RFID Passports Raise Safety Concerns 459
CurtMonash writes "CNNMoney.com features a skeptical article about the US State Department's plans to soon issue RFID passports (currently being tested on State Department employees). One fear is that they can be hacked for information about you. And even if they can't, carrying around a little transmitter saying 'I'm an American! I'm an American!' isn't a fun and safe thing to do in all parts of the world." From the article: "Basically, you've given everybody a little radio-frequency doodad that silently declares 'Hey, I'm a foreigner,' says author and futurist Bruce Sterling, who lectures on the future of RFID technology. 'If nobody bothers to listen, great. If people figure out they can listen to passport IDs, there will be a lot of strange and inventive ways to exploit that for criminal purposes.'"
yeah (Score:5, Funny)
Re:yeah (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:yeah (Score:5, Funny)
Re:yeah (Score:3, Interesting)
And, for added juice, an additional transmitter in the absorbent sleeve announcing that you're CowboyNeal! Who says the era of Cowboy Diplomacy is over?
Re:yeah (Score:5, Informative)
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Re:yeah (Score:3, Interesting)
Of course, this was not difficult were I lived as, usually people from USA get stuck in Cancun or Los Cabos were they find all their beloved touristic heaven. It is only European (and sometimes Canadian) tourism the one we (in Mexico) call "tourism with culture" that gets a bit away from Cancun to see the Mayan [bill-in-tulsa.com]
Re:yeah (Score:2, Informative)
Oh, and nobody is paying me for posting all this, haha.
Re:yeah (Score:5, Insightful)
Plus I hear they constantly stereotype people from other countries! Stupid Americans!
Sorry, but you don't sound like someone it's particularly worthwhile being "real" friends with. Tell me, how do you treat your "fake" friends? What if I'm one of them and don't know it? Guess I don't need to worry about either, being born in the wrong country and all.
Re:yeah (Score:3, Funny)
"erm, Upper Canada city. yeah that's it."
Re:yeah (Score:2)
Re:yeah (Score:3, Informative)
Re:yeah (Score:3, Interesting)
You can have a thousand native citizens walk down a busy street, and the bomb doesn't go off until an American (or possibly, even a native with US embassy employee-ID) walks right past it.
I know it's an essential part of the whole "keep 'em fat, stupid, scared and easily-trackable" agenda the US/UK governments have going, but I
Re:yeah (Score:2, Funny)
Presumably it's part of this "war on tourism" that I keep hearing Bush talking about.
Re:yeah (Score:3, Interesting)
RFID only has the edge if the data has to be read at high speed or where putting something in actual contact with a reader is awkward (Packages etc). There are a couple of exceptions (Such as 'hidden' door locks like at my school, to stop idiots filling card readers with chewing gum) but for the vast majority of cases it's just "Ooh new technology, lets use!"
I
Re:yeah (Score:3, Interesting)
1) Most contact chips don't last past 5 years, and they wanted a longer validity (10 years in the US case)
2) The chip specification was for the 28 (?) Visa-waiver countries and each of them can have a different passport form factor, so it would be very difficult/expensive to implement a single contact based reader or set of readers for them all. Contactless solves this issue and allows each country to keep whatever form factor they want.
Th
Re:yeah (Score:5, Insightful)
Meanwhile I see some guy here (you'll never guess from what country!) spinning a story of Americans pretending to be Canadian ON A CARIBBEAN FREAKING CRUISE! I'm sorry, if you're that stupid, don't leave home.
Re:yeah (Score:5, Insightful)
1) Most people in Europe, Austalia, NZ and Asia that I have met realize that the Americans that they are likely to meet are not the ones who voted for Bush. The coasts have a much higher density of passport holders than the "Heartland," for example. (Active passport holders favored Kerry to Bush 58% to 35% [zogby.com].)
2) The "obnoxious American" stereotype is partly a result of biased sampling. If there are two Americans somewhere, and one is a fat, obnoxious, non-local-language speaking lout with a Hawaiian shirt and a camcorder and the other is a quiet, sensible, local-language speaker, the locals may not even notice that the second is an American, let alone remember the encounter. I am an American, and when I am in Europe, I am frequently mistaken as being Dutch, perhaps because I have a beard, a bicycle and can communicate passibly in any one of about five standard European languages, even if I don't happen to speak the local language. I also usually do not go out of my way to correct this misconception...
Re:yeah (Score:5, Insightful)
I'd have to say that walking around with your mouth shut, or at least under control, is a pretty good way to avoid looking like an idiot anywhere you go. It saves you from making yourself (and the country you represent) look like an ass.
