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The Courts Government Security News Politics

Gary McKinnon Loses Extradition Appeal 380

Posted by Zonk from the still-working-the-angles dept.
G0rAk writes "The BBC is reporting that hacker Gary McKinnon has lost his High Court appeal against extradition to the United States. The fight is not yet over yet: 'We will certainly be applying for this court to certify a point of law of public importance and to grant leave.' said his lawyer, referring to alleged threats by US authorities. One New Jersey prosecutor apparently has stated that that 'he would fry,' a statement that would be among issues raised when they take they appeal to the House of Lords."
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Gary McKinnon Loses Extradition Appeal More

Gary McKinnon Loses Extradition Appeal

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  • New Jersey (Score:3, Funny)

    by BigDaddyNyth ( 932952 ) on Tuesday April 03, 2007 @08:57AM (#18587047)

    One from New Jersey prosecutor apparently has stated that that 'he would fry'
    I thought they wacked people in New Jersey

    • Re: (Score:2, Funny)

      by Anonymous Coward
      No longer. The Mob lost the contract for dispatching (convicted?) offenders. Yet another case where the state was unwilling to pay for quality work.

    • Re: (Score:3, Funny)

      by SatanicPuppy ( 611928 ) *
      Only the Mob...I know it's hard to tell the difference between the Mob and their "opposite numbers" in the government. One of the tell tales is the Whack/Fry thing...If someone offends your wife, you whack him...if someone offends your sense of social stratification, you manufacture evidence and fry him.

      Subtle difference, I know. But it's Jersey, whadda ya gonna do aboud id?

      • Re:New Jersey (Score:4, Insightful)

        by StormReaver ( 59959 ) on Tuesday April 03, 2007 @09:44AM (#18587803)
        "...if someone offends your sense of social stratification, you manufacture evidence and fry him."

        In this case, there was no manufactured evidence. Gary admitted the crimes, but tried to justify them with the age old crap of "curiosity". Curiosity with disregard for others is a pale excuse even for a minor, and no excuse for a grown adult like Gary. He didn't click a link on a web site thinking it was going to take him to Slashdot, only to be tricked into breaking into NASA's (and other government agencies') computers. He intentionally broke into their computers, knowing full well that it was illegal in both the U.S. and Britain, and weak security does not excuse that. He is guilty, and he has admitted that.

        That said, the penalties in the U.S. for intentional unauthorized access where no damage was done are ridiculously harsh. At his age, the proposed punishment is a life sentence for relatively minor law violations. While I think extradition would otherwise be reasonable is this case, I also think the statements made by the New Jersey prosecutor indicate an absurdity of justice which are enough in my mind to allow him to be punished at home. Perhaps something along the lines of 180 days in the local jail and a few tens of thousands of pounds in fines -- enough to hurt and discourage him, but not so much as to ruin his life.

        • Re:New Jersey (Score:5, Insightful)

          by Bloke down the pub ( 861787 ) on Tuesday April 03, 2007 @10:40AM (#18588757)
          If he'd lived in the US and hacked into UK government computers, do you think there'd be any chance at all of him being extradited? No, it would be ruled unconstitutional. [bbc.co.uk]

          On those grounds alone the request should be refused as all such requests should be, until a balanced treaty is in place (and ratified).

          • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

            by StealthPenguin ( 690533 )
            Perhaps not, but the US government would probably punish the American for hacking UK computers anyway.

            Besides, you all seem to be forgetting that the individual was convicted of a crime. "Boo-hoo" if some tough words made the convict soil his pants -- maybe he should have thought about that before he hacked the computers.

      • Let's Pretend This Is Your House (Score:5, Insightful)

        by queenb**ch ( 446380 ) on Tuesday April 03, 2007 @10:20AM (#18588473) Homepage Journal
        How about this scenario? I show up at your house while you're at work. You're locks aren't strong enough to keep me out. Your windows aren't bullet proof. Your walls aren't made out of titanium. Now, since I'm well equipped for this sort of thing - complete set of lock picks, bricks for smashing widows, and a saws all to just cut holes in the walls, I'll just break into your house, go poking around "because I'm curious" and "your security is lax". Now imagine for a moment you come home to find the mess that I've made of your domicile? Are you going to be happy? What about the time and expense it takes to clean all that up and repair your house?

