Canadian Privacy Act 398
Nos. writes "Yesterday, I happened upon an Act that came into effect in Canada on January 1, 2004. The Personal Information Protection and Electronic Documents Act protects almost every bit of personal information not publicly available. For example, your name, race, date of birth, income, etc. are protected where your address and telephone number are not (these are generally available in the telephone book). Some of the more interesting parts of the faq include such wonderful things as: '[businesses must] supply you with a product or a service even if you refuse consent for the collection, use or disclosure of your personal information unless the information is essential to the transaction'. Definitely a step in the right direction."
So it happens... (Score:5, Funny)
Re:So it happens... (Score:3, Informative)
Fake data (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:Fake data (Score:5, Funny)
1060 West Addison Ave.
Chicago, IL 60613-4397
773-404-2827
Ok, one record store clerk and Blues Brothers fan almost died laughing.
Re:Fake data (Score:2, Offtopic)
Re:Fake data (Score:5, Funny)
Name: Zaphod Beeblebrox
Address: (I live 2 states away now)
Phone: 620-664-5522 (Modem Pool)
Re:Fake data (Score:2)
Address: <my old mailing address> (I live 2 states away now)
Re:Fake data (Score:4, Funny)
Re:Fake data (Score:5, Informative)
translation: (I have) (an) (ass(, (a) (new) (ass)
note that in French, the adjective (new) comes after the noun (ass), and I switched them for non-French slashdotters
Obligatory Simpsons Reference (Score:3, Funny)
732 Evengreen Ter.
Springfield KY, 40069
(859)764-8437 (I know, it's Moe's...)
Re:Fake data (Score:3, Interesting)
BTW- I'm not so worried about MY gov't collecting info on me, as I'm worried about YOUR gov't (read - Carnivore) collecting information on me...
The tale of Ray Diosack and Mike Rocenter (Score:5, Funny)
He then went to a local computer shop called MicroCenter. As he was waiting in line he realized that this would work great for his little name game: Mike Rocenter... it even sounds like a real name. So anyway, he gets to the cashier full of excitement and gives the name Mike Rocenter. The cashier enters the name into the computer and says, with a straight face, "727 Memorial Drive"? This was, of course, the location of the store. Somebody else had given them the same fake name and address. Oh well, my friend sheepishly said yes and paid for his purchase.
Re:The tale of Ray Diosack and Mike Rocenter (Score:3, Informative)
The PIPDA's been on the books for two years. It only came into effect for non-government agencies Jan. 1st. It's been in effect for crown corporations, agencies, and federally regulated industries for quite a while.
One of the stipulations of the act is that they have to inform you why they're collecting the information.
Re:Fake data (Score:4, Interesting)
Re:Fake data (Score:4, Interesting)
Jason
ProfQuotes [profquotes.com]
AND! You can curse on the radio! (Score:3, Informative)
Yes, while much of the US has their shorts in a knot over Janet Jackson's nipple, and the FCC wants even more draconian penalties for college radio stations that dare to broadcast the word f*ck, Canada rolls along, worrying about neither.
Trust me, 3PM on a school day is the best time to listen to hardcore punk rock!
And the Canada is... (Score:4, Funny)
The Canada of America is Canada.
The Canada of Germany is Austria.
The Canada of Australia is New Zeland.
The Canada of Britain is France.
The Canada of Spain is Portugal.
The Canada of Singapore is... Sorry, I guess you Singaporians are screwed.
Not retroactive? (Score:5, Interesting)
Or if governmental agencies' practices are also influenced by the act.
RD
It IS absolutely retroactive (Score:5, Informative)
It seems that information already collected must be dealt with according to the act. Just because you collected it last year, doesn't mean you don't need consent to use it this year. Actually, my Dentist made me sign a form for them to share/get information with outside labratories.
Re:It IS absolutely retroactive (Score:4, Informative)
However, being a dentist, the transaction may well require an address to send a bill to.
