Malaysia Blocking Websites Based On Political Content 121
An anonymous reader writes: A few days ago Slashdot carried a piece of news from Malaysia whereby [news] websites based in Malaysia must be registered. Now comes the news that Malaysia is actively blocking websites which carry political opinion contrary to those of the ruling elite.
Granted, Malaysia is no US of A nor Europe, but the world must understand that Malaysia is the only country in the world where racial apartheid laws are still being actively practiced — and have received endorsement from the ruling elite which has controlled Malaysia for the past 58 years.
(Wikipedia lists some other candidates for modern-day apartheid in its entry on Contemporary segregation.)
Who's down with TPP (All the homies) (Score:1)
Gotta make Malaysia look all nice and 'stuff'.. Or was that Burma?
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those in power
Without an army, where is the power?
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Without an army, where is the power?
You don't need a whole army to make people disappear in the night.
Oh look, 3 minutes between comments now. But I haven't been modded down. So did Slashdot detect that I was posting something objectionable and toad me? Or maybe an "editor" did it manually? Or has Slashdot just been fucked up again? Ah, now 4 minutes. So I presume I am now on the 5 minute delay, probably for my anti-Zionist comment. What the ever-living fuck, Slashdot? This is how you treat commenters whose karma is typically pinned to your p
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Archduke Franz Ferdinand. Look how well that worked out.
Why link.. (Score:1)
To a news article where you have to "answer a question" to see it. There must be dozens of reputable news sites with the story and you link to an unknown "bignewsnetwork"? Does slashdot even have anyone checking submissions?
Re:Why link.. (Score:5, Informative)
It's mentioned here: http://www.bbc.com/news/world-... [bbc.com]
Boycott, Divest, and Sanction (Score:5, Interesting)
If Malaysia practices apartheid, why is the civilized world not boycotting, divesting from, and sanctioning this country? This is what happens to countries that practice apartheid. It worked on South Africa and it can work again on Malaysia.
I wasn't even aware of this until I read the summary, and I read a lot of international news.
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The difference is that in South Africa, European colonists practiced apartheid against the older indigenous racial group. In the case of Malaysia, the laws favor the Malay people and their culture, who have been there for thousands of years, against ethnic Indian and Chinese who have only been there for a mere few hundred. Arguably Malaysia is not the only country with such apartheid cultural views that go all the way to being ratified in one law or another.
Rather than a cultural stir-fry a melting-pot is e
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"while its difficult to convert away from Islam to another religion..."
It's more than difficult, it's illegal. Converting away from Islam in Malaysia is punishable by life in prison.
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That is not true. A person wishing to leave Islam in Malaysia may apply for a certificate to do so from the Shariah courts - this is a legal right. In practice attempting to obtain such a certificate can lead to bureaucracy, red-tape and persecution. But a person can't be legally imprisoned for desiring to renounce Islam.
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To all, if you really want to know the truth, please go find out what has happened to Ms. Lina Joy, a Malay Muslim who converted into Christianity and ended up being forcefully locked up and is being brain-washed by the Malay regime.
The following link tells all !
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/... [wikipedia.org]
The link does not say that. It says that it is a difficult bureaucratic process. The link also states that 16 people have before renounced Islam and converted to another religion.
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Don't you ever get tired of spreading your lies, jblues??
I have absolutely no interest in defending any government, anywhere. Someone (you?) stated that renouncing Islam in Malaysia is illegal and punishable with life in prison.
I stated there is no such law in Malaysia, (that I know of) and that, according to the law a person can obtain a certificate to renounce Islam as a religion, after which they are free to marry and convert to the faith of their spouse. I also stated that while the law exists, in practice a person seeking such recourse can encounter red-tap,
Treatment of Ex-Muslims in Malaysia (Score:1)
http://www.wikiislam.net/wiki/Persecution_of_Ex-Muslims_(Malaysia)
http://michellemalkin.com/2006/08/25/the-persecution-of-lina-joy/
Whatever anyone says that Malaysia is an open-minded country, please consult the links above
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That is a lie as anyone with any experience with Malaysia knows.
Half a century ago it was a "Legal right" for black men to vote & yet we all know that the entrenched power in southern states refused to respect it. Stop pretending that Malaysia respects the rights of it's minorities and apply real reform to sanction the abuses.
