AT&T Is Spying on Americans For Profit, New Documents Reveal (thedailybeast.com) 161
AT&T has been secretly spying on its own customers, the Daily Beast reports. The revelation comes days after the top carrier announced plans to purchase Time Warner. The report claims that AT&T ran a program called Project Hemisphere through which it analyzed cellular data from the company's call records to determine where a given individual is located and with whom they are speaking. The New York Times reported about the program's existence in 2013, but it was described as a "partnership" between A&T and the government for fighting narcotics trafficking. But today's report, which cites several classifed documents, claims that AT&T used Hemisphere for a range of other functions -- and always without a warrant. From the report:Hemisphere is a secretive program run by AT&T that searches trillions of call records and analyzes cellular data to determine where a target is located, with whom he speaks, and potentially why. [...] Hemisphere isn't a "partnership" but rather a product AT&T developed, marketed, and sold at a cost of millions of dollars per year to taxpayers. No warrant is required to make use of the company's massive trove of data, according to AT&T documents, only a promise from law enforcement to not disclose Hemisphere if an investigation using it becomes public. These new revelations come as the company seeks to acquire Time Warner in the face of vocal opposition saying the deal would be bad for consumers. While telecommunications companies are legally obligated to hand over records, AT&T appears to have gone much further to make the enterprise profitable, according to ACLU technology policy analyst Christopher Soghoian. "Companies have to give this data to law enforcement upon request, if they have it. AT&T doesn't have to data-mine its database to help police come up with new numbers to investigate," Soghoian said. AT&T has a unique power to extract information from its metadata because it retains so much of it. The company owns more than three-quarters of U.S. landline switches, and the second largest share of the nation's wireless infrastructure and cellphone towers, behind Verizon. AT&T retains its cell tower data going back to July 2008, longer than other providers. Verizon holds records for a year and Sprint for 18 months, according to a 2011 retention schedule obtained by The Daily Beast.
It'll only get worse (Score:5, Insightful)
Obama (Score:5, Informative)
I sure wish Obama was actually going to stop this kind of thing like he promised long ago :(
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hahahahhahahahaahahahahHAHAHAAHAHAHAAA
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If only congress didn't become the House of No....
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If only Obama would ever negotiate for anything instead of refusing to even speak to the other side.
Politics is now and always has been about negotiating with people you don't agree with, not shutting them out.
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I sure wish Obama was actually going to stop this kind of thing like he promised long ago :(
Just like he promised to stop GMOs from being forced upon unsuspecting consumers... just like he promised to bring more-transparency to the public... just like.. oh I give up.
Promises shmomises...
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"Just like he promised to stop GMOs from being forced upon unsuspecting consumers...."
But he has stopped the oil pipelines, so your beloved Stone Age probably isn't as far away as you think.
One more administration like this, and the only Democrat energy source left will be the rapidly spinning body of Franklin Roosevelt.
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Hope and Change, add a little Uncle Tom Obama and voilà Despair and Stagnancy.
Re:Obama (Score:4, Funny)
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A little refresher [slashdot.org] for you. AT&T spying on behalf of the government is nothing new, and had the whistle blown a long time before Snowden.
Obama used Bush's warrantless wiretapping as a club against Bush's policies when running for election in the primaries, then voted for telco immunity after the primaries and facing McCain -- because he didn't want to look weak on security and he no longer needed to appease his base. While he's given lip service to the Constitution and the privacy of citizens, once he g
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Al Franken is too busy protecting us from Pokemon Go. It's way sexier than this complicated mess than only a few even notice.
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The average person's response to this, assuming they even hear about, will be along the lines of "... So?"
And yet, those same nitwits will continue to think that they embody creativity and freedom, even though they toe the corporate line and won't question authority. Hey, they're getting XX G of data for $$, that's all they're worried about. Consumerism is working it's magic.
I'm glad I don't use AT&T and dropped Verizon a few years back. Can't be sure, but I bet CREDO [credomobile.com] will be very unlikely to do this so
Re:It'll only get worse (Score:5, Informative)
Credo is an MVNO [wikipedia.org] running on the Verizon network. Therefore, Verizon can do exactly the same monitoring of your calls as they do with those of their own customers.