        I think his punishment should be working until he's paid back every penny of the expense of cleaning up his little intrusions. If it were in my hands, he'd be making restitution and not serving time in the traditional sense.

        2 cents,

        QueenB

    • We do... it's called the New Jersey Turnpike.

  • Interesting comparison (Score:5, Insightful)

    by clickclickdrone ( 964164 ) on Tuesday April 03, 2007 @09:01AM (#18587099)
    In the UK the CPS decided there wasn't enough evidence to bother pushing for a trial and prior to that he'd been warned he could get community service (help in charity shops, that sort of thing) but then the US manages to extradite him using an agreement they refuse to ratify and with threats of the electric chair being thrown at him (and not in a Balmer sort of way) before the trial even begins. Ye Gods.

    • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

      by SatanicPuppy ( 611928 ) *
      Here we can look at that and say, "Psssh, effing New Jersey" but in a lot of places in Europe they absolutely believe that we would fry this joker for a non-violent crime.

      Just fricking typical of what passes for "diplomacy" out of the states these days. They should just make him do a stint hacking for the government to pay for some of the (grossly overinflated) damage bills.

      • Here we can look at that and say, "Psssh, effing New Jersey" but in a lot of places in Europe they absolutely believe that we would fry this joker for a non-violent crime.

        Also going to prove what a wonderful job "The Sopranos" has done for New Jersey's image... I'm going to start a campaign to get the motto "The Garden State" changed to "The Whacking State" or "Don't F**k With Us".

        • Meh, it was always that way underneath...I mean, I lived there for years, long enough to actually see why it was called "The Garden State" which never made any sense to me when I didn't live there...But there was always this undercurrent of "You gotta f**kin problem?"

          To be fair, that's mostly North Jersey, but, unfortunately, that's the face Jersey shows to the world, so it's not surprising that they think all the state is like that.

      • Re:Interesting comparison (Score:5, Insightful)

        by jimicus ( 737525 ) on Tuesday April 03, 2007 @10:19AM (#18588441)

        Here we can look at that and say, "Psssh, effing New Jersey" but in a lot of places in Europe they absolutely believe that we would fry this joker for a non-violent crime.
        The BBC is a fairly well respected news source and when they publish things like:

        Speaking later, solicitor Jeffrey Anderson said alleged threats by US authorities, including one from New Jersey prosecutors that Mr McKinnon "would fry", would be among issues raised.

        ....I think you can see where that opinion of the USA comes from.

      • Re:Interesting comparison (Score:5, Insightful)

        by kocsonya ( 141716 ) on Tuesday April 03, 2007 @05:36PM (#18596187)
        > but in a lot of places in Europe they absolutely believe that we would fry this joker for a non-violent crime

        Why, you kidnapped and tortured that Canadian guy for no apparent reason, kidnapped (and probably tortured) quite a handful of other guys in Europe, some of whom did not do anything unlawful, you run a "the law does not apply here" concentration camp on soil that you rent from your arch enemy communist country from which you can not otherwise import even cigars, bombed the crap out of and pretty well destroyed a country which did nothing to draw your mighty anger, you fight a war in an other against a regimee that you put into power, funded and armed to the teeth, declared that your soldiers can not be held responsible for whatever warcrimes they commit and last but not least, as a matter of fact, you (alone in the developed world) do actually off quite a lot of your people.

        So, there's some reason behind that sentiment in Europe; even if it is stereotyping, like many stereotypes, it is not entirely baseless.

    • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

      by mi ( 197448 )

      with threats of the electric chair being thrown at him

      Come, come... Surely, you do not honestly believe, there was such a threat thrown. The prosecutor's threat "to fry him" was, obviously in jest and no more death-threatening, than promises to "destroy competition" — made by sportsmen and businesses daily — are, for example.

