41% of Chinese Websites Shut Down In 2010 203
BinaryMage found a pretty shocking bit- apparently the Chinese government has shut down 1.3 million websites in 2010, an incredible 41% of all sites behind the great firewall. The usual reasons (pornography) are cited, as well as the reminder that China blocks Facebook, Twitter, and YouTube from its citizens. Anyone behind the firewall know if Slashdot is currently blocked? I've heard it varies.
To answer your question (Score:5, Informative)
I am in P.R. China and I have never had trouble accessing Slashdot. In fact, it is so reliable that it is the site I typically check if I want to see if the internet connection is working.
Re:To answer your question (Score:4, Funny)
Re:To answer your question (Score:5, Interesting)
I've been a daily Slashdot reader since 1997, and I've been exploring China since March of this year. The only time that I've ever had Slashdot blocked was with the Falen Gong article a couple of months back. Apparently, there was a url keyword detection routine which filtered the page out. Every other page has loaded just fine. Fortunately, since I have a shell account on a U.S. server, ssh -D [port] got around it quite nicely.
I'm not sure how it is in the rest of the country, but here in Kunming, if you run a website, you have to have it registered with the police, which means that someone is probably periodically checking on your site to make sure that the content is considered appropriate and "harmonious." It is definitely a big brother approach, but considering the situation with the cameras in London, Homeland Security in the U.S., and the filtering in Australia, I really can't see an open web besides perhaps a couple of the European countries. To be honest, it reminds me an awful lot of the early gated communities like AOL, only this time, we're dealing with government rather than corporate interests.
Youtube, Dailymotion, Twitter, Facebook, and other such sites are blocked on a constant basis requiring a VPN or SOCKS proxy to get around. It's a bit of an annoyance, but most people around here simply use the native Chinese versions and don't notice anything of the outside world. It's only us foreigners that really know what's going on.
On the one plus side, China Telecom has a 3G mobile data plan with a 100 hour per month limit. I haven't found a data cap on it yet, and I used 17GiB last month watching Stargate: Universe. It's 500 yuan for the adapter and 400 yuan for six months, which works to ~67 yuan, or slightly over $10 per month use. Take that, AT&T!
Whenever I finish exploring here and get to Europe, I'll get a chance to see how all of you fancy Europeans have been haggling us Americans about our data plans and cell phones for years. ;-)
Re:To answer your question (Score:5, Insightful)
>It is definitely a big brother approach, but considering the situation with the cameras in London, Homeland Security in the U.S., and the filtering in Australia,
Cameras in public spaces or being searched before getting on a plane have nothing to do with state enforced censorship. I'm not sure why so many Chinese find it believable that their limits of expression are normal and fit in with the West. They don't. Its just propaganda to make you feel better and not to try any pesky revolution or uprising.
Re:To answer your question (Score:4, Interesting)
It's interesting that you should use the word "normal" in your post, because here in China, Internet filtering is indeed normal, the same way that you would considering post-9/11 groping to be normal and being constantly watched in the streets of London normal. Do I agree with it? Certainly not, but every place has its own culture and laws, and for the most part, the modern Chinese people are getting along just fine without trying to fit in with Western ideals.
It's actually quite amazing to me how much China has progressed from the days of the Cultural Revolution though. Between all of the new high-tech buildings, the girls in miniskirts out on the streets, the new high speed train which rivals the Japanese, and the huge influx of luxury items, it's hard to believe that this was a nation torn apart and hungry just half a century ago. Now, I believe that the Bill of Rights (not the Constitution itself, due to that nasty 3/5th compromise) is one of the greatest ideas in history, but China has placed economic freedom above political freedom in its efforts to pacify its people, and having a chance to be here and talk to various people, I've actually found that it's working decently well.
Not every place is like the U.S., but not every place is like the Middle East either. I really don't know how the "China model," as it's often called, is going to end up, but to be honest, propaganda is everywhere. How many times have you watched a commercial where everything was true? How many people do you know who watch Fox news or listen to Rush Limbaugh? Even NPR and the BBC have their own biases. How many actual, purely objective articles can you find in the mainstream media? Certainly, we don't have the state mandated media in the U.S. like China does, but the important thing to accept is that everyone has their own propaganda, no matter where they are. It's just a matter of which ones you agree with and which ones you don't.