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That is a lie as anyone with any experience with Malaysia knows.
I lived in Malaysia for a few years, and openly opposed racial and cultural discrimination, even though expressing such views could be dangerous. I still live nearby in another part of SE Asia.
Half a century ago it was a "Legal right" for black men to vote & yet we all know that the entrenched power in southern states refused to respect it.
And the solution to that injustice was to start with the facts: The legal right was there. But there were thousands of other problems to solve before it could mean something. Many of those problems have been solved, and some yet remain. Its a continuum in any part of the world. Newly industrialized nations have somewh
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Your claimed knowledge & experience of Malaysia should have led you to denouncing their apartheid & discrimination of minorities yet you attempted to minimize the indefensible with half truths. The fact is that fiction of having rights when the government refuses to respect them is worse than having no rights at all as it crushes the hopes of those who were deluded by the lie.
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I was simply pointing out the law, not saying I agreed in any way with a flawed execution, or with the law itself. I thought this would've been obvious. I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but even in countries with a high human development index, the law is not always fair and upheld flawlessly, let alone in newly industrialized nation like Malaysia, which is on the good side of the middle. [wikipedia.org]. The country where I live now is lower down, but that's another story.
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Perfect application of laws isn't the subject. Wide-spread regime-condoned discrimination of minorities is. No other nation with anything approaching their level of economic development practices Apartheid in the 21st Century as Malaysia does.
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It's more than difficult, it's illegal. Converting away from Islam in Malaysia is punishable by life in prison.
What are you talking about? The issue is someone stated that its illegal to convert away from Islam in Malaysia. It is not. I corrected that.
You seem like someone who cares about social issues, and that's great. But if you want to help, start with the facts.
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Dude,
Apartheid means "separateness."
You can accuse Malaysia of doing numerous bad things to minorities, but keeping them restricted to their own little Chinese-only ghettoes and persecuting anyone found out late at night is not one of them.
It is impossible for an activist to effectively fight a problem if he can't even articulate what the problem is in a sensible fashion.
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You are objectively incorrect. I don't have to pull out the resources, everyone can do on her own. There are camps where people who desire to leave the Islamic religion are interned for weeks, and months. They are called 're-education camps' where some Imam tries to convince them of the beauty of the religion.
True, it is not life imprisonment, but against basic western understanding.
Be aware of professional spin-doctors !! (Score:5, Interesting)
One thing about Malaysia is that the ruling regime invested very heavily in professional spin-doctors, with their history-twisting lies, in order to hide all the ugly truths
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/media/tv-radio/special-investigation-tv-company-takes-millions-from-malaysian-government-to-make-documentaries-for-bbc-about-malaysia-2338813.html
The message I am replying to is one of those beautifully crafted piece filled with fact-twisting half-truths
To jblues,
Please spread your bullshit somewhere else!
The Malays did not have 'thousands of years' of history nor culture on Malaysia.
The Malay arrived in Malaysia from Sumatra of Indonesia. Even their own history books have noted that Parameswara, a defeated prince from Sumatra, running from his enemies, landed on the shore of the Pininsular, some six hundred years ago
However, there is one people in Malaysia who can trace their ancestry back to thousands of years - the Orang Asli, the TRUE aborigines
All of you are invited to find out the truth for yourself, instead of listening to professional soothsayers paid by the racist regime which is now controlling Malaysia. I will only include a single link, to illustrate how the Orang Asli are being treated by the Malay authority ---
http://www.culturalsurvival.org/ourpublications/csq/article/orang-asli-odds-with-nation-state
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Professional spin doctor? Dude, you can look me up - I earn my bread writing code.
I was simply stating that addressing the problem of apartheid views/laws might be even more challenging in Malaysia than in South Africa because people tend to be more apologetic to the group that claims a longer cultural tradition. In fact I can think of some other countries where these kinds of views are seen as virtuous, whether or not they're legal. My own birth country is an example, and it makes me reluctant to bring my
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Take a look at actual info on these people.
The Proto-Malays actually started out as Orang Asli of the southern half of the country. The current Malays [wikipedia.org] may be descended from the Duetero-Malays who appeared in the Iron Age. Even the northernmost (and thus furthest from Sumatra) Sultanates have histories dating back to the 630s.
OTOH, the Chinese and Indian minorities on the peninsula are largely, but not entirely, a product of British Imperialism in the 19th century.
