SCO Targets UK Firms 183
indierockboy writes "It seems that SCO is bringing its dodgy 'Linux licenses' over here to the UK. Vnunet.com reports that SCO's expansion of their 'Linux licensing programme' makes legal action against UK users 'imminent'. Does anyone know if the ongoing cases in the USA can be used as a defense? Since SCO has yet to prove anything..."
Merry Xmas to you too, SCO! (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Merry Xmas to you too, SCO! (Score:2)
It's been what? Two years? Two years into a process and the trial isn't even scheduled till the end of next year, SCO hasn't had to show any evidence, both companies have spent tens if not hundreds of thousands of dollars for what? Nothing.
All you have to do is make baseless allegations and you can drag a company through hell for for a few years and make them spend a million or two.
It sure worked. Scox up 20% at the open. (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:Merry Xmas to you too, SCO! (Score:2, Insightful)
There's a lot more information at groklaw [groklaw.net]
I for one welcome our new SCO overlords. (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:I for one welcome our new SCO overlords. (Score:2)
Re:I for one welcome our new SCO overlords. (Score:3, Informative)
It wouldn't be cost effective for each company to sue SCO individually. But a class-action lawsuit could be quite effective.
Re:I for one welcome our new SCO overlords. (Score:3, Informative)
Re:I for one welcome our new SCO overlords. (Score:2)
Re:I for one welcome our new SCO overlords. (Score:4, Interesting)
Re:I for one welcome our new SCO overlords. (Score:3, Insightful)
Problem is that the linux kernel doesn't contain unix code, and SCO doesn't own the copyright to unix, and the person who does own it (SuSE/Novell) has already given them a licence, as has Caldera/SCO to the extent that they can do this.
Sounds like there is some sort of case under the Control of Misleading Advertising Regulations and the Trade Descriptions Act.
Re:I for one welcome our new SCO overlords. (Score:2)
Didn't Germany order them to shut up until they have proof of violations?
Re:I for one welcome our new SCO overlords. (Score:2)
Re:I for one welcome our new SCO overlords. (Score:3, Interesting)
Yes, I realize that. How many companies purchase a full office suite, for every desktop in the building without any regard for who will actually use it or not though, even if Wordpad would suit their needs just as well, let alone abiword. LOTS of them. Relative to what companies spend on wages, hardware, and software licensing $699 per CPU on their Linux machines is a pittance. And these are Fortune 500 companies they are targetting, not small businesses with shoestring IT budgets.
Re:I for one welcome our new SCO overlords. (Score:2)
That is not a pittance. Particulatly when weighed against, say, per-CPU licenses of Windows XP. I would not at all be surprised to learn that the "licensing program" was intended to simply steer people away from deploying Linux in the first place, rather than extorting fees from current users.
Suing to get out of the contract could also restore some of the
Re:I for one welcome our new SCO overlords. (Score:1)
One can hope anyways...
Re:I for one welcome our new SCO overlords. (Score:3, Funny)
Re:I for one welcome our new SCO overlords. (Score:1)
The UK law will not tollerate the kind of mockery that SCO plays in the US as we do not allow the appeal, reappeal nonsense.
You can be sure to see SCO back on your door steps very soon, most of the UK citizens who are not living next door to IBM south bank will probably not have heard of Linux over hear so anything SCO does to get into the papers will just give Linux further popularity.
It wont work! (Score:1, Funny)
Plus British people are less in fear of these sorts of things.
Re:It wont work! (Score:2, Interesting)
Re:It wont work! (Score:2, Informative)
"The decision of the European Court of Justice is now binding for a final rule to be made by British courts... With the ruling, the court finally declared that retailers in the European Union need the approval of the trademark owner to buy merchandise outside the EEA "[e.g. a cheap country like the USA]" and sell them at prices below the suggested prices of the manufacturer or its authorised agents." which sucks for consumers, but is good for trad
Re:It wont work! (Score:2)
Re:It wont work! (Score:2)
The main purpose of legal systems is to enrich those who practice in the legal system, the rest of us are just a source of income. Lawyers play silly games just to increase costs - like the sending of endless needless letters or winding up each party to ensure that litigation will go on for longer.
I have seen this many times at first hand; a good friend of mine gave up being a solicitor because it was dishonest.
Not news. Moderate article "dumb". (Score:5, Informative)
AFAICT this isn't news. This is an old article that's surfaced again, possibly courtesy of Google News.
Evidence. (Score:3, Informative)
'same' article from 14 Jan 2004 [vnunet.com]
Slashdot editors might want to remember that January comes first, so it's pretty much a year old.
even funnier.. (Score:5, Informative)
Where he reiterates the same FUD. Heck, he only took an old story, modified it to look different, and posted it again.
