Bell Canada Wants Pirate Websites Blocked For Canadians (www.cbc.ca) 136
New submitter wierzpio writes: According to Rob Malcolmson, Bell Canada's VP of regulatory affairs, Canada is a safe haven to internet pirates and the only solution is to create a federally mandated blacklist of pirate websites. Unlike the existing blacklist in the U.K., Bell's plan appears to involve no judicial oversight. "Engaging in extrajudicial attempts to block access to sites, I think, raises all kinds of Charter of Rights and Freedoms issues," argues Michael Geist, a University of Ottawa professor and internet law expert. Quebec also wants to block sites. The province recently introduced a provincial law that would force internet providers to block users' access to online gambling sites not approved by the government. It argues the legislation is necessary to ensure internet gambling companies maintain responsible gaming rules.
What could go wrong (Score:3, Insightful)
Hmm, the government and private companies putting together a list of sites they consider "prates" and blocking them from your view.
Certainly no potential for abuse here.
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Re: What could go wrong (Score:2)
never
That word doesn't mean what you think it does.
And what could actually go right ? (Score:2)
And conversly, given the current age,
where technologies such as VPNs and Tor exist,
what do they expect to actually work ?
Basically people will just browse to http://uj3wazyk5u4hnvtk.onion/ [uj3wazyk5u4hnvtk.onion] instead of https://thepiratebay.org [thepiratebay.org] and completely ignore whatever restriction the local government is trying to put.
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Which will cause even more problems than it solves. People will go through great lengths to get around the blockages. Installing various nefarious programs or visiting web sites promising to deliver content and then just infecting their computer. I'm not saying pirating is right, but I've seen it happen time and time again, where people who want content that isn't easily available will do really stupid things directed by websites that promise the content.
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What can go right? Easy. Bell Canada can brag about stopping piracy, and by disposing of any stupid due process doesn't need to do much work.
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Basically people will just browse to http://uj3wazyk5u4hnvtk.onion/ [uj3wazyk5u4hnvtk.onion] instead of https://thepiratebay.org [thepiratebay.org] and completely ignore whatever restriction the local government is trying to put.
Bell Canada knows that the majority of us Canadians aren't savvy enough or motivated to even find pirate sites in the first place, never mind installing TOR and/or using a VPN. This smacks to me of the attention-getting, politically-motivated posing that one expects from the media empire mouthpieces of companies like Bell. That "no judicial oversight" caveat seems ripe for all kinds of abuse that may have nothing to do with combatting piracy per se.
OTOH, maybe there are more pirates here in Canada than I th
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Re: What could go wrong (Score:1)
I can't tell if this is sarcasm or genuine.
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Re: What could go wrong (Score:2)
Don't British people want freedom?
Well, let's see: when, exactly, did they give up their inherent rights to personal freedom and self defense?
Semantics (Score:2)
So for Quebec,
"maintain responsible gaming rules" means "gimme some of that money"...
Just think off the copyright holders! (Score:3)
Don't sound as convincing as "Think of the children", but probably will be enforced anyway.
Sigh. (Score:3)
They should just ask DICE to run them for them. That'll take them down rather quickly.
Sourceforge and Slashdot have been doing the old "front-page-only" trick for a few days in a row now.
You made TheRegister too: https://www.theregister.co.uk/... [theregister.co.uk]
But not a mention on here?
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A lot of people who have mentioned it are getting down-modded for "Off Topic". A cynic might suspect the Lords and Masters here don't want to talk about it, and they don't want anybody else talking about it either.
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Ah, nothing like a techy news site trying to stifle the news of their public techy failures.
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Hmm.., are you creimer's uncle by any chance?
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Ah, the worst features of public and private censorship combined! No accountability and sweeping coverage. How efficient of you.
Canada Copyright Laws Are Fine (Score:2)
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Thing is, it's fairly easy for a police officer to tell if I'm speeding and issue a ticket. It's a lot harder in general to see if I'm violating copyright.
Sorry for offtopic (Score:2)
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This was mentioned in threads on some earlier posts https://www.theregister.co.uk/2017/09/27/faulty_data_center_takes_out_sourceforge/ [theregister.co.uk]
It would be nice to have a geeky article about how things went wrong.
And then (Score:2)
They'll mark sites like netflix, hulu, CBS All access and Amazon, because someone told them to block them.
It's not like their citizens actually have rights or freedom. Just ask the guy from TVAddons for Kodi:
http://cordcuttersnews.com/now... [cordcuttersnews.com]
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We only have Netflix and Amazon Prime in Canada. Well, those two and CraveTV, of course. Would be funny if Bell blocked CraveTV.
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CraveTV is Bell's answer to Netflix. They seem to think that TV is only for TV shows.
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Audio only.
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This could get interesting (Score:2)
Canadians are a pretty tech-literate lot when it comes to entertainment. If Bell gets what they want, I would expect to see significant push-back in the form of increased VPN use. Then Bell will be back trying to get VPN's outlawed.
