European Parliament Clashes Over Software Patents 213
D4C5CE writes "The European Parliament's Daily Notebook reports on the turbulent final plenary debate this morning regarding a draft Directive
to legalize Software Patents (which are currently unlawful under Art.52 (2) (c) of the European Patent Convention). The Notebook quotes some truly bizarre views and arguments (which no doubt you'll take the time to point out to Members of the European Parliament before tomorrow's
vote), with some MEPs even claiming to feel harassed because they are suddenly also being lobbied by numerous concerned citizens, rather than solely by industry representatives as usual."
Could be worse... (Score:3, Insightful)
Ah, hopefully things will go well and all these great software projects (and their home pages) will go back to normal!
Re:Could be worse... (Score:4, Interesting)
An example: some inserted text reads:
Remembering that "Computer-implemented inventions" are quite clearly already patentable under current law, this passage only restricts their applicability. The amendment itself is full of such restrictions, and doesn't add any new ways of patenting computer programs that I can see. "The open-source community" is mentioned specifically in a part of the amendment. There is even a new passage making it legal to implement patented methods for the sole purpose of software interoperability, and protecting reverse engineering! Where exactly is the problem with this legislation? You might disagree with the fact that it is possible to patent "computer-implemented inventions" at all, but you can already do that now. This amendment only makes it harder. If you want to strike this concept out of current law, you should lobby for a different amendment and leave this one alone.Re:Could be worse... (Score:5, Interesting)
Especially read 4. How CEC/JURI ensure Unlimited Patentability: Some Sample Provisions from their Directive Proposal for a translation into real English: For a patent laywer, the term "computer-implemented inventions" means that everything that potentially runs on a computer (like, Software) can now be patented! Compare this to the existing law, which explicitly forbids pure software patents, yet the EPO (European Patent Office) granted ~30,000 software patents, from one-click shopping over email archiving to progress bars (so much for the "don't extend current practice" bit).
What it would mean for Linux et al. if this practice will be officially sanctioned we all know...
Re:Could be worse... (Score:5, Insightful)
However, the mobile phone argument shows exactly why this is still a bad law. Mobile phones these days are essentially "software plus an antenna". So what happens when we allow people to patent "algorithm X plus an antenna"?
What we get is this: some open source programmer writes algorithm X, and deploys it in a usual fashion. Some patent miscreant then jumps up and says "hey, you're running algorithm X on a laptop with a wireless network card! You're infringing my patent and owe me royalties!".
No, the current "clarifications" are no good. Software patenting must be abolished completely, in all of its forms. If the physical device does not have some unique and novel feature of its own, sans software, then the device should not be patentable. Period.
Re:Could be worse... (Score:2, Interesting)
Re:Could be worse... (Score:2, Informative)
You were more correct initially.
The current law is EPC and national laws that are based on the EPC. The European Patent Office is not related to the EU.
All EU states are EPC contracting states but not all EPC states are EU states, e.g. Switzerland and Turkey.
The EU cannot change the statutory definition of what is patentable because this would conflict with the member states obligations under the EPC or creating a situation where nation patents are granted on a different basis to European patents, wh
Re:Could be worse... (Score:2)
The citizens are coming after them with pitchfork. (Score:4, Funny)
Re:The citizens are coming after them with pitchfo (Score:3, Informative)
Total nonsense. All MEPs get lobbied by the public, stop trying to make them out as ivory tower-dwelling bureaucrats. Only Arlene MacArthy, the sponsor of this whole mess, complained of harassment. Seeing as she has been the focus of this whole mess and been unnecessarily painted as a heartless crone, it's not surprising some compaigners have gone over the top. Other repres
Heaven forefend! (Score:5, Funny)
Imagine that -- contacted by (ugh) commoners. Oh, the ignominy!
