PayPal Freezes MailPile's Account 443
rysiek writes "Remember MailPile, the privacy-focused, community-funded FOSS webmail project with built-in GPG support? The good news is, the funding campaign is a success, with $135k raised (the goal was $100k). The bad news is: PayPal froze MailPile's account, along with $45k that was on it, and will not un-freeze it until MailPile team provides 'an itemized budget and your development goal dates for your project.' One of the team members also noted: 'Communications with PayPal have implied that they would use any excuse available to them to delay delivering as much of our cash as possible for as long as possible.' PayPal doesn't have a great track record as far as fund freezing is concerned — maybe it's high time to stop using PayPal?"
Who leaves money in a paypal account. (Score:5, Insightful)
It's well known that they do this sort of stuff - not regularly sweeping it out to a bank account is a really bad idea.
Few Alternatives... for now. (Score:5, Informative)
The sheer amount of hate that banks, financial services and operators like Paypal have generated in the population at large is amazing. Exorbitant fees, slow transfers, arrogant customer service, publicly funded bailouts for amounts that almost defy imagination, systematic fraud [google.com] reaching to the the highest levels of most governments of the world, few to no prosecutions of financial crime - the world of finance and banking it is a stagnated corrupt market that needs some serious competition, a bright light and a clean sweep.
Bitcoin is a tiny flicker of a spark in the dark rotten world of finance - not even in its infancy. Sure like any currency it can be stolen or used and abused to perpetrate fraud. Sure it is damn inconvenient to use or exchange, hardly anybody accepts it - but despite all this there is an army of people and entrepreneurs [coindesk.com], early adopters with more joining every day that are willing to bend over backwards and work through the teething problems simply because it could almost possibly eventually bring much needed change to the almighty financial sector to which our economies now serve [nakedcapitalism.com] (as apposed to the other way around).
If you think mass media can drum up a propaganda campaign so the Military Industrial Complex can have their profitable wars, wait till you see how far and loud the corporate media "journalists" will willing to go when the financial sector stands to lose absolute monopoly over our currency for online global payments.
First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.
Re:Few Alternatives... for now. (Score:5, Insightful)
Paypal isn't a bank according to U.S. Regulations. Otherwise their doing this would get them slammed by the Feds in a hurry as it violates many regulations. In fact, under the Feds, they would be slapped down for Money Laundring and I'd suggest the Project Devs push RICO Charges in Federal Court against Paypal (Racketeering/Corruption) which if successful would give them punitive damages of not triple but six to ten times the amount of the monies stollen and the profit Paypal is making from holding that money to play with it. How much money is Paypal making by holding those funds as they are - Stocks/Bonds market - 2+ percent per day? That's a lot of money when you look at the totals.
It's this kind of action by Paypal that pushed me to drop all family accounts with them and to quit using Ebay. It's not worth the agravation and I did vote with my wallet.
Re:Few Alternatives... for now. (Score:5, Informative)
Don't confuse your little corner of the internet with the real world. In the real world, you're a tempest in a teacup, son.
Right [1], back [2], at ya [3], son.
[1] The 2012 Harris Poll Annual Public Summary Report (PDF) [harrisinteractive.com]
[2] Banking Stinks Like Cigarettes and Politics: Survey Shows Contempt for Industry [mybanktracker.com]
[3] Banking Sector Is Slowly Replacing Big Oil As The Most Hated Industry [huffingtonpost.com]
The Harris poll asks consumers for their opinions on six key attributes of the 60 ‘most visible’ corporations in the United States. Rating companies’ social responsibility, emotional appeal, products and services, workplace environment, financial performance and vision and leadership, the Harris RQ survey seeks to get a snapshot of corporate America’s reputation among consumers.... Banking and financial services scored terribly.
...
But the banking sector has screamed up the charts, and not counting the always-hated federal government, it was No. 2 with a bullet as of Gallup's most recent poll [gallup.com], taken way back in August 2012. Fifty-three percent of Americans surveyed had a negative view of banks in that poll, up from just 18 percent in 2007, before the crisis. The percentage of people with a positive view of banking has plunged to 25 percent from 50 percent in 2007.
