Swedish Pirate Demo

Arioch of Chaos writes "In Sweden, May 1 is still a day when many people get out on the streets to take part in the traditional demonstrations. Today, the Swedish site Piratbyrån organised demonstrations in several Swedish towns, demanding more bandwith and the abolition of intellectual property laws. This picture is just great. More pictures here." Congratulations to whoever made the AYBABTU sign.

Let me be the first to say...

[Cinematique]

Arrrr.

Mirror , just in case

[pigscanfly.ca]

Hi their, just in case things go sidewise as it were I have put up a mirror.
The mirror of http://www.piratbyran.org/ is at http://mirrorit.demonmoo.com/r_154/www.piratbyran. org/ [demonmoo.com]
The mirror of http://www.piratbyran.org/1majbilder/umea/DSCF0020 .jpg is at http://mirrorit.demonmoo.com/r_154/www.piratbyran. org/1majbilder/umea/DSCF0020.jpg [demonmoo.com]
The mirror of http://www.piratbyran.org/1majbilder/ is at http://mirrorit.demonmoo.com/r_154/www.piratbyran. org/1majbilder/ [demonmoo.com]
The mirror of http://www.piratbyran.org/1majbilder/sthlm/DSCF002 3.JPG is at http://mirrorit.demonmoo.com/r_154/www.piratbyran. org/1majbilder/sthlm/DSCF0023.JPG [demonmoo.com]
The mirror of http://www4.tomshardware.com/column/20040430/index .html is at http://mirrorit.demonmoo.com/r_154/www4.tomshardwa re.com/column/20040430/index.html [demonmoo.com]
The mirror of http://www.dailywireless.com/modules.php?name=News &file=article&sid=239 is at http://mirrorit.demonmoo.com/r_154/www.dailywirele ss.com/modules.php%3fname=News&amp%3bfile=article& amp%3bsid=239 [demonmoo.com]
The mirror of http://www.kismetwireless.net/ is at http://mirrorit.demonmoo.com/r_154/www.kismetwirel ess.net/ [demonmoo.com]
The mirror of http://www.stumbler.net/ is at http://mirrorit.demonmoo.com/r_154/www.stumbler.ne t/ [demonmoo.com]
The mirror of http://www.tomshardware.com/column/20040430/images /warfly.avi is at http://mirrorit.demonmoo.com/r_154/www.tomshardwar e.com/column/20040430/images/warfly.avi [demonmoo.com]

Cease and desist

[Big Nothing]

Your unlawful copying of our images will not go unpunished! You will hear from our lawyers!

/Piratbyrån

Demanding bandwidth?

[PurifyYourMind]

I can see how people are justified in demanding human rights like clean water or civil rights like free speech. But is bandwidth really something that humans need to the degree that it should be a "right"? And if so, who's going to pay for it all?

Re:Demanding bandwidth?

[arashiakari]

Even if two-thousand people marched, it would be a tiny fraction of the population protesting. Who cares if twenty-five people protest? Even if 99% of the population marched to defend their right to take your work and copy it without paying you, would it make it right? No.

Re:Demanding bandwidth?

[Anonymous Coward]

If 99% of the world marched protesting people charging for products and services that should be given freely, then after say 60-70 years it would become right. You only think it's wrong because the Bible said so, and the last xxx generations have taught people right and wrong based on the bible.

And where, exactly, does the bible say 'Thou shalt respect copyright'? I can certainly come up with a counter-example: Luke12:16-21.

16And he told them this parable: "The ground of a certain rich man produced a good crop. 17He thought to himself, 'What shall I do? I have no place to store my crops.' 18"Then he said, 'This is what I'll do. I will tear down my barns and build bigger ones, and there I will store all my grain and my goods. 19And I'll say to myself, "You have plenty of good things laid up for many years. Take life easy; eat, drink and be merry." ' 20"But God said to him, 'You fool! This very night your life will be demanded from you. Then who will get what you have prepared for yourself?' 21"This is how it will be with anyone who stores up things for himself but is not rich toward God."

And bear in mind that this is concerning physical property only, the very concept of owning an idea was so beyond the comprehension of anyone at that time that there is *NO* mention of Intellectual property or *Any* justification thereof in the bible as far as I am aware. If you can find such, point it out, but otherwise withdraw your statement. Disclaimer: IANAT (Theologian)

Posted anonymously in a (probably vain) attempt to avoid the atheist zealots causing yet another flame war (my argument is one of historical and textual reference, not a religious one per se.)

Re:Demanding bandwidth?

[Anonymous Coward]

Exodus 20:15 Thou shalt not steal.

Bullshit

Slashdotus 23:45 Thou shalt not confuse stealing with copyright infringement

Haven't you read the Very New Testament?

Re:Demanding bandwidth?

[phurley]

I guess my point is there is no right or wrong. It's what the majority believes to be right or wrong. And saying that if 99% of the world had a belief, you could still claim "it was wrong", is only based on the fact you were taught by said majority your whole life.

