Man With 3-D-Printed Gun Had Hit List of Lawmakers, US Says (nytimes.com) 277
A Dallas man was sentenced to eight years in prison on Wednesday after the authorities caught him with a partially 3-D-printed rifle and what federal prosecutors described as a hit list of lawmakers in his backpack. From a report: The man, Eric Gerard McGinnis, had been under a court order that prohibited him from possessing a firearm when he was discovered to have had the partially printed AR-15-style rifle in July 2017, according to a statement from the United States Attorney's Office for the Northern District of Texas. Mr. McGinnis, 43, was charged with possession of an unregistered firearm and possession of ammunition by a prohibited person, prosecutors said. A jury later convicted him on both counts.
Prosecutors said in their statement that police officers had arrested Mr. McGinnis after hearing three shots he had apparently fired in a wooded area just outside of Dallas. They also discovered a list in his backpack labeled "9/11/2001 list of American Terrorists." The list included the office and home addresses of "several federal lawmakers, both Democrat and Republican," the statement said. Prosecutors did not reveal the names on Mr. McGinnis's list, but at the sentencing hearing on Wednesday they disclosed that a forensic analysis of his electronic devices suggested that Mr. McGinnis "had a strong interest" in James T. Hodgkinson, the man who the authorities say shot and wounded Representative Steve Scalise and several others at a congressional baseball practice in June 2017.
Prosecutors said in their statement that police officers had arrested Mr. McGinnis after hearing three shots he had apparently fired in a wooded area just outside of Dallas. They also discovered a list in his backpack labeled "9/11/2001 list of American Terrorists." The list included the office and home addresses of "several federal lawmakers, both Democrat and Republican," the statement said. Prosecutors did not reveal the names on Mr. McGinnis's list, but at the sentencing hearing on Wednesday they disclosed that a forensic analysis of his electronic devices suggested that Mr. McGinnis "had a strong interest" in James T. Hodgkinson, the man who the authorities say shot and wounded Representative Steve Scalise and several others at a congressional baseball practice in June 2017.
Alleged? (Score:5, Insightful)
I didn't realize there was any doubt about this.
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There is doubt. The security detail could have been paid to take the shot and tossed him out as a fall guy. Is it the most probable thing? No but it is within the realm of reasonable possibility. Him being dead means it will never be investigated. Unless you did it or witnessed it yourself, it is alleged.
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Re: Alleged? (Score:2)
Actions versus guilt (Score:2)
He's innocent until proven guilty in a court of law, no matter the amount of pre-trial coverage
There is no meaningful dispute as to whether he was the shooter. Guilt or innocence in a court of law is an entirely separate discussion. He could in principle be found innocent despite there being no dispute as to whether he committed the acts for which he was arrested.
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He'll never be found innocent in a court of law, they don't assess innocence in a court of law just whether or not he is guilty.
That said, there is meaningful dispute as to whether he was the shooter or not. Basically it all comes down to the word of the security detail who aren't above suspicion anymore than the police. The security detail themselves could have taken a payout and he could be a fall guy.
Now before you go saying anything about crazy conspiracy. I'm not alleging or asserting any of that or tr
Presumption of innocence (Score:2)
He'll never be found innocent in a court of law, they don't assess innocence in a court of law just whether or not he is guilty.
They absolutely do assess innocence in a court of law. In fact it is the default presumption under the Universal Declaration of Human Rights [wikipedia.org] and is firmly established from the US Constitution via the 5th, 6th, and 14th amendments as well as extensive case law. The entire point of a court is to determine guilt or innocence insofar as that is possible. If the accused is not found guilty then by default they are considered innocent. You can get pedantic about the distinction between "not guilty" and "innoc
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Which makes it even more interesting that there was no problem with releasing his name for everyone to know, but the list of politicians on the hitlist was not revealed.
Why name one criminal and protect the others?
Oh. Sorry. Alleged criminals, all of them innocent until proven guilty, of course.
