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Some Baltimore Residents Are Lobbying To Bring Back Aerial Surveillance (theoutline.com) 145

Posted by msmash from the closer-look dept.
A local group in Baltimore argues that a plane providing real-time surveillance of the city will dial down police brutality. From a report: A piloted plane would fly over the city, capture images from 30,000 feet in the air, and use a computer program to stitch the photos together for a real-time, by-the-second portrait of what's happening on the ground. With access to all 911 dispatches, which provide information about the the time and place of a crime, local analysts could track the dot-like people and cars at the scene of a crime forward and backward in time until they arrive at a house or address. With a permit from the city of Baltimore, this surveillance system could access videos from street cameras and cross-reference their aerial data with precise, on-the-ground footage.

The analysts would then compose a PowerPoint report with visual data and a written explanation regarding the activities of all possible suspects or witnesses, and they send out five copies of that report via thumb drive: two copies go to the Baltimore police (one for an investigator, and one for evidence storage), and if the case goes to trial, two copies are given to the city prosecutor, and one copy is given to the defense. All of this could occur in just a few hours. Baltimore residents argue that a system like this is the only solution for a city grappling with high crime rates and a systemically corrupt police department.
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Some Baltimore Residents Are Lobbying To Bring Back Aerial Surveillance More

Some Baltimore Residents Are Lobbying To Bring Back Aerial Surveillance

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  • eh.. no it won't.. (Score:2, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward

    whenever its footage is "needed", it will be conveniently missing or cameras or recording servers discovered to have been 'broken' at the time of whatever incident the footage is needed from.

    • Re: (Score:2, Insightful)

      by ShanghaiBill ( 739463 )

      whenever its footage is "needed", it will be conveniently missing

      Have you ever been on a jury? They tend to be made up of people from the lower echelons of society who have neither the means nor the need to weasel out of jury duty. These are the people least likely to believe the police, and given some lame excuse about "missing footage", they are going to award the abused plaintiff everything he is asking for.

      On another subject: Why is this a "piloted plane"? A drone would be far less expensive, and just as capable of carrying a 5 gram camera.

      • Re: eh.. no it won't.. (Score:4, Insightful)

        by reiterate ( 1965732 ) on Friday August 31, 2018 @11:30AM (#57231860)
        That's not true. Juries rarely convict cops, eapecially white juries, especially when the officer involved was on duty. You seem like one of those people who thinks court proceedings are about the rule of law and not about 2 highly trained parties attempting to manipulate the opinion of average citizens to see who "wins".

        • Juries rarely convict cops

          Doesn't matter. It is the civil suits that are important, because they hit the wallets of the people that have the power to fix the problems. That is not the cop on the beat.

          The cops who beat Rodney King were acquitted, but the City of Los Angeles still had to pay out $3.8M in civil damages.

          • Civil cases have juries. Unless both parties waive the right. And I fail to see how the LA comptroller cutting a check addresses the systemic abuses found in many American police organizations. Indivudual convictions is exactly how you stop that.

          • The cops who beat Rodney King were acquitted

            Two of them were convicted in a federal show trial and sentenced to 3 years in prison.

            but the City of Los Angeles still had to pay out $3.8M in civil damages.

            Which, in this case, rewards the perpetrator for being a cunt who resists arrest after leading cops on a high-speed chase which itself was motivated by the desire to avoid going back to jail for a previous robbery. So obviously that's a miscarriage of justice right there. Even if you're going to "punish" the city with a monetary fine, the money should not be going to the scumbag who caused the incident to occur in the fi

            • Re: (Score:2)

              by DanDD ( 1857066 )

              Aren't District Attorneys, Chiefs of Police and legislators elected?

              When a portion of a city's tax revenue is spent on legal settlements, isn't that disclosed in some way to the citizens of that city?

              Don't these citizens vote?

              It seems to me that significant fines against a city and it's corrupt police actions is a perfectly reasonable thing to do. Citizens can choose to keep electing leaders that allow such things, thus wasting their tax money, or they can elect new leaders.

              As far as a perpetrator resistin

              • Don't these citizens vote?

                In municipal elections? Be serious. Voter turnout is dismal, especially in large cities, and issues like these don't even make it onto the voters radar. The negative publicity around these events can occasionally damage political aspirations; the fines never do.

