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China Japan Australia Government

15 Asia-Pacific Countries Form World's Largest Trade Bloc, Exclude the US (cnbc.com) 295

"Fifteen Asia-Pacific economies formed the world's largest free trade bloc on Sunday," reports CNBC, "a China-backed deal that excludes the United States, which had left a rival Asia-Pacific grouping under President Donald Trump." Amid questions over Washington's engagement in Asia, the Regional Comprehensive Economic Partnership (RCEP) may cement China's position more firmly as an economic partner with Southeast Asia, Japan and Korea, putting the world's second-biggest economy in a better position to shape the region's trade rules...

RCEP could help Beijing cut its dependence on overseas markets and technology, a shift accelerated by a deepening rift with Washington, said Iris Pang, ING chief economist for Greater China. RCEP groups the 10-member Association of Southeast Asian Nations (ASEAN), China, Japan, South Korea, Australia and New Zealand. It aims in coming years to progressively lower tariffs across many areas... RCEP will account for 30% of the global economy, 30% of the global population and reach 2.2 billion consumers, Vietnam said...

"For the first time, China and Japan reached a bilateral tariff reduction arrangement, achieving a historic breakthrough," China's finance ministry said in a statement, without giving further details. The deal marks the first time rival East Asian powers China, Japan and South Korea have been in a single free trade agreement.

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15 Asia-Pacific Countries Form World's Largest Trade Bloc, Exclude the US

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  • Lesson for America (Score:3, Insightful)

    by ShanghaiBill ( 739463 ) on Sunday November 15, 2020 @04:47PM (#60727974)

    A lesson for America: When your foreign policy is based on throwing temper tantrums, the world looks elsewhere for leadership.

    China won. America lost in an own-goal.

    • by K. S. Kyosuke ( 729550 ) on Sunday November 15, 2020 @04:53PM (#60727988)
      America First...but Asia now indexes from zero!
    • A lesson for America: When your foreign policy is based on throwing temper tantrums, the world looks elsewhere for leadership.

      China won. America lost in an own-goal.

      Obligatory: 72 million "real" Americans voted for 4 more years of temper-tantrum foreign policy.

      • by paiute ( 550198 ) on Sunday November 15, 2020 @05:10PM (#60728068)

        Obligatory: 72 million "real" Americans voted for 4 more years of temper-tantrum foreign policy.

        Historical reality check: In 1944, after FDR had led the county through the Great Depression, kicked Hitler's ass, and destroyed Imperial Japan, 46% of the electorate voted against him. In 2020, Trump got 47% of the vote.

      • by BAReFO0t ( 6240524 ) on Sunday November 15, 2020 @05:24PM (#60728108)

        Falsely implying fully independent thought in a social species

        Man, we wouldn't even know if one dies from jumping from a skyscraper without others telling you how that works! (Nobody reading this ever did any research on this, did you?)

        This is the age of social warfare, and you're surprised a deliberately low-educated part of the population follows a loud nutjob that promises them freedom from all their problems? Even Germany didn't manage that, about a 100 years ago.
        I say, yes they got some independent thought. About as much as when you piss against a thunderstorm.... ;)

    • A lesson for America: When your foreign policy is based on throwing temper tantrums, the world looks elsewhere for leadership.

      China won. America lost in an own-goal.

      Let me get this straight, you think that a regional trade deal of ASEAN countries hatched back in 2012 that is now coming to pass means "America loses"? This deal means "the world" is looking for leadership elsewhere because of Trump's antics? That if it wasn't for Trump's tantrums, the US could have been a part of this deal, and it would've been economically stronger for it? Or maybe the US could have convinced all the other ASEAN countries to dump the deal with China they'd been working on for years an

    • by Evtim ( 1022085 )

      Lessons in reality is more like it.

      The proportion of westerners among the richest peoples on Earth is dropping. Soon it will be below 50%. The world is catching up and it does it with greater acceleration than the west, since it can avoid mistakes and also uses the latest in scientific understanding and technology.

      When the worlds population hits a plateau (we are almost there, the amount of added people per year is dropping since the 90's), Asia and Africa will account for 80 percent of all humans. https:// [worldometers.info]

  • by fluffernutter ( 1411889 ) on Sunday November 15, 2020 @04:54PM (#60727996)
    Canada is just getting dragged down by Americans. We should be in that agreement but Trump pretty much locked us out of it.
    • by robi5 ( 1261542 )

      In an agreement dominated by China?

