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Japanese Video Chain Cashes in on Mobile Internet 150

Posted by timothy from the what-you-watch-when dept.
Matthew Rothenberg writes: "CIO Insight has a case study that describes how Tokyo's Tsutaya video stores are tracking their users' shopping habits in real time via NTT DoCoMo's i-Mode wireless services and devices. 'We're not interested in merely renting videos to people,' Tsutaya founder Muneaki Masuda says. 'We're collecting lifestyle information, and the possibilities of that are, over time, enormous.'"
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Japanese Video Chain Cashes in on Mobile Internet More

Japanese Video Chain Cashes in on Mobile Internet

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  • Huh... (Score:1, Flamebait)

    by GTRacer ( 234395 )
    Leave it to the Japanese to use their l33t cellphone network to collect personal info...

    Fist?

    GTRacer
    Could it be?

  • I'm going to start bar coding my customers.

  • Bad movies (Score:3, Funny)

    by Capt. DrunkenBum ( 123453 ) on Thursday February 28, 2002 @03:41PM (#3086500) Homepage
    I guess I won't rent that copy of "Dude, Wheres my car."
    • actually, what if you "borrowed" a friends (or foes) phone and then made a lot of VIctoria's secret orders and bought some NSYNC cd's?!

      Could you then "RUIN" someone's demographic fit?
      Thats actually real scary.

      Imagine getting bombarded with goatse.cx pictures while trying to read about the latest linux distro?

      Oh, wait, this is slashdot...
    • Actually, I think that is a good point. Would you end up on academic probation for renting "Animal House" too many times?

      After all, you never know what kind of ideas might come of it...

      I guess I should go rent "Sense and Sensability" and Rocky MCMLX just to put myself in the 3rd standard deviation...

      -WS

  • At what point... (Score:5, Insightful)

    by banky ( 9941 ) <gregg AT neurobashing DOT com> on Thursday February 28, 2002 @03:41PM (#3086501) Homepage Journal
    At what point do the marketing types realize there is a growing segment of the population that 1)actively works to avoid having their "lifestyle information" harvested, and 2)rarely- if ever - does things like click on ads, respond to junk mail or spam, or otherwise do anything that this stuff would help?

    • Re:At what point... (Score:4, Insightful)

      by foobar104 ( 206452 ) on Thursday February 28, 2002 @03:51PM (#3086585) Journal
      At what point do the marketing types realize there is a growing segment of the population that 1)actively works to avoid having their "lifestyle information" harvested, and 2)rarely- if ever - does things like click on ads, respond to junk mail or spam, or otherwise do anything that this stuff would help?

      Think of it like evolution. Once you get so old that you can no longer reproduce, natural selection doesn't care about you. You're outside the system. The same forces act on you, but your success or failure has no effect whatsoever on your species.

      Same thing with advertising. If you don't participate in the see-buy cycle, then you're outside the system. You still get advertised to, but your choices have no effect whatsoever on your market segment.

      In other words, as long as there are enough people out there who respond positively or neutrally to this type of thing, then there's a good reason to keep doing it.

      Another analogy. People hand out flyers on street corners because, although 90% of the people may ignore the flyers, 10% of the people may respond to them.

      On the other hand, if that 90% of the people, instead of ignoring the flyers, punched the flyer-hander-outer in the nose and burned down the flyer-hander-outer's store, you'd see a sharp decline in flyer-hand-outism.
      • On the other hand, if that 90% of the people, instead of ignoring the flyers, punched the flyer-hander-outer in the nose and burned down the flyer-hander-outer's store, you'd see a sharp decline in flyer-hand-outism.

        What is that, a suggestion?
      • You Say: On the other hand, if that 90% of the people, instead of ignoring the flyers, punched the flyer-hander-outer in the nose and burned down the flyer-hander-outer's store, you'd see a sharp decline in flyer-hand-outism.

        I say: Does this mean we can and should beat the living shit out of jehova's witnesses and other god loving preacher type monstrosities that come my home door? sounds like a great idea to me!

        • You say: Does this mean we can and should beat the living shit out of jehova's witnesses and other god loving preacher type monstrosities that come my home door? sounds like a great idea to me!

          I say: You are clearly a sociopath, and a danger to yourself and others. At worst, your suggestion is criminal; at best, it's stunningly unfunny. Please get up from the computer and check yourself into the nearest facility for the criminally insane immediately. After two weeks of regular group therapy, we'll get together again to see how well you've worked out your violent tendencies.

    • Re:At what point... (Score:4, Interesting)

      by sabinm ( 447146 ) on Thursday February 28, 2002 @03:53PM (#3086591) Homepage Journal
      Unfortunately, were applying western thought to a very eatern culture. Japanese do not have the same feeling of privacy. Loudspeakers in public places "encourage" people to go to bed in some areas of Japan. The "annihilation of self" or the sacrifice of self for the good of the group is a prevalent ideology in Japan and other eastern cultures and I'm assuming that they would not be too put out by having their information transmitted to a potential supplier of wares, goods, or serivces.
      • Don't forget that the Japanese put some cultural practices over profit (which is one of the reasons their banking industry is in such bad shape), so it would probably stop at the point where it conflicts with accepted cultural practices. In America a never-ending supply of corporate shills would be constantly pushing it past any boundaries, obsessed only with eking out a few more dollars.
        • the Japanese put some cultural practices over profit (which is one of the reasons their banking industry is in such bad shape), so it would probably stop at the point where it conflicts with accepted cultural practices. In America a never-ending supply of corporate shills would be constantly pushing it past any boundaries, obsessed only with eking out a few more dollars.

          bullshit!