Do the things that work for the U.S. automatically work in China? It's going to be very interesting to find out in the next ten to twenty years as China continues developing and opening up to the world. I'm curious to see how this huge housing bubble and the enormous debts of the local governments are going to turn out, but there's no denying China's growth and advancement in the last 30 years. With Russia's fade from glory, I'm hoping that some competition can get the U.S. out of its current funk and start being the country that we're capable of being. If not, China will be glad to sell us everything that we need, and once they get past the copying stage and start innovating for themselves, it's going to be scary.
Re:To answer your question (Score:4, Interesting)
Now, I believe that the Bill of Rights (not the Constitution itself, due to that nasty 3/5th compromise) is one of the greatest ideas in history
Interestingly, the point of the 3/5 compromise was to kill slavery. If a slave counted for one person for purposes of representation, the slave states would have 2/5ths more representation than they got under the actual Constitution. They would have used that extra representation to hang on to slavery for as long as possible.
This is one of the most misunderstood concepts in American history.
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but to be honest, propaganda is everywhere. How many times have you watched a commercial where everything was true? How many people do you know who watch Fox news or listen to Rush Limbaugh? Even NPR and the BBC have their own biases. How many actual, purely objective articles can you find in the mainstream media? Certainly, we don't have the state mandated media in the U.S. like China does, but the important thing to accept is that everyone has their own propaganda, no matter where they are. It's just a matter of which ones you agree with and which ones you don't.
Yes, it's human nature that organized groups enjoy pushing their own agenda, and are willing to hide certain facts or bend the truth in order to do it. When governments do it, we call it propaganda. When companies do it, we call it advertising. It's everywhere.
The critical difference here is what a government does when you publicly disagree with its propaganda. You mentioned the Bill of Rights; consider Freedom of Speech. Yeah, it's not carte blanche to say whatever you want (you can't scream "Fire!" in a c
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In this way I think, sadly, that the Chinese are just buying in to the "we're rich therefore we're right" concept, right as America is FINALLY starting to admit that the ideology has decimated so many facets of our society.
I hope you Chinese citizens don't spend as long wallowing in your own supposed superiority as we did. Wasted some of the best years of our society so far on complete nothingness.
Re:To answer your question (Score:4, Informative)
Ooh, the culture card. To oppose Internet censorship is to be provincial, parochial, imperialist, colonialist, or whatever the bad word is today. Imagine how silly it would be if someone from some other culture objecting to TSA groping were to be told that the US was getting along just fine without trying to fit into that other culture's ideals.
You do understand that it was the free states which wanted a slave counted as zero, and the slave states who wanted a slave counted as a full person, for the purposes of representation?
Indeed it is. Enjoy your job at the (Chinese) Ministry of Propaganda.
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Does Immigration & Customs Enforcement (ICE) not ring any bells for you? At the behest of Disney, et al, they're stealing domain names, often on the flimsiest of evidence.
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You know what site my U.S. govt censors? None. Not a single one. They do shut down a handful of sites though. ...
So shutting a site down doesn't count as censorship? That's certainly an, uh, "interesting" interpretation of the words. Do you by any chance work for Homeland Security? Or just in advertising? ;-)
Someone else has already pointed out the story of the US government forcibly taking over domain names. I suppose some people might also not consider that to be censorship, since you can still use the numeric IP address.
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"China has placed economic freedom above political freedom"
What 'economic freedom'? What are you talking about? Almost 85% of the population are dirt poor.
The model of capitalism is that it is OK to have the majority of the population poor, just as long as the rich are getting richer. Oh yes, and in theory this wealth mysteriously trickles down to everyone thanks to the generosity and public-mindedness of the rich capitalists.
In practice, the majority have to fight for a share of the wealth, starting with organising themselves into unions.
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They were obviously talking about how the UK is using the internet to police cctv cameras (extremely big brotherish)
And how does this amount to censorship by the government? Please explain, I'm obviously missing something.
Or is it just a "teh evil gobmint...using r intarwebz!" knee jerk reaction?
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Yep, ignorance is bliss.
