Microsoft Sues and Gets Sued 192
wubo writes, "Microsoft is apparently stepping up its anti-piracy measures by publishing the locations and specifics of their pending lawsuits. Check out the snazzy map — warms me heart and soul." And to even the scales of justice, one of the last remaining class-action antitrust lawsuits filed against Microsoft in a state court is set to go to trial in Iowa later this year. An anonymous reader writes, "Iowa consumers who purchased Microsoft products in the last 12 years are being represented in a class action anti-trust lawsuit against Microsoft. The jury trial begins on November 13 and is expected to last 6 months." Bill Gates is on the witness list.
Hey that's me. (Score:5, Funny)
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So, so that's the Windows Genuine Advantage!
Buy stuff, get to take part in class action lawsuits...
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I cannot believe that after nearly a decade of running nothing but linux and BSD, This finally happens about a year after I buy a new laptop.
aw Eff it. I'm dual booting.
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wow. (Score:2, Insightful)
Wow, a whole 73 lawsuits. In a nation of 260 million people. That tremble in the force you feel is the pirates quaking in their boots.
Re:wow. (Score:5, Insightful)
If you've just got a copy of Windows on your machine you lifted from work or the net, I wouldn't worry too much. As that recent
I've also felt they deliver a buggy system that degrades over time all by itself on purpose. If forces you to upgrade. I've gone through several Windows machines this decade, but the Mac I bought my wife in 2000 is still kicking, and still quite useful. The difference is in the software.
ahahahahah (Score:2, Insightful)
I'm not sure what kind of mac you're talking about, but if you bought it in 2000, it certainly can't be useful for anything more than email, considering that OS X ran miserably on existing hardware when officially released in 2001 [macdailynews.com]. (And if your wife is running OS 9, then your comparison is even more ridiculous and irrelevant.)
Re:ahahahahah (Score:5, Informative)
Re:ahahahahah (Score:5, Informative)
Basically, they improve the engineering rather than just add more features. Good call, in my book.
Eivind.
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If your idea of "fine" is a G3 running OS X, then any PC released in the last decade will run Windows "fine".
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Browsing the web, email, wordprocessing, itunes, iphoto, chat, work fine and CPU isn't a big factor. That's probably 95% of non-gamer home use. Games are not really a big focus on the mac like they are on Windows. People with simple needs should not waste their money buying a new computer all the time when the old one works fine. It's a major source of toxic waste in our landfills and is a waste of natural resources.
But back to the FA, I fully support MS's effort agains
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My wife still uses the machine heavily for publishing work, running lots of Adobe applications,
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"I'm not sure what kind of mac you're talking about, but if you bought it in 2000, it certainly can't be useful for anything more than email...."
Let's see... I have a PowerBook G3/400mhz with a slightly dated version of OS X that we still use for word processing, e-mail, web surfing, watching DVDs, iPhoto... remind me again, why is that not useful?
Or worse, I have a beige G3/333mhz minitower (same OS X) running a file server, backup server, print server, web server... remind me again, why is that not u
Re:ahahahahah (Score:4, Interesting)
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My friend has an OS 9 Mac that she recently got as a hand-me-down. She's near on the verge of asking me to put Linux on it because she can't make it do anything useful. It came with IE 4.5, which can't handle the websites she goes to, so I looked for a better browser and found iCab, which gives her tabs for browsing the websi
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If your wife is happy with a ca. 2000 Mac running OS X, then it's pretty clear she doesn't have a great deal of sensitivity to OS performance.
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This story looks like the soap melodrama of the
I also bought a computer to my girlfriend in 2000. It was a WinME version, probably the worst Windows ever at the very bottom of the
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You bought a computer for your girlfriend running Windows ME? and she didn't leave you? She is cl
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2000 (Score:2)
Stability issues are far more often behavioral in nature.
That said, I think your assessment of petty piracy is pretty accurate. I have my suspicions about the genuineness of the OS on my laptop as I bought it from a small shop
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I've got a useful computer that was made in 1998. Granted, it's a Xeon workstation that run Windows and it's one of the best-built computers I've ever seen. I did get it relatively cheap, but that's because the machines depreciate properly.
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Note it's not about piracy in general, but pirates that sell their stuff.
I'm sure there are still a lot though, but far less than if including "regular" pirates.
But tens of thousands of auctions blocked. (Score:2)
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And of course (Score:5, Informative)
Re:And of course (Score:4, Informative)
Apparently, they were including XP Pro for free with their bundles.
If you're going to offer your customers Microsoft products, at least make them pay for it. Not worth the risk. Either that or offer alternatives.
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It's probably more productive to get fired up about stupid suits where some mom gets sued for what her daughter was downloading.