Re:Heaven forefend! (Score:4, Funny)
Diagnosis: results of
Re:Heaven forefend! (Score:5, Informative)
Re:Heaven forefend! (Score:2)
Re:Heaven forefend! (Score:5, Interesting)
The Commission is the executive of the EU. It carries out and polices EU law. It also proposes EU legislation, but since it cannot itself pass the legislation this does not make it a legislative body. Indeed, in most democracies the bulk of legislation is proposed by the executive (including the US and UK).
The Council of Ministers and the Parliament together form the legislature. Every piece of new EU legislation proposed by the Commission must be ratified by the Council of Ministers to take effect. In many areas, the approval of the Parliament is also required. Just as in the US and UK, the legislature can amend or throw out proposed legislation.
Finally, the European Court of Justice is (predictably) the judiciary of the EU. It has the power to strike down EU legislation for being incompatible with the Treaties that created the EU, as well as ensuring that the Commission, Council of Ministers, Parliament, Member States and individuals follow EC law.
While the EU is often condemned as being undemocratic, its legislature is in essence much like the US congress. The Parliament, like the House of Representatives, is elected by the people on on a demographic basis (more populous regions get more MEPs). The Council of Ministers, like the US senate, is made up of an equal number of representatives from each member state. While members are not elected directly to the council, they are drawn from the democratically-elected governments of the member states and so are ultimately subject to democratic control.
The big gap in EU democracy is in the unelected nature of the executive, the commission. But it's unfair to blame that on the EU itself -- it was the member states who vetoed the idea of a popularly elected President of the commission at the EU constitutional convention. Why? precidely because an elected President would give the EU Commission democratic legitimacy, and therefore suck power away from individual governments. It's the same story again and again -- national governments deliberately deny the EU proper democratic accountability precisely in order that they can then denounce EU policies they disagree with as being undemocratic and so retain their own grip on power.
Re:Heaven forefend! (Score:2)
Re:Heaven forefend! (Score:5, Informative)
Correct.
Unfortunately, that's rather misleading. The European Commission are essentially appointed (though by elected governments, one hopes) whereas the European Parliament consists of directly elected MEPs. Unfortunately, we have here a rather bizarre system where the EC probably holds more real power than the EP. There are other players involved here as well, but when it comes down to it, hearing a commissioner state that some of the EP's amendments are "not acceptable to the Commission" is a fairly chilling warning that they're going to over-rule them.
Of course, given the frequently misunderstandings about what is and is not being proposed here, and the fact that idiots trying to be clever appear to be alienating the very elected representatives who needed to be convinced, this could all be for the best anyway.
Re:Of course (Score:2)
Re:Of course (Score:2)
However, in this case, after numerous readings and intermediate votes including some in the European Parliament, it's basically going to come down to the European Council of Ministers, IIRC. That's how the codecision process works, and means that if the Ministers prefer the Commission's view to Parliament's, then that's how it's going to go.
Re:Heaven forefend! (Score:2)
Oh yes, it is. Even more than the parliament (like the other poster indicates).
Furthermore, there's the European Counsel (of ministers). Can be heads of state (France), but usually prime ministers or, in specialised cases, ministers of e.g. agriculture. This counsel has large powers, perhaps even more than the European Commission. Furhtermore, it is difficult to control. Those
Interesting. (Score:5, Interesting)
Interesting. So now when citizens try to express their views on upcoming legislation to elected officials, it's "harassment". Only industry reps should be allowed this privilege?
Re:Interesting. (Score:2, Insightful)
Describing your opinion to an aide in the lobby after waiting for hours to talk to someone = Harassment
Re:Interesting. (Score:5, Informative)
Re:Interesting. (Score:4, Insightful)
In such situations, the correct thing to do is really to deal the legislation, so that the citizens can sort themselves into groups based on their views and make coherent presentations of their concerns.
Re:Interesting. (Score:2)
I'm sorry, you completely lost me here. I'd love to know the correct thing to do, but the answer doesn't seem to make sense to me. Could you explain further, what you mean?
