China Will Monitor, Censor SMS Messages 328
maggeth writes "Early reports on the AP (via Yahoo) indicate that China will begin monitoring and censoring SMS communications in real time. China's 'great firewall' is infamous, but the move to censoring SMS has been slow due to technological roadblocks. Algorithms are used to identify key words and combinations of words that might be associated with 'political rumors and "reactionary remarks,"' and the system automatically notifies local police. Something to think about on your Fourth of July weekend!" Reader ackthpt adds links to coverage at the BBC and The Register, asking "What next, a massive government database system to track every message and contacts between people?"
nothing new (Score:5, Interesting)
nothing new-These shoes are made for walking. (Score:2, Insightful)
You forget one can leave their service provider for another. What will the Chinese leave their government for?
Re:nothing new-These shoes are made for walking. (Score:4, Insightful)
No differents as far as I'm concerned
Wireless Cameras [completecctv.com]
Re:nothing new-These shoes are made for walking. (Score:2, Funny)
Re:nothing new-These shoes are made for walking. (Score:5, Insightful)
A concerted letter writing campaign is more likely to get you additional scrutiny from the PATRIOT act.
If you try to run for office based on this platform you are going to be branded unPATRIOTic. Why do you think they picked that name, to discourage anyone from criticizing it. You will be painted as either soft on terrorists if not one yourself and I assure you those kinds of charges play very well with at least half of America's less than smart voters.
If you look at Kerry he was stumping against the Patriot Act only in the Democratic primaries which is where most of the American against the Patriot act are, excepting a few true conservatives, like me, that hate it too along with all big government. In the general election I doubt Kerry will mention it, and if he is elected he probably wont support doing anything about it, except fine tuning it which will probably end making it worse, not better. He is a former prosecutor and probably has a fond spot in his heart for tools that make prosecuting people easier.
I'll probably get slammed for it but multinational execs probably love China's repression of its people and America's repression of its own. Most corporations deep down really want quiet subservient people who go to work every day, keep secrets, keep their mouth shut, don't complain and don't organize to get better wages and benefits. Multinational execs in China might get upset with China's rules if they interfere with their SMS traffic but I wager China is being selective and not putting this filtering on foreign executives phones.
Re:nothing new-These shoes are made for walking. (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Who said "Slashdot is too US-centric"? (Score:3, Insightful)
I find it so odd that all the Republican business and political types who placed China at the right hand of the devil a few years ago, when they couldn't make a profit there now seem to think its a fin
Sounds like a need for encrypted SMS. (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Sounds like a need for encrypted SMS. (Score:5, Interesting)
Our sales guys are known to send SMS messages about "got [big client]" and similar.
If someone can listen in to such communicatios, there's a big opportunity for really hard to detect illegal stock-market trading with insider information they pick up from sales people in other companies.
Re:Sounds like a need for encrypted SMS. (Score:4, Interesting)
Today one can use some Java app that runs on a Java-enabled phone. This way at least you know what you are running. But a generic solution would need to be built into all the phones, and that can't happen overnight.
Re:nothing new (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:nothing new (Score:5, Informative)
http://www.kuro5hin.org/story/2001/12/20/211923
Re:nothing new (Score:2)
Is the reason you're posting as an AC because you don't want someone to do the same thing to you?
Re:nothing new (Score:5, Insightful)
While one is worse than the other, that still doesn't mean that both aren't undesirable, infringing or wrong.
I think the US government should be rightfully criticized for a level of surveilence that is likely illegal, or was highly illegal before the PATRIOT was enacted.
The existence of MATRIX and ECHELON aren't exactly winning my confidence in the US government. The kind of things that they fail to cover up completely makes me wonder what they did manage to cover up, just didn't get any people with enough guts to be whistle blowers?
For a government that is supposed to be about checks and balances, neither seem to be used much.
Re:nothing new (Score:2)
Re:nothing new (Score:2)
Re:nothing new (Score:5, Interesting)
Oh, and when your government stops killing people for money and wiping their asses on the constitution, I'll start to respect them. As that's never going to happen, fuck 'em. dumb monkey-faced bush and his evil cronies. fuck 'em to hell.