If you're willing to pay at the desk, in cash, you can tell him no, and suggest that if he refuses based on that, you will contact the government of Canada for a PIPEDA infraction.
Re:It IS absolutely retroactive (Score:3, Informative)
Re:Not retroactive? (Score:5, Informative)
Re:Government (Score:5, Interesting)
I don't even have to review the legislation to know that no matter how it is written, CSIS, the RCMP, and your local cop shop will ignore it if they feel the need.
Your SIN is private, right? HEH. Nope. Now it's linked in government databases to everything. As someone who once had complete and total access to several sensitive (welfare client info) government databases - and was challenged appropriately by only ONE of dozens of sysadmins - I don't trust the government to protect a pile of dog feces.
Re:Government (Score:3, Informative)
Now it's linked in government databases to everything.
Canada's Social Insurance Numbers are basically an account number for each citizen. By law even the banks can't demand it although they can refuse service if you don't give it to them.
Re: GoC does take privacy seriously (Score:5, Informative)
The personal details of all Canadian residents (not just citizens) are automatically classified as "Protected" and any department or agency worth their salt actually do take this sort of stuff seriously.
Any case of abuse (of people's personal data) does tend to result in being fired, period.
The federal government (outside CCRA) does avoid using SIN as much as possible because any document with that on it, has to be classified "Protected".
HRDC uses a fair bit, but as little as possible in what I've seen.
I've seen federal government forms that ask for only the last digit of your year of birth, in an attempt to prevent age decriminitation (if they don't know your actual age, they can't be accused of decriminiating based upon it) in the hiring process.
Honestly I have to say the Canadian federal government takes privacy seriously, it's an important Canadian value. Sure, some people see it as a hassle and more paperwork, but overall the vast majority do value the public's privacy and security.
BTW, do you know if there was an auditing on that database? Not all privacy enforcement is pro-active, to prevent being overly burdensome, but can flag and catch abusers. That technique is heavily used in medical privacy, and the medical files of celeberties.
Re: GoC does take privacy seriously (Score:3, Interesting)
Re: GoC does take privacy seriously (Score:3, Interesting)
mind you , those are the very lowest form of 'classified' documents I've seen in the military. It's not that secure!
It doesn't have to be very secure, the largest threat is internal - employees, who can be easily sanctioned, not foreign militaries or governments. The next largest threat is "direct marketers" (read: junk mail and telemarketers) and "credit agencies" and data warehousers like Equifax.
Re:Not retroactive? (Score:5, Insightful)
It just demonstrates how strongly America loves its businesses and corporations (and subsequently, its money). These corporate/business-friendly policies that put so much pressure on American employees are just like outsourcing in that they alienate the apparently "not-worthwhile" American employee. While America may keep their corporations and their corporate revenue, they might lose a comparable amount in salaries and income taxes. Perhaps.
I like these progressive-non-Big-Brother (i.e. not China, Saudi Arabia, evidently) countries that respect the people and their lives rather than corporations.
You do raise a good point about govenment monitoring and the like. It does seem like small consolation to have your privacy rights from your employer, but still allow the government to monitor every aspect of your existence.
Still, this is a good thing.
Re:Not retroactive? (Score:3, Informative)
The abolition of slavery was considered the work of religious radicals too, who had this wild notion that all those slaves were human beings and their book said it was wrong to keep human beings in bondage, but not every abolitionist was religious. The right to live, like the right to not be a slave, is something that plenty of people can grasp without the guidance of Holy texts.
So, at the end of the day,
I'll get to the point at the end of this post. (Score:3, Interesting)
The abolition of slavery was considered the work of religious radicals too, who had this wild notion that all those slaves were human beings and their book said it was wrong to keep human beings in bondage, but not every abolitionist was religious. The right to live, like the right to not be a slave, is something that plenty of people can grasp without the guidance of Holy texts.