Re:Alleged? (Score:4, Interesting)
"Which makes it even more interesting that there was no problem with releasing his name for everyone to know, but the list of politicians on the hitlist was not revealed."
If he is over 18 it is a matter of public record but accusations of crimes really shouldn't be. It allows for exactly what you see here trial in the court of public opinion and the destruction of careers over charges which are ultimately dismissed or for which parties are found not guilty.
Re: Alleged? (Score:3)
Someone has been watching law & order while they eat their pudding. As a matter of fact, unsurprisingly, there is no constitutional guarantee to a phone call. Further, not all states have any laws regarding them. In most jurisdictions whether you get a phone call is completely left to the discretion of the police. The reason for this should seem obvious, is you could call someone and warn them that the police are onto them.
Additionally, due to a supreme Court ruling, you are only granted access to a l
Re:Alleged? (Score:5, Informative)
I"m a bit puzzled about the charge they convicted him of..."unregistered firearm".
I thought this was TX, and I don't believe you have to 'register' your firearms there, right?
Also, as the law stands federally and in most states, you can make your own firearms, and as long as they are not NFA items (short barreled shotgun, short barreled rifle, etc)....you do NOT have to serialize them, or register them or tell any government entity that you have built and own this weapon.
And for more firearms, like the AR platform...the only normally serialized part of the gun is the lower receiver....which you can 3D print, somewhat these days.
Anyway, with that in mind, I'm curious of the law they convicted him of on that front.
Now, as I understand it, he's not allowed legally to posses any firearm, and that's cool.....but I hope they didn't bend a law that's not applicable to convict him, that presents a dangerous precedent.
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Prior convictions (Score:2)
I thought this was TX, and I don't believe you have to 'register' your firearms there, right?
Texas generally is pretty relaxed about gun ownership (shocking I know) but in some cases [wikipedia.org] they do require registration according to federal laws.
Specifically
"Texas Penal Code Section 46.05 requires that "explosive weapons", "machine guns", "short-barrel firearms", and "firearm silencers", as defined in Section 46.01, be "registered in the National Firearms Registration and Transfer Record maintained by the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives or classified as a curio or relic by the United St
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Ah...now THAT is different!!
That indeed would be a NFA item, and that's a federal charge.
If he'd not been stupid, and just put a pistol brace on it, he'd have not gotten charged with that.
I know, very stupid distinction, but important for you if you are a gun owner (speaking more for legal gun owners here).
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or maybe he made it full auto/select fire.
Now that I think about it, I bet that's the case and the news agencies who don't know better stated like this.
It's less that full auto/select fire is illegal, you just have to pay tax and license for such.
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He made it into short-barrel rifle
Re: Prior convictions (Score:2)
He. Inverted it to auto, but only fired three shots?
Why go through the effort?
All he did was physically shorten the gun as I understand it.
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It's less that full auto/select fire is illegal, you just have to pay tax and license for such.
As long as it was manufactured before May 19, 1986. If it was made after that, then it's illegal to possess at all under 18 USC 922(o). This single change in law is why a beat-to-hell, non-functional full-auto MP5 will still set you back $25K or so.
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I think what happened was that he was legally barred from possessing firearms due to a 2015 court order. Didn't matter how the firearm was acquired, he wasn't allowed to have it due to prior convictions.
That would seem to be a different violation, prohibited person in possession or similar.
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He assembled it into a short-barrel rifle which fell under the requirements for an NFA under federal law and Texas Penal Code Section 46.05 as you quoted above.
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From TFA:
"The man, Eric Gerard McGinnis, had been under a court order that prohibited him from possessing a firearm when he was discovered to have had the partially printed AR-15-style rifle in July 2017"
I know it's tradition and all, but it was in the second paragraph and would have taken you less time to read than it did to type out that long answer.
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Interesting, a post that is basically quoting TFA to present some factual information is considered trolling... Because it's a thread about gun rights and it suggests that there isn't actually a conspiracy to manufacture fake charges against a gun owner.