          Do you honestly believe that Japan would have the number two economy in the world with such constraints on profit? For the roots of Japan's banking crisis, you would do better looking at economics and what sort of FINANCIAL transactions they have made. Look at what they actually did in the bubble years rather than spreading some bogus nihonjinron. Then look at what Japanese employers ask of their workers and tell me that they aren't concerned about squeezing them for everything they can get.

          • Yes, the FINANCIAL transactions were often made not on the basis of what would be PROFITABLE, but what was expected of the people approving the loans in terms of personal obligations.

            Yes, they do ask a lot from their employees, like US companies, but they also give more.

            In the US, if your job becomes unnecessary, you're tossed out onto the street. In Japan you'd be more likely, especially if you're an older employee, to be given a make-work position. Why is this the case if they're only interested in squeezing them for everything they can get?

      • Re:At what point... (Score:3, Informative)

        by raian ( 23120 )
        The "annihilation of self" or the sacrifice of self for the good of the group is a prevalent ideology in Japan and other eastern cultures and I'm assuming that they would not be too put out by having their information transmitted to a potential supplier of wares, goods, or serivces.
        I'm sure that sounded great when you read it in your Japanese cultural theory class, but I can tell you for a fact that it is not true.

        Japan actually has much stronger laws than the US regarding what kinds of information companies can collect, and what they can do with that information. "Privacy" is quite important to most modern Japanese, and the fact that it is difficult to obtain just makes it more precious.

        There is already a huge problem with keitai (cell phone) spam on i-mode and other services in Japan. My girlfriend recently had to change her number due to 50+ spam calls a day. These kinds of problems have made Japanese consumers very aware of the dangers of leaving personal information unguarded.

        Tsutaya is not doing anything that hundreds of US companies aren't slavering to do. And you can bet that once wireless penetration in the US reaches the levels of Japan, Americans will be tracked in far more insidious ways than this. In fact, I would say that Americans, rather than Japanese, are the ones who would happily "annihilate themselves" for convenience, as their use of credit cards (which most Japanese mistrust) for even the smallest transactions shows.

        • I must qualify myself. I'm not readily speaking of *all* japanese culture, and no, I know a bit more than textbook reading. The anecdotal examples are not enought to refute years of research and self analysis.

          You only have to be invited as a guest into a Japanese home and they will bend over backwards to prove that you are right in any occasion--employees will readily resign or immolate themselves publicly if their screwups have caused any degree of discomfort for the corporation. Many Japanese ideas of teamwork and "annihilation of self" have carried over to US work forces.

          But I'm not here to get into an argument over east vs. west. You obviously had occasion to interact with different people than me. That's ok too. You cannot deny that my examples are part of eastern culture. BTW--I wasn't advocating US interests or putting US privacy concerns in the limelight. Only making observations on the *Japanese* culture (that was the topic in question, I think) ;). And the way that many will accept this as reality.

          By the way---The very fact that instead of calling up the corporation and suing, or even send angry letters to the perpetrators and instead just changing numbers to *avoid any more confrontation* kind of proves my point, dontcha think?

    • Re:At what point... (Score:5, Interesting)

      by Bodrius ( 191265 ) on Thursday February 28, 2002 @03:56PM (#3086635) Homepage
      At what point will people realize that lifestyles are not globalized by any means yet, and that part of the difference is the level of willingness to share that kind of information.

      I'm not surprised this would work in Japan. Japan is "consumerism 'done right'", where 'done right' means there are no compromises. We're talking about a culture that has underwear vending machines, corporations live in a comfortable mercantilist marriage with the government, and the idea of opposing a keiretsu makes as much sense as voluntary amputation.

      This doesn't mean it can work in the US, or many other places.

      The fact that it may not work here doesn't mean it won't work there, either. Not every culture puts that much value in "privacy", not even the US's, and you require a very significant demographic actively opposing this, or your privacy advocates will end up being tomorrows "sovereign citizen"'s movement.
      • I agree that in the context of *this story* we're talking Eastern culture, but the *same shit* happens here, too. Perhaps it works poorly here and therefore continues to go on, as different means and methods of using the info are tried.

      • ... makes as much sense as voluntary amputation.

        Actually, they do that there too. If you work for the Yakuza, and mess up bad (but not bad enough for them to kill you immediately), you're expected to make a sacrifice. Usually just a pinky... unless you've been really bad.

    • It's only an evolution twords a more efficient form of capitalism. If they can predict us consumers better then goods will only get cheaper you realize. They will know us better then we know ourselves. It's either that or move to a third world nation, or under a mountain where you won't be bothered.
      • goods will get cheaper but do you honestly think we'd see any of that ? Corporations are moral and $$$ blackholes. If you know history it was not the English government the US rebelled against but the chartered corps that controlled everything.
        • Just give in.... you can't fight it. They will only sell your rebel bones on ebay if you resist. There is only one true god and it's name is the almighty dollar.

