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China The Courts United States

In a First, Missouri Sues China Over Coronavirus Economic Losses (reuters.com) 263

Posted by msmash from the new-billboard-outside-ebbing-missouri dept.
Long-term reader schwit1 shares a report: Missouri became on Tuesday the first U.S. state to sue the Chinese government over its handling of the coronavirus, saying that China's response to the outbreak that originated in the city of Wuhan brought devastating economic losses to the state. In Beijing, a spokesman for China's foreign ministry dismissed the accusation on Wednesday as "nothing short of absurdity" and lacking any factual or legal basis. The civil lawsuit, filed in federal court by Missouri Attorney General Eric Schmitt, alleges negligence, among other claims. It says Missouri and its residents suffered possibly tens of billions of dollars in economic damages, and seeks cash compensation. "The Chinese government lied to the world about the danger and contagious nature of COVID-19, silenced whistleblowers, and did little to stop the spread of the disease," Schmitt, a Republican, said in a statement. "They must be held accountable for their actions."
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In a First, Missouri Sues China Over Coronavirus Economic Losses More

In a First, Missouri Sues China Over Coronavirus Economic Losses

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  • Hopefully They Win (Score:2, Funny)

    by Anonymous Coward
    Hopefully they win and this becomes a trend. Then the US can start seizing their assets.

    • Re:Hopefully They Win (Score:5, Informative)

      by Martin Blank ( 154261 ) on Wednesday April 22, 2020 @12:53PM (#59976782) Homepage Journal

      It will almost certainly get tossed early on. China has sovereign immunity, like all other nations, and US law doesn't recognize an exception for this. Asset seizure could result in a tit-for-tat with US assets (including those privately owned) in China seized. It's a big part of the reason that states generally do not allow suits against other states.

      • Re:Hopefully They Win (Score:4, Insightful)

        by rogoshen1 ( 2922505 ) on Wednesday April 22, 2020 @12:55PM (#59976792)

        it's a symbolic gesture. no one honestly expects this to go to court let alone result in financial reparations.

        • Re:Hopefully They Win (Score:5, Insightful)

          by apoc.famine ( 621563 ) <apoc...famine@@@gmail...com> on Wednesday April 22, 2020 @01:26PM (#59976932) Journal

          Symbolic gesture or an attempt to look like they're doing something to cover up not doing enough?

          • Re:Hopefully They Win (Score:4, Insightful)

            by ShanghaiBill ( 739463 ) on Wednesday April 22, 2020 @03:08PM (#59977328)

            Symbolic gesture or an attempt to look like they're doing something to cover up not doing enough?

            Exactly. This is just the government of Missouri wasting tax dollars.

            If you live in Missouri, you may want to think about this on election day.

            Both the governor and AG are up for reelection in November.

          • Symbolic gesture or an attempt to look like they're doing something to cover up not doing enough?

            Actually it looks like the typical American answer to any problem, so many of us just saw this as a matter of time.

            I'd mod you down, but this is America so I think I'll just file a frivolous suit against you and Slashdot instead. USA USA USA!

        • Re: (Score:2)

          by gtall ( 79522 )

          Nah, it is the Republicans is Missouri wanking off for the alleged president.

          • Re: (Score:3)

            by dcw3 ( 649211 )

            Kinda like you wanking off calling him "alleged"? Disclaimer: The man is an ass, but he's still President.

            The suit against China will be tossed because it goes against existing law. But the suit against the Communist Party has possibilities.

      • Re:Hopefully They Win (Score:4, Informative)

        by Martin Blank ( 154261 ) on Wednesday April 22, 2020 @01:05PM (#59976844) Homepage Journal

        Incidentally, the case is State of Missouri v. People's Republic of China (1:20-cv-00099), filed in the Eastern District of Missouri. It's mirrored on Court Listener [courtlistener.com] via the ReCAP plugin.

      • The idiot is also suing the Chinese Communist Party, which is not sovereign, but I still don't see how that's going to get him anywhere. He lacks just about every requirement to be able to bring a successful case, according to almost every lawyer that's commented on it.

        He's probably hoping for miracle assistance from Congress... where, in a total coincidence, a Congressman from Missouri has proposed a bill that would deny all immunity to China and Chinese entities for COVID-related suits.

  • Shouldn't he be suing Trump? (Score:2, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward

    China locked down Wuhan so hard they welded people's front doors shut, sealing them into their homes.