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Alas, wrong. But you couldn't necessarily know.
The Malays have not been lving there for thousands of years, 90 % are migrants from other places as well, from the overcrowded Malayan Archipelago, driving out the native population ('Orang Asli'), who are in these days more often that not forcibly converted to Islam.
Yes, you fell for the usual official propaganda, which is shown by your second last sentence. That's the official formulation. Don't forget that in 1969 close to 2000 people were slaughtered in a l
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Ah right, I stand corrected on that one.
It appears that the Orung Asli people that you refer to are in fact 18 different ethnic/tribal groups. I live in the Philippines now - a nation consisting of 7200 islands, so there are many tribes here too. One such group are the Negritos who are related to the Semang Orung Asli (according to wikipedia). Sadly they are also persecuted here. Life expectancy at birth is just 27 years vs the national average of 70.
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You sure about the "not thousands of years" thing?
Because their northernmost Sultanate, which would be the last one conquered by immigrants from the Archipelago, claims a history back to 630 [wikipedia.org]. Granted this starts with conquests by a Sumatran, but as an American I have to say 13 or 14 centuries is a pretty damn long time to occupy a piece of land. In many countries in Europe the dominant ethnic group of 650 AD or so is not the dominant ethnic group today, and nobody claims the Romanians have no right to their
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I'm sorry for you, but you did a thorough research without finding the relevant semantics. Otherwise you could not have titled me as 'UMNO propagandist', because what i wrote is exactly the opposite of what UMNO is trying to instill into the population. Namely, that the Malays are the indigenous population. If I had much more time on my hands, I'd find out some academic articles, including by prominent Malaysians, that this is exactly not the case (Malays being there for thousands of years).
Alas, you are al
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Two points:
1) This is an American site. Most readers don't actually believe the world existed before July 4th, 1776. Which means we really do not give two shits whether the Malays got there in 1500 or 630. Either way it's before time began, so they get to call it their country.
2) By making this argument you are helping UNMO. That is why I called you an UNMO Propagandist. As an American the only place I hear people make complex arguments about whether such-and-such a place was inhabited by such-and-such an e
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I am sure that there are many American "Indians" who would agree with you, and look back at their hundred-odd centuries of inhabiting the Americans before being kicked out by white-skinned Europeans.
I thought that the American site is slashdot.us, and that this is the international site. There were no passport checks on entry.
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I am sure that there are many American "Indians" who would agree with you, and look back at their hundred-odd centuries of inhabiting the Americans before being kicked out by white-skinned Europeans.
Read some Native American history.
Yes, they were here on the continent before us, but they were always moving around on the continent. Take the Crow. They were driven West several time, ending up on the Great Plains. By the early 1800s they owned a significant tract of land centered on Montana. In 1851 they lost that land to the Sioux. They have technically never ceded an acre to the white man because by the time the white advance caught up to them they were homeless.
The Pueblo are pretty unique in being ab
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Was just going to say this. Similar to the reason Singapore gets a free pass on being a faux-democratic authoritarian dictatorship - its just too nice of a place for businesses.
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And Israel. We give them weapons and money instead, because they are our partners.
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Fix what? It is very convenient for politicians and allows businesses to make higher profits. What's the problem?
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It's not apartheid, just institutionalized racial discrimination. For example:
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How's that strategy working in North Korea, Iran, etc.?
The collateral of such a strategy puts a heavy toll on the citizens. I would rather prefer that countries freeze assets of officials and restrict their movements internationally.
By the way, I am in agreement that international communities can help persuade such countries to enact fairer policies.
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Partly because it's not Apartheid. The only state that is anything nearly as bananas legally as Apartheid* is Israel, and the Israelis actually allow quite a bit of inter-communal contact if you were lucky enough to be on their side of the border after the war of '48. The tricky bits come in the Occupied territories, where the Israelis make an argument that works fine for a few years. If you're militarily occupying another country you do get to run things, and they don't get to vote, but OTOH if it's lastin
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I have to ask... Umm... I don't disagree with your sentiment but what are you on about? This is about Malaysia which, unless I am wrong - I've never been, is somewhere in the South Pacific. African-Americans are, well, probably not persecuted all over the world considering they're in America. That's the "American" part of that expression. Elsewhere they're just "Africans."