Re:Who leaves money in a paypal account. (Score:5, Insightful)
regularly sweeping money into a bank account will also get your account frozen.
At least it won't get your account frozen with your money in it!
Take money out of PayPal to buy more product (Score:2)
It's well known that they do this sort of stuff -- regularly sweeping money into a bank account will also get your account frozen.
When I first read your comment, I thought PayPal might do this to encourage people to spend the money in their PayPal accounts within the eBay-PayPal ecosystem, so that PayPal can milk 3% off each transaction. But then I realized that sweeping money into a bank account was commonplace among businesses whose suppliers don't accept PayPal, such as a business that buys radio control cars from a distributor [horizonhobbycorp.com] and sells them on eBay [ebay.com] or on its own web site [philshobbyshop.com]. Is it really that much easier easier for an online retaile
Re:Who leaves money in a paypal account. (Score:5, Informative)
I'm not saying I trust PayPal all that much, but this is simply untrue. I have businesses that use a couple of different PayPal accounts, and regular sweeps are de rigeur for us, and we've never had any account frozen by them.
Part of the reason we sweep them is to guard against just that possibility, however.
It's also important to sweep the account you are sweeping into... usually, the wire transfer capability works both ways. So they can, without additional authorization, suck funds back out of your bank account. (if anyone happens to know a bank that will let you prevent this sort of outgoing transaction, I am all ears)
If the funds aren't in that account, you could get hit with an NSF charge from your institution, but you'll have an easier time arguing with them about it than with PayPal, and a $30 bounce charge is a lot less than $50,000 or whatever amount PayPal might decide to sit on instead.
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It's also important to sweep the account you are sweeping into... usually, the wire transfer capability works both ways. So they can, without additional authorization, suck funds back out of your bank account. (if anyone happens to know a bank that will let you prevent this sort of outgoing transaction, I am all ears)
I think most banks will provide an account like that. I found out at work that we have an incoming only account (outgoing only to another account of ours) where our customers pay us when someone started trying to cash fraudulent checks on it. Since it doesn't allow it, we didn't lose anything. We use Bank of America.
Re:Who leaves money in a paypal account. (Score:5, Insightful)
There is also the problem that many services are integrated with PayPal, so if you want to use them and their systems you have to use PayPal too.
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Failing to use it reduces your customer/client/whatever base
So I risk alienating a potential customer and their money, thus should accept paypal and risk having that customer send me money that I quite possibly will never see?
Doesn't sound like too much of a risk either way as both end up with me not getting paid, so might as well go the least effort route.
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If you're any sort of serious business you should go to a bank and get a proper merchant account instead. For me, nothing screams 'part-time trader who normally only uses eBay' than someone accepting money only via PayPal.
Bigger multi-million turnover customer might get a better deal (but how many of those do you see accepting PayPal?), but PayPal's model seems to be to essentially very cheaply bulk 'retail' payment accounts with almost everything automated. I think that's one reason so many people have pro
Re:Who leaves money in a paypal account. (Score:4, Insightful)
Agreed. PayPal has become synonymous with the word 'scam.'
The banks / credit unions should just drop the cost of wire transfers, and be done with it; the result would probably destroy PayPal in a week, provided the cost was low enough, and painless enough...
Re:Who leaves money in a paypal account. (Score:5, Informative)
Visa and mastercard have prepaid cards that work just as easily as a credit card you put fixed amounts onto them and then spend it as a credit card.
It is much safer than paypal. I only use paypal when i am forced to. 1 out of 10 transactions go bad for me when using paypal.
Re:Who leaves money in a paypal account. (Score:5, Insightful)
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Also can PayPal do charge backs like credit cards can?
They can, but they don't. They'll chargeback from the seller, but hold it and not give it to the buyer. I always use PayPal with a credit card. I got scammed by a "yes, I sent it" shipper who never sent it, so I tried to get my money back through PayPal and they refused. The credit card dispute had my money in my account almost instantly.
Of course, every seller claims buyers are scammers, and buyers claim sellers are scammers, and PayPal just tries to scam both.