Re:nothing new (Score:5, Insightful)
Avon and Somerset Police said a Special Branch officer visited Mr Devine after the person who received the message contacted police.
And
Mr Devine, an engineer at Orange, said he was worried when the officer confronted him a month after he had sent the text.
I think you've embellished it a bit
Re:nothing new (Score:2)
Maybe he mixed them up.
Re:nothing new (Score:2, Insightful)
How many terrorists or plots has all of this surveillance stopped? Close to zero. How many terrorists or plots have been stopped by plain old, word-of-mouth, guy-on-the-street info? More than the high-tech surveillance. How much does it all cost? Far too much.
How do you know AT&T doesn't notify the police? Would the police tell you immediately if they were notified of your private messages? No. They investigate f
Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:nothing new (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:nothing new (Score:3, Informative)
Had he not obviously used it as an example then that would be another matter.
Re:nothing new (Score:3, Interesting)
so since they do log 3 months worth that means they (as in AT&T) monitor our sms messages? and then you point to "the Americans" as monitors too? i'm not seeing your connection between a communist government that will throw people in jail for saying bad things about them and your conspiracy theory that AT&T and the US govt are in league to crack down on political opponents.
or just maybe its time for your nap.
Censored or Mindfucked? What's better? (Score:5, Interesting)
In some ways, China has a more honest approach with their barbarism than the US. China is at least very upfront about their intentions. They are watching and you may go into a gulag. It's pretty clear. In the US, you are being watched and instead of being clear coherent about it, they always try to mindfuck you. "For your safety. For the Homeland."
If there was ever a word that would come from a sociopath, it would be the word "Homeland". That is not a common word in the American lexicon.Words like this don't appear out of the blue. Lot of thought went into that. A lot of thought about thinking. Kind of like how Pavlov thought about his dogs.
All this bold and blatent meddling with the American psyche is starting to scare me. Such disrespect and careless tampering sends a message loud and clear. "We own you." And it's true. Americans, and most people around the world are owned property in so many subtle ways, that once you add them all together, there is no room left over for anyone (who desired it) to be free. Let's let debt be one of the less subtle methods to allowing yourself to become property. Consider cultures immense pressure to encourage debt for everyone. Consider what is happening to culture itself. No longer a free and natural exchange of information between human beings but a top down force-feeding of this sick "television culture" we have. You are composed of the information you allow yourself to be exposed to.
You fools will protect your computer with a firewall but when it comes to your own brain you feel invincible and plop down on the couch for hours on end and let an entire universe of sociopaths(a direct metaphor for marketing) have their way in any way they want with your own brain.
This is a sad and critical time in human history. I wonder what's going to become of us? Keep an eye on the television brain-washed crowd. I suspect whatever strange crap happens, they're gonna get it first. Think about it. You might consider life as some 70 odd years of crossing busy intersections. If you aren't paying attention the more subtle trucks will run over you first, followed by whatever else crosses your path when you're not looking.
What did your television tell you do do in the days shortly before the big internet/stocks crash. your television told you to buy. *splat*
This is common sense. Pull your heads out of your asses. Thanks.
Re:Censored or Mindfucked? What's better? (Score:5, Insightful)
True, but "Fatherland" was already taken...
Re:nothing new (Score:5, Insightful)
A.) They're not preventing messages from being sent.
B.) Due process.
C.) Nobody's been investigated for discussing anti-Bush views via SMS.
Re:nothing new (Score:5, Insightful)
Would you know this for sure? In the UK the authorities now have powers to gag people interviewed during an investigation, so you would never know. Does the US have similar imoral laws?
Comment removed (Score:5, Informative)
Re:nothing new (Score:2)
Despite the slide down the slippery slope in our country concerning privacy and other freedoms, we ARE in fact b
Re:nothing new (Score:2)
china, on the other hand, IS an orwellian state.
big difference.
