based on the sketchiest possible interpretation of the respective nations' laws, happens thousands of times per day - and it works both ways.
Or, rather, I should say it works all five ways ...
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Or, rather, I should say it works all five ways ...
10 ways if it's bi-directional.
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I suck at maths,
5 ways times 5 ways == 25, bi-directional means 50 ways. At least. Then there's data stored someplace where it may or may not be or have been or is about to be, compromised by flaw or design, etc.
But I digress.
here's a few extra commas, place them wherever you want. ,,, , ,,,
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I suck at maths, 5 ways times 5 ways == 25, bi-directional means 50 ways.
You still suck at math. Five parties sharing means for each party there are four others to share with. Five parties sharing with the other four is 20 ways. Since the reverse direction is included, it's still just 20.
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Fair enough.
How many parallel dimensions in a quantum state do you feel safe adding to the equation? Cause in one of those realms I can actually do math. Lol.
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Every which way but loose.
$5000 fine? (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:$5000 fine? (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:$5000 fine? (Score:5, Insightful)
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Or America, or pretty much anywhere, since pretty much all border agents have the legal authority to search your stuff, including your phone.
It's not like New Zealand is the only place where this applies.
Hell, in America since the "border" is now arbitrarily within 100 miles of the actual border, that is most of the population. And the US Border Patrol have already set up checkpoints in random places and demanded ID.
So, if you live in the US, don't go ge
US Border Patrol demanding ID (Score:3)
Actually CBP merely request ID and legal status.
The problem is that when an aggressive uniform with sidearm gets in your face and states "Are you a citizen? I need to see some ID!" it does rather come across as a demand.
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New Zealand is a beautiful country and one that I would like to visit again. The people were all very nice, but the bozos they've elected as lawmakers don't appear to share some of those same traits.
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Not simple (Score:2)
Don't bring personal/business electronics across borders. It's that simple.
Not really much of a choice these days. Are you really going to go on a business trip without your laptop and phone? I'm sure your employer might have something to say about that. Are you really going to go on vacation without your smartphone? It's not that simple and pretending won't make it so.
Re:Not simple (Score:5, Informative)
Most employers don't care (Score:2)
My employer would have something to say about it. They would issue me burners.
Then your employer is very unusual indeed. That isn't how most of them roll in my experience.
This just imposes a huge expense on business travelers in order to apprehend the dumbest of criminals.
It's a little worse than that. It also means some genuinely innocent people are going to get to be abused by the authorities. You're right that it will not catch anyone worth catching which should make one wonder what the real point is...
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My employer would have something to say about it. They would issue me burners.
Then your employer is very unusual indeed. That isn't how most of them roll in my experience.
Any company that has ever been the victim of spying by a foreign nation state tends to have policies that limit exposure to future abuse.
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Re:$5000 fine? (Score:5, Insightful)
All this does is disrupt legitimate travellers who have genuine need to carry such devices.
Any serious criminal is going to be prepared for this... they will travel with devices containing nothing but a fresh install and download any data they want over an encrypted channel using the first internet connection they gain access to.
Also, what assurances do you have that the government will be able to keep your data secure and not leak it somehow?
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Yes. Smart people don't try and smuggle things across borders. They pay stupid people to do it for them.
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Those shows by definition are showing the people who got caught, who are therefore the most stupid of criminals, or people who are just stupid (ie they weren't actually intending to do anything illegal)...
Illegal drugs are widely available in AU/NZ, so clearly criminals are getting them into the country and doing so without being detected. The vast majority of criminals are not stupid, and are not getting caught.
But trying to smuggle a physical item is very different from carrying a device containing digita
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Re: $5000 fine? (Score:5, Interesting)
Re: $5000 fine? (Score:2)
Re: $5000 fine? (Score:5, Informative)
I assume your employer has rules concerning travel with the laptop containing the oh-so-special secrets. Mine does. Leave it at home and take a burner. It's the cost of doing business and the burner costs less than $5000.
