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Sony The Courts

Sony Demands Press Destroy Leaked Documents 250

SydShamino writes In an effort that may run afoul of the first amendment, Sony, through their lawyer David Boies (of SCO infamy), has sent a letter to major news organizations demanding that they refrain from downloading any leaked documents, and destroy those already possessed. Sony threatens legal action to news organizations that do not comply, saying that "Sony Pictures Entertainment will have no choice but to hold you responsible for any damage or loss arising from such use or dissemination by you."
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Sony Demands Press Destroy Leaked Documents

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  • Rootkit (Score:5, Funny)

    by Anonymous Coward on Monday December 15, 2014 @03:12PM (#48603547)

    What are they going to do, install a rootkit on my computer to prevent me from downloading stuff? Who thinks up this stuff?

  • First amendment? (Score:3, Interesting)

    by Anonymous Coward on Monday December 15, 2014 @03:12PM (#48603557)

    [quote]In an effort that may run afoul of the first amendment,[/quote]
    First amendment has nothing to do with this. The first amendment protects from criminal government prosecution, not reactions from private individuals/entities.

    Here's a very good explanation - http://www.xkcd.com/1357/ [xkcd.com]

    • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

      by jvp ( 27996 )

      [First amendment has nothing to do with this. The first amendment protects from criminal government prosecution, not reactions from private individuals/entities.

      I'm glad someone posted this before I did. This most definitely has zilch to do with Amendment #1. I'll bet money that any of Sony's documents and emails had all sorts of disclaimers added to them. It's those disclaimers that Sony will use to sue press organizations into oblivion if they dare print any of it.

      While I'm no fan of Sony, I don't really see this ending well for the press.

      • Re:First amendment? (Score:5, Informative)

        by Anonymous Coward on Monday December 15, 2014 @03:30PM (#48603771)

        Eh - sorry, but you're way off base. It is protected, and by the first amendment.

        http://www.oyez.org/cases/2000-2009/2000/2000_99_1687

        Question:
        Does the First Amendment provide protection to speech that discloses the contents of an illegally intercepted communication?

        Answer:
        Yes. In a 6-3 opinion delivered by Justice John Paul Stevens, the Court held that the First Amendment protects the disclosure of illegally intercepted communications by parties who did not participate in the illegal interception. "In this case, privacy concerns give way when balanced against the interest in publishing matters of public importance," wrote Justice Stevens.

        • Mod parent up! (crap, I had points left yesterday.... :)

          Parent makes the important point: There's existing SCOTUS case law for this, and Sony's legal-ish threats and demand for press et al to refrain from looking at embarrassing things wouldn't stand up in a stiff breeze, much less in a lower court.

          Frankly I'm kind of surprised to see a relatively experienced lawyer such as Boies make a demand like this, even if he is a distinguished douchebag. Usually lawyers like him are concerned about appearances, an

          • Mod parent up! (crap, I had points left yesterday.... :)

            Parent makes the important point: There's existing SCOTUS case law for this, and Sony's legal-ish threats and demand for press et al to refrain from looking at embarrassing things wouldn't stand up in a stiff breeze, much less in a lower court.

            Frankly I'm kind of surprised to see a relatively experienced lawyer such as Boies make a demand like this, even if he is a distinguished douchebag. Usually lawyers like him are concerned about appearances, and making laughable demands that evoke a Streisand effect is bad for business.

            Unfortunately, parent is incorrect regarding the SCOTUS case law. Not the AC's fault, though - Eugene Volokh's quoted in the article and makes the same mistake. The case law refers specifically to publishing (actually re-playing) an illegally intercepted phone conversation on a matter of great public interest (specifically public teachers union negotiations with the school board). It explicitly says that its holding doesn't apply to trade secrets, private matters, or gossip... and what's the issue here? Trade secrets, private matters, and gossip.

            Boies may be a douchebag, but he's a douchebag who actively practices law and apparently reads the cases in full, unlike the good Professor Volokh, who has never actually practiced.