So everything is relative and ruled by the mob? If 99% of the people believe slavery is moral, then slavery is moral? Nope don't buy it. There are many ways to find an ethical compass, and I will not argue the positive (right now); however, you

Re:Demanding bandwidth?

[canajin56]

Hehe, given the effects that observers can have on quantum interactions, it just might be the case that the number of people who believe in string theory will determine whether or not it is valid ;)

Re:Demanding bandwidth?

[FrYGuY101]

In some society's if you need something fix, you go to the fixer person, and he fixes it. And if the fixer person is hungry, he comes to you and you give him some food. Sure it's mostly african tribes, but who says capitalism is "right"? It's what we have, but I'm not sure it's a universal law on earth and from god that charging for services is "right".

I've found that the inherent problem in communism lie in scale. A village can subsist as a commune, as African tribes, an indeed some places in America even. A country, however can not. As a commune grows past the ability for everybody to recognize every other person, the free rider problem [wikipedia.org] grows geometrically. More people assume they can get away with doing less and taking more without their neighbors retalliating, resulting in a tragedy of the commons [wikipedia.org] type scenario. The fact that people will always seek to maximise their personal utility is, in fact, a cornerstone of economics.

So. Back to the topic. Why is capitalism a "universal law"? Because it's the only real way a large-scale society can function efficiently, by putting the burden not on the society as a communism does, but the individuals. It has nothing to do with the bible, but rather it's a pretty damn efficient way of making sure society does whats best for society most of the time, and for the most part it works.

If you want to get into socialism, or Laisse-Fair, that's a different subject, but the point stands.

The real problem with real communism

[wowbagger]

OK, first of all, let up NOT confuse true Marxist communism with any of what is going on in the world today - China et. al. are as faithful to real Marxism as StarShip Troopers the movie was to the book.

The fundamental limiting factor to Marxism is the idea the "the workers own the means of production", which fails miserably in an Industrial Age society, and implodes in an Information Age society.

Consider a chip fab plant - they cost BILLIONS of dollars to build. Now, how many people work at a chip fab? Even if 10,000 people worked at a fab, that would mean that each worker's portion of the plan would come to about 100,000 dollars. Compare that to a furnature factory - which set of workers has to be worth more?

And that is the key problem - some workers need to be worth more than other workers - anathema to the Marxist. And since things like chip plants, auto (or tractor) factories and suchlike cannot be funded by the workers, *something* must come in to fund them. So you either have a) rich people (again, anathema to Marxists) or b) "The State" come in to create the plants. But if "The State" owns the plant, the workers don't own it, and "The State" is not going to give it up.

That was what prevented the Communist nations from being able to scale - Marxism didn't work, they went to "The State", and inefficency prevented them from getting anywhere.

(-- boy I wish /. would let me put an HR here)
That said, I agree with the parent - and this bunch of wastes of flesh are posterchildren for the free rider problem. And even if we assume the cost of copying software is 0, even if we assume that all electronic content should be Free (in the RMS sense), there is still the little problem that you simply cannot say "router = new Cisco; fiber = new Fiber;" - these are physical things that somebody had to expend resouces to create.

Re:The real problem with real communism

[geekee]

"And that is the key problem - some workers need to be worth more than other workers - anathema to the Marxist. And since things like chip plants, auto (or tractor) factories and suchlike cannot be funded by the workers, *something* must come in to fund them. So you either have a) rich people (again, anathema to Marxists) or b) "The State" come in to create the plants. But if "The State" owns the plant, the workers don't own it, and "The State" is not going to give it up.

That was what prevented the Communi

Re:Demanding bandwidth?

[arvindn]

These guys must be prescient, they saw the slashdotting coming and demanded bandwidth in advance!

Re:Demanding bandwidth?

[anti-trojan]

Especially after posting 769 KB (1600x1200) JPGs on their web site.

Re:Demanding bandwidth?

[itsme1234]

I got the text but it's encrypted :-) See for yourself:

Piratbyrån demonstrerade i tre städer
Inlagd: 2004-05-02 00:49
I tre städer demonstrerade idag anhängare till Piratbyrån under paroller som "Välfärdssamhället börjar vid 100 Mbit" och "Avskaffa upphovsrätten". I Stockholm demonstrerade närmare 200 personer, i Umeå ett hundratal och i Malmö ett tappert halvdussin.
Deltagarna skanderade nypåkomna slagord som "Use the force - Open Source" och "Vi vill ha sex, vi vill ha sex, vi vill ha 600 Mbit", och bar på hemgjorda banderoller med pirat- eller fildelningstema. I Stockholm genomfördes också historiens första Copyswap, där de som hade med sig egenbrända skivor med film eller musik delade med sig till sina nyfunna vänner. I Umeå delades det ut pris till demonstrationens bäst utklädde pirat, en alldeles äkta hårddisk.

Både i Stockholm och Umeå fokuserade talen på den nyligen avslutade kampanjen "Stoppa Fluktarna", som syftar till att sätta press på internetleverantörerna att inte acceptera branschorganisationernas maffiametoder när de bland annat spionerar på internetanvändare för att sedemera kunna anmäla dem till deras leverantörer.

