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Court Puts Further Limits on Software Patents 113

An anonymous reader writes "The Wall Street Journal is reporting on a recent court ruling that may severely limit the scope of both software and business model patents. The court found that 'The routine addition of modern electronics to an otherwise unpatentable invention' isn't enough to get over the 'non-obvious' hurdle that every patent is supposed to clear. This is a huge step in the right direction and one of the first admissions from the court system that perhaps software and business model patents have gone too far. 'In August, the Federal Circuit in essence raised the bar for proving willful infringement, a finding that allows a judge to triple a damage award. In April, the Supreme Court handed down a patent decision making it easier for trial-court judges to call an invention "obvious" and therefore ineligible for a patent.'"
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Court Puts Further Limits on Software Patents

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  • One Click (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward on Friday October 05, 2007 @12:27PM (#20870349)
    There goes the One Click patent. And to think it was only good for a 10 year head start.

    This move should also kill a whole bunch of the "... on the internet." patents off.
  • Common Sense Wins? (Score:3, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward on Friday October 05, 2007 @12:28PM (#20870385)
    Thank you for using your common sense to defeat the enemies of innovation.

    Three cheers for the independent judiciary.
  • Modern? (Score:3, Insightful)

    by Aladrin ( 926209 ) on Friday October 05, 2007 @12:29PM (#20870397)
    What about the adding of old or futuristic electronics? Why is that not covered?

    Professor X invents a Frammwizle. Patent Troll Y see that a Frammwizle can make many other past inventions more useful, and simply patents the use of the 2 together, just like is current dont with the Internet.

    Since it's already happened, and this is meant to address that very situation, why should 'modern' be there at all?
  • obvious (Score:4, Funny)

    by User 956 ( 568564 ) on Friday October 05, 2007 @12:29PM (#20870409) Homepage
    In April, the Supreme Court handed down a patent decision making it easier for trial-court judges to call an invention "obvious" and therefore ineligible for a patent.

    Did this patent decision also make it easier for them to call an invention +5 insightful?
    • by Tablizer ( 95088 )
      Did this patent decision also make it easier for them to call an invention +5 insightful?

      Dude, I think you need a vacation from slashdot
           
  • by zappepcs ( 820751 ) on Friday October 05, 2007 @12:29PM (#20870413) Journal

    The court found that 'The routine addition of modern electronics to an otherwise unpatentable invention' isn't enough to get over the 'non-obvious' hurdle that every patent is supposed to clear. This is a huge step in the right direction ......
    Can someone please explain why NTP has a patent on sending e-mail to wireless devices? Looks like we have an opening to go back and invalidate quite a number of patents.
    • Re: (Score:2, Interesting)

      by Anonymous Coward
      Yeah and who will be liable for RIM and NTP losses. To me it looks like the USPTO acted fraudulently in taking money to grant such a patent. I hope NTP legal advisers also have good liability insurance.

      What's the difference between the USPTO selling void patents and a conman selling famous landmarks? Is it a case on caveat emptor or would the con artist be prosecuted?
      • What's the difference between the USPTO selling void patents and a conman selling famous landmarks? Is it a case on caveat emptor or would the con artist be prosecuted?

        I hadn't heard that the USPTO was 'selling' patents, personally. Perhaps charging filing fees (which you pay whether you are granted a patent or not), yes, but AFAIK, they don't take money to award a patent. Are you implying that the USPTO was taking payoffs?

        As far as the conman goes, it's mostly a civil matter. You can't sell what you don't own.

        • I hadn't heard that the USPTO was 'selling' patents, personally. Perhaps charging filing fees (which you pay whether you are granted a patent or not), yes, but AFAIK, they don't take money to award a patent.

          Ah but the USPTO is selling patents. The more patent they issue the more people will apply for patents, and pay when making a claim. If the USPTO were to start turning down patent applications the number of applications would decline. For them it's a matter of volume.

          Abolish all patents!