    • I'm afraid most Americans are less discriminating than the average /. poster. Junk mail and telemarketing calls really are profitable enterprizes. If people weren't afraid to use their credit card on-line, spam would be much more profitable as well.

      Besides, personal information can be used for much more than just ads and spam. Insurance companies might want to purchase this information to adjust rates. Employers might find it valuable to know a candidate's gun purchase history, for instance. In fact, it's not too far off that I expect to buy a book at my local book-seller and hear the cashier say "Mr. Waddell, our records indicate that you may be interested in Jackie Chan, and he has a new biography out. We have a special today on this book, just for you, at 20% off. Would you like me add this book to your order?"

      What we need is a system that would allow us to treat our personal information as our property, that we can choose to sell or withhold. Kroger's policy of giving you discounts if you give them personal information is a good example. If my video store asked me "Would you like to let us track this rental information for 50 cents off?", I wouldn't mind a bit. But I do believe my personal information should be mine to use as I wish.

    • "Says Shinozaki: "Our ability to target certain segments of the population allowed us to charge [Kirin] a higher price, and the response rate to our survey was very high." The company has done similar promotions for companies in other industries, like shampoo manufacturers, but now it sees the market research option as a potentially lucrative source of new revenues."



      So they would be using my demographics/information against me to charge me a higer price? I don't think I like that.



      If the trend here is that my information will be used against me to charge me higher prices for something, then perhaps I will not be providing any more information to be used against me.

  • Since everyone will be up in arms about video stores collecting personal information and surfing habits.

    Not all data collection is bad, just often abused, though.
    • Either that or we'll have another, real, dot.com recession.

      Just think about it: constant collection of personal information, a record of surfing habits... pr0n sales will plummet.

      The Internet was designed to survive nuclear warfare, but nothing can be designed to survive the lack of pr0n.

    • Up in arms? Hardly. (Score:1, Insightful)

      by Anonymous Coward
      I guess you haven't been to a US supermarket in the past year. All the major store chains require you to use a "discount card" (e.g. customer profile ID) in order to avoid paying an inflated price. Notice how many people voluntarily use those cards seemingly without a care in the world?

      Perhaps you should reconsider your statement.
      --
      Spaz!
  • I don't know about anybody else but the idea of ANYBODY tracking my habits of shopping, roaming or just plain anything else spooks me.
    I don't like the idea of anybody keeping track of what I do even though I'm not doing anything illegal.
    The worst part is that corporations only have 1 thing in mind and that's the almight dollar ( or Yen in this case ) and so they'll do anything to make a buck... including selling this kind of information.

    The kind of fear I have of that??? enormouse

    • Re:Like Doubleclick (Score:3, Informative)

      by Jeremi ( 14640 )
      No kidding. If a person does it, it's "stalking" and you can get a restraining order. If a company does it, its "market research" and perfectly legal.


      (Yes, I know, you don't have to do business with a company that does this sort of thing. But that presumes that (a) you know that the company is spying on you, and (b) that there exist reasonable alternatives)

      • So i could start my own home business that does market research on those lovely celebs that don't return my mail?

  • Not In the US? (Score:1, Insightful)

    by zentec ( 204030 )

    Blockbuster baby. They have your info, they have your credit card, they have your address.

    Don't think for a minute they don't track and sell the info about what you rent.

    • They must not do a very good job because you can have late payments due in one store... in one side of town and then go to another... on the other side of town and they'll let you rent.

      Not what I exactly call a national infrastructure of info. What I gather these people are wanting to do this nationally and thus profile a persons daily habits.
      • Maybe where you live but here they've integrated. It's so bad hat if you have anything OUT they call to confirm! That really sucks when I go store-hopping to find the games I want when my mates come over for a weekend of binge-gaming...

        GTRacer
        -- Fist Prost - Gone in (less than) 60 seconds...

    • Re:Not In the US? (Score:2, Informative)

      by xphase ( 56482 )
      Actually I think that it is illegal for Video Rental companies to sell information about you rental habits. At least in the US.

      See: Here [consumerprivacyguide.org]

      --xPhase
    • Blockbuster baby. They have your info, they have your credit card, they have your address.

      Don't think for a minute they don't track and sell the info about what you rent.

      I'm fairly sure that's illegal. There was a federal law [cornell.edu] passed in 1988 regarding the handling of video-store rental records in the aftermath of the Clarence Thomas nomination hearings, or something to that effect.

    • ...they don't have any pr0n.
  • I think that studying people's lifestyles with out them knowing by tracking what they watch is trash. Why can't people mind their own business.
    -voices for choices
    • Because they want YOUR business to be THEIR business! :)

      It sucks, but there's really nothing new here that anyone should be surprised by.

  • 'We're collecting lifestyle information, and the possibilities of that are, over time, enormous.'

    Technology isn't evil, but people are. We all know exactly where this is going..

  • Now that sales are tracked... (Score:4, Funny)

    by gpinzone ( 531794 ) on Thursday February 28, 2002 @03:48PM (#3086551) Homepage Journal
    ...will this mean less sales of bukake films or more?
  • ...it will probably be replicated in other areas of the world. What with the 3G networks rolling out here in the US this kind of stuff could get really pervasive.
  • Imagine the amout of targeted spam, junkmail that is focused on our shopping habits. Sure its done now, but this would really make it worse than it is already.
    • Of course, if a company could guarantee (via a legally binding membership agreement) that they wouldn't spam you or sell/give your name/habits to other people/companies/governments, people would be more willing to use the service, making life easier for both company and consumer.