Re:Who leaves money in a paypal account. (Score:5, Interesting)
I used PayPal once or twice when they first started up, but it very quickly became evident that they were on the fast track to becoming complete dicks.
Since then, if a merchant doesn't provide an alternative to PaylPal, I find an alternative source for whatever it is that I want to buy. If there is no such alternative, then I suddenly discover that don't want the item as badly as all that. End of story.
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Nevertheless, the signs were there very early in the piece that they were going to take the douchebag route, I've seen no evidence to the contrary in the years since, and I prefer not to do business with douchebags, even if I'm not myself affected.
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Re:Who leaves money in a paypal account. (Score:5, Insightful)
It's poor form to use a referral link that will personally benefit you in this sort of context. It diminishes your point, making you look like any other spammer or paid shill.
Re:Who leaves money in a paypal account. (Score:5, Informative)
tried to sign up to dwolla a while ago.
half way through, they asked for my ssn.
at the time, i didn't think it was worth it so i didn't provide it.
but magically, i ended up on their spam email list.
fuck them and they shitty spam emails, will never use them now.
"Maybe?" (Score:5, Insightful)
"High time to stop using paypal" was years ago. They've been famous for this scummy behavior since even before ebay bought them and forced you to use them.
Re:"Maybe?" (Score:5, Insightful)
Why does PayPal have any say in how the funds raised are to be spent? That is like the bank demanding an itemized weekly budget and a yearly fiscal and activity plan before they'll dispense funds from your account.
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It stinks of the government and/or IRS abuse. Forget boycotting business for its behaviour [read: complicity]. Isn't it time we start boycotting government a bit?
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I suspect a lot of what PayPal does (e.g. freezing accounts with "suspicious" transactions and refusing to unfreeze until you provide proof you are who you claim to be and proof of where the money came from/where its going to) has to do with the international rules designed to prevent money laundering.
When you open an account at a regular bank, you generally need to show ID to prove you are who you claim to be (usually at least one piece of ID that can be linked back to government databases such as drivers
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Shhh, you'll ruin a perfectly crazy rant!
Re:"Maybe?" (Score:5, Insightful)
Hell, even with CASH transactions the government likes to take first and then asks questions
well, that's because cash is the easiest and most obvious form of money laundering, and we all know that criminal proceeds are laundered by terrorists to fund their evil activities, so when you next see someone using cash, just point to them and shout "a terrorist, a terrorist". If they complain, get a group together to chuck them in some water, if they drown they were innocent and will get 27 virgins in the afterlife.
(and before anyone says, that's witches... witches are so 10th century, terrorists are today's excuse for government control).
Oh, any Paypal is not regulated nearly as much as other credit providers. That's the problem - Visa, for example, is not allowed to freeze anyone's account unless they are suspected of being a wit... terrorist, or just disliked by the US government.
Re:"Maybe?" (Score:5, Insightful)
I'll move to Somalia if you move to North Korea. I'd rather have no government than a totalitarian one.
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Banks do do stuff like this.
Just one example - Wells Fargo instantly freezes the bank accounts of someone who files bankruptcy, until the bankruptcy trustee tells them to unfreeze them. WF claims that they are required by law to do this, though strangely no other major bank interprets the law that way and the feds have not prosecuted them. Lots of fun for example over a holiday weekend, for someone who is already financially in a bad way.
Re:"Maybe?" (Score:4, Informative)
What else is there? Look, if I see a vendor on eBay who doesn't use PayPal, my first thought isn't "oh, this person is a conscientious objector to PayPal's malfeasance." Instead, it's an instant scammer alert. The one time I used BidPay, I got scammed. Never again. On the other hand, it's way to easy for shitty buyers to screw you over on PayPal.
I don't know what the other options are, though. Even on Slashdot, there seems to be a lot of "don't use PayPal" but not a lot of "use $SERVICE instead" as an alternative.
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Okay, lets rephrase the question ...
Why are you still using ebay? It hasn't been a worth while way to buy things since roughly 2006 or so.
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Just the one guy handing out his dwolla affiliate referral link. I thought those went out of style?
