Facebook A Black Hole For Personal Info 242
Hugh Pickens writes "The NY Times has an article on how Facebook is so sticky it is nearly impossible to get loose. While the Web site offers users the option to deactivate their accounts, Facebook servers keep copies of the information in those accounts indefinitely. Many users who have contacted Facebook to request that their accounts be deleted have not succeeded in erasing their records from the network. 'It's like the Hotel California,' said Nipon Das, a user who tried unsuccessfully to delete his account. 'You can check out any time you like, but you can never leave.' It took Mr. Das two months and several e-mail exchanges with Facebook's customer service representatives to erase most of his information from the site, which finally occurred after he sent an e-mail threatening legal action. But even after that, a reporter was able to find Mr. Das's empty profile on Facebook and successfully sent him an e-mail message through the network. Facebook's quiet archiving of information from deactivated accounts has increased concerns about the network's potential abuse of private data, especially in the wake of its fumbled Beacon advertising feature."
Good (Score:3, Interesting)
Fuck privacy. Here's to transparency and the death of hypocrisies!
Re: (Score:2, Insightful)
Note to mods: Don't bother modding this OT/flamebait/troll/stalker or whatever. I'm just continuing a conversation with parent that we've been having for a while, so don't bother wasting any points.
Re: (Score:3, Funny)
Injokes are great.
I hope to have one, one day.
Moderation options, please! (Score:3, Insightful)
Note to mods: Don't bother modding this OT/flamebait/troll/stalker or whatever. I'm just continuing a conversation with parent that we've been having for a while, so don't bother wasting any points.
Hmmm .... while we're offtopic, can I put in a request for "-1 Fucking Stupid" and "-1 Uninformative" moderation options? Too many times have I seen someone get modded up writing incorrect drivel, and the only option you can use is "Overrated".
/.ers! No more Mr. Nice Geek!
Let's get some angst into our moderation,
Re:Good (Score:4, Insightful)
Which probably means 'normal' isn't what the press would like you to think it is.
Re: (Score:2)
Oh wait
Re:Good (Score:5, Interesting)
Re: (Score:3, Funny)
I bet you think "irony" means "sort of like iron".
Re: (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:Good (Score:4, Funny)
New Idea (Score:4, Funny)
Visit our website right now to enroll for free!
Re:New Idea (Score:5, Interesting)
Tech giants Microsoft, IBM, Google and Yahoo have joined the board of the Open ID Foundation which aims to streamline login systems across the web.
The Foundation wants to bring about a system that could mean one ID acts as a guarantor of a person's identity across all the sites they have signed up for.
Oh good, so I only have to have one online identity compromised in order for them all to be compromised. I hope it's not just us slashdotters who think this is a bad idea.
Re:New Idea (Score:5, Interesting)
For most users, having their primary email address compromised leads to the same situation, so the transition to Open ID won't really change anything, except it allows you and your Open ID provider to pick the level of authentication, rather than the provider of whatever service you want to use.
Re: (Score:2)
Re:New Idea (Score:4, Funny)
Re:New Idea (Score:4, Funny)
They wish. It's really the crappy coffee. Let's replace it with Folger's crystals and see if Slashdot notices.
Easy Solution (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:Easy Solution (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Easy Solution (Score:5, Insightful)
Good idea but.... (Score:3, Insightful)
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
But that is the way it should be, The internet was made to be
Re:Good idea but.... (Score:5, Insightful)
As funny, scary and true as that is, does anyone realize that there's a whole generation of kids, who've never really known life without the 'web, who not only know this but actively count on it?
Re: (Score:2, Insightful)
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Re:Easy Solution (Score:4, Interesting)
Re:Easy Solution (Score:5, Funny)
Leaving Facebook sounds a lot like what I did when I joined Facebook.
Re: (Score:2)
When you want to leave, start adding bogus data. Friend people you don't know. Change the bio data. Tag yourself in pictures you aren't in. Basically, generate random activity. Defriend your actual friends. Change your name. After a time, it becomes very difficult to determine what is real and what is fake.
Or they could just provide a "delete my account" link like everyone else.
The one lesson (Score:2, Insightful)
Be smart about what you put online and for pete's sake don't let anyone take naked photos of you, 'cuz they *will* end up online, and it will be *hilarious*.
Re:The one lesson (Score:5, Funny)
I was hoping for "awe inspiring", or at least "impressive". Way to dent a guy's ego...
Re: (Score:2)
Not for us who have to look, ugh!
Re: (Score:2)
Now all the hot 18 year old chicks that read slashdot are that much less likely to let someone take naked pics of them and post them on the internet!
Re: (Score:2)
Wow, that's some parallel universe you come from! Where's the interdimensional portal???