                As far as a perpetrator resisting arrest and all that, the last time I checked, "Innocent until proven guilty" is a thing in this country, and it should serve to equally protect all: white, black, brown, and yellow.

                Of course. But if you think that the presumption of innocence gives you the right to resist arrest ... you are badly confused.

                We don't justify skimping on due process for anyone, for obvious reasons. Ever. Even if it results in a miscarriage of justice from time to time.

                The way due process works: you see police lights in your reaeview mirrror, so you pull over to the side of the road. T

                • Re: (Score:2)

                  by DanDD ( 1857066 )

                  I'm not sure what part of "due process" you think was violated in the King case, but I know that you're wrong.

                  You know? Do you now?

                  Here are the facts: [wikipedia.org] (emphasis mine)

                  ... Koon acknowledged ordering the continued use of batons, directing Powell and Wind to strike King with "power strokes." According to Koon, Powell and Wind used "bursts of power strokes, then backed off." The officers beat King, who was already subdued. In the videotape, King continues to try to stand again. Koon orders the officers to "hit his joints, hit the wrists, hit his elbows, hit his knees, hit his ankles." Officers Wind, Briseno, and Powell attempted numerous baton strikes on King, resulting in some misses but with 33 blows hitting King, plus six kicks. The officers again "swarm" King, but this time a total of eight officers are involved in the swarm. King is placed in handcuffs and cordcuffs, restraining his arms and legs. King is dragged on his abdomen to the side of the road to await the arrival of emergency medical rescue.

                  Fortunately the US judicial system doesn't agree with you, and has confirmed that continuing to beat a drunk and subdued man is a violation of due process:

                  The federal trial focused more on the incident. On March 9 of the 1993 trial, King took the witness stand and described to the jury the events as he remembered them.[48] The jury found Officer Laurence Powell and Sergeant Stacey Koon guilty, and they were subsequently sentenced to 30 months in prison. Timothy Wind and Theodore Briseno were acquitted of all charges.

                  Yes, King was a piece of shit that needed brought to justice. No, this does not give police the right to deny due process and beat senseless someone that annoys them. At least not in the USA. Perhaps this is ok wherever it is that you are from.

                  In a previous conversation [slashdot.org] you trivialized the treat

                  • You know? Do you now?

                    Yes. With a great degree of certainty prior to your response, and with 100% certainty now that you've confirmed it.

                    Fortunately the US judicial system doesn't agree with you, and has confirmed that continuing to beat a drunk and subdued man is a violation of due process

                    Wrong. Your quote does not say what they were actually convicted of, so its entirely irrelevant to the point you're trying to make. The page you stole it from, however, does; to summarize, the judge in the case found that the first minute and a half of them beating him was perfectly fine and within the law, including the facial fractures, the broken leg bone, and all of the substantive harm

                    • Re: (Score:2)

                      by DanDD ( 1857066 )

                      Oh noes. A pedophile thinks I'm racist. Whatever shall I do.

                      You might want to avoid having your identity and these little 'private thoughts' of yours become public in, say, Latino neighborhoods, black neighborhoods, or near Indian reservations. Then again, you do seem to be bat-bat shit crazy, and psychopathic tendencies [bustle.com] are generally self destructive, so who know's what you'll do.

                      When your last little nerve of white supremacy and hatred snaps and you lose it, I hope your arresting officers treat you humanely on your little trip to the funny farm.

                    • Thanks for the tip pedo-boy. You might likewise want to avoid having your fondness for fondling little kids become public in, say, prison. Chances are they'll find out anyway, but the longer you can keep it a secret the less damage your asshole will take.

                      Good luck!

        • Well it happens.. https://www.cnn.com/2018/08/29... [cnn.com]

      • On another subject: Why is this a "piloted plane"? A drone would be far less expensive, and just as capable of carrying a 5 gram camera.
        Because the laws don't allow drones to be used that way. E.g. it is only allowed to be in a certain range of the controlling station.

        • Re: (Score:1)

          by Anonymous Coward

          Also, the laws of physics don’t allow a five-gram camera, manufactured using 2018-level material science and technology, to have the published optical characterustics mwntioned the article.