      Even if the prosecutor wanted, he would not be able to do it — although New Jersey has capital punishment on the books, it has not executed anyone since 1976 [deadlinethemovie.com]... An

      • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

        by voice_of_all_reason ( 926702 )
        You have no issue with a prosecutor jesting in his official capacity as the one who suggests a sentence without penalty?

        I guess you're okay with police officers and judges jesting in a similar matter. This are Serious Court and this is Serious Business, instead we have the "good guys" acting like kids on a playground.

      • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

        by Dogtanian ( 588974 )

        And not for lack of seriously violent crimes in the State -- they are not going to execute a computer hacker, if they let murderers and rapists live.
        Uh... not saying that Britain is perfect, but given some of the f****d-up, topsy-turvy values and morality we see coming out of the States at times, I certainly wouldn't take that for granted.

  • 6 years ago i would of agreed with the court (Score:2, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward

    now iam not so sure,
    while watching the Guantanamo debacle continue alongside CIA secret prisons and torture openly embraced by the country that seeks to convict Mr Mckinnon i would be worried about my Human Rights too, is such a thing as a "fair trial" even possible in USA anymore ?

  • Wow... (Score:3, Insightful)

    by Jaysyn ( 203771 ) on Tuesday April 03, 2007 @09:09AM (#18587223) Homepage Journal
    Yeah, I can see why Brits would be upset. This would set a very nasty precedent. I didn't realize that even after all the lies about Iraq, etc, that we are *still* far enough into the U.K. that they'd bend over like this.

  • Am I the only one... (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Noryungi ( 70322 ) on Tuesday April 03, 2007 @09:09AM (#18587225) Homepage Journal
    ... who thinks this is actually a disgrace?

    AFAIK, Gary McKinnon is a british citizen (check Wikipedia [wikipedia.org] for this). Why does the UK allow one of its citizen to be extradited to the USA? Why is he not judged and sentenced in the UK?

    Does anyone think, for just a millisecond, that the USA would do the same? Extradite one of its own citizen to be tried in the UK?

    Where on earth is the outrage? How come a sovereign country, like the UK, is extraditing one of its own citizen -- regardless of his crimes -- to another country to be tried there? This is ridiculous! Can anyone answer that question?
    • No, you're not the only one. Bill Bailey [wikipedia.org] commented on a recent tour that the US was like the playground bully, with the UK as the little guy who stands behind him going 'Go on, beat him up'. The degree with which the 'special relationship' has made us the USA's lapdog makes me wish I was French - and that's baaaad.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by cs02rm0 ( 654673 )
      Our entire nation is completely apathetic. I have no idea why, but it explains the record emmigration levels.

      • Our entire nation is completely apathetic. I have no idea why, but it explains the record emmigration levels.

        The non apathetic one's have already gone or are packing their bags. The others are either chavs, chav wannabees (shudder) or just too stupid to care.
        Almost every night, when I catch the bus home there's a mad woman who shouts and swears and threatens any young girls/women, often driving them to tears. She then gets on the bus and does the same to the drivers, telling them how crap they are to be

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by Sancho ( 17056 )
      Are there laws against hacking a computer in another country in England?

      The fact is, he committed a crime, and some portion of that crime took place on US soil. By convention, that allows for the US to extradite him, even if he never set foot here, himself.

      That said, with the fucked up US prison system, I hope (for his sake) that he gets to stay in the UK.
    • Looks like we do it all the time, and to many different countries. Next please.

    • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

      by pizzaman100 ( 588500 )
      Does anyone think, for just a millisecond, that the USA would do the same? Extradite one of its own citizen to be tried in the UK?

      No, not the UK. The USA extradites its citizens to Mexico instead.
      Dog' the Bounty Hunter loses extradition battle [msn.com]

    • Esp. considering how little media attention it gets.

      I wonder if the guy can appeal to the European Court of Human Rights, I hope they would cancel this scandalous extradition considering the terrible track record of the US justice system.