Rubbish. Go Polish Your Tinfoil (Score:2)
Just to add to your paranoia, Slashdot is tracking you every time you access this site! Wow! They know what you did and when you did it and what you read and what you posted!! Better call out the militia.
Whack yourself on the head and understand what is happening in China: Certain things you say in an SMS message will be censored by the state. They will never be seen by the other party. A computer program will key on certain language an
Something to keep in mind... (Score:2)
but america does it to protect the children (Score:3, Interesting)
From the article:
The official Xinhua News Agency said the campaign was aimed at cleaning up "pornographic, obscene and fraudulent" phone messages that have "infiltrated short messaging content."
Sounds evil and Orwellian right? Now read this:
T
Meet the NSA (Score:3, Insightful)
If you make a call that the NSA has processed your conversation. The only difference is the "in the U.S. we protect personal freedoms", but don't worry, the Bush administration is working hard to remove that distinction.
Re:Meet the NSA (Score:3, Interesting)
MOD DOWN (Score:5, Insightful)
- the CIA used to be prevented from spying on US citizens, not the NSA.
- Patriot act I and II (which was quietly approved on the day that we announced the "capture" of Sadaam) stripped all that pretense away. Any group is allowed to spy on us, with any group being (NSA, CIA, Fatherland Defense, and DOJ).
Are we any different than China? Yes we are. We have the ability to auto spy on most aspects of our life. That allows the feds to focus on the otherPlenty of misbehavior in both parties. (Score:5, Informative)
2.Patriot act I and II (which was quietly approved on the day that we announced the "capture" of Sadaam) stripped all that pretense away. Any
group is allowed to spy on us, with any group being (NSA, CIA, Fatherland Defense, and DOJ).
There's plenty of misbehavior to point at on both sides. But let's understand it.
From at least the mid '70s to about the mid '90s (as far as us outside the "security community" wall can tell) the breakdown was this:
- FBI was responsible for investigations involving interstate lawbreaking, kidnapping (assumed to involve intestate flight), and domestic security (including investigating spy rings and conducting security clearance investigations). Their operations often lead to prosecutions and are intermittently subjected to court scrutiny and on-the-record congressional investigation. So they must meet strong constitutional tests, or risk losing cases, injunctions, and civil-rights suits.
- CIA was responsible for spying and covert operation. Their operations are compartmentalized for security - which limits oversight and control - and are often outside the law in the areas where they operate. They were prohibited from operating inside the US at all - due to constitunal-authorization concerns, practical concerns (like coups, political sabotage,
- The NSA was charged with signals intelligence - both decoding to hunt for enemy action and protecting US communications - government, corporate, and personal - from foreign spying. As a side-effect they end up intercepting lots of private domestic communication content that the government isn't authorized to use. So they held it tightly (which also helped protect their methods) and dribbled it out pretty much only to the intelligence community (because a drop of it in a criminal case could blow the case). (Indeed, for decades the US claimed they didn't exist. Joke: NSA = No Such Agency.)
Info from NSA (apparently) fed mainly into CIA (which had the political/military implication analysis section). CIA would give info to FBI when appropriate, mainly stuff related to domestic spying and security clearances. (CIA and NSA info generally could NOT be used in criminal cases, because it's collected without probable cause or warrant. The constitutional protections would get stretched by using it to generate a "tip", telling the FBI where to look for something - but the info they developed had to come from open observation -> probable cause or warrants to be used in court.)
During the Clinton administration the wall between CIA and FBI was raised: ALL communication between them had to go up a bureaucratic red-tape chain and be handed over through a special office headed by a Clinton appointee (after approval by that office). The same set of Clinton administration officials came up with the idea that terrorism should be treated as a criminal offences rather than acts of war.
The result: No information was passed through the red-tape gauntlet from NSA and CIA to FBI. First fallout: The "nuclear secrets for campaign contributions" investigation was gutted (leading to leaks from frustrated agents.) (Some speculate that gutting this was the reason for the change.) Second fallout: Info about Bin Laden's activity didn't reach the FBI. The Clinton administration had several offers from Middle Eastern powers to hand over Bin Laden, which they turned down because the FBI couldn't make a criminal case against him. Third fallout: The mechanism hadn't been dismantled by 9/11.