Facebook Terms of Service (Score:5, Informative)
Here is an interesting excerpt:
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Re:Facebook Terms of Service (Score:5, Insightful)
So in fact the license expires as soon as you remove the content. From reading some of the other posts here, it seems that Facebook tries to make a difference between "removing" material and "deactivating" material. I guess if all you do is "deactivate" you account, you're technically not removing it and thus Facebook retains its license, so one must remove their material. If Facebook then retains that information, I would say they are then in violate of copyright.
Re:Facebook Terms of Service (Score:5, Interesting)
The legal question here is: what is the definition of an "archive", as the term is used by Facebook?
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
It's been done (Score:2)
Re:It's been done (Score:5, Interesting)
1. Delete your photo
2. Delete Comments and messages you wrote
3. Delete your friends from your friends list.
4. Leave all your networks and groups you have joined.
5. Delete all your photo albums.
Sounds like an awful lot of work. Here's an alternate suggestion...also a bit of work, but definitely more enjoyable.
From the Facebook Terms of Service:
Re: (Score:2)
Haha, is there anything that could be posted without violating some law somewhere?
Re:It's been done (Score:5, Funny)
Re: (Score:2)
I was dealing with a minor facebook addiction last year and even after I deactivated my account I'd get bored after a while and reactivate it. I did exactly what you said. Deleted all my friends, changed all my personal information. Changed my e-mail address to a 10 minute e-mail and then deactivated
Surprisingly when there's nothing to l
Ditch facebook! (Score:2)
What could it do for the cause of privacy if people all left facebook over their various privacy abuses?
And what would it do if no one seemed to care?
Re:Ditch facebook! (Score:4, Insightful)
Of course that's only on small group of examples - but the rest of the world doesn't share the same privacy concerns as many here do. If you ask them though, of course they care - but would they do something about it or help to fix the issues? Nope.
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
The fact that this record is permanent adds to the importance of being careful what you put on line. My oldest is 8, and when she starts getting into this, it's a lesson I hope I can teach her. The tactic I've heard with parents who do allow their child
I'm not sure whose side I'm on! (Score:3, Insightful)
I agree that it seems unusual, and that maybe it's an unanticipated side-effect of giving your info to a social networking site that your data may persist forever, but I really don't think they're doing anything immoral.
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Is it really possible to be that naive, or are you just pulling my leg? Take an economics class and think some more about this. Here's a little Adam Smith to help you along: "It is not from the benevolence of the butcher, the brewer, or the baker that we expect our dinner, but from their regard to their own interest."
Classmates (Score:2)
hating facebook (Score:5, Insightful)
Can someone suggest a cleaner, more useful alternative to facebook that I can try and talk all my friends into joining?
Re:hating facebook (Score:5, Insightful)
Here's the best one for all your local friends to join: The Pub. It's great, you get to talk to each other face to face! I joined this group when I was about 15, and I've enjoyed it ever since. Only real friends join my group and we can buy each other REAL drinks.
If you like you can write on the wall, but I don't think the publican will be too happy.
Re: (Score:3, Funny)
Uh, how about meeting your friends at a *real* place?
Re: (Score:2)
And how do you delete a SLASHDOT account? (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:And how do you delete a SLASHDOT account? (Score:5, Insightful)
Not to be a fanboy.
Re: (Score:3, Informative)
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Re:And how do you delete a SLASHDOT account? (Score:5, Funny)
Re: (Score:3, Interesting)
I wanted to, some 3 or so years ago, when I switched nicks. Why? I'd established a reasonable reputation with my previous account, and didn't want anyone to abuse the rep*.
--
* Plus, I like to keep my online aliases "clean", by deleting the ones I no longer use. I don't mind leaving the information up, so long as the account is inaccessible.
What a business model (Score:5, Insightful)
Really, the only thing you can do to throw a wrench in the works is to falsify the entire contents of your profile. It would be very interesting to see if you could use that to influence the behavior of advertisers. For example, I wonder what would happen if every account suddenly added "Cowboy Neal" to the Interests field. Facebook bombing, anyone?
Re: (Score:2)
They'd lose all their advertising revenue. Who wants a bunch of lunatics as their market?
You have no privacy anyway (Score:2)
Which is why I don't do facebook, Linked In, myspace, or any other 'social networking' site.
When I google my name (my real name, not 'wiredog') it returns zero results. I'm very happy about that.
Re: (Score:3, Funny)
So, Mr Aoiuvoasihuashiuerqkaskjas, we meet at last!
This Just In! (Score:2, Informative)
Kicked out? (Score:5, Interesting)
Re: (Score:3, Interesting)
Wiki on the Data Protection Act [wikipedia.org]
"5. Personal data processed for any purpose or purposes shall not be kept for longer than is necessary for that purpose or those purposes."
