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The Courts CDA Crime United States

Are Tech Firms Liable For What Their Users Post? (mercurynews.com) 98

Posted by EditorDavid from the indicting-indecency dept.
Thursday Texas police officers arrested the CEO of Backpage.com, a web site allowing escorts to post classified ads, on a felony charge accusing him of pimping. Slashdot reader whoever57 writes: It is likely that the charges will not stick because of section 230 of the Communications Decency Act, under which publishers are protected from liability for the postings of their users. However, this could just be the first shot in the battle to weaken section 230. This could endanger other sites, such as Craigslist, and ultimately, any site with user-written content.
Backpage calls the prosecution "frivolous," arguing that the site's classified ads for escorts are protected by the First Amendment. But a law professor at the University of Santa Clara suggests prosecutors may argue that the site had been "optimized to facilitate online prostitution ads," establishing some level of complicity.
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Are Tech Firms Liable For What Their Users Post? More

Are Tech Firms Liable For What Their Users Post?

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  • What about Banks (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Herkum01 ( 592704 ) on Sunday October 09, 2016 @10:46AM (#53041927)

    Well they have been going after the Backpage for 10 years, so I guess at this stage they are just throwing it against the wall and hoping for a judge that will let it stick.

    Besides considering how complacent they have been with banks and money laundering drug money and tax evasion, it seems that this is just low hanging fruit by comparison.

  • of people pulling this off?
    One has to wonder....

    needs recognition
    feels inferior and has to compensate trying to fill this void
    stubborn frame of mind
    shine before his/her peer group, partner
    neural concept how things have to be ... ???

    • Control. If they can get this to stick then its a short walk to be able to start taking on and controlling opinion, thoughts, etc. This is progression of a Republic descending into Fascism(from Capitalism then into Crony Capitalism) and then complete Totalitarianism. Power is the ultimate high and as any one who knows about that, knows that over time, with no control or oversight, you have to keep upping the ante to get the high you're looking for. In this case, it's the destruction of our freedoms.

      • The feminazi bitch Harris who is the AG from California pulling this off is likely to be elected to the US Senate. Ttterly despicable how far American politics have descended. Democracy is pretty much dead in America.

  • This is why I hate Jury trials (Score:4, Insightful)

    by rsilvergun ( 571051 ) on Sunday October 09, 2016 @10:52AM (#53041957)
    this won't be decided as a matter of law, but a matter of feelings.

    • This would likely work to the CEO's advantage because most people really don't care about prostitution unless it is a streetwalker outside Chuckie Cheese.

      There is an ooooold case where a guy who ran an answering service was convicted of pimping, and the appeals court overturned the conviction because there was nothing about his business that specifically turned on whether the phone calls were for legal or illegal purposes. This CEO has the same defense: I think of Backpage as being geared toward adult ente

      • OK, editing ads does it!

      • This would likely work to the CEO's advantage because most people really don't care about prostitution unless it is a streetwalker outside Chuckie Cheese.

        I don't think this is true. There is a gender disparity in views about prostitution. Men tend to be more tolerant. Women tend to be overwhelmingly opposed. Conservative women are usually opposed because it is "immoral". Liberal women are opposed because they consider it degrading to women. From a purely utilitarian view, it makes sense for women to oppose legal prostitution, since an open and legal market for sex lowers their bargaining position in traditional relationships and marriages.

        Also, while m

        • Well facts is facts and that is all a jury is supposed to decide—I didn't mean to imply that a juror who didn't care about prostitution would vote Not Guilty because of it. But jurors are regular people and there is a sliding scale when it comes to the evidence required for things they care about and things they don't. There is actually less documentary evidence in the Lauria case than I would have thought, supporting your skepticism—but the case is 50 years old.... Results may vary in Texas.
          • Ooops. He wasn't convicted, he was trying to get the case thrown out and lost the first time.

          • Re: (Score:2)

            by rtb61 ( 674572 )

            Out of curiosity, I dug a bit deeper and those ads only offer the companionship of the person, quite often the ads distort the nature of the person even with the accompanying photographs but they most definitely do not state what services will be provided. Plus the ads all point to direct contacts and not contacts solely via back page and back page are running a full set of alternate ads. The courts in this case would have to prove back page reviewed the ads and new their contents, passed them and demanded

            • According to the Arstechnica article, which I have not read, the company would edit ads to make sure they complied with the law/posting rules. This suggests that there was a sort of "coded" language which was in use. For example, in the context of Backpage "companionship" might be understood to mean sex. The prosecution has to prove all this beyond a reasonable doubt, but it doesn't look frivolous or like a shakedown. This is an ostensibly legit businessman with the resources to defend himself so a consp
    • Jury trials are a fail-safe against the government becoming so corrupt that it starts passing and enforcing laws contradictory to the wishes and best interests of the citizens as a whole. Like the Second Amendment, the value of jury trials is not obvious when things are working more or less fine - in fact as you express it may actually make things worse during these times. But when the sh!t hits the fan, it's one last way for the citizens to reassert dominance over an out-of-control government.

      That's w

      • Juries have that *power*, yes. Whether this constitutes a *right* to do so is a matter of debate. Many regard it as a bug in the Double Jeopardy Clause.

        Moreover, a judge *definitely* has the right to remove any juror who he has good reason to believe will vote to disregard the law.

        At least this is what my attorney told me some years ago.

  • Since when is any company with a website considered a "tech firm"?