            • Since Sony isn't a part of the government, it can't really demand destruction of those documents. It can merely request, which is basically the same as 'politely ask to'. It can also note that disseminating parties may be liable for any damages to Sony that could arise. They need to prove damages though, and there's a lot of news sources involved. Will they do a reverse class-action suit or something? :P
              • It can also note that disseminating parties may be liable for any damages to Sony that could arise. They need to prove damages though, and there's a lot of news sources involved. Will they do a reverse class-action suit or something? :P

                No, but they could sue them collectively under a joint and several liability argument, saying "we were damaged by $X... feel free to figure out which of you pays which percentage of that amongst yourselves," based on a theory that by linking to each other in the articles, they were acting in concert. That wouldn't require proving which individual new source is responsible for which damage.

            • by fuzznutz ( 789413 ) on Monday December 15, 2014 @04:46PM (#48604639)

              Boies may be a douchebag, but he's a douchebag who actively practices law and apparently reads the cases in full, unlike the good Professor Volokh, who has never actually practiced.

              You may have a point, but given the bludgeoning that SCO took from IBM, I'd think twice before putting my eggs in the Boies basket.

            • by thaylin ( 555395 )

              So you yourself have seen the documents, all of them, and know that is all it pertains too?

        • Re:First amendment? (Score:4, Interesting)

          by cyberchondriac ( 456626 ) on Monday December 15, 2014 @04:34PM (#48604533) Journal
          How are Sony's private memos, emails, and employee information a "matter of public importance" ??
          So, when J-Law's photos are leaked, or juicy Sony private emails are leaked, those leaks are to be protected under the first amendment-?, but if the NSA does it in the context of looking for matters that actually *are* of public importance (possible criminal activity, technically), suddenly these same people scream about their privacy being violated.
          This seems rather hypocritical.
          1) Either nothing is private, or
          2) Everything is private unless the owning party wishes it distributed or is under criminal investigation.

          Personally I prefer the latter.
      • by thaylin ( 555395 )

        It does not matter. If you bothered to read the article there is established case law on this that says that the media is fine.

      • Of course the first amendment applies here. The government can't abridge the freedom of the press, it doesn't say anything about only criminal prosecution. So the government (in theory) shouldn't be able to compel the press to pay damages to Sony.

        What Sony does have the power to do is to stop advertising in said press, or complain about it loudly. Legal action, I'm picking the press to win this one.

      • The question is whether those little notices actually have teeth at all let alone are binding against third parties.

        For example, if I send an email after hours to friend regarding plans for watching the game, that notice gets attached but I and not my employer own the copyright on the contents of that email. Similarly a company will include that on outbound emails but has no basis for asserting ownership of a conversation that includes another party. If you have two companies like this involved both will be
      • Well, when a newspaper publishes something, that has everything to do with the First Amendment.

        I'll bet money that any of Sony's documents and emails had all sorts of disclaimers added to them.

        Sony can add all the legal disclaimers it wants to its docs. None of them are legally binding on anyone who hasn't agreed to them in writing.

        No more than the following:

        Anyone reading the above comment is liable to send CrimsonAvenger $100 Canadian. Please contact CrimsonAvenger for the address the money is to be

        • Crap. Ok, what's your address? And is that $100 Canadian, or $100 Canadian Tire?

          • Crap. Ok, what's your address? And is that $100 Canadian, or $100 Canadian Tire?

            Hold on while I count my stack of 5 cent bills while the Christmas shopping lineup wraps around the store.

            -Some old guy 10 people in front of you.

      • by frovingslosh ( 582462 ) on Monday December 15, 2014 @03:42PM (#48603945)
        They can put whatever disclaimer that they want on the e-mails, but if e-mails or other documents show that Sony is involved in illegal things, then the disclaimers will not protect that from disclosure. Of course, the press would be wise to thoroughly investigate and make sure then they were not passing along bogus information that North Korea was trying to falsely attribute to them. But given that this is Sony and "lawyer" David Boies, I think that this threat reeks of desperation and would not be at all surprised to find that illegal things were leaking out. You can't hide a conspiracy or other illegal action simply by attaching legal boiler-plate "for internal use only" tags to all of the documents.
    • by jedidiah ( 1196 )

      ...and just who is going to enforce any action against the parties that Sony wants to stop here?