          The weight limit puts an upper bound on the mass (given density of available optics) which puts upper limit on lens aperture and focal length, which puts limit on angular resolution resolution (due to diffraction limit), which puts limit on spatial resolution at ground level.

      • That was a pretty quick rabbit hole you just slid down. People that are to you, "low class", are not going to be fair? That really speaks more about your person than about anyone else.

        I've been to jury duty in all possible courts available in my jurisdictions and I've seen people from every walk of life. Every one of them can wear a nice skirt or button up shirt too. Your presumptions don't work on the people I've seen when I've reported for jury duty.

        --
        I'm smarter than the av-er-age bear! - Y. Bear

    • Body cams and dash cams would be more effective than a camera from 10,000 feet.

    • Yep. Key phrase for why expecting this to work well is optimistic: "systemically corrupt police department".

  • So reform. That is the only solution. (Score:5, Interesting)

    by bill.pev ( 978836 ) on Friday August 31, 2018 @10:46AM (#57231586)
    The solution to a systemically corrupt police force should be the reformation of the police force, not some multi-million dollar project to watch all activity in the city and beget from, dare I say it, corruption itself. Plus, where would that end?

    I hope "the citizens" all declared their personal interests in such a project. As if.

    • Re:So reform. That is the only solution. (Score:4, Insightful)

      by jellomizer ( 103300 ) on Friday August 31, 2018 @11:14AM (#57231742)

      The problem is all their training, has taught the police to front line infantry and not police.
      They are all about catching the bad guys vs making the place safe for the population.

      There really should more cops outside of cars and helicopters just walking the streets, knowing the people and the culture. Not a force to fight it. Yes there are dangerous elements such a gangs, and bad guys who seem to actively want to make the area a dangerous place who need to be dealt with with force. And they should have the rights to be safe.

      However the main argument against these reforms, is that police will second guess their instincts putting themselves in danger, or letting the bad guy get away. However I think we as a culture should say our freedoms is worth the risks, of bad guys getting away and some people may be hurt.

      • So what you're saying is... (Score:1)

        by Anonymous Coward

        ...we need cops to walk about, but then have an armed paramilitary force armed to the teeth to fight crime? Sounds good to me.

      • This is called "Community Policing" and used to be the norm in policing. Why did it go away? Violence in the 'inner city" was one thing. Not wanting to have enough cops on the street - literally , walking the neighborhoods. Minorities resenting white cops. Lots of reasons. I agree we need to return to it - but I doubt if there's the will on the part of the taxpayers to go for that.
        • There are big differences between a "Police Force" and "An Occupational Army" that people are missing. 1-A police force is there to Protect the Community, and must have community support to achieve that goal. If nobody reports crime they have nothing to investigate. A police force must conduct foot patrols to be effective. You can tell who the police work for by looking at where they conduct their foot patrols. 2-An occupational army isn't there to protect the community, they are there to protect their
          • I absolutely agree. However, when you try community policing and the cops get assaulted and battered, well, it does make the idea be "let 'em kill each other" yes?

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by Mal-2 ( 675116 )

      I know someone who unfortunately bought into the recruiting bullshit of the BPD that they were looking for "new blood to change the culture" and signed on with them as his first police job. He's stuck there for a couple years if he doesn't want to look like a job churner, which would be bad for his future hopes of working for the FBI.

      How the hell do you enforce reform if nobody watches the watchers?

  • I was all in until... (Score:1, Funny)

    by Anonymous Coward

    ...PowerPoint.

    Don't know why, that made me laugh. New method of capital punishment: Death by PowerPoint.

    • I was thinking the same thing... here was my stream of consciousness:

      Hmmm.... aerial surveillance eh? I have heard of this in the context of Mexico.... what podcast was that? 99PI? Can't remember... huh.... "some residents" eh? Paranoid residents perhaps.... uh huh..... real-time, stitching together..... where is that data stored? All streamed by satellite? Is 30k ft close enough to get cell coverage? Not sure that they direct signals up in the air.... probably local storage with periodic dumps.... how much

  • Cluster Fuck Dichotomy (Score:3, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward on Friday August 31, 2018 @10:46AM (#57231592)

    What a fucking mess.

    Too many cops
    Not enough cops
    Not arresting criminals
    Arresting too many minorities
    Oppressive Police Presence
    Not enough police presence.