I Umeå tågade demonstrationen förbi tre stora internetleverantörer som har kontor i staden, och i Stockholm var slutdestinationen Datainspektionen där 23.000 namnunderskrifter lämnades in - brända på CD-Rom. Datainspektionen ansåg sig inte ha tid för Piratbyrån, så listan lämnades i deras postfack.

Piratbyrån vill tacka alla som anslöt sig till demonstrationerna idag. Vi visade att vi faktiskt finns på riktigt, och att vi är en kraft att räkna med. Tills nästa arrangemang - fortsätt piratkopiera!

Re:Demanding bandwidth?

[Mr_Perl]

Vi vill ha sex, vi vill ha sex

Yea... right.

Re:Demanding bandwidth?

[mattjb0010]

Vi vill ha sex, vi vill ha sex

Yea... right

Observe how information about what is being said leads to quick breaking of cryptosystems.

Re:Demanding bandwidth?

[ayjay29]

>>"Vi vill ha sex, vi vill ha sex, vi vill ha 600 Mbit"

More like: "Vi vill ha porn, vi vill ha porn, vi vill ha 600 Mbit"

Re:Demanding bandwidth?

[iolaire_in_swe]

Actually, sex is six in swedish, so it's more of a play on words than a geek call to mate :P

Re:Demanding bandwidth?

[Anonymous Coward]

Manually babelfishing (I'm I mere Norwegian, so bear with me, Swedish brothers ;-)

"Piratbyrån (the pirate bureau) demonstrated on three locations
Submitted: 2004, May the 2nd, 00:49

In three cities supporters of the Pirate Bureau demonstrated under slogans like "The welfare society starts at 100 Mbit" and "abolish copyright". In Stockholm almost 200 persons demonstrated, in Umeå about a hundred and in Malmö a bold handful. The participants chanted newmade slogans like "Use the force - Open Source" and "We want six, we want six, we want 600 Mbit" (pun lost in translation), and carried homemade banners with piracy and file sharing themes. In Stockholm the first Copyswap ever was pulled off, where people exchanged their privately burned discs with film or music with their new friends. In Umeå a price was awarded to the best dressed pirate; a real harddrive.

Both in Stockholm and Umeå there was particular focus on the newly finished campaign "Stoppa Fluktarna" (stop what? Will some Swedes help me out?), aiming to put pressure on the ISPs, so that they will not accept the media industry's mafia methods; spying on Internet users and subsequently reporting them to their ISPs.

In Umeå the demonstration marched by three large ISPs having offices in Umeå, and in Stockholm the final destination was Datainspektionen where 23000 signatures was passed over - burned on CDROM. Datainspektionen couldn't be bothered, so the list was put in their mailbox.

The Pirate Bureau wishes to thank everybody that participated in the demonstrations today. We showed that we exist for real, and that we have a force to be reckoned with. Until the next happening - keep on pirating!

Re:Demanding bandwidth?

[Anonymous Coward]

"Stoppa fluktarna" means "stop the peekers", it is a slang word generally reffering to peeking at wonem. It is a silly word, but the pirate bureau uses it to reffer to ISPs tracking your activities on the internet.

Re:Demanding bandwidth?

[Guppy06]

A moose once bit my sister...

Re:Demanding bandwidth?

[remahl]

We, through taxes. The government has already spent billions (SEK) on building up a good fibre network covering most of the country. However, they left it to the private sector to provide connections to individual households. This has resulted in a situation where most small towns have extremely good backbone connections, that can only be used by a few % of the population in those towns.

Public institutions, the government, 'län' and 'kommuns' should make sure that everyone has access to good communications (Internet or otherwise). Most people are more than willing to pay for that through their taxes.

Broadband connections may not be a human right, but having great communications definitely gives the economy an advantage and helps to boost research and development.

Re:Demanding bandwidth?

[Echnin]

Yeah. Internet access should be considered on the same plane as telephone access. All we ask...

You don't seem to understand

[Sycraft-fu]

This is Sweden here we are talking about, not the United States. Now I know you may find it hard to believe, but there are other kinds of free governments than the one we enjoy here. We are a fairly private sector, pay-for-it-yourself kind of country. That's fine, but Sweden is NOT. They are far more socialist than the US. This means that they pay a LOT more taxes. Like around 65% income tax in the top brackets, not to mention other taxes.

Well, the flipside of the higher taxes is they expect more services. A free government is supposed to be one that serves its people. The reason that they take money from the people is to give them services that they all need and want such as transportation, public safety, health care and so on.

So, if people pay taxes to the government with the understanding they will be used to build broadband infastructure, it is not unreasonable to demand that they actually recieve the broadband as a result.

Just because we here in the US think that broadband ought to be in the hands of private (well, sort of private) corperations does not mean that the rest of the free world shares those views. What's more, if the US government levied a tax to provide unviersal boradband availability, as they levy a tax to provide universal phone availability, I would expect to recieve broadband as a result, as I expect to recieve phone service.