      Without the government, none of Sony's threats have any teeth.

      • advertising dollars and the threat of their loss sure has a bite though.

    • by halivar ( 535827 )

      That comic is in relation to Brandon Eich, and it has no relevance. Mozilla did not stifle Brandon Eich's speech, or tell him to stop supporting or giving money traditional marriage causes, or by any other means stifle his freedom of expression.

      Sony, on the other hand, is.

    • Actually, it could tie into the First Amendment. They point out that it's a journalism issue. This would be closely related to issues that journalists deal with when protecting sources. While that doesn't always work, the idea is that the press needs a certain amount of latitude in being able to protect their sources or have access to material that, for various reasons, may not be printable without consequences.

      But, since the internet is an international object, something else comes into play here. In c

    • by sexconker ( 1179573 ) on Monday December 15, 2014 @03:35PM (#48603835)

      You're an idiot. The first amendment ensures the freedom of the press.

      Sony can't (successfully) sue them for breaking into their servers because they weren't the ones who did that (even then they'd have a hard time - look at what Murdoch gets away with).
      Sony can't (successfully) sue them for libel / slander / defamation / damages because all of the shit leaked is true and no member of the press was under contract to not release that information.
      Sony can't (successfully) sue for whatever else you can dream up, because that would be the government enforcing some law restricting the press from doing their job as the press, a clear violation of the first amendment.

      The press hasn't done anything to Sony aside from reveal the truth.
      Until you find the press has been actively hacking Sony, or has been trespassing on their property, or has been torturing Sony employees for info, or has been engaged in other such crimes in pursuit of this story, the press is free and clear.

      Finding and disseminating truth is the press's job. This is exactly what the first amendment is designed to protect.

      • Re:First amendment? (Score:5, Interesting)

        by Em Adespoton ( 792954 ) <slashdotonly.1.adespoton@spamgourmet.com> on Monday December 15, 2014 @03:48PM (#48604015) Homepage Journal

        You're an idiot. The first amendment ensures the freedom of the press.

        Sony can't (successfully) sue them for breaking into their servers because they weren't the ones who did that (even then they'd have a hard time - look at what Murdoch gets away with).
        Sony can't (successfully) sue them for libel / slander / defamation / damages because all of the shit leaked is true and no member of the press was under contract to not release that information.
        Sony can't (successfully) sue for whatever else you can dream up, because that would be the government enforcing some law restricting the press from doing their job as the press, a clear violation of the first amendment.

        The press hasn't done anything to Sony aside from reveal the truth.
        Until you find the press has been actively hacking Sony, or has been trespassing on their property, or has been torturing Sony employees for info, or has been engaged in other such crimes in pursuit of this story, the press is free and clear.

        Finding and disseminating truth is the press's job. This is exactly what the first amendment is designed to protect.

        ...and this is likely why, despite having their own large legal team, Sony Pictures hired David Boies to run this show. The aim is probably not to actually successfully sue anyone, but to spread FUD and create a chilling effect to limit what gets reported.

      • wrong (Score:5, Informative)

        by aepervius ( 535155 ) on Monday December 15, 2014 @04:02PM (#48604185)
        "Sony can't (successfully) sue for whatever else you can dream up, because that would be the government enforcing some law restricting the press from doing their job as the press, a clear violation of the first amendment."

        No. Proof : press is bound by copyright law too. Press cannot give the full copy of a book in an article and pretend it is covered by first amendment and freedom of press. Freedom of press is not a get-free-out-of-civil-liabilities card.

        Bottom line : the first amendement and freedom of press is about not allowing the government to limit and infringe on press. It is not a "get free" card for all laws whatsoever, including copyright, 3rd party liabilities and so forth. If you spread private confidential or copyrighted document, you will get bitten in the ass , and it will be by civil lawsuit.


        In fact remember : free speech mean the government cannot stops your speech. It does not protect you of ANY private consequence for that speech. If that would be the case journalist would never be sued for libel.
      • by NoKaOi ( 1415755 )

        Those things are not necessarily true. It really depends on if they gave campaign contributions to the right people, in the right amounts, at the right time. Or were you under the impression that separation of powers in the branches of government still exists? Judgeships are political appointments. All Sony really needs is for a politician to pressure the judge to issue an injunction that lasts long enough for the news to go stale.