    It seems like the minority communities rationally understand that the police are a force for good, keep order and protect the innocent. But they just can't wrap their minds around the fact that in doing so, their friends and family members who are the perpetrators of the violence are going to be arrested and sometimes killed when they draw down on cops.

    Their Tribalism will be their end.

    • Realizing there needs to be a balance and it isn't all or nothing, will help you understand this.
      Too many police in cars or placed in a way isolating themselves themselves from the public. Their is too much police hunting down the bad guys, and not enough serve and protect where they are patrolling the streets talking to the people.

      Second why are you connecting minorities with criminals?

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by swb ( 14022 )

        Too many police in cars or placed in a way isolating themselves themselves from the public. Their is too much police hunting down the bad guys, and not enough serve and protect where they are patrolling the streets talking to the people.

        I agree with this wholeheartedly. But AFAIK, police labor budgets for the most part have already been normalized to absorb the savings that comes with the efficiencies associated with putting cops in cars and having them serve a much broader geographical area than any cop on foot could.

        Bottom line, police forces have nowhere near the manpower necessary to go back to foot patrols and couldn't go back to foot patrols without a major funding increase. Most cities that need it the most (ie, more poor and mino

        • Maybe you should not fund your police at the local level.

          The most affluent often need police presence the least. Lack of resources breeds conflict.

          The same with schools and a lot of other public services by the way.

          I usually find that the US model makes no sense. So I'll add in that getting rid of a lot of guns would also help.

          • Re: (Score:2)

            by swb ( 14022 )

            I don't think local funding of police will change due to the distributed nature of the US political structure. Plus local funding == local control. Nobody wants a national police force accountable only to Congress or a giant Federal bureaucracy.

        • If you stop spending money on the war on drugs you'd have enough for foot patrols. You know something is wrong when the police arrest and prosecute the Victim of crime.

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by sycodon ( 149926 )

        Do you have any idea of...

        1. The equipment they carry and its weight?
        2. How hot it can get in most of the US during the summer and almost all year in some parts?
        3. How exposed that leaves them?

      • Anecdote: I lived within sight of a police station, and one of the "bad parts of town" was quite literally two blocks behind my house. In 5 years of living there, I never once saw a cop on foot outside of the parking lot of the police station. They could walk past my window and 5 minutes later be where their presence was most needed, but seemingly never did.

        But they did have a quarter million dollar APC that they couldn't drive on most streets because it was too big and heavy.

    • Only the first two you mentioned are a dichotomy. The rest have to do with how police go about their business and can all be solved at once.

  • Cameras are racist dependent on altitude? (Score:3, Insightful)

    by Luckyo ( 1726890 ) on Friday August 31, 2018 @10:48AM (#57231604)

    First of all, when story starts with "A handful of Baltimoreans are willing to try anything to stop their police force from killing them", you know you're looking at the standard far left anti-police hit piece.

    Second, the story has all of the far left talking points. Namely utterly ignoring who is committing the crimes, complaints of racial profiling based on the fact that clear majority of criminals in this community fit a certain race profile, accusations of "Hitler, uncle Tom" pointed toward black people who dare to disagree. And really novel and strange beliefs on part of people complaining, such as suggesting that they can't tell race from high above, so it's ok to conduct surveillance from there as opposed to street level, which is apparently racist to do.

    The only thing I got from the story is that people behind the complaints are not the sharpest tools in the box, and that far leftist dogma is alive and well in their circles, and crying wolf in old ways apparently got old, they had to invent new talking points, such as the fact that camera surveillance on ground level is just racist and cannot be trusted, because [bigotry and corruption], but camera far in the air can be.

    I guess they never looked into resolutions and ability to see colour of those aerial cameras they're looking for.

    • Why do you think Baltimore is the way it IS?

      You have a community COMMITTED to finding any possible thing to blame other than themselves. Leftists feed off the energy generated by the rage, so city administrations simply continue to feed the fire instead of fixing the place. Baltimore is to Democrats what Palestine is to Radical Arabs: a source of rage, energy, conscript-victims and (in Baltimore's case) reliable votes.

      cf Detroit, coming soon: Chicago.