          Falcon

    • Re: (Score:2, Informative)

      by joeyblades ( 785896 )
      Technically NTP's patents are not for sending wireless email... rather, the patents are more about the "push" technology that is used. In other words, sending email to wireless devices is OK - just don't use the methodology that NTP patented. Where RIM and possibly others have infringed is due to performance issues with alternate methodologies. In other, other words, the NTP patents actually do conver a competitive advantage over alternate methodologies.
      • Re: (Score:2, Informative)

        by Gr8Apes ( 679165 )
        Actually, they could go with a sessionless protocol (which they might) and that the server receives an announcement packet, which then gets "responded" to when email arrives. Then the originator responds with a new announcement packet when it's received the entire file, thus indicating receipt and kicking off the entire cycle again. That's far different than "push".... ;)
        • Actually, they could go with a sessionless protocol (which they might) and that the server receives an announcement packet, which then gets "responded" to when email arrives. Then the originator responds with a new announcement packet when it's received the entire file, thus indicating receipt and kicking off the entire cycle again. That's far different than "push".... ;)

          You will be hearing from my attorneys you insensitive clod. ;)
        • by m2943 ( 1140797 )
          Actually, they could go with a sessionless protocol

          Actually, "they" go with IMAP IDLE.
        • That's not sessionless. When the server gets the announcement packet, it has a session with the client, and the client assumes it has a session with the server. What you described is TCP, except without ACKs. The server is pushing data to the client; the fact that the client initiated the connection is immaterial. Using elm over telnet in 1986 would be prior art.
          • by Gr8Apes ( 679165 )

            That's not sessionless. When the server gets the announcement packet, it has a session with the client, and the client assumes it has a session with the server. What you described is TCP, except without ACKs. The server is pushing data to the client; the fact that the client initiated the connection is immaterial. Using elm over telnet in 1986 would be prior art.

            Other than the fact it partly tongue-in-cheek, who the heck said it was a session. What if, just if, it was done over UDP, or perhaps some other protocol entirely (there's quite a few in the wireless realm, like, say, GPRS)

            If IIRC, elm required user input before updating the screen. It's been about 17 years since I've seen elm though. However, your point proves my point precisely, that the entire NTP patent is patently obvious.

            • Well, just because something is implemented in UDP doesn't make it sessionless. You can, for example, implement TCP over UDP.

              I think we agree on the main point, so carry on. :-)
              • by Gr8Apes ( 679165 )
                You could, but the underlying protocol itself is inherently sessionless.

                It's why UDP can load a network to 99% of theoretical throughput while TCP gets a maximum of roughly 60% under optimum conditions.
      • by Ungrounded Lightning ( 62228 ) on Friday October 05, 2007 @02:18PM (#20872043) Journal
        Technically NTP's patents are not for sending wireless email... rather, the patents are more about the "push" technology that is used.

        How is their patented "push technology" different from, say, someone with a linux based phone running a stock mail transfer agent (such as sendmail or its successors) on the phone, with his ISP's MTA programmed to forward his mail to his own MTA in the normal fashion, and BIFF (or one of its successors) set up to beep at him when new mail arrives? This is a straightforward configuration of standard components. If you want to be able to read your email when out of range of the cell network it's the obvious way to configure it. No "invention" required.

        I have a site, for instance, that receives mail by periodic polling of the ISP using UUCP-over-IP with dialup UUCP backup. If I were to move it to a linux phone - or clone the configuration - and switch the initiation of scheduled UUCP polling from my side to the ISP's side, I'd have one form of what I described in the paragraph above. It would be a typical mail configuration from the earliest days of UUCP-internet mail bridging. The sole change would be that the user's terminal happens to be a cellphone and the dialup polling happens to be by "radio phone" rather than landline.

        Similarly if the cloned configuration accepted mail forwarded via SMTP, with the ISP's mail servers as some of the MX record entries (or the only ones), so inbound mail has somewhere to go when the phone itself isn't present on the net.
        • Ditto if I put a cellphone-net modem in my laptop and programmed the laptop to advertise its new IP address to the routing daemon of my home machine whenever the laptop came up on the net - or did the equivalent on, say, a linux-based cellphone.

          In this case would a mail transfer agent on the home machine, programmed in the normal way to forward mail to the laptop's or cellphone's MTA, also be infringing "push technology"?