Having just come back from Europe (Rome, Nice, Paris & London), as an American (from Texas no less), I had nothing but good experiences with everyone I met. I can't say the same about the other idiot Americans who also happened to be staying at my hotel. In typical movie fashion they got louder and louder as the unfortunate hotel clerk tried to help them find a restaurant to eat at late at night. The more she had trouble understanding them they just got more irritated, annoying and bigoted. Standing there at the counter I felt so ashamed.
This isn't to say that Americans don't have a negative image in the world, but overall, people are smart and realize that not everyone conforms to the stereotype. My advice is to remember that you're not at home when you travel. Things don't go according to plan. Understand that you will have a hard time making yourself understood, but be polite. Don't leave the country if you're a rude, pompous, arrogant asshole (or leave and don't come back).
Re:yeah (Score:3, Insightful)
Well, I find that mouth shut and ears open does tend to improve one's chances of making a positive impression.
Unfortunately, there is a small minority of my fellow Americans who seem to get this backwards. And what comes out of their mouths tends to be stupid and ugly.
Remember the run up to the war, the big stink about France? France's crime: disagreeing with us about strategy (all the while cooperating with us on the parts of the strat
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Re:yeah (Score:2, Interesting)
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Save tinfoil hat for passport (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Save tinfoil hat for passport (Score:2)
Re:Save tinfoil hat for passport (Score:5, Informative)
Re:Save tinfoil hat for passport (Score:2)
somewhat a good idea (Score:2)
When I bought my pre-paid toll transmitter [sunpass.com], one of the things it came with was a very small plastic bag that you can put the transmitter in. This is in case you were at a toll but wanted to pay cash for some reason. The bag looks like a small ziplock bag with a silver tint.
I can see someone selling those at passport sizes on the internet as 'passport holders'.
Re:Save tinfoil hat for passport (Score:2)
Even if it can be hacked? (Score:5, Insightful)
Confused? (Score:2)
Re:Confused? (Score:2)
Re:Confused? (Score:5, Informative)
The whole "it's broadcasting all of your personal information!!!!" hype is a bunch of FUD. The only way it could really be a security risk is if the card itself was stolen, and then it's really no different than having your S.S. card or driver's license stolen.
Re:Confused? (Score:2)
Re:Confused? (Score:3, Insightful)
I'm not saying it's impossible, but I'm not losing any sleep at night over my RFID card.
Re:Confused? (Score:2)
Re:Confused? (Score:5, Insightful)
It would take a heck of a lot more juice than what those readers put out to make something that's actually useful for reading these passport chips remotely. Assuming the effective range on the readers I've used was exactly 2cm, the inverse square law tells us that doubling the power my chip out (and keepin the reader's receiver at the same power) would increase the range to 2.83cm, quadrupling it would get us to 4cm, octupling it would get us up to 5.66cm. . . and by the time you get to the point where a potential passport snooper isn't making himself *really* suspicious by running around an airport waving his briefcase next to everyone's baggage, you've got yourself quite an RFID reader. And then you throw on the shielding that's being put into these RFID passports and it's back to square one.
Not saying it's impossible to make a device that effectively identifies Americans by their passports, just saying that everyone should probably put their tinfoil hats on now because a device like that would probably give you one heck of a headache.
Re:Confused? (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Confused? (Score:3, Insightful)
Of all the possible threat models, you've picked the least likely. If you are in an airport you can probably just look at the guy's luggage tags.
No, the threat is out in the real world where there is plenty of opportunity to disguise super-huge equipment. Like a doorway where the e
Re:Confused? (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Confused? (Score:2)
I don't know whether fingerprint readers are getting tiny enough to be embedded in something that small, but it seems like a good idea. I would be
Re:Confused? (Score:2)
Re:Confused? (Score:2)
Re:Confused? (Score:2)
Re:Confused? (Score:2)
Re:Confused? (Score:4, Insightful)
That's secure in the same way as an object that's only invisible until you look at it, or a door that's only locked until you try the handle.
Passive RFID chips are likely harder to detect at range than active ones (for obvious reasons), but no-one's answered the question yet: Why do we need ranged querying at all?
Much, much safer would be a normal smart-card chip (like the one in your credit card) that requires physical contact to read anything. Frankly, once somone's got their hands on your passport it doesn't matter if it's a smart-card or normal paper one - they can easily find out things about you from it (or just nick it) at that point.
Allowing ranged querying seems to offer no really compelling benefits, and opens up a whole can of worms on issues like personal security, remotely tracking/identifying people without their knowledge, you name it.