Re:Interesting. (Score:2)
Re:Interesting. (Score:2, Interesting)
Joachim WUERMELING (D), [...] He regretted the sometimes personal and irrational lobbying that had taken place. [...]
Just for the record: I am an EU citizen, I wrote an Email to Mr. Wuermeling, and he took the time to reply personally, explaining his position and adressing my concerns.
So him feeling "harrassed" doesn't seem to hit the nail here.
Also, after being against this EU derective for long time, I had to change my viewpoint somewhat.
This directive
Re:Interesting. (Score:5, Insightful)
Just today on Fox News Oreilly had a big thing comparing America's teen pregnancy and STD rated to Europes, and then comparing America's Abstinence as the only option approach versus Europes Libertine sex-ed approach. We have four times the pregnancy rate as France and 12 times the ghonnorhea rate as Denmark. F-in Amsterdam where prostitution is legal, and there are more STD cases per 100000 here. WTF? Something isn't working.
Same holds true for binge drinking rates at college and underage drinking rates in the US versus alchohol use and abuse in europe. Suprisingly, toleration of alchohol creates a healthier mentality versus abolition (for those under 21). Exact same issue as sex.
The same holds true for Marijuana use/abuse. Not to mention the waste of money the war on Marijuana is.
Software Patents aren't an idealogy problem like these. They are instead a business vs. consumer problem. Yet, the business vs. consumer stance of europe makes so much more sense than America's sell-out policies.
I'm so disappointed in this puritanical corporate-sell out country. ( I know, if you don't like it, leave). Well maybe I will. I'll live where I'm free to code without fear of the DMCA and where I'm free to read without the government looking up my library records and where my children will get education and we'll all get health care and where my neighbor can smoke a J and it's no big deal because it really isn't a big deal and all that drug war money is instead spent to make life better. Imagine a land where you're free to tinker, and where we're brave enough to allow personal choices. Hmm, how ironic, home of the free and the brave. That should be HERE. That should describe America.
oh well. maybe someday.
Re:Interesting. (Score:4, Insightful)
Actually old bean, at least from where I stand, it is indeed a matter of ideology - the ideology of free speech, freedom to engage in the arts and sciences, freedom to communicate ideas and culture, freedom of thought.
It has been a long time since the failure of your great compatriot, Phil Salin and others to prevent the tragedy of ideas patenting in the U.S. and we Europeans have had the opportunity to prepare for this inevitable onslaught on our fundamental human rights. Yet it looks likely that the forces arrayed against us will prevail anyway.
I call them 'ideas patents' because that is what they really are - I am not primarily a software developer or a businessman but a mathematician and I see software patents from a rather different perspective than has been customary in the 'debates' in the E.U. Parliament. Ever since I first came across the abominations that are the RSA patent and the DHT transform patent and others like them I have become more and more disgusted and horrified at the level of intellect displayed by those charged with the responsibility of formulating and enacting laws on my behalf.
Every debate has centred on the economic consequences of patenting with no attention whatsoever paid to the rights of which I speak. Of course you'd think I needn't worry when a quarter of a million people (mostly programmers) signed a petition against software patents and an organization representing half a million European S.M.Es stated their opposition to them too. So it must be obvious to the MEPs that there isn't even an economic case to be made for patenting software - right?
Wrong! Unfortunately we have to contend with a level of disingenuity, stupidity or underhand venality - I don't know which - capable of making statements like this:
"With regards to calls for abolishing, within the EU, all patents on computer-implemented inventions, EU companies would be at a severe disadvantage in the global market place if they were not able to apply for a patent over their invention."
(From Arlene McCarthy's website). Even a child would laugh at such a cretinous non sequitur - not so your average MEP.
Re:Interesting. (Score:3, Funny)
You just described Canada... except you m
Re:Interesting. (Score:4, Funny)
Also, I'd like to throw in the obligitory comments about being able to walk down the streat and not get shot, and being able to visit other countries with your flag sewn on your backpack and not get shot...and...just generally not get shot.