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Credo Mobile MVNO dumps Sprint for Verizon [fiercewireless.com]
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The bigger question is does anyone really believe a business does something for free? Or do they pass the costs around?
Show me one business for profit or non profit that works for free. You can't as they don't stick around very long.
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There's a difference between demanding compensation for a legitimate police request vs developing a spying system and actively trying to sell it to the police.
The first is not wanting to work for free, and entirely understandable.
The second is doing work they didn't even have to do based on some very very questionable practices. They could have chosen to just not do this. They wouldn't be "working for free" since _not_ doing something involves zero work.
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as a business gets larger, the goverment wants to force their way on them, to get some kind of 'goody' that they can use for some kind of evil purpose.
I'm 100% convinced, corps in the US are practially universally evil; and as they get larger, they get more evil.
in their defense, they probably have no choice. 'an offer you cant refuse' is likely made to them and they concede.
but still, I distrust corps as much as I distrust our own government.
in my ideal dream country, no company would ever be allowed to g
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The bigger question is does anyone really believe a business does something for free? Or do they pass the costs around?
Show me one business for profit or non profit that works for free. You can't as they don't stick around very long.
Google, as an individual it's never cost me a dime and with the free programs like Google Earth, and showing me how to root my Motorola Xoom tablet and such, I have no problem with them collecting my searches.
Google has done so well that everybody is into data collection as AT&T shows. And why facebook isn't a place to visit, they collect everything, and Mark Zuckerberg has proved time and time again he can't be trusted.
You do have a valid point; it's just Google is unique in the way they make their for
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That's actually a pretty interesting list. Beyond the obvious ones, I think we tend to forget that the data aggregators like Acxiom are always there, operating in the background to scoop up any information they can to sell. And that a company like Uber would sell your location and any other data related to timing/pickup/dropoffs at the drop of a hat. Whatsapp got exposed recently for privacy violations but guess that falls under the umbrella of Facebook. Then outside of the privacy realm you have pay-fo
too big? (Score:5, Insightful)
I'm guessing too big to fail also means too big for jail.
Sometimes I just lose faith.
Re:too big? (Score:5, Informative)
I'm guessing too big to fail also means too big for jail.
Nobody is going to jail because none of this is illegal. That is the problem.
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"I will *MAKE* it legal!"
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Nobody is going to jail because none of this is illegal. That is the problem.
So they excluded data on any call where either party is potentially a doctor or other healthcare provider? Side channel attacks disclosing private medical information could be HIPAA violations.
Re: too big? (Score:4, Insightful)
Don't worry, if anyone does come forward with details of wrongdoing, they'll be prosecuted like the rest of the whistle-blowers.
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Nothing is illegal until proven by a court.
And I bet you want Trump to select the next supreme court justice.
Thanks for playing.
Re:too big? (Score:5, Insightful)
Most spying is done for profit. A small percentage is actually done for civilian protection.
The only reason you want to "lose faith" is because you aren't thinking objectively. You believe that the government should be full of true statesmen, who have the best interest of the majority at heart. As nice as that would be, there is no rational reason to expect that it would be so, nor does it doom us when this is not so.
In order to attain power, one must defeat rivals who want that same power. The most effective means of doing this is to lie to the public. Therefore, those who lie effectively and trenchantly are the ones that win elections. Most true statesmen who run are filtered out by this alone.
After that, in order to execute on a political agenda, one must co-operate with other politicians. Our government was designed to make it impossible for a rogue politician acting alone to accomplish much of anything (see: dictatorship). Politicians learn very quickly (really, they already knew) that co-operation requires compromise. No one will work with an absolutist who refuses to yield to their concerns. Furthermore, the people with whom they must co-operate are people who have the moral rectitude and mental disposition to be masterful liars (see above). The end result is simple: one must sell one's soul to the devil in order to get anything done.
We will never "fix" this by encouraging people to vote. Nor by writing letters. Nor should this be a problem for us.
If we are truly devoted to putting statesmen in office, we will need to fundamentally boost the intelligence of the general public (so they can smell the lies, and reject them). There is no practical means to do this in the short run, so we should stop crying about it and move on.