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Apparently, they were including XP Pro for free with their bundles.
Same here, except they were selling Windows XP OEM CDs as if they were Windows XP retail packages and without bothering to sell these OEM CDs along with one of their home brewed PCs like they were supposed to. They didn't go out of business though.
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I'd like to see who's NOT on the list. Racket! (Score:2)
Grief, that list has everyone from CompUSA to the mom and pop store down the street. I know of one guy in town who's store was almost ruined fighting such a bogus charge, but seeing a list like that drives home how common such things are. The local who was sued eventually won in court. There was no way he could tell the fakes from the real because they had all the little stickers and worked. His distributor burnt him and was in turn burnt by someone upstream but the whole thing has the stink of an extor
Doh, that's Computer Plus USA. (Score:2)
Computer Plus USA is not CompUSA, so M$ might not be shaking down it's larger corporate pals this way. The extensive list of small shops is still disturbing and I stand by my opinion that it's another part of the non free extortion.
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Please, get help.
Is this the best time? (Score:2)
Microsoft has a few important things going for it, but the user share and market dominance is the most important; I wouldn't want to test it, it's easier than ever to switch to Linux.
Re:Is this the best time? (Score:4, Informative)
The actions of Microsoft in these cases show that they are trying to improve their image with the end users by persuing the business that deceived them while simultaneously offering said end user a discounted or complimentary legitimate copy to help resolve the situation. Furthermore these actions are also considered to be defence of copyright so that they do not lose that copyright.
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And not suing the users and give them a way to legalize their machines is the correct way to deal with this. If MS were the [R/MP]IAA they would already have pulled the plug on pirated copies, making a huge number of people furious and many people would loose a l
Obeying the law (Score:4, Interesting)
This makes me sick. For example, we have strict privacy laws in Poland -- in theory. Every single database that includes any personal data needs to be reported to GIODO -- and you need every person on your list to agree to that use. You also need to provide a way for every person to review whatever data you have on file about them, and/or request their removal.
And if you anger the powers that be, you will be controlled and face stiff penalties. Unless you have enough political clout, that is.
Now, take a wild guess who is playing a major role in building the henhouse...
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But this is good news and good news? (Score:5, Insightful)
This is a good thing. A lot of people have no problems with downloading software or other copyrighted materials illegaly, as long as it is for free. But a lot of people are against selling such items, or making a profit off of it. Unfortunately, the copyright lobby views both groups as filthy stinking pirates, but the public don't really care about the first group, and only view the second group as the real pirates that actually ought to be punished for it.
What Microsoft is doing here, is targeting the second group only. And that is a good thing.
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In many ways the people who support those pirates are no more different than a person who goes to his local pub and buys a nice HD-TV for 10% o
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A lot of people have no problems with downloading software or other copyrighted materials illegaly, as long as it is for free. But a lot of people are against selling such items, or making a profit off of it. Unfortunately, the copyright lobby views both groups as filthy stinking pirates, but the public don't really care about the first group, and only view the second group as the real pirates that actually ought to be punished for it.
This is because until the 70's, non-commercial copyright infringement
Give it time... (Score:2)
The RIAA started by suing big distributors such as Napster before they sued end users. This is just the first step down the new litigation business model for MS. The lawsuits they filed are a direct result of the WGA initiative. It won't be too long before they go after individual people t
HAHAHAHA (Score:2, Funny)
Guess that havent found me yet
HAHAHAHAHAHAH
See im anonymous so they wont know my Ip or anything
Im sooo LEET
Re:HAHAHAHA (Score:4, Funny)
You see, AOL made a little oops. I know, those hand cuffs are a bid uncomfortable. They accidently released a few search logs. Hmm, these police car seats are pretty comfortable. So some people might have gotten some information on what you were looking for on the internet. You're supposed to push you thump in the inkt and then on the paper. But I'm sure this isn't going to affect your life negatively at all. Hmm, that cellmate seems to have a liking for you. So I suppose you don't hold this little slip-up against us and aren't going to give up your subscription, are you?
Did anyone read the website? (Score:5, Insightful)
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Although I agree with you there is a flipside to this argument. The lobbies for the big copyright holders such as Microsoft have skewed the copyright laws to the point of ridiculous. They have bought the politicians to ensure never ending profit from copyrighted works. Ensuring a pe
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You may know someone like this. It could be you. (Score:2)
Yes the list of defendants is a who's who of mom and pop computer store owners. Have you ever thought that they too might have been passed off an "illegitimate" copy by their distributor? The wild and wacky
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Besides, soney and other companies have software on these restore cd's that is often required for certain hardware to work. You may know what to do, but if joe nubjie screws his machine he'd be fecked unless there was a nice 'stick this cd in and all will be well' solution.