RFID security (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:RFID security (Score:2)
Just one more justification... (Score:4, Funny)
What's the range? (Score:3, Informative)
How far are you broadcasting in the first place? If its like 10 feet who cares? Now in good practice, whenever I travel I leave my passport in the safe at the hotel. Not really a good idea to walk around with it ;)
http://religiousfreaks.com/ [religiousfreaks.com]Re:What's the range? (Score:3, Insightful)
What a convenient tool for implementing an application named "proximity fuse."
Re:What's the range? (Score:3, Interesting)
Better yet "minimum target count".
Place a bomb at desired location... have it count the number of 'mericans in the vicinity... when the number exceeds a certain threshold... detonate.
Cool new way to make sure you don't waste explosive!
Other variations abound.
Place bomb inside but trigger at doorway. Count number of individuals that pass through door. Detonate when target amount reached. Of course this method can't account for pers
Re:What's the range? (Score:2)
No way, if you lose it or it gets stolen, then you have some problems. I've been all over Europe and China and that's what worked the best. No problems :)
Passports & Immigration (Score:2)
Whenever I have questions about Passports or Immigrations, I always say WWFD (What Would Fez [that70sshow.com] Do?)
I am a free man (Score:5, Insightful)
They'll have radio frequency identification (RFID) tags and are meant to cut down on human error of immigration officials, speed the processing of visitors and safeguard against counterfeit passports.
Human error will still occur in whichever system a human is involved in.
Couldn't they get all the same benefits with a simple barcode?
Does the RFID hold just your ID number for lookup on the database or is the RFID part now full identification?
I hope this doesn't go ahead (like the UK now isn't going ahead with its ID scheme) because whilst RFID might make tracking warehouse stock easy, its not great for humans.
Just because the technology exists doesn't mean we should use it for everything.
Re:I am a free man (Score:2)
Re:I am a free man (Score:2)
Sounds to me like it's an additional way to verify the identity, not a replacement. Assuming they use encryption/etc, it should be a lot harder to fake a passport.
Nothing will stop a determined counterfeiter, I'm sure, but the newbies won't be able to handle this.
Re:I am a free man (Score:2)
That's a damned good question. The government has given absolutely zero reason why the chip on the passport needs to be accessed remotely. I'm sure there are plenty of solutions that would give the same information but require physical access to the passport. This is a stupid government "we're going to jump on a new technology because it is cool" trick.
The whole *point* of RFID was to replace barcodes because on assembly line like systems th
Re:I am a free man (Score:2)
Re:I am a free man (Score:2)
Is This Madness? (Score:5, Insightful)
Good Business Opportunity (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Good Business Opportunity (Score:3, Funny)
$50 in Canadian Tire Money
Milk in a bag
Those Groucho glasses with the fake nose and moustache on them (trust me on this)
Ticket stubs from a recent Gordon Lightfoot concert
and a mini Canadian phrase book
What happens if the RFID doesnt work (Score:3, Interesting)
Will you still be allowed to travel with just the written portion of the passport. Hell, just go around burning up other peoples passports and the riots will soon begin in the security line....
Re:What happens if the RFID doesnt work (Score:4, Informative)
Re:What happens if the RFID doesnt work (Score:2)
But you're right, if it's just sat too near your microwave and gone pop, you won't know until you next try to use it.
Easy Way To Stop Skimming (Score:2, Interesting)
Re:Easy Way To Stop Skimming (Score:2)
I'm assuming that the "anti-skimming material" mentioned in the article is a thin sheet of foil embedded in the cover. I could see how a damaged cover or one that's not closed completely would allow RF leakage. Perhaps the best solution would be something like an old metal cigarette case that snaps shut around the passport and won't open unless you want it to. Hmmm ... marketable idea...
-b.
Re:Easy Way To Stop Skimming (Score:2)
With every technology advance (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:With every technology advance (Score:2)
The problem isn't that it is an electronic chip. No one has a problem with that. The problem is that the chip is designed to be read by radio, automatically, at range.
Give me a good scenero where I want someone able to read my passport without me being able to hand it over to them. I can think of a few places where it might speed things up a bit, but no legitimate ones where it would save more than a few seconds.
On the other hand, I can think of lots of illegitimat
Get yours now! (Score:5, Insightful)
Re: (Score:2)
New uses for microwave ovens ... (Score:2)
Tux2000
Could you... (Score:2)
This would be the simple answer to all those who fear the wrath of the RFID t
Re:Could you... (Score:2)
If it's the standard grain-of-rice sized RFID they wil just make one thick page with it in inside. If you smash it, no one will be able to tell (probably). Although I do like your Microwave idea.