In the real world, we can recognize the following facts:
1) An evil governor still has the interests of the state at heart, inasmuch as his level of power is a function of the prosperity of the state.
2) All politicians are ultimately still held accountable to the court of public opinion, so the more we can keep visibility on their actions, the more beneficial to us those actions will be.
3) All politicians are for sale (see above): so the next most effective means of getting them to act as desired is to fund the appropriate lobby.
It has always been this way. The only difference now is greater awareness of it. And the world is better now than it has ever been before, because of this.
We can use evil men to good ends, if we try.
Re:too big? (Score:5, Interesting)
You've made the best case I've seen in a long time as to why Government should be limited. Not sure that was your intention though. ;)
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Power is dangerous, so the more power gets concentrated in a small group, the more dangerous that group becomes. This is why anything with power should be limited.
It also happens that those who have power are universally focused on using their power to obtain even more power, so keeping a powerful body limited is no simple task. Especially not when their power is over a large group of people who would rather not deal with any of that.
Knowing how power moves is still important, regardless of what limits ar
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Government already is limited via the 4th amendment, Wiretap Act, and other statutes.
Now that's funny right there, I don't care who you are!
Two words: "Parallel construction".
The US government has become powerful enough and the power concentrated enough away from the States and citizens to the federal government that those limits no longer have any real meaning or force behind them except as propaganda for the masses.
Rule of Law is no longer applied relatively (nothing is perfect) equally nor universally. Far from it, as a glance at recent headlines proves. Laws in the US currently apply to
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Oh so that's why they keep trying to defund the schools!
They already have nice fences up around the local schools here all they are missing is the razor wire.
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Actually, what is the difference between a prison and a US public school?
1: Both have fences.
2: Both have commissioned/sworn peace officers to drag anyone misbehaving off in seconds to minutes for additional criminal charges.
3: Both teach that might is right, be it physical, or having your bros.
4: You learn nothing upon getting out.
5: Oftentimes someone is there due to no fault of their own, just a bad system.
6: They often lead to higher security facilities (the schools to prisons track is a lot bette
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The whole 'in order to attain power' bullshit is why the government & country is failing.
Why do we have to be the 'best'? Why can't we just be a good country? Everything else just feeds that bullshit.
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we will need to fundamentally boost the intelligence of the general public (so they can smell the lies, and reject them)
1935 Germany & 2016 USA couldn't see lies (on both sides), NOR reject them if they did see them.
So how are we supposed to get around having assholes in power?
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1) Find genetic source of "being an asshole"
2) Undertake Eugenics program to eliminate (or sterilize) those with the "asshole gene"
3) Rejoice, you've Progressed to a better world for all!
Before it's too late (Score:1)
It's time to add encryption to our ham radios, double down on the tin foil, and cut the cable.
If a tree falls in a forest, the government already knows before it hits the ground, especially if no one is around.
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http://www.amateurradio.com/en... [amateurradio.com]
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https://tech.slashdot.org/stor... [slashdot.org]
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I am not a licensed ham. I cited the article to indicate that other people have also *thought* about the idea. I have no intention of doing this.
My original comment was a tongue in check.
It was a sarcastic attempt to portray such an act of desperation as the only option left; to place emphasis on how truly bad things have become that the only way to achieve a measure of privacy was to resort to encrypting a communication method not owned and controlled by a corporate entity.
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2) Tin foil does nothing useful when it comes to this type of thing.
3) Wired transmissions are probably the most secure way to communicate.
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It seems more and more like the only method of wireless communication left is ham radio... and to protect what little is left of our privacy, encrypt it. I know that's not realistic, as the process requires shared keys, but such blatantly ridiculous methods do appear to be our last hope.
Tin foil is not a solution, but it may give a false sense of safety - which is all we have left.
"Cut the cable".. aka end one's subscription to cable TV... Time Warner stands out...
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That said it is difficult to say that any telecommunications device is actually secure. The hardware it-self could be configured to make
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This story isn't about AT&T knowing the content of your communication, but only with whom. The Metadata.