    • It does, a bit. If someone were to write an article talking about terrible/illegal/immoral actions Sony has engaged in, and uses the leaked documents (or excerpts thereof) as evidence, those people are free from criminal prosecution, such as slander.

      Of course we know Sony will try to sue the crap out of them for "damages", but other than being expensive, probably won't stick provided the media DOES download the leaked documents.

  • by AuralityKev ( 1356747 ) on Monday December 15, 2014 @03:12PM (#48603561)
    Yeah, this won't spur me to download them for myself. Nah, not at all.
  • by grilled-cheese ( 889107 ) on Monday December 15, 2014 @03:13PM (#48603573)
    If Nixon could have just asked everyone to destroy the recordings, we might have been able to avoid watergate too.
    • by hey! ( 33014 )

      Well, if the Sony records had been subpoenaed, your analogy would be spot on.

  • by xevioso ( 598654 ) on Monday December 15, 2014 @03:14PM (#48603581)

    "Sony Pictures Entertainment will have no choice but to hold you responsible "

    They have no choice? As in their hands are legally or physically tied so that they absolutely HAVE to sue you? The people at the top of Sony will have actually no other choice in the world, like, say, going to watch a Knicks game or reading a nice book? They have only one choice, which is to sue?

    Bullshit.

    • Well, you know Sony. Shit in one hand and wish in the other and see what fills up first. The press will crawl through these documents looking for juicy tidbits are in there. Now that you have issued demands like this, they will crawl through with even more zest. It makes you look like you have something to hide.

      • The press are owned and controlled by people who probably play golf with the heads of Sony, and keep their yachts in the same marinas. So, you decide if that means the press will do a damned thing about it or not.

        It's long past the point where the press will focus on honest and objective reporting, and instead focus on corporate interests and policy.

        You really can't take that out of this equation.

        Everyone likes to pretend there's still a free press. But, that's not 100% true when corporate policy dictates

    • Well, think of it as "in order to protect our interests and make this go away we are going to hold you legally accountable".

      The trick will be if they have a legal basis to say anything about it, or if this is just bluster from a legal team.

      You don't lawfully have the information, but is it illegal for you to have it? And, is it actionable that you have it?

      Would the lawyers for any large media outfit fight this? Or since all of the large media outfits are owned by companies like Sony and Time and the like,

      • Will people latch on to this and try to disseminate it? Probably.

        Will they be any more impartial than the news media?
        Doubtful.

        Eventually people might realize that they can't trust reporting, that they must survey things for themselves, and that they shouldn't trust people who make decisions without surveying things for themselves, because those people don't know shit. Probably not, but it could happen.

        They'll be old by then, though, and another generation of naive people will be fleeced.

    • He doesn't say sue, because if he did the press could sue per-emptively. He says hold accountable for a reason, that reason is that threat of a suit would be baseless.

      • Damn autocorrect, preemptively, the press could sue for a declaratory judgement of non-infringement.

    • by Zocalo ( 252965 )
      Oh, please, please, PLEASE let them mean that.

      If every media outlet there proceeds to print as much as they can about this story then Sony will apparently have NO CHOICE but to hold them responsible and take every single one of them to court. Given David Boies' likely fees that alone will probably end them, let alone any damages that such losing suits will bring, and with the reputation as being the lawyer that drove two companies into Chapter 7 bankruptcy though bad advice it will probably end David Bo
    • by aaaaaaargh! ( 1150173 ) on Monday December 15, 2014 @03:50PM (#48604049)

      Well, it's Sony. They used to sue their own customers, so why shouldn't they sue the press now.

      They sure know how to make friends.

  • by Trachman ( 3499895 ) on Monday December 15, 2014 @03:15PM (#48603593) Journal

    If Sony keeps doing it, their documents will be forever alive in the form of magnet links, formerly torrent file sharing technology.

