FBI Used Etsy, LinkedIn To Make Arrest In Torching of Philadelphia Police Vehicles (6abc.com) 325
Authorities used popular websites including Etsy, Poshmark and LinkedIn to identify a woman who has since been charged for the arson of two Philadelphia police vehicles during the unrest that followed peaceful protests on May 30. From a report: Lore-Elisabeth Blumenthal, 33, of Philadelphia, is currently in federal custody and had her initial court appearance on Tuesday. According to United States Attorney William M. McSwain, on May 30, two vehicles, one PPD sedan (number 2514) and one PPD SUV (number 1612), were parked on the north side of City Hall. During the violence that began around City Hall following peaceful protests, Blumenthal allegedly set fire to both vehicles.
[T]he FBI says it was Blumenthal's T-shirt and a forearm tattoo that helped authorities identify her. In amateur photos given to authorities, she is seen wearing a T-shirt that says, "Keep the immigrants, deport the racists." They were able to trace the T-shirt back to an Etsy shop, where a review was left by a user that displayed a Philadelphia location. Investigators say open searches for the username led them to a Poshmark user by the name of lore-elisabeth. Open searches for a Lore Elisabeth in Philadelphia led investigators to a LinkedIn profile for a woman who was employed as a massage therapist. [...] If convicted, Blumenthal faces a maximum possible sentence of ten years in prison, followed by three years of supervised release, and a fine of up to $250,000.
[T]he FBI says it was Blumenthal's T-shirt and a forearm tattoo that helped authorities identify her. In amateur photos given to authorities, she is seen wearing a T-shirt that says, "Keep the immigrants, deport the racists." They were able to trace the T-shirt back to an Etsy shop, where a review was left by a user that displayed a Philadelphia location. Investigators say open searches for the username led them to a Poshmark user by the name of lore-elisabeth. Open searches for a Lore Elisabeth in Philadelphia led investigators to a LinkedIn profile for a woman who was employed as a massage therapist. [...] If convicted, Blumenthal faces a maximum possible sentence of ten years in prison, followed by three years of supervised release, and a fine of up to $250,000.
You're being watched by a thousand cameras (Score:5, Informative)
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Tell that to the police during peaceful protests.
https://www.vice.com/en_ca/art... [vice.com]
Tell that to the police (Score:3)
A lot of people are, and the police may just be starting to listen. The politicians certainly are.
Good (Score:4, Insightful)
Hope they sue her for the cost too.
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Why, so that they have a huge debt hung round their neck as well as the criminal conviction and are unable to return as productive, reformed members of society?
I guess it's profit for the prison-industrial complex, so not all bad.
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Our taxes keep going up for all sorts of reasons. Trying to minimize that, I guess. After all, it's tax dollars that will be spent to buy new cars to replace those. That brings their yearly budget up a pretty good deal, as those police cars are fucking expensive due to the equipment that's inside them. When their budget goes up, so do our taxes.
Besides, what was she trying to accomplish by setting fire to 2 police cars? Do we really expect that a thug-mentality is going to take any country anywhere? I
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Didn't you get a huge tax cut a couple of years ago? Or were you not rich enough to benefit from it?
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Why, so that they have a huge debt hung round their neck as well as the criminal conviction and are unable to return as productive, reformed members of society?
I guess it's profit for the prison-industrial complex, so not all bad.
According to one news report I read, she may be looking at $500,000 in fines so the price of a couple of patrol cars is peanuts. Besides, that is called restitution. Isn't restitution one of those pillars of restorative justice that your type is always harping on?
Re:Good (Score:4, Insightful)
She's 33. By the time she gets out of the graybar hotel her birthing days will be in the rear view mirror. Who knows what the state might throw at her? She's been unmasked now and there's a lot of video to pore through.
Comment removed (Score:4, Interesting)
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I wonder why someone would have a hard time reforming when a criminal record and massive debt have no negative consequences at all.
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The system is rigged.
There are inherent financial incentives for recidivism, because these prisoners, even in county jails, are paying for-profit companies that things like phone and commissary service are outsourced to.
