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Amazon To Comply With Kansas Sales Tax Law 73

Posted by timothy from the lion's-share dept.
theodp writes "Online retailer Amazon.com will begin collecting sales tax on Kansans' Internet purchases in April, company officials told legislators Tuesday. Kansas' new destination-based sales tax law took effect last July."
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Amazon To Comply With Kansas Sales Tax Law More

Amazon To Comply With Kansas Sales Tax Law

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  • That's too bad. (Score:2, Interesting)

    by sushi_steve ( 713062 )
    I hope Texas doesn't pick up on this an require sales tax on us. You can't beat no tax and free shipping on Amazon. They're prices are always decent.
    I also found it interesting that this article was written by my local newspaper. It's fun to see Fort Worth out in the world!

  • Taxes on Internet purchases (Score:5, Interesting)

    by craXORjack ( 726120 ) on Tuesday February 03, 2004 @11:18PM (#8177129)
    Who wants to pay tax and shipping when you can go to a local store and just pay tax? Plus you get the item right away. On-line retailers will have to cut into their margins even further to compete.
    • It is especially strange that Amazon has had no desire to fight laws like this. They certainly have not objected in the last couple of years when states have been trying to collect internet sales taxes. What will be their competitive advantage against Barnes and Noble now?
    • I live in Oregon, one of the few states without sales tax. So it is already pretty much that way for me. On Amazon I might purchase the hard to find items, but if you can find it local it is usually better. It's not only the extra shipping that you have to pay, it is also having to wait a few days to get your item. Plus their prices aren't all that great, they just have a huge selection.

      • Re:Taxes on Internet purchases (Score:2, Interesting)

        by Anonymous Coward
        The prices on amazon are usually comparable with local places in Portland (Oregon). If an item isn't at a reasonable price on Amazon, you can typically find another online retailer who *does* have a good price.

        I don't shop in the real world. I would rather order my item online - use the FREE SHIPPING that most places (such as Amazon) offer for items after a certain total (at Amazon, I think it's $50 worth of purchases) and then wait the three to five days for ground shipping. That is MUCH preferable to get
      • Besides, you have Powell's, the best bookstore in the world (which also has a website...)

        • Re:Taxes on Internet purchases (Score:1, Interesting)

          by Anonymous Coward
          Except I've found that Powell's City of Books has horrendous shipping charges - not to mention, I frequently find NEW books that I want selling at or below the price that Powell's is selling their *used* copies for. I'd rather get 3 books at my door for $50 from amazon than 1 book, plus shipping from Powell's.

          That being said, Powell's is still a joy to shop at *physically*. It's one of the rare exceptions where the in-person experience beats the fuck out of the online one.

          • I frequently find NEW books that I want selling at or below the price that Powell's is selling their *used* copies for.

            Their prices are not always the best on common books. For rare/out-of-print ones, they're pretty good. (I've always found better deals on out-of-print martial arts and Asian bodywork there than at any other on-line bookseller.) And Powells is not, to my knowledge, evil like Amazon. [gnu.org]

        • Agreed.

          I stopped by yesterday just to browse (I was in the area) and I left with four books before I knew it. Powells is freaking awesome. Plus, for a self proclaimed nerd like me, Powells technical is like mecca. They have everything.
          • Ahhh, Powell's Techical! It is indeed the holy grail of geek bookstores. Any bizarre leftover computer or telephony related subject I can think of, and they probably have at least 3 or 4 books on it. It's so cool. They even have a cool, ancient cat which roams the bookstore! I make a pilgrimage from Bremerton about twice a year to go there.

    • Who wants to drive all the way downtown to some stupid store, hope they have the book you want, then turn around and drive all the way home?

      Not me, thank you. I'll spend 2 minutes on my computer and have it show up the next day.

    • Someone's probably already said this, but the problem is I can't find most of what I'm looking for locally. Trust me, finding jazz guitar instructional books in eastern NC is just about impossible much less old Chet Atkins CDs.

