Mexican Government To Document Cell Phone Use 232
Alyssey writes "The Mexican government wants to have a database to track every cellphone number in the country (in Spanish, Google translation) and whom it belongs to. They want to tie in the CURP (Unique Registration Population Code in Spanish, like the Social Security Number in the US) with cellphone numbers. If Mexicans don't send in their number and CURP via SMS before April 10, 2010, their cellphone number will be blocked. The new law was published back in February and is going into effect now."
Attention citizen (Score:2, Insightful)
Respond via SMS?
Sounds Phishy
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WOrse then Mexico (Score:2)
Only in the USA do they lock/tailor the phones to some sort of "plan". Everywhere else you just open an account then buy yourself a handset in a 'phone shop.
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I think all the telcos here (Australia) lock the phone if you buy it through them. They will unlock it for a fee, and I think they're required to unlock it free of charge once your contract expires. This only applies if your new handset is part of the contract. Most let you buy the phone outright and that should come unlocked.
Even so, if you buy a handset outright from a third party it'll come unlocked, and I've never heard of any of the telcos refusing a phone on their network which you didn't buy from the
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Nonsense. If you have a contract, any lock will be removed for free. Its only the prepaids that are normally locked, and then only for 6-12 months, or until you spend enough money or pay a fee.
Why would they lock the phone if you are already committed to a contract? Pure corporate greed, thats why. But fortunately the regulator will not allow it.
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Sprint/nextel have sim cards. They used to be built into the phones and I remember having to actually take one completely apart to remove one when I changed a phone once. Any phone you get now will most likely have a sim car somewhere in it. It just may be hidden and not considered user accessible.
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They do? Interesting...I thought they were only for the GSM phones?
Hmm, well looking here [wikipedia.org] it appears we both may be right. The equivalent in a UMTS phone is called a UICC, in a CDMA device, it might be a R-UI
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What I mean is situations like in the USA where if you want an iPhone you have to go with AT&T or where texting is regarded as an extra (ie. needs you to sign up for a 'premium' plan).
Around here I can walk into a shop, buy an iPhone, and it'll work. No plans have any kind of feature restrictions, I just get billed for what I use.
Prepaid phones. (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:Prepaid phones. (Score:5, Funny)
I don't have any information on prepaid phone providers in Mexico; if they're as prevalent as they are here in the States, how will this affect those users? Can you just register the phone as belonging to Inigo Montoya and be done with it?
Worst case, you need a fake id. Surely those are impossible to get in Mexico.
Re:Prepaid phones. (Score:5, Informative)
Actually, they'll be fingerprinting [telegraph.co.uk] people.
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Re:Prepaid phones. (Score:4, Insightful)
1) Use the phones of illegal immigrants crossing to America under the pretext of America tracking them.
2) Use the kidnapped persons phone.
3) Mug foreigners, and use their phone.
4) Make other people buy the phones.
5) Start own phone shop.
I don't understand why you would use a device that can track your position anyway to communicate a kidnapping/etc.... and those are just a few suggestions off the top of my head to circumvent the law. I would suggest that the police force in Mexico is undermanned and that is the real problem, not the cellphone usage.
Re:Prepaid phones. (Score:4, Insightful)
Undermanned?
I'm a photojournalist who works in the borderlands quite frequently.
Law enforcement in Mexico is an entrepreneurial exercise. They could have an order of magnitude more cops than they do, and it wouldn't make any difference in the world.
The present prohibition is making a class of narcolords who make Al Capone look like a big pussy.
These narcos have more money, more power and more influence than basically any other crime syndicate presently in existence. And it's moving north. Home invasions, kidnappings and drug rips are becoming the norm in suburbia anywhere within a few hundred miles of the border.
Legalizing marijuana (and possibly cocaine) would solve 96% of the problem overnight. Not to mention creating new revenue streams for the government, and maybe allowing the US to once again step behind Russia in the running to imprison the largest percentage of the population.
To the crowd: Face it. It's illegal. But your kids smoke it, your co-workers smoke it and you/your spouse smokes it. Its illegal status is not a deterrent. Wouldn't you rather know where it's coming from and that people aren't dying over it?
Legalize marijuana.
Re:Prepaid phones. (Score:5, Insightful)
I know more people that don't smoke it, then smoke it. That's false. I know a lot of different people too from different walks of life. I don't think they are hiding it either, since I am quite vocal about my positions on a great many things. I have always argued for legalization. So to say everyone is doing it, is quite a stretch for me.