Some people have really lost the plot, and the argument due to their need to suppress any information that contradicts their narrative.
Either that or the last sentence triggered a particularly sensitive snowflake.
Re:Alleged? (Score:4, Interesting)
Actually there is another post further down, which I also replied to, that also quotes TFA to make the same point and which was also modded "troll".
It really does appear to be the gun toting snowflakes, a very strange bunch to be sure. That and I've got a mod stalker who systematically mods everything I post as troll until they run out of points, even random jokes about Amazon and the like...
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https://www.justice.gov/usao-ndtx/pr/federal-jury-convicts-grand-prairie-man-firearm-charges
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Security detail at the game allege they saw him start shooting, engaged him, police joined. Police believe the detail, therefore "authorities say."
It still has to be proven in a court of law.
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He is presumed to be innocent, that is SUPPOSED to be the reason. You aren't supposed to defame people, that is the reason there are damages!
Besides, in some cases defaming the dead could cause damages to surviving relatives and business interests and you could be liable for those.
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Wait... are you saying MAGA hat wearers are automatically considered guilty regardless of evidence, or are you saying MAGA hat wearers automatically consider others guilty regardless of evidence?
The former... At least in the press. Don't believe me? Google Covington and look at the news coverage. Those kids where literally just standing there with MAGA hats on, didn't do anything wrong and got raked over the coals in the press on the testimony of the actual aggressor, even after the full story came out. I hear they are planning to sue multiple people and media outlets over defamation and I hope they win.
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Yes, but the MAGAts do not thing there is anything wrong with that.
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Or maybe he just understands the difference between the builder and their hammer. By your logic we should ban hammers if the popcorn guy at the movie theater builds a shoddy house with it.
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No one is trying to ban hammers, in this scenario. They are trying to make sure that guy and otehrs just like him don't get to own one.
3d printer? (Score:2, Informative)
I suspect this was a machined lower - possibly using a ghost-gunner.
CNC machines, while computer-controlled and similar in utility, are not really 3d printers. A 3d printer is generally an "additive manufacturing" device, whereas a CNC machine is subtractive.
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There are examples out there of true 3D printed AR lowers (the part actually considered the firearm (serialized by manufacturers)...that you can bolt an upper and other parts kits too and have a functioning AR.
However, while novel....I'd not trust o
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"But the 3D printed stuff is getting there.....and you can make one that functions today."
Sure, not that either saves you much in the end. No matter how much the ATF (or whatever their latest acronym is) says otherwise there is a lot more to a gun than a lower and those parts add up to the cost of the gun.
You might save a little bit of cash if you want a very non-stock gun by buying the parts you want in the first place but usually not as much as you think and certainly not vs buying a non-ar style rifle.
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Also there are 3D printers that print in other materials than plastic and they are used by gun shops that do custom work all the time. They aren't the cheap consumer ones but they are certainly out there.
The thing that is lost here is that it isn't hard to make a lower for any number of rifles. This isn't some magical 3D printing makes it possible thing. For maybe $300 you can put together a simple foundry that will let you cast anything from aluminum to bronze. Achieving great skill takes a lot but getting
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And for the price of a finished high-end AR-15 lookalike, you can buy yourself an old (but still quite functional) Bridgeport or other big, solid knee mill, and make whatever you want out of a solid piece of brass, steel, or whatever your tooling can handle. Your point is well taken - people have been making stuff in their home shops since forever, and used mills and lathes (even multi-axis CNC) are quite easy to come by nowadays for a surprisingly little amount of money. Aside from making stuff that will
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What kind of plastic though? 3d Printers that the public has access to usually use PLA stuff that is rather weak, essentially the same stuff as milk jugs. I've seen polymer components that while looking and feeling like plastic are considerably tougher.
Unregistered Rifle? (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Unregistered Rifle? (Score:5, Insightful)
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The firearm itself was illegal -- short barrelled rifle.
A twofer.
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"shall not infringe," doesn't apply.