  • Well its only fair... (Score:3, Interesting)

    by shaka999 ( 335100 ) on Wednesday February 04, 2004 @12:04AM (#8177379)
    I don't like to pay taxes anymore than the next guy but I've always felt a little bad for the brick and motar stores. Not taxing online stores gave them an unfair advantage.

    An online store should have to have efficient enough in their operations to run on lower mark-up so that their price + shipping + tax is less than an old brick and motar (price + tax).

    In an ideal world the tax rate would go down when more items are taxed (i.e. a revenue neutral change). Of course we all know the increase in tax actually goes to fund someone pissing in a cup and calling it art or maybe a few more jets to fight a cold war that has been over for years...
    • Considering the fact that you cannot physically see a product online before you buy it nor can you take it home with you right away, I would say online stores don't have that much of an unfair advantage just because they can cut the price a little bit without sales tax. Especially since shipping charges more than make up for the tax in most cases. Unless I find a really good deal online, I buy from a physical store. Combine this with the people who are too scared or too computer illiterate to shop online, I

      • Re:Well its only fair... (Score:4, Insightful)

        by Txiasaeia ( 581598 ) on Wednesday February 04, 2004 @12:27AM (#8177502)
        There's no way brick and mortar stores beat online. Going to your local book store is great if you want John Grisham's latest book, but when was the last time you saw Ash: A Secret History by Mary Gentle or The Prestige by Christopher Priest in a local bookstore? Or how about even Call of Cthulhu and other Weird Stories by Lovecraft? These are not obscure titles in any way, yet it's impossible to find any of them in a physical store.

        Amazon.com has free shipping on books over $25; Chapters.ca and amazon.ca have free shipping over $39 CAD. If you wait until you have two or three books you want to buy, you can get free shipping, plus amazon.ca (at least) has online coupons, usually $5 off on an order. Sure, it takes about a week to get here, but it saves a ton of cash.

        Every year I spend between $500-1000 on books, and all of that money (save one or two books locally) is spent on online booksellers. I'm not exaggerating when I say that I save a few hundred dollars on books every year just for waiting a few days for a shipment to show up. Bottom line: if you want to save money, buy online.

        • Call of Cthulhu is obscure. I bought all his books for my wife in the mid 90's and the only store I found them in was The Tattered Cover in Denver. Sadly they have been hit hard by the online book sellers.

          Call of Cthulhu was out of print before 1995.
        • There's a rising interest in Lovecraft, driven partially by S. T. Joshi's scholarship, and new editions of his works are being released now that Arkham House is losing some copyrights and licensing others (not to mention releasing those horrid posthumous Derleth "collaborations.") The brick and mortar Barnes & Nobel in my local mall (Hartford, CT area) usually has a respectable selection on the shelves, as did the one in my parents' hometown (southern NH), and the Borders where I went to college (centr

        • >>Every year I spend between $500-1000 on books, and all of that money (save one or two books locally) is spent on online booksellers. I'm not exaggerating when I say that I save a few hundred dollars on books every year just for waiting a few days for a shipment to show up. Bottom line: if you want to save money, buy online.

          Alternatively, join a library and save even more.
  • without representation? I know the merchants always pass it onto the customer, but still.
    If states start doing this for internet sales, they'll do it for mail order/catalog sales.

  • If all states don't cooperate, double tax? (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Godeke ( 32895 ) * on Wednesday February 04, 2004 @12:33AM (#8177524)
    This could be interesting if some states insist on collecting point of sales tax, and others insist on collecting point of delivery tax. If all states are not using a single system, it would seem that some combinations would cause you to have to pay for both states... that would kill any reason to order online or from catalogs.
    • Ofcourse, if there was a mix to choose from, an online sales based buisness would move to a delivery tax state (or preferably a no-tax state) about as fast as they could. It will probably mean, sooner or later the system will be forced to standardize.
    • I seem to remember reading that a lot of states are working together to set up what amounts to a common sales tax. All the states would end up having the same sales tax rate, and restrict the ability of local governments (cities, etc) to add their own on top. The intent of this was to make it much easier for online stores to calculate the sales tax, since there would be a rate rather than several hundred different rates within a single state. My understanding was that the states involved intended to get

    • You see, the federal government has a constitutional, and historical jurisdiction over interstate commerce. If it gets to a turf war, then NO states will be able to levy excise taxes on interstate commerce, or (more likely) states will be required to adhere to the US Dept. of Commerce rules. That will allow federal officials like the US. President from having to commit political self-injury of imposing a new, unpopular federal Internet sales tax.