          Now substitute "the ISP's routing daemon" for "my home machine's routing daemon". Isn'
        • (re)Register Republican NOW. Vote Ron Paul in the primary. It'll drive the politicians NUTS!

          I'll change my registration just before the primary to Republican so I can vote for Ron Paul. Then afterwards I'll change it right back to "No Party Preference". This is stupid, with an open primary I could vote for the best candidate for each party. Of course that would reduce the power of the parties though.

          Falcon
          • with an open primary I could vote for the best candidate for each party.

            In an open primary, Republicans could vote for the worst [votefortheworst.com] Democrat, and Democrats could vote for the worst Republican.

            ObTopic: But is there a candidate for President of the United States from each of the top two U.S. political parties who advocates correcting the balance of property rights in inventions and works of authorship? Has Ron Paul stated his views on these? Google ron paul copyright law and ron paul patent law didn't seem to help.

            • In an open primary, Republicans could vote for the worst [votefortheworst.com] Democrat, and Democrats could vote for the worst Republican.

              While this is a potential negative of open primaries I think those who would do something like this are shortsighted for putting their political party above having the best candidate win the election. Instead of being able to think for themselves they let the party think for them.

              Has Ron Paul stated his views on these?

              I didn't find anything either however I imag

          • I'll change my registration just before the primary to Republican so I can vote for Ron Paul. Then afterwards I'll change it right back to "No Party Preference".

            Since your affiliation affects only which primary you can vote in, it doesn't hurt to have it set any way that's convenient.

            I understand that for some states the cutoff for party change is coming up in a week or so. Even if it isn't, changing now means you won't risk forgetting it until it's too late. It also means you'll have a chance to correct
            • I understand that for some states the cutoff for party change is coming up in a week or so. Even if it isn't, changing now means you won't risk forgetting it until it's too late. It also means you'll have a chance to correct any errors before the deadline.

              I hadn't thought about a cutoff for registration. However some states allow you to register on election day, or used to at least. Also I'm already registered I just need to change some info on it. I'll have to check on that where I live, however I

      • Well there are only two methodologies, push and pull. And in a given situation, one will have clear advantages. And both are obvious.
        • You're still thinking in the box... There ARE other alternatives.

          Everyone always says, "that's obvious..." and "of course, push email, blah, blah, blah..." What most people don't realize is that it's not merely the idea that gets patented - it's the technology that enables the idea. In 1984 when the idea for push email first gelled, there was only pull. It was not obvious, at the time, that a push email system could work. In fact, it took nearly 8 years and lots and lots of money to build a push email solut
          • I would argue that the "technology that enables the idea" is actually a bunch of source code that NTP isn't showing anyone. So it is the idea that's being patented in this case. Which is of course wrong, as patents are not supposed to encumber ideas.

            If you were to take somebody from 1984 and tell them about the ubiquity of cellular networks and the internet, and ask them to design an email system, push would be obvious to them. It genuinely is an obvious idea. That it hadn't been invented before wheneve
            • No one said the idea wasn't obvious.
              Using nano-technology to eradicate cancer is an obvious idea.
              I assure you the first person/company that successfully pulls it off will have patents to protect their IP, even though it was "obvious".
              It's not the WHAT that gets patented, it's the HOW.
              In spite of what you might believe, this is true for the NTP patents, as well.

              As for your little time-travel gedankin experiment... as they say, hindsight is 20-20. I don't find your reasoning particularly compelling.
              • I understand that it's HOW and not WHAT that is supposed to be patented. My argument is that this is not how software patents work in practice. They are at best obfuscated, verbose descriptions of block diagrams.

                For example, here's the first claim of 6,317,592, which Wikipedia says is involved in the NTP dispute:

                What is claimed is:

                In a communication system comprising a wireless system which communication system transmits electronic mail inputted to the communication system from an originating device, mobi

                • If the summary was all there was to it, you'd be right - it's too vague. But that's why that section of the patent is called the summary. The detailed description and the claims are what differentiates the patent from similar "ideas". If you don't like the language, blame the USPTO and the many, many patent lawyers that have evolved this language over the years. All patents are written in this "obfuscated" language. If they are not the patent isn't even considered.