    • Comment removed based on user account deletion
    • I used to be a policemen and stopped because a) I haven't liked the direction the country has been going since Clinton was President, regardless of which party was in power, and b) police management is , shall we say, not good. It's so weird because I'm quite sure there are racist cops - there are racists in every profession and fortunately not as many as their once were. Ultimately some of the issues cops have with various classes of people (and this is not a synonym for American blacks, because dependin
    • I agree with some of your assessment - except for the far left part. Professional organizers and academics pushing for a technical solution to a social problem that have no analysis of capital? These people are center-left through and through.

  • Dirigibles! (Score:2, Interesting)

    by Anonymous Coward

    If they want constant aerial surveillance, use a constant aerial observation platform. A collection of lighter-than-air craft with high resolution cameras can record the entire city constantly and at much lower per-day energy costs than spyplanes.
    Use some combination of course-correction and semi-strong tethers to maintain position. With the size of modern cameras and communication options, each skyeye only needs a few pounds of payload, which can be padded to minimize risk when the lift portions fail..

  • A handful of Baltimoreans are willing to try anything to stop their police force from killing them, and one technologist is only too happy to help.

    So a small group of people wants to decide this for everyone else? Also how much you want to bet they're white and perhaps also upper-middle-class or higher? Also what if the Balitmore P.D. is overwhelmingly racist and will conveniently not pay any attention to, or just coindicentally not have any recordings of areas where police brutality allegedly is occurring? TFA also says there's ground-level surveillance cameras all over the place already, both owned by the city and by private parties/businesses. Real

    • So a small group of people wants to decide this for everyone else?

      Welcome to how the entire country works.

  • It's the lobbying group the 6 folks who want this set up. I bet if you did some digging you'd find they're not just after security. If I had to guess they run a company that fuels the planes or something. Every time I see something like this that no sane person would want I find a PAC behind it looking to line their pockets.

  • What a ridiculous idea... go with body cameras. (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Noishkel ( 3464121 ) on Friday August 31, 2018 @11:17AM (#57231760)

    First off I'd point out that Baltimore is a city of about 620,000. Not the biggest city, but it's more than big enough that trying to provide areal over watch to watch the watchers, so to speak, is going to be increasingly expensive. Not to mention the fact of how hard it is going to be to try and use a 'computer program to stitch the photos' of still pictures from 30K feet up in the air. Assuming that's even technologically possible and good enough to be used in a court of law. Not to mention the idea of trying to fly in bad weather or at night, and most digital cameras don't work very well at night, especially when your moving.

    No, I think this entire plan was cooked up by some activist group that doesn't have a single clue about what they're talking about. But if they're really concerned about police brutality then I would suggest lobbying the BPD to use mandatory body cameras. That's a far more feasible plan than trying to do areal surveillance of the police. Of course I don't really think they'll go for that... because it turns out that those body cameras sometimes end up being used in court to justify the actions of the police against bad actors. There's been a handful of incidents where someone get's pulled over by the cops, make up a wild story after the fact about police brutality, only to have their claim completely disproves when the body camera footage is released.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by Pulzar ( 81031 )

      Assuming that's even technologically possible and good enough to be used in a court of law. Not to mention the idea of trying to fly in bad weather or at night, and most digital cameras don't work very well at night, especially when your moving.

      It's already been used in 2016, so it's technologically quite possible and effective.

      https://www.bloomberg.com/features/2016-baltimore-secret-surveillance/ [bloomberg.com]

      That's when the original "outrage" shut it down... but now I guess some want it back.

      The point is not so much to

    • Of course I don't really think they'll go for that... because it turns out that those body cameras sometimes end up being used in court to justify the actions of the police against bad actors. There's been a handful of incidents where someone get's pulled over by the cops, make up a wild story after the fact about police brutality, only to have their claim completely disproves when the body camera footage is released.

      They don't see it that way generally because body cams do correlate with a decrease in accusations of police misconduct, so most of the people complaining about the cops still want them.

      It's funny watching their spin on it though. The decrease in accusations against police is spun as "See they work! Cops don't commit as much crime when they're being watched!". Of course an equally likely explanation is that the rate decreases because many false accusations of misconduct don't get made when people know th

  • So the people are willing to be surveilled/tracked wherever they go in the hopes to reduce police brutality. Ben Franklin: "Those who would give up essential Liberty.....