So, at the end of
Re:Not retroactive? (Score:3, Informative)
Failure to comply is a serious issue and may result in (now stealing from our website):
- Legal liability
- In
Wow, time to move to Canada! (Score:5, Funny)
Re:Wow, time to move to Canada! (Score:5, Funny)
Thank God! (Score:5, Funny)
Oz? (Score:3, Funny)
You were going to say
-kgj
So hypothetically... (Score:5, Interesting)
Privacy = Myth (Score:3, Interesting)
Privacy is impossible if one is to interface with the digital world.
Re:Privacy = Myth (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Privacy = Myth (Score:3, Insightful)
I was reviewing my companies out going email the other day and apparently our CFO sends himself financial spreadsheets through email with no encryption, security, etc. Crazy.
Some people will blow it on HIPAA but many others are running around like crazy trying to be in compliance- as they are afraid of getting slammed. (We work with hospital
Re:Privacy = Myth (Score:3, Interesting)
And this helps me out how? (Score:5, Funny)
What I want is not to be pestered salesmen and junk mail.
I don't care if total strangers send me birthday cards.
Your name? (Score:4, Funny)
"where your address and telephone number are not (these are generally available in the telephone book)."
So in Canada they dont put your name in a phone book?
If this was real, it would make for some great jokes.
Re:Your name? (Score:2, Insightful)
Not in Canada. Here you have to pay a surcharge to be unlisted from the phone book.
I suppose it doesn't mean it's impossible, but at least now the service will be completely free.
Speaking of that, the idiots at Bell will probably finally be forced to list my fax number properly (well, they did that out of courtesy and confusion a while ago anyways, but that's another story).
What the law says and what's done in practice ... (Score:5, Informative)
Unfortunately the laws and procedures are broken every day, simply because it's so easy to do. It's very rare that somebody publicly complains when personal privacy is jeopardized and even when somebody cries foul, the public doesn't care.
Re:What the law says and what's done in practice . (Score:3, Informative)
This is actually a EU directive [eu.int]. Or actually, two different ones. One dealing with regular privacy (enforced since 1998), and one with online privacy (enforced since last year). Seemingly when you read the text of the directive, it has a lot of teeth, but in practice they make exceptions every time someone asks. Like when the US insisted on having every bit of availab
Re:What the law says and what's done in practice . (Score:3, Informative)
Yes, unfortunately the law doesn't specify any about penalties. To the best of my knowledge the highest damages that has ever been awarded for a violation of the privacy rights was ~100k. Not bad, but that person was able to proof in court that he had suffered real monetary damages. Psychological distress doesn't count
Courts have been relucatant with rewarding damages. For example, the phone company published a phone number of battered women's sh
I wonder... (Score:5, Interesting)
How are they going to call you without your name?
Re:I wonder... (Score:2, Funny)
You can have the listing read "flancrest enterprises" if you want, or "compuglobal hypermeganet"
Re:I wonder... (Score:3, Funny)
Dukael: Hello?
Prerecorded Voice: Has your love life been slow recently? If so I have a great new product that can endow you one or two more inches.
Dukael: Keep talking...
You might remember me (Score:3, Funny)
Toothless? (Score:5, Interesting)
This is likely more toothless than you would think - or at least, if this were U.S. law, it would be - because things like your SSN, date of birth, or mother's maiden name would be described by the service provider as "necessary" because they "need" to do a credit check on you.
Re:Toothless? (Score:2, Funny)
Re:Radio Shack (Score:5, Interesting)
I said "man, I dont have time for this, I'm trying to catch a train. I just need a battery for my walkman "
And the guy said "Sir we cant sell anything without this information."
I put the cash on the counter and the battery in my pocket, and said "whatever keep the change" and the guy threatened to call the cops.
Radio Shack == fucked up.
Re:Radio Shack (Score:4, Informative)
He lied. The bypass is built into the register software. Complain to RS Corporate is this happens.
From http://corpinfo.radioshack.com/CompanyInfo/Ethics
[Getting off their mailing list]:
"Customers who prefer not to receive offers, promotions and other information, may call 800-415-3200, e-mail at www.radioshack.com or write at RadioShack Circulation, 100 Throckmorton, Suite 300, Fort Worth, Texas 76102."