No, you should look to Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives instead of the 2nd amendment to the US constitution.
As you know full well, there are lots of "arms" that civilians can't keep and bear. A short barrelled rifle is one.
Re: Unregistered Rifle? (Score:3, Insightful)
Re: Unregistered Rifle? (Score:5, Informative)
Registration of those *is* required, even in Texas...
Re: Unregistered Rifle? (Score:4, Interesting)
Much like sawed-off shotguns or machine guns, these sorts of firearms have extra regulations attached to their legal ownership: you must pay a $200 tax, pass an expanded background check, seek local law enforcement approval, etc...
As for why it matters enough to slap a bunch of extra restrictions on it.... your guess is as good as mine. Best theory is in the 1930s it was thought that rifles and shotguns were being sawed off by criminals for easy concealment for their use. Whether this was a response to real crime or just crime shown in the movies is open to argument. Oddly, the Supreme Court ruled that such short-barreled rifles weren't constitutionally protected due to them lacking a military usefulness.... (oddly, it is now the "military style" guns being targeted for extra restrictions...)
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https://www.justice.gov/usao-n... [justice.gov]
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The 3D printing thing is just for show, because the current gun control agenda is targeting 3D printing. The actual charge regarding unregistered rifle as I understand it was that he was found in possession of an unregistered short-barreled rifle (SBR). This is a violation of the National Firearms Act of 1934.
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FTA: "The man, Eric Gerard McGinnis, had been under a court order that prohibited him from possessing a firearm"...
I mean, it's not like the summary was long. That sentence was right at the top.
Not about registration (Score:2)
Texas has no gun registration laws
Not entirely true. [wikipedia.org] Texas law is fairly relaxed on gun registration but there are some types required to registered to comply with federal law. Gun registration was not the issue here. He wasn't allowed to possess a gun of any description due to a 2015 court order.
and it's not illegal to manufacture your own gun or gun parts...
Generally true though here are some legal issues [wikipedia.org] and they cannot make one that cannot be detected [wikipedia.org] by metal detectors or similar scanning devices. Despite personal use manufacture largely being permitted legally it does not permit someone prohib
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The texas statute requires you to follow federal law. Only in the most literal sense could you call that a Texas requirement. Texas doesn't have the right to exempt people from federal law. It's a clarification as much as anything.
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That isn't universal, there are still certain types of weapons that have to be registered federally. You can't build your own machine gun without registering it or as applied here your own short-barrel rifle.
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Re:Unregistered Rifle? (Score:5, Informative)
You are mistaken.
https://www.atf.gov/firearms/qa/does-individual-need-license-make-firearm-personal-use
Does an individual need a license to make a firearm for personal use?
No, a license is not required to make a firearm solely for personal use. However, a license is required to manufacture firearms for sale or distribution. The law prohibits a person from assembling a non–sporting semiautomatic rifle or shotgun from 10 or more imported parts, as well as firearms that cannot be detected by metal detectors or x–ray machines. In addition, the making of an NFA firearm requires a tax payment and advance approval by ATF.
[18 U.S.C. 922(o), (p) and (r); 26 U.S.C. 5822; 27 CFR 478.39, 479.62 and 479.105]
https://www.google.com/search?q=laws+on+making+your+own+firearms&oq=laws+on+making+your+own+firearms&aqs=chrome..69i57j0.6230j0j8&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8
In the US, under Federal law, it is legal to make a firearm for your own use. It has to be a firearm that is not regulated under NFA. This means it can't be fully automatic, a short barrel shotgun, a short barrel rifle, or a disguised gun of some sort.
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Whew. My Trebuchet is safe.
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Whew. My Trebuchet is safe.
Only if you're using metal nails.
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https://www.pennlago.com/are-f... [pennlago.com]
There’s another possible scenario in which there is no serial number, and that is in the case of a home build. As of late, there has been a 80% or 60% receiver complete craze. In these particular cases, the gun cannot be sold or transferred and must only be for the manufacturer’s own personal use. If it is a home build manufactured by yourself, using your own equipment, for your own personal use, no serial number is required.