      Spam isn't profitable if it costs you customers.
  • sounds like a japanese doubleclick to me, except they can now get info on you anytime anywhere...

  • stores?

    After all, can't Japanese pay utility bills and purchase phone cards at conveinence stores? I'd think this would be a great place to collect info since you can link bill payments, phone usage (to an extent) and impulse buys all from one place.

    Maybe it'd also spur asset management software since that seems to be one of the central techs behind TOL. It's like being e-mailed books Barnes adn Nobles thinks you'd like and telling you they have 3 in stock at various San Diego bookstores.
    • At the moment, there is fierce competition between convenience store chains in Japan, while Tsutaya rules to video reantal market more than Blockbuster does in the US. Thus, I don't think it would be as easy for convenience stores to implement. Especially because member cards are unknown in convenience stores, yet accepted and necessary for video rantal.
  • "...the possibilities of that are, over time, enormous." ah, I think they meant ominous
  • This was a great article filled with buzz words managerial biz-speak, and its great that there is this sprawling wireless tracking service,
    but has this been useful? Are there any measured improvements in sales?

    And more importantly, how have the users reacted? Oh yeah, yr always gonna get those privacy zealots, but what about everyone else? Do they just shrug it off? Do they hate it? Or are they actually using it?

    • You asked if there is any improvement in sales?

      The article said both in store shoppers and those who don't normally come into the stores increased in volume.

      It has been going on for several years so while certainly backlash can always occur, so far it hasn't happened.

      You talked about "Biz speak" which is no different than "Geek speak" short hand to help those people with in a field communicate with each other. There is nothing wrong with Geeks talking about Linux Clusters, DDR and IEE 1394 and there is nothing wrong with marketers talking about ROI, CPM, retention and churn.

    • privacy zealot = anyone who doesn't want to be stalked by his neighbors, business, or the government.

      anti-privacy zealot = those bugshit morons who think they have a god-given right to spy on you, either personally or through their the actions of their government. Fans of the "Enquirer" and The Oprah Winfrey Show. Typified by extremely low IQs.

      Max
  • hello big brother. how are you today?

  • Evisceration (Score:3, Interesting)

    by anonicon ( 215837 ) on Thursday February 28, 2002 @03:54PM (#3086610)
    Either Japan has a wildly different culture that has no expectation to legal, personal or consumer privacy, or this company is going to be eviscerated for tracking its customers' behavioral habits (not just purchasing habits).

    Then again, I wonder what the safeguards are. If people are opting in to receive this wireless info, no big deal - they chose to receive it. Tracking's a different story, but still, what web site owner doesn't track how much demand they get from an ad or a news story? If they're not opting in, hmmm - sounds spammish.

    Last, I wonder if Tsutaya is tracking consumer response to their e-notifications en masse, like matching up web site visitors to their country of origin, or if they're doing microtracking - matching up responses to each individual, each indiv with their own corporate-database-tracked profile? One's OK, the other's nuts. Both are easily and totally possible.

    Can't wait til Blockbuster or BestBuy starts doing this! Not...
    • Well duh... Japanese society is too cramped for there to be much privacy (or personal autonomy) at all. Their society is built around families and communities rather than individuals. It's been that way for ages. I doubt they see much point in worrying whether some company is watching them and tracking their habits - since plenty of people and organizations are doubtlessly doing it anyway and feel perfectly entitled to do so.

      And yet, for all its restrictions and lack of privacy their society has not devolved into some drab 1984-ish autocracy. In fact it's one of the richest most cultured nations in the world. What a paradox.
    • While I can't speak for Japanese culture, I doubt evisceration is on the way. After all, we ourselves have not eviscerated TRW or Visa.

      The (somewhat sad) fact of life is that here in the US, banks and other financial institutions (BFIs) have done an outstanding job of tracking and making available the spanding habits of consumers. Every time you use your credit card, the issuing agency gains access to yet another transaction. Ditto checks, ckeck cards, etc.

      BFIs have been happily selling the information to, well, just about anyone who can pay for years, so this kind of 'harvesting' is nothing new. The proliferation of technology (read : the Net) has simply brought this kind of activity more widespread attention.

      Not to woory though... you have no need to wait for Blockbuster to start tracking your video rentals - they likely do now. But, even if they didn't, they could buy the information from your bank anyway.

      Put on a happy face...

    • Less worse than Amazon, probably... (Score:4, Informative)

      by wirefarm ( 18470 ) <jim@@@mmdc...net> on Thursday February 28, 2002 @07:10PM (#3087831) Homepage
      I live in Japan and have been renting videos from Tsutaya for years.
      In Japan, for a huge number of young people, the keitai (cell phone) is the primary phone - they don't have another one in their apartment.
      So when you sign up at Tsutaya, they want your keitai number. Big deal. I'll bet Blockbuster has your phone number, too.
      Over here, it used to be that your keitai number was also your email - 09012345678@docomo.ne.jp - most people have changed it to something a bit less spammable. (I don't know anyone who hasn't changed it.)
      So, most likely, Tsutaya doesn't have any linked information, unless you've offered to link it for them via their website...