[Not giving personal data]:
"Rest assured RadioShack values its customers regardless of whether or not they choose to provide us with their name and address."
[From elsewhere on the site]:
Ethics Team at RadioShack
Phone: RadioShack Hotline: (800) 826-3915
Email: ethics@radioshack.com
Fax: (817) 415-3922
Mail: RadioShack Ethics Team
100 Throckmorton Street, Suite 813
Fort Worth, Texas 76102
I've never had any such problem myself. Anytime they or anyone else asks me for such things I look them straight in the eye and give them a clear and firm "No.", loud enough to make sure it's understood that I could have said it louder.
Re:Toothless? (Score:5, Informative)
If someone asks for it, read the fine print. It's usually optional. If it's not optional, make sure you phone the company and ask why it's required, and make sure they know that you know that it's not necessary for them to have it. DON'T GIVE IT OUT. It's not necessary to have your SIN for companies to do a credit check on you here.
Re:Toothless? (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Toothless? (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:Toothless? (Score:4, Insightful)
If however you would like to use someone else's money to buy your house then they are obviously going to want to know whether you are a good risk or not and are going to check your credit history to determine this.
Re:Toothless? (Score:3, Informative)
A credit report in canada can be produced with none of the above information you have mentioned. The core information for a credit report in canada is your name and date of birth and maybe a credit card or bank ac
2 thoughts... (Score:2, Interesting)
2) if this is bullshit, then it is nothing but a pr stunt.
i am feeling awfully cynical today. sardonic too, with a splash of "eat shit and die, big brother".
btw, how will this be protected? what happens if a multinational corporation keeps information gathered in your country in a different country?
Re:2 thoughts... (Score:3, Informative)
Interesting logic, care to explain? This isn't your usual local ordinance proclaiming some random date to be [insert local sports team] day.
As to how it will be implemented, many companies ask up front where you're from. They then structure their conversation with you appropriately (or say they don't deal with Canadians).
This article [infoworld.com] from last year goes into a few of these issues:
Great in theory... (Score:4, Insightful)
The whole war on spam is the exact same thing. The government passes all of these laws to make it look like they're doing something but then can't/won't enforce said laws.
They can pass all the laws they want but if the government is unwilling to enforce them then what's the point?
Re:Great in theory... (Score:5, Interesting)
For example, you know those "preferred customer" cards that most stores have? Well, the pharmacies at stores in Canada are refusing to take them, because of the possibility that the marketing info from the cards could be correlated with your prescription information. They have big signs up to this effect in the stores in my area, and they say this is to comply with the law.
And Safeway (perhaps others as well) is hoping to develop a generic coupon system so you can get credit for the pharmacy purchases later. I suppose they'll hand you the coupon with your prescription, and you can present it at the cash register at a later date, so there's no way to correlate the pharmacy purchase with the money. They already do this with a couple of other things, so it wouldn't show as pharmacy purchases. Not really sure though.
Businesses MUST (Score:2, Insightful)
I already have your product and it doesn't seem to be working correctly. I DON'T WANT YOUR SURVEYS OR MARKETING CRAP. I want support and it seems that I call the wrong number every single time.
Circular reasoning.. (Score:2, Interesting)
Car Dealerships... (Score:5, Interesting)
They were flustered. They said there was no way to put me into the system without getting on a marketing list. Eventually I gave them a fake address.
Go Canada. Stop this abuse.
Re:Car Dealerships... (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Car Dealerships... (Score:5, Informative)
Re:Car Dealerships... (Score:3, Insightful)
Radio Shack. (Score:3, Interesting)
You know you've pissed off your customers when the CE
Previously collected info. (Score:4, Interesting)
I like the idea, but this creates a lot of work too. For the unemployed, though, I guess that doesn't always sound like a bad thing.
why all the disbelief? (Score:5, Interesting)
My employer has been spending a few weeks getting all ouf our information complaint with this act, and pulled me off the phones for an information session.