The Bush administration went overboard the other direction. The Constitution's protections of the accused are relaxed in wars and the like - apparently because holding a trial in the middle of a battlefield is impractica
Re:Meet the NSA (Score:5, Informative)
From here [jya.com]
From a CNN special about the NSA [cnn.com]: While it's not "normally" permitted, it's hard to say if they ever get turned down.Re:Meet the NSA (Score:2)
Secure IMs (Score:4, Informative)
Re:Secure IMs (Score:2)
Re:Secure IMs (Score:2)
Yes, if everyone did it then it would work. The problem is the hardware needed on the ends to do it in the general consumer market isn't there (like common in cell phones and Outlook Express for example), so the majority of users won't use it because they are too busy to be bothered with the hassel.
Re:Secure IMs (Score:2)
Re:Secure IMs (Score:5, Informative)
The encryption alogorithm for Trillian is quite strong (128 bit blowfish), but the method of exchanging keys is open to attack. Tril uses Diffie-Helman key exchanges for the clients to get private keys, but this is entirely open to a man-in-the-middle attack. A server (or carnavore type machine) could sit between the two clients during the key exchange, and manipulate the exchange so that the whole conversation is readable to the client.
More info here [rsasecurity.com]
I always thought about creating an IM service that uses certs in order to encrypt / decrypt messages. Like, when the person logs in and authenticates with the server, the client registers a new public key with the server.
Of course, something like this will take a bit of thought, and is in the future. Thoughts?
If there ever was a people needing liberating... (Score:5, Insightful)
We will not speak ill of China (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:If there ever was a people needing liberating.. (Score:2, Interesting)
"It could be worse" is an awful justification for the present. If you continue to think that way your statement above will look slightly different in a few years....
That is to say, we could fall farther down the slippery sloap than China ever has.
(Yes, this post is BS - but this is YRO, such is the norm under that flag.)
Re:If there ever was a people needing liberating.. (Score:4, Insightful)
Excepting the U.S. is becoming completely dependent on China for just about everything. Imagine if they shut off their imports how empty the shelves will be in your local stores, especially WalMart.
Today the U.S. might weather it but at the rate multinational corporations are rushing to move everything to China the U.S. will be totally at its mercy in a few years. Is America a sovereign nation and bastion of freedom when all its jobs are in China and all its dollars go to China and China can destroy the U.S. by stopping all the container ships from leaving its ports.
Its my conjecture China a decade or two ago deduced it couldn't beat the U.S. idealogically or militarily so its opting to beat the U.S. by exploiting its greatest weakness, its greed, and beat the U.S. economically.
They manipulate their currency to make China a great place for foreigners to invest and there good ridiculously cheap on foreign markets. They have a huge, subservient, labor pool which will be unlikely to ever see pressure for higher wages. They dangle that in front of greedy American execs who don't think past the end of the quarter and the U.S. guts its own economy and moves all its capital and intellectual property to China. One day the U.S. wakes up and realizes that the trade deficits have destroyed it, it doesn't make anything any more and China will has taken control of all the capital and IP. Some of the multinationals, and there execs, might survive and make a killing, but America's as a country is finished.
Last week figures came out on foreign investment in various countries. The U.S. was passed for the first time in recent history by China and it was by a lot. China had $50 billion in foreign investment versus $40 billion in the U.S.
Re:If there ever was a people needing liberating.. (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:If there ever was a people needing liberating.. (Score:5, Insightful)
'A Large proportion of the population' also benefited from segregation.... Free societies are judged by how well they protect the rights of the individual.... not how many they sacrifice 'for the greater good'
Re:If there ever was a people needing liberating.. (Score:2)
"Nosirree, my slaves don't want to be free. The fact that they haven't freed themselves shows this. No need for emancipation..."
one system to monitor them all? (Score:4, Informative)
Like this [hiwaay.net], or maybe this [aclu.org], or this [mcmail.com]
I don't know if the Chinese have a system like this yet, but we already have Echelon, so were set.