      I just don't see how this relates exclusively to Japan or to advanced CRM or keitais: the same thing could have been done 100 years ago by your library using postcards.

      Keitais are not so advanced here that they can tell when you are watching a movie or close to a store. Perhaps you get an occasional email on your phone. (I've never gotten one.) This is not particularly Big-Brother-ish.

      Blockbuster already knows what movies you rent from them, what days you rent, how often you pick a foreign film, a soft-core, a sci-fi, new release, whatever. They also have your phone number and maybe your email, if you signed up for some promotion or "member's club" on their website.

      This is completely a non-story.
      Any website that ties browsing to any real-world activity can do this.
      If blockbuster.com or bestbuy.com has a page where you can enter your personal info and you actually do, you can bet that you will be tracked in this way.
      It's not really an invasion of privacy if you are opting in...

      Cheers,
      Jim in Tokyo
  • What if I liked the idea of only having to see or sit through ads for things I would actually be interested in? I don't want to be tracked either, but is anyone aware of a company working on tracking where I submit what I want tracked (I don't give a damn if everybody know how many times I've seen Star Wars) and can keep the rest of my privacy? Would such submission be more hassle than it was worth, or would the advantages (to me) outweigh the effort?

    That said, I also have no problem with word of mouth ads that are one-off. I'm interested when someone tells me something they like even I it's new to me. Otherwise, how would I be made aware of new things to try or look into (like how I found out about Slashdot)?

  • What I hate about this (Score:3, Interesting)

    by mrroot ( 543673 ) on Thursday February 28, 2002 @03:58PM (#3086643)
    Corporations always think they can track what I buy and then use something like the "recommendation engine" they talk about in the article to tell me what else I would like. Sure that seems like a helpful service but it really is a very selfish service, because it does nothing to expose me to new and interesting stuff, it simply herds me along with what 9 out of 10 other people watched after they watched what I just watched. The whole purpose is to get the most of my money the fastest way possible.

    OK, so you might say, "you dont have to use the recommendation service". But you see that is not the problem. The problem is that they will eventually produce a much less diverse range of films, music, etc and focus in only on what the majority wants to see. They are already doing that today, but it will get worse with systems like these. Soon your local Blockbuster will not bother stocking your favorite cult film, if they haven't already. My problem with this is that it really homogenizes the population into a bunch of boring drones who are told what to like and what to think.

    • So where are the big films and the variation of 20+ years ago, where is the ground breaking Star Wars, the revolutionary 2001, the Hitchcocks, the acting of Bogart and Bacal.

      Star Trek 4^100
      Star Wars 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9
      Yet another "Action adventure"

      This is thanks to crap focus groups that also make sure every car looks the same. Mapping more customers can only help identify that 5% of people actually do like Trainspotting, Shallow Grave, but hate the Beach. Rather than asking a bunch of no marks with nothing better to do than fill in questionaires.
    • This is yet another point where your initial viewpoint influences the conclusion you arrive at.

      Instead of "this will drive products to centrist crap" you can have a different perspective on this. One thing this will allow, is to provide a "guaranteed audience" for just about any genre you care to name. And provide a way to get access ot that audience.

      You like movies about obscure topic X. Most movie companies don't bother making such movies, because the marketting costs involved in informing you that the movie exists are too high for the small size of the market. If, instead, you can simply send an email out to everyone that likes these movies, your marketting costs just dropped like a rock. Your audience is suddenly aware of your movie, and, one can hope, if it doesn't suck too much people will actually see/rent/buy it. But no one will see/rent/buy it if they don't know about it.

      This *can* make it more economical to target smaller audiences by decreasing the costs of communicating with that audience.

      Will it acutally be done that way? Well, that's where your initial preconceptions come into play. :)

  • I love this...we do it here why not there (Score:3, Interesting)

    by CDWert ( 450988 ) on Thursday February 28, 2002 @04:04PM (#3086681) Homepage
    We do similar things here, cable companies selling logs to the same people that administer the systems of grocery cards to know if someone was watching a commercial for a product bought by you.

    I wonder what sort of psycological impact this has on a person.

    Really, people talk about the internet polarization of ideologies, what is this doing to say someone that may have a passing interest in say quiltmaking they rent a video, the japaneese system shove quiltmaking products of all sorts down the customers throat at every juncture, and eventually through the aid of all including the ISP, Cable Companies, etc, all the person see is quiltmaking shit, do they , A) go insane B) Join the Rosie Grier [agelesssports.com](for you who dont know look it up its worth the laugh) needlepint society. c)Gain a hatred for quilts, buy ginsu knives and start chopping up quilts, which then leads to a proliferation of cutlery advertising targeted at this same customer, who in turn becomes a serial killer due to all the cutlery advertising now.

    Leave your TV on some stupid ass channel when not at home, trade grocery cards(please make sure you cant cash a check with it) and lend you cell phone to your aged aunt selma who couldnt figure out how to use it if her life depended on it.
    • We refuse those grocery 'value cards' for just this reason. But, really, sooner or later you use something for convenience (credit card, video rental card, whatever) and there you have it, a record of something you did. I don't like being tracked, either, but it's hard to do everything in cash. And so many people, especially the younger ones of us, want to travel with only the "basics" - cellphone, driver's license, debit and credit cards. Sometimes for the vainest reasons such as the wallet making ugly bulges in their fashion jeans. So, there's no stopping the tracking, all we can do is screw with it like the previous poster said - give them bogus data.
      • Try this - random grocery cards!