So, yeah... I really don't know where you were going with this. Apartheid means something about kept apart, ala segregation, if I recall
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I was kind of assuming they were going with the African part but your way works too.
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You're wrong, Malaysia is between the Indian Ocean and South China Sea.
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Isn't that considered the South Pacific? I think it's near the south of Vietnam? I'm not the greatest at geography (obviously). That's not the Pacific still?
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You know... I have no idea where the ocean ends and it becomes a sea. That and well, as I said, I've never been to Malaysia. I've been, kind of, in that area but not to Malaysia. Maybe I should try that Google thing and learn where those borders are? I'll probably just forget. :/
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It's an AC.
I suspect he was trying to start a flame-war, and he picked on black guys because a) it's traditional for Americans to pick on black guys, and b) the Malaysian government is known for affirmative action programs, which are associated with black guys.
Malaysia's apartheid (Score:1)
Officially sanctioned apartheid in Malaysia has been in place since the 70s. My family and I were placed under house arrest by machine-gun toting police in '79 because my father refused to play along with the government's desire to rob him of his company. We had a friend in the government who attempted to protect us but was murdered in a faked helicopter crash, at which point we decided to leave and were smuggled out with false papers by the British embassy.
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Even though you are AC, I correct you:
Your assumption is possible, but in reality it is a bunch of oligarchs that hide behind Islam in order to con the simple people, who are, as we have learned in other posts, forced to be Muslims. This is - by the way - expressed in the law of the land.
So what? (Score:1)
Al Jazeera and the government sponsored news from NK are blocked from being aired in the USA. Stuff is blocked because of USA DMCA law. Images are blocked because of US definitions of underage. Even when the sites aren't in the USA or hosted in the USA or owned by anyone with anything IN the USA.
So, really, until the USA gets its act together, I really REALLY don't give a shit what other countries do to block stuff on the internet IN THEIR OWN COUNTRY ONLY.
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I know Dubya and co were targeting them and Reuters for being the only independent press operating in Iraq instead of being embedded under contol of the US military, but I'd have thought that within the US borders at least, your Constitutional Right to Free Speech was still being upheld.
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He's probably referring to the trouble they had getting cable operators to agree to carry them. That was a problem when they launched,. but at the moment they seem to be available in half the country.
Some confusion here. (Score:1)
Should people in glass houses throw stones?
the ONLY country in the world...? (Score:1, Interesting)
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Don't be such a anti-semite. Going against the state sanctioned narrative supporting Israel and the white genocide will only get moded down.
You were very wise to post anonymously.
Re:Small correction (Score:5, Informative)
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Israeli currency is labelled in both Hebrew and Arabic [wikipedia.org].
Re:Small correction (Score:4, Insightful)
There may have been black doctors, politicians et al living in 1950s segregated America but anyone that would claim blacks weren't heavily discriminated against because the US Constitution supposedly protected them is living in an alternative universe. Claiming there is no institutionalized discrimination in Israel is even more absurd. It's blatantly obvious that many Jews in Israel have been extreme nationalists that are engaged in a slow pogrom to not only eject non-Jews but to continue to expand Israel's borders.
That said, there is certainly racism in Palestine too and that shouldn't be swept under the carpet nor should the double standards in much of the Arab world that obsess on Israel.. .then don't look at how they treat non-Muslims in their own countries. In Saudi Arabia, allegedly our allies against Islamofascists like Isis and Al Qaeda, they still behead people for apostasy and homosexuality. The government there make Israel's inhumane treatment of Palestinians look like a human rights.
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Claiming there is no institutionalized discrimination in Israel is even more absurd
Institutionalised discrimination and constitutional racism are two very different things. One is against the law but tolerated and ignored, the other is enshrined in law. The latter is many orders of magnitude worse.
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Arabs in the government [knesset.gov.il] ? I think Lieberman would be the most virulent opponent to that notion (with Netanyahu and Naftali Benett among many others). Ayoob Kara is an Arab, yes, but check his alliances...
Israelis Jews don't like Arabs in general. Just go in Israel, you'll witness it first hand. If you think USA in the 50's were bad, Israel is a whole another crap hole...
Israel is de facto an apartheid nation (remember that Israel was the last entity working with South Africa when apartheid was in place ?).