I always demanded it. I knew *exactly* where mine was coming from. As in, I could touch the plants, when I went to go pick some up. I find your comment hilarious in a way too. It reminds me of blood diamonds. It would be pretty difficult to put together a certification program for people to *know* their weed comes from honest law-abiding Americans, and not the evil Mexican "narcolords".
Of course not. It was never designed to be a deterrent. That's like saying speed limits were truly designed to keep people safe.
It was truly designed as a way to control people and seize assets. Just like federal income taxes, your Social Security number, and the IRS were designed as a methodology to control people, control information, and to be used as leverage by the state. The money is incidental. It's use as an information gathering tool and a way to destroy people was deliberate.
You use Al Capone as an example which is downright fucking *hilarious* since he was ultimately taken down by the IRS.
No offense, but you annoy the shit out of me. Or more specifically, your "it's not a deterrent" and the "it would be cleaner and less risky for me to consume it" speech just rubs me the wrong way. You will never be effective in communicating the "why" when you argue for legalization when you talk about deterrents, actual usage rates, "we all use it man", etc. The people that don't smoke it, don't care. Their choice to alter their state is alcohol or prescription drugs. Your effectively arguing for something they don't understand, don't choose personally, and have no emotional or intellectual investment in protecting *for you*.
When people are opposed to something, or even indifferent, stating they are *not winning* is NEVER a productive path to get them to change their mind. That's just psychology. They have made themselves part of a group, and to say their group is losing (and them as well) can just make them stubborn, emotional, and irrational. Then they have to win to become right. Sounds insane, but then most of our behavior as a whole really is.
You need to explain to them how Pot being illegal actually affects them *very* negatively, even though they never smoked it or even hate it. I know people that outright hate it, hate the idea of getting high, and would otherwise wholeheartedly support sending your pot-smoking-hippie-ass to jail.
When I explain to them how the government actually uses it to populate prisons, seize property, control soceity, and in general have an excuse to perform actions against citizens that would otherwise be impossible in a truly free society, they become more open to the idea that it needs to be free. That, even though they hate it, other Americans should have the rights to be left in peace and make their own choices.
Truly man, change your tactics in how you go about pushing your views of legalization for pot. I agree with what you want to do, but think about it from a purely "debate team" point of view on how you can more effectively win the argument and win over your audience. Just some positive criticism (really, its intended to be positive) on how you argue for legalization.
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Some very good points... even if I don't completely agree with them all. The main argument is, that you still suppose, in the end, that people function logically. So many of our important decisions are gut reactions, and education only goes so far in a generation.
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From the U.S. Constitution, Article I, Section 8:
While the collection of federal income taxes may have become what you suggest, I doubt the founding fathers designed them
Re:Flamebait (Score:4, Insightful)
Well, you can't read then. That's not flamebait either. You. Can't. Read.
What condescending insults? There was none. I identified with him. I said I agreed with him. There was no insult of any kind whatsoever. The closest I came to anything remotely like that, was expressing my dissatisfaction with his points to make marijuana legal. That's it. As for condescending, well that is your interpretation. I was merely trying to express to him there can be more effective means of not only communicating his points, but to win over people in this argument. To say that I was acting superior or patronizing is a stretch IMO. You are entitled to your opinion though, but to say I insulted him is just incorrect.
Here's what he said that had to do with marijuana (the rest was about himself and Mexico):
So now, where I am making the same points he did? Keep in mind that I made a specific commentary on the 2nd statement.
He made a point about the reduction of crime and a new revenue stream for the government. I made no such points at all. If anything, I disagreed with the new revenue stream as the government gains a far more valuable level of control AND revenue with the current illegal status of marijuana.
We both pointed out the prison population, but we were using it in different ways. He was saying that we could reduce the prison population while I was pointing out that it was illegal for the very fact it could create a profitable prison population in the first place. He implies we can address a problem, while I point out that the problem was desired and designed. Not the same point.
He used Al Capone as a comparison against the current Mexican drug lords, while I mentioned it specifically in regards to the IRS, something he never mentioned did he?
So I fail to see how I was redundant.
I honestly believe that his argument about how 1) Everyone does it and 2) The laws are not stopping anybody are extremely counter productive towards achieving the goal of legalization. You can think I insulted him, or that I was patronizingly superior, but I did NOT make the same arguments for legalization that he did.