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Registering guns, serials, transferring ownership, etc.
There is no fed law requiring any of that. I know most states don't either, maybe Cali and NY. All the serial is good for is for reporting stolen guns in the hopes the police accidentally find them.
Also, there is paperwork/background check required for buying new guns, there is none for a private(non business) selling guns.
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"Registering guns, serials, transferring ownership, etc.
There is no fed law requiring any of that."
This is entirely inaccurate. There are most definitely federal laws surrounding gun manufacturing, registration with the BATFE, the transfer of firearms, and the recording of transfers. Those laws allow for exceptions and cases where the rules are relaxed but the laws exist and in many cases the exception is merely the BATFE's choice for there to be an exception.
"Also, there is paperwork/background check requi
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100% WRONG and Fake News. If you can legally own it. You can build it. You can make as many firearms as you like so long they are for your personal use and not for sale. ZERO markings are required from the ATF. A simple Google search will tell you that you are full of BS.
https://www.atf.gov/firearms/q... [atf.gov]
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The goddam mother "fake news" sumbitch card.
It's tiring and redundant. I don't like it, so quit already.
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" You can make as many firearms as you like so long they are for your personal use and not for sale. "
Whether you were manufacturing for personal use or not has nothing to do with you or even reality and everything to do with a BATFE determination. If you have an arsenal of 200 AR's you manufactured for "personal use" and a BATFE agent sees it you are screwed. The could be the case with three if he doesn't like the look of you. It isn't wise to push too far under a 'right' that vanishes the instant a BATFE
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That is correct however with a few exceptions that require a special tax arms manufactured by you for your own personal use fall under an exemption from those requirements. There is no limit to the number but it's up to the BATFE if your intent was personal use so anyone with a brain won't expect this to protect racks of identical rifles made to outfit their militia and even 3 identical rifles is probably pushing your luck if you don't have at least that many shooters in your household.
Similarly, you could
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You must have never heard the term "80% lowers". Purchasing the receiver part that is 80% competed is just a block of metal / plastic according to ATF because is't not capable of doing anything. There's a huge market in completing and finishing these. Again, you can't sell them.
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Your knowledge is shallow.
It's not a huge industry. DD is barely afloat. They sell 3D printer files via thumb drives at $10, only in the US (and some cool merch) and that's it.
Ghost Gunner is probably what you're thinking about and those are expensive with low volume sales.
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His argument may have been weak but his premise was correct. It is not illegal to manufacture a firearm for personal use without a serial #.
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It's not a huge industry. DD is barely afloat.
DD isn't the whole industry. Ask Polymer80 how well they're floating...
They sell 3D printer files via thumb drives at $10, only in the US (and some cool merch) and that's it.
Ghost Gunner is probably what you're thinking about and those are expensive with low volume sales.
You do realize that the manufacturer of the Ghost Gunner CNC machine is Defense Distributed... right?
Your knowledge is shallow.
Yours is apparently worse...
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Tell that to the dudes at Defense Distributed selling CNC mills.
You own that, right?
You've broadened the scope because you know you're wrong about DD.
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You only need to register with the ATF when building certain types of firearm and when transferring ownership. Registering with the ATF requires a serial #. Most of the rules people are thinking of regarding serial numbers actually apply to firearms that had serial numbers which have been removed.
In practice you might be able to get away with registering one and keeping only one or two around at a time and just using the same serial. It'd be illegal but it might pass under the radar. The key thing to rememb
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Maybe but if you are actually doing it for personal use it isn't like you are going to be machining more than one or two.
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"What is odd is why Texas is charging him with that when NFA violations are federal offences."
Texas has a statute that requires you to follow the federal laws. Technically when you violate the federal requirement you also break the Texas one.
OMG (Score:2)
here we go again with the 3D printed guns crap...
Phew, that was close (Score:2)
That could've been the end of legal unrestricted 3D printing right there!