Bell might want to watch out. In some respects, it could almost be considered a monopoly. Certainly it is a scumbag of a company, and it is heartily detested by a huge number of Canadians. If I were in government, I would be very careful indeed about what I gave them, and wh
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Don't a lot of businesses require vpn's in order to work from home? Would a vpn ban amount to making it impossible to telecommute?
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Canadians are a pretty tech-literate lot when it comes to entertainment. If Bell gets what they want, I would expect to see significant push-back in the form of increased VPN use. Then Bell will be back trying to get VPN's outlawed.
Not necessary. Netflix has been quite successful in maintaining a block list of VPNs. No reason Bell couldn't do the same.
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Thanks for saving me the trouble. ;-)
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Netflix blocks VPN's to their servers. How the fuck would Bell block and limit VPN'S not using Bell as a server and not being accessed?
Learn what a fucking VPN does.
I should have been more specific and said Bell or other ISPs. Since your data passes through them, they can most certainly block it.
I completely agree (Score:2)
I think we should all get behind this initiative from Bell and block all the bad websites.
Can they propose a method that does not involve becoming an isolated, non-democratic and dictatorial regime?
You see so far, even countries like North Korea cannot block access to anything it likes...so how will an interconnected, development and democratic country like Canada mange that?
Having considered the above and weighed the possibilities I suggest we just ignore Bell and carry on with our lives. This seems
DNS (Score:2)
In Belgium, they enforce that on ISP level by sending DNS response redirecting to a site from the ministry of justice telling you that piracy is bad mmkay.
Thanks to Google Public DNS it's only an issue for unrooted phones, which are not the best device for piracy anyway...
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You don't need a rooted phone. You can easily change the DNS Settings on your phone to use whatever DNS server you want, or you can connect through a VPN if you so desire. What kind of phone are you using that doesn't allow you to change your DNS Server?
Tireless lobbyists (Score:3)
We've had this debate, at least in my country, I think four or five times now. Canada is probably no different. It's always about blocking content someone or other wants blocked opening the door for censorship. Sometimes the approaches are a little different, be it some kinds of illegal content, terrorism etc.
There is always strong lobbying by the content industry that wants the mechanisms in place and some law that eventually can be extended to cover what they really want. Standing on the sidelines are religious communities that want blasphemy banned or other content they consider to be "dirty".
The first few times these attacks on civil rights met a strong reaction, there was a big discussion and the attack failed. Nevertheless the lobbyists simply start a new attack a few years later and the public just grows tired of having the same discussion over and over again.
Also the politicians either stay completely clueless regarding the subject or the bribes are just raising. Otherwise it's unexplainable why the lobbyists aren't simply ignored when they start the same debate after they've lost it previously. In my opinion politicians supporting such crap should be constantly hammered with accusations of corruptness until they leave politics.
Web blocking isn't the only debate where this happens, wire tapping, IP-logging, the cryptowar, it's all like:
"Not again, we had this debate already."
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In this case, Bell is the content distributor, the lobbyist, one of the largest Telcos and also a crown corporation.
I think there should be a movement to silence Bell on this issue as they have a clear conflict of interest.
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Would you be able to provide a source to your assertion that Bell is a crown corp?
Nope, I goofed. I'm looking for some of the more interesting references on the juicy bits of the history, but no, it's not government-owned.
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Crown corporation? I think not. Perhaps you can find a citation?
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Whoops, yeah, that's strictly wrong.
Bell Canada has a complex history with special statuses and stuff, but it's not a crown asset. Flub on my part.
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They've probably absorbed an ex-crown corp or more, perhaps like Telus here who were created from BC Tel and whatever Alberta's phone company was called.
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Also the politicians either stay completely clueless regarding the subject or the bribes are just raising. Otherwise it's unexplainable why the lobbyists aren't simply ignored when they start the same debate after they've lost it previously. In my opinion politicians supporting such crap should be constantly hammered with accusations of corruptness until they leave politics.
The problem is the voters: the voters are supposed to see that these representatives aren't working for them, and vote them out. They
I thought pirates didn't exist in Canada? (Score:2)
Don't you guys have a tax on media that effectively paid the rights holders for your now perfectly legitimate practice of copying things? I thought pirates couldn't exist in Canada... without boarding ships, raping, pillaging and making the crew walk the plank.
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DuGGNsE3_8Y
RRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR!!!!!!!!!!
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If you're referring to the blank media levy that you have to pay in Canada, the levy doesn't exist to legitimatize the illegitimate practice of media piracy, it exists to compensate the rights holders for personal and private use copying *ONLY*.
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The levy is mostly on audio stuff like cassette tapes and CDR. After the courts ruled that the levy made all private copying of audio basically legal, they didn't pursue a levy on stuff such as DVDR. That's also why blank DVDs are cheaper then blank CDs
Comment removed (Score:3)
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Translation (Score:2)
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Bell Canada is pissed off that Canadians won't subscribe to CraveTV to watch Star Trek: Discovery.
Canadians are pissed off that Bell Canada got Star Trek: Discovery, instead of Netflix Canada.
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People always complain when Netflix doesn't get X.