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You're right... You shouldn't be moderated Flamebait. Too bad you can't moderate someone "-1 Asshole", though. No offense, but you annoy the shit out of me (Hmm, where have I heard that before?).
You're also right that you didn't make the same points as the GP... He made rational point, your random paranoid conspiracy ramblings aside, your post added absolutely nothing to the discussion except insults.
Some of the GP's statements may have been overbroad, but none of them were actually wrong. Marijuana's legal
Comment removed (Score:5, Informative)
Re:Prepaid phones. (Score:5, Insightful)
Which is why in the Netherlands, Prostitution is legal while Pimping isn't, Marijuana is CONDONED and not 100% legalized, and the focus for users of cocaine, E, Amphetamines and even heavier stuff like heroin is to Inform & Help them rather than to lock 'm up and throw away the key.
Do we have problems? Sure we do. Do we have a violent crime rate as in the US and certain other countries? No we don't. As a matter of fact, it's quite boring here. And we like it that way. Well. Some of us do at any rate.
Lastly I have to point out that the workings of Life, The Universe and Everything Else *cannot* be deduced by watching Mob movies.
Amen, Brother! (something on topic, too) (Score:3, Interesting)
Even if you're an anonymoys coward, I have to agree with you. On both counts.
If we legalize Mary Jane and Nose Candy now, the "hip, with it" people will move to something else that is way too dangerous to be legal (crystal meth, anyone?). That will create a lucrative market for it.
The real solution would be to have a new kind of culture, that doesn't glorify delinquency and criminality. That'll be the day...
By keeping Marijuana illegal we make teens think they're living on the edge when they toke a joint. T
So when alcohol was legalized.... (Score:5, Interesting)
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Heroin doesn't warp reality like that. He's either a user of hallucinogenics or a Republican.
*I kid, I kid. I'd never call someone a Republican*
Off topic with an great seg to on topic!! (Score:5, Insightful)
The collateral damage of crime surrounding narcotics is so much worse than the actual damage that the narcotics cause. Even your "way too dangerous" drug, the most dangerous thing about it is the production of it. I agree meth ravages a person and isn't something someone should be taking, but instead of throwing them in a pound-them-in-the-ass federal prison, we should be giving them counseling.
Look at tobacco and alcohol, two things that are legal, and please realize that everything you wrote is completely nonsensical. Your entire argument reads like a pro-prohibitionists argument during the 1920's. Absolutely nothing is solved by making narcotics illegal and thousands of problems are created.
By keeping Marijuana illegal we make teens think they're living on the edge when they toke a joint.
This sentence is the most ignorant of all. It sums up your complete incomprehension of the motivation of teenagers with your lack of the ability to see the major problems that prohibition causes. Just like this bill will do nothing to deter criminals in Mexico and only put more innocent people in harms way as the incentive to mug someone for their cellphone has just increased tenfold.
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Maybe it's me, but, I never thought anyone really did booze or drugs to be 'cool', they did it to feel good and party?
I'm sure 'some' people and kids do it just to be cool doing something illegal and getting away with it, but, I can't believe that the majority of people do it just to be 'cool'.
Unless
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Morelike kids will do whatever is easiest to get messed up, which is why they do household inhalents, choke themselves, and sniff jenkem(fermented crap).
When I was in highschool, I made booze out of grapefruits. Nastiest stuff I've ever tasted, but bring it to a party and people would drink it because they couldn't get anything easier until they could drive across the border.
If someone came up with a safe, cheap oral/smokeable euphoriant/intoxicant that wore off quickly, they'd make a bundle.
Get some EXPERIENCE, and then maybe we'll talk ... (Score:3, Insightful)
OK. We get it. You call Marijuana "Mary Jane". and Cocaine "Nose Candy". You use the word "hip". You speculate what "hip" people would do in ways that make it painfully evident that you have exactly zero insight into what it is like to be one of those people. You are not hip, and never will be. You
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Their business is not drugs, their business is fear and violence.
And here I thought their business was making piles of cash for reasonably little effort. Gambling: people throw money at you for no good reason. Note that gambling is legal in Nevada, but there are still indications that organized crime is involved. Drugs: people pay a premium for 'fun' stuff that happens to be expensive because it's illegal. Organs (and I have heard stories of bootleg organs, in person): Illegal, very expensive, pretty much guaranteed to involve violence.