        Some chains [Safeway] allow you to type in your "phone number" when you check-out, rather than requiring you to scan a card.

        Sign up for a card so you have a "legit" number to use as a last resort if needed, then next time you check out try a random phone number, until you get one (or more) that work. The number I usually use apparantly belongs to a family with young chilrden, as the coupon machine sometimes spits out diaper coupons...

        If enough people do this the database gets corrupt (or they require physical cards, which lowers the convenience/compliance and risks alienating customers, which they do not want to do).

    • Leave your TV on some stupid ass channel when not at home, trade grocery cards(please make sure you cant cash a check with it)...

      I was just thinking about banner ads. I remember seeing a lot of amateur web sites with banners to pay their hosting fees, saying "please click on our sponsors so we can pay our bills!"

      I think a neat plug-in might be something that scanned the most-recently loaded page for banner ads, and then pretended to click on them (not sure exactly how to do this without using a lot of bandwidth for the ad to come down; make the connection, then quickly break it? Pretend the connection came from a different IP? Something like that).

      This would serve two purposes: it would, in the short term, provide funds to those sites that you frequent; and in the long term, it would eliminate that form of advertising, while at the same time emptying the pockets of the ad-man.

      ...and lend you cell phone to your aged aunt selma who couldnt figure out how to use it if her life depended on it.

      My grandmother just got a cell phone, and programmed my number in. She has called me by accident no less than 5 times in the last week, the phone being activated in her purse. Each time she calls, I call her back, asking her to look up the "key guard" or "key lock" feature in the instruction book, but she just doesn't seem to understand it.

      She's not going senile; she's very sharp, conversationally, and remembers events with clarity. It's just that the technology is beyond her.

  • Isn't it wonderful... (Score:2, Funny)

    by Anonymous Coward
    how companies in Japan work...

    Step one sell iMode phones.
    Step two ...
    Step three profit!
  • Just imagine...sites such as thinkgeek.com could garner useful statistics about their customers, statistics that answer such difficult questions as:

    1. Are "geeks" the majority of people that order from thinkgeek?
    2. Do most thinkgeek consumers own a computer?
    3. Do some of the people that order the Perl shirts program in Perl, or do they mostly program in VB?
    4. Are women truly the majority of their purchasing audience as first guessed?
    5. Is the first thing noticed by most users on the site the first thing that comes up in the middle of the screen within one's line of sight?
    6. Do people that buy mugs also drink Dr. Enuf? Water? Milk?

    This kind of thinking is so exciting, I so wish I was in marketing.

  • and everything to do with DoCoMo. They made i-Mode just for this stuff. That is why I cringe when people (if I remember Taco's quote correctly) describe the Japanese as "light-years ahead of us in cell phones."

    I did some work on this stuff a while back, and the outline of their system is here [slashdot.org].

    The really fun part is that what I was involved with was making the information about how this worked clear to American executives at telcoms. I doubt we have long to wait till this great tech comes to a continent near us.


    • describe the Japanese as "light-years ahead of us in cell phones."

      Let them be light years ahead of us in cell phones. I really don't want all of that crap.

      SPEEDIAL. VIBRATE MODE. A RELIABLE WAY TO SHUT THEM UP IN THEATRES AND OTHER QUIET PLACES.

      That is all I want. I don't want to watch Blade Runner on my cell phone. I don't want to ask Jeeves anything, GET IT? I don't want a map to the city that is so dang tiny that I can't read it. If I want to order Chinese food, then I will call them personally, not use a scroll down menu. I am not trading stocks on my phone.

      These are the same bastards that want to put a TV tuner card or a DVD drive in my PC... and make my computer into the worlds most expensive, horrible looking and sounding home theatre system. STOP IT!

      Oh, and another thing. Stop making ring that plays 'Stairway to Heaven,' Snoop Dogg's 'Gin and Juice,' or the national anthem of France.

      Those songs are driving everyone in the office crazy when "Mr. Cell Phone Jerk" is away and we can't find the phone in time to turn it off. Then "Miss Cell Phone Boyfriend Obsessive" calls back three times because sweetie didn't answer. Who hasn't played that game?

      This is why my fiancee has our cell phone. I hate the things... and make her keep it off in my presence. Besides, is anyone really got anything that important to talk about that justifies vehicular manslaughter?

  • Or just purchases? It all seems a little scary to me. Just think, if you buy a book in a store that is known to harbor anti-Japan literature, are you "marked" for special observation?
    • If you read the article carefully, Tsutaya is not engaging in any nefarious geographical tracking--in fact, DoCoMo cell phones generally cannot be localized at all except within a relatively large range of an antenna. They almost certainly do track which branches you rent or shop at, but you don't even need cell phones for that.

      And before slashdotters get all worked up about spamming, this campaign appears to be opt-in. I have had a Tsutaya card for a year and a half (yes, I live in Japan), but since I didn't give them my i-Mode address, I have never heard a word from them. Ever.