Re:Interesting. (Score:2)
NO! -- if you don't like it, fix it!
What kind of patriot turns tail and runs? I can't stand it when flag-hugging idiots spout that shitty "love it or leave it" copout.
--
will of the people (Score:3, Insightful)
What kind of patriot turns tail and runs? I can't stand it when flag-hugging idiots spout that shitty "love it or leave it" copout.
From the evidence I've seen, a country where the decisions are made by "benevolent" multinationals is exactly the kind of place where Americans want to live. Some of the evidence of this comes from our own community.
Why don't we have a PAC capable of going head to head with "the big boys"? Because all of our high-tech millionaires, includ
Re:Interesting. (Score:2)
Yes, drug prohibition is a complete waste of the taxpayer's money, but more importantly, drug prohibition creates violent crime. Just as alcohol prohibition gave rise to organized crime, drug prohibition gave us the bloods and the crips, and drive-by shootings. Of course the government would never admit this; instead they will claim that the people are the problem, not the law. But, it's hard to argue with the fact that nobody is out in the street
Re:Interesting. (Score:2)
If it were 2000, I'd possibly agree with you. The
Re:Interesting. (Score:5, Informative)
Obviously, the writer has an agenda, which is clear based on the link for the software patents. By knowingly mis-representing and mis-stating the complaint of the MEP, he only serves to call into question his own ethics. Ya, the story submitter seems like just the type who might actually bully an MEP, because he knows he's right. Slashdot lives down to its reputation once again.
And yeah, software patents seems like a bad idea (at least as implemented in the USA). That doesn't excuse the deliberate misrepresentation of facts (or, obviously, actual harrasment) by its opponents.
The harassment continues... (Score:2)
Nice going guys, you slashdotted the EU!
Read the text! (Score:4, Interesting)
Most of the speakers emphasised that this was not about legalising software patents, and the impression from the linked article is that over half of the speakers understood what the debate was about and were against software patents.
Surely this is a good sign from the European Parliament?
you gotta love the European Parliament... (Score:5, Funny)
10. Gain EU Citizenship through the liberal citizenry laws in the Republic of Ireland.
20. Move to an EU country, err, excuse me, "Member State."
30. Run for the EU Parliament. Have 2 people vote for me and I win my seat!
40. PROFIT!!!
Re:you gotta love the European Parliament... (Score:3, Informative)
wtf?
most votes would be deemed illeagal under such a low turnout.
and yeah i do live in eu, and yeah the partys(that i vote regularly) representive isn't in favor of software patents.
it certainly isn't "easy" to get elected as there are no shortage of candidates(if not for any other reason then because they get nice pay).
Re:you gotta love the European Parliament... (Score:3, Informative)
wtf?
most votes would be deemed illeagal under such a low turnout.
and yeah i do live in eu, and yeah the partys(that i vote regularly) representive isn't in favor of software patents."
Which EU *Member State* do you live in? If I am to believe what the Financial Times reports, the turnout for EU Parliament elections in the U.K. are frequently at or below the 10% threshhold. I would also imagine that in other EU Member States that have a low regard for the Eurocracy also poll quite low as
Re:you gotta love the European Parliament... (Score:2)
the turnouts for european parliament voting last time was around 35-40% iirc(under 10% would be considered total fiasco on the marketing side of the poll and i'd imagine heads to roll just because of that), can't be very sure though. the eu parliament votings are a bit hard for to motivate people(because it's not on the news all the time like the local parliament and it's politicians are, and since uk has had the crazy system w
Re:you gotta love the European Parliament... (Score:2)
How can you claim the British system is crazy when its governing structure has lasted a good 800 years? Compare that with France which since 1789 has had 5 1/2 Republics, 2 Monarchist Regimes, and 2 Dictatorship/Empires? Just because someone was born a noble does not make them crazy or less fitting to sit in the House of Lords. Were there crazy Lords? There were some. But
Re:you gotta love the European Parliament... (Score:5, Informative)
Why dont you just inform yoursel before just writing some wild guesses and thus givin a wrong impression? A simple Google search ("europarl European Elections") gives you as 4th link the UK office of the european parlament with information on the election turnout (http://www.europarl.org.uk/guide/textonly/Gelect
To quote some numbers:
UK turnout has been between 24% and 36% in the last 5 elections, which is not at or below the 10% threshhold.