(For those of you to lazy to read all the articles, Echelon is a global communications spy network run by the NSA (with cooperation, in the form of listening posts, from the UK, Australia, and New Zealand. It gives them the capability to listen to and monitor any broadcast transmission on the planet.)
Echelon isn't necessary! (Score:3, Interesting)
That this information was able to be requested in the first place was quite a shock to me. The request pre
Re:Echelon isn't necessary! (Score:2)
Let's see them censor this! (Score:5, Funny)
D G0v3RNm3n7 5ux. m40 5UX.
D 0NL3 7ru7h 1Z PH4Lun D4F4.
l37Z g0 8uRN 0Ur53lV3z n pr07357.
Re:Let's see them censor this! (Score:2, Informative)
D G0v3RNm3n7 5ux. m40 5UX.\
D 0NL3 7ru7h 1Z PH4Lun D4F4.\
l37Z g0 8uRN 0Ur53lV3z n pr07357.'
This new censorship sucks.
The government sucks. Mao sucks.
The only truth is Falun Dafa.
Let's go burn ourselves in protest.
Re:Let's see them censor this! (Score:3, Funny)
Re:Let's see them censor this! (Score:2)
They should be much more worried about tight little cells that are already speaking l33t-equivalent, except it's a l33t that nobody knows but the conspirators.
Re:Let's see them censor this! (Score:3, Insightful)
What if thousands of people demonstrated in opposition to the government, and stood up to tanks?
Well it happened. They KILLED them. End of problem for the government.
What you need to understand about China: They've got a LOT of people. They can kill MILLIONS of them and not make a serious dent in
Big Brother Syndrome in Disguise Getting Worse (Score:5, Insightful)
I'm sad to say that I have noticed a disturbing gravitation towards this kind of draconian system by our government who has somehow convinced the majority of the populace that they should be granted whatever monitoring rights they want because we need them to protect us from terrorists. Personally, I could give jack sh*t about terrorists on a minute by minute basis throughout most of my day. I feel much safer keeping certain parts of my life private and away from the Washington watchdogs.
The reality of the situation is that if we willingly give up all rights to privacy something like this type of system is not going to be far away, though few see it.
Re:Big Brother Syndrome in Disguise Getting Worse (Score:2)
China Government == King Canute (Score:4, Interesting)
Though the Chinese Government now trying to maintain such control over it's population is fighting a losing battle. Control WAS just about possible before the prolification of IT for the masses, but now the Chinese Government is trying to stop the tide. There is NO WAY to keep up such control on modern communications. Even with auto-text-pattern matches and auto-calling-of-the-local-police, all the participants need to do is use code words!
I think we can expect the Chinese Government, in the next couple of years, in effect throw in the towell and permit uncensored communication to occur. If they do not the populus will have found ways round it anyway. Then what - who knows... I hope not another Tiananmen Square.
Huh? Most mobiles here are quasi-anonymous (Score:5, Interesting)
Most people use a prepaid card that they recharge in 30, 50 and 100 Yuan quantities.
It works quite well and I have been using such a quasi anonymous card for almost the whole time.
How would the government track down such numbers to names? Maybe through correlation of SMS communication?
Re:Huh? Most mobiles here are quasi-anonymous (Score:5, Informative)
Re:Huh? Most mobiles here are quasi-anonymous (Score:2)
secure ims... sure (Score:3, Interesting)
Doesn't the US already do this? (Score:3, Funny)
All your SMS are belong to U.S.
Im sure the US does too (Score:5, Informative)
I'm sure they have tons of backup plans. Including
Sharks with freakin
MPAA-China we support you, Oh most favored Nation! (Score:2, Funny)
Please forward any MS Word templates for the secret laws you passed to put this in place so we can send them to our employees in State and Federal legislative offices.