      All Tsutaya is doing here is sending you targeted advertising--the only novelty is that the mail reader is a cell phone instead of a PC. What makes the cell phone approach more effective is that people generally take cell phones with them to the rental shops, whereas PC's tend to stay home.

      I don't know how they associate purchases with cell phone addresses, but they did have campaigns in the past where you got discounts for presenting i-Mode based "online coupons" at the counter, so maybe that's how they do it. Rentals are easy, of course; you just associate (again, I have to emphasize, voluntarily provided) i-Mode addresses with rental membership cards.

      Frankly, I would find these email ads to be annoying as heck, but some people apparently like it; as long as it's opt-in, I see no problem.

  • Good Old Phone for Me (Score:2, Interesting)

    by filtrs ( 548248 )
    This is exactly why I hope the US NEVER gets 3G! I want my phone to do one thing: make and receive phone calls. If I can hook a modem or such to it and transfer data, thats great ... but through another device! I don't want everything in my phone; not my PDA, not my web browser, just a phone.

    *sigh*

    Realistically, I know that we will be getting something (probably not true 3G by the time its all done, but something similar) and I will have to switch phones if I want one at all.

    Damn.
  • I'm waiting for the day I can write an OpenGL screensaver that connects to the internet and creates a splendidly chaotic display of dots, each one representing one person in my town as they drive around and go about their business. It could even be interactive! Link their coordinates through a mapquest style system and float little tags over each of their heads on mouseover, displaying where they're shopping or what adult video store they're in.

    Then, I would use this data to fuel an immensely complex encryption system, using the to's and fro's of my community as seed values, to encrypt all of the software I stole from CompUSA with my iPod.

    If anyone thinks Microsoft is an unholy empire, what about DoCoMo? They're probably selling their data out to the Japanese Army by now. Huge dividends!

    --"Dispelling Disillusion Since 2002"
    --The Sensorium [thesensorium.com]
  • If you want to escape it, then you download your own moves, then you have to deal with federal reguations.. either way you loose.
  • If this service could actually identify my preferences and let me know about things I care about, rather than just spam me with anything they can think of, I would love to see it.

    How many of us rushed to see the Lord of the Rings or Phantom Menace trailers? Wouldn't it be great to be informed about such things as soon as they happen, as long as you don't get a ton of other crap?

    I still think it would be better to have an intelligent agent that represents you finding these links for you rather than a marketing engine pushing the links to you, but, frankly, there's virtually no economic incentive for someone to build such an agent and every incentive for the marketers to send you their links. In fact, over time, I think marketers who actually do meet our needs will be the ones who win out, and untargeted spam will fall by the wayside.

    There are already services [mailshell.com] that let you give each person with whom you correspond a different email address, thus letting you see who you can trust and eliminate those you can't. As these kind of services become ubiquitous, indiscriminate spammers will begin losing money, while smarter marketers, who actually (gasp!) tell us about products we care about will succeed.

    Reading the article, it sounds to me (of course, it's marketing hype, and only time and experience will tell) like this might be such a service.

    Wasn't there a slashdot article fairly recently about useful marketing versus spamming?

    • sure, until you have 1000 different shops telling you they have LOTR books, and 100 cinimas pushing the show time of LOTR, and then they relize they might get an extra sale if they tell you about all the fanatsy books they have, etc.etc.etc....
      • Right, and then you stop accepting email from the address from which you're getting that crap. If that becomes standard (and I think it will start to be), then the spamming bastards go out of business and only the reasonable services survive. In theory ;)

  • Not as nefarious as it seems at first glance (Score:4, Insightful)

    by spun ( 1352 ) <loverevolutionary@@@yahoo...com> on Thursday February 28, 2002 @04:42PM (#3086914) Journal
    WHAT?!? A company where people can voluntarily sign up for membership is actually using that membership to track what they buy? And then turning around and using that information to target ads to those members? How innovative.

    Although the article is more 'gee-whiz-ain't-it-great' than actually informative, it seems like Tsutaya is only tracking purchases at their stores and through their website, not somehow using people's phones to track everything they do and buy.

    Does anyone actually believe there are ANY companies that have a club card that AREN'T doing this? It doesn't really sound like they are doing anything revolutionary.
  • Lets not forget about Radioshack.

    I always thought it was a joke, I never really shopped much at Radioshack before, but I remember watching Seinfeld and Kramer going on and on about them requesting his phone number to purchase some batteries.

    It's no joke, I bought 3 dollar batteries from them, paid cash and they tried to get my Name, Phone Number, Address, and DOB.. I'm willing to bet money, maybe some Radioshack emloyees can back me up, that they have fields in their Database for Social Security # and Drivers License #.. I wonder what they're doing with all of that information they are stockpiling? .. I'm with Kramer, it's a front for some kind of Mafia.
    • Typically, when they ask for my last name, I say "Doe". When they askfor my first name, I say "John". About two seconds later, they figure out what's going on.

  • Product of the economy (Score:2, Informative)

    by Harley ( 63100 )
    I hate to say it, but as a result of the economic downturn I'm doing coding for a direct marketing company. As such I get to see, and often implement, all the nasty tracking stuff that follows so many users through their visits to different web sites.