A drawer full of driver discs and windows installer such as you and I would like would be a nightmare for some, resul
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Actually, my Compaq R4035CA laptop came with an OEM version of the XP Home CD, and a separate disc for all the other preinstalled crap. The Product Key sticker on the bottom of the laptop even worked with the XP CD... who wouldda thunk?
Why pirate Microsoft products? (Score:2, Insightful)
To clarify this, I don't condone pirating software that you don't already own. While this statement sounds odd, anyone who has had to deal with Windows Product Activation or Office Product Activation should know just how painful Microsoft makes it to activate your software after you've passed some arbitrary threshold. I spent a half hour on the phone with one of their activation people a few days ago attemp
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Wait a minute! If somebody steals your software, they are not a customer, they are a pirate. Your ending clause "maybe more of them will feel inclined to start paying for the software" indicates you are specifically refering to those people who did not pay for the software in the first place. So, let's fix your statement so it is more correct:
Microsoft needs t
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Let's clarify this: software is _not_ property, it can't be stolen.
You are using an analogy that doesn't work.
When someone steals something from you, you don't have it anymore. That doesn't happen in the case you describe.
There is not such thing as intellectual property. That is just an slogan, like "diamonds are forever". Intellectual stuff can't be regarded as property, because you can't own things that don't have
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I had typed a long, thoughtful response to your comment, but then
Mostly your post amounts to semantics. The usage of the word "steal" refers to the act of taking something that doesn't belong to you -- in most Western nations it is illegal to install software for which you do not have a license (or, to use your own words, software for which you have
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I agree that the line you are referring to was a poor choice of words. But the overall premise of the post is still valid. They are treating their customers as if they were pirates with product activation. When the activation fails, it is the customer that has to initiate (sometimes unsuccessfully) the remedy either legit or not. The legit route the GP is referring to
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I have found, however, that if you go through the wizard to telephone MS and activate over the phone, but instead opt to enter a new product ID, enter your current, valid, legal product ID and then try to activate over the Internet.
If it doesn't work, try a couple more times. Every time I've reinstalled Windows on the same hardware and failed the first act
Microsoft getting sued ? (Score:2)
They're not bringing anything new to the table, I don't see why the folks in Iowa decided to sue Microsoft at this particular time, when they could've brought the same claims to the table around 5 years ago.
Microsoft will probably bring the "but there are alternatives to Windows" claim in its defense. Well for 93% of the population, Linux is as mu
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There is no "guilty" verdict in civil suits.
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What you fail to acknowledge is the fact that people have different definitions for what IS a good OS.
For most people, it's "I want everything to work the second I plug it, and I want to be able to connect to the tubes to get intarweb". They don't care about issues such as privacy, monopoly abuses and the like. Maybe it's because they don't understand the implications of this, what they are sacr
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There are Linux distros that, if you have compatible hardware (which is not obscure - my random Dell with a Linksys wireless card is compatible), require no configuration after install. I installed Mepis for my friend this weekend, and she was good to go right after, with flash, mp3, realplayer, etc, all working with no configuration. Certainly a lot faster and easier than
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Unfortunately for those people, it's not that way, even if MS told them it was. And as far as them caring about privacy and security,
they'll care all too well once they get phished or similar.
Anyhow, it's quite a moot point. The desktop won't come from the home users, any more than Windows use came from there.
It'll be business use- and I can readily assure you that they DO
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If, after having a functional OS, you want proprietary stuff in you
Why piracy? 'Cause I'm lazy. (Score:2)
Count steps, cost in time and effort, behind purchasing a legal piece of software, and obtaining it from illegal source.
Legal, downloadable:
- Find website.
- Access "shopping part"
- Dig through marketing junk, looking for "buy"
- Enter full billing information, usually involving grandmother's dogs name and shoe sizes of all children.
- Ag
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sudo apt-get install softwarepackage
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In addition to being much harder to acquire and install, the "legal" proprietary software is frequently inferior to the pirated version.
For example, the "legal" version may require the DVD to be in the drive at all times. It may require you to "activate" the product which you already bougth and paid for. It may require you to *repeat* this process if you buy a new computer, or even if you just change components in your existing comput
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Umm, you forgot a few steps. You forgot the part where the illegal copy was infested with all sorts of malware. Let me finish the scenario for you:
- during the install your machine sends your private information (credit cards, passwords, etc) to some illicit server
- a root kit gets installed, turning your machine into a po
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If I know a thing or two about these problems, these steps happen transparently thanks to virus scanner running in the background. The moment I click on the program, the antivirus will abort execution and display a warning if the program is a trojan.