The financial incentives for the "justice system" to reduce recidivism are much smaller. While it's true that jails and prisons receive money for lowering the rate of recidivism, they receive much more money for active inmates.
And it's not the inmates that pay for it--they don't have $5 for
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If she is convicted, restitution for the cost of the vehicles will almost certainly be part of her sentencing. Not that there would be any reasonable expectation of her paying more than a token amount each month, but if she ever comes into any money (e.g. from an inheritance), the feds will be there to take their cut.
noobs? (Score:5, Funny)
so evidently the FBI has achieved entry-level 4chan-doxxing skills?
Re:noobs? (Score:5, Interesting)
They have access to plenty of data. After they figured out who she was the easy way, they had to construct a chain of evidence in parallel that is admissible in court. This is known as "parallel construction."
Don't lull yourself by thinking that the FBI is incompetent at tracking people down. They are not.
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so evidently the FBI has achieved entry-level 4chan-doxxing skills?
This IS significant. Apparently they didn't need to break into everyone's iPhone and actually learnt some investigative skills.
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When they start analyzing directions and times of airplane vapor trails in the sky cross-checking them with flight schedules, they'll have achieved the 4chan level.
Nothing changes though (Score:5, Interesting)
I think the amount of effort here was probably overkill, but people need to remember that no matter how peaceful or violent a protest/riot is, if you do property damage, you're never absolved of it.
When there was a Riot in Vancouver, Vancouver PC/RCMP used the ICBC insurance (That's the DMV to you Americans) to identify nearly everyone at the riot and everyone that engaged in property crime was punished to some extent, either through the media (which had a field day with it) or with fines. Some kind of facial recogniction was used in this process, but because ICBC is government owned, the police had express permission to do this.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_Vancouver_Stanley_Cup_riot#Criminal_prosecution
301 people were found guilty out of the 100,000 people who were in the crowd. So 0.3% were responsible for all the property damage.
Now, on the other hand here, was it worth the amount of manpower to go after each and every one of these guys? Probably not. A lesson other cities should have learned by now is to not escalate a riot so that vandals can blend into the crowd.
So this one person who torched two police cars, was basically found because:
- They did something stupid (vandalism in excess of $10,000)
and
- They made it easy to identify (tattoo's, hair dye, clothing, etc. Whatever happened to "masked bandit"'s wearing solid black huh?")
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Right, because only the cops can escalate a situation. I suppose if the cops just stayed in the donut shop everything would have been just peachy.
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Right, because only the cops can escalate a situation. I suppose if the cops just stayed in the donut shop everything would have been just peachy.
There was a story here only two weeks ago that I think you'll find enlightening "The 50 Years of Crowd Control Research Police Are Ignoring" https://news.slashdot.org/stor... [slashdot.org]
Re: Nothing changes though (Score:2)
The comments there do a great job of pointing out why the article is bullshit. I suppose if you ignore the comments and don't think too hard, then yeah, the article is kinda interesting.
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More talking about what's wrong with the police than any discussions about the article.
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Yeah I come here strictly for the intelligent and factually correct comments.
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Yes, actually. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/... [wikipedia.org]
Re:Nothing changes though (Score:5, Insightful)
When all opposition is dead, and all buildings are burned down, all that's left is peace.
Re:Nothing changes though (Score:5, Interesting)
The amount of effort here was a small fraction of the cost to replace two police vehicles. That means it wasn't overkill.
I'd agree with the idea that lives are more important than property, so we shouldn't be shooting (and potentially killing) rioters. But in this case there's a direct economic comparable - the cost to replace the property she (allegedly) destroyed, versus the cost in labor to track her down and arrest her to stand trial. And it's skewed pretty strongly in favor of tracking her down. This stuff isn't free. If you figure replacing the two police cars will cost $100k, then it's going to take the equivalent of a generic American working roughly two years to fix what she broke. Two years of labor which we can no longer apply to improving society in other areas. That's what she (allegedly) robbed society of with her actions - two man-years of productivity.