And tech support centers don't do things like that unless they are required to by law.
Re:why all the disbelief? (Score:2)
Just wondering why no one noticed before this.
Finally! (Score:4, Funny)
I can see it now...
"No, mister clever Radio Shack employee, I don't want to give you my mother's maiden name, i just want to buy these double-a batteries! And now the law is on my side!"
I can hardly wait!
Canada, beautiful Canada (Score:3, Insightful)
Seriously though, I have done allot of thinking about the difference between Americans and Canadians lately and I believe that the best way of explaining it is by looking at American idol and comparing it to CBC's Monday Report. Americans like to laugh at themselves and Canadians like to laugh at their politicians.
Inaccurate Blub (Score:3, Insightful)
When I took an IT law course in 1999 we talked about PIPEDA and it came into effect in stages starting in 2000, first affecting government, then banks, then large companies, and so on until it applies to all companies.
Jason
ProfQuotes [profquotes.com]
The Privacy Commission slaps a big bank around (Score:5, Interesting)
I promptly forward this to the Privacy office who responded back in just a week to both me and the X Privacy Department that:
a) The Privacy Commission's opinion was that letter X sent to me implies that if I don't agree to let them collect information, I loose services. It then scolded X for forcing clients to agree to the new policy. Fork 1, X 0.
b) X was warned to revise the letter to adhere to the new policy. Fork 2, X 0.
c) X was to clarify their communications to the customers on what they mean by 'reduced services.' Fork 3, X 0
d) X was to inform their clients of this new policy ASAP and apologize to me. Fork 4, X 0.
X Bank has not contacted me to date (it's been four weeks). I closed my account with them today and informed the PC of the fact. When X bank asked why I was closing:
"Sir, before I close this account may I ask why you're closing it?"
"You don't know how to play the customer service game. The score is 4 to nothing."
"Excuse me sir? I don't understand the answer and I need to put in something"
"Fork 4, X 0 - put that in there"
Re:The Privacy Commission slaps a big bank around (Score:4, Interesting)
I know, not your responsibility, but it would have been nice for other folks having to deal with these guys.
More about the vigor (vigour?) of enforcement (Score:4, Interesting)
What they report is that the office of the Privacy Commissioner is strongly committed to protecting individual rights, and that if one customer complains then the company can be plunged into an expensive investigation.
Even nutcases get a careful hearing, apparently. Normal and semi-normal customers get responsive answers because the company is afraid of formal complaints.
The ISP will not turn over customer records, even to the tax authorities, without a court order or search warrant.
Sign at the conference: "If you don't need it, don't collect it!"
"To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public." --Theodore Roosevelt (1918)
Police Information Systems (Score:3, Informative)
Information Practices and
Individual Privacy.
If your really interested in Ontario's laws regarding information storage, read the following article:
http://qed.econ.queensu.ca/pub/cpp/March97/Sche
The easiest way ... (Score:5, Interesting)
I'm talking mainly about the retailers who ask for name, address, phone number, email etc, when you try to buy something.
I went to Circuit City to buy a TV, took out enough cash to pay for it, walked in, told the guy which I wanted, and we walked to the little sales terminal. He asked "can I have your name and address?" And I said, "no, you can have $499 plus tax". He started telling me how the computer "requires" it.. Gimme a break.
What you need to do is know when to walk away. I grabbed a sales circular by the door on my way out (because Best Buy would match the price)..
In the states, I've noticed that Best Buy stopped asking, they must have got the message, for instance.
It wastes the clerks time, annoys customers, and the marketing value of the collected data would come nowhere close to the amount of cold, hard, stinky cash walking out the door.
It's just the tip of the privacy iceburg, sure, but it annoying, and a good place to start sending a message.