Re:"Maybe?" (Score:5, Informative)
High time was when I first read a few stories on here:
http://paypalsucks.com/ [paypalsucks.com]
In like 2006.
Re:"Maybe?" (Score:4, Insightful)
"High time to stop using paypal" was years ago.
No, it wasn't. What passed years ago was "It's high time PayPal was regulated as a bank."
FE F1 F0.fm (Score:2, Insightful)
I smell the NSA.
Re:FE F1 F0.fm (Score:5, Insightful)
I smell the NSA.
I don't. I smell Visa and MasterCard... which is worse.
PayPal is on the hook for chargebacks when MaiPile doesn't deliver. They're on the hook based on their own internal policies, and the policies of the big card networks.
Given how many of the crowd sourced projects never come to fruition, it doesn't surprise me that there's pushback from the companies that handle the payments. (Especially now that so many of them are pushed as more than a simple donation and are really a pre-purchase of a product or service.)
Don't use US services (Score:3, Insightful)
They will betray you.
Other countries' immigration departments (Score:2)
Re:Other countries' immigration departments (Score:4, Funny)
As a U.S.-born U.S. resident with a B.Sc. in computer science, I sort of feel locked into U.S. services. What other country would let me use its services instead?
If you get the M.Sc., you will know answers to all questions!
We need to push regulators to treat them as a bank (Score:5, Insightful)
Comment removed (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:We need to push regulators to treat them as a b (Score:5, Informative)
It's not just Paypal they have to worry about. Look at what normal financial institutions did to Wikileaks. Mastercard stopped procesing payments, and Julian Assange's swiss bank account was frozen. If you challenge the powers that be, you will be retaliated against.
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Yes, just like all the other well-regulated banks in the US.
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The real issue here is that the US, unlike a lot of other countries, allows businesses who act like commercial banks to not be regulated like commercial banks. That's actually something the CFPB is supposed to be doing, is adding duck-typing to the laws around customer disclosures, access to accounts, etc.
Some examples of businesses who sometimes act like commercial banks but don't get the same regulations as commercial banks:
- Mixed commercial and investment banks like BofA.
- Mortgage brokers
- Payday lende
Who do people still use PayPal high value accounts (Score:4, Interesting)
I don't get it.
I hear stories like this all the time.
Why do people insist on using PayPal for high value accounts?
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Why do people insist on using PayPal for high value accounts?
Why do people use PayPal at all?
PayPal has always done things I found objectionable. There was a period of time when some websites would only accept Paypal; but I haven't run into one of those in years. But back when I did, I'd make a point of telling the website operator they'd lost a sale because I refused to use PayPal (not that anyone cares what I did as an individual, but I figured if enough people did it things might change).
Re:Who do people still use PayPal high value accou (Score:5, Informative)
Why do people use PayPal at all?
Mainly as a convenient means to avoid giving credit card numbers to those I trust even less than them. Nothing beyond that.
Re:Who do people still use PayPal high value accou (Score:5, Insightful)
That's insane. If someone steals my credit card number, there's fast and quick legal redress. The most inconvenient part is waiting for the credit card company to overnight me a new card.
Paypal, on the other hand, can lift actual money right out of the checking account they insist on linking to my account and actually defraud me. There is literally no instance where simply using a credit card number is less safe than dealing with paypal.
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The whole system is broken, that's what's missing here. A couple numbers and a name contains all the information needed to withdraw money from my account, that is the real problem and it is seriously backwards early 20th century thinking. There is no reason that information should fly around unencrypted, heck it's written in plain text on my credit card for crying out loud, why does no one think that is an issue!? The sad thing is that something like Google Wallet, that has enough brains to be password p
Re:Who do people still use PayPal high value accou (Score:4, Informative)
And giving PayPunk the card number is better?
They won't let you delete all your card numbers from your PayPal account. You have to leave at least one.
The only work around is to cancel the card.
Actually, you can be used by PayUpPal without giving them a credit card number. They just go out of their way to make life difficult for you.
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Why do people use PayPal at all?
Because they want to buy and sell stuff on eBay?
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Because "everything else" at Amazon doesn't include old-school retro hardware.