    On the bright side, a lot of what is tracked from our end tends to be geared towards interpretting responses from different advertising campaigns rather than pinning habits on particular users. Such information results in more effective advertising, and most likely brought about the dreaded "Wazzzzzzup?!" ads.

    Tracking isn't always a bad thing, but it justifiably becomes a concern when the relative anonymity of those being tracked is lost.
  • How does it all work for the consumer? Suppose your 13-year-old daughter bought the latest CD by *NSYNC, a popular boy band. When the band's next release is available, Tsutaya Online (TOL), Tsutaya's wireless i-Mode site, will e-mail you a digital music clip. Similarly, fans of movie star Nicole Kidman can be sent a review of her new movie, "Birthday Girl,'' and then track its availability on video via the Web or mobile phone.

    And now, the problems with this, for those not following it close enough:

    1) If I bought the n*sync album, and liked it, I'd already know a new one was coming out. Informing me it of this would embarrass you and creep me the hell out.

    2) If I bought said album and didn't like it, your informing me that there is a new one would probably not entice me to buy it. Getting a free "clip," which would no doubt be identical to the songs played on mtv, the radio, and cars parked next to mine at Target, would not entice me to buy it. So again, it embarrasses you and creeps me the hell out.

    3) If you let me know there's a new Nicole Kidman flick out, and tell me where I can see it, you assume that I had nothing to do that evening but what you tell me. Basically, you're suggesting that I do what you say and forcefully providing me with a suggestion. And since nobody goes to a film alone, I'd have to admit to my friends that we're going to see this damn butterfly movie because a cell-phone provider told me to. When they were done laughing, we wouldn't go. Again, you are embarrassed and I am shamed.

    There is no way for this technology not to be obnoxious. It is not passive advertising, like a magazine or banner ad, which I act on if that's what I am searching for. It is active advertising, singling me out, and unlike telemarketing which has a (slightly) human factor to it increasing the probability of success. So we have obnoxious technology on expensive devices. Result? Devices become marginalized to only people who are themselves obnoxious, deleting the street appeal (one of the largest sellers of cell phones). Companies realise this and don't use the service. The service dies, and CIOs fire ad sellers like it's their fault.

    Jesus, people, how hard is it to build a company through great customer service, useful products and quality goods? It seems that everybody's looking to force junk down our throats for loads and loads of money, claiming it's "free." Is it any wonder OSS has such trouble in this market?
  • If I were to follow someone around and gain this detailed level of knowledge about their activities, I would be dragged into court for stalking. But if a corporation follows people around to find out what they are doing, it is called "targetted marketting" or "demographics information gathering" and it is just business. I don't want people or corporations following me around trying to gather information on me. If you actually want to know about me, ask me to my face and I will probably tell you. Otherwise, if you have to follow me around all day and look at my video rental history, list of books purchased lately, and recently purchased groceries, you are becoming a stalker.

    Remember when the government followed people around to find out what they were up to? That was the Stasi.
  • ...great article, written in 100% pure Marketeese!

    Gee & Gosh, the Wonders of Behavior Tracking. Don't you envy those cool futuristic wireless Japanese cyberconsumers? I pray that some day somebody would Profile my Consumer Product Consumption Patterns so that I never again would feel unentertained.

    All the time my wireless telephone would call me and on its little color television screen there would magically appear targeted 3D joy-consumer-grams keeping me Informed of Newly Released and Upcoming Derivative Entertainment Products scientifically cloned and distilled in the Hollywood labs from Stuff that Average Consumers within my Profiled Demographic Group had been Profiled to determine they would probably Like to purchase.

    Because it's always Great to Consume Entertainment Content Exactly Like The Stuff You've Consumed Already. You fucking worthless foodtube.

    Fuck that.

    Not a single paragraph was spent in that article addressing privacy concerns, but it must be assumed that the matter-of-factly business rationalization of computerized obsessive stalking is that only troglodytes, communists and paranoid perverts with Something To Hide would worry about privacy anyway.

    I hate the future. I hate you. Death is too good for marketeers.

  • About the use of this information by parties other than marketing departments.

    Harvesting lifestyle information allows psychiatrists to accurately predict how you think.

    Large applications written with the help of psychiatrists can accurately predict public reaction to information, allowing government support agencies (read: political marketing firms) to tailor speeches to exactly what will get the best response from the public.

    We all know that political agenda is achieved not by simply saying "We are going to rape you of all your rights" but by gradually stripping each person of their rights by making it look like they are protecting your rights. &nbsp&nbsp For instance "Another instance of <anti-agenda-item/> has caused incredible problems and suffering all because <relate any-unrelated-issue/> has not been dealt with yet. &nbsp&nbsp But if only someone <implied hero-agenda-supporter-stuffing-our-pockets/> would do something <imply agenda-item/> to miraculously save us all and bring us peace.&nbsp&nbspUnfortunately someone <imply agenda-item-antagonist> stands in the way of <imply word-peace-and-harmony/> by keeping <imply something-deserved warning="do not mention it was taken away by gvmnt in first place"/>"

    Well, enough of my <rant any-/.-rant>, back to <work person-stuffing-my-pockets at the present/>

    P.S. Yes, I used word to write the html because I was in a hurry. It dumps crap into my html that I hate, but it's faster than typing all theose tags.

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