Re:You don't seem to understand

[d_strand]

I agree that with higher tax pressure you expect more service from the government (and that 65% figure, while true, is a bit extreme and only applies to the very highest income brackets.. most people pay 30-35% income tax in sweden).

BUT.

We do not have a specific "broadband tax" in sweden, which means that the first things you should make sure is properly funded by the government should be important things like schools and healthcare (which arent properly funded). Not silly things like fiberlinks to every house. And thankyou for clearing up who the hell these people where when I saw them yesterday. I couldnt hear what the hell the nerd was mumbling into his microphone (I live in the town on the picture that is "just great"... yay Umeå!).

You totally missed the point.

[mc6809e]

First, you are not free if you're forced to pay for someone else's high-speed porn link. Freedom is being able to say "no thanks". If the response is "tough luck" then you are not free.

Don't confuse democracy with freedom. They aren't the same unless you mean the majority is free to do whatever it wants to the minority.

Second, if there was enough money available by those that would use such a system, then a private company would step in to provide the service. If there is no such company, then obviously t

You don't understand freedom

[Sycraft-fu]

At least as it applies to nations. Freedom, or at least a free society does NOT mean the ability to do whatever you want. That is called Anarchy, and has never worked for a society. A free society is one where the people control the government in an indrect way. That doesn't mean that they are free to do whatever, just that they are free to change the way their government works.

This isn't up for debate, this is what a free country means. You may feel that isn't enough freedom, but that doesn't change how the word is used. In your point of view, there would be NO free countries since they all tell you what you can and can't do, and levy some taxes. Under what seems to be your view, the only real freedom is Anarchy (the absence of government).

Re:You don't understand freedom

[Tonytheloony]

It means people who weren't born with a golden spoon in their mouth are able to afford things such as healthcare or, in this case, information. People like you probably consider the law of gravity a form of servitude. Wake up.

Re:You don't understand freedom

[Jim Starx]

You could say the same thing about everything else taxes are used for. How many people out their would opt out of paying their social security if they could? How many pay taxes that help upkeep the roads when they don't actually own a car? How many people have never needed a cop or been to court yet still pay for them via taxes?? The point here is that these things are for the common good. Even if you don't directly use these things, they still benifit your life. A free internet connection would obviosly be for the common good, the argument is whether that good justifies the cost of putting the system in place.

Re:You don't understand freedom

[Jim Starx]

Of course there's a common good. Values are subjective, so everyone doesn't always agree on what it is, but it's still their. People don't agree on capitol punishment or abortion because their values and their definitions of what those things entail differ. But everyone can agree that murder is wrong. Outlawing murder is for the common good.

Re:Infrastructure.

[mc6809e]

What do governments do? They provide infrastructure. That's one of the reasons they collect taxes. The swedish government collects more taxes, so people expext to get more and better infrastructure. I don't know about you, but I would consider backbones infrastructure... It's something done not for direct profit, but for the convenience of the people.

There are all sorts of conveniences you could apply this same logic to. Why not have a ministry of washing machines, for example? Wouldn't it be a convenienc

Re:You don't seem to understand

[Anonymous Coward]

I've been hearing this kind of bullshit for the past 30 years, yet in the meantime Europe keeps getting richer and poverty keeps steadily increasing in the US.

Europe has lower crime, longer lifespans, lower infant mortality, you name it they've got it. Go back to reading "USA Today" and keep dreaming that you live in utopia.

Re:Demanding bandwidth?

[Flak]

In Estonia internet (knowledge) access is by law a human right.

Stupid question

[Anonymous Coward]

Maybe someone can explain this to me, cause I just have no clue....

How much does bandwidth itself cost? I mean, once you lay the line, aren't your costs pretty much fixed, regardless of how much bandwidth you use?

On a pipe, you pay for:
Router, or other form of access --> one time cost
The line itself --> one time cost
Person/people to maintain it --> ongoing fixed cost
Internal switches --> one time cost
Servers --> one time cost, till they go down. Going down is going to happen regardless of

Re:Stupid question

[nacturation]

I'm just pulling this out of my ass, but anyway... should be reasonably accurate.

The cost of everything you mentioned is amortized. Optic cable costs $X/meter to lay, especially if roads need to be dug up, or if it needs to be laid across the Atlantic or Pacific Ocean for example. Charging the first guy the billions of dollars it really cost so that everyone else can have it for the cost of ongoing maintenance isn't going to work very well. :) So the install cost, maintenance costs, repair costs, upgrad

Re:Demanding bandwidth?

[jeff munkyfaces]

this is Sweden we're talking about, not the US - they already have clean water and free speech..

Re:Demanding bandwidth?

[KingRamsis]

ouch !!! right on target.

Re:Demanding bandwidth?

[Sunnan]

While I don't think it's a basic human right in the same way as clean air and water can be considered, I don't think it makes sense for basic infrastructure to be ran in a for-profit manner.

I'd love to see an organization that works similar to, say, Debian, take care of the infrastructures.

Re:Demanding bandwidth?

[tx_kanuck]

Telephones are the way to communicate right now, but you don't see society paying for it. Yes, there are subsidies in place to the companies, but that doesn't mean everyone has one.