      To understand this issue you must understand the role govern

  • No Tax is not No Tax (Score:4, Informative)

    by jackb_guppy ( 204733 ) on Wednesday February 04, 2004 @12:50AM (#8177597)
    What people miss is that, if the store does not collect tax (no tax) then the buy still needs to pay the tax.

    Interstate shipping is viewed more as wholesaler transfer. When you buy out state, you are importing goods to your state. If you "consume" them then you pay the local tax on the "consumation" based on your price. If you sell them retail, you collect the tax and pay that.

    This is what business have done for years.

    It is what you should be doing today.

    • Re:No Tax is not No Tax (Score:2, Informative)

      by Anonymous Coward
      What people miss is that, if the store does not collect tax (no tax) then the buy still needs to pay the tax.

      Ohio has a Use Tax to cover things like mail order purchasing that works the way you mention. They have a nice little line on the state income tax every year asking you to declare any out of *county* purchases. You have to pay the difference between your local county's sales tax and the rate you paid where you bought the item. I.e. if I drive to a county where the tax is 6% (my local is 8%) I n

    • Use Tax (Score:3, Informative)

      by kaszeta ( 322161 )
      What people miss is that, if the store does not collect tax (no tax) then the buy still needs to pay the tax.

      Usually this is the case, and it's called a "Use Tax" levied by the state where the items are going.

      The biggest problem with Use Taxes is that they are hard to enforce. For example in my area (VT/NH border area), a substantial fraction (well over 80%) of the retail businesses in the border area are all on the NH side, so much of Vermont shops over here to avoid the VT sales tax (we don't mind mu

    • It is what you should be doing today.

      Heh... That almost comes across as though you wrote it with a straight face...

      Good one. Heh... Pay a "use tax" on something we manage to buy without a second (or third) raping by the IRS (and the individual states', and counties', and cities' version thereof)? Hilarious.

      It amazes me that people put up with the idea of sales tax at all. The US constitution has these funny ideas about "taxation without representation". They exist for a reason, and the entire conc

  • The have to... (Score:4, Informative)

    by zulux ( 112259 ) on Wednesday February 04, 2004 @01:15AM (#8177697) Homepage Journal


    Amazon has a distribution center in Kansas. Other companies that don't have a presence can safly ignore Kansas law.

    • Re:The have to... (Score:1, Informative)

      by Anonymous Coward
      Yes, I purchased some items for a girl I know in San Francisco. I did this online from Oregon. The items were bought from Sephora.com, which is in New York.

      Oregon has no sales tax, but Sephora charged me something like 10% sales tax. When I inquired, they said "it has nothing to do with the destination having a sales tax, specifically. Nor does it have to do with where YOU live even though YOU are ordering it. The taxation is due to the fact that our company has a physical presence in California and that i
    • I hope you're right. Since I live in Kansas, I don't want to have to pay tax on everything ordered from the 'net....
      • In New York for example, you're supposed to pay a "use" tax on goods you buy in other states, including online since you don't pay a sales tax.

        There's a little block on my New York state tax form where you're supposed to tell them how much you bought and how much tax you're going to pay them.

        Many (most?) other states that have a sales tax have similiar deals going on. I remember I was at an auction in New Hampshire right across the border from Massachusetts and the auctioneer stated that how great it was

        • Re:The have to... (Score:3, Interesting)

          by eht ( 8912 )
          Sales and Use Taxes in Kansas [cch.com]

          Granted it's nto a government publication, but I quote "Use tax. In Kansas the use tax supplements the sales tax. The use tax is levied upon people that are using, storing, or consuming in Kansas any article of tangible personal property that has not been subjected to sales or use tax by any state. Thus, the use tax is also referred to as the "compensating tax."