Organized crime got out of th
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1) Criminals are dumb. Otherwise they would have figured out how to get rich legally, or at least on crimes less risky than a kidnapping
2) Even if 10% of them slip up and use their own phone in an incriminating way, its better than nothing and saves some work for the understaffed police force
3) Getting caught with a mugged foreigners' (let alone kidnapped person's) cell phone on your person doesn't help one's case
4) If your girlfriend made a call to any cell phone triangulated to be around the crime's locat
Re:Prepaid phones. (Score:5, Interesting)
You're applying what you know about US crime to Mexico. Our war on drugs is figurative. Their war on drugs has become quite literal. Some have suggested that the Mexican government may soon be co-opted or overthrown by the drug cartels. Politicians and law enforcement alike are legitimately scared for their lives and the protection of their families. Kidnapping isn't like robing a bank in that social environment. It's a form of blackmail. It's not a get-rich-quick scheme by any stretch of the imagination.
Re:Prepaid phones. (Score:5, Insightful)
Their war on drugs is powered by our war on drugs. In fact, it is our war on drugs, only exported across the border. During prohibition of alcohol we had an elevated level of violence in this country -- the current system is much more efficient, at least if you live in the USA. If you live in Mexico... not so much.
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2) Only small fry with zero political influence will be caught.
3) See #2
4) See #2
Remove prohibition and even the most powerfull and influential drug lords will disappear into the dustbin of history.
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Re:Prepaid phones. (Score:5, Informative)
When I bought a prepaid sim card in Switzerland last year, they wouldn't give it to me unless they got my passport information etc.
In Australia, you need to call to activate your prepaid sim card. When you do, they ask for your name and address under the pretext that they need it for emergency services.
I can't be bothered making up any in Soviet Russia jokes, but I'm sure someone else will :)
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So what happens if you buy and activate a prepaid cellphone in the US or Guatemala, then use it in Mexico??
Yeah, this will stop crime, all right.
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No Roaming (Score:2, Informative)
So what happens if you buy and activate a prepaid cellphone in the US or Guatemala, then use it in Mexico??
Simple: Your prepaid phone will work only as long as it has a connection with a carrier that has a roaming contract with yours. Many, if not most, prepaids don't work internationally unless you register them (often for a fee), because international calls are hard to charge on prepaids (at least, where receiving one is charged to your account). Sure, you can use a fake ID, but pretty soon that will be considered a premeditated action to conceal illegal/terrorist activity.
Slam goes the door!
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Simple: Your prepaid phone will work only as long as it has a connection with a carrier that has a roaming contract with yours. Many, if not most, prepaids don't work internationally unless you register them (often for a fee)
This is certainly untrue for prepay phones in the UK - you haven't had to ask for roaming for years, they Just Work when you take them to other countries these days. I'd be pretty surprised if the same wasn't true for the majority of GSM carriers in other countries.
because international calls are hard to charge on prepaids (at least, where receiving one is charged to your account).
AFAIK, this problem has long since been solved by the CAMEL [wikipedia.org] SS7 protocol.
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> When I bought a prepaid sim card in Switzerland last year, they wouldn't give it to me
> unless they got my passport information etc.
Whereas here in the horrible, oppressive USA I can buy a Tracfone and card for cash in most any store with no id required.
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Re:Prepaid phones. (Score:5, Funny)
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Re:brought to you by some long distance lobyist? (Score:2)
So US citizens living or working in mexico can no longer get a cell phone in Mexico?
In AZ prepaid long distance cards covering "international" calls to Mexico are cheap and insanely popular. Mexico will not prevent US phones from roaming, so I am guessing pre-paid "International" cell phones will be here too.
Mexican here (Score:5, Informative)
In my experience, there's several people who due to poverty or lack of concern are not registered with the relatively new CURP system. Thus I wonder, how will it affect those people? Will they shell out 20 pesos to pay some kid with internet access to get it for them, or will they stop using cell phones?
I believe (and hope) this law will fail in epic proportions. Mainly due to Telcel, pretty much the only cellphone provider, losing too many costumers over it. Also, there seems to be much opposition: there are very few comments supporting the law on the article linked.