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I haven't found a data cap on it yet, and I used 17GiB last month
17 Gigs ?? Wow ... I once went to 370 Gigs with mine here in Europe (downloaded a bunch of Bluray movies) and nothing happened.
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It is definitely a big brother approach, but considering the situation with the cameras in London, Homeland Security in the U.S., and the filtering in Australia, I really can't see an open web
If you are referring to CCTV cameras, what do publicly sited cameras have to do with the web?
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The Chinese are more like Americans than you expected?
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In fact, it is so reliable that it is the site I typically check if I want to see if the internet connection is working.
You don't do that by clicking any of the article links, do you?
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Why would it, anyone with reasonable intelligence wouldn't believe a word on Slashdot anyways. Slanted Stories, Comments from numbskulls like me who just debate people and often will just play devils advocate just to keep things interesting and fight off boredom.
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wouldn't believe a word on Slashdot anyways. Slanted Stories, Comments from numbskulls like me who just debate people and often will just play devils advocate
So... you're saying that since you're playing devil's advocate, Slashdot comments are perfectly trustworthy?
But that would mean that you're sincere, which would mean that... so, if I asked you which door the white knight would tell the black knight to go through that didn't lead to certain death... what would Douglas Hofstadter answer?
(Trick question! Douglas Hofstadter always answers "Douglas Hofstadter".)
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I am in P.R. China and I have never had trouble accessing Slashdot. In fact, it is so reliable that it is the site I typically check if I want to see if the internet connection is working.
Why don't you just use Google like most people? Oh, wait...
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Sorry to bust your bubble; but, Google works fine too. It does default to a Chinese version; but, there is a redirect link on the page to go to the English version.
What doesn't work, as some have alluded to, is youtube and facebook. Yes, there are workarounds; but, I haven't gotten any of the free workarounds to work.
Re:To answer your question (Score:4, Informative)
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It's like how anyone who uses the phrase "USAian" is an idiot, because, among other things, there are two countries on the American continents with "United States" in their name, while there's only one with "America."
Claiming that Americans has a right to the name because it's the only country on the continent with America in the name is disingenuous, because by that measure, the only Africans are those from South Africa.
"United States Virgin Islands" isn't causing ambiguity, because the citizens of that state are ALSO citizens of the United States of America.
"United Mexican States" isn't causing ambiguity, because it's not United States, it's United Mexican States.
America, on the other hand, is ambiguous, because it al
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Natural languages evolve in non-obvious ways. In English, American means "citizen of native of the USA", and nothing else. This has nothing to do with someone "usurping" the word - it's just the way it is. In other languages (e.g. Spanish, I believe?) things are different, but this has no relation to proper use of the word in English. The fact that some people are so mad about this whole issue would be funny if it weren't so sad.
(I'm not an American)
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In English, American means "citizen of native of the USA", and nothing else.
Um, no, it doesn't.
Webster says:
American A*mer"i*can ([.a]*m[~e]r"[i^]*kan), a. [Named from
Americus Vespucius.]
1. Of or pertaining to America; as, the American continent:
American Indians.
[1913 Webster]
2. Of or pertaining to the United States. "A young officer of
the American navy." --Lyell.
[1913 Webster]
Merriam-Webster says:
Pronunciation: [snipped due to /. not handling unicode]
Function:noun
Date:1568
1: an American Indian of North America or South America
2: a native or inhabitant of North America or South America
3: a citizen of the United States
4: american english
Collins says:
American ([snipped due to /. not handling unicode])
- adj
1. of or relating to the United States of America, its inhabitants, or their form of English
2. of or relating to the American continent
- n
3. a native or citizen of the US
4. a native or inhabitant of any country of North, Central, or South America
5. the English language as spoken or written in the United States
Collins English Dictionary - Complete & Unabridged 10th Edition
2009 © William Collins Sons & Co. Ltd. 1979, 1986 © HarperCollins
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Yes, USAian is silly. Use US American unless it's clear from the context that you mean someone from USA.
The American continents are a big place. (Technically, they're TWO big places.) There is a wide variety of... well, pretty much everything. The richest people on Earth live here, but so do some of the poorest. Every kind of terrain, from Arctic tundra to sweltering desert, is represented. There are democratic republics and communist dictatorships. And there's no central government overseeing the whole thing.