                  Also, one final point. You seem to be confu
                  • That wasn't the summary, that was the first claim. My understanding is that that is the part that's legally binding. And I know that claims tend to get thrown out in ascending order, but you still get sued before that can happen.

                    The constitutionally mandated purpose is "To promote the progress of science and the useful arts." Historically the idea was that patents were a way of encouraging inventors to disclose their inventions, in return for a temporary monopoly. (If the purpose were only to protect, w
  • The system is still a mess, but at least this is a step in the right direction. Hopefully, in the future, there will be some legislation (taking a hint from these court decisions) involved where clear, up to date, policies are defined, resulting in less of these software patent lawsuits in our court system.
  • by sconeu ( 64226 ) on Friday October 05, 2007 @12:31PM (#20870455) Homepage Journal
    This is a huge step in the right direction

    IsNot (patent pending)!!!!!
  • This ruling may have been a catalyst for IBM's new position and backtracking on their 'outsourcing' patent. http://www.sutor.com/newsite/blog-open/?p=1869 [sutor.com] (posted on Slashdot just a few hours ago http://yro.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=07/10/05/0449218 [slashdot.org])

    From Sutor's blog IBM adopted a new policy a year ago to sharply reduce business method patent filings and instead stress significant technical content in its patents.

    Does this make IBM's new policy seem a bit less altruistic?
    • Does this make IBM's new policy seem a bit less altruistic?
      I would say no, considering IBM's new policy seems to predate this ruling by a significant margin.
  • by postbigbang ( 761081 ) on Friday October 05, 2007 @12:34PM (#20870499)
    If you RTFA, the litigation was over a business-process that was deemed to be more about thought than process, and therefore not covered.

    Although many software patents might be obvious, and pass the Supreme Court test, there are no really good precedents - yet - that cover software patent obviousness, saving the ongoing one-click litigation.

    Not as nice or as pertinent as some would like, but I'll take it.
    • There does not need to be a court precedent for software. ALL patents are supposed to pass the "non-obvious" test. It has always been that way (in theory... for some reason not in practice lately). The fact that obvious software has been granted patents is not a reflection of the current nature of software patents at all. LOTS of patents have been awarded that should never have been, software AND non-software. I do not know why the PTO has been so lax lately on non-obviousness, but the court seems to think
      • You answer your own thoughts....

        'I don't know why the PTO has ben so lax lately on non-obviousness....'

        This is why we need precedent to bridle the weasels that believe their brilliant software idea must be exempt as no one could ever think of it (wink wink). The law's vague and the congress is lame and incapable of thought and action, so for now, it's the US Supreme Court that must guide this by example, because no one else west of them in Washington has given any leadership/guidance. And though the court
  • by blind biker ( 1066130 ) on Friday October 05, 2007 @12:40PM (#20870599) Journal
    We had a competence transfer about patents and IP, and as the tutors were explaining what can be patented, the techies in the audience (me included) would exclaim, from time to time "what, you can patent that?" We were just so surprised that you don't need to come up with something original or complicated, not even the software algorithm. I had the impression as if we were almost encouraged to patent the most broad possible vaggueties - the word "idea" only barely applies.

    I'm sure other companies do exactly the same.
    • No patents without implementation! That's one essential reform.
      • by y86 ( 111726 )

        No patents without implementation! That's one essential reform.
        That would eliminate an entire business model! SWEET!!!! No more IP Patent Trolls.

      • by moderatorrater ( 1095745 ) on Friday October 05, 2007 @01:08PM (#20871057)
        Let them get the patent before implementing the idea, but don't let them enforce it until they've implemented it (if it really was an original idea, they should be able to implement it quickly enough to enforce it, right?)
        • They'd still be able to wait to see what other pioneers do, and steal their business model.

          I'm suggesting you don't have to have a commercial app ready, but you have to have a working model (if it's a physical device) or software that runs (if it's software) that the patent examiner can try out.

          • you have to have a working model (if it's a physical device) or software that runs (if it's software) that the patent examiner can try out.