Smells fishy to me, if you ask me.
Re:even funnier.. (Score:3, Interesting)
You call this mr. Peter Williams an Author??
:-)
Ah well, if VNUnet is woth their salt he'll be looking for a new (Microsoft?) job before the year is over.
technically, yes. (Score:2)
but sure/yes, I do get your point. :-)
Phone call log (Score:5, Funny)
SCO: I was just looking on your website,
thats a nice computer system you've got there.
Wouldn't want anything to happen to it now would we?
A thing so precious would need protection.
We could offer that protection.
Because protection is good to have.
$699 per cpu per year to you.
UK Company: Martha, its another crank caller [click] beeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeep
All I want for Christmas... (Score:4, Funny)
SCO Files Chapter 11.
Re:All I want for Christmas... (Score:2)
As William Burroughs used to say about seeing weeds growing through empty streets in Chicago, "May not have to wait long..."
Response letter to send if SCO tries to sue you (Score:5, Funny)
It has come to my attention that you are attempting to use your phony IP claims as support for attempting legal action against our company. Unfortunately it has been revealed that your business model has some flaws which we can not overlook. At the present moment it seems that you are employing the following strategy in pursuing this threat against us:
1. Claim to own Linux
2. ???
3. Profit!
But, if I may point out sir, that particular strategy was shown to be ineffectual as a vehicle for revenue generation a while ago. Furthermore, and as Kyle pointed out, the particular Gnome who first came up with that strategy was not operating on all intellectual cylinders at the time. Consequently, I would advise you to reconsider the logic of continuing to pursue this plan of action in the future.
Sincerely yours,
Company X
P.S. If you still want to sue us, feel free to try because our legal department is quite bored right now and they could use an easy win. It seems they have not seen anywhere near as much action as our US subsidiary recently.
Re:Response letter to send if SCO tries to sue you (Score:3, Funny)
Hello, this is the qconfirm mail-handling program. One or more messages
from you are being held because your address was not recognized.
To release your pending message(s) for delivery, please reply to this
request. Your reply will not be read, so an empty message is fine.
If you do not reply to this request, your message(s) will eventually be
returned to you, and will never be delivered to the envelope recipient.
This confirmation verifies th
Any evidence? (Score:1, Insightful)
Here we are more than a year after the trial started and they haven't produced any evidence that they own anything, and they are threatening legal action on the basis of their no evidence. This is redundant, but why does anyone listen to them? Do they think the CIO's of companies will just pay
Re:Any evidence? (Score:1, Insightful)
I don't know, why not try asking EV1 about that?
The legal system (Score:5, Interesting)
Returning to topic, SCO have to tread really carefully here. Firstly, if the British courts find their claim to be baseless that surely more ammunition for a motion to have the cases in the States dismissed.
Secondly, we have some pretty strict rules about business practices. They could find themselves in hot water with the regulators if they're shown to be effectively extorting people.
Thirdly, they have the EU to deal with. Lots of EU countries are rolling linux out. For this reason, they automatically have many powerful enemies who will be looking for ways to silence SCO. Microsoft learned the EU has teeth. So will SCO.
Simon
Re:The legal system (Score:3, Interesting)
I have a (hopefully correct) layman knowledge that in the UK, unlike as in the US, the loser pays all, which serves as a guard against the nuisance lawsuites. However, The SCO Group is unlikely to have any money left in 1-2 quarters, so how does the UK's justice system operate in such cases, i.e. when the defendant is unlikely to recover litigation costs?
Re:The legal system (Score:4, Interesting)
Bankruptcy, of course, gets them out of owing millions at the end of selling everything.. But it's still a hit to take.
Re:The legal system (Score:4, Informative)
Re:The legal system (Score:2)
Re:The legal system (Score:2)
In addition to that, any new lawsuits they start have to come out of their meager operating budget. Most of their cash is in a restricted reserve for their legal cases, but that ONLY covers the currently active cases. With their declining revenues and nonexistent future prospects, that will just make them crash faster.
Anyone want to bet on whether they find any customers if they ever come out with their "Legend" software slated for early n
Re:The legal system (Score:2, Insightful)
To put a finer point on it, the UK has some government offices that take in interest in SCO-like shakedown practices. The Office Of Fair Trading [oft.gov.uk] is concerned with fair business practices in general; misleading sollicitations being a particular area where they have legal powers.