Sweden had a turnout of 41.6% and 38.3% in the 2 elections it took part.
Denmark had between 46.1% and 52.9%.
Belgium had aturnout alway >=90%.
EU average had been between 49.4% and 63%.
Unfortunately there is a negative trend, so in 20 years your statement might become true (which is especially sad because the EU parlament becomes more and more important...)
if France and Germany are not forced to meet their treaty obligations...
As a German I can say that at least the fact that Germany is breaking the stability pact for the second year in a row is not due to unwillingness, but due to inaptitude
Re:you gotta love the European Parliament... (Score:2, Informative)
That's because in Belgium voting isn't a right but a duty. If you don't turn up during elections you can get fined (although judges have been very easy going on people who don't turn up to vote during the last couple of elections).
The idea is to protect the weaker groups in society as they usually are the first to forsake their voting rights. By forcing them to vote, you make sure that politicians will take them into account in their programs instead of just listening
Re:you gotta love the European Parliament... (Score:2)
I envy your country (Member State) then... Australia does that as well (or is it New Zealand?). Unfortunately here in the U.S., we do not require people to vote (although you have to sometimes question the intelligence of some voters, especially ones in Florida who voted for
Re:you gotta love the European Parliament... (Score:2)
EU average had been between 49.4% and 63%
Well, using Britain as my example for the 10% score and the Member State I'd want to run in, the 10% score is closer to the proported voter participation statistic of 24% in comparison with the EU average which you quote as being between 49.4% and 63%. An American holding dual citizenship with Britain would probably favor a better chance of being elected tha
Re:you gotta love the European Parliament... (Score:2)
Ahillen, I'm not clai
Re:you gotta love the European Parliament... (Score:2)
No prob there, my virtual friend. I cannot quote which day the story ran back in 2000, but it seemed like the article was implying that British participation in EU Parliamentry elections were incredibly low and that is why members of the Conservative Party (I believe their European counterpart is the "Europe
Re:you gotta love the European Parliament... (Score:2)
Re:you gotta love the European Parliament... (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:you gotta love the European Parliament... (Score:2)
Wait, are you suggesting someone who *programs* using Visual Basic is not an actual programmer? Next thing you'll be suggesting is an MCSE is not really an engineer...err, wait a minute...
works out better here in the US... (Score:3, Funny)
20. Move to California and become body-building movie star
30. Run for governor without even bothering to wait until the last one's term is up
40. PROPHET!!!
Re:works out better here in the US... (Score:2)
40. PROPHET!!!
Hey, I like Arnold too and will vote for him, but that does not mean I think he's a Prophet! That title belongs to people like Ezekiel, Isaiah (sic), John the Baptist, Jesus, Mohammed, and Nostradamus... I think you meant "profit." But that's not much profit. The elected position of Governor of the 5th (soon to be 4th) Largest Economy in the World is not much more than a Member of the European Parliament...
Re:you gotta love the European Parliament... (Score:2)
20. Move to an EU country, err, excuse me, "Member State."
Wow! I'm only two steps away from profit!
Re:you gotta love the European Parliament... (Score:2)
I think there are quite a few people who would disagree with you on that one.*
Certainly I will. The Republic of Ireland is very "liberal" (IMHO) in terms of granting citizenship to descendents of people who were born in Ireland, whether it be from the North (the Ulster province, aka "Northern Ireland" which is part of the U.K.) or what is today the Republic (Erie, Southern Ireland, the C
Open letter from SuSE (Score:5, Informative)
SuSE wrote an open letter [www.suse.de] [german] today. Translation is here [google.com].