Why should the net be any different? If you can't afford it, go to a cafe, or the library, or a friends house.

Warez the Future

[miracle69]

Is that sort of like offshoring?

Value?

[arashiakari]

If everyone was a pirate, what would they steal?

Silly Pirates Play With Reality

[RavidgeMole]

They would probabley just steal from eachother. I could see an entire pirate economy coming out of it: black market becoming the predominant [stock]market, thereby calling out the need for a fusia or peach pink market. *sigh* Silly pirates, don't they realize what they're doing?

Re:Value?

[krumms]

music, movies and Windows XP.

and...

[RavidgeMole]

and Paris Hilton video.

Re:Value?

[Ceriel Nosforit]

Open Source software.

Funny...

[Anonymous Coward]

Obviously http://www.piratbyran.org/ needs more bandwidth...

Re:Funny...

[syukton]

Indeed. I got to the picture labeled as "great" by the submitter before the server melted, though.

The original was 1600x1200 weighing in at 769kb. I reduced it to 800x600 and 128kb.

Click here [forest.net] to view it.

Re:Funny...

[Halfbaked Plan]

Why is there an audiocassette forming the skull on that banner? Do we need to airlift in big boxes of 5-1/4" floppy drives and diskettes in kind of a Geek Rescue campaign?

No ship? No beard?

[Anonymous Coward]

These shipless, beardless landlubbing wenches call themselves pirates!?

The rise in the landlubber:pirate ratio is very bad, Arr.

Demonstration

[ramk13]

Am I the only one who thinks that "Swedish Pirate Demonstration" would have been a better article title?

My imagination cooked up some confusing stuff in the short times before my eyes made their way down to the description. A game where you are a Swedish pirate raiding Danish ships? A new P2P program written by a Swede? Maybe something involving a Swedish demolition guy?

Anyway, that's pretty neat that there were organized demonstrations. Hopefully it'll get some press (outside of the /. type community).

Re:Demonstration

[Hannes Eriksson]

Apparently, the local newspapers in Umeå thought that horse racing and Nancy turns 90 were more interresting than a hundred people demanding free bandwidth...

Let me guess...

[Anonymous Coward]

...nobody at this demo is over the age of 16.

I still fail to see why people want the abolition of IP laws. If you don't want to pay for the music/game/movie, then don't copy it either. The reason for the charge is to pay peoples wages, buy equipment, etc.

Otherwise they wouldn't be able to make whatever it was.

Re:Let me guess...

[Anonymous Coward]

Software could be a lot cheaper if there were more cooperation and building on top of eachother's work, which is discouraged by current IP laws (especially software patents). The software development process is becoming more and more like walking through a minefield. Practically endless copyright and software/algorithm/math patents have to go. IP laws are a cludge with the sole purpose of prolonging the business models around not easily reproduced material things into the realm of information which has no s

Re:Let me guess...

[phaze3000]

Yes, because no-one is going to make [kernel.org] things [gnu.org] if [gnome.org] other [openoffice.org] people [kde.org] can [debian.org] just [redhat.com] take [sourceforge.org] a [apache.org] copy [isc.org] without [isc.org] paying [freebsd.org].

Re:Let me guess...

[nacturation]

Thank you for making the point. And just what laws would those organizations invoke should I create a project called "Apache's GNU OpenOffice GNOME: Debian SourceForge edition"? I don't think they'd be so willing to give up their Intellectual Property when it doesn't suit them.

Re:Let me guess...

[Aderym]

I saw nobody below the age of 16. Anyway, I was at the demonstration and I don't think we should remove any copyright laws. I think we should reform them. Copyright as we know it is more designed to make companys like the recording companys and microsoft richer. It is a result of several decades lobbying by already wealthy persons and companys. It is definatly past time to look over them again. But if we look past that, The real reason I was there was because the fact that private organizations founded by different companys shouldn't be allowed to do the law enforcement which is what the situation more and more looks like today.

Oh boy,here we go again...

[nukey56]

Arrr mateys! Three swigs ah rum to anyone who can find out who slashdotted our ship! Yarr!!

Re:Oh boy,here we go again...

[paul248]

Three swigs ah rum to anyone who can find out who slashdotted our ship! Yarr!!
I think it was slashdot.

Re:Oh boy,here we go again...

[nukey56]

I think I'm going to be sick.. my sea-legs aren't sprouting right. Oh, wow, I'm not really a pirate!

*pukesoverthesideoftheboatandmanagestoscareawayt he lastgirlawakeatthishour*

Sigh... yes... piratbyrån

[NickeB]

It's unfortunate that piratbyrån get's this kind of publicity, but I'll try to fill you in.

Piratbyrån (roughly translated to "The bureau of piracy") was formed as a childish response to the lawyerfilled "Antipiratbyrån" (I think you can take a guess at the translation).

The "members" are mostly 14 year old kids, who just discovered that "heeey! i can use kazaa to download pr0n! wow!", and shortly after discovered "what do you mean it's illegal? I'll pirate anyway, motherbitches!" and is as of thus filled with these crying fools. Noone with half a brain takes them seriously, and I hope none of you do either.