If you're concerned that the simple fact you exchange messages with another specific person or site could set the black helicopters on you (or them), then a wireless broadcast, decryptable only by your pre-arranged partner will protect you better than encrypted, wired communication.
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This story isn't about AT&T knowing the content of your communication, but only with whom. The Metadata.
Just like the Yahoo story was only about metadata except that it wasn't and Yahoo has been searching content for the Feds. With parallel construction preventing court challenges, legislated telecom immunity, and lack of an exclusion remedy for most searches, internet and phone communications have no 4th amendment protection.
EAE - Encrypt Absolutely Everything
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IIRC wired is not safe either google found out the hard way that their leased point to point fiber lines weren't private.
Which is why they are now using encryption for traffic on even their own lines.
Re:Before it's too late (Score:5, Informative)
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"It is not for general personal communications or commercial use."
Sad, that this may be one of the few ways to communicate that is not controlled (via centralized servers and corporate interests). Obviously w/o encryption it's not secure. Shows how competently modern communication methods have all been turned into one massive surveillance operation to both provide profit and power to the 'ones behind the curtain'....in the name of public safety of course, it's for the children!
Well, well, well.. (Score:2, Informative)
Memo to all of you who are saying they're tired of the 'conspiracy theory' nuts: It's not a 'conspiracy theory' anymore, now is it? Also, don't allow yourself to think for a single moment that they're not collecting more data than even this article reveals, or that they're not doing more with all that data than it reveals.
Also, Memo to the 'I'm not doing anything wrong, so I have nothing to fear' idiots: You helped create this dystopia we're liv
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Memo to all of you who are saying they're tired of the 'conspiracy theory' nuts
I challenge you to get one reply here from someone that didn't think AT&T was mining user data. We all know this.
You're never going to stop it. It's absurdly easy to track you with today's technology and in 50 years it's going to be literally impossible to stop. Moreover, you are going to be tracked by organizations not beholden to your own government.
You should focus on limiting how that information can be used. I don't care if Aetna has data that I was within 50 meters of a store that sells drug parap
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Stop them from collecting data on us, AND stop them from using what they already have.
And we live in a world there we don't have infinite resources, infinite time, and infinite influence.
I DEMAND that any 'data' you have on me be DELETED
(Imagine a flurry of action as the Russian and Chinese governments read this and spring into action to abide by your demands)
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You're a beta-as-fuck pussy if you're not even willing to say out loud that you want justice.
Someone posting anonymously telling me I don't have the guts to say what I believe in out loud. Sweet irony. I needed the laugh, thanks.
I understand though you need to protect yourself. Your mom can't find out that you are using foul language on the internet or you'll have your XBox privileges taken away.
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Reversing this is pretty much impossible. The only effective solution would be a government ban on privacy invasions like this, but since they're benefiting as much if not more than anyone else, they sure as heck won't make that sort of law.
And the companies definitely won't stop the practice voluntarily -- its way too profitable.
And "voting with your dollar" won't work either. When your only options are a range of companies that universally all engage in these practices, your dollar's vote isn't worth sq
Discovery (Score:5, Interesting)
"only a promise from law enforcement to not disclose Hemisphere if an investigation using it becomes public."
Aren't they required to disclose this kind of thing in the discovery phase of the prosecution? Anything less would be blatantly unconstitutional.
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Correct, which means that every single offender convicted as a result of this now has a legitimate claim to appeal based on "fruit of the poison tree".
Re:Discovery (Score:5, Informative)
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two words: Parallel Construction
Ding ding ding.
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"only a promise from law enforcement to not disclose Hemisphere if an investigation using it becomes public."
Aren't they required to disclose this kind of thing in the discovery phase of the prosecution? Anything less would be blatantly unconstitutional.
I am not a lawyer (and you are not either, it seems). However, I do know the law is a complicated thing, and when private individuals take action no warrant is required.
For example, if I walk into the police station with a video I took of my neighbor attacking her husband with a knife in her home, the defense can't claim that the video was recorded without a warrant. The state took no action to retrieve this data, so no warrant is needed. In this case AT&T is acting as a private individual to collect th
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It's not just about the warrant. If the neighbor was charged, the police would have to hand over the video to the defense and explain how they got it, even if no warrant was needed. For this data they are required to keep the source secret.