Re: $5000 fine? (Score:5, Insightful)
So which law trumps the other one?
I don't see a conflict.
You'll already lose your job (and worse) if you travel to a country like North Korea or Iran.
Just add New Zealand to that list. Do not go to New Zealand, or you may lose your job and possibly go to prison for the rest of your life. Or if you do go there with your devices on an official government business, you better make sure you have diplomatic immunity.
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It's one of the ways they're trying to get the cost of housing down, by limiting the number of people who want to live here with their stupid policies.
Screwed either way (Score:2)
So which law trumps the other one?
Sadly for you it doesn't matter most likely. The local authorities (where you physically are) can throw you in jail (or worse), possibly beat you with the xkcd wrench [xkcd.com], and keep your laptop for as long as they like. Hell they can torture it out of you if they like and you have little to no legal rights. Nation states aren't really accountable to anyone if they don't want to be. Unless you have some sort of diplomatic immunity and the security to back it up then you are fucked well and good. Your job st
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The local authorities (where you physically are) can throw you in jail (or worse), possibly beat you with the xkcd wrench [xkcd.com], and keep your laptop for as long as they like. Hell they can torture it out of you if they like and you have little to no legal rights. Nation states aren't really accountable to anyone if they don't want to be.
It's also not entirely clear how much your own government will care about you if you get held by the local authorities.
This is the great thing about living in a first world democracy, how we have the human rights we deserve because of how we protected them.
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I work in a critical field. My employer (the State by the way) requires my laptop and phone must be encrypted. I could lose my job or much worse of I give my password to anyone. So which law trumps the other one?
Sovereign jurisdictions each make their own rules, so both. But personally as an employee I would let the NZ goons do what they want and claim duress back home, it's their soil and their law. Do you think US customs would give a shit about NZ law? If they'll let me I might call my boss and try to escalate it past my pay grade, but if I'm not I'd take the defense that they beat me with a $5000 legal wrench. Assuming that you went there on a work trip by the employer's rules of course, if the rules say to get
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The fine ALSO includes forfeiture of the device and subjecting it to analysis, and legally their country can continue to heap more penalties on you if you fail to provide access once their lawyers are involved.
So, it's still probably 'not worth it'.
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Re: $5000 fine? (Score:2)
"There is no technical way for the attacker to know if you are done revealing encrypted volumes without literally reading your mind)."
Seems you've missed the entire point of the wrench test. An average citizen who is being interrogated and under stress is likely to give away signs that they aren't telling the truth, i.e. your mind can be read by your facial features.
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Not to mention them denying you entry to the country. That's going to mean you'll have a harder time getting in to any other country in the future.
They'll put you on a list they share with their friendly nations and immigration will get notified of the other countries you've been denied entry to.
Damn it! Foiled again! (Score:2, Funny)
If only there was some other way to transport digital information...
Trust us (Score:3)
so we understand the importance and significance (Score:3)
so we understand the importance and significance of it
You clearly don't.
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In This Thread (Score:2)
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a year ago, I was contacted by a recruiter in NZ, asking if I wanted to move there for a job. I was a little tempted, having gone thru a nasty dry period in employment here in the US.
at this point, I'm so glad I didn't move to NZ. this article is very telling about the legal culture there. I want no part of it. we have that same crap here and I don't like it. in fact, it sounds worse in the british-oriented lands; UK, oz and NZ all seem like they're racing toward fascism even faster than the US is!
glad
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I for one, aren't mourning the loss of your immigration.
Yeah, right (Score:2)
I personally have an e-device ...
Sounds likely.
Easy solution? (Score:2)
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Dual "boot" (Score:3)
Why not just a dual boot mode? Enter in passcode 1 and you get boot region 1 which can be a generic install with a few downloaded apps for cosmetics.
Passcode 2 gets you the other boot region.
Bonus points for some cheesy option that prevents boot region 2 from loading at all for some time window or number of reboots.