I'm not, repeat not, som kind of guardian of antipiratbyrån, but piratbyrån uses just the kind of methods that makes antipiratbyrån look like the good guys. Unfortunate indeed.

Re:Sigh... yes... piratbyrån

[Arioch of Chaos]

It's unfortunate that piratbyrån get's this kind of publicity, but I'll try to fill you in.

Sorry . . . But I did submit it under "It's Funny, Laugh" ;-) Basically, I agree with you but I do think it's good that someone starts making some noise. I am not against IP but I do think that we need a discussion about it in society. Nowadays, all you hear (except on /. and a few other sites) is the people crying "theft".

too bad it's not iceland

[blair1q]

Too bad it's not Iceland. Then we could say "Slashdottir".

Re:too bad it's not iceland

[Sven-Erik]

That would mean the daughter of Slash.

Why I don't take this organization seriously...

[Jugalator]

They think piracy is a right. They at the very least wish to get rid of copyrights so they can perform software piracy without a fear of getting caught. They encourage people to swap copyrighted works burnt on CD's on the demonstration, etc. "Piratbyrån" also means "The Piracy Bureau" in english. Miles from what the EFF [eff.org] stand for, for example.

I think there's a line between fighting for freedom (software patents and so on), and fighting for piracy, and these guys crossed it.

It's a legit stance

[Sycraft-fu]

And one that some OSS people take rather seriously. It can be summarized as such:

Information is not a physical good, and shouldn't be treated as such. It costs virtually nothing to make a copy and spread information, and all of that cost is incured by the copier. Thus there should be no ownership of information, it should be free to all to promote progress and free thinking.

Now, I'm not saying there aren't problems with this point of view, but there certianly seem to be problems with the current views on intellectual property. This is a legit stance and one that can certianly be taken seriously. I don't think it's the right answer, but that doesn't mean I'm going to dismiss it as not serious.

The more laws there are, the more crime there is

[Sunnan]

Do you choose your morals after the law instead of the other way around?

Re:Why I don't take this organization seriously...

[Reality Master 101]

18th Century: Sailed to the New World to escape religious persecution.

1865: People put down their lives to end slavery.

1945: Millions die to stop Hitler and preserve freedom.

1970: Massive protests for civil rights.

2004: Protest for the right to steal other's work.

Nah, this generation isn't spoiled. What makes you think so?

Yarrr

[l0ungeb0y]

Yarrr ... Share me some MP3's on yon fat pipe matey .... Yarrr

And not a peg leg amongst the lot of 'em. These swabbies aren't much for piratin, but I ain't never met me a pirate worth his salt hailing from Sweden.

Back when I was earnin me sea-legs we'd be out a rapin' and a pillagin' and a downloading our warez over 28baud ... and ain't no p2p in those days either.

Yarrr, more rapin and a pillagin and a downloadin' and less parades say me.

Vikings

[Ceriel Nosforit]

They called themselves Vikings, predated, and were a lot better at it than pirates.

Aaah, it's good the young ones keep up the traditions. 1st of May is even today the day to drink copious amounts of mead.

why May 1 as the 'traditional' day of protest?

[fantomas]

... because in 1889, The Second International organized in Paris and set May 1 as a day of international labor solidarity, to support US trade unionists. European socialists like Engels decided it was important to publicise the plight of poor working conditions in the USA.

Riiiight.

[flynns]

C'mon, how much meaner can we GET?? We post a site that's (1) about pirates, which are inherently cool, (2) got a picture of a real-life AYBABTU sign (both of these make it a primary Slashdotting candidate) (3) is ALREADY involved in protesting because they need more bandwidth-- and we post this on our front page.

It's like inviting the WHOLE frikkin' horde of Viking^H^H^H^H^H^HSlashdot barbarians to bang on their gates. In the words of a certain GalaxyQuest character: "Those poor people..."

</humor>

AYBABTU

[God! Awful 2]

Okay, am I the only one who thinks that AYBABTU is getting a little old (or who can't figure out what made it so damned funny in the first place).

At any rate, shouldn't they be using something a little more piratey, such as "all your doubloon are belong to us?"

-a

This is a joke

[PimpbotChris]

In so many countries there are people who cant access certain content (especially political) even if they are willing to pay for it and yet these idiots think that they have some god given right to streaming porn and warez, come on!

Some facts about the Swedes

[Nightreaver]

Well I'm a Dane (and therefore I'm obligated to hate the Swedes :)) and I'd say that in Sweeden the are much better off than us Danes. Bandwidth in Denmark costs about 400DKK ~ $60 a month for a 2048/256 ADSL line, where in Sweden the get 10/10 Mbit line capacity for 1/4 of the Danish 2 Mbit ADSL. 100 Mbit bandwidth is also quite common over there for end-users

BTW, if anybody has tried Direct Connect P2P program they'll quickly find out that the 7151.97 TB [neo-modus.com] online are almost hosted alone by Swedes...