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Aren't they required to disclose this kind of thing in the discovery phase of the prosecution? Anything less would be blatantly unconstitutional.
If they do it right, then the prosecutor will not know so there will be nothing to turn over.
Extremes (Score:2)
AT&T spies on everyone else: Now I'm OUTRAGED!
This is 2016 (Score:5, Interesting)
This is 2016, I would have thought the very fact our telecommunications companies (and everyone else who has the ability to) are spying on us should be common knowledge, not news.
Here's a quick flow chart that applies to all big companies and organisations that you associate with.
Can they spy on you ------No-------> They're buying data about you from someone who can.
.|..
.|..
.|..
Yes.
\./.
They are spying on you.
but this is NEW (Score:2)
What is NEW here is not that they could collect that metadata or that they let government benefit from it. What is new that this time it is a BUSINESS plan, a service for sale where they do the government's work for them and then sell the results to whomever they can find to sell the service to.
Assuming they follow the law (like anybody would go to jail) do we even have any laws that would apply to a private corporation data mining their customers and then selling the analysis?
REMEMBER after Snowden when t
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You need to work on your ASCII art skillz.
Dear Narcos (Score:2)
Please use the SIgnal app instead of Whatsapp or the phone, then the morons will perhaps stop spying on us.
Profit? Who is paying? (Score:5, Interesting)
Lets say I want a list of all cell phone customers who regularly commute to a certain location in Langley, Virginia. And a list of the numbers that they call. And then I want a list of all of the phones worldwide that call these same numbers. I now have a pretty good list of all of your agents*. And if I am the FSB [wikipedia.org], it's a hell of a lot cheaper to buy that data from AT&T, Verizon and others than try to collect it myself. Thanks a lot, useful idiots.
*It's a bit more complicated than this. But link analysis tools can dig down through quite a few nodes to recover useful information.
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But, but, but... according to the occupants of a certain location in Langley, Virginia, it's only meta-data and therefore harmless, does not require warrants to obtain, and is so innocuous that really, it tells them nothing. And despite telling them nothing, they are willing to work really hard and spend a lot of money to get it!
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But we know that the H1-Bs working for the telcos are all trustworthy, patriotic folks who would never betray their country to Russia!
Companies keeping records... (Score:2, Insightful)
Since when is this NEW? All major telcos keeps records of activity by their own customers. How the hell do you think they even bill you in the first place? They just arbitrarily make up numbers!? (oh wait, we're not talking about Comcast here, are we)
For every single person I've had to help service and get into their phone information through their carrier, the carrier's web site for that account has a full detailed history of every single incoming call, outgoing call, time of call, duration of call, and ot
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What's new is that they're selling the data to law enforcement you ridiculous twat.
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What's new is that they're selling the data to law enforcement you ridiculous twat.
Yeah, I thought "read fail" when I read the GP. I was waiting for the technical description of routine system logging and routing to come to the point of TFA, and it just ended. I did appreciate the caps on the holyshit, though.
Re:Companies keeping records... (Score:5, Informative)
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The way it currently works: Bob wants to buy something from Frank. To facilitate this, he gives Frank his personal cell phone number. Mary wants to contact Bob. She finds o
AT&T was #4 in 2012 (Score:2, Informative)
They followed the money http://www.phonearena.com/news/Wiretapping-is-common-practice-heres-how-much-carriers-charge-law-enforcement-agencies-for-it_id28755
I already assumed this (Score:2, Funny)
I mean when I pick up the phone I already say hi to the NSA person, speak my location, who I am talking to, and the purpose of the call. Doesn't everybody do this?
How is this not wiretapping? (Score:2)
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Wiretapping means listening to the wire, or in this case, the signal of the audio conversation. That wasn't done.
Instead, the metadata details were sold, meaning things like what time a call was made, where the tower locations were, the duration, and so forth.
Not wiretapping, but still ratting out customers.
Stallman right yet again (Score:5, Insightful)
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He's been saying for years that our phones are being used as spying devices. Most wrote it off as an extreme view, even those who are sympathetic to Stallman's causes.