Please, point out where I can get early-80s computer hardware at Amazon. Say, a TRS-80 Model I Expansion Interface. Or S-100 memory cards.
Sorry. Asides from lots of usually fruitless google searching, there's no real market for retro hardware besides Ebay.
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Because of this, even though there are alternatives to paypal, most sellers continue to accept paypal or they will lose customers that prefer paypal.
The policies of paypal will eventually put them out of business unless they change their ways, but its a long way down unless they start messing with the buyers too.
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You'd have to be a fucking moron to use them at all. Why would anybody with a brain give their banking information to this company, even for a "low value" account?
That's why you don't give them your normal bank account. Instead you create a separate checking account (which you can get from some banks with no monthly fee) and link that account to PayPal. Regularly transfer the money from that account into your real account. That way, if PayPal does decide to do something stupid, the amount of damage they c
People still use PayPal? (Score:2)
I cancelled my account years ago due to their fishy tactics.
Don't feel sorry for anyone using PayPal (Score:2, Insightful)
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Sometimes there are services that don't have another option for online payment *other* than PayPal. It kind of sucks, but there it is. Just make sure you never keep any money in the account. PayPal's been pulling this kind of shit for years. I'm surprised no one has taken them to court over it yet (or if they had, why it hasn't made the news).
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Getting such an account probably requires signing 30 pages of fineprint, making sure that anything you do can get your account banned.
A bigger question is why. What do PayPal gain by "randomly" freezing accounts like this?
Re:Don't feel sorry for anyone using PayPal (Score:4, Insightful)
A bigger question is why. What do PayPal gain by "randomly" freezing accounts like this?
You'd think the goodwill hit would be more costly than the interest on the frozen funds for the time they hold the cash until forced to finally pay it back.
They've already got your customers in check, but they go ahead and take an extra pawn, because -- why not? Who else they gonna play with?
And yet, all this bad publicity -- for years and years -- and still no viable, widely accepted, competitor.
What right does PayPal have? (Score:5, Insightful)
Aside from the fact that PayPal holds the money, what right do they have to demand a business plan from an indiegogo funded project? Is there a business connection between PayPal and Indiegogo? Or is PayPal just performing a dick move?
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Because fuck you, that's why. Also, they keep bribing congressmen to not regulate them so there is no enforced law saying they can't do that.
Re:What right does PayPal have? (Score:5, Informative)
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Funny; I don't see it there.
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Why people voluntarily continue to use PayPal is beyond me. There are an increasing number of less evil alternatives.
People use paypal because people know about paypal. I use paypal to buy stuff because it works. Nobody takes google payments. I suspect there's two reasons for that, and only one is inertia. Everyone has a paypal payment module because it's easy. Not everyone has a google payments module, perhaps it's not as easy.
I hope PayPal becomes a relic of the past, like AltaVista and other things I can no longer remember.
Me too, but it doesn't seem likely. eBay/Paypal, it's a tight combination.
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Google recommends Braintree (Score:3)
Google Checkout will be retired on November 20, 2013
For sellers of "digital goods" (whatever that means [gnu.org]), Google Wallet will remain open [google.com]. For sellers of physical goods, Google recommends Braintree [google.com]. I'm under the impression that Google was shamed into closing Google Checkout for physical goods after one of Microsoft's "Scroogled" ad campaigns, which protested the fact that sellers could see buyers' postal codes.
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There's one website I know of which had a choice between PP and Google Wallet. I don't even have a PP account because they're well known for this kind of crap.
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You get raped with CC fees if you use a traditional processor, that's a last-resort option. I have a Square account and all that, but I only have it so that I can accept payments face to face from someone without cash, not so that I can accept web payments.
The writing has been on the wall for years... (Score:2)
Paypal freezing is old news (Score:5, Informative)
Paypal froze Notch's account after Mincraft went gold and began selling. Supposedly in just one day he managed to get over one hundred thousand dollars in sales which prompted paypal to freeze his account.