            Software should never ever be patneted!!`

            FALCON
        • The original idea of the patent system was that some individual inventor could come up with the invention in their bedroom, get a patent, then go round venture capitalists looking for funding to implement it without having to worry about them stealing his idea and implementing it themselves.
          • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

            by BillyBlaze ( 746775 )
            The original US patent system required sending a working model of the (physical) invention to the patent office.
          • The original idea of the patent system was that some individual inventor could come up with the invention in their bedroom, get a patent, then go round venture capitalists looking for funding to implement it without having to worry about them stealing his idea and implementing it themselves.

            No, patents were originally granted to encourage public disclosure. With a patent an inventor has to publicly disclose the invention, but then they get a limited monopoly to the right to market it. If an inventor

      • Your plan will eliminate 99% of startups or "small guy" businesses.
        • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

          by Belacgod ( 1103921 )
          Aren't they nowadays being crushed by large companies with extensive sets of overbroad patents? I don't see how this would make things worse.
          • So instead of at least giving them a fighting chance in court, you'd rather just give them no chance at all?
            • Would I like to give a fighting chance in court to people who have a patent on a concept but no implementation of that concept that they can develop to benefit society? No.
          • by bvimo ( 780026 )
            It might not make it any worse, but it won't make it better.
            • I'm not demanding a sales-ready product. For physical items, a prototype where the patentable function works. For software, a set of code that will do what the patent covers, even if not attached to anything else. That's not going to break any little-guy companies, but it will shut out patent trolls. Plus, by restricting patents to those who have already done the work of making the product work, it makes it more likely that a patent will result in a product being sold, which benefits society as a whole.
        • [citation needed]

          To prove that point, you'd have to show that:
          • A% of startups get patents before writing code
          • B% of those designs would be copied by someone else
          • C% of those small companies would be driven out of business by the copy
          • D% of those designs would not be copied under the current system

          where A * B * C * D = 99%. I'd estimate that it's actually far below the noise floor, and other factors, such as the insane cost of patent litigation (allowing the use of bogus patents a weapon against small companies

      • No patents without implementation! That's one essential reform.

        So you'd deny Keith Henson his satellite launching whip patent [google.com] - just because he can't afford to buy a 747, modify it to attach the tow cable, and do aerobatics with it until he gets a payload out of the atmosphere?
        • Re: (Score:2, Insightful)

          by Anonymous Coward
          Patents should go to whoever DOES it first, not whoever comes up with the idea for doing it first. Merely documenting a cool concept should not prevent others from trying it.
        • So you'd deny Keith Henson his satellite launching whip patent [google.com] - just because he can't afford to buy a 747, modify it to attach the tow cable, and do aerobatics with it until he gets a payload out of the atmosphere?

          Yes! That's a perfect example! That patent should have been denied!

          Only people that invent stuff should get patents. An invention isn't just sitting around thinking up crap. Anyone can do that. To qualify as the inventor, you have to show that the idea is actually physically realiza

          • "Invention" is coming up with the idea, by definition.

            Once someone comes up with the idea, there's a lot of development to do before it becomes a working prototype and then a marketable product. (Edison: "... one percent inspiration, 99 percent perspiration.") That 99% stage requires a lot of money.

            If somebody isn't already independently wealthy, he'll need to find backers. One of the primary purposes of the patent system is to protect the inventor during this stage. A prospective backer would get a LO
    • by Toonol ( 1057698 )
      vaggueties

      Neither my spellchecker or online dictionary recognize this word, but I still like it very much. Is it real?
    • by ejasons ( 205408 )

      We had a competence transfer about patents and IP,
      "competence transfer"? So glad that I don't work for a large company anymore...
  • What this says (Score:5, Interesting)

    by WPIDalamar ( 122110 ) on Friday October 05, 2007 @12:40PM (#20870609) Homepage
    The test-case in the article was completely uninteresting to most of us. It was a further comment in the ruling that is "the routine addition of modern electronics to an otherwise unpatentable invention"

    What this really is saying is...

    If an idea isn't patentable on it's own, then simply doing it with a computer isn't enough to make it patentable.

    So if an idea such as "Tell something to somebody using piglatin" isn't patentable, then "Tell something to somebody using piglatin on a computer" or "Tell something to somebody using piglatin on a PDA" is not patentable either.

