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The Courts Government Privacy News

Swedish ISP Deletes Customer ID Info 177

NewYorkCountryLawyer writes "A Swedish internet service provider, Bahnhof, has begun deleting customer identification information in order to prevent it from being used as evidence against its customers under Sweden's new legislation against copyright infringement via peer-to-peer file sharing. According to this report on 'The Local,' it is entirely legal for it to do so. The company's CEO, Jon Karlung, is identified as 'a vociferous opponent of the measures that came into force on April 1st,' and is quoted saying that he is determined to protect the company's clients, and that 'It's about the freedom to choose, and the law makes it possible to retain details. We're not acting in breach of IPRED; we're following the law and choosing to destroy the details.'"
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Swedish ISP Deletes Customer ID Info

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  • Wow (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Spazztastic ( 814296 ) <> on Friday April 17, 2009 @12:57PM (#27615823)
    Buy the guy who made that decision a beer. Kudos, Bahnhof.
  • This guy is a hero (Score:5, Insightful)

    by BadAnalogyGuy ( 945258 ) <> on Friday April 17, 2009 @12:59PM (#27615877)

    And sometimes heroes get arrested and thrown in jail for obstructing justice.

  • Re:Wow (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Aladrin ( 926209 ) on Friday April 17, 2009 @12:59PM (#27615885)

    While I love this decision also, I find it sad that we now applaud people who want to take care of their customers... Didn't that used to be a given?

  • I hope... (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Narnie ( 1349029 ) on Friday April 17, 2009 @12:59PM (#27615889)
    I hope this won't be like what happens in the US where the company deletes data, but when pressured by the courts, they happen to recover a backup.
  • Re:Wow (Score:4, Insightful)

    by TheGratefulNet ( 143330 ) on Friday April 17, 2009 @12:59PM (#27615891)

    I'll buy an ACCOUNT on his server. even though I don't live anywhere near there.

    this guy IS a hero!

  • That's it... (Score:3, Insightful)

    by Chabo ( 880571 ) on Friday April 17, 2009 @01:01PM (#27615929) Homepage Journal

    I'm moving to Sweden.

    Anyone want to hire me?

  • Re:Wow (Score:2, Insightful)

    by TheGratefulNet ( 143330 ) on Friday April 17, 2009 @01:02PM (#27615933)

    find it sad that we now applaud people who want to take care of their customers..

    modern age: 2 kinds of 'customers':

    - the ones that pay the bills by buying your products or services
    - the other kind that shows up with as a band of thugs bearing guns and badges

    the first one you can abuse and refuse. the 2nd one, well, not so much.

    welcome to the brave new world.

  • Re:Wow (Score:5, Insightful)

    by MozeeToby ( 1163751 ) on Friday April 17, 2009 @01:03PM (#27615967)

    Better yet, if you live in Sweden move your Internet connection over to his ISP. This is a very rare chance to financially support someone who is trying to protect your privacy while having little net cost for yourself.

  • by DarrenBaker ( 322210 ) <> on Friday April 17, 2009 @01:06PM (#27616061) Homepage

    ... and you'll be charged with destruction of evidence, and obstruction of justice, and almost assuredly, they'll think you complicit, because silence = guilt here.

  • by IanHurst ( 979275 ) on Friday April 17, 2009 @01:24PM (#27616453)
    in 3... 2... 1...
  • by javakah ( 932230 ) on Friday April 17, 2009 @01:32PM (#27616609)

    Preview of next months news:

    Swedish authorities discover that ISPs deleting cutomer ID info has led to them being unable to determine the ID of file sharers, but also child pornographers, terrorists, people threatening suicide, etc.

    New laws will be up for debate trying to outlaw deleting this kind of customer ID info, with privacy groups outraged.

    (Not advocating anything here, just figuring this is where this is going.)

  • Re:Wow (Score:2, Insightful)

    by spoilsportmotors ( 1251392 ) on Friday April 17, 2009 @01:41PM (#27616767)
    Case in point: working for money and customer support are not mutually exclusive.
    Watch for people asking where to sign up...
  • by Archangel Michael ( 180766 ) on Friday April 17, 2009 @01:50PM (#27616925) Journal

    Welcome to the world of Government intrusion into every aspect of our lives.

    The camel is in the tent. The Elephant is in the living room. We are sliding down the slippery slope. The Frog in the pan is getting well done.

    The problem is, one cannot have privacy, if the government controls everything, because they will claim a need to know.

    And how many of you people want government run health care? You think the government will want to keep your health info private?

    Progressives want what they want, until it is too late to realize that what they want is contrary to freedom. One cannot have freedom while being compelled by threat of force to do ANYTHING.

  • by hesaigo999ca ( 786966 ) on Friday April 17, 2009 @01:52PM (#27616961) Homepage Journal

    They did nothing wrong, you were the one that did when you decided to torrent a file, not them, they did not twist your arm did they. If i build something and you use it for something of an evil nature, then who is the wrong one here?

  • by JohnnyKrisma ( 593145 ) on Friday April 17, 2009 @02:07PM (#27617271)
    I doubt that could be the actual charge. Obstructing justice usually means there's an ongoing case with actual defendants. This is more like obstructing potential justice... or witch hunts.
  • by Xest ( 935314 ) on Friday April 17, 2009 @02:12PM (#27617383)

    A fairly recent round of laws to come into play for all EU member states specifies that data like this must be retained for 6months.

    But fuck the legality of it, he may be in the wrong legally, but he's one of the few ISPs in the right morally. It's just a shame more wont stand up across the industry and do this.