      Note that before this case I believed that no country extradited its own citizens, because that's how it is here in France. Might have to do with brits being subjects, not citizens, I guess ;) Anyway, they (government) couldn't pull that shit off here. You might make fun of

  • to extradite or not to extradite (Score:3, Insightful)

    by N3wsByt3 ( 758224 ) on Tuesday April 03, 2007 @09:09AM (#18587233) Journal
    European countries (well, their governments) are ubelievably hypocritic in this regard. I think it's just because, time after time, they buckle to USA pressure. Not all that long ago, a EU-citizen was extradited to the USA, facing a possible deathsentence (acording to US laws). It is clearly stated, in many national laws, but also as an European law, that NO EU-citizens may be extradited to countruies which implement the death-sentence. Luckily, there are only a hanful of barbaric states left who do such a thing, such as china and N.-Korea, etc. Even fewer countries which claim to be democratic still practise it, such as...the USA.

    But, what did they do? The govenments made a deal, where the USA 'promised' they wouldn't actually deal out the capital punishment to that citizen. That was *before* any sentence on guilt or lack thereof was made. Actually, this should anger americans as much, because this means their government arbitrarily decided to NOT treat a person who (alledgely) commited crimes on USA soil according to their own law, and that that EU-person got an illegal advantage which no ordinary US citizen gets.

    For me, however, the anger comes at the fact they *did* extradite him to the USA, clearly in violation of the rules and laws of that country and the EU. If the USA wanted him so badly, they could abolish the death penalty. speaking of which, if I'm not mistaken, some more progressive non-bible-belt states in the USA already have forbidden such practises, as any civilised society would do. Or does it ultimately remain a federal decision? Maybe some US slashdotters can fill me in on this.

    • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

      by thebdj ( 768618 )
      Actually, it is pretty widespread [wikipedia.org] in the US and hardly limited to the "Bible Belt". I also wouldn't call many of the states where the DP is no longer practiced "progressive". And if you check out the map here [wikipedia.org] you might find that there are a few more countries still holding on to the death penalty then you originally thought. It isn't just something used by those oppressive regimes.

    • Re:to extradite or not to extradite (Score:5, Informative)

      by Zenaku ( 821866 ) on Tuesday April 03, 2007 @09:27AM (#18587499)
      That would depend on which sovereign is trying the defendant. Some states have the death penalty, others have outlawed it. The FEDERAL government does have the death penalty.

      Since in this case the crime is against the Department of Defense, it would be a federal crime, under federal jurisdiction.

      However, hacking is not a capital offense under any jurisdiction, so far as I am aware. When the prosecutor said he would fry, it was a figure of speech.

      That being said, if I were the U.K. I sure as hell wouldn't extradite one of my citizens to a country where due process and habeas corpus have recently been ruled to not apply to "enemy combatants," a designation which is applied to non-citizens solely at the discretion of the executive branch. Under our constitutional system of justice, he would not have anything to worry about as far as the death penalty -- but since he hacked the military, and the government could ignore the constitutional system of justice by uttering the magic words. . .

      Well, that probably wouldn't happen. Probably.

      • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

        by clickclickdrone ( 964164 )
        >When the prosecutor said he would fry, it was a figure of speech.
        Which I'm happy to believe but hardly professional behaviour by an official though is it?
    • "Actually, this should anger americans as much, because this means their government arbitrarily decided to NOT treat a person who (alledgely) commited crimes on USA soil according to their own law, and that that EU-person got an illegal advantage which no ordinary US citizen gets."

      That's as ordinary as plea-bargaining. In the real word situations are not ideal, and a little of something is better than nothing.
      Given the choice between never punishing a criminal or getting a lesser sentence, it makes perfect

      • My reaction is that everyone who bootlicks these vermin should volunteer to share cells with a few of them
        Congratulations, you've just invented the next reality TV project.

    • Re: (Score:2)

      by praksys ( 246544 )
      US prosecutors routinely make deals where the death penalty is taken off the table in return for testimony (against accomplices for example), information (about where other bodies might be buried for example), because they think it might be easier to get a conviction, or even because they think it would be a waste of money to pursue the death penalty in a particular case. So your claim that the US prosecutors were ignoring US law is incorrect. They have wide discretion when it comes to pursuing the death pe
    • Even fewer countries which claim to be democratic still practise it, such as...the USA.