  • Why not drones? (Score:3)

    by jwhyche ( 6192 ) on Friday August 31, 2018 @11:26AM (#57231820) Homepage

    Instead of flying airplanes over the city, why not a fleet of drones? Seems that would be cheaper, better for the environment, and have better coverage.

    The whole ideal of trying to blanket the city with 24 hour camera coverage is stupid, not to mention all the privacy issues it would entail. But if you are going to do something stupid, lets at least be smart about it.

    • Why not treat crooked cops as criminals?

      Seriously, why is wearing a badge and uniform automatic immunity to virtually every blatant transgression? Police should be held ot a higher standard, not a very low one. Seeing your fellow brother's in blue headed to the lockup will be more of a wake-up call than hours and hours of training and re-training you not to beat the crap out of, or shoot those you are protecting and serving.

      • Crooked cops are criminals and should be treated that way! Plain. And. Simple.

      • Re: (Score:3)

        by jwhyche ( 6192 )

        Why not treat crooked cops as criminals?

        Well first you have to be able to prove the crooked cops are criminals. Not something easily done if the police control all the data that you need to do this.

        I understand both sides of the issue. People want to be able to trust the cops but "who watches the watchmen?"

  • Didn't anyone there see the movie Eagle Eye.....
    https://www.imdb.com/title/tt1... [imdb.com]

  • surveillance state (Score:5, Insightful)

    by sdinfoserv ( 1793266 ) on Friday August 31, 2018 @11:59AM (#57232084)
    If the local PD is corrupt, vote out the Council and City leadership, fire the Police Chiefs and get accountability back. Creating a surveillance state is the antithesis of freedom. Otherwise, just like Democracy in the Middle East, you end up throwing out that which you want most.

    • Re: surveillance state (Score:1)

      by Anonymous Coward

      They already fired the police chief. Twice. One for corruption and stealing money to pay for hookers, the other for not doing jack shit.

      The current police chief seems to be next on the chopping block.

      The problem is, they are all corrupt. It's a culture. You can't just fire one guy and replace him with his underling. Because 9/10 the underling learned to be corrupt from his boss.

      So it's basically corrupt all the way down. We need to clean house and "drain the swamp" LUL.

  • ... is this?

    The end game is creating a revenue stream.

    Any bullshit on the part of the surveillance company is just a parallel argument of type, "What about the children?" when the actual objective is to sell data to any and all takers.

  • "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances."
    So long as the Constitution Stands, the notion of hate speech is nonsense.
    to quote an American President:
    "You want free speech? Let’s see you acknowledge a man whose words make your blood boil, who’s standing center stag

  • Is it not a sign of utter despair that you have to fall back to a measure like this?
    Is it really so hard to have a police, like in Europe, that is there for the citizen, and not for its own purpose?

  • Corruption in the Baltimore City Police Department is absolutely endemic. I can understand citizens wanting more accountability and to root out the corruption but something like this needs to remain in the citizen's (not the P.D.'s) hands. If it remained outside the control of the state, I could see it being useful.

  • These people don't know what they are asking for (Score:4, Insightful)

    by DanDD ( 1857066 ) on Friday August 31, 2018 @12:37PM (#57232464)

    The system being described fits under the category of Wide Area Persistent Surveillance [wikipedia.org]. This requires far more than a single 5 gram camera carried by a simple drone. Perhaps a few hundred 5 gram cameras with onboard storage and data processing to geo-locate each image and stitch them together in both space and time - or at least store all the relevant data to allow all the data fusion to occur on the ground. Also, operating such a system at 30,000 feet is not practical as high-altitude clouds will often obscure the ground, and at over 5 miles range the optics needed [wikipedia.org] to discern details would be impractical on board an aircraft smaller than an airliner. These types of persistent surveillance systems typically operate much lower.

    These systems capture and record everything, and I mean everything, that moves. Nobody that lives beneath such a system will have any privacy. Keep in mind that image data from airborne sensors is often fused with ground sensors, making The Minority Report [imdb.com] more of a documentary than a sci-fi thriller.

    If a society has problems with crime and corruption, monitoring every detail with such a surveillance system will certainly be entertaining, but it's not likely to actually solve anything, and might lead to even more hilarity [imdb.com].