This is thanks to the US patriot act [wikipedia.org], bank secrecy act [wikipedia.org] and possibly some other nanny state laws. Large transactions are red flagged and reported. The owner of the account must provide an explanation of what they are doing with the money. This is one of those risk mitigation plans we were talking about the other day which helps the US government find the "bad guys". Eventually paypal will unfreeze the account once they learn the money won't be used for terrorism, drugs, racketeering or other boogeyman bullshit. I feel safer already.
Re:Paypal freezing is old news (Score:5, Insightful)
Paypal froze Notch's account after Mincraft went gold and began selling. Supposedly in just one day he managed to get over one hundred thousand dollars in sales which prompted paypal to freeze his account.
This is thanks to the US patriot act [wikipedia.org], bank secrecy act [wikipedia.org] and possibly some other nanny state laws. Large transactions are red flagged and reported. The owner of the account must provide an explanation of what they are doing with the money. This is one of those risk mitigation plans we were talking about the other day which helps the US government find the "bad guys". Eventually paypal will unfreeze the account once they learn the money won't be used for terrorism, drugs, racketeering or other boogeyman bullshit. I feel safer already.
As if Paypal unfroze Notch's account out of the goodness of their hearts. No, the only way to get unfrozen is to have a huge crowd of fans making a big stink and generating lots of bad press. Does anyone remember Something Awful's Katrina fund [somethingawful.com]? Paypal will try to steal your money, or at least sit on it for as long as they can to make interest on it. That this is a surprise to anyone is a surprise to me. (yes, that is what I meant to say there)
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What? PayPal freezing accounts has nothing to do with bank regulation and everything to do with the fact that they're not a bank. Think of PayPal like a shifty uncle who offers to let you store your money in his safe. Store too much and he might decide to keep it, and there's not a goddamn thing you can do about it.
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Paypal froze Notch's account after Mincraft went gold and began selling. Supposedly in just one day he managed to get over one hundred thousand dollars in sales which prompted paypal to freeze his account.
This is thanks to the US patriot act [wikipedia.org], bank secrecy act [wikipedia.org] and possibly some other nanny state laws. Large transactions are red flagged and reported. The owner of the account must provide an explanation of what they are doing with the money. This is one of those risk mitigation plans we were talking about the other day which helps the US government find the "bad guys". Eventually paypal will unfreeze the account once they learn the money won't be used for terrorism, drugs, racketeering or other boogeyman bullshit. I feel safer already.
Actually put this way, and after what's happened recently with the US going after bitcoin companies for money laundering...it actually makes sense for paypal to protect itself (from the government) by making a reasonable attempt to verify that the money passing through it is not obviously money in the process of being laundered.
High time to stop using PayPal? (Score:3)
Shit man, that was 14 years ago. You know, when they started abusing accounts under protection of "not a bank".
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Worse than this, I have friends that tell me, "Oh no PayPal is fine, just only use it for sending money, not receiving."
No, just no. By supporting them you are helping perpetuate the scam that is PayPal. How do you think they make money? By getting people to use their service.
Stop supporting people that make PayPal possible, and they will disappear.
This seems like a no brainer. (Score:2)
The second I do something like this where I have a large amount in there, I'm switching to another service.
I've been hearing horror stories like this since they froze the Paypal account of the dude who made minecraft.
War on Privacy (Score:4, Informative)
Anyone who is funding any project that the US government does not like should know better than to use Paypal at this point.
Paypal is a tool of the US government, for whatever reason(s). and this is hardly the first time they use Paypal as an attack vector.
I use it because I have to (Score:2)
It take a bit of diligence on my part, but this way if my account is frozen, or some
WTF? (Score:2)
Seriously WTF?
Since when is it any of PayPals business what people use their accounts for?
Oh, right, because PayPal likes to act like a bank when it's convenient, and then loudly say "we're not a bank" when they don't want to do something a bank couldn't do.
Yet another reason why I think PayPal are assh
Indiegogo (Score:5, Insightful)
Considering how many Indiegogo campaigns this has happened to, I'm surprised the service hasn't switched to one of Paypal's competitors yet. Otherwise this is going to drive projects to Indiegogo's competitors instead.
Remember, no. (Score:3)
Care, no...