OTOH if I have no clue, my computer is already infested with enough spyware from porn webpages and "freeware".
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It really depends on how you set them up. Many are configured to run a full scan every day at a certain time. Some are configured to do an "access scan", but this can really slow down your system so often it isn't the default. Plus, there are things called "shallow" scans and there are "deep" scans. You are right though, with most modern virus scanners, realtime protection is provided - especially when you try to run an executable, or when a process attempts to modify sy
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Now, these steps don't happen every time - that's what keeps people coming back. But you have to admit, many of the "crackers" are doing this sort of thing. The "free software" is the bait. So perhaps you need to add a few steps to your illegal process - run virus scan, run rootkit scan, run malware scan BEFORE installing. Of course if you do that, then the legal path looks like the simpler path.
Back in the day, I used kazaa networks, and that kind of thing never happened to me. I suppose it _could_ happen,
this is rather tricky (Score:4, Insightful)
If your product is software, how else but via software are you going to enforce legality? Go on, answer that one? Postcards? Hey man, shareware days are long gone, and they failed because of piracy, postal registration doesn't work. Nowadays it's electronic product monitoring or nothing, sorry.
And for that matter, what's wrong with wanting people to pay for it if it's non free software?
These are reasonable points if you remove references to microsoft. It wouldn't be fair to say I was trolling just because I think it's reasonable to expect to be paid.
I don't like a lot of what microsoft are doing, but you must point out when things they are doing are fair or reasonable, or you're just as bad.
There are also no ways to 'phone home' with any peice of software without sending some kind of identifying material, even if its just the originating IP. That's a lose lose situation, they can't do it at all without being accused of invading privacy, and yet if they don't then piracy of windows products will spiral even further out of control.
Everyone I know who's complained about WGA has a dodgy copy of windows, almost everyone with legal copies either hasn't even noticed unless I've pointed it out, or doesn't care.
I've only known one person with a legal windows copy who got screwed by WGA, and that was a corporate install in a university lab, so probably a mistake by the IT dept giving the wrong key.
Re:this is rather tricky (Score:5, Interesting)
Everyone I know who's complained about WGA has a dodgy copy of windows
I've got TWO legal copies of XP for my current PC. The first was delivered with the PC, but not in the language I preferred. So I bought a second copy.
And I hate the WGA. I hate the fact that Microsoft will automatically inspect my PC every time I turn it on. I hate the fact that if I place too many new components in my PC, Microsoft will rate it as a new PC and will give me troubles. I hate the fact that Microsoft can influence the behaviour of my PC from a distance. And I hate the fact that I am treated like a criminal, while I have no intention of being one (except that I maybe get stimulated by all these flashes of hate to become one).
I've only known one person with a legal windows copy who got screwed by WGA
I'd say that is one too many.
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They will never just say 'oh well, we give up, after all, whats a few billion in lost sales between friends'.
One is one too many perhaps, but could you do better? IIRC it was the IT depts fault anyway. I don't recall all the details though. Since I don't use windows in my lab it doesn't effect me.
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And we all continue to lament the fact that WGA is "acceptable" to the community despite its invasiveness. Gee, any wonder?
Make your bed, sleep in it.
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Dumb lawsuit against Microsoft (Score:2)
"The purpose and effect of Microsoft's illegal conduct has been to deny purchasers of Microsoft operating systems and applications software at a competitive price..."
At $40 per OEM Windows license, I don't see why they're upset. Complain about Windoze because it sucks, not because it's too expensive. Complain about Microsoft because they illegally use their OS monop
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Given the fact that a District judge has allowed the case to go forward, I'd suggest a few years in law school may help to refine that opinion.
Snazzy map (Score:2, Funny)
Awesome! (Score:2)
Piracy (Score:3, Interesting)
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* (it had FreeDOS actually, but I'm sure he wouldn't know how to use that, or ever bother to learn how to use a CLI)
your lawsuit... (Score:2, Funny)
! you may be a victim of lawsuit piracy.
Your lawsuit number is not genuine. Authorities are being notified. You will be sued shortly...
Well, of course (Score:3, Informative)
Re:Nice Map.... (Score:5, Insightful)
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Re:Nice Map.... (Score:4, Insightful)
Most likely, the customers will be looking for alternatives to that retailer and not for alternatives to Windows.
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Secondly MS would much rather you use a pirated compy of Windows rather than e another OS. If people switch their monopoly weakens.
That is why MS only sue large scale pirates, and why they only sue in countries where people will not switch.
I live in a country where MS advertsises moderately heavilly, do a fair amount of PR, and have put money into localising Windows. No one here (even corporates) buys legit compies, except with a big brand PC.
MS could easill
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