Mexico does need a way to get rid of our infamy before the eyes of the world, a police state will only make us even worse. We don't need this kind of stupidity coming from our government, however corrupt it may be.
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Re:Prepaid phones. (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Prepaid phones. (Score:5, Funny)
(My sig has been waiting YEARS for me to make a post like this!)
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My sig has been waiting YEARS for me to make a post like this!
When you wish upon a star
Makes no difference who you are
Anything your heart desires
Will come to you
If your heart is in your dream
No request is too extreme
When you wish upon a star
As dreamers do
Fate is kind
She brings to those who love
The sweet fulfillment of
Their secret longing
Like a bolt out of the blue
Fate steps in and sees you through
When you wish upon a star
Your dreams come true
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NOt if you just buy it with cash from a private individual.
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If you're going to wish on stars, I'd go with (Wolf-Rayet) WR104.
Who needs a rifle when you can wield the power of cosmic radiation.
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Maryland, I take it? Move to the other side of the Potomac; Virginia's a lot friendlier about that.
Per federal law, a resident buying a gun from, or transferring one through, a dealer requires a government-issued photo ID (driver's license, military ID, etc), an instant background check, and (I think) some proof of residency (usually satisfied by item 1). Non-residents are subject are also subject to the laws of their state of residence and to some additional federal requirements. If you posess a valid s
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No good. I've known too many Spaniards.
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A Telegraph.co.uk [telegraph.co.uk] article on this story suggests that this is specifically about prepaid phones. It appears that nearly all Mexican mobiles are prepaid.
Re:Prepaid phones. (Score:5, Informative)
If I recall correctly you do not need any type of identification to get a prepaid telephone in Mexico. It is just a matter of going to your Telcel shop at the corner of the street (there are more of those than there are cantinas) and buy a chip with "100 pesos tiempo aire".
Funny that they provide a link to the Milenio paper... I believe that "El Universal" ( which has the article here [eluniversal.com.mx]) is better.
Now, for those very paranoid slashdotters, note that one of the reasons they are doing this is because given the lack of such identification records, mobile phones are heavily used in blackmailing.
That happened to my brother once, he was studying in Mexico City and he got a call which went like this:
After the phone rang and he answered a shouting voice said:
"Hey we got your brother, and we will kill him unless you comply with our desires"
After that, a voice in the background of the telephone shouted as if he was the "captured" brother "please please, help me, please don't leave me"
In the "heat" of the moment, my brother shout my name "Pedro, are you ok?" [not my real name of course].
Of course with that information the criminals continued with their tale, telling him that yes they had "Pedro" and they were going to hurt him blah blah...
My brother just hung up the telephone and called my mother (who lives in another state)... Fortunately for us, I have been living *outside* Mexico for the last 5 years... therefore I could not have been trapped in Mexico City...
My brother wrote me an email telling me to ask me to mail back just to be shure I was OK, I called him that afternoon from the UK where I was living then.
There are countless of similar stories with such kind of social engineering. Of course not all the people are as "wise" as us, or they get blackmailed in the middle of some kind of crisis (money, family, etc) where the scenario of a kidnapped relative is very possible.
The issue until now (that the database is started) is that even if you had a caller-id and a number, you could not do anything with it because it would not be registered, or it will be faked. The current registry will require both an valid id (Mexican voting credential which is the national id) and a fingerprint.
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Yes, prepaid or "as you go" service is the most popular kind of cellphone service in Mexico. I read some time ago that it was even bigger than land lines. I can't find the link where I read that but this [bumeran.com.mx] says something similar.
From the article you need to provide name, date of birth and CURP if you are registering via SMS (you might be asked to provide gender and state of residence). However, to get a new cellphone number you would also need to provide a fingerprint, proof of address (like a hydro bill) and
Border runs (Score:4, Insightful)
I assume this doesn't apply to PAYG phones bought in the US? What a way to not affect criminals in the least.
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I'm not assuming they are stupid. I can see them requiring anyone visiting Mexico to register their phones with immigration or the border authority before local towers will authenticate. That's reasonable.
It is erecting a large Tempest shield along the borders to prevent cell reception from outside the country that I find implausible, to say nothing of satphones.
Perhaps they can get the US to use a fine mesh chain fence instead of building a wall?
Corruption (Score:2, Insightful)
With an already corrupt government and police force this benefits the people how..?