Europe is more homogeneous in pretty much all those ways. (There's also the EU, which is supposed to
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I love it when people call China the P.R. or People's Republic... Such a delusional misrepresentation. Do you HONESTLY think that it is YOUR republic and YOU have control? ...
So how is this different from the American use of the term "public" to mean "owned by the government"? One could easily see a certain level of cynicism here, since very few of the people who use such terminology would expect that they could just start using any "public property" as their own, and not get arrested and charged with a crime.
The streets on two sides of our yard would be called "public" by nearly everyone, but if I were to start digging up the pavement and converting it to an extension of m
but where would you put it? (Score:2)
I'll take two!
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Hello, China? I think I have something you may want, but it's gonna cost you. Yeah. That's right. All the tea.
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No love for Xinjiang? Darn Tibetans get all the attention...
Not blocked (Score:5, Informative)
Slashdot is not blocked in China, but citizens are forced to use older browsers that choke on Slashdot's excessive CSS and Javascript goodness. The result is an experience - not unlike my own - that makes Slashdot increasingly too annoying a site to visit.
Re:Not blocked (Score:4, Informative)
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Stop using a computer from 1996 then.
Why should he?
Re:Not blocked (Score:5, Insightful)
./ is annoying in new browsers too. I can't click a link anymore without the page doing a random scroll-jump instead. Same for middleclicking, or trying to moderate something, or anything else that requires clicking any of the 3 mouse buttons on ./.
Furthermore it often shows an eternal "loading" spinning thing at the bottom.
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I'm using Firefox 5 and all is good. Are you using IE or is your idea of "new browsers" Firefox 3 and IE5?
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I'm using Firefox 5 and get exactly the same symptoms he is. I'd love to know what I'm doing wrong.
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I'm in the US using Chrome and I have this problem when I come to a comment thread from the notification email and everything except the last reply is hidden. Every click involved in replying to the new comment uncollapses the next level up, and jumps to it. I usually have to click the text box 4-5 times before it will let me type a reply.
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FF4.
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What he describes can be observed when you have a post open, but several of its parents collapsed. This does not normally occur on article pages, but is what you see when you click on the link in those "you've got a reply to your comment" notification emails. Alternatively, here [slashdot.org] is a link that will display your own post that way.
Now go there, and try to click on any of the words in your post (e.g. assuming that you're trying to select them to copy/paste). Notice how it expands the parent post and moves focu
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I thought it expanded the parent for me when I click on my post so I can review or cut and paste out something I want to comment on. When I click on "Reply to This" it again centers on the cursor in the Comment box. I guess I'm used to gui interfaces automating things for me if I want them to or not so I ignore it. Regardless. That is not a "random scroll jump" IMHO. I thought he was actually getting random focus points, which is still possible. If not then he should have added "Get off my lawn" so we
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Protip: if it ain't broken, stop trying to FIX it!
You are like so Web 1.0 you probably prefer serif fonts.
Re:Not blocked (Score:5, Informative)
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The sliders seem to remember their position across all devices - they must be associated with a login - so setting them from your desktop browser should keep working on the phone/tablet.
I wish I could just switch to Classic, but then I lose the ability to expand child comments, and have to open them in new tabs, which is particularly inconvenient on mobile. Sometimes I think it would be easier to write a comment scraper (over Classic), and a sane UI on top of that - it would probably be faster than waiting
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I got so fed up with the threshold sliders not working, especially on my phone,
Holy crap, I cannot even begin to imagine how horrible slashdot would look on a phone.
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Argh, I just realized I typed ./ instead of /.
But hey, maybe it should not be called /. anymore with its current JS implementation :p
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Re:Not blocked (Score:4, Informative)
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Was there something wrong with good old HTTPS? Using ActiveX for encryption... now I have something new to give me nightmares.
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Maybe it lacked government backdoors?
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Good point. I wasn't thinking like a fascist.
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Last I checked, nothing prevents you from using IE for your online banking, and a different browser for everything else.
Indeed, only a few years ago it was very common to have to resort to such things in Western countries as well. There are many creative ways to break HTML in non-IE browsers other than ActiveX, and I have long suspected that knowing them all is part of the job interview for web developers in banking.