Furthermore, the Serious Fraud Office [sfo.gov.uk] is a likely place to turn to in the event SCO starts sending out letters to a lot of businesse
They can't be serious! (paraphrasing John McEnroe) (Score:2)
Mike Davis, senior analyst at Butler
Ooh, not wise. (Score:5, Interesting)
Mr. McBride better be careful what he says about Linux over there...
Re:Ooh, not wise. (Score:2, Informative)
I was under the impression (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:Ooh, not wise. (Score:2)
On behalf of the people of Earth, I would like to formally welcome you to our planet.
Re:Ooh, not wise. (Score:2)
SCO claims that IBM entered into a contract with AT&T whereby they agreed to grant ownership of all intellectual property that they joined with any of the System V source code while producing their implementation of a UNIX like system. Thus SCO claims that they have the right to restrict the use of Linux and its source code even though the intellectual property that IBM sup
Re:Ooh, not wise. (Score:2)
Re:Ooh, not wise. (Score:2)
Re:Ooh, not wise. (Score:2)
Re:Ooh, not wise. (Score:2)
so.. who is it? (Score:3, Interesting)
The biggest users of GNU/Linux must be the banks here, and the likes of RBOS/HBOS/HSBC are an obstacle on the same scale as IBM & Daimler-Chrysler.. Way, way deep pockets, and more lawyers than even SCO could possibly envision..
In fact, given how things have worked out so far, and given who they would be up against in that sort of case, they would have trouble finding a competent solicitor to represent them. When it comes to crushing upstarts, the banks have been doing this longer than anyone...
Re:so.. who is it? (Score:1, Interesting)
Working at HBOS right now, and linux is being phased out, along with the big iron. Standard development now is C#/.net. It's hard to get any other type of development past the standards bunch in Bristol.
(excuse me being anon)
The early worm... (Score:2)
Can they really be that stupid? I mean, won't that level of stupidity be actionable when the sky really does fall and penguin little guts himself laughing?
PS, how would they react to you running the C#/.net stuff up on Mono?
SCO v. DaimlerChrysler case is closed (Score:5, Informative)
As others have pointed out, the Peter Williams article linked to in the article was actually written in January [vnunet.com] and it's just a vnunet.com fuckup that it's now showing with a December date.
If you want some fresh SCO info, here's the December 21 order [scofacts.org] that dismissed the remaining claim in SCO's complaint against DaimlerChrysler and thereby closed the case. Here's a write-up [scofacts.org] that includes information about some rules of Michigan's appeals court.
Re:SCO v. DaimlerChrysler case is closed (Score:1)
Re:SCO v. DaimlerChrysler case is closed (Score:3, Informative)
"THIS ORDER ... CLOSES THIS CASE." (Score:3, Informative)
I'm not a lawyer, but Judge Chabot is, and she's the one who signed her name below the sentence "THIS ORDER DISPOSES OF THE LAST PENDING CLAIM AND CLOSES THIS CASE", so I think we can take her word for it that the case is "closed".
She only dismissed the last remaining claim in the case without prejudice. The bulk of SCO's complaint was dismissed with
SCO Looking for Foreign Funds To Wage Legal War (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:SCO Looking for Foreign Funds To Wage Legal War (Score:2)
Target them (SCO) (Score:1, Funny)
SCO
Croxley Business Park, Hatters Lane
Watford WD1 8YN
Not that I'm suggesting linux users should put dog-shit in their air-conditioning (which, as I scoped the building a while ago, is publicly accessible without much trouble)
Re:Target them (SCO) (Score:1)
Why offend dogs like that?
Re:Target them (SCO) (Score:2)
If you're going to do something evil with shit, use fresh cat shit.
Re:Target them (SCO) (Score:2)
What about some of that artifical skunk smell? A large quantity of that should render the building uninhabitable for quite some time.
Also, rotten eggs are supposed to be very effective for hiding in ventilation systems, according to some posts I read in another slashdot story.
Re:Target them (SCO) (Score:2)
Not that I'm suggesting linux users should put dog-shit in their air-conditioning
Why bother? Would they notice any difference?
Lets hope (Score:1, Insightful)
Re:Lets hope (Score:2)
You obviously see a distinction I don't.
Well, there is one difference.... (Score:3, Interesting)
Even if you win you might end up out of pocket. I recall a case where a man sued for slander and actually won the action, but he was awarded two pence in damages and ordered to pay the costs of both sides. And lawyers in the UK are no cheaper than their US equivalents.
The UK courts (usually) have a good sense of fairness and even some measure of common sense, which seems remarkably uncommon in some courts. This cuts down immensely on frivolous law suits.