Re:Corruption (Score:4, Insightful)
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Lots of transient workers (Score:5, Informative)
here where I live. I just pay them a hundred pesos to buy a chip for me. He'll be leaving town in a few months, and I got my phone. Repeat as needed. With a legitimate name and my phone is stolen, lots of luck defending yourself against false accusations here. Luckily the old system of "justice" is still in place. Una mordidita para las polis y ya.
You mean a log file or like a phone bill ? (Score:3, Funny)
Stupid Laws, more stupid implementations. (Score:5, Informative)
I live in Mexico and I can tell you that one of the intentions of the law is to reduce the crimes that use cellphones to coordinate and execute (like kidnappings and drug deals).
The problem with this is the implementation, the law clearly specifies that your cellphone provider must take an ID and your fingerprint, but the most popular provider Telcel lets you register sending a SMS with your name and birth date. Essentially rendering the registration useless.
Re:Stupid Laws, more stupid implementations. (Score:5, Funny)
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This sounds more like a plan for Telcel to maintain its monopoly.
Sounds like a great way to steal identities (Score:2, Interesting)
This will solve which problem again? (Score:3, Insightful)
I cant understand what this will solve for the Mexican Government. Does this have anything to do with all the violent crime linked to the Mexican drug trade? Do they really think sending a CURP via SMS is a secure and infallible method? Good luck to them.
Oh and here is a possible theory: The USA could use this system to track illegals who might have bought their cell phones into the US. Doesent sound all that plausable but hey its a theory.
Re:This will solve which problem again? (Score:5, Informative)
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Or more like it'll just ensure that being seen talking on a cell phone is the BEST way to get targeted!!
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Re:This will solve which problem again? (Score:4, Informative)
The problem is extorsion.
This is a growing problem in Mexico.
You get either a
1. SMS that says that you won a prize. Most of the time you need to send another sms to another cell number where they tell you that you need to pay a deposit to get your prize. Or,
2.- A call in which a person tells you that have kidnapped a relative of yours. They don't demand a lot of money. They just want to get some money because 99% of the time they haven't kidnapped anybody. They rely on getting you scared enough so you deposit some money before you can check if it was true.
Most people know it's a scam, but still a lot of people fall for it.
The thing is, most of the scammers come from inside prisons so this is an attempt to make it more difficult to get a stolen cellphone which is what the criminals usually use.
- A mexican that has gotten those calls.
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I see now, many others have pointed this out so it makes perfect sense. It has also jogged my memory a bit too. I remember seeing a special on TV a number of years ago talking about the kidnapping problem in Mexico. I believe they said Mexico City was the kidnapping capital of the world. That scare led to many wealthy people (frequently targeted) to hire security and drive armored vehicles. Less wealthy people would have plastic film applied to their car windows to prevent shattering during a car jacking/ki
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Of course getting an stolen phone or cloning a numbers is still as easy as ever. This accomplishes nothing except perhaps tracking of innocent citizens.
Lessons to be Learned (Score:5, Interesting)
At the end of the day with technology constantly advancing and the "here there be monsters" parts of the map becoming non-existent there is only one way to ensure our future freedoms. My daughter will know how to execute SQL injections by the time she is 10! We live in an era where your average teenager is more capable of destroying/manipulating government plans/records/whathaveyou than any pitchfork and torch wielding mob has had since the days of the caveman!
Disclaimer: Parents, be careful with this plan, you wouldn't want to have your records swapped with (notorious threat of the day) for grounding your kid.
Well... the gov. didn't saw the issues of this... (Score:2, Interesting)
The measure of a cellphone number database is to identify who is the user of the cellphone, this is intended to reduce the criminal movements of drugdealers and mafias all over the mexican country.
Well it's a good idea, but the mexican government didn't saw the real issues of relate cellphones and users: the institutions that will have access to the databases are corrupt far beyond solution, we all know in Mexico that institutions like AFI (similar to FBI in USA) and others are full of double-agents of orga
Hey, Mano... (Score:2)
Let me use your phone for a minute...
Why?
You know...battery is dead again.
Oh, sure.
Crackdown (Score:2)
I'd imagine this has something to do with an attempt to crack down on the drug running cartels that threaten to grow so powerful as to destabilize the government. A threatened government is a dangerous thing.
so, use an iPhone with Fring or Skype (Score:2)
Don't even have to change gadgets. That takes care of the average citizen who would be fine with consumer-grade privacy.