5000 bucks buys a new fresh computer and phone (Score:2)
If you're traveling for business, ask about corporate policy with regards to this policy,
If it is for personal equipment, it's cheaper to buy/rent something, than be forced to give up your personal/pirated data.
hmm (Score:2)
Time to start carrying 'clean phones'
Burner Phone (Score:2)
Cheap Cells are available everywhere.
Just cross with a new phone and restore your data and settings from your backups over the internet with a VPN.
Comment removed (Score:4, Interesting)
"Refuse to comply"? (Score:4, Insightful)
One method which privacy protestors sometimes favor is wiping their phone prior to entering the airport terminal, and restoring it to normal after leaving... and with the ubiquity of encryption on smart phones, that makes it extremely likely that a forensic search would be entirely fruitless, regardless of the methods employed. So how long will it take for airport authorities to decide that a wiped phone qualifies as a refusal to comply?
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Wrong direction (Score:2)
Shouldn't they be worried about the data that is leaving the country? Not the stuff coming in? Anything from state secrets to kiddie porn, they need the be looking for the stuff on its way out, not in.
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Shouldn't they be worried about the data that is leaving the country?
They're not looking for "data". They're not looking for your company's magical design for the next cancer cure. They're not looking for the secret financial data that proves that your company is screwing the IRS.
They're looking for data that would indicate that you are not traveling for the purpose you claimed on your entry permit or visa. If you are on a tourist visa, then if they suspect that you are actually on business they will ask to see your phone's data. That SMS you forgot to delete that says "Th
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None of this matters. Anything stolen or generated in-country illegally will be caught going outbound. They don't check for that.
If you are on a tourist visa, then if they suspect that you are actually on business
If I was on business, I'd be more than happy to declare that. And then on my way out, I'd just tell customs that the deal fell through because the regulatory environment in their country was shit. And if they push me, I'll tell them that I'd be more than happy to inform their local press about how a $10 billion investment deal just slipped away.
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If I was on business, I'd be more than happy to declare that.
That's swell. If everyone was such a law-abiding conscientious citizen there'd be no need for police of any kind. I think the point is that not everyone is, and these folks have a job to do. There are certainly people who would claim holiday status while coming for work, especially if they are from a country that requires an actual visa before entry, or if they are bringing in high-dollar samples that they intend to leave behind. That's the kind of thing they're looking for.
And then on my way out, I'd just tell customs that the deal fell through because the regulatory environment in their country was shit.
You don't talk to customs on the
titles dont help (Score:2)
So what do they do in North Korea or China?
The same thing?
Besides NZ being 20k miles away by plane as a reason to to visit, I don't have anything on my non-smart phone but I still wouldn't go.
Yes America can do this too but at least I can stay in the country and not have to deal with customs.
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Nowhere on earth is 20,000 miles away. The earth is less than 25,000 miles in circumference.
Good to see the American education system at work.
"Delicate balance." (Score:5, Insightful)
"Mr Brown said the law struck the 'delicate balance' between a person's right to privacy and Customs' law enforcement responsibilities."
Yes. A "delicate balance" wherein customs officials can do whatever they want to your device and slap you with a $5000 fine if you refuse to comply and you have no recourse if you think they're acting in bad faith.
In so far as dropping an anvil on one side of the scale is a "delicate balance," I suppose that's true.
The "Delicate balance" here (Score:2)
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is that rich people just pay the fine
Did you miss the part about "their device would be seized and forensically searched"?
Yes, they might be unable to unlock your device, but you will still lose the device.
encryption? (Score:2)
Does this extend to encrypted data stored on such devices?
So what you can log in if it's all encrypted anyway...
It appears this could only be effective for an ad-hock searches of hobbyist criminals and would do nothing for professionals?