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"I'm in China and using Firefox 4.0"
Firefox 4 is an older browser.
I think Mozilla is working on version 8.0 right now. The official release is 5.01
Facebook and Youtube varies (Score:2, Informative)
Just spent 36 days in china.
Youtube would work maybe 1 or 2 clips, before you had to change connection.
Facebook, would work for an hour or so and then be offline for an hour. Keep bouncing up and down.
weird firewall (Score:2)
What causes this?
Are they blacklisting single videos on youtube? But why does changing the connection solve this? Are they listening in on your connection and modify blocks individually just for your session?
Why would they block a site (facebook) and then unblock it an hour later? The content is most likely unchanged.
Are they using a rand() to decide on blocks?
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if Slashdot is currently blocked? (Score:2)
Short answer: No.
Longer answer: Usually no. It has been blocked a couple of times in the last few years, but that usually only lasted one day, or half a day. The fact that /. was blocked was probably a mistake in filter manipulation. It's not blocked, because probably the firewall admins waste their days away, lounging here too?
Quick experiment for you /.ers currently in China (Score:5, Interesting)
Anything happen when you search Tiananmen in the Slashdot searchbox? It used to time out the entire domain for me.
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Just tried it here from Kunming with the results:
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Yahoo Confirms Beijing Blocking Flickr 163
what is the status of flickr, btw? is that viewable in china?
I bought some item from china and it was defective. had to email them for an rma; and it seems currently the 'fashion' to have to take a picture of the item (??) before they'll allow an rma. not sure what that's about - a photo could be of anything! but to them, its some kind of 'proof' (go figure!)
so I pointed the guy at my flickr page where I took a photo of the defective item. he claimed he could n
Re:Quick experiment for you /.ers currently in Chi (Score:5, Interesting)
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Great, now people in China can't read this story about China. Thanks a lot jack-ass!
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Oh... In that case I'd like to rescind my previous comment and offer the AC a high-five. Now if you'll excuse me, I'm off to brush up on history.
Did News Corp buy slashdot? (Score:2, Insightful)
there were were 41% fewer websites at the end of 2010 than a year earlier.
This does not mean that 41% of the sites were shut down by the government. In fact, nowhere in the article does it say the websites were "shut down" at all. There are many other reasons websites go offline, like people getting bored of maintaining them, their not being popular, their failing to make a profit or break even, etc. Sensationalistic reporting, now on slash!
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There are many other reasons websites go offline
All the pr0n is downloaded.
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this document [cnnic.cn] of the .cn-registry is interesting.
sure, the thing is biased but take a look at page 23:
In the first half year of 2010, the number of internet sites in the globe has fallen and that in China has declined synchronously. According to the statistics of Netcraft, in the first half year of 2010, the number of internet sites in the world has been decreased by 27 million7, with a drop of 11.5%. An important reason for the drop of total sites is the expiration of web hosting services.
TFA compares end of 2009 with end of 2010, the survey is unfortunately older (June 2010) so it is not possible to see the same data from the 2 different POVs...
Zhao Lianhai begs to differ (Score:2)
he was sentenced to prison (in part) for running a website about the poisoned baby milk scandal.
its not hard to explain why that happened. there was no boredom involved.
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And you would be sentenced to prison for not submitting to a TSA pat-down. Moral of the story - breaking the laws of your country result in jail.
By the way, this has nothing to do with the other 1,299,999 websites that disappeared from the internet. But I guess this is the kind of rationalization you need to construct when you live in a country that tells you every day how free you are, when really you're no better off than anyone else and much worse off than quite a few. Yeah, keep focusing on those exce
False summary (Score:3)
I haven't read the BBC article but have read this in the local Hong Kong paper today.
Lots of sites closed, but the opinions vary on why. The state-sponsored bodies in China claim it is because most of those sites went bankrupt, while others (mainly foreign human-rights activists) claim it's the government forcing them to close. Fact is lots of sites closed, yet the total number of pages available is a whopping 90 billion. Yes that's like 70 pages for every Chinese citizen. And many more if you only count Chinese Internet users.