We had this 16 years ago (Score:5, Interesting)
the us and canada (Score:5, Interesting)
americans think of canadians as cute little fuzzy americans who got lost in an ice box... they tend to think of canadians patronizingly, paternalistically, if they even think of canadians at all
canadians think of americans as scary warmongering orwellian pseudofascists a half heart beat away from doing something really scary that canada has to worry about... they tend to emphasize their differences with americans as much as humanly possible, and they tend to think about their relationship with america alot
as an american, all i can say is the maple leaf state sure is a cold lonely place (chuckle)
Canada - Land of Restricted Speech (Score:3, Interesting)
Canada has an "Official Languages Commissioner" currently looking into Don Cherry's
http://www.opinionjournal.com/taste/?id
remarks about "French Guys" being "wimps" since more of them in the NHL wear face shields. Basically, that's the whole story.
The "Minister of State for Multiculturalism" is also involved: "the government will not tolerate statements that create dissonance in our society and disrespect for others."
All this proves is that Candians need a Bill of Rights stronger than their wimpy... oops - Charter of Rights and Freedoms. Well, it doesn't seem to protect any speech outside of these Ministers of Silly Walks combined tut-tutting (which would be a fine way to just keep these political hacks busy if their mere opinions did not have the force of law).
PIPEDA (Score:5, Interesting)
The ramifications of it are quite enormous though as someone pointed out, it isn't retroactive. Canadian lawyers will make a killing as contracts are established/renewed will need to ensure that privacy is taken into account.
There are a few interesting twists to it, though. For example, my company is planning on implementing a very strict policy regarding PIPEDA. But I am currently outsourced working at a client's site. The policy that I will have to follow will be the one that my client implements.
I was also told that there are looser stipulations for international business. So if I'm doing business with an American resident, and the United States doesn't have a similar law, then I am not required BY LAW to follow my company's privacy policy.
It'll be interesting to see how the government tweaks this in the future. I am very happy that something like this is finally in place.
get the facts right (Score:4, Insightful)
Specifically, the federal Privacy Act came into effect July 1, 1983, the federal PIPEDA (Personal Information Protection and Electronic Documents Act) came into effect January 1, 2001, and the BC provincial PIPA (Personal Information Privacy Act) came into effect January 1, 2004. What it is important is that "[a]s of January 1, 2004, the [Personal Information Protection and Electronic Documents] Act will cover the collection, use or disclosure of personal information in the course of any commercial activity within a province, including provincially regulated organizations. The federal government may exempt organizations or activities in provinces that have their own privacy laws if they are substantially similar to the federal law." PIPEDA has been in place for a few years now, it just got extended to corporatations; BC now has their own overriding legislation as well.
See here for more details:
http://www.privcom.gc.ca/fs-fi/02_05_d_
I also thought your post was a horrible summary of the various pieces of legislation and their consequences, but that's just my opinion. I'd suggest next time using the official government propoganda. Even your first sentence managed to probably be incorrect--PIPA (and probably PIPEDA, I'm not sure) does protect your personal information that is public as well, in terms of reasonable use (i.e. I believe telemarketers aren't allowed to go through the telephone directory).
Regards,
Casper
Sounds Good On Paper But.. (Score:5, Interesting)
Guy calls the bank to activate his new credit card. At the beginning of the call he gets the obligatory "This call may be mointored for quality assurance purposes" message. The guy complains that he doesn't want to have his call monitored. The bank says well if you don't like it you can jam your card where the sun don't shine. Guy complains to the privacy commissioner. The privacy comissioner rules in favour of the guy and decrees that banks cannot monitor calls without consent as it violates our fabulous new privacy laws.
The upshot? It's now much easier for theives and fraudsters to steal credit cards from mailboxes and activate and use them. The bank is no longer allowed to record what phone number is used to register the card, and if the fraudster has obtained other personal information about you (or fraudently applied for the card in your name) you and the bank are screwed. Go privacy!
Negligent (Score:3, Insightful)
Steal the card, call from any phone, activate it.
They don't authenticate in ANY way that I'm aware of.