    Trump didn't even invoke the Defense Production Act to build testing supplies, like the swabs and reagents that are preventing the USA from testing even patients who are displaying symptoms.

    Can't argue China is downplaying it when they shut down their entire economy before we had a single recorded death in the US.

    Trump on the other hand, downplayed it and lied about Covid-19 from the beginning. He's still ly

    • Re:Shouldn't he be suing Trump? (Score:5, Funny)

      by BeerFartMoron ( 624900 ) on Wednesday April 22, 2020 @12:39PM (#59976700)
      They should sue the bats. Guano has some real economic value!

    • Comment removed (Score:5, Insightful)

      by account_deleted ( 4530225 ) on Wednesday April 22, 2020 @12:49PM (#59976756)
      Comment removed based on user account deletion

      • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

        by Vancorps ( 746090 )

        Saying Trump shares a good portion of the blame isn't TDS. Saying he is the only source of blame is not something I see most people doing. China has a role in all this and frankly if Trump was doing his job he would be taking action to hold them accountable rather than trying to white wash his problems by attacking the WHO which provided him ample warning that he chose to ignore because he had no people with any experience on his staff because he fired them saying he can get them back at any time. (Which we

        • Very much agree; the states failed to have sufficient supplies and plans for the event that unfolded, but much of that responsibility is (wrongly) delegated to FEMA. Looking at where we stand today, the government (collectively) was woefully unprepared for a pandemic; ignoring that reality eliminates the foundation to understanding this whole mess. FEMA seems to be well prepared for hurricanes, and maybe earthquakes and extreme weather events... but something that has a national impact in very short order

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by hey! ( 33014 )

      Actually by this argument Canada could sue the US, because most of the virus circulating there came through the US.

    • Shouldn't he be suing Trump?

      The point of a lawsuit is to get a hard redressed. What That Trump may or may not have harmed the State has nothing to do with if China did or did not harm the state.

      Should they also sue the Trump administration maybe but that is an entirely separate question with its own set of arguments for and agent.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by klui ( 457783 )

      Governor is a Republican, so he most likely want to remain in power so has to kiss Trump's ass. Party over country.

  • Schmitt, a Republican. Republican? No way!

  • Probably not legal, and probably not a good idea (Score:5, Insightful)

    by joe_frisch ( 1366229 ) on Wednesday April 22, 2020 @12:41PM (#59976708)

    I don't think its legal for a US state to sue a sovereign country, but even if it were, it seems like a bad precedent. Can you imagine the lawsuits for CO2 emissions, and chemical pollution by the US?

    Even just considering the virus, its likely at lest some countries were infected by people from the US, and an argument could be made that the US containment effort was every bit as flawed as China's.

    I don't see how everyone suing everyone else is going to make anything better. Mostly it will create hostility and reduce international cooperation when its most needed.

    • What if it's exactly that, a ploy so that American companies stop relying on foreign companies for materials and parts? Never let a crisis go to waste, etc.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by AmiMoJo ( 196126 )

      Looking at the history of Europe and the US it seems like if suing other countries becomes a thing we are going to get hit with a lot of historic and current lawsuits.

    • Don't forget the repercussions of the second Iraq war. Basically everything ISIS ever did could be claimed to be the consequence of those first lies about WMDs.

      Also, if Missouri can sue China in a Missouri court, can China sue Missouri in a China court? I'm sure there's plenty of people in Missouri doing really nasty and illegal stuff like watching Winnie the Pooh. Prepare to get sued!

      This is just dumb and meaningless. The only reason I can imagine for doing it is as a misdirection to shift the focus and th

    • the Governor is trying to change the narrative away from his party and his president's terrible response to the crisis and shift blame to China. That's all this is.

      So far it's working. The GOP is ignoring the damage down and the evidence that, had the Obama-era pandemic playbook been followed 90% of the deaths were avoidable.

      The key to politics is Narrative. It's controlling the conversation by forcing your adversaries to answer to your ridiculous claims. Gish Gallop with lives at stake.
    • Normally not by US law and some international agreements. However, the US Supreme Court has said that states can sue foreign corporations and organization.
      The chinese government owns a corporation that owns land in Missouri so they are sueing to take the ownership of that.
      The way they can sue is that they are saying that labs are not covered under the sovereignty laws.