Self-contradictory post... (Score:2)
Which is it, does the court decide or is there some automatic rule? Both things can't be right.
Well, let's see (Score:1)
Hurray! And I just got my Anti-SCO shirt! (Score:1)
Imminient (Score:2)
How many have they sued over Linux? Somewhere on the order of none
Re:Imminient (Score:2, Informative)
Moll.
Re:Imminient (Score:3, Informative)
Autozone = unauthorized use of SCO libraries in porting to Linux. It wasn't over Linux itself.
Everyone sued so far is a customer of SCO and has had a contract with them. There has not been a single Linux user not previously associated with SCO sued by SCO.
Liscensing localization (Score:3, Funny)
Not again . . . surely (Score:1)
Re:Not again . . . surely (Score:2)
give up and ignore it and lose? I'd love to see the arguments they
used and the court's response to them.
Somewhat OT: EV1 Servers (Score:5, Insightful)
Speaking of SCO and "IP", I've noticed that for the last couple of months EV1 Servers has been advertising in "Linux Journal". They have the gall to put a claim of being "IP Compliant" at the bottom...
Does EV1 really think it's a good idea to KEEP supporting SCO's FUD in front of a big audience of Linux people? Or do they figure that not many Linux people remember what was going on?
Before, I could have written them off as "suckers" for falling for SCO's claims. Now, though, I can only assume they're doing it on purpose...
BSDi Settlement Agreement (Score:2)
It basically says the USL (SCOX's claimed successor in interest) agrees to not sue anyone who is not a licensee who uses "methods and concepts" (i.e. non-literal copying), which is what SCOX's allegations against Linux are based on.
IANAL, and my
My advice to you, UK (Score:4, Insightful)
SCO/MS will never make specific claims anyway, so who cares WHAT they say.
Seems like their WHOLE business model at this point is making noise.
Yeah, the buzz is growing, but it's called Linux!
There is no 'UK' legal system (Score:4, Informative)
Just as a point of information, people are writing as if there is one unified 'UK' legal system. There isn't. Scots law (in Scotland) is completely different from English law (England and Wales) - not even the same basic legal principles apply.
I think Northern Ireland is different again but I'm not certain of that. The Isle of Man certainly has a separate legal system, as do the Channel Islands and other bits and bats that people think of as part of the United Kingdom but which technically are not. Even within Scotland, Orkney and Shetland use old Norse ('Udal') law for some civil matters which is different from Scots law.
SCO are almost certainly talking about bringing action in the English courts against Linux users in England. But, as we've seen before many times, SCO talks a lot about bringing these actions. They don't actually do it. And given their 4th Quarter license revenues have dropped $10M to $120K [theregister.co.uk] over the past year, even the threats aren't working any more.
Oh go on, pleaaaaaassssssse...... (Score:3, Interesting)
The second is directed to the local (to SCO UK) police reporting an act of attempting to "obtain funds by deception". This law covers acts along the lines of falsley claiming ownership of something with a view to selling it. Until SCO prove a case one way or the other they have no such proof and no claim.
The third is to the Trading Standards Office complaing of false claims being made.
Between the three of them, it could get quite entertaining.
Total scosource failure in Asia, USA, and Germany (Score:2)
Steve Stites letter to the SEC (Score:2)
http://users.rcn.com/srstites/jacuse/sec.compla
Re:I don't know... (Score:1)
Re:I don't know... (Score:2, Funny)
Does that answer your question?
Re:I don't know... (Score:1)
Re:I don't know... (Score:5, Informative)
Re:I don't know... (Score:2)
Re:Don't forget... (Score:1)
Re:Don't forget... (Score:1)
Re:Don't forget... (Score:2)
Frock rhymes with cock. The UK has a reputation of men dressing up as women both in entertainment (The Two Ronnies, Monty Python, etc) and in real life (conservative ministers found dead in women's underwear, etc).
I didn't think it was a troll either, just a joke that fell a bit flat.
Cheers
Stor
Re:Don't forget... (Score:1)
Re:SCO programme only half UK-translated (Score:1)
"is" is a verb.
"ice" is a noun.
"licensing policy", "licensing committee".
And the BBC can't make up its mind whether it is "programme" or "program".
Re:SCO programme only half UK-translated (Score:2)
A computer program.
A television programme.
Get with the program(me)?
Re:SCO programme only half UK-translated (Score:2, Interesting)
I think Patrick Moore in his heart of hearts thinks that a billion is a million million but he doesn't say that wor
Re:SCO programme only half UK-translated (Score:2)
Wrong! (Score:2)
Re:FU SCO! (Score:2, Insightful)