    They do have the the army of trained lawyers to harass mass audiences, except that newspapers have seen much badder boys coming to them with the threats.

    Now, assuming Sony documents will survive, will be available for everyone, and will be commented, how exactly SONY will know which newspaper has caused an actual harm?

    I think that their litigation budget will be fully depleted for several years in the future.

    • by Z00L00K ( 682162 )

      Someone has opened Pandora's Box at Sony, now they try to get all the crap back into that box.

      Good luck with that.

    • IF? (Score:5, Insightful)

      by Theaetetus ( 590071 ) <theaetetus DOT slashdot AT gmail DOT com> on Monday December 15, 2014 @03:33PM (#48603815) Homepage Journal

      If Sony keeps doing it, their documents will be forever alive in the form of magnet links, formerly torrent file sharing technology.

      Regardless, those documents will be floating around torrent sites, even if they do nothing. The horse has left the barn.

      But this isn't about trying to actually keep the information under wraps - this is about trying to get some financial recompense. Like, someone let the horse out, and your neighbor suddenly has a sale on fresh horse meat... You're not getting your horse back, but maybe you should get a portion of their unlawfully gained profits.

      In particular, the material includes both material under copyright, as well as trade secrets. Copyright law doesn't include a safe harbor for "but I'm a newspaper" or a generic "first amendment!" defense - while papers could publish short excerpts of the leaked info under fair use (17 USC 107), for news or commentary purposes, they could not, say, publish the entire script to the new Bond movie, relying on a defense of "well, we didn't steal it, and the first amendment says we can publish anything we want because we're the media."

      Going further, many states' trade secret laws actually include explicit provisions about publishing trade secrets that were obtained unlawfully, even if you weren't the person who originally stole them. And while terrible law professor Eugene Volokh thinks that the Bartnicki case has a first amendment exemption, he's clearly never actually read it - SCOTUS specifically said that it doesn't apply to trade secrets, but for matters of public interest. Now, that may apply to things like Sony's CEO's salary, but it likely doesn't apply to things like advertising campaign plans or product release strategies.

      So, if the media publishes the unlawfully obtained trade secrets or publishes the material under copyright in a way that exceeds the bounds of fair use, then they may be financially liable for Sony's damages. That doesn't put the horse back in the barn, since it's gone, man, but it does at least help pay for the new horse (and maybe a better lock).

      • Has there been any indication that newspapers and such are going to publish full scripts or anything like that? They might report on leaked scripts and torrents containing said scripts, but that's not what a newspaper is going to be interested in.
        • Has there been any indication that newspapers and such are going to publish full scripts or anything like that? They might report on leaked scripts and torrents containing said scripts, but that's not what a newspaper is going to be interested in.

          I think it was one of the Gawker media sites that posted a full (and amusingly terrible) powerpoint presentation from the leaked stuff, full of marketing and distribution plans.

          • Found that. When you said amusingly terrible, I thought you meant it in the sense of every powerpoint presentation being terrible, but that might have been the worst powerpoint presentation I've ever seen. That was just painfully bad.
    • Now, assuming Sony documents will survive, will be available for everyone, and will be commented, how exactly SONY will know which newspaper has caused an actual harm?

      As you say, Sony won't know.

      Besides, the newspapers do not need to download anything. They just need to let bloggers do the downloading and do the analysis for them.

      Then once the information is out on blogs, and out on foreign newspapers, they can just republish what was said by those other guys.

      The only thing they can do really is to stop advertising on the newspapers and on the television channels that choose to republish that information prominently, but this alone can't stop the wide release of the info

    • If Sony keeps doing it, their documents will be forever alive in the form of magnet links, formerly torrent file sharing technology.

      They do have the the army of trained lawyers to harass mass audiences, except that newspapers have seen much badder boys coming to them with the threats.

      Now, assuming Sony documents will survive, will be available for everyone, and will be commented, how exactly SONY will know which newspaper has caused an actual harm?

      I think that their litigation budget will be fully depleted for several years in the future.

      Actually they might have the right idea. The info the media will be most interested in is the gossipy Sony exec emails, and those things only really have legs for one news cycle.