What do they expect to find? (Score:2)
This is the first step do denial of ... (Score:3)
...Freedom of Speech. I am appalled by the NZed politicians if this is the way they want to treat travelers
Mine is one family that will continue to travel to Australia, when I can, but I have now put NZed on my "Anti-democratic government" list, until wiser souls in the NZed government returns to its' senses and quashes this kind of nihilism. And, I had such great hopes with their new Prime Minister!
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...Freedom of Speech. I am appalled by the NZed politicians if this is the way they want to treat travelers
Mine is one family that will continue to travel to Australia, when I can, but I have now put NZed on my "Anti-democratic government" list
LOL! So much stupidity in one small comment.
Let me guess, you'll go live in Canada if America introduces universal healthcare? That's the level of intelligence you're expressing saying you'll go to Australia if NZ take your electronic devices.
To say NZ is anti-democratic is even more moronic, being in 4th position in the world on the democracy index, listed as "full democracy" (Australia is 8th, United States 21st and classified as a "flawed democracy"):
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/... [wikipedia.org]
Finally, thank god yo
Reasonable... (Score:2)
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What are the dangerous files Customs needs to stop people bringing in on their phones?
They mostly want to look at your contacts. Who were the last few people you called or messaged? A recent call to "Bombs R Us" or "Joe's Exotic Reptiles" may indicate tat you are not entering the country for the reasons stated on your customs form.
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Citispects and tourrorists?
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New Zealand joins Australia, the United Kingdom, Canada, and of course the United States, forming The Paranoid Five. Everyone is out to hurt them and take away their freedom and liberty.
Hence it is of paramount importance that the government take away freedom and liberty first, to safeguard it for future generations.
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Burner phones are cheap.
Cost becomes irrelevant in the face of shit functionality.
Your CEO will make that clear in about 3 milliseconds when you tell him you want to swap out his iPhone for a flip phone for his next trip, because "security"...
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A CEO can afford a second iphone as a burner phone.
Suggesting that a CEO travel with a burner iPhone tends to invalidate your first rule; "Don't travel with hardware you need to trust."
I'm pretty damn sure every CEO needs to be able to trust their smartphone device, particularly as you also suggest to "cross border, restore", implying all of that highly sensitive and private information will be re-loaded back onto an device. Why would anyone perform such an action on a device you should not trust?
While I do understand your intent here from a tin-foil hat
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Inconvenience for law abiding citizens, extra cost or hassle to wipe when you go and restore a backup once you return.
For criminals, using burner phones is already a standard part of their operation so it's of little or no consequence to them.
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That's casuistry, and sidesteps the basic issue.
At issue is the right of an individual to be secure in their own privacy. Doesn't matter whether they're innocent as a lamb or dangerous as a lion. The guarantee should hold.
People who ask "what do you have to hide" generally ignore the fact that quite innocent data may easily be manipulated to provide the appearance of impropriety or criminality - and that is why privacy is important. It's not because we want to protect the guilty, but because we want to pr
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People who ask "what do you have to hide" generally ignore....
what they have to loose.
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That is not how encryption works.
Re: wipe your phone before you go (Score:2)
Note that some pornographic material is actually banned / censored as objectionable material in New Zealand, so you potentially could be charged with importing objectionable material.
I don't think goatse is a problem, but (for some reason) water sports are. Actually tubgirl might be too.
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"White" is a very American centric term, that racist term is not used in New Zealand to refer to someone's. Just as we don't use the misnomer "black". Is it the two party political system in the states that makes americans think in racial terms like white and black? It's always struck me as peculiar, people with light coloured skin are far from white (more like peach) and those with dark coloured skin are more often brown. Skin colour should matter as much as eye colour.
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If you refuse to cooperate with customs, you'll be denied entry. Being denied entry will make it extremely difficult to ever get back in.
It's not a "$5k entry fee" it's a "$5k fee, be denied entry to the country and have your device confiscated for forensic examination"
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Name one country that won't confiscate your device and deny you entry if they want to search it.
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Don't let facts get in the way of an internet rant.
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