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Censorship The Internet

China Detains Internet Essayist for Subversion 450

Posted by Cliff from the watching-what-you-say dept.
romcabrera writes: "Reuters reports that 'Chinese authorities have detained a civil servant, whose essays are banned by Beijing on the Internet, on charges of subversion'. According to the article, China has created a special Internet Police Force which 'blocks some foreign sites and shuts down domestic sites posting politically incorrect fare'."
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China Detains Internet Essayist for Subversion More

China Detains Internet Essayist for Subversion

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  • These guys mean business... (Score:4, Informative)

    by GreyWolf3000 ( 468618 ) on Friday October 31, 2003 @04:06PM (#7362409) Journal
    My father works for British Petrolium and used to work in China. I spent the summers of there for a few years. They block just about any domain that contains any word related to criminal activity. At the time, they blocked sourceforge.net subdomains because a robot found the words "mp3" on several of the hosted project pages.

    They take censorship very seriously over there. Frankly, it would surprise me more if they didn't detain him.

    • I give China a lot of credit for what its government does. I might not agree with it, but they're upfront about their censorship and their control (suppression) over their citizens. It would be refreshing if other governments had the same sense of honesty about citizens' "freedom," but I doubt we'll see it.
      • Exactly. The Chinese know their government is large and does not have any notion of civil liberties. We accept the belief that we are free so dogmatically that we refuse to vigilantly guard it, and it slowly erodes...

        The phrase "give me liberty or give me death" makes us feel warm inside, but when Dick Chaney says on record that when the next attack comes, Americans should expect to see their civil liberties suspended, no one even notices it.

        • Re:These guys mean business... (Score:5, Insightful)

          by Stargoat ( 658863 ) <stargoat@gmail.com> on Friday October 31, 2003 @04:43PM (#7362809) Journal
          You fool. You sorry sorry fool. You have no idea how good you have it.

          Until you've seen the face of a person terrified at the idea of meeting any police, or a person shaking after getting a ticket, or a person afraid to talk to anyone in government, then you should talk.

          We are free. We are very free. You can walk up to the White House and picket it. You can drive your truck with a rifle in the back. You can say what you want on the Internet. You can read the books you want.

          Even if another terrorist attack occurs, do you think they're going to take these liberties away? No. The government won't. In fact, they can't. Because people like myself speak up and let people like you know what is going on. Because people like myself are armed and watching.

          Our founding fathers knew what they were doing a hell of a lot better than you give them credit for.

          • Even if another terrorist attack occurs, do you think they're going to take these liberties away? No. The government won't. In fact, they can't. Because people like myself speak up and let people like you know what is going on. Because people like myself are armed and watching.
            And yet, we have the PATRIOT ACT, and the threat of the PATRIOT ACT II, and the DMCA, and the TCA, to name a few.

          • You fool. You sorry sorry fool. You have no idea how good you have it.

            I really had a hard time taking this post seriously.

            Until you've seen the face of a person terrified at the idea of meeting any police, or a person shaking after getting a ticket, or a person afraid to talk to anyone in government, then you should talk.

            Given that I have lived in China (and other underdeveloped nations), and have seen all of this first hand, I do believe that you must grant me the authority to speak on this matter, ba

      • Re:These guys mean business... (Score:5, Informative)

        by Stargoat ( 658863 ) <stargoat@gmail.com> on Friday October 31, 2003 @04:40PM (#7362772) Journal
        They're upfront about censorship? BS. There are news blackouts on almost everything for the common person. Remember that 600K person march in Hong Kong a few months ago? Average Chinese had no idea it took place. They think their government tells them all the news that's fit to print. They believe the lies about Tibet, the lies about religion, the lies about Taiwan, because no one tells them different.

        As for supression, see how you like when you are up late at night, worry how your family is because you may or may not have been caught bringing a Bible through customs.

        Or maybe that this guy might disappear and his family never know under other circumstances. Or the fact that Chinese detains American citizens of Chinese descent when they go to China after writing such things?

        Then, asses like Hu claim that it is the good for the Democracy in China. When someone claims otherwise, the Chinese either kick them out of China, declare colonial racism, or simple beat the poor bastard up.

        Or the news blackouts over SARS. Arresting doctors who spoke out about it? Let alone the nukes pointed at Taiwan, or the loss of submarines, or coal mining disasters. This attitude is killing people!!!

        • They're upfront about censorship? BS. There are news blackouts on almost everything for the common person. Remember that 600K person march in Hong Kong a few months ago? Average Chinese had no idea it took place. They think their government tells them all the news that's fit to print. They believe the lies about Tibet, the lies about religion, the lies about Taiwan, because no one tells them different.

          And how exactly is this different to the United States?

          Average Merkins still think that Saddam had weapo

          • The point is, you can tell the average American differently, and you won't go to jail and have your family starve.

            You can say it on the Internet, and not have your computer impounded.

            You can declare for all to see that you hate George Bush and not be shot for it.