Do you have any evidence for this? Because tracking data wasn't exactly a secret, but I think most people put up with government (and corporate) intrusion on privacy as the government being government, and what are you going to do, gotta live your life, convenience, etc. I didn't see anybody calling Stallman out on this.
They tie this into facial recog pics from DMV (Score:1)
In case you thought you were safe, all of this is tied into the facial recognition systems.
Wear hoodies. Use reversible layered clothing with dazzle patterns.
Use burner phones.
Use a voice mod and talk in a different pitch and pattern than usual.
Crowd Funded Secret Busting (Score:2)
Should start a crowdsource fund to entice those who work with or have direct access to information like this to " leak " it out for all to see.
Put bounties out on secret hardware, manuals, source code, etc.
Nothing kills secrets faster than large amounts of cash. Once the rewards are large enough, nothing is safe.
So, let me get this straight... (Score:5, Insightful)
AT&T can determine where you are, and who you are talking to, and all sorts of super-spy stuff like that. But they can't figure out where robocalls are coming from and stop those? AT&T can find me, but they can't find fucking Rachel from Card Member Services?
Make it make sense to me, AT&T. I challenge you.
Re:So, let me get this straight... (Score:4, Interesting)
Re:So, let me get this straight... (Score:5, Insightful)
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I don't know who you are. I don't know what you want. If you are looking for a sucker, I can tell you I don't have money. But what I do have are a very particular set of skills; skills I have acquired over a very long career. Skills that make me a nightmare for people like you. If you take me off your list, that'll be the end of it. I will not look for you, I will not pursue you. But if you don't, I will look for you, I will find you, and I will kill you.
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Duh? (Score:2)
Any device / service that CAN gather data about you IS gathering data about you. The profit motivation for doing so is just too high for any corporation to turn it down. Even if they aren't immediately monetizing is, they are gathering it. Doing so is like making a deposit into a bank account.
Is it time to break up AT&T (again)? (Score:3)
Then, like idiots, we allowed AT&T to gradually reconstruct itself. "It will be OK this time" we maybe thought. "They've learnt their lesson. No more abusing their position and size."
Of course AT&T is spying on us for *profit*. (Score:2)
Did you expect them to spy on us out of prurient interest? It's not like AT&T is an actual person...
To protect yourself (Score:2)
You must *assume* carriers aren't honest. You don't know everyone who has access to the data that profiles you. You don't know their intentions, their contacts, their back-room deals. Do you really *want* to know? Do you think it would make a bit of difference?
Use strong encryption wherever you can. Encrypt your phone storage. Use anonymous VPNs and Tor. Be vigilant. Do whatever defensive measures you can do to protect yourself and the privacy of you and those you care about. Laws are meant to be broken. Th
Actually this would be okay (Score:2)
Outside dense urban areas, AT & T can't get a signal through to save its life. Now if Verizon spied on us, I would be concerned.
The freedom to spy domestically (Score:2)
The color of law, Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act and past "partnerships" are back with new laws to get around the Fourth Amendment protections.
"NSA Can Access More Phone Data Than Ever" (Oct 20, 2016)
http://abcnews.go.com/US/nsa-p... [go.com]
"The USA Freedom Act ended the NSA's bulk collection of metadata but charged the telecommunications companies with keeping the data on hand."
"... the pe
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Hey...those phone cops play hardball!!!
And just remember.....
When everyone is out to get you, paranoid is just....
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Then you have nothing to hide, citizen.
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You'll take it up the ass and like it because we're fighting narcotics trafficking.
I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the blanket of the very freedom I provide, then questions the manner in which I provide it! I'd rather you just said thank you and went on your way.
Re:burner phone with no plan (Score:4, Insightful)
Cross-check the IMEI of the phone against store inventories for when it was sold; pull CCTV camera footage for the store; put your face through face-recognition
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Then they'll just link the numbers you call to your phone. They'll have your contacts mapped to your location. They'll also have your traveling behavior due to the path of cell towers you connect to.
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Except AT&T uses corruption to push the competitors out of the so-called "free" market.