Sincerely, Domo iragato, and sorry about Lost in Translation,
The MPAA and our new f
easy to evade (Score:4, Insightful)
Futile (Score:4, Insightful)
A low tech solution is just to use code phrases - SMS people seem to use enough of those already. Won't fool a human but it'll get past the automatic filters. A funny example was the use of the number 9 on restaurant signs which sounds like "dog" in Cantonese to advertise that delicacy while avoiding the wrath of the British. Since people in China already know that their e-mail and chat rooms are monitored I assume that they are already doing things like this.
The government could of course, adjust their filters from time to time as they learn of these things but my guess is that the clueless party official who suggested this is happy that it has been implemented and that it looks like they are in control and doing something. Whether it works or not is not really that important.
Ob. Soviet joke (Score:2, Funny)
It already happens in Britain (Score:4, Interesting)
And I'm sure it happens in the USA as well.
Wow (Score:2)
Makes me wonder if AOL or someone would ever try something like this, just for market r
Carnivore anyone? (Score:5, Insightful)
The US is just as bad as China but its more polished on the outside. The difference is that china is open about what they do.
Is this the same China... (Score:3, Insightful)
SEGA's on a roll... (Score:3, Funny)
So amongst all the spam and pirated material... (Score:2)
The goals (Score:4, Interesting)
If the leash is removed right now and the Party dissolved, only the worst types of people - the most despicable arch-villains, mobsters, aspiring politicians - will be on top, simply because they know how to wield power. It would be awfully reckless to give them the power. China will be torn into pieces, and every one will have The Bomb.
Re:The goals (Score:4, Insightful)
Don't quite grasp it (Score:5, Informative)
Re:Don't quite grasp it (Score:2)
Well, you can track down a mobile with ease provided you have such a system in place. If i'm not mistaken your phone still has an ESN as well as a SIM. Sims you can swap out with ease, but the
L337 Speak? (Score:2)
The Australian government has used Echelon taps. (Score:4, Interesting)
They were caught that time, but it's probable that they're routinely scanning both internal and overseas (the Tampa is Norwegian) conversations. The tapping was judged to be illegal, but no prosecutions occurred, and nothing has been changed to prevent a repetition.
Project Mooncake? (Score:3, Informative)
Don't be fools - look around (Score:3, Insightful)
(1) We have the second amendment. The chinese don't. If the government gets out of hand, we always have the upper hand. Mao said it best: Government comes from the point of a gun.
Don't like Bush? You have three options: (a) vote for the other guy, and do everything you can to get him elected, (b) pick up your rifle and follow the example of our founding fathers, pledging their lives, fortunes, and sacred honor in open rebellion, or (c) shut up and sit down, coward.
(2) We have a seperate judiciary, for the most part. Once appointed, a judge is pretty much left alone. This leads to some corruption, but the net effect is that President Bush can't order the judiciary what to do. Chinese don't have this.
Before you get your panties in a bundle over Gitmo, notice that Pres. Bush is bringing them into the homeland to prepare for arraignment and trial because Supreme Court said so. Who really controls the US? It sure ain't Bush.
(3) Patriot act gives the police the same rights that they have for prosecuting drug crimes and organized crime but now for terrorism. I certainly wish we didn't have the Patriot act, but what are the alternatives? Citizen vigilance, or martial law. That's about it. How many terrorists have you caught today? Didn't think so.
Citizens (that means YOU, unless you are a cop) have more rights to investigate crime and build cases against criminals than police do. Don't think so? Ask a bounty hunter about what he is able to do. Hint: Breaking and entering a felons home is not a crime for a bounty hunter. No warrant needed, either. Go ahead and arrest anyone you find in the house, and tie them up if need be. Bring them all downtown to get booked.
(4) The United States is the BEST and the LAST defense agaisnt tyranny. Make no joke about it, in no other country do you have as many rights that are protected by government as you do here. Is it perfect? Of course not. Rather than complain, get off your butt and do something about it.
If you really think the US is stinkier than other countries, then you are more than welcome to leave and rescind your citizenship. No one is keeping you here, unlike China.
Re:Don't be fools - look around (Score:5, Insightful)
Senator Joseph McCarthy
However generally I agree, except I'd include the western european democracies in there too. None are perfect, but all are not perfect in different ways so the sum of the whole is better than any single one.