  • Clean Hands Doctrine (Score:4, Insightful)

    by Synonymous Cowered ( 6159202 ) on Wednesday April 22, 2020 @12:42PM (#59976712)

    I'm not sure how lawsuits between nations are handled, but I would think some version of the clean hands doctrine would come into play. Hard to sue someone for not taking appropriate steps when you yourself didn't take your own appropriate steps to avoid the problem. Lied about the the danger? Did little to stop the spread? That sounds like our own country. Of course, we did a few things to try and stop it, but we could've done way way more. Our president lied and denied there was a problem, even as that problem was already beginning to spiral out of control in our country. Yes, China might have delay our response by a month, but what about the 2 months after we knew about it still did nothing significant?

    • There is also the concept of mitigation. Even if someone causes damage to your property, you have to lessen the impact of the damages as best as you can. For example if you get into a car accident with your bumper dangling precariously off your car, it’s your responsibility to at least remove/fix the bumper even if the accident was the other driver’s fault. If the bumper falls off during a drive and causes more damage the courts will not see the additional damage as a consequence of the accident

    • Re:Clean Hands Doctrine (Score:5, Insightful)

      by PsychoSlashDot ( 207849 ) on Wednesday April 22, 2020 @12:58PM (#59976798)

      Yes, China might have delay our response by a month, but what about the 2 months after we knew about it still did nothing significant?

      What I'm hearing is admission of wrong-doing on the part of the United States' government.

      As a Canadian, whose nation has suffered a high burden from "snowbirds" returning from an infected Florida, I thank you for this exhibit which will no doubt be very useful when we sue the US.

      Yes, I'm kidding. One: it doesn't work that way. Two: we're Canada so even if it did work that way, we'd just thank you for letting our elderly vacation in your beautiful nation in the first place, and apologize for not sending more of our doctors to Detroit than we already do. We're all in this together... which is something a pandemic should illustrate nicely. This bullshit lawsuit disregards that.

      • Your post is yet another reason I wish I could move to Canada.
      • The problem with that is the USA and Canada already have agreements about about current immigration, and you would have to show that the USA is not following the agreement and that agreement would have the punishment.
        Otherwise all you are doing is stopping immigration and that just gets you labeled as racist.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by AmiMoJo ( 196126 )

      The most they can do is sue them locally and then try to seize Chinese government asserts to cover what they win. I doubt there are many such arrests in the US but they could go after Chinese companies on the dubious basis of them being effectively state owned (they aren't).

      Of course China could retaliate in kind.

      Other options include a complaint in the WTO but that's also a can of worms that probably wouldn't go anywhere. UN sanctions won't work, will be vetoed.

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by HiThere ( 15173 )

        Can we complain to the WTO? I though we were effectively withdrawn by refusing to appoint judges.

        • Re: (Score:2)

          by hey! ( 33014 )

          That theory would entail a vast expansion of WTO appellate judges over the actions of previously sovereign governments.

          In effect, it would be similar to the way SCOTUS's interpretation of the Interstate Commerce Clause vastly expands the authority of the US federal government over the states.

    • this is a distraction from the governor, his party and his president's extremely poor preparation and response to the crisis.
  • If they want to sue, sue them for economic dumping , pollution, etc.
    As to the virus, they will lose. Why? While China IS guilty of hiding and lying about it, Trump did only 1 intelligent thing and up until CDC/Medical group pushed, he was a total idiot. And then add in the the idiots in the Political Correct idiots of Californa, Washington and esp. New York that lead to most of our worst infections.
    Still trying to figure out how michigan got it so bad. Mi is NOT known for Political correctness.

  • Just a poitcal PR stunt (Score:3, Insightful)

    by larryjoe ( 135075 ) on Wednesday April 22, 2020 @12:50PM (#59976758)

    As the article points out, there is zero chance that this lawsuit will succeed. And as a matter of practicality, it would be disastrous if the US could punish China in US courts because that would mean that China could punish the US in Chinese courts. That would be a true mess.

    International law experts told Reuters that efforts in U.S. courts to hold China liable for the virus would probably fail.

    A legal doctrine called sovereign immunity offers foreign governments broad protection from being sued in U.S. courts, said Tom Ginsburg, a professor of international law at the University of Chicago.

    Furthermore, the article points out the potential motivation for this PR move. As Orwell correctly points out, less than altruistic governments often create strawmen to detract from their own abuses and incompetence.

    Ginsburg said he thought the recent flurry of lawsuits against China serves a political end for Republican leaders facing an election in November.

    “We are seeing a lot of people on the political right focus on the China issue to cover up for the U.S. government’s own errors,” Ginsburg said.