Comment removed

[account_deleted]

Comment removed based on user account deletion

Re:Swedish Pirates

[hanssprudel]

The Vikings were not pirates, they were traders. They just had their own methods of breaking down trade barriers and confronting protectionism.

In a sense, the Vikings were the original free trade lobbyists.

Mirryarrr

[jackalski]

http://tinyurl.com/2sqaj

fetched, (yaaa)rarred, served. enjoy :>

I'm looking at those pictures

[Walkiry]

And I'm thinking they better finish the demonstration before 9 pm and wash their hands afterwards or they'll get into trouble...

More bandwidth??

[cibus]

My impression is that everyone living in one of the major cities in Sweden can have 10Mbit for just a few SEK montly...
It's not coincidence that 50%+ of all DC servers are(atleast was) located in Sweden...

...yeah I'm just another jealous norwegian :-P

Only in sweden (and maybe a couple others)

[Datasage]

Can you actually attempt to demand abolishment of IP rights. Im not sure wether to be horrified or to commend them. Well how about I commned them for there attempt but would be horrified if they succeed.

If you try this in the US, you would have RI/MP AA hitman after you. Im sorry i mean FBI agents working under a hidden clasue of the DMCA that prevents any attempt to undermine copyright.

Satire aside, if they do succeed, they will probably manage to create an IP anarchy. Content providers outside of Sweden would do what they could to prevent content from going into sweden. THose content providers in sweden that dont support this anarchist dream, would probably leave. So what you get in the end, is a place where content is free to all, but there is no content being created. Well except for a few anarchists.

That said, i dont support a place with no ip laws. But i also dont support the path the US has been taking recetnly. IP holders posses alot more power than IP consumers. We need to find a point of balance. IP holders need to allow market forces to shape the the market. Not make thier consumers criminals.

We really need to do a 180 as far as ip law is concerned. Copyright law needs to be reaxamed and balanced in favor of both interests. I suppose this is not going to happen when most people dont know the diffrence. We can vote with our dollars, but most of the dollars are still going the wrong way out of ignorance.

Done ranting... or whatever...

Better AYBABTU picture

[kasperd]

Congratulations to whoever made the AYBABTU sign.

Anyone else noticed, that at first the article linked to a picture which wasn't very good. But a short while after the article came on slashdot they swapped around two of the pictures on the server, such that now the link point to a better picture of their sign. DSCF0023.JPG [piratbyran.org] DSCF0033.JPG [piratbyran.org]

Media attention

[TorKlingberg]

It got quite a lot of attention in Swedish media, both before and after the event. Here are some links (all in Swedish):

Dagens Nyheter, morning paper [www.dn.se]

Svenska Dagbladet, morning paper [www.svd.se]

Aftonbladet, tabloid [aftonbladet.se]

Computter Sweden [www.idg.se] (paying subscribers only)

Yelah [yelah.net]

Gnuheter, /. clone [gnuheter.org]

A little explanation of their views

[Anonymous Coward]

A lot of posters here say "How can they demand the abolishment of IP laws? They must exist!"

Well. Piratbyrån (the bureau of piracy organization) has the opinion that the current IP-Laws does not help and/or protect content creators / artists, they protect the publishers, record companies and stifle innovation. Many artists only want to spread their music and play concerts (where many small artists make most of their money anyway).

An example of todays bad IP-laws; After the artists death the copyright is still valid up to 70(?) years after. That is not protecting the rights of the artist, that is protecting the rights of the owner of the copyrights. - and those are separate issues.

Piratbyrån is of the opinion that the laws of today is formed by and for the major owners of copyrights - such as publishers and record companies, and therefor they want to abolish these laws.

Please note that I am not a member of piratbyrån, if there are someone from piratbyrån here; please explain it a little further.

Cassette Tape and Cross Bones?

[nutznboltz]

Their banner seems so out-of-date. I guess it must be paying homage to the first inexpensive, mass-marketed electronic/electro-mechanical device that moved information duplication capabilities into the hands of the un-incorporated populous.

Phun

[MC68040]

Actually, everyone that doesn't speak Swedish should know that "Piratbyrån" is a phun of "Antipiratbyrån" and I guess everyone knows the word anti.
(piratbyrån = piracy agency)

The absolutely scariest part of this article...

[Kjella]

...is that I recognized what AYBABTU was an acronym for, before I saw it. I got to read less Slashdot...

Kjella

Piracy is Civil Disobedience

[Catamaran]

We view piracy as a form of civil disobedience.

The fat corporations represented by the MPAA and RIAA have been fleecing the public for years. They are the real criminals.

Now, as the people are becoming empowered by technology, those same corporations are fighting a propaganda war in a desperate attempt to derail a future in which they have no place. Let us celebrate their imminent demise!

Check out Downhill Battle [downhillbattle.org]. They have the same sort of skull and crossbones logo.