    It could really limit the "dumb" patents.
    • I've got the points, but I already posted. But I think you did provide a good analogy in your post.

      I wonder how this would affect Vonage's patent woes.
    • The other ground-shaking part of the decision is this: "mental processes -- or processes of human thinking -- standing alone aren't patentable even if they have practical application." That would seem like grounds for invalidating a whole universe of bogus "business method" patents. Amazing what one judge's application of simple common sense can do to highlight the idiocy and cravenness of the rest of the corporate-government complex. This guy should go into the history books as a hero in the war for libert
      • The other ground-shaking part of the decision is this: "mental processes -- or processes of human thinking -- standing alone aren't patentable even if they have practical application." That would seem like grounds for invalidating a whole universe of bogus "business method" patents.

        Business methods patents are patents on complexes of actions, not "mental processes", aren't they? And, if not, wouldn't this also imply that patents on algorithms (e.g., in cryptography) are not patentable?

    • So if an idea such as "Tell something to somebody using piglatin" isn't patentable, then "Tell something to somebody using piglatin on a computer" or "Tell something to somebody using piglatin on a PDA" is not patentable either.


      However, Tell something to somebody using piglatin wirelessly is innovative and is patented by NTP. ;)
    • This stuff is all regurgitated from Diamond v. Diehr (1981), in turn
      barfed up from Parker v. Flook (1978), wherein it is largely accepted
      black-letter law that:

                'insignificant post-solution activity will not transform an unpatentable principle into a patentable process'

      Totally ancient. Even Slashdot's own 'djb' (Daniel J. Bernstein) recognized
      the veracity of the "mental steps" doctrine as applied to software.
    • Part of the whole non-obviousness principle is that you cannot just take two common items, slap them together, and call that a patent. The invention has to be or do something novel.

      As I mentioned elsewhere, I do not know why the PTO has been so lax on these rules in recent years, but the rules have been in place for a very long time.
  • Now this is assuming a great deal but hopefully it isn't too stretched.

    If a bunch of patents are, for whatever reason, invalidated and the process is determined to be broken then what becomes of the payments that companies have already forfeited in court?

    There are some who postulate that the radar gun will never be truly beaten in court because it will then invalidate all the speeding tickets of the past that relied on a radar gun. I am not a lawyer so I have no opinion on either really but it is someth
    • by bvimo ( 780026 )
      'start a Patent Militia' Them be fighting words, I'll bring my d20.
      • 'start a Patent Militia' Them be fighting words, I'll bring my d20.

        Instead of the D20 I'd rather have Canon's new EOS 1Ds Mark III [canon.com] with it's new 21.1-megapixel full-frame Canon CMOS sensor. Now we are seeing DSLRs closing in on low end medium format digital backs as well as 35mm film. I got my issue of "Digital Photo Pro" [digitalphotopro.com] today and it has a review of it and of Nikon's new fullframe D3.

        Falcon

    • It makes me wonder what Thomas Jefferson would think about today's citizens.

      Thomas Jefferson was originally opposed to patents, however eventually his friend James Madison convinced him that patents could prove more beneficial than not having patents. He even took out some patents himself. One was a machine that processed hemp aka marijuana, which up until the cotton gin was invented was the most widely used material for making cloth.

      Falcon
  • by pieterh ( 196118 ) on Friday October 05, 2007 @01:04PM (#20871005) Homepage
    This is most definitely not about software patents, it is about business method patents. This has no effect on software patents at all. It simply stops the patenting of mental processes that are vaguely assisted by technology. You can be certain that software patents - on designs, algorithms, procedures, whatever - are as strong before as after this ruling.

    Am I the only one that finds it deeply ironic that this ruling came because an "inventor" (patent jargon for 'lawyer') tried to patent something that would affect other lawyers? The CAFC does not care a jot about engineers, programmers, designers. But it does really care about inventors, sorry, lawyers.
    • That's funny, because, software can't be patented.