    I find it odd that the EU recognises that storing people's DNA on a DNA database when they're innocent and haven't been convicted of any crime is clearly wrong, but that on the flip side of it they support the storage of what people did and where on the internet.... even if people are innocent and haven't been convicted of any crime.

    It's just a shame they don't understand technology and the implications of their decisions related to it as well as they do real world justice.

  • Re:Wow (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Jugalator ( 259273 ) on Friday April 17, 2009 @02:18PM (#27617451) Journal

    Actually, that, combined with this, has made me consider a switch from Bredbandsbolaget (a major Sweidsh ISP) to them. They have pretty decent pricing too, and I have no problems at all with BBB -- rather to the contrary. But it would simply feel good to be an ISP customer where the CEO shared my ideals. :-) And know that they at least try to protect the privacy of their customers. That's so little of a given these days that it's scary.

  • Re:Wow (Score:1, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward on Friday April 17, 2009 @03:54PM (#27618933)

    What the CEO is doing is based on his right to run his company the way he feels like running it.

    This is a FREE MARKET concept that the American Conservatives support full hardly. The next law put forth to curtail piracy will have a fix for this loophole which will likely force the company to store data on customers for X amount of time. The government controlling a company is a Socialist ideal. The Tea Party, that was not put on by Fox News they just happened to be the only people reporting on thousands of people protesting the US governments overspending. This includes people who hated Bush's spending and hate Obama's spending plans and are fed up with government who spend and spend. Maybe if you read/watched anything besides the Liberal media you would be more educated.

  • Re:Wow (Score:2, Insightful)

    by Jared555 ( 874152 ) on Friday April 17, 2009 @04:00PM (#27619047)
    Why is this considered Troll? Because they say they don't fileshare or because they are mentioning a problem with a privacy supporting ISP?
  • by omglolbah ( 731566 ) on Friday April 17, 2009 @04:41PM (#27619653)

    By using such information for hunting file-sharers they pretty much breached the trust relationship with the ISP. If the ISP could keep the data and only give it out in cases of child porn I'm sure they would keep them.. But the law doesnt make that distinction so the only option left to protect his customers is to not keep the data.

    Actions have consequences. Sometimes an idea will bite you in the ass in unintended ways... Like the diesel-fuel added to processes in paper-production factories to get money even though diesel is not needed ;)

    People are creative, and people do what they can to get what they want. If the law allows it I do not see the problem with him doing it. He is forced into a corner.

  • Re:Wow (Score:5, Insightful)

    by causality ( 777677 ) on Friday April 17, 2009 @04:43PM (#27619683)

    Yep, pretty much. What's your point?

    Unfortunately a man who has his spine intact is a rare sight these days. Too many people don't understand that being petty and easily upset so that you respond with anger to whatever you dislike is the wrong kind of strength. That anger looks forceful and powerful but there is a great deal of cowardice behind it that comes from looking everywhere but within for your joy and your strength. Thus, anger is almost always about control of externals. It's also being strong in the wrong way because it is a compensation for weakness rather than a removal of weakness.

    What you have provided a good counter-example against are the people-pleasers who derive their being and their self-worth (of a worthless sort) from the approval of others. Thus, they have no idea how to be their own person and they have conflict and frustration because their life is not really theirs. Such people usually believe that they are living their own lives because they have personally identified with those external influences that control them, which is why this system is so effective and why so few come to understand it. It needs this deception to work, which is why understanding it is the same thing as having freedom from it.

    For you, it may be rather easy to understand that when you have a nation full of people with such weakness, it sets the stage for a powerful government to cater to it. If those people were whole and joyous and complete in the right way, the sort of comfort and security that government can offer would not be tempting to them. There are also economic and political reasons for it, of course, but this is the predecessor to fascism that no one in the media talks about. It is, in fact, the one enabler that makes all of the others possible. The mainstream media really can't talk about it and still have high ratings because most of the population has become this way. Of course, high ratings are more valuable to them than a chance to promote joyous, secure, sane people who cherish freedom. There's not much else to know about what sort of people they are.

  • Re:Wow (Score:2, Insightful)

    by Dextrously ( 1086289 ) on Friday April 17, 2009 @04:50PM (#27619759)

    Great! Now slashdot is guilty of being "Accessories to pirating" too. ;)

  • Re:I hope... (Score:3, Insightful)

    by rts008 ( 812749 ) on Friday April 17, 2009 @06:19PM (#27620951) Journal

    I hope this won't be like what happens in the US where the company deletes data, but when pressured by the courts, they happen to recover a backup.

    And when the courts pressure the gov't. for data, it's lost/unrecoverable.

    Sometimes I just have to wonder....

  • by Pig Hogger ( 10379 ) <pig.hogger@gmail.NETBSDcom minus bsd> on Friday April 17, 2009 @11:10PM (#27623327) Journal

    And how many of you people want government run health care? You think the government will want to keep your health info private?

    You goddammed fucking stupid moronic yankee. Only a yankee would be that stupid in his irrational stupid hatred of government.

    Everywhere there is GOVERNMENT HEALTH-INSURANCE (repeat: GOVERNMENT HEALTH-INSURANCE), the health info is KEPT PRIVATE (repeat yet again so it goes through your thick cranium: KEPT PRIVATE) because THE FUCKING GOVERNMENT IS ***NOT*** PROVIDING THE HEALTH-CARE, JUST PAYING FOR IT.


Where it is a duty to worship the sun it is pretty sure to be a crime to examine the laws of heat. -- Christopher Morley