    Quis custodiet ipsos custodes? [wikipedia.org]

    • Re: (Score:1)

      by ebvwfbw ( 864834 )

      Post is BS. They were using a Cessna 172, something that can't get up to 30,000 without say mother nature taking it up there. Even then the pilot would soon be dead from hypoxia.

      They were at 3,000'. Some PDs are using drones to do this now. Even in rural areas.

      Don't do the crime if you can't do the time (in the theme from Baretta, 1970s cop show)

  • Here is how you know these people have no idea what they're talking about. They want all that information from 50 different angles (not even thinking about the privacy implications of that) distilled in a 5-slide PowerPoint animation. And who is going to pay for those "analysts"? I'm sure you can raise some taxes for that. And I'm sure they won't be partisan at all. Perhaps you can get some leftist group to do it.
  • Maybe Baltimore residents should spend more time lobbying for people to stop breaking the goddamn law... the rest will fix itself. Yes, there's some asshole cops out there who go too far... but let's be honest, it's not like they're just randomly abusing soccer moms and, if we're being honest, I'm not overly concerned with how nice cops are to the shitheads that can't follow the law. Wasting money to try and punish police isn't going to stop any crime or improve conditions, all it's going to do is make the

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by DanDD ( 1857066 )

      I'm not overly concerned with how nice cops are to the shitheads that can't follow the law. Wasting money to try and punish police ...

      Innocent until proven guilty and the due process of law apply to everyone here in the US. And yes, sometimes it's slow, painful and imperfect. Or, do you think it would be better if some people are more equal than others? [wikipedia.org]

      Cops should be equally nice to black shitheads, and pasty white shitheads. And while we're at it, black kids should have all the same opportunities to succeed in life as white kids, but in the US, they don't, now do they?

      Both problems require more than knee-jerk reactions. Cops are ofte

      • Re: (Score:1)

        by bblb ( 5508872 )
        No one said anything about black vs white and it's nice to see you assume you know my skin color but... I'll let you in a little secret, us black folks aren't the only people who encounter the police in Baltimore and we're also no exclusively in support of criminals. Some of us are damn sick and tired of seeing our communities ravaged by guns and drugs and young kids who want to be thugs more than they want to be doctors or lawyers. Take it from a successful black man who was raised in the projects to a sin

        • Re: (Score:2)

          by DanDD ( 1857066 )

          My apologies, I was conflation the overall issue with the Rodney King case from a different thread, which has little relevance here.

          My hackles get raised when police cross the fuzzy line from apprehension to punishment, especially when mental illness, alcohol, or drugs are involved.

          My hat is off to you and especially your mother. The world needs more people like the both of you.

          Here's a nice talk that touches on divorce and what it does to children, though it may have little relevance to your family: https [youtu.be]

  • from a few years back!
  • Comment removed based on user account deletion

  • Of course this type of system has huge Public Safety benefits, and being against Public Safety is political suicide.

    But then a phenomena rises ... not sure if there is a term for it so I will coin one for this post ... "Crimesolver Creep".

    Either it happens secretly, with no public information released, or you just wait for some crime where extending the scope would have "prevented this heinous act". There will always be such an example, if you wait long enough ... it's the nature of crime, basically. So the

  • ...the criminals that turned that city to a cesspool instead of targeting the police. Better yet, if people don't want the police in their communities, then those communities can be "no response zones" that are off limits to all public services. Seems to be what they're asking for in some of these places. Let's give it to them.

  • Bring in undercover state and feds to pose as new "criminals".
    Offer city police all kinds of different payments and see who accepts. Who says no and reports the bribe.
    Capture every offer using surveillance. The police station, in the police car, via the cell phone. Any new offer of cash could be a trap.
    Make it so every bribe offered to police "could" be from other under cover law enforcement.
    That results in a good police force over time.

    Map out all crime in the city and get the good police to enfor
  • This article is all over the place, starts with trying to stop crime but ends up claiming crime isn't the problem, it's police corruption, so is this to stop crimes or stopping police corruption? Because there's simpler ways to stop police corruption.

    Piloted plane? Is this 2003? A team of automated drones doing wide circles would be much cheaper than even one piloted plane and provide better footage in real time 24/7. Cost of a plane with maintenance, fuel, paid pilot, etc would cost a fortune in com

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