They are of course against software patents...
Re:Open letter from SuSE (Score:2, Funny)
Anybody got a translation that's in English?
Re:Open letter from SuSE (Score:2)
Re:Open letter from SuSE (Score:2)
Boo hoo hoo (Score:4, Interesting)
Apparently they're not used to actually representing their constituents, as opposed to just their industry lobbyists.
Re:Boo hoo hoo (Score:5, Informative)
It was the European People's Party (aka, "Christian Democrats") that had some WAY over-zealous advocates harassing MPEs. Yes, that's an accurate word, "harassing." I believe it's accurate because of you read the article (and the poster clearly didn't), the EPP rep. APOLOGIZED for the extreme behavior of its zealots.
He apologized because they were out of control. Showing up at an MPEs residence and hurling insults at them on their front door step in the name of OSS (or whatever) isn't "lobbying." It's harassment. Plain and simple.
And they were bullied. Hurling invectives in the name of OSS is still rude and over the top. Contrary to what
Re:Boo hoo hoo (Score:2)
Re:It does in English (Score:2)
Try looking up the word "Thesaurus" in a dictionary.
Malcolm Harbour MEP (Score:5, Informative)
Needless to say, this guy has a page to himself [ffii.org] on the FFII site.
My impression from this (admittedly brief) note is that even the most aged and out-of-touch members of the (British) House of Lords would have managed a more coherent debate on this. Still, it's not gone all the megacorps' way.
Just look at the U.S. (Score:5, Funny)
EU == US? (Score:4, Interesting)
Heavens to Murgatroid! The Humanity! I'd expect this sort of contempt from a US Representative but not from such a democratic body as the EU Parliament.
At least one MEP seems to understand (Score:5, Interesting)
"Neil MacCORMICK (Greens/EFA, Scotland) warned against possible "leakage" from genuine protection of computer implemented inventions to companies being able to patent computer software. He stated that the present system, where genuine inventions are patentable and software is protected by copyright worked well. The responsibility, he underlined, lay with the Commission to find a balance between over and under protection for inventions."
This is exactly the problem with the directive to begin with. What exactly is the point of "legalizing software patents" if software itself cannot be patented?
I am not asking for software to be patentable, far from it, but I fail to see the need for this entire exercise if the end result will be patent rules that are substantially similar to the current rules with more complicated language.
It is good to see that at least one MEP understands that no matter how persuasive the language, patent applicants will attempt to find ways to patent the supposedly unpatentable. "Systems" and "processes" in a patent will cover such obvious ideas as one click purchasing and on-line auctions. If anything, this entire directive has done nothing but muddy the waters about what is and what is not patentable, something patent inspectors and the public do not want or need.
Re:At least one MEP seems to understand (Score:2)
To let greedy people find a legal way to lie and cheat their way into money without producing anything that people would actually pay for.
Bullied and harrased (Score:2)
I would really like to find out what exactly those actions were. Although, if they were serious I'm quite sure that she would get the law involved.
Re:Bullied and harrased (Score:4, Insightful)
However, I think whatever happened, as long as it was legal and didn't involve threats, that's something that an MEP should put up with without whining about it or calling it "harassment". If McCarthy had received such a response at something, oh, on some directive on child pornography or retirement benefits, I suspect she would not have considered it harassment but mainstream, widespread outrage. If you look at McCarthy's web site, you'll see that this issue isn't featured there prominently (in fact, I didn't see any reference to it at all on the web site).
MEPs need to come to understand that this is something that geeks and technologists are genuinely outraged over. It is something that matters to a lot of people, and it is something they need to take very seriously.
Of course, people trying to contact them should also realize that MEPs still just don't quite get it and perhaps adjust their behavior accordingly.
statement on McCarthy's site (Score:2)
For one thing it's not a non issue to them (Score:4, Insightful)
If all that matters is the mere glorious victory, well, then find a cave and have your victory there. It's not going to happen. A small win is a win even if it only means less of a loss.