      • by green1 ( 322787 )

        Better than being dominated by the USA

        • Re: Dragged down (Score:5, Insightful)

          by fluffernutter ( 1411889 ) on Sunday November 15, 2020 @05:33PM (#60728126)
          Precisely. We are really not sure if we should trust America any more. You don't have your house in order.
          • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

            by robi5 ( 1261542 )

            Still a hundred times more trustworthy and cooperative than China, especially post-Trump. Just think of the rampant IP theft, violation of agreements (eg. the one country, two system with Hong Kong), violation of international law (nine-dash line), broad violation of human rights, child labor and no regard for the environment, with China constructing hundreds of coal plants just abroad (and more domestically), as well as restarting the release of CFC which is illegal.

            Also, there's a mixup, Canada wasn't goi

        • by robi5 ( 1261542 )

          Wait till China soft powers other nations to be more like them, autocratic, dictatorial and anti-democratic. You'll want US hegemony back

      • Well, if Satan boils a soup for you, you at least want *you own* piss to be a flavor ingredient, don't you? ;)

        • by robi5 ( 1261542 )

          Not sure what you mean, read up on China's innumerable negative actions over the past few decades which outweigh by far anything the West has been committing

          • From your point of view. From other points of view the american atrocities are worse and certainly much more numberous.

    • This is basically an expanded regional ASEAN bloc of countries that already trade with each other.

      Canada isn't in the western Pacific. TPP is a separate agreement entirely.

      • Re: (Score:2, Insightful)

        This is basically an expanded regional ASEAN bloc of countries.

        It is more than just ASEAN.

        Japan, Korea, Australia, and New Zealand are all signatories.

        India voluntarily pulled out because Modi is even stupider than Trump.

    • by Luckyo ( 1726890 )

      Remind me, how are those Canadians rotting in Chinese jail for political reasons jail doing?

      CCP fluffers out in force today.

  • Thanks, DONALD (Score:5, Insightful)

    by JustAnotherOldGuy ( 4145623 ) on Sunday November 15, 2020 @04:56PM (#60728002) Journal

    "Fifteen Asia-Pacific economies formed the world's largest free trade bloc on Sunday," reports CNBC, "a China-backed deal that excludes the United States, which had left a rival Asia-Pacific grouping under President Donald Trump."

    Thanks for fucking us again, Donald.

    But not to worry, I suspect that after President Super Spreader is out of office, we'll be able to join, but only as a junior partner until they trust us again.

    • Re:Thanks, DONALD (Score:4, Insightful)

      by Anonymous Coward on Sunday November 15, 2020 @05:04PM (#60728046)

      Will anyone trust you again? It's not like trump was voted out by an overwhelming majority. This election just showed that america is as xenophobic and selfish as ever.

      • Re:Thanks, DONALD (Score:5, Informative)

        by Chris Mattern ( 191822 ) on Sunday November 15, 2020 @06:27PM (#60728246)

        "It's not like trump was voted out by an overwhelming majority. "

        Trump got voted out by a larger majority than any incumbent president since Herbert Hoover.

        • It took a pandemic to make that happen though.
        • Trump got voted out by a larger majority than any incumbent president since Herbert Hoover.

          That ultimately doesn't matter. The number may show the biggest gap but it's a question of absolutes. 73,155,408 people (and counting) voted for an additional 4 more years of this dumbfuckery. Even if it failed it demonstrates the single largest example of mass attempted self harm ever.

          Trump shouldn't just have lost by a larger majority, he should have been annihilated in a landslide. But he wasn't showing that the USA may very well re-elect either him or some equally destructive moron again.

          There's no trus

      • Re:Thanks, DONALD (Score:4, Interesting)

        by OzPeter ( 195038 ) on Sunday November 15, 2020 @06:28PM (#60728248)

        Will anyone trust you again? It's not like trump was voted out by an overwhelming majority. This election just showed that america is as xenophobic and selfish as ever.

        In some ways it will be a good thing that the US is no longer implicitly trusted. Because in order to actually be trusted in the future the US will have to work hard and achieve real results rather than just coast.

    • Re: (Score:2, Informative)

      by guruevi ( 827432 )

      The agreement was started in 2012 (hint: Biden was VP then). The media is simply blaming Trump for everything bad that happens in the world. China doesn't think about what looks good in the next election, because it doesn't have a fair and free election, their dictator is in power forever and thus can realize long-term goals.