Actually I do. I could care less about the project, who gives a fuck. Another bleeding heart FOSS is your friend bullshit waste of time and money.
But clearly since PayPal provides a crowdfunding platform they have a right to ask for LEGITIMATE reason to continue to fund a project if there is some question to how the money is being used, or no real information about the progress of a project.
I am tired of people rising to the defense of open source and crowdfunded projects without thinking. There is no reason to assume that you can be handed thousands of investor's money and then have no real business strategy, budget, or timeframe to deliver on your goals. If your investor asks for progress, you fucking provide it. If your investor is calling you out, you better cover your ass with legitimate paperwork.
So suck it up MailPile. You thought you could create some crowdfunded bullshit project, take the money from tens of thousands of people that will just throw anything at FOSS out of some vapid belief it matters and then provide what; a reskin of some existing open source mail program and call it a day?
Hey, if MailPile is legitimate and well organized that information should be trivial and readily obtained so feed it to PayPal and tell them to shut the fuck up. But if its a bunch of stoners thinking they got away with ripping off a bunch of retards through PayPal, they should guess again.
I think PayPal is clearly in the right here to ask for some information about how the money is being spent considering they offered the opportunity to have this project funded through their organization.
Bam
https://developer.paypal.com/webapps/developer/docs/classic/lifecycle/crowdfunding/ [paypal.com]
Time to RTF-Guidlines
Comment removed (Score:4, Informative)
you may not like it but, yeah, it is (Score:4, Informative)
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Gay IS a widely used synonym for "bad". But of course, it is also used to describe sexual orientation. We all know this, and all the arguing about it is silly.
What is NOT silly is determining if we're going to let this continue. We all understand that using the word Niggerdly in polite company is rather gauche. Niggerdly has a meaning, and it's not very flattering. It's not a good word to use. Gay needs to become like that.
Lets find a new word for Bad/Stupid. We all have friends/coworkers that are gay.
Re:Depends on what you do via Gaypal (Score:4, Insightful)
Did you mean this word [merriam-webster.com]?
Yes, sometimes being one letter off makes a whole heap of difference.
Not that I would be inclined to use either one of them, since I have some idea what might (not) be good for me.
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Niggardly [etymonline.com] and the other word are false cognates.It's not a good choice of word these days because it will most likely be mis-understood by a significant number of people.
Gay is interesting since it's use for homosexual is just as much slang as it's use for bad. meanwhile, bad==good and many years ago it was noted that you gotta be hot if you wanna be cool.
While it certainly was a slur against homosexsuals to use gay for bad at one time, it's not clear that the association is intended anymore, though like n
Re: (Score:2)
Since most donation-based projects ultimately want USD or EUR, they need an easy way to convert BTC donations to their target fiat currency. The days of easy conversions of BTC to fiat are pretty much over. Governments are increasingly seeking to regulate (or eliminate) the BTC currency markets, making this even more of a mine field than Paypal.
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from paypal to ManSlave
That would be sexist.
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If someone started doing this; they should start with larger, more dangerous targets, like the executives of Goldman Sachs, who've basically stolen 7 trillion from the American people.
Chargebacks (Score:3)
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Did you actually demand your money back from PayPal? I think people should do exactly that now ... because of the money being blocked. Then donate it by another means.
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Paypal has no right to withhold funds on demand of this information, that money belongs to the organization.
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I stopped using PayPal a few years ago. I forgot to renew the card it was associated when it expired. When I tried to update the details PayPal had blocked the account and refused to re-active unless I provided photographic ID. What, pray tell, do PayPal want or need with photographic ID? So, I, being the level headed and rational individual I am, smelled a huge fetid rat and stopped using their 'services.'
One good reason is to prevent forgotten/inactive accounts from being fraudulently reactivated for nefarious purposes (id theft, money laundering, whatever). Asking for proof of identity seems like a good security measure to me, not some nefarious scheme to - well what were you afraid of exactly?
I'm beginning to realize that despite genuine problematic behavior on their part, a lot of the PayPal hate seems to be the result of knee-jerk "I didn't get what I want so they suck", a whopping dose of conspiracy a