For instance the UK hasn't been a full democracy for as long as the USA but it's enshrined demoncratic institutions since 1688 which have proven remarkably robust.
Or Germany, which of course had the trauma of Nazism, but as a result of which is probably more concious of civil rights and freedoms than the USA.
Or France, whos foreign policies I'm sure you don't agree with but who's independent attitude does act as a friendly counterweight to the USA and others and so forces them to justify themselves.
Or the Dutch, who's liberal, permissive, personal-freedom centered attitudes are usually 10 to 20 years ahead of the rest of us.
Or the Scandanavians, where personal freedoms are considered to include social support and equality to a degree you might profoundly disagree with - but do pose you questons.
Re:Don't be fools - look around (Score:3, Insightful)
Yes, we did, and that really is an illustration of jgardn's post. Notice how many laws have been passed since then to enforce civil rights and equality. Those came about because people took action, not because the government happily saw the error of its ways. But because the US is a democracy, and because people have freedom of political speech here, changes came about and those "problems" with civil rights in
Re:Don't be fools - look around (Score:2, Interesting)
Re:Don't be fools - look around (Score:4, Interesting)
James Woods (the actor) identified 9/11 hijackers [democrats.com] on a flight they were using as a dry run. He got the information to authorities, who did nothing about it. (The link tries to spin this as a "Bush knew" conspiracy, but it's far more likely to be typical bureaucratic inertia and incompetence). Thanks to citizen vigilance, we had the information we needed to stop 9/11 without invasive laws like the Patriot Act.
Re:Don't be fools - look around (Score:3, Insightful)
Exactly. And the best form of defense, as we all know, is a strong offense. Which is why, in the name of defeating tyranny, the US supported Pinochet and a host of other murderous regimes in South America; why they still support the Saudis - a regime that makes China look free; that nice man Karimov in uzbekistan (what do we care if he boils his political opponents alive in oil? he's on our side!); General Musharraf in Pakistan
Re:Don't be fools - look around (Score:2, Insightful)
Whats that got to do with a civil revolution in the United States? This always comes up and I debate it's correctness.
First it isn't really the most powerful army in the world but, it would like you to think so. If it was why would it be calling up a huge number of "ready reserve"/people who have left service? It's more that no one wants to chalenge it currently. Despite all the noise from world governments about a "rouge US". Not one has put
The size of it... (Score:5, Informative)
Already happens in the UK (Score:5, Interesting)
Some guy [theregister.co.uk] gets picked up by Special Branch for sharing Clash lyrics by SMS.
I imagine this happens to most SMS messages in Europe. (Echelon conspiracies, yada yada) The US may have a less joined-up Big Brother, but that will probably have more to do with the general lack of integration of their mobile network.
Well... (Score:2)
the hypocrisy of indignation (Score:3, Insightful)
Carnivore = american
they do not censor, they just infiltrate your peace group or get you arrested for speaking against Bush (yes this is a reference to scenes of Fahrenheit 911).
It's easier to be shocked by other nation than our own but to critisize China for openly doing what the US are doing hypocriticaly (we all know it but still pretend it's just "stories") is disturbing to the least, it's like saying that removing people right is ok as long as you don't tell them which and you keep it a "secret".
Re:the hypocrisy of indignation (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:China Taking over the World (Score:2, Insightful)
Much is made of the countless hordes of the Chinese population, and the 1 billion number is bandied about in evidence of this. I fail to see why this is relevant on a global scale.
For example, the EU has over half that population, and it is a population that is better fed, better educated, better equipped, and better armed than the Chinese are ever likely to be, with an industrial, commercial, and technological infrastructure that is literally centuries ahead of China. India has a population near to Chin
Re:Slashdot in China (Score:3, Informative)
The only evidence of the Great Firewall I've seen is trying to access Google's cache -- after trying to view a cached page, Firefox gives me a "Net reset error" and I won't be able to access anything from Google.com for about an hour.
(Oh, and BBC's news site always times out.)