      For what it's worth, Japan does too.

      For me, however, the anger comes at the fact they *did* extradite him to the USA, clearly in violation of the rules and laws of that country and the EU. If the USA wanted him so badly, they could abolish the death penalty. speaking of which, if I'm not mistaken, some more progressive non-bible-belt states in the USA already have forbidden such practises, as any civilised society woul
      • I'm anti-DP but I fully agree that in the UK at least we're far too light weight with sentences. Life means anything but - you could be out in 8 years. OK, it's on licence, which is probably stricter than most people realise but as say the parents of a murdered shild, knowing the murderer was out and about just 8 years after the event when it's still pretty damned raw for them is a bit of a kick in the teeth.
    • if I'm not mistaken, some more progressive non-bible-belt states in the USA already have forbidden such practises, as any civilised society would do

      If there's one thing Jesus taught us, it's that bad people must be hung by the neck until they are dead. It was in his Sermon on the Gallows.

  • The moral of the story... (Score:5, Insightful)

    by DragonPup ( 302885 ) on Tuesday April 03, 2007 @09:10AM (#18587241)
    Don't try to gain unauthorized access into the freaking Department of Defense network, and then basically admit to it.

    For a smart guy, he's rather stupid.

  • End justifying the means? (Score:3, Insightful)

    by Critical Facilities ( 850111 ) on Tuesday April 03, 2007 @09:11AM (#18587261)
    From TFA
    ...has always maintained that he was motivated by curiosity and that he only managed to get into the networks because of lax security.

    So by that rationale, if I can kick in your front door to get into your house, is it your fault for not having a better door lock/frame?

    • Re:End justifying the means? (Score:5, Funny)

      by Rob the Bold ( 788862 ) on Tuesday April 03, 2007 @09:21AM (#18587415)

      So by that rationale, if I can kick in your front door to get into your house, is it your fault for not having a better door lock/frame?

      I still don't get it . . . Maybe you could use a car analogy.

      • Re: (Score:2)

        by Aladrin ( 926209 )
        So by that rationale, if you lock you car door, but leave the window open a crack and I ue that to steal your car, is it your fault for not rolling up your window?

        There, I think that does it ;)

    • No, he's saying he found your key under the mat and let himself in to have a look around, believing you're hiding secret spaceship technology somewhere in your house that you're not sharing with the rest of the world. The man is a loon, pure and simple; I suspect the Brits will be more than happy to extradite him, simply to be rid of him.

  • maintained that he was motivated by curiosity
    Hmmm... .I wonder how easy it is to get into...(insert anything here).

    B.S. The guy is a hacker who purposely broke into a system he was not supposed to be in. He knew it. He knew it was improper and illegal.

    It's no different that getting into bank accounts, credit card accounts, school records, etc.

    If you excuse him, then no one can bitch and moan about hackers and vulnerabilities in Windows, OS X, Linux, or anything else.

    If we are serious about computer security
    • Who is going to jail for the Sony rootkit/trojan incident?

      Or is it one rule for Sony (remember their rootkit thing) and one rule for wacko people looking for UFOs?

    • If *they* were serious about security they wouldn't have left default admin settings on hundreds of machines. Gary talks of seeing many people from round the world doing the same thing he was as the security was so bad. He only had a 56k modem, hardly the connection of choice for an uber-hacker.

      This case I believe is a disgrace.
  • I can't believe they managed to extradite him. Blowing it up into 'the biggest millatary hack ever' seems a bit over the top. From what I read he scanned for default passwords and installed publically available trojans while leaving a clear trail back to himself.

    He is both incompetant and a bit crazy (he was looking for UFO evidence...) Why go to all this trouble to lock him up?

    • As an example to other people who think that they are so special and precious that your/my/anyone elses computer they fancy is fair game.
      "Why go to all this trouble to lock him up?"
      There are some people who don't "get" this, so we step on a few to send a message.