So perhaps we can finally be a little positive about this. OSS has a lobby. It is being heard. More importantly it's being listened to and more people seem to be understanding what's at stake. That's quite something.
Re:For one thing it's not a non issue to them (Score:2)
Re:For one thing it's not a non issue to them (Score:2)
If you're a smoker (I am) I'm pretty sure it will be "something" at such a point.
Which was my point. I wasn't cheering.
kurious? (Score:2)
kurious
sounds like a debatable KDE app
(sorry)
Re:kurious? (Score:2)
Re:For one thing it's not a non issue to them (Score:2)
Re:For one thing it's not a non issue to them (Score:4, Interesting)
But you never win in big leaps. At least normal people don't. And they're at their best when being pushed around. Frankly, that's where my hope is. Not at short term all-or-nothing thinking.
I'm talking about that there are turning points (which are always small otherwise it would be shove rather than turn) and that they shouldn't be overlooked nor deemed insignificant. Especially when the alternative is what?
I am *very* well aware of what's at stake but are you pulling out a gun yet? Neither am I so we're gonna have to make do with what we *can* do. And certainly the OSS voice is being considered a force to reckon with by now.
Sure many still don't have a clue. And diversity within the OSS community all to often leads to unneeded flamefests. No one's perfect. And expectations should be accordingly. A people thing will have a people signature. Nothing wrong with that.
For one thing, the OSS community should preach Humanity. That includes not being able to turn around a massive and increasingly repressive force easily. That includes a community developer fucking off because he's having a hard time privately, it includes people making human errors. It's not "get victory fast" by nature and that should be accepted both personally and more generally IMHO.
Re:For one thing it's not a non issue to them (Score:2)
Just as you no longer hear much about getting rid of the DMCA anymore, now you hear about amending or adjusting it. If laws like these are ever to go away completely as they should, it won't be until they are as irrelevant as the new developments with the commad
In other, related news... (Score:2, Interesting)
I just got an e-mail from an entity that was responsible for part of the presentation taliking of a last minute change: instead of presentation there will be a debate, and the people invited to debate are, instead of free software advocates were experimented proprietary software advocates.
Balance of power - State vs People ( go EU ! ) (Score:4, Insightful)
I never realized that so many sites could be / would be affected and will join the protest against this.
I would not have been aware of this unless there is this thing called INTERENET and EU people contributed a major portion of GPL Software.
If this works out, then, it will show that the "Europe" is still probably the place where people have the voice and can make a difference.
Balance of power between state and people is getting one sided in US--unfortunately. Before the IRAQ war more than 40% of the people in US actually thought that there is a connection between IRAQ/WMD/Terrorist etc. etc. Govt. is too strong compared to the people at this point to pull this and still stay in power.
(I supported the war anyway--this type of dictators need beating--well so is Pakistan/North Korea but that's another story).
So, congratulations EU people--you did well.
P.S.
Probably does not make much sense here, but, If you just happen to visit a bookstore, pick up the last issue of Foreign Policy ... read and get depressed.
Re:Balance of power - State vs People ( go EU ! ) (Score:2)
To all native speakers: (Score:3, Insightful)
Is it just me or is the "innovation/patentability" part not making sense at all? Is this something like "war is predicted through declarability" or more like "rain is predicted through cheese"??
watched it live (Score:5, Interesting)
I watched the discussion on software patents this morning. I have to say that without knowing the real backgrounds you could really fall for the arguments of the proponents. No, they do not want laws like the US, they want to restrict software patents. I don't know how they can keep straight faces saying that. Luckily, some other speakers did not fail to mention that software patents are actually against the law and the new proposal would legalize those patents. Restrictions to the new law (like those discussed on Slashdot yesterday) are not needed. Simply do not pass the new law and enforce the existing ones.