Argue that once the account is deactivated the data is no longer necessary. Facebook has an office in London now (for sales, I think) so the
FINALLY! (Score:5, Informative)
Re: (Score:2)
And how do you know that delete button really, truly deleted everything? Don't you think that MySpace has backups of their entire database somewhere? When you delete your account, do you think they go back and delete it from all the backups as well?
Facebook's explanation for why they retain the data is, basically, "People close their accounts, and then they change their minds and want them reopened, and this way, we
Re: (Score:2)
You really think
would take 10 minutes?I closed my account and get nagged all the time (Score:5, Interesting)
After deactivating the account, I saw that a lot of my information is still retained, and I'm CONSTANTLY getting e-mails from facebook saying "so and so wants to be your friend! reactivate your account!" and also messages from "Facebook" on AIM saying essentially the same.
I really wish that they took the hint "If someone deactivates their account, odds are they want to stop being involved in the site"
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Shocking, just shocking (Score:5, Insightful)
Seriously, even if Facebook did have a motivation for fully scrubbing users data when asked, I would think just Facebook employee incompetence would result in a certain percentage of information being left. And from Facebook's perspective, how many times do you think they have to deal with a user wanting everything they ever posted/uploaded gone forever one week, then wanting it all back and restored perfectly the next?
If you don't want it in the public realm, don't upload it/post it. Simple as that.
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
Most of Europe, from my understanding, has very strict privacy policies regarding personal data. You must have data retention policies detailing when the information will automatically go away, always allow customers to opt out, and always allow customers to remove their data.
Thank god we have freewheeling capitalism where companies can sell my personal data with no consequence.
I'm sure someone can point out something wrong with the European system, but it sure is a whole hell of a lot be
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
The focus on Facebook is really obscuring the main issue, which is that anything that you make public on the Internet remains public. Have people never heard of the Wayback Machine [archive.org] and other such services?
Many of them may well have removal policies, but are you really going to know about every web server that holds a cache containing information about you, and go through the trouble of contacting the administrator of each one to get it removed? Forget it. Once it is public it remains public
Because They Can (Score:3, Insightful)
Deactivate doesn't deactivate (Score:2, Interesting)
It's probably easier (Score:2)
Take it easy (Score:5, Funny)
All Night Long I was worried about this. Is my privacy Already Gone? It made me feel like a Certain Kind of Fool to think that I had put my personal data on a site that would Take It To The Limit in terms of giving away info about me. The Outlaw Man that runs Facebook has erased my Peaceful Easy Feeling. In The Long Run, After the Thrill is Gone, Facebook will learn. Untill then, I won't Get Over It and I Can't Tell You Why.
I've run out of Eagle's songs now....
Not just in facebooks servers (Score:5, Insightful)
Not just personal data, but your relationship to all your friends list. If you 'went to school with' so and so, then it's easy to find out what school you went to based on what school your friend went to. If you have cousins on there... odds are one of them has a last name the same as your mother's maiden name. Yeah... the 'how do you know this person' info is bad too.
My Personal Solution (Score:2, Insightful)
Though as for Facebooks right to do this? I dont think so. They may have some sort of backward legal right to do this but if thats the case someone needs to get some sort of action together to stop it. If not they will end up simply licencing the data off to companies, if anyones
Re: (Score:2)
Very common on dating sites (Score:2)
Friendfinder, the dating service, (AFF, alt.com, etc.) was notorious for this. Most of the profiles on their sites were of people who were no longer members. Good-looking photos stayed on the site for years after account termination. It took a lawsuit to stop that.
One encyclopedia for me (Score:5, Funny)
Spoil their data (Score:2)
And what the hell are people doing putting seriously private data on a public server anyway? Have the past TWO DECADES of internet privacy violation news stories not been an educator for the general populous? If you put something on someone else's server, it's their data. You screwed u
Bogus headline (Score:2)
Well Facebook is not as bad as EA (Score:2)
Here's what their "support" replies to question on how to remove account:
Thank you for contacting Electronic Arts.
Unfortunately a registration code can only be used to create one account. If it has been used to register an
Bah (Score:3, Funny)
"Let's you and them fight."
Dumb, Dumb Dumb Dumb, Duuuuumb (Score:3, Informative)
I'm not sure why people are so surprised to find out that FaceBook doesn't care. This just in - those social networks don't actually exist for *your* benefit. They are there to make money (although their business plans are sometimes a bit dubious...).
A Black Hole? (Score:4, Informative)
( =P )
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2, Insightful)
Re: (Score:2)
It's legal because all the information was in the Terms and Conditions that you should have read before you ticked the box and clicked "Accept".
Should have read a bit closer, eh?