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If you were truly looking to denounce racism you could not denounce Israel without also denouncing the far more virulent racism endemic in Islamic countries. Nah, you just think that your racism is justified.
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I'm not as much trying to denounce racism as I'm trying to state some facts.
I'm not a "denounciator", that's why the comment above "denouncing" me as a SJW made me laugh. Hard.
For me to denounce Israel, I'd also have to denounce other racist countries ? What's the logic with that ? Israel is racist *because* of the surrounding mulsim slates ? Come on ! They're even racist between themselves ! Talk to a sepharadic jews who is constantly refered to as an "arab" by its ashkenazi brethren...
To be clear, I wasn'
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Then you're a moral relativist intent on seeing the transgressions of one side while ignoring those of the other. In sum a hypocrite. Spare us your moral judgements, you have no basis for forming any.
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So you basically have low comprehension skills, you are quick to form an opinion with these aforementioned skills (or lack of) and you're prone to insult others in consequence of all that.
What a delight to talk to you !
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Then you're a moral relativist intent on seeing the transgressions of one side while ignoring those of the other. In sum a hypocrite. Spare us your moral judgements, you have no basis for forming any.
Question:
If I denounce the Nazis, how much space do I have to devote to denouncing Stalin before you decide I'm a "moral relativist intent on seeing the transgressions of one side while ignoring the other?"
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If you were truly looking to denounce racism you could not denounce Israel without also denouncing the far more virulent racism endemic in Islamic countries. Nah, you just think that your racism is justified.
Dude, when you're denouncing one injustice that does not put the onus on you to denounce every injustice.
Moreover you're insane if you think Islamic states are more racist then anyone else. India, for example, has institutionalized Affirmative Action that most American minority-rights groups would look at funny. The Chinese are racist enough that the Dalia Lama's people have been forced into low-grade rebellion and the poor East Turkestanis are in trouble (not that Israel's friends care: they're Muslim). Ev
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Ayoob Kara is an Arab, yes, but check his alliances...
So an Arab isn't really an Arab if his opinions do not align with what you think an Arab should believe in? Or do you think that Netanyahu's government should have accepted an Arab minister who has an ideology very different than the government's, merely because they are Arab?
Israel is de facto an apartheid nation
Most of that sentence was opinion, so I cut it out. You are entitled to yours, of course (what's more, it is impossible to really prove or disprove to anyone's satisfaction). This part, however, requires more clarification. How can you
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Happy to see someone is able to express arguments, even if I disagree with most of them. A refreshing change in these forums.
A little less of "hypocritical" and "dubious" would be fine though. And putting words in my mouth is very effective but counter-productive in the long-run.
I might take you up on you offer though, maybe we could have productive discussions. Although you're defending Israel and I oppose it and if history is any judge, discussions haven't gotten really far, sadly.
I agree, as I said earli
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Happy to see someone is able to express arguments, especially since I disagree with most of them. A refreshing change in these forums.
FTFY.
Surely, you meant that you were tired of talking either to hotheads or to people who already agree with you, and that you greatly welcome the opportunity to test your assumptions against someone who's willing to answer with actual verifiable statements of fact, so that you can find out in case you are, against all of your expectations, wrong.
A little less of "hypocritical" and "dubious" would be fine though.
I'll do my best, though I counted one "hypocritical", directed at a statement (i.e. - not at you, but at a statement you made), and zero "dubious", which I'll find
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And the most important thing : the whole state of Israel has been taken by force in 1948 !
Why would you defend such a country ?
All countries were made through force. Do you think the Russians lived in Russia since the dawn of time? Do you think the Chinese lived in China since the dawn of time? The only thing unique about Israel is that it was carved out by a third party for them.
Personally, I would nuke the whole area for all of them being jackasses. The Israeli leadership for allowing settling land and bulldozing houses and the Palestinian leadership for never being amenable to any rational agreement and being committed to keepin
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An SJW criticizing Israel and an anonymous coward shooting himself in the foot. Way to go Mr Rebel :)
Have you noticed that you didn't respond in any way to my post and just thrown an epithet in my face ? Truth be told, I wrote about Israel in a topic about Malaysia, I'm to blame too...
Israel versus Malaysia (Score:5, Interesting)
I have been living in Malaysia / Singapore since 2012, on a work-related assignment.
My previous assignment took me to Israel, for a 3-year contract.