One could add complexity by creating multiple Skype land-phone-accessible numbers, and push them through Grand Central. Or get sexy by using VOIP over a VPN connection to a stateside proxy.
The nontechnological solution: "Hey, amigo, lemme use your phone for a minute - I left mine in my Mercedes."
All of the National Mexican Databases (we have 11) (Score:5, Interesting)
Yep this is another stupid law passed under the guise of trying to fix a national security problem. The truth is it is just another way for the government to get another Nationwide Database of us Mexicans. Let us count how many we have.
1) We have the CURP. (national ID number)
2) We have the IFE. (national voting card)
3) We have the RFC. (national Tax Number, complete with electronic digital certificate plus you need to fingerprint your 10 digita for that one)
4) We have Cartilla de Vacunacion (national medical card, needed for most hospitals and free health services)
5) We have drivers license (again taging all the above)
5) We have CLABE (national bank account database... all your Financial info are belong to us linked to the Mexican Tax Sistem)
6) We have the Afore (national retirement account number)
7) Some states have a secondary voting card (since the national one could be untrustworthy)
8) We have birth certificate records with the CRIP (a longer version of the CURP)
9) National Military Card (for all males 18 and older which technically makes all of Male Mexicans National Reserve and you need to have it for the next database one, the passport)
10) Passports, (not required by law but do require #9 to get one and will also be required if you ever need to leave this place.)
woohoo.. so much for freedom of speech.
Most of them have all your personal info in them, plus fingerprints, plus anything and everything to tag you. There was the defunct RENAVE which was the national car ID. That was pass under the guise of people commit felony's on stolen cars.
Now a National Celular Id, what is next a National Phone Id, since people also commit crimes on the phone. Or maybe a National Public Phone id, since criminals could also use Public Phones. Or a National Internet Users Id while you are at it. Or a National Credit Card registry since credit cards are used in scams. No wait we have that one also (chalk it as number 11)
Maybe a national knife owners id, so in the supermarket when you buy a knife it will be registered in your name.
Now seriously, the main problem in this is that one more database to cross reference you by will not solve the crime problem. I used to work for a telemarketing firm, and they had bought half of the Databases mentioned above, so the information contained in those database is readily available thanks to corrupt officials. Some of them are even online like the CURP. (one XSS away from full access).
If you are Mexican, don't worry about all the databases, organized crime already have them all. That is how they target you. I know of cases where the criminals even know how much money you have in your bank account and suggest it to you if you try to say you don't have any money.
Now the implementation, you can send a SMS with what ever info you want. Want to become your neighbor, look his CURP up online here:
http://www.emexico.gob.mx/wb2/eMex/eMex_Consulta_tu_CURP
(just need his name and his birthday).
Seriously the problem is the Corrupt Mexican Government, why don't they pass laws to fix that, and maybe we wouldn't need just another national public database.
Here in Mexico they passed a law to instantly tax your deposits in the bank, if you get a cash deposit of 25000 pesos or more (like 2000 dls) instead of going after the known tax evaders. So honest folk pay taxes for the criminals which never do, and the criminals either don't care, have lawyers, or use bribes. Do you think criminals have money in the bank, come on.
This database will get abused like all the others and it is not in the public's interest. Criminals will now have access to all you family's cellular phone numbers so they know who to ask ransoms to.
MEXICAN GOVERNMENT, solve the problem don't make another stupid law that will not solve the problem.
In Soviet Mexico are belong to us, all your information.
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At first, I was going to moan about how awful that you have 10 different numbers to keep track of. Then I thought a bit about it. That actually makes more sense and should in theory be more secure than our system of just using the SSN everywhere. In the US, we are only really required to have a SSN, DL, Birth Cert, Marriage Cert & tax records to get by in life. The SSC has no real useful info on it. Your name and a number. The DL is the most dangerous one, it has you name, address, and physical info. Ou
This is really stupid (I'm a mexican) (Score:2, Interesting)
There is simply nothing that stops you from grab the CURP from anyone, send the sms and get your phone linked to other person, then you can carry on with whatever illegal activities you plan to do and have the other person blamed.
It is insane, and I asked someone I know that works at Telcel and you can have more than one phone number linked to a single CURP.
Yes, this is supposed to difficult the coordination of illegal groups, such as drug dealers and kidnapers, but I fail to see how will this help unless w
No news for Italy! (Score:2)
And if you sell or give it away, both parties should update the registration details.