Curious (Score:2)
Where's he get the gun, since it was illegal for him to buy it? Will the seller be charged?
The 3-D printed aspect is stupid, he 3-D printed attachments to a gun, the headline leads one to believe he 3-D printed himself a gun, but hey, it's a msmash story, so inaccurate/misleading headlines are the norm... sadly.
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Where's he get the gun, since it was illegal for him to buy it? Will the seller be charged?
The 3-D printed aspect is stupid, he 3-D printed attachments to a gun, the headline leads one to believe he 3-D printed himself a gun, but hey, it's a msmash story, so inaccurate/misleading headlines are the norm... sadly.
He 3-D printed the lower receiver, which is the part that has the serial number and is the part that is considered a "firearm" from a legal point of view.
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"The Jackel" where the antagonist cuts up a chopping block to make a nylon zip gun
I missed that one. I've seen Day of the Jackal and The Jackal. Neither of which involved a zip gun. In The Line of Fire (Eastwood/Malkovich) featured a non-metallic, custom made double barreled derringer.
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You also can buy an 80% lower and finish it will a drill for like $100. Even with a drill press it is cheaper than a 3D printer... and more likely to actually work.
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Contradiction: Did he have a partially "printed" (rather "milled") firearm or was it a completed one? If it was an incomplete firearm, how did he manage to fire it?
He printed the lower receiver, which is the controlled part of the rifle. He then completed assembling the rifle using commercially produced parts. Hence "partially printed" = not all the parts were 3D printed
Producing a firearm (milling the receiver) is not illegal (https://www.atf.gov/firearms/qa/does-individual-need-license-make-firearm-personal-use) - but possessing one is. He was convicted of illegal manufacturing among other things. Why?
The article doesn't say he was convicted of illegal manufacturing, but according to another article, he *was* convicted of possessing a unregistered Short-Barreled Rifle. Manufacturing an unregistered SBR is usually a separate offense.
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He would have printed more, but the cyan cartridge ran out and the printer wouldn't print the rest of the gun.
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"Producing a firearm (milling the receiver) is not illegal (https://www.atf.gov/firearms/qa/does-individual-need-license-make-firearm-personal-use) - but possessing one is. He was convicted of illegal manufacturing among other things. Why?"
He printed a lower and assembled it into a short-barrel rifle, an SBR can be made for personal use but does require a serial, registration with the BATFE and paying of a tax as an NFA firearm. He was nailed by Texas rather than feds because Texas has a statute requiring y
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The system doesn't work that well. The NICS system allows for blocking thousands of requests all over the map every day. Following up would require the handful of federal agents to manually investigate. The brutal reality is there just aren't that many people killed in this manner, if it weren't a highly politicized thing we wouldn't hear about every case where someone is probably even on local news.
Not about logic (Score:2)
How can someone who live in a properous country such as the US, end up like an idea like printing a gun and killing a few lawmakers....
Crazy people are in every country. The US is no exception. Prosperity does not change this fact.
I mean, you have to realise that doing that wont solve anything.... even if you killed a few lawmakers they would be replaced by someone else who would most probably continue his work.
Logic does not mean much to someone who is mentally unstable or otherwise incapable of reason. Stop trying to figure out how he logically could have behaved the way he did because logic had little to do with it. His brain was not functioning in a healthy manner.
The real problem is that it's very difficult to identify people like this in advance in an accurate, objective, and fair way so that you can keep fire
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Crazy doesn't separate by nation. There are always crazy people. always.
Re: More "my violence is really speech" progressiv (Score:2)
He had a bipartisan hit list, he honestly could just have been fed up with politicians no matter their party affiliation.
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I believe it was the being killed while allegedly shooting a congress critter part which led to search. I could be wrong though.
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A better headline would have been:
"Today a man was imprisoned in Texas for the unlawful possession of an unregistered NFA firearm along with a list of potential targets which included lawmakers."
The 3D printed component isn't particularly notable.