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However; what I do have an issue with is that as many of you will have had personal experience of the amount of effort the police put into investigating issues relates almost entirely to what they want to put effort into and not what is necc
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Don't forget the cost to society of allowing this sort of thing to go unpunished.
Deterrence is important! It might be one thing to allow the misdemeanors might be allowed some investigative and proprietorial discretion amidst impassioned political happenings, its quite another to allow people to go thinking serious felonies will just be ignored and a demonstration means its some sort of free-for-all.
I don't think if you ask people, "Hey do you want to live in a society where become someone posted something
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Deterrence is bullshit
You are full of shit. Deterrence is very effective. Otherwise nobody would both putting up signs indicated their store as CC-TV etc. Fear of getting caught stops all sorts of crime.
In fact is really basic psychology the more switf and certain punishment is the more effective the deterrent.
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We should have been much more aggressive to head off the rioters to begin with. As of a week ago, the BLM riots resulted in at least 15 people being murdered after the murder of George Floyd. At least 10 of those lives were black. For context, that is one more black person then all of the unarmed black people killed by all cops nationwide in 2019. I have not recently seen a count of how many people have been murdered since then, surely the number has grown. The knock on effect inspired the city of Chicago t
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Stop lying about everything!
A lot of those business are franchises are are in fact owned by members of the local community. For others is a opportunity to get a job, experience and work history that will open doors to future opportunities elsewhere beyond their neighborhood. That type of ownership and general stability/peace in those places is exactly the sort of pathway to the middle class and social mobility these people are demanding.
Marxist shitstains like yourself are who are consistently denying it to
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It's _fortunate_ no one got hurt. Well made molotov cocktails are very difficult to extinguish. These Molotov "mocktails" were much less dangerous, but still pose real risks to fire personnel and innocent people who may be unable to escape a burning vehicle's sparks, flame, or smoke in a rioting crowd.
Half an hour on LinkedIn and Google? (Score:2)
> I think the amount of effort here was probably overkill
They spent half an hour clicking. Maybe an hour.
I suppose you one could maybe make a cogent argument for "I think people should torch police cars". A bad argument maybe, but a comprehensible one.
Arguing that 30-60 minutes sitting on your butt is too much effort to bust someone who has torched at least two of them? I don't buy that.
I say "at least two" because I've known quite a few people who have been arrested and precisely zero of those people
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I think the amount of effort here was probably overkill
I think there was 15min of Google searching to track down an arsonist. Now if they took the iPhones off everyone and started paying an Israeli company thousands of dollars to unlock them while complaining to congress that Apple is the root of all evil, then we can talk about overkill.
Re:Nothing changes though (Score:4, Insightful)
By that logic the police can never be absolved of all the violent crime they perpetrate.
Can't have it both ways, if it's just a few bad cops then it's just a few bad protesters too. If protesters become a mob then so do the police. In fact it's far worse for the police because the protesters are not really organized or trained, but the police are so bare even more responsibility for members of the group.
All this is just a distraction though. The way to stop this kind of crime is to address the issues.
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"no matter how peaceful or violent a protest/riot is, if you do property damage, you're never absolved of it."
Tattoos and scars have been used to identify people for hundreds of years.
No matter how peaceful or violent a protest/riot is, if you do property damage, you're better wear a white or black T-Shirt and no tattoos.
Re: Statute of Limitations takes effect (Score:3)
Rioting is the last resort of people being ignored.
And the first resort of people who are too lazy to do anything on their own, and are simply looking to cause trouble but too chickenshit to do it without a crowd.
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If the police are making poor people poorer, you must be referring to them taking away their drug income?
What the *bleep* are you talking about (Score:2)
Second I'm not an Accelerationist, I'm an Incrementalist. I've said numerous times that the path forward is through peaceful protest and the ballot box, and that a revolution would just end in a military Junta. If you know me well enough to comment as you did you'd know that.
And yeah, we're not supposed to complain about Mods, but who modded this obvious troll post up? Do we have bots hanging around here now or somethin
Statute of laziness takes effect (Score:2)
There are socially acceptable ways of affecting change which usually means making a greater effort (short term and long) than getting into a crowd and burning down a Wendy's.