      If he were a burglar who just wanted to look around and fiddle with the premises, he'd still go down for breaking and entering.

  • This guy has clearly committed a crime, and I certainly think that there ought to be some repercussions regarding that. Nonetheless, I can't help but feel that he's being treated very unfairly. The guy is crazy, as evidenced by the fact that he was actually cracking the machines to look for complete conspiracy theory stuff; he wanted to find information about UFOs, anti-gravity technology and "free energy". In addition, he cracked the machines using a simple perl script to find machines with blank or defaul

  • No Surprise Really (Score:5, Insightful)

    by segedunum ( 883035 ) on Tuesday April 03, 2007 @09:15AM (#18587341)
    This is no surprise really. Sadly, Britain has become another state of the US and a bitch that bends over at every available opportunity when the US government asks, and people like Blair and John Reid have been happy to go along with it. The favours are not returned, needless to say (witness the current Iran hostage problem).

    The CPS (Crown Prosecution Service) have even stated that there is insufficient evidence to go ahead with a prosecution, but as soon as the US steps in (using some very murky agreement related to terrorism the last I looked) the seas (or should I say, the legs) part. If there are grounds for deportation then fine, but sadly, if this guy had sneezed he would have been on the next plane if the US asked.

    As a British person I find all this humiliating to see, and quite frankly, treacherous now. I'm not having a go at the US or Americans here. This is a British problem, and one related to standing up for itself, self respect and knowing what its own self interests are. The US are merely looking out for theirs.
    • Ok, the Iran thing is of no importance here but as a side note, Bush has publically stated that we are with them in anything they need. He went on to state he wishes to avoid violence with Iran but isn't taking that off the table, it is England's call.

      Also we have had extradition treaties for most of the history between the two countries. Just because the latest rendition happens to follow signs of the times is also irrelevant. We have given criminals to England and they have done the same for us in the pas

      • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

        by clickclickdrone ( 964164 )

        Their large fleet of warships are mostly in mothballs and would take over a year to bring them back into service with another year to competently train crews for them.

        No, not in mothballs, just run down in numbers and has been since WW2. Modern warfare that the UK is ever likely to be involved in just doesn't need them. We're still keen on our nuclear subs (well, Blair/Brown are anyway). As our own head of the armed forces noted, the sort of wars that get fought these days are different and we need forces

  • Curiosity Killed Gary (Score:5, Insightful)

    by C4st13v4n14 ( 1001121 ) on Tuesday April 03, 2007 @09:22AM (#18587435)
    I've been watching this story for some time now. As an American living in Europe, and as a forensic psychiatrist, I really feel sorry for this guy. I know how they treat prisoners at home as I've worked with them, and I know how they treat them over here as I work with them now. If he gets shipped over to the States, he will have his human rights violated. Being a high-profile prisoner, they'll never let him serve any part of his prison term in the UK and his family will never be able to visit him. Basically, he'll never see the light of day again. With all the threats made against Gary, especially what this idiot in New Jersey said, and with all of his supporters, I don't see why he hasn't won his fight against extradition. It must have to do with politics. America has to be putting significant pressure on the British government to make this one go their way. We, unfortunately, would never see these reasons reported in any newspaper thus we can only speculate.

    He's never said that he didn't do what he's accused of, and he's always said that he only did it out of curiosity. He didn't even steal anything, let alone national secrets. It's really a shame that he didn't pick a target somewhere within Europe to satisfy his curiosity. They would have been a little more lenient and his subsequent time in prison could actually be bearable. After all, why should he go to prison? He's already very sorry that he did such a thing, he's beginning to fall ill because of the immense stress and feeling of impending doom of getting extradited, and prison is not only about punishment, it's about rehabilitation.

    • Re: (Score:3, Funny)

      by Quiet_Desperation ( 858215 )

      He's already very sorry that he did such a thing

      Oh, well, why didn't anyone say so?! Case dismissed!