Since 1994. We are ahead!
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Indeed, I tried to get a SIM in Italy. They asked me for my government health insurance card, so I showed them my Danish one. They didn't accept it. Tried it three times with different providers.
So much for free trade within the EU...
There already is a very similar thing in Bulgaria (Score:2, Informative)
Obligatory (Score:2)
Sent via SMS (just now):
"Hello! My name is Ignito Montoya, you killed my father, my new number is ...."
Coming soon to a country near you... (Score:2)
So, our neighbors to the South are getting ahead of us on something, eh? I must say, given the slow but steady trend of the U.S. towards ever increasing surveillance, one thing that has puzzled me is why our government has not yet implemented something like this. If you're going to go so far as to use warrantless wiretapping and monitoring of the domestic phone system to keep tabs on your own citizens, it can't be very effective if anyone can walk into a Wal-Mart or 7-11, use cash to buy a cheap prepaid cel
CURP is not like SSN (Score:4, Informative)
...CURP (Unique Registration Population Code in Spanish, like the Social Security Number in the US) ...
Not by a long shot. CURP consists of four sections:
1. Four letter acronym - last name, mother's maiden name, first name and second name (or second letter from first name).
2. Six digits indicating your birth date.
3. Three letters indicating your state of birth.
4. Three letters and three digits, seemingly random but actually a predictable tag, to differentiate you from others sharing the first three sections, all very similar.
Many commercial apps in Mexico have the "CURP function" installed, you just type in the first three criteria, and out comes the full CURP. I believe even some legit Mexican websites provide this function. It's not intended to be secret and it's not tied in with your personal finances in any way.
Little or nothing to see here, folks, move along.
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They don't have to. You have a internet connection.
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Stories like this always make me very, very glad that I've never bothered to buy a cell phone. I mean sure, I know my government will track me somehow anyway, but at least I have the satisfaction of making the bastards work for their data.
By posting as an AC you really showed them. They'll be stumped for months on that one!
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Seriously, how is one going to properly use 'whom' rather than 'who', but still end a sentence in a preposition?
Did a teacher tell you that prepositions are not for ending sentences with?
(Any rule of style can be violated if you understand the reason for it. The reason for this one is that there is usually a better way of phrasing the sentence that doesn't end the sentence with a preposition; there are exceptions.)
(Alternatively: "This is the kind of fucking pedantry up with which I shall not put." (Church
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Really, is this so hard to figure out?
Users text in their CURP.
Most will be accurate and there will be enough info on file to match them up to their phone number and carrier.
Some won't send in their CURP. No service for you.
Some won't match. Letter comes attached to phone bill. Mail it back with correct boxes checked, or No service for you.
Claim my CURP on your phone, I check the box that says not my phone, and No Service for you.
No number no ring-e-dingie. Its pretty simple.
In the US, they get your SSN
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No, here's how it's going to work:
Users SMS in a CURP.
That's it, there's no way to check if it matches the real user as long as the number/birthdays themselves match to the DB. There's no phone bill, you buy a prepaid card for X pesos at any kiosk when you run out of money. At least, that's how prepaid SIM cards work everywhere else in the world. Also, where do you propose you check the box that says it's not your phone?
I also find it hilarious that, with the corruption levels as ridiculous as they are in M
Re: (Score:3, Interesting)
Since pre-paid anonymous cell phones are almost always used for no good and legal purpose this sounds like a great idea for that kind of phone.
That's a very old and tired lie that "those with nothing to hide have nothing to fear"
http://www.biometricidentitycards.info/articles/NoHideNoFear.htm [biometrici...cards.info]
What about whistleblowers, victims of abuse, or political dissidents? What happens when the government becomes a totalitarian regime?
Another powerful take on this:
http://tithonus.livejournal.com/339295.html [livejournal.com]
I'm cheap, not evil. (Score:2)
Since pre-paid anonymous cell phones are almost always used for no good and legal purpose this sounds like a great idea for that kind of phone.
I have an anonymous tracfone. I got it not because I am evil, but because I am cheap. My phone has lasted me 18 months for a total of $140 or $7.78/month. Tell me the cell plan that would be cheaper than this.
I'm sure the telcos would agree that not paying at least $50 every month should be illegal. Don't worry, I'm sure in a few more years it will be.