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There are socially acceptable ways of affecting change which usually means making a greater effort
Just because there's an even harder way still doesn't mean they're lazy.
Regardless of whether you agree with the cause or methods employed, going on a riot isn't a lazy potion nor is it something you can just choose to do unilaterally.
Re:Statute of Limitations takes effect (Score:4, Interesting)
Jeeze. Fox news much?
The person(s) being ignored are the people that have been crying foul over our rotten and corrupt police force for decades AND BEING IGNORED. These are not lunatics. These are Americans who have spent the last 4 decades watching their families and peers get beaten and murdered in the streets in front of everybody over and over again with no consequences. They don't want revolution, just just want equal justice under the law for everybody. Why is this harder to believe than whatever spin fox news is peddling? Who told you those kids wanted a civil war? You actually believe that? Really?
Which is more likely?
Marxists and Maoists managed to get their message to RISE UP to all of those impressionable American people all at once despite pervasive mass surveillance and domestic spying, and it just so happened to line up with overwhelming camera evidence of police misconduct on a massive scale in pretty much every state in the union hitting the internet at the same time-
or
The American people are continuing their proud tradition of destroying property and burning shit down when their government fails them.
The mental gymnastics that Hannity et-all have been leading over the past couple of weeks in mind blowing. It's hard to believe so many people fall right in lock step to it, but the proof is right there in this comment section. You really believe they want to bring down this nations government? These are children tired of being shit on over and over again with no recourse trying to be sure the whole nation hears them this time. All they want to do is consume in piece like the rest of us Americans.
There is video after video after video of police not only killing unarmed people, but video of them lying about how it went down in nearly every instance. LYING. These are the same servants that can and will put you in prison for decades based ONLY on their testimony if you so much as rub them the wrong way. American justice is rotten, and it has been for my entire lifetime. Ask yourself, "Why is it always smart-phone video or some grainy CCTV from across the street when the police kill somebody? How come it's not the body-cam footage from the cameras we made them start wearing last time we caught them on video killing innocent people?" Why is that? How many more damning snuff films and murder clips does it take before people start to understand what the property damage is all about?
Nobody is starting fires and attacking police cruisers because they're Marxists. That's stupid and you know it. They are not lunatics either. Radical does fit the bill though, because watching your friends and family murdered by those in positions of authority for years on end does that. These people have experienced a systematic betrayal at ever level of our system. For decades.
Police can afford a new cruizer for the whole force every year, expect the latest in cutting edge technology, enjoy guaranteed pensions, and start at a solid middle class wage. They have the manpower to commit 3+ traffic officers to pulling over a gandma for driving too slow, but can't be bothered to even investigate property crime. They investigate themselves, cannot be held accountable for laws broken in the course of their duties, and enjoy wide discretion regarding the enforcement of the law, and their sworn testimony is taken at face value as fact, even in the face of contradictory and sometimes obvious evidence to the contrary.
Once you are charged with a crime on the other hand, you will find a justice system wholly unequipped to handle the massive caseload. It runs on obsolete technology. Public legal defense is so over capacity that they barley have time to read your name and case number (and you need these guys because there are more laws than we have books, and half of them are written in latin) and the modus operandi of the whole system is to simply threaten you (the innocent) with complete and utter destruction of your livelihood, utter career destruction, forfeiture of everythi
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>and half of them are written in latin
>the *modus operandi* of the whole system
I see what you did there.
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Burning that car means the city has to replace it. That means spending money on a new car that could have gone to training or salaries. More police on the street means less crime. Just their presence acts as a deterrent
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Yes, it is wrong. It doesn't work. Can you point to a single country that has a successful socialist/communist economy? One that we should mimic here?
And pre-emptively, no - the Nordic model is NOT socialist. Bernie was schooled PERSONALLY about that lie by the PM of Denmark. The Nordic model is a highly capitalist, free-market economy with a heavy emphasis on social net spending by the Federal Government. It's capitalist, with a different focus of tax expenditures (internal, rather than external).
Re: Statute of Limitations takes effect (Score:5, Insightful)
There was a strong Antifa presence in the US in the 1930's and 1940's... we called them the US military at that time.