    • Re:Curiosity Killed Gary (Score:4, Informative)

      by xtracto ( 837672 ) on Tuesday April 03, 2007 @11:42AM (#18589671) Journal
      If he gets shipped over to the States, he will have his human rights violated.

      Somehow, I believe something *more* than his human rights will be violated [hrw.org].

      What I dont understand is why the UK does not understand that he commited whatever crimes he commited in the UK. As you said, there is surely some kind of political agenda before this... poor sucker. Of course I do not condone what he did, he indeed commited a crime but he should be judged and charged *where* he commited it, in the UK and not in whatever country wants who wants to charge it.

    • Re:Curiosity Killed Gary (Score:5, Insightful)

      by ElephanTS ( 624421 ) on Tuesday April 03, 2007 @02:06PM (#18592117)
      Yes, well said. I've followed Gary's case closely (unlike most people that seem to be commenting here) and know what he actually did. Which was, as we know, very little and nothing to damage national security. He was chasing the 'free energy' dream and secrets of Area51 as some kind of personal project. He was naive (I would have used a chain of proxies ahem) but the security was minimal and invited attacks. He claims he saw other people up to the same thing while he was there but for some reason he seems to carry the can for everything.

      He doesn't appear that bright - just a very standard computer guy with some Windows admin skills. The punishment here will not fit the crime and a man's life will be wasted because of this. It's insane and I feel very sorry for him. If they cared so much about the contents of these computers why did they not secure them?

      And, as you say quite rightly, punishment should not be purely vindictive there must be an element of rehabilitation as well.

  • Security consultant (Score:4, Insightful)

    by Peter Trepan ( 572016 ) on Tuesday April 03, 2007 @09:41AM (#18587755)

    Wikipedia says The US estimates claim the costs of tracking and correcting the problems he allegedly caused were around 700,000 USD. It then goes on to say that he hacked the government websites with a Perl script, and found default passwords on their "secure" network. Good think McKinnon found them before China did. (Or did he?)

    Maybe they should treat him as a $700K security consultant.

  • IF he didn't pilfer and sell any secrets (a big IF, i'm not that familiar with his case), then the US should just hire him. If he pilfered and tried to resell secrets, then let him rot in jail. But otherwise, he's kind of like that Abagnale guy from "Catch me if you Can," the check forger: why let him rot in prison, when his hacks have proven to be useful in hardeing your security? Employ the dude. Put his skillset to useful work.

    Look at it this way Mr. Pentagon bureacrat: would you rather this British dork

  • let the book be thrown (Score:5, Insightful)

    by spyrochaete ( 707033 ) on Tuesday April 03, 2007 @10:44AM (#18588823) Homepage Journal
    "Okay, you just bought yourself a 317: Pointing out police stupidity." - Chief Wiggum

    America will throw the book at McKinnon because they are embarassed of their lax security practises on such high profile systems. They will make an example of McKinnon because he used little more than a brute force 2-line PERL script to bombard many desktops with obvious passwords (e.g., "password" or "" [blank]).

    America is even more ashamed of this security breach because the many same systems were infiltrated by Mathew Bevan [bbc.co.uk] using the exact same tactics over 10 years prior. That's right - these government and military and NASA computers have had no password policy after 10 years and 2 break-ins. Adding the number 1 to the end of these passwords would have stopped McKinnon dead in his tracks.

    McKinnon is not a sophisticated programmer or cracker. He simply challenged seemingly high security systems with very low-tech kludgey scripts to see what would happen. He got lucky, then he got audacious, and then he got careless.

    Get ready for another Mitnick-scale high profile court case on this one. McKinnon won't fry, but he won't see the sun for quite some time.

    • Re: (Score:3, Interesting)

      by _Sprocket_ ( 42527 )

      America will throw the book at McKinnon because they are embarassed of their lax security practises on such high profile systems. They will make an example of McKinnon because he used little more than a brute force 2-line PERL script to bombard many desktops with obvious passwords (e.g., "password" or "" [blank]).

      Not quite. The US Government is not embarrassed over this incident. Officials will throw the book at McKinnon because, unfortunately, that's how they handle these things. For a long time, the

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