The so-called harrassments by citizens also were described quite differently depending on the side the speaker was on. The speakers for patents pretended to be offended by such wild actions.
The speakers against rather described them as reasonable concerns by middle sized businesses who fear for their survival.
"Linus aeh Linux" was also mentioned. But one speaker talked about "Unix, which is free"?! Hmmm, let's not let Darl hear about this.
one speaker talked about "Unix, which is free" (Score:2)
Bye SCO
Bye HP
Bye Sun
Bye IB
Well seriously, the more people thinking "UNIX is free" while perhaps pointing at Tux -- who cares -- each and every one of them would be just excellent. It will plant the idea that *NIX belongs to "the" community. That's good. We need mind share. At any level.
Re:watched it live (Score:2)
Funny thing is, every year there's another big story about Europe wondering how to stop the "Brain-Drain" (Scientists going to the USA) and yet they continue on with things like this.
Publicise this BS (Score:5, Insightful)
When election time pass this around to the candite of your choice running against the reps that said this. I'm sure the opposition would be happy to have those quotes.
Concerned Citizens (Score:2)
Could it be Entropic ? (Score:4, Informative)
Now here's the beef : Microsoft acquired Entropic in 1999 [microsoft.com].
So unless the SME mentionned by McCarthy was another one (which I doubt), she's probably been telling us another whopper of a lie.
Re:Could it be Entropic ? (Score:2)
So I guess the SME was a different one.
So no beef. Completely cow-less and without bovine.
troc
Too many laymen with too much vote (Score:2)
Just stumbled across an article in an on-line paper [nu.nl] (sorry, Dutch only) that puts forward two really ridiculous arguments:
WAKE UP! A patent cannot keep you from using a word. This sounds more like a trademark isssue and trademark protection has been there for already a long time.
Furthermore, there
Re:Too many laymen with too much vote (Score:2)
Don't worry, they're probably equally bad in fields you don't know about
an article in an on-line paper (sorry, Dutch only) that puts forward two really ridiculous arguments
First of all the meat of it is anti-swpat arguments filtered through an MEP and a non-tech journalist. (My impression) What did you expect?
Then there is the Stallmann quote. I think you're too quick at condemning it. "Combinations of tones" can mean simple chord
Re:Too many laymen with too much vote (Score:2)
No you can't. You can protect a sequence of tones but not a combination. I think Stallman is asking the question "How many tunes would be written if chords could be copyrighted?" The answer, of course, is "very few".
TWW
Re:Too many laymen with too much vote (Score:2)
Exactly (well, not, I do, be it not in this particular case).
So when Stallman tries to explain to the horrible things software patents would do in his opinion, he refers to an example where copyright protection is already applicable for a long time, without those horrible effects he describes (no more music being written), he totally misses the point.
Or he succeeded to prove the opposite of what he tries to prove: he proves (inductively) that software patents will at al
Mod down (Score:5, Informative)
Mod Up Parent Up - Not Quite 100% Off Topic! (Score:2)
Nice of the USPTO to issue another arguably bad Amazon patent on the eve of the EU vote.
Re:Canada and software patents (Score:3, Informative)
Now... that having been said I have approached my legal counsel on this issue - directly - and I have not at this point received a direct answer.
It is possible that the reason is because a court may have to make a ruling on this issue.
Re:Ok... here's a solution. (Score:2)
Software patents are a direct attack on programmers.
The VAST majority of programmers do not want to be involved with the patent system in any way. Those that do are simply naive or stoopid or both.
Unfortunately sometimes wars are necessary when one group tries to steal the property of others. This is what the patent system does.
music, drawings, and text cannot be patented (Score:2)
Works that come out of a lathe, or microprocessor, or some universal Turing machine, like music, drawings, and works of text, can be no more patentable than the configuration of the lathe or Turing machine tape. They might be copyrightable, but patentable? They're expressions of ideas, not inventions, so they don't qualify, not even under the twisted US patent regime.
Re:Mirror anyone? (Score:2, Informative)