If you could bring those men into the 21st century, they would gladly pick up truncheons and go around smashing the heads of the current crop of "antifa" lunatics. Given that most of them were pretty racist it's a fair bet that they'd also gladly smash all the black looters, and quite likely many of the peaceful black protestors too. God help you if you tried to vandalise or tear down a Confederate statue in front of them; I doubt you'd be walking away from that one.
You see, at the time and in that context, "antifa" meant "anti-fascist", and was concerned with stopping actual fascism. It didn't have a damn thing to do with racism, sexism, anti-capitalism, pro-communism, gay rights, tranny rights, or any other of the miriad bits of left-wing talking points which get shoved under that umbrella today. And it certainly didn't involve smashing Starbucks windows and stealing iphones in your own country to "protest" some combination of the above.
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A lot of the Confederate statues were not put up until after WW2. They were a reaction to the civil rights movement, designed to remind black people that the ancestors of the white people they were living among fought to keep them enslaved and are considered heroes.
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Interesting how people get attached to the wrong team. It's almost like they want to see the world burn.
Good! (Score:5, Insightful)
Actual detective work. Good for them!
Re:Good! (Score:5, Interesting)
Indeed. This has nothing to do with internet surveillance or privacy or rights online. It's just plain old police work done right. The woman was stupid enough to leave clues all over the place and got caught. It's just that she left clues online, but she might as well have left fingerprints on the scene.
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Re:Good! (Score:4, Insightful)
So? It's still good police work. If it was easy, so much the better.
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There are some lessons to learn here. Don't use the same username or other details in multiple places for a start.
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Fingers crossed that a high percentage of criminals remain stupid.
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Maybe. More likely it is just parallel construction. They have to create a chain of evidence that is admissible in court.
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Tattoos are pretty good for that.
There's also the fact that they have her on video with enough resolution to see a tattoo. All they really needed was to find her.
Massage therapist arrested. (Score:5, Funny)
She was rubbing the police the wrong way.
Re:Massage therapist arrested. (Score:4, Funny)
YAY for the Police. (Score:4, Insightful)
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must have learned a lesson from this sting operation.
So you're saying it was a bait car and they were trying to entrap arsonists?
Re: YAY for the Police. (Score:2)
You clearly don't know what entrapment is
Not bad (Score:2, Insightful)
That's some decent sleuthing, tracking her through all her mouse droppings on social media. Remember, even something completely innocuous can end up leading people to your door.
(And I'm glad she got caught because I don't think people should be allowed to run around setting fire to shit whenever they feel like it.)
As Sid from Toy Story says: (Score:2)
"Where are your Rebel friends NOW? Heh. Heh. Heh."
I suppose this should teach you that if you go after the police, they'll go after you.
But I kinda wonder if they just didn't have a cell phone ping match for the two locations at the times of the incidents, and had to reconstruct a more palatable excuse like Etsy and Linked in. I mean, really, did they do an image match on the shirt against Etsy?
It seems much more likely to have outed her that way without wanting to disclose the capabilities at play here.
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Exactly.
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Made it easy for the police (Score:3, Insightful)
Smarter criminals know how to avoid leaving incriminating evidence behind.
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_That_ is a real problem with US policies for jail time. However, this was not a non-violent drug crime. It was arson. These two already had law degrees as well, so they were certainly aware of the risks. It does make me wonder how many of their former clients were mis-served by an attorney "helping the homeless" who hands out Molotov cocktails in public. How many of her clients exxperienced convenient arson, especially if they were due for eviction?
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Smarter criminals dont break laws. They buy Congressmen to write the laws that make their actions legal and use the cops to enforce their will.
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They buy Congressmen to write the laws that make their actions legal and use the cops to enforce their will.
In a civilized country "buying a congressmen" would be considered its own crime.
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You can't buy congressmen. They only come rental.
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He told me, we don't catch the smart ones.
Precisely.
She would have gotten away with it (Score:2)
Should have listened to her Mother (Score:2)
awesome (Score:2)
Riots. BAD.