      They get around it by calling it "the device", but it essence, "the device" is a computer running "someone's software".
  • by CaptainPatent ( 1087643 ) on Friday October 05, 2007 @01:42PM (#20871499) Journal
    Automation of a manual process has been unpatentable for quite a time now, this is just a court decision upholding what was already known. For those of you that don't have an MPEP handy, this is an excerpt dealing exactly with that:

    2144.04[R-1]III. AUTOMATING A MANUAL ACTIVITY
    In re Venner, 262 F.2d 91, 95, 120 USPQ 193, 194 (CCPA 1958) (Appellant argued that claims to a permanent mold casting apparatus for molding trunk pistons were allowable over the prior art because the claimed invention combined "old permanent- mold structures together with a timer and solenoid which automatically actuates the known pressure valve system to release the inner core after a predetermined time has elapsed." The court held that broadly providing an automatic or mechanical means to replace a manual activity which accomplished the same result is not sufficient to distinguish over the prior art.).
    While this case is a little outdated, they're saying that the process would occur manually and all the timer / solenoid combination is doing is automating the formerly manual process. This is expanded to include thought processes too. While it's probably good to have a more recent case back up a good decision made years ago, it won't change patent law any.
    • While there may be an old precedent for prohibition of automating a manual process, both the patent office and the courts have been ignoring that precedent for "on the internet" and "on a computer" patents; if that precedent had been followed we wouldn't be in the situation we are in. So in effect patent law HAS been changed by this decision; that earlier precedent previously was not considered to cover "on a computer" patents.
  • It seems there is a huge bias against patents here which if fine as long as it doesn't detract from good data. I rely on the slashdot scoring to filter which posts I read. It seems that all pro-patent or more to the point all non-anti patent posts have a 3 point penalty. Any post that includes "patents suck, one-click die" gets at least 2 points. What????? There were some really interesting comments made by pro-patent people that are worth reading but the scoring is such crap on this issue that slashdo
    • Re: (Score:2, Insightful)

      by pinka ( 82537 )
      This is a reflection of the profession of a vast majority of slashdot people. In computer science particularly, patents have hindered, rather than fostered innovation; which is why computer scientists tend to be particularly dismissive of its virtues. Electrical Engineers are a little bit more sympathetic. Biotech Engineers (is there any such term) are far more supportive. Probably a reflection of the fixed costs involved in establishing a business in the respective fields.

      • I think that is the perception but I think it is the wrong perception. If we were able to delete the top 100 bad patents then I don't think this would be the perception. I look at all the new laws around patents that have come down and I am happy. A lot of bad patents are taking a big hit.....but... I personally worked for a company that had an important patent in their field and because of it they never had to raise money. Which meant that they didn't have to give up most of the company to a VC. Whic
  • Hold it... (Score:3, Funny)

    by idontgno ( 624372 ) on Friday October 05, 2007 @04:14PM (#20873579) Journal

    Hold it hold it hold it...

    The latest ruling came in a case arising from a patent application by Stephen Comiskey, a lawyer who wanted to create a system for "mandatory arbitration involving legal documents," such as wills or contracts. The U.S. Patent and Trademark Office denied Mr. Comiskey's patent application, as did the agency's board of appeals. Mr. Comiskey took his appeal to court.

    Did this guy try to patent lawsuits?

    Wow. That takes huge brass ones.

    Frankly, I wonder if Mr. Comiskey shouldn't be more worried about his patent being invalidated by the huge body of prior art on Slashdot, every time a patent subject comes up and some bright bulb attempts to create a joke metapatent or something.

  • I'm an Englishman and know nothing about US Law. I work as a Structural Engineer and am not an IP Solicitor. However as a geek I think it is time to change the way IP law works. Take software. I think that only the code in a piece of software should be protected by Law. Not the functionality. The USPTO can't possibly keep on top of it. IP Law is damaging innovation as things stand. The only ones who win at present are the legal trade. In fact, it is in their interests to make the system as complicated as po
  • The only reason courts are finding in favor of common sense and the obvious workings of the law, and against shortsighted business interests, is because the culture is slowly making these attitudes part of common sense. Before, these principles were always merely a matter of esoteric expertise, which excludes "common sense" itself. The nature of "obvious" is defined by the overall community experience.

    So it pays to keep whining, if the whines are legitimate, about injustices like these. It just takes way to

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