        • Um, of any of the times I've been there and of all the people I talked to the only people who ever gave any indication that they believed for a second their government was being upfront with them and not telling them lies was the occasional tour guide when I decided to go on a tour somewhere. All of them are government employees, and a number of them got across pretty clearly with their faces that they knew it was a load of crap but they had to say it.

          There is certainly the angry minority who likes to pus
      • I had lunch with a coworker who just came from mainland China (to help us debug). I asked him what are governmental taboo subjects - and he replied that only Falun Gong cannot be mentioned publicly, and that the government really doesn't care about other stuff.
    • Good to know. Just put the following line into my /etc/mail/access file:

      From:cn ERROR:"550 Support Falun Gong!"

  • Well done China (Score:5, Funny)

    by KDan ( 90353 ) on Friday October 31, 2003 @04:07PM (#7362417) Homepage
    Gotta have respect for a country which managed to take the best of both worlds. They got totalitarianism from communism, and greedy corporations from capitalism. w00t! Well done!

    Daniel

    • Re:Well done China (Score:2, Interesting)

      by seriv ( 698799 )
      I have stop considering China a communist contury. They stop following all the values pf it. I do not consider censurship communist either. It is one screwed up political system.
      -Seriv
    • Oh yes, because as we all know, communism is EVIL .
    • greedy corporations from capitalism

      There is no such thing as greed. It is a completely subjective notion that has no objective means of measuring it.

      Is it greedy to buy a 29 inch television when you could have bought a 27 inch television and given the difference to someone who "needed it"?

      If so, then is it greedy to have bought a 27 inch television when you could have bought a 25 inch television...?

  • Sssshhhh!!!! (Score:2, Funny)

    by Anonymous Coward
    Don't give Ashcroft, Cheney and Bush anymore ideas for Patriot Act II....
  • In case anyone hasn't noticed, China is a hardline socialist dictatorship. They kill people for defying the state and send the bill for the bullets to their families. This is why American protestors really have no idea how good they have it. The "state" doesn't come and kill you if you voice your opinion on something. China's government is bad, we know this. Unless we plan to invade and liberate them then there's nothing we can do about it.
    • Unless you're sent to guantanamo bay!

      Just pointing out that not all systems are perfect. As described in the Matrix, there are ALWAYS defects to the rule.
    • We can stop enriching and rewarding their overlords with our so-called 'free trade'.

    • Re:Why is this news? (Score:5, Insightful)

      by Trigun ( 685027 ) <evil.evilempire@ath@cx> on Friday October 31, 2003 @04:14PM (#7362493)
      Good effin' luck on that one, too.
      You can't attack them into becoming a democracy.
      You can't sanction them into it.
      You can only start by persuading the younger members of the political party and wait for the old hardliners to die off. Befriend the country, help it grow on the international market, and be very vocal about it treating its people better. Don't go beating your chest over it, because then they'll just shoot a hundred prisoners right in front of your diplomats to prove a point.
    • It is news worth repeating because we can't afford to start thinking that China is "all right" just because they are allowing a bit of economic freedom.

    • Unless we plan to invade and liberate them then there's nothing we can do about it.

      ROTFL that' d be a laugh and a half. The US vs. CHina in a Real War(tm).

      The US would lose so many lives and get so thrashed that China would probably end up taking over portions of US territory in the end.

    • It's news because the western news media has done a great job of swallowing the idea that today's China is about being pro-capitalist and pro-Western. Add in a healthy dose of multiculturism and self-criticism of Western democracy, and you have a potent cocktail capable of making you forget that China has jailed, punished or outright killed as many or more of its own citizens in the pursuit of a political goal as any other nation in history -- and continues to do so as a matter of public policy!

    • >China is a hardline socialist dictatorship ...

      >This is why American protestors really have no
      >idea how good they have it.

      So you're saying that because some other country sucks, my right to petition my own government for redress of grievances is somehow diminished? Why is that exactly? Because agents of the state aren't literally executing protestors and dissidents where I live, means everything is just fine and I don't have anything to complain about? And that's up to you?
        • So you're saying that because some other country sucks, my right to petition my own government for redress of grievances is somehow diminished?
        No, I think the poster was saying that your right to petition for redress of grievance is amplified, not diminished, because it's absent in so much of the world.
    • This is why American protestors really have no idea how good they have it.

      That is such a red herring.

      What does that have to do with anything related to american protests?

      You shouldn't judge our state (The USA) based on the evils of another but on the principles it is straying from.

      There are many thing we can do to change China, suspending aid, trade and other things for one.

      War isn't the only solution to a disagreement and protesters aren't really stupid just because they have it "better" than people
    • This is why American protestors really have no idea how good they have it.

      Just to clarify: when American protestors continue to try to improve their lives despite perhaps living better than various other parts of the world, it does not per se mean they're unaware of the harrowing plights of (for example) the Chinese. Don't know if you meant to imply to the contrary.

    • Actually, China is a fascist capitalist state. And one of the reasons we have it so good in the U.S. is that we offload a lot of our shit work to organizations in China--where they don't require the pesky 'unions' that we here in the states have to protect the health and wellbeing of our workers. That's where all those cheapo plastic American flags come from, fellow patriot! Ain't capitalism grand!