Here's my own personal Canadian Privacy Act (Score:5, Interesting)
Here's an example (Score:4, Informative)
Parking lot [canoe.ca] complaints [canoe.ca]
825 complaints in 18 months in one city against one company. The data was sold by the government to the parking company.
Vip
Re:Never learn (Score:2)
Re:Serious (Score:2, Interesting)
Re:Serious (Score:5, Informative)
Yeah, it is truly bizarre -- if the business is making money off the product.
Sometimes, the business is making -- or plans to make -- the majority of its money off selling your name or your "eyeballs" (viewership).
Some MBA has convinced ShopShack that the real money is in selling its customers to other businesses, and MBAstard realizes that you just want to make the purchase and get on with your life. So a policy is made that the shop won't sell without getting your information, wagering that, having waited in the check-out line, rather than go to the trouble to buy elsewhere, you'll just do as you're told like a good little consumer.
The only effective response to this is to make the cost of doing this as high as possible for the business by
It's not easy, and it's not convenient, but if you want to keep your privacy, you need to make it uncomfortable and costly for those who want to take it from you. make it costly enough, and the stores will stop doing this crap.
Re:Serious (Score:4, Interesting)
I managed to slip by but soon had one goon chasing me. I made it to the convenience store where they insisted on searching my bag. I told him to fuck-off.
After cackling on his walkie-talkie, he had three more goons on me, while I picked-up my snacks. I told them all to fuck-off (extremely loudly), that they had no fucking business searching people like that, and if they don't like it, they can shove their jobs through their asses.
I then proceeded to the cash counter line, where the head goon insisted that I pass in front of everyone.
I shouted back why don't you go fuck yourself, no, I'm not passing in front of everyone in line. So I waited a good five minutes while the goons were fuming. All the while I shouted back obscenities at them (all the time making sure I was in plain view of the security cameras).
When I paid and got out of the store, they escorted me out to the gate of the festival. They did not succeed in searching me, I got them pretty pissed-off at me, and I had the pleasure of yelling at them...
Re:and Canada is a socialist state? (Score:3, Insightful)
I think the argument usually comes down to taxation rates. I've lived and worked in both the U.S. and Canada. All I know is, I payed whackloads less on employee stock options that I exercized in
Re:and Canada is a socialist state? (Score:4, Interesting)
Actually, it's not. Our government is Socialist. (Note that most Americans seem to believe that all socialist government are totalitarian, and I think you may have fallen into that trap as well.)
We have stronger state education and health care, but I think that's only a wise application of capitalism.
We also have government-run business ("Crown Corporations", like Canada Post), which is what makes us socialist. If there were no Crown Corporations, we'd be capitalist, if there were no independent businesses, we'd be communist. (OK, it's a little more complex than that, but that's the basic gist of it.)
That is the most absurd thing I've ever heard. (Score:3, Informative)
Do you even [wikipedia.org] know [wikipedia.org] what [wikipedia.org] socialist [infoshop.org] means [parecon.org]?
bacchusrx.
Yes, we are socialist. (Score:4, Insightful)
yes, this is correct. Canada, like most countries with high standards of living (like most of Europe) is Socialist. As a Canadian, I'm quite proud of this.
This seems to be the counterproof.
No, this is exactly proof. This is what Socialist governments do - they enact laws that benefit people instead of ones that benefit corporations.
Americans seem to equate 'socialism' with 'totalitarianism', when the two have exactly zero in common. Perhaps if you understood what the terms actually mean, you wouldn't be so confused.
Re:Race? (Score:3, Informative)
The typically usage for "race" is actually voluntary disclosure whether you are member of a visual minority for the purposes of "employment equity" status for hiring preference.
The recent US name was "affirimative action" hiring.
It gets quite funny with security id cards that try to describe appearance (the form on file) without actually offending anybody where the actual only purpose is to ensure that Jill's id card is only used by Jill.
Here's why you track race. (Score:3, Interesting)
Unless you TRACK the problem (ie measure the race/sex/age of hiring in the example - then observance to law cannot be proved. And is therefore lip-service. These statistics are KEY to prosecution.