      So a lawsuit does two things, first it causes a bunch of papers to run things by the lawyers first, this could slow down some of the reporting until the news cycle has finished.

      Second it gives them another related bit of news to report about, so the email contents are now part of the previous news cycle and the Sony lawsuit threat i

  • by Anonymous Coward on Monday December 15, 2014 @03:16PM (#48603603)

    And all I got was $150 dollars reimbursement for the damage their rootkit did. I say the guardians of peace should be limited $150 dollars worth of liability as well.

  • Nothing good can come of this for Sony. All it will do is further harm the brand and, by proxy, all the honest Joes already screwed over by the breach. It's pathetic how badly that company needs a coherent PR strategy.
    • All it will do is further harm the brand and, by proxy, all the honest Joes already screwed over by the breach.

      You missed that this is the point. It legitimizes their damages claim.

  • imo, the news organizations are aiding the criminals by publishing the material. If the news organizations did not publish the materials, then the leverage the criminals have would be less.

    .
    While I do not look at Sony's latest threat tactics as beneficial to the situation, I also think the news organizations should stop their feeding frenzy.

  • David Boies has not intention of upholding his oath as an officer of the court to uphold the Constitution of the United States, otherwise, he would never support the blanket suppression of Free Speech of the Press. Granted Sony has a right to protect their intellectual property and press should have an obligation not to publish trade secrets that have no public value other than to cause harm to Sony, but that's an ethical decision, not a legal one.
  • That is all.

  • Ha. Right (Score:5, Insightful)

    by headhot ( 137860 ) on Monday December 15, 2014 @03:40PM (#48603929) Homepage

    The newspapers with go toe to toe with the Pentagon, CIA, and NSA, but will back down from a nasty letter from Sony with no legal standing? Right.

  • grow some balls and go after the real culprits instead of some wimpy bloggers and journalists. You have Stallone and the guy who played Spiderman at your disposal, send them to go kick some communist ass. Go on!

  • by BUL2294 ( 1081735 ) on Monday December 15, 2014 @03:55PM (#48604101)
    Brian Krebs got one, reported on it, and was kind enough to post it for the world to see Sony for their true colors...

    Article: http://krebsonsecurity.com/201... [krebsonsecurity.com]
    Demand Letter: http://krebsonsecurity.com/wp-... [krebsonsecurity.com]

    I can hear Barbara Streisand's voice now... (Well, what I hear is "her" voice from the Mecha-Streisand "South Park" episode...)
    • by hey! ( 33014 )

      The lawers' grasp of the rules of English capitalization does not inspire confidence:

      “SPE does not consent to your possession, review, copying, dissemination, publication, uploading, downloading, or making any use of the Stolen information, and to request your cooperation in destroying the Stolen Information,”

      It reads like a bad fantasy novel full of Portentous Capitalization.

  • by Anonymous Coward

    I've personally gone against David Boise (yes IAAL -- and I won that case actually). And while his marketing is a little over the top, he is still a very good lawyer and he has built up an excellent team of lawyers. The problem with block downloads like this are that they contain materials that are protected by harsh laws (copyrights, trade secrets, etc.) that the journalists do not require for their articles or investigations. Sure there are fair use defenses, but it's going to be a tough one for [NEWSPAPE

  • by organgtool ( 966989 ) on Monday December 15, 2014 @04:22PM (#48604403)

    Sony Pictures Entertainment will have no choice but to hold you responsible

    Well, someone has to be responsible for Sony's massive fuckup and we all know it won't be Sony.

  • I think Frozen said it best... "Let it go, let it go..."
  • Comment removed based on user account deletion
  • The flower children of 1960-70-ies have all grown and are running the country. A feminist NY Times reporter agreed to show the Sony exec an article about her prior to publishing it [buzzfeed.com] — which is strictly against journalistic ethics. The article, of course, is quite adoring — the firm is praised for its "pro-women" movies (like "Frozen"). Journalistic integrity is secondary to the agenda — the Greater Good of promoting women justifies the means. Nobody will know, right?

    Sony executive —

"The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, but wiser people so full of doubts." -- Bertrand Russell

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