Some web sites are for sure closed by the government, mainly for pornography, but also sometimes for political speech. Though it seems the Chinese actually enjoy quite some freedom on-line.
And Twitter not available from within China, who cares when you have Weibo? Most Chinese can't read English anyway. And no Google? Well they have Baidu.
Yes it's censored, but no they don't miss out on too much functionality either. It's not that the Chinese can not do those things by themselves, and they do it in Chinese catering to Chinese users. It may be an American viewpoint but all the time I hear "no YouTube, no Google, no Twitter" as if that's the complete Internet?! I'm happy there is more than those few sites. Much more.
And on the importance of Twitter in China... how many non-Chinese will ever look at what's going on on Weibo?
i just posted a link to Weibo in a /. article (Score:2)
a few weeks ago.
it was about how some people got 18 months in prison for industrial espionage... what were they spying on?
the size and shape of the ipad 2. they were going to make cases for it, before it was released.
im glad the chinese communist party caught these horrific criminals and put them in jail.
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I signed up for a Weibo account last week. I've had a Renren account (Chinese Facebook clone) for over a year now. I can't effectively use either of them due to language difficulties. Really need to practice my Chinese reading. So this gives some insight into how Chinese people view western sites. They just can use them - so they don't care that they are blocked. Why would you worry that Youtube is blocked when you have all the videos you need on Youkou or Tudou.
If it was blocked... (Score:2)
How the heck would you expect them to post on here saying so?
Durr.
subject (Score:2)
I wish the Chinese government were at least partly as zealous about shutting down forum spammers.
Porn (Score:3, Funny)
Almost think that the takeaway from this article is that 41% of websites in china are porn,
Gweilo say Falun Gong is tops (Score:2)
Wikipedia (Score:2)
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China stopped allowing anonymous domains (Score:2)
This is because China stopped allowing undocumented domain registration. [washingtonpost.com] Registering a domain in China now requires a national ID and a business license. GoDaddy then stopped registering ".cn" domains, probably a good thing.
Re:Chine (Score:5, Funny)
Wikipedia says it's the French name for China. The Grammar Nazi in me was saddened to hear that.
Not really, the French have a history of accomodating Nazis.
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Not really, the French have a history of accommodating Nazis.
[citation needed]
[history lesson needed]
Try starting with Vichy France [wikipedia.org]
Re:Pr0nography?? (Score:5, Funny)
In a more enlightened atheist society this would never happen!
Only according to a typically immoral, decadent liberal.
In a socialist society, both men and women will have respectable employment and not turn to work in pornography to make a living. The reification of private intimacy to marketed commodity is the very height of alienation; on the other hand, it still exists outside the market as a homemade expression of individualist nihilism, the consistent self-indulgent stamp of the culture industry that has appropriated and homogenized everything in its contact. Sex is replaced with watching sex. Social bonds break down as partners become as interchangeable as the URL in the browser. It is the another illegitimacy in the wake of Enlightenment subjective rationality: that only the method by which free speech is achieved may be debated, while the objective remains as a dictator.
Not to suggest that China has much communist credibility remaining these days...
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Sofi Oksanen begs to differ (Score:2)
consider her two books, "Stalin's Cows" and "Purge"
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The Nazi apologists always disagree.
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Your entire counter-argument rests upon conflating happiness with the consumption of pornography. You're a simple pervert manipulating my post in a weak attempt to justify your own shameful lifestyle to yourself.
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I know two ladies and one guy in pornography.
Names and pix or it didn't happen.
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Well, apparently CmdrTaco took your corrections. If I didn't miss something, the only difference now is "bit-"/"article -" (missing space after bit BTW, and it should be an em dash "—", not an hyphen-minus "-").
However, you didn't correct what I believe is another grammatical error :
"Anyone behind the firewall know" : Shouldn't that be "Anyone behind the firewall knows" ? Or is that a valid ellipsis with an interrogative form : "(Does) anyone behind the firewall know" ?
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Chine is french for China, maybe he wanted to be smug!
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That's the nitpicking park. Obviously a typo.
Typos are excusable in hastily written emails or posts to internet forums, not as fucking news headlines on a serious web site.
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I stopped reading at "Re:".
I mean, it's the next logical step after NRTFA and NRTFS.