  • The lawsuit includes the CCP, a political party, and individuals. More than a claim of sovereign immunity will be needed dismiss the suit.

  • Just a stunt (Score:3)

    by Cyberax ( 705495 ) on Wednesday April 22, 2020 @12:58PM (#59976796)
    This is just a stunt and an attempt at deflection. The US doesn't respect jurisdiction of any international courts, so this lawsuit will have to be adjudicated in the US. And the US has a federal law that prohibits lawsuits against sovereign nations and their state agents: "Foreign Sovereign Immunities Act".

    If this lawsuit is allowed to go through then think about this: Iraq suing the US for compensation for the botched US invasion on false pretense, Vietnam suing for the Vietnam war, US Navy for downing of an Iranian plane, etc.

    • Iraq suing the US for compensation for the botched US invasion on false pretense, Vietnam suing for the Vietnam war, US Navy for downing of an Iranian plane, etc.

      Indeed! If we open that gate, the bulls will eventually rush back in with a vengeance.

      And include the US supporting Israel's illegal land grab.

  • There's a little thing called The Foreign Sovereign Immunities Act of 1976 which means this joke lawsuit will be tossed right out of court after Missouri has wasted taxpayer money.

    But hey. Red meat for the base. Priceless.

  • That means other countries can use the same tactic to sue the USA over the 2008 financial crisis!

  • "The Chinese government lied to the world about the danger and contagious nature of COVID-19, silenced whistleblowers, and did little to stop the spread of the disease. They must be held accountable for their actions."

    The above quote needs slight modification, "The United States government and Pres. Trump lied to us about the danger and contagious nature of COVID-19, silenced whistleblowers, and did little to stop the spread of the disease. They must be held accountable for their actions."

    While there is muc

    • Re:Right Idea, Wrong government (Score:4, Interesting)

      by Sebby ( 238625 ) on Wednesday April 22, 2020 @01:18PM (#59976908)

      While there is much to criticize about how Chinese the government handled the coronavirus, the fact is that the problems with the coronavirus in the United States have been caused largely by Trump's actions or lack of action. It is Trump and the U.S. government that should be sued.

      I would argue that because they had the chance to remove him during the impeachment, but decided not to, the GOP is now directly responsible for Trump's actions.

  • How dare you, sir! How dare you say something true!

  • Foreign Sovereigns Immunity Act (Score:3)

    by hey! ( 33014 ) on Wednesday April 22, 2020 @01:21PM (#59976920) Homepage Journal

    Basically says you can't sue foreign governments for doing or failing to do government-y things. State owned enterprises engaged in commercial activities are exempted from the act, so you can sue those.

    The reason for the act is to give the US government cover when it tells other countries they can't sue *us*. If we allowed suits to proceed against China, the Chinese citizens, or even companies, would surely have the right to sue the US government. Remember the Wikileaks "Collateral Murder" video? While I think Wikileaks grossly misrepresented the actions of US attack helicopter crew, those crews would be open to lawsuits from the families of the journalists killed.

    The AG obviously knows his suit is going to be dismissed, unless he thinks he can get FSIA declared unconstitutional, but that's a Pandora's box that I'm pretty sure no American politician wants opened.

    So why is he doing this? It's intended as a distraction. What it's a distraction from I leave up to you.

  • People don't understand lawsuits (Score:3)

    by wakeboarder ( 2695839 ) on Wednesday April 22, 2020 @01:22PM (#59976922)

    If you sue, it doesn't really mean anything, people don't understand that. Suing means you have enough money to hire a lawyer and bring a case to court. The case could and probably will be thrown out. If you want to generate headlines, then this is a good way to do it. Now if they won this case, then that would be significant, call me when that happens.

  • This could be a gold mine, because if China doesn't show up for the court date, the judge might make a summary ruling against them and then China would have to go on the lam, maybe hightail it down to Mexico for a few years til things blow over. Then get a different haircut and come back and just try to blend in.

  • Hopefully, they will have to prove China released the virus deliberately or showed negligence. That means they would have to show that China knew how well it spreads, the reaction of foreign nations to shutdown economies over it. I mean, we have copies of the virus now and we still aren't sure how contagious it is, whether masks work ..how aerosolable it is .. we don't know any of that. Also, unlike the virus CO2 and other noxious pollution is provable, yet countries especially island nations affected can't

  • Good luck with that. Stop believing every distration, misdirection, contradiction or ie that happens to fall out of Lord Trumpkins mounth...
  • This is a toothless threat done by a Republican Governor for media attention.

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