  • Covered this already (Score:5, Informative)

    by Anonymous Coward on Sunday October 09, 2016 @11:21AM (#53042087)

    This already made the rounds at Ars [arstechnica.com]. The current spat has nothing to do with Section 230. The warrant states that BackPages was complicit in editing ads to hide their illegality befor posting. That makes them complicit. Section 230 won't protect you if you edit the stuff your users post.

    Anyway, the formal charges are here [ca.gov]. Pimping is defied in teh CA Penal Code as profiting off of someone else's prostitution. I'd like to note that further reading of the Ars thread brings to light that things like Overt Act 9 are not nebulous "some child", but rather, that they have children who are testifying.

    tl;dr: this is about section 230. This is about a company taking an active role in prostitution and sex trafficking.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by OzPeter ( 195038 )

      ^^Mod up^^

    • Was coming here to say exactly the same (also read the Ars story).

    • well, yes, but it doesn't really matter. truth is the first casualty in a war, and that goes double for "culture wars".

      with "news" like this, there's nothing to do but just sit back and enjoy the frothing. it's kind of like watching a group therapy session, except pseudonymous and not very therapeutic.

    • Was the "editing to conceal evidence of illegality" perchance what agent Fitchner described in this statement?

      In May 2015, I created another BACKPAGE "Escort" ad with the goal of trying to post an ad containing sexual verbiage indicative of a prostitution ad. I used the words "cum" and "quickie" in the ad, but when I tried to post it, I received a message that told me those words were "forbidden in this category." I had to change the words to "come" and "quick session" in order for the ad to be accepted.

      If

  • What does the user agreement say? (Score:5, Interesting)

    by pesho ( 843750 ) on Sunday October 09, 2016 @11:27AM (#53042123)
    If there is a clause in the user agreement that they own all user generated content, then these are their posts and they should be liable.

    • Except Backpage was editing the ads before posting them not simply posting them as is. It does change the facts of the case and their liability. Strange that the summary omitted such an important deal.

    • That particular clause is in there to prevent a situation where a user posts something on a public forum, then later changes their mind and uses copyright law to force the forum to delete their post. It's not a problem if one or even a handful of users does it. But when you start to get up to hundreds or even thousands of users doing it, it turns the forum's historical archives into swiss cheese, not to mention the extra cost and manpower needed to remove the posts from things like backup tapes.

      The wis

  • Only if complicit (Score:3)

    by goodmanj ( 234846 ) on Sunday October 09, 2016 @11:55AM (#53042241)

    "Are [publishers] liable for what their users print?" No, unless they knowingly help their users commit a crime. Which Backpage allegedly did.

    • Bullshit. They absolutely did not. Its absurd to think that any employee of Backpage went to work one day and deliberately intended to allow, create, or promote an ad for an underage prostitute.

      By the way, illegals routinely pimp their own kids out. Mothers (older brothers, etc.) will literally accompany their kids on "dates". An attractive girl born into an illegal family is considered a family asset and the parents pimping the kids out is considered training and helping the kids.

      I don't see Harris cra

      • If that were true why were they editing ads before posting them?

        • They probably have staff who are paid to edit ads to remove explicit pictures which is a standard thing on many websites. Its disingenuous to equate that with deliberately pimping out kids.

        • Would that "editing" be related to this statement by agent Fitchtner?

          In May 2015, I created another BACKPAGE "Escort" ad with the goal of trying to post an ad containing sexual verbiage indicative of a prostitution ad. I used the words "cum" and "quickie" in the ad, but when I tried to post it, I received a message that told me those words were "forbidden in this category." I had to change the words to "come" and "quick session" in order for the ad to be accepted.

          The statement that indicates that Backpage t

  • There are plenty of more dangerous, more arduous, more humiliating jobs out there - even ones that require touching the bodies and excretions of other people. And most of them are paid much lower than prostitution. I for one am happy that where I live, prostitution is a legal job, involving taxation and social security insurance like every other job.
  • actually ... NO ! to say they are is to say goodspeech is a good thing and you get to regulate and dictate what others say and the leaders of the free worlds very constitution would oppose that in a real world

  • Elizabeth Nolan Brown gives her (derisive) take on the prosecution of the Backpage CEO, [reason.com] filled with links to further details on the case.

    Among the allegations:

    Backpage removed an ad suspected of offering prostitution when it was reported and then blocked it from being re-posted.

    and

    Backpage uses automated filtering to try and prevent people from posting about illegal activity.

    Nolan-Brown writes about prosecutors using Backpage's cooperation with law enforcement to prevent illegal activity as proof that Bac

  • A big thank you to the Texas Attorney General (Score:4, Funny)

    by Macdude ( 23507 ) on Sunday October 09, 2016 @07:49PM (#53044409)

    I wanted to send a big thank you to the Texas Attorney General, I hadn't heard of this site before.

  • There is no reason for prostitution to be illegal in the first place.

    This is just another assault by the totalitarian scumbags....

    • There are reasons for prostitution to be illegal. I happen to disagree with them, and I really don't like having victimless crimes, and it isn't clear to me that in practice outlawing prostitution delivers a better outcome, and I see ways in which outlawing prostitution creates more problems, but the reasons exist.

      Women are likely to be pushed into prostitution and exploited by pimps (editorial comment: this is easier to deal with if prostitution is legal). It can spread sexually transmitted diseases

  • Why is it that so many Americans are convinced that the merchant who sells a gun is not liable for what the purchaser does with it? (2nd amendment over all! yada yada . . .)

    But that these same people keep claiming that the merchant who sells a message is liable for what the purchaser says in it? (1st amendment! but not really. yada yada . . .)

    Apparently, they have realized that the pen is mightier than the sword and taken the wrong lesson from it: they have decided that everyone should have weapons and no

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