If Netflix had every show, the price would be $100/month instead of $14
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Netflix got the rights for ST:D for all other countries on the planet, except the U.S.A. (CBS kept it for themselves since they're the ones making it) but Bell Media was able to get the rights instead of Netflix? We suspect a dirty deal somewhere. After all Bell has tentacles in media, TV, internet, etc. They are in a constant flux of conflict of interest but the CRTC doesn't do shit.
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Netflix has more content than CraveTV. So they probably made more dirty deals than Bell.
Netflix's strategy is clearly to become a monopoly. They already started raising prices.
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jasa maket (Score:1)
Bell Canada can go jump in a Great Lake (Score:1)
Establishment Thinking v. Invisible Hand (Score:2)
With high prices, limited selection of channels, and ongoing high rental fees for boxes (required for each TV in the house) it's not surprising that Canadians are pirate-friendly.
Netflix has proven that customers are willing to pay for content when the price is right.
Pirating and cord-cutting should be the canary/coalmine to Bell
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Well, they are trying and already have something in place [cravetv.ca]. Of course, when they introduced it, you needed to be a Bell satellite subscriber to even sign up but after a few months they removed that requirement. Unlike Netflix Canada, however, they only have a handful of movies. They seem to have all James Bond movies, the classic Blade Runner movie and... that seems to be it. If you like TV shows from the 90's, however, there's plenty of those (Seinfeld, Cheers, etc). They also have Star Trek: Discovery and
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As your own link shows, Netflix has gone to some lengths to block customers who use VPN services to get around their geo-blocks.
This isn't a problem for me: I canceled my Netflix subscription. I suggest everyone else disappointed with Netflix's service do the same. You can get all the content you really need on BT.
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Netflix doesn't have to do a good job of it. They can do a half-ass job to show "we're trying!", but they're not.
Québec (Score:2)
Loto-Québec [wikipedia.org] also wants to block sites. The provincial crown corporation recently introduced a provincial law that would force internet providers to block users' access to online gambling site
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http://business.financialpost.... [financialpost.com]
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The reason why (Score:2)
The reason why they're saying this is because Bell is a content provider and they refuse to lease rights to places like Netflix.
Bell is over priced so people got to streams (Score:3)
Another incident involved their new Fiber internet service. They got a slap on the wrist again by government regulators for false advertising, claiming their fiber internet deal was less than it was. (I never signed up as I never trusted them, obviously).
My first and last experience with Bell as an ISP was when I got my own DSL modem, returned theirs (which they accepted) and they kept billing me an extra $5/month even when they acknowledged they had received their modem back. They said they couldn't cancel it as it was a required part of the deal (although they gave me an address to return the modem as I told them I now had my own). I cancelled their service. 3 days before the cancellation was finalized, I got a call telling me they would drop the fee if I stopped the cancellation. No go there.
So Bell has a bad business for consumer all round and government divisions coming down on their so their credibility is questionable there.
In addition, people are fed up with Bell's exorbitant fees for satellite tv fees.In Canada, Bell is the exclusive content distributor for HBO. They've had a deal for years. (Bell owns several phone company and at least one IPTV service). If you want to get say, "Game of Thrones" in Canada without using a "grey market" (it's not illegal to download restricted intellectual property, only to distribute), you have to pay them $60 basic fee, plus an extra fee to get a channel for extended HBO content including "Game of Thrones". HBO has a very nice Internet only service for $20 USD a month which I tried to sign up for. But it's not allowed in Canada because of Bell's deal. People are pissed and using streams. So bell wants to block that.
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Bell is always been like that.
They still charge you $5/month for "touch tone service"! You can't even ask to remove it, either.
And Bell was the primary driver behind killing gray market satellite services - there was actually a few Canadians who received US satellite service (paying for it legitimately - not hacked access) and Bell decided it was too much competition for their satellite TV and went all the way to the supreme court.
They are one of the scummiest companies in Canada
I'd be cheaper to have a tax (Score:2)
Have a tax that goes directly into the pockets of film studios and music labels. It would be cheaper for everyone than some kind of hair brained scheme to block servers based on some nebulous definition of "pirate".
My guess is Bell wants to buy new routers and have the government pay for it.
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I know they have the tax. But there is no law preventing the government from taxing you multiple times for the same thing.
Wha? (Score:1)
Safe to say I will not recommend Bell (Score:2)
to any of my clients. Anyone else offering IT advice should do the same. Why would anyone want a crippled internet service?
Bell, always looking out for Bell's interests (Score:2)
I don't think I can ever see a news release about Bell Canada that doesn't make me roll my eyes, and wonder how they get any customers at all. Everything they do, or say, screams their status as a pile of anti-consumer twats. They want to be a shitty ISP, a shitty telco, and a shitty content provider. Ever use the CTV streaming app? Dodgy, glitchy, and slower than hunting down a torrent of whatever show you could already legally watch. They're succeeding at suckage in spades, yet people still give them mone
Censorship (Score:2)
Restricting and blocking access to certain information is pure censorship.
Why has it suddenly become both okay and the thing to do?
This is wrong on so many levels.
Translation (Score:2)
We'd like to keep charging customers, but reduce the services they can use to reduce their data usage. That way we don't have to invest in infrastructure and we can suck them like vampires.