As a Brit I have to say that racism does occur in both countries, albeit with a not-so-subtle difference:
In Israel, the laws do not favor any one race ...
... while in Malaysia the laws are stacked against the minorities ,
Every conceivable law and regulation favors the majority Malay race ---
From the issuance of Taxi Permit to the paying of income taxes ...
From the purchasing of houses, to university enrollment...
... the minorities, be it the Indians, the real indigenous (locally known as "Orang Asli"), the Chinese, and the mixed races, bear the brunt of legal discrimination.
But please, do not take my word for it ...
http://world.time.com/2013/09/... [time.com]
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Israel has no constitution.
Try not to let the facts slam your face into the wall on the way out.
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They do and they don't. They have somethings called their "Basic Law" that fulfill the role of the Constitution. These are Constitutional in the sense that they can only be changed explicitly (ie: if Bibi wanted to start seizing property without compensation he'd have to amend [wikipedia.org] the Basic Law banning that), but can be changed by simple majority vote in the Knesset. This system is pretty much identical to the one used by the Brits.
The anonymous coward post below actually has pretty good info in it.
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On the contrary... most countries have some level of institutionalized racism. This is because there is an unresolved conflict between democratic rule and national identity.
Unfortunately having an adult public debate about it is next to impossible for the political class. On the one side you have the extreme left that typically slanders anyone that points this problem out as racist or fascist (nearly the entire "human rights" industry falls in this category) On the other you have the extreme right that goes
Re:Small correction (Score:5, Interesting)
We have this problem in Sweden, whose previous mishandling of massive inflows of immigrants has already started leading to ghettoisation.
The Left here refuses even to discuss this, thus ceding the debate to Sverigedemokraterna (the right-wingers) before it's even begun.
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The "wild west" stuff with the settlers running the locals off their reservation even bounces it back into comparisons to the USA some time back.
This Land Is Mine [vimeo.com].
Look, seriously [wikipedia.org], Nobody does ethnic cleansing like the Jews [biblegateway.com]. You think the politicians who created the nation of Israel were aware of history? I'm sure they were. They put the Jews there just to shit on the natives. So far, so good, right? And We The People of the USA pour gasoline on that bonfire every year. Your tax dollars at work.
This is not to say that all Jews are bad people. It's to say that Zionism is another typical evil. You know, like the USA, founded on theft, rape, and oppres
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Thank you for providing an example of why mentioning Israel is a pointless sidetrack likely to do nothing apart from start flame wars. True or not it's argument fuel.
Yep. I agree wholeheartedly. It's impossible not to have an emotional reaction to the issue one way or another. If it's not directly comparable, it shouldn't be mentioned at all.
Re:Small correction (Score:5, Informative)
Insightful? Hmm.
Do you really know the situation in Malaysia, or are you arguing out of some emotional arousal?
The Malaysian constitution prescribes favorable allotment of jobs and university places to the members of the ruling, majority, ethnicity, the Malays. And this is not just in writing but implemented. Malaysian citizens of Chinese or Indian ethic background see it happen that a student with straight 'A's is denied a university education in the public universities while a mediocre Malay student is gladly admitted. Wow! There is even a university with 140000 students exclusively for students of Malay ethnicity. Check UiTM in WikIpedia if in doubt. Malays get monthly allowances for their kids, the others ethic groups don't.
All chancellors of all universities are Malays, almost all deans (with very few exceptions) are Malays due to the constitutional 'preferences'.
I think I can stop here, and I am arguing based on 12 years as university lecturer in said country.
Now the ball is in your court: I don't have much of insight into Israel, maybe you can enlighten me on the situation in Israel, please? Maybe I can learn something from that.
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"One of only 2 countries in the world with constitutional racism, Israel being .."
Only two? Here are a few more. Feel free to add more
1. Saudi (No rights for non-muslims) ...
2. UAE, (No rights for non-muslims)
3. Pakistan (non-muslims cannot become head of the state).
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Erm, cough, cough, Saudi Arabia is by far the worst offender, not just racially and religious prejudiced but also hugely gender biased. So the no matter how bad any other country is, they run a poor second to Americas best buddies even when those best buddies fly planes into buildings and kill thousands of Americans. If the bribes are big enough and hidden in tax havens, you most certainly can get away with mass murder in the United States of America. Typical act of the political elite, exploit racism and
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