Throw the GD rioters into prison. Oddly, a number of them are being shown to be on the far right, not far left, like this woman.
Remember, kids (Score:2)
If you torch a police car, you shouldn't include that on your resume.
Save that tidbit for the second job interview.
It was an open records search (Score:5, Insightful)
As they used to call it, good old fashioned police work
The Pressure (Score:2)
The pressure on her is going to be intense over the next few weeks or months, as she is nailed dead to rights committing a major felony, but the Feds actually don't care about her much and want to go up the chain to get whoever organized and funded these riots. Of course, it's almost 99% certain that she doesn't know anything useful and was just drunk/high and caught up in a moment that will result in her passing away in prison.
Reminds me of Minnesota (Score:3)
A police station in Minneapolis was burned down via arson. Videos from around the area showed a white guy in a distinctive shirt throwing a molotov cocktail into the building [duluthnewstribune.com] along with a second person.
After reviewing a Snapchat account, the ATF found comments from the criminal such as, “These guys have never made a Molotov Rookies,” and “We need gasoline.” Investigators reviewed another Snapchat video in which Robinson can be seen setting a fire in a stairwell inside the third precinct.
Fortunately for investigators, a woman emailed the ATF and identified Dylan Shakespeare Robinson as the criminal in the video. She explained Robinson was from the Brainerd area and she was familiar with him, the complaint stated. She requested anonymity and said Robinson removed pictures from his Facebook account. She said Robinson also posted he “also did AutoZone” and had posted videos on Snapchat. During the rioting on May 27, the AutoZone building across from the Minneapolis precinct was burned to the ground.
The police found the criminal in Breckenridge, CO a few days later. According to court records, Robinson is currently on probation in Crow Wing County for a fourth-degree possession of a phencyclidine/hallucinogen conviction. Robinson also has been convicted of petty misdemeanor and misdemeanor traffic and parking violations in Crow Wing, Ramsey and Hennepin counties.
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Doesn't make any sense to me, but I'm not part of either group so maybe I'm missing something.
As a side note, it looks like Brainerd is a picturesque lakeside vacation town. It's also 95% white, so you know this Shakespeare kid was deeply immersed in black culture and the problems faced by urban minorities.
Hello! (Score:2)
Jaron Lanier (Score:2)
I don't support what she did... (Score:2)
Re: W T F (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:W T F (Score:5, Interesting)
Also (black) lawyers in New York as well...
The 2 Lawyers, the Anti-Police Protests and the Molotov Cocktail Attack
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/0... [nytimes.com]
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Interesting read. Thanks for posting.
Re:W T F (Score:5, Informative)
They modded you troll, and I'm not sure you're not trolling, but you're also not completely wrong, and you're definitely right about the part that people need to wake up and stop it, it's just that these insurrectionists are false-flagging on both sides, and it's hard to pick them out from the organic response that inspires among others who only needed a bad role model to convince them to take action.
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these insurrectionists are false-flagging on both sides
The rule is: when right-leaning people protest and there is video evidence of misbehavior, there were far-right troublemakers in attendance; when left-leaning people protest and there is video evidence of misbehavior, there were troublemakers on both sides.
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lol, never seen this interpretation, it's always been something more like 'fuckin-a'
not that there is a right and wrong way, just seemed funny
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Clearly a Freudian slip.
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Lol, France would like a word with you. Burning cars is their national pastime.
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In this case, it could be argued, she saw a police sedan on fire and sought to help save it by risking her life to remove burning timber from the vehicle. Having no place to put the burning timber she threw it in the back of the sport utility vehicle, many of which have all metal surfaces in the back, safe from fire. I mean she could not throw the burning timber into the crowd. Finding her strategy to save the sedan ineffective she stopped. Perhaps her thinking was very unwise but it was all down the the st
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It doesn't matter if your are 7 https://www.theguardian.com/us... [theguardian.com] or 75 https://www.nbcnewyork.com/new... [nbcnewyork.com] the cops will fuck you up for merely being there. They claim the 75 year old man "fell" but video shows him being shoved backwards while cops step over his bleeding head.