Re:The letter “Å”

[Hannes Eriksson]

Yes the letter Å is in general pronounced like a in all, but since it was introduced by some stupid king or whatever from the southern half of Sweden to the end of names like Ume, Skellefte, Pite and Lule, nobody actually living in those cities pronounces the final addendum. This is offtopic, hooray! But on the other hand - Ume (with that silly, non-needed and by natives non-pronounced letter) is mentioned in the article, and umu.se is the University of Umeå :-)

Re:The letter “Å”

[gantrep]

Then why is the scientific measurement abbreviated with that letter pronounced "Angstrom" like the A in "hang?"

Re:The letter

[lastninja]

Well if you want to impress a Swede, pronounce it as Ångstöm. Here is a link [angstrom.uu.se] with some info on the Ångstöms.

Re:The letter “Å”

[IWannaBeAnAC]

Hmm, "Å" is equivalent to "aa", and in the place name Faarbog at least (where I have visited several times) the pronounciation is an 'o' sound, like in "ogg".

Re:The letter “Å”

[orbitalia]

It depends if it is a long or a short "Å" sound. In Swedish the letter "Å" itself is actually pronounced with a long vowel sound in American English, like the "aw" in awesome (or "ou"ght in British English). The short sound (when used in words is pronounced like 'o' in "ogg").

Anyway, as a Brit living in Sweden I think Swedes demonstrating over a lack of bandwidth is a bit like Saudis protesting over a lack of sand. Get outta it! Most people in the cities have access to 10/100Mbit connections and

Re:abolition of laws

[mc6809e]

Sorry, but here, "you made it, I want it" will always trump the principle that people ought to be compensated for their creative works.

Re:abolition of laws

[Kiryat Malachi]

Intellectual property laws existence is a violation of natural economic law itself. This law declares that when supply is infinitely greater than demand, and marginal cost per item is near-zero, the cost per item should be driven to near-zero as well.

Sound familiar?

There is a serious issue with IP law in the digital age; it's designed to prevent and deal with a whole different class of issues, ones that barely seem relevant when I can copy the entire Library of Congress's contents in a day or two. IP law is an attempt to impose an artificial scarcity on a commodity that not only doesn't need to be scarce, but by its very nature is easier to assume common.

Do you want *proof* that IP laws are quite probably unnecessary?

Look at Linux. Who would ever write a huge undertaking like an operating system only to give it away for free; to more or less mandate that it must be given away for no more than the cost of distribution? Apparently, lots of people. I know, from several years of working in the radio and music industries, more than a few musicians who could give a shit about their music being copied; as long as people are listening to it, they're happy.

As bandwidth becomes larger and cheaper, storage becomes larger and cheaper, etc, etc, we have to find a *better* way to encourage creation *and* consumption. Eventually, we'll have to do it for real objects, if we ever figure out how to do assemblers. But we need to acknowledge that our IP laws are broken in the modern era, and rather than trying to nudge and tweak and suspender up their sagging morass, we need to figure out a sensible approach.

Who cares about what worked for printing presses? Let's figure out what works for GB/s pipes and TB of disk.

Re:abolition of laws

[mabinogi]

Linux is a bad example...the GPL exists and works BECAUSE of IP Law, the license gets it's strength from the fact that the only leagal way to copy or derive from a GPL'd work is by accepting the license.

If it were not for copyright law, you could just ignore the license and take the code anyway.

Now for the musician point of view, whilst those musician friends of yours might be happy having people listen to their music, whether they payed for it or not, how would they feel if the next mass produced plastic pop star made some record company millions by singing one of their songs without permission, accreditation or compensation?

IP and copyright are about more than some 15 year old kid downloading songs with Kazaa.

I can accept that there are problems with some aspects of current law (duration being the bigest one), but the original intent of the laws are sound. If an artist or coder wants to give away their work they can. Those that don't want to, shouldn't have to.

Re:abolition of laws

[Sunnan]

The GPL doesn't depend on any law that prohibits duplication. The only thing that GPL does compared to no IP laws at all is that it helps keep the source code available. Even then, without the IP laws, reverse-engineering and decompiling would be legal. That's not allowed now with non-free versions of say BSD, X11 and Apache, but those free projects still seem to be pretty popular. (They sort of emulate how a world without IP laws would work.)

Also - think outside the box - what about a law that's allows co

Re:abolition of laws

[velo_mike]

The abolition of intellectual property laws would be a violation of legal rights in itself. IP laws exist for a reason - to ensure that people are protected when it comes to their intangible property.

IMHO (also, IANAL), that's not necessarily true. In the absence of IP laws, everything could be distributed (whether sold, rented, or viewed) under contracts. Want to buy that latest Robbie Williams CD or Tom Clancy's latest read? Sure, just sign this here contract that you won't copy or redistribute it.

Re:woohoo!

[IWannaBeAnAC]

May 1st is May 1st. Its over by May 2nd.

Re:Abolition of IP laws would be disasterous

[oldstrat]

Your Anonymous statements require proof.
"your invention is unprotected and copied and you make no money, the consequence is simple: no one invents any more."

I doubt that, needs would still exist and there would still be money to be made by filling those needs.

What would change is that 'invention' would become a different proposition going from get rich quick, and retire, to invent more often to produce an income.

Current IP law is becoming too cumbersome with innovation being killed by trivial paten