          If you ordered something online from Pennsylvania and didn't pay a sales tax to PA, you owe a use tax to Kansas.
          • Massachusetts has a similar law. You are supposed to self-report any such items for the Use Tax. Hehehe. I believe I read that New York does as well now. These things are of course generally unenforceable, and I would guess that only large companies would even think to do something like this.
        • One word: "Ouch."

          I guess we need duty-free shops on the 'net....
    • Oh really? Well in that case move it to Tulsa just south of there....we have plenty of room and we won't tax you.
  • Maybe Amazon thought if they just clicked their heals it would all go away.

  • Internet Taxes (Score:2, Insightful)

    by TSage ( 702439 )
    First, I'll come out and say my philosophical leanings are definitely libertarian. So anyone who dislikes such people for going horribly against their personal views should probably stop now. ;)

    OK, I've never quite understood sales taxes to begin with. Because of my philosophy, I'd just assume that it's just greedy governments wanting more. However, I'll set that aside if someone can point out a rather good reason.

    The thing is, it would have to be some pretty good reasoning for me because there are a

    • Re:Internet Taxes (Score:3, Informative)

      by clintp ( 5169 )

      OK, I've never quite understood sales taxes to begin with.

      The way I've always had it described to me is that sales taxes are how a state can raise funds proportional to its economy.

      Sales taxes are one of the most practical ways of doing this. Determining taxes at the point of manufacture is dicey (when is an automobile really "built"? when the engine is inserted? what's a car without bumpers really worth?) and collecting taxes during wholesale is impractical because goods can be transferred more than

      • Re:Internet Taxes (Score:2, Insightful)

        by abohart ( 598007 )
        Except in states that have no State income tax, this is, for all intents and purposes, double taxation. Triple taxation if you count what the Feds take out of your paycheck!!
      • Thanks for the informative reply.

        I actually remember reading that sales taxes are generally more stable compared to income taxes. I think it's because consumption is not as directly related to business cycles as wages are, which isn't to say they aren't affected by them. I would like to see some proof of that from an economist though.

        On my libertarian side, I've actually seen support for sales taxes in some instances. For example, the Americans for Fair Tax [fairtax.org] call for a nationwide sales tax of over 20%,
  • Currently, Kansans are required to pay a use tax to the state for purchases they make out of state, over the Internet or from catalogs, if the retailer fails to do so.


    "Presumably, some customers are self-assessing and remitting that tax," Prem said, drawing chuckles from legislators.
    Ha! Even the gov't realizes what a joke use tax is.
  • .. I lived there for a while and there taxes are pretty high, and they tax about everything and the high paying jobs are goverment jobs which pay a whopping 17 to 20k per year. Housing is cheap there though, but this is another reason NOT to live in kansas

    • I just don't get why people are so pissed about taxes. I make a decent wage and don't mind paying a few bucks to feed hungry people, fix the potholes, buy some modern textbooks or give a kid a free doctor visit a few times a year. I do get pissed about welfare payments to corporations or multi-billion dollar aircraft carriers but I figure it's the part of the cost of paying to fix the potholes.

  • Actually Amazon was covered under the "nexus" (Score:3, Insightful)

    by multiplexo ( 27356 ) on Wednesday February 04, 2004 @09:25PM (#8186198) Journal
    decision handed down by the Supreme Court. Amazon maintains a distribution center in Coffeyville, KS, meaning that they have a physical nexus in Kansas and thus are required to charge sales tax to residents of Kansas, just as they are required to charge sales tax to the residents of Washington State where the corporate headquarters are located.

  • well i hope this doesnt catch on. if i have to pay Tennessee's ungodly 9% tax AND shipping that will be the end of me buying anything online...

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