      It was never China's intention to have the US included in these agreements. China wants regional domination, because it desperately needs resources from neighboring countries and desper

  • by meglon ( 1001833 )
    No one saw this coming... oh wait, a LOT of people did, but this is what happens when you elect stupid, inept, asshole, fascists like Trump to a position of power; the world moves on without you, and you're basically fucked. Another complete fuck up by the Grand Old Party of Fuckups.
  • by dujardin ( 622689 ) on Sunday November 15, 2020 @05:00PM (#60728022)
    Brexiters projected that, after leaving the EU, they would set more economic ties with their historic partners from the Commonwealth. Now, there are two large potential partners, Australia and New Zealand, which prefer to turn to RCEP. The lesson, geography still matters. And the UK is more and more at risk of being alone.
    • by ChunderDownunder ( 709234 ) on Sunday November 15, 2020 @07:19PM (#60728390)

      We share their Queen and their flag anachronistically appears in the corner of ours. What relevance is an island on the other side of the world? My ancestors left Britain 160 years ago. Aside from being flooded with BBC programming on the ABC, I have little cultural affinity with the 'motherland'. Australia of the 21st century isn't an 18th century colony.

      The commonwealth is little more than an excuse to join other nations that are crap at athletics once every 4 years as an alternative olympics.

      • You know that. I know that. Unfortunately it seems many Brexiters don't know that.

        Actually, I can well imagine the UK government trying to join RCEP (despite not being anywhere the Pacific). The only thing that would stop them would be if the US objected.
  • by BAReFO0t ( 6240524 ) on Sunday November 15, 2020 @05:12PM (#60728074)

    What is the basis for this view of having to rule the entire planet for your selfish advantage?
    Why not make the world a good place for *everyone*?

    Also, are we expecting too much, when we say that you *must* realize that behavior like that will get you shunned and excluded and disliked and at the first chance (like, during this presidency) stabbed in the back?
    Social Behavior 102.
    I mean there have been studies that show that literally squirrels, crows and monkeys get this!

  • ... China. America had innovation but lacked the motivation to pay for labour.

    China has gobs of labour and has always looked for manpower solutions to do their work.

    A combination of strengths would have been a good marriage.

    As for niggling disparities such as human rights what with America separating children from parents and the Chinese disrespecting Muslims and all that crap, that's a fight for other departments extant to economics to figure out.

    • by robi5 ( 1261542 ) on Sunday November 15, 2020 @06:52PM (#60728308)

      China sucks the air out of whoever partners with them. It infringes on its own neighbors' coastal waters and claims the entirety of the South China sea. They're signing countries into agreements that result in infrastructure buildout by Chinese companies and workers, establishing infrastructure critical for China's trade, meanwhile indebting the recipient country to an extent where they're likely to give up ownership or control of key infrastructure such as ports, which can also be used for military purposes.

      China achieves a lot by throwing its weight around, and its motives and goals are rather clear.

  • by schweini ( 607711 ) on Sunday November 15, 2020 @06:05PM (#60728198)
    The trans-pacific-partnership (TPP) deal that Trump canceled was designed to mitigate this geopolitical move.
  • by hey! ( 33014 ) on Sunday November 15, 2020 @06:30PM (#60728252) Homepage Journal

    But its main purpose was to curtail the expansion of Chinese influence.

    The timing of this agreement isn't a coincidence; Biden's victory lit a fire under China to cement its control over the region before an administration that was less allergic to multilateral agreements took over. Despite Trump's hostility to China, his exclusive focus on bilateral agreements has been very good for China's international ambitions.

    • by khchung ( 462899 )

      The timing of this agreement isn't a coincidence

      The negotiation of this agreement started in *2012*, eight years ago.

      The only possible relationship to the US election is that the Trump administration was finally too occupied elsewhere to try to delay the signing any further.

  • by Anonymous Coward on Sunday November 15, 2020 @07:37PM (#60728428)

    Looking at the other comments on this story, this comment will probably be modded into oblivion. But it's worth considering why India pulled out of the RCEP.

    From the linked article:

    "India’s objections to the trade agreement aren’t hard to understand. For one, India has trade deficits with 11 of the 15 other RCEP members, many of them sizable .... As a country with one of the highest average tariff rates on all imports among RCEP members, India would be among those making the largest cuts to get tariffs to zero"

    "Another major issue for India was the potential that opening up its market to China, another RCEP member, would lead to a flood of cheap Chinese goods crowding out Indian-produced products. India’s trade deficit with China accounts for about 50 percent of the country’s total trade deficit."

    These same issues regarding trade deficits don't just apply to India ...

    Here's the article:

    https://foreignpolicy.com/2019... [foreignpolicy.com]

    • by Aliks ( 530618 )

      Free trade normally benefits all participants as tariffs (in a mature product space) hold back efficiency improvements. If India can't make things as cheaply as China, they are better off focusing on things they can do better. And of course consumers benefit from lower prices.

Children begin by loving their parents. After a time they judge them. Rarely, if ever, do they forgive them. - Oscar Wilde

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