If they did make these mandatory (like a Nation wide ID card) then we should all throw them in the Microwave on a planned day and the next day go to the issuing agency and say "it no longer works" if 150,000 people or more did this I thin
Enterprising RFID Entrepeneur (Score:3, Informative)
It would be nice to know who got the contract, what city they live in and what relationships they have with government.
The obvious application (Score:2)
Too expensive? Oh c'moooon, those babies are BUILT where they would potentially be used that way, you save big time on shipping costs!
Yeah well. Not good. (Score:3, Interesting)
So, the issue, you consider is that the transmitter is giving away your nationality and NOT that it's a....I dunno. a BLOODY TRANSMITTER?( worst case scenaria, and I'm really going off the top of my head here, how about professional passport thieves:"Hey, there is a city building with 24 passports in there, let's see which suits are empty at the moment, and do some damage."(I'd think anybody smart enough to detect the signal would be smart enough to block it afterwards)). I'd be appalled if other countries follow suit, I fear that they will. Let's just hope that there is enough damage done the moment they try to use RFID's so the launch fails.
Can you imagine the terrorism weapons? (Score:3)
The most workable solution? (Score:2, Insightful)
Either way, people can protect themselves whether it is in the design or not.
Re:The most workable solution? (Score:3, Informative)
http://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2005/08/rfi
The UK's already got them... (Score:2)
Why RFID and not smart cards? (Score:4, Interesting)
I can only think of two possibilities. One is just good old fashioned corruption. It's no secret that the GOP has pretty much put a 'For Sale' sign out front of the Capital, so it may just be a way to send a bunch of money to a valuable 'doner'. Or they have some requirement which needs RFID, but is being kept secret.
I suppose they could almost completely automate letting US citizens back into the country. Will I be able to use my RFID passport to scan in to the country just like I do with my work badge to get into the machine room or co-lo? I can see benefits for having an express lane at immigration for citizens with RFID passports so we don't have to wait behind all the riff-raff
Re:Why RFID and not smart cards? (Score:3, Interesting)
Because smart cards were invented in the 70s [wikipedia.org] and the patent has expired. Thus not putting money into the pocket of your "constituents*" as fast as a patented technology would.
So... they aren't the ones that did the lobbying.
When it comes to politics... "why" is always easy.
Just follow the money.
*constituent: the people that bribed you
Passport Souffle (Score:2)
Time for a big brother to the duct tape wallet? (Score:2)
Not really a security concern. (Score:3, Informative)
People fear what they don't understand.
Re:Hows about.. (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:Hows about.. (Score:2)
But, it's not compulsory.
Carrying ID usually is necessary, at least when travelling, but when it's not immediately needed you have the choice whether to keep it tucked away in a pocket, or paste it to your forehead and install a system of glowing neon arrows pointing to it while shouting your name, rank and serial number through a megaphone.
Re:Hows about.. (Score:2)
Now they can impersonate you, and when that person's crimes come back to you, the cops will say "We know it was you, those passport chips are unhackable!" It makes no sense, an optical (2D barcode or something similar) system would make MUCH more sense.
Re:Hows about.. (Score:2)
I suspect that the length of a passport number or the structure might identify the passport holder as an American...
-b.
Re:Passport holder activation switch (Score:2)
Re:How to tell if a foreigner is American... (Score:2)
'Round my parts ya'all should know that this happens quite often. Ya'all just need to get out da truck and pull da tail, and they all will start a runnin'. Simple as a sweet cherry pie made by my momma.
Re:The Department... (Score:3, Insightful)
come on,we're not all that stupid! (Score:3, Funny)
Re:Can already spot a foreigner a mile away (Score:3)
Ahhh... racist stereotypes. I suppose you think that all the Polish are stupid, that all the British have bad teeth, that all Irish are drunken potato eaters, that all Germans are Nazis, etc. The US has more than 220,000,000 people of a variety of races living it, and they all have their own statures and personalities which vary greatly.
Re:endangering civilians (Score:5, Informative)
As I stated in an earlier post, Austrailia, New Zealand and Singapore already have RFID passports. The information that can be obtained from the chip is encrypted, and will only be readable using the public-key which is encoded in a machine readable format inside the passport http://www.dfat.gov.au/dept/passports/ [dfat.gov.au]. The plan in the U.S. is the to do the same thing, as well as putting a metal lining in the cover of the passport so that the RFID cannot be read when the passport is closed. See http://www.aimglobal.org/members/news/anmviewer.as p?a=394&print=no [aimglobal.org]