      So, actually, we could do something about it if we wanted to--hit 'em where it hurts--in the pocketbook.

  • Let's just hope... (Score:4, Insightful)

    by Diedrich Vorberg ( 710751 ) * on Friday October 31, 2003 @04:08PM (#7362434) Homepage
    ... the internet is growing faster than the policeforce. In China or at home...
  • Bravo for the Republic, such insolence is to be weeded out early and often. This rebel's rhetoric was not in-line with that of the People, and therefore he is to be detained and rehabilitated. Perhaps, he could even prove to be a powerful ally.....

    DAARRRHHHHH---DAARRHHHHHHH

  • You read subversion and think of the version control system.

    pi

  • freenet (Score:4, Insightful)

    by capoccia ( 312092 ) on Friday October 31, 2003 @04:09PM (#7362454) Journal
    this guy should have used freenet.
    • Doesn't fix everything. They could say, "hey, you! You're literary style is similar to this guy's, so in you go!" That's the thing. They don't need evidence. The point isn't to catch the guy who spoke out, it's to scare those who didn't, but might have. The dissenter is already lost. Who cares about him? You want to keep more from arising.
    • He was.

  • Another blotch. (Score:4, Insightful)

    by hethatishere ( 674234 ) on Friday October 31, 2003 @04:11PM (#7362472)
    This is sad to hear, being someone who has traveled to China several times in the past ten years it has been my experience that China has been very slowly opening up and becoming freer country. This saddens me deeply considering the progress that has been slowly made since Tienanmen Square. The internet still proves to be something that the Government is very sensitive about. Luckily there are many American Corporations who seem more than happy to help continue the cycle of information opression.
  • Even in a free country where people are afraid to speak anonymously speech is curtailed...if not by the government but by the screaming mob.

    We live in a country now where people who criticize the war are called traitors and put in government databases. Where visitors to our country are fingerprinted without suspicion and where people are held without charges for months at a time. Where the label of terrorist is slung around with a casualness unknown 5 years ago.

    Our politics has been poisoned and this pois
    • Yes!!

      It sickened me that people who were against the WAR (slaughter) in Irag were dubbed as being "against the troops". They then had to say, "We're for the troops, but against the war in Iraq." I thought it was idiotic that they had state this. Some how, in this country (US), being anti-war means being anti-troops. The only thing I can think of is that it's a reaction to the Vietnam era protestors who confused the drafted troops fighting with US Government policy - which is idiotic in itself.

      Another note

  • "www.democracy.org.hk could not be found."

    A good /.ing leads to truth!

  • Politically incorrect (Score:3, Insightful)

    by friendofafriend ( 602350 ) on Friday October 31, 2003 @04:17PM (#7362529)
    Why do I get the feeling that their definition of "Politically incorrect" does not bear much resemblence to my definition?

    --

  • Can't you just see Ashcroft drooling at the possibilities? As he sits in a darkened room illuminated only by 1000 little monitors constantly shifting back and forth with the views of tens of thousands of video surveillance cameras around the country, as the muted audio from hundreds of roving wiretaps fills the air, can't you just see him leaping to his feet from his crouched position on the cold marble floor and screaming YES!.

    Well, I can. I've got a secret surveillance camera watching him right now.

  • Should Have Used CVS (Score:3, Funny)

    by N8F8 ( 4562 ) on Friday October 31, 2003 @04:20PM (#7362560)
    Everyone knows commies prefer CVS over Subversion!

  • President Bush says... (Score:4, Interesting)

    by Bakobull ( 301976 ) on Friday October 31, 2003 @04:31PM (#7362681)
    "We see a China that is stable and prosperous, a nation that respects the peace of its neighbors and works to secure the freedom of its own people. " President Bush Addresses Australian Parliament Oct. 22,2003 [whitehouse.gov]
    • And of course, the next day, Hu Jintao asks the Australian Parliament to help him "secure" the freedom of the Taiwanese people.

      Oct. 23, 2003 [yahoo.com]

    • Mod this down, please... the quote is "seek," not "see."
    • I followed your link, being an Australian. What I found there disturbed me greatly.

      The speech transcript acccurately gives Bush's words on the day and lists in brackets the parliament's responses where said (eg. Hear, hear etc). However, what non-Australians may not know is that there were two outbursts from Senators Brown and Nettle (both from the Greens Party) during the speech.

      The disturbing part of this self-censroship of the Whitehouse is that whilst the Speaker's comments on the outbursts are writte

  • Okay, so... (Score:3, Insightful)

    by TwistedGreen ( 80055 ) on Friday October 31, 2003 @04:32PM (#7362682)
    what did this guy REALLY do? I mean, this is Slashdot. You can't exactly expect biased reporting. Especially when it's reporting on news reported by a biased Western news source! What exactly did this guy write? What else is he involved in? Who does he work for?

    I just can't take this very seriously. It reeks too severely of "look at how evil our rival government is!" propaganda.
  • ...he had used Freenet [freenetproject.org].

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