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The Internet Your Rights Online

etoy.com Returns 86

Posted by Nik from the NP:-gimme-shelter dept.
The lawyers have been on the phone, and etoy.com is finally back up, after over two months of outage. Hopefully this marks the an end to all the legal wranglings with eToys. See the most recent story for the details on what's happened over the last few weeks.
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etoy.com Returns More

etoy.com Returns

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  • Re:this is dumb (Score:3)

    by perky ( 106880 ) on Friday February 18, 2000 @05:47PM (#1260771)
    do you really think that had anything to do with the court case and not the problems they haev had with order fulfillment (here on FT.com [ft.com]).

    clearly in this sector delivery times are critical, and matter to their customer base much more than a bit of corporate bulldozing. Remember, your average net consumer doesn't care about (until recently) obscure European conceptual artists. They care about getting little Jonny's toy on time, and eToys were below industry standard here.

    I think that the result is fantastic, and was registered on toywar a while back, but I, and the average slashdotter, are not the same as the standard net user. The stock fall had very little to do with the domain dispute.

  • True, true, true.

    Seek help first. I have in the past been in such a state of mind. I never thought the possibility existed that I might come into a different state of mind where things would be even a little bit more tolerable. I did not believe those who said you will someday be able to tolerate living.

    I am here now, though. It is many years later and it took a long time, but my life has become tolerable. I enjoy living. I'm not sure about whether those who told me to keep up hope were right or not, I just know that I am here now and living life is not that bad. Before I thought I could not go on and that things could not change. Instead I am here okay now today. Keep yourself alive, out of all the things you do. That is the first and most important step. If you feel unsafe, let somebody around you know. Allow others to help you if you will not be able to help yourself.

  • As I understand it, they won against the perliminary injunction (every corporation's favorite legal device), but the RIAA continued the lawsuit untill Diamond ran out of cash, at which point Diamond gave in. It may be that my facts are wrong regarding this case, but there are plenty of other, similar events which illustrate the same point.

    My Rio is one of the first ones made, and has no copy protection. It will probably be worth something by the time my friend gives it back. :)
    ------
    -Everything has a cause
    -Nothing can cause itself
    -You cannot have an infinite string of causes

  • DDoS. (Score:1)

    by Nafta ( 42011 )
    Way to go! They finally get their site back up and slashdot posts a link to it, thereby ensuring it becomes flooded!

  • You should be aware that toywar managed to get several people to QUIT etoys ?

    I am pretty certain that it was toywar that did most of the stock-crashing. They drove the stocks down with false orders, threatening emails, flaming emails, and so forth. The entire company got the "wrath of the internet" poured down their shirts. They didn't have a chance. :)


    --
    "Rune Kristian Viken" - arcade@kvine-nospam.sdal.com - arcade@efnet
  • Hmmm. Let's mull this over.

    First we have this wonderful timeline [rtmark.com] of events and eToys' stock price. But perhaps that's all propaganda...

    Who is eToys target customer?
    That would be net-savvy or at least net-capable people. The kind of people that would be bound to come across the massive amount of unfavorable eToys press [dmoz.org]. The kind of people who would have to be blind to miss half the protest sites if they did a search on eToys [yahoo.com].

    Who is eToys target investor?
    People who are subject to all of the above but also get to read all the bad investor news [yahoo.com].

    To top it all off, you have people who realize that if Etoys is looking at controlling the etoy.com content we should wonder what kind of content [virtualsurreality.com] they have. Now the FCC does too [yahoo.com]. Hmmm, I wonder who sent the information on over 350 mismarketed products?

    No. Toywar had nothing to do with the fall of eToys, and Slashdot is a powerless entity as well. The only people who want you to believe that is companies who don't want to face their own toywar.

    -----

  • Ah, but at what cost (Score:3)

    by Gleef ( 86 ) on Saturday February 19, 2000 @05:24AM (#1260780) Homepage
    The fundamental goal of E-Toys, like any corporation, is to make money for its shareholders. Have you seen what this action did to its stock price [etrade.com]? See that peak at the left, that's when they filed suit. By Xmas, they were less than half that value, during a very busy and very profitable shopping season. By now, their share price is below their initial IPO value of $19.

    There was no legal precident set, but hopefully we have set the meme in corporate minds that if you take frivolous action against people on the internet, you risk a Public Relations and Financial disaster. If the cause is just, we don't need the courts anymore.

    Legal backing would have been nice, but the US Courts have an iffy record of upholding peoples rights in the face of high paid corporate lawyers, so unless the courts change I wouldn't count on their help.

    ----
  • Exactly... which is why etoy should get a trademark on etoy.com and then sue etoys.com for their name. They'd have more a chance to win then etoys did. and that would be real funny, at least the temporary injunction.

    The battles over, but the war isn't.
  • If you want to stop boycotting, and get straight to the point here is the ceo's email addy.

    Toby Lenk
    President and CEO, Etoys
    toby@etoys.com

    Phone 310-664-8100 (i doubt this is direct line, but not sure)

    ummm.... be responsible.
  • Thought is only a flash between two long nights, but this flash is everything.
    Henri Poincaré

    I really hope this is not serious, but if it is then I strongly urge you not to do it. As Poincaré says, the moments are everything, and the nights fade into nothingness in those fleeting moments of clarity or emotion. Don't rely on the doctors, rely on yourself and let the docs help if you need them to. There are always options, and the best one is usually to just go and attack the problems head on.

    good luck

  • furthermore, the name was produced by a random word generator. Or so I read somewhere, possibly their site.

  • Does anyone know if NSI can delete, remove domains if you register them with other registars? It seems like they still own the main boxes, can the still arbitraraly delete domains if someone else sets them up?

    [ c h a d o k e r e ] [dhs.org]
  • If you were to consider trolling an art, then that should be moderated down. It sucked. If it's art, that's bad art. It would be like the drawing of a 2 year old. It was a lame and pathetic rehash of the clichéd. RWM (right wing maniac).

    If you want art, just look in trolltalk (although I'm not sure if it's still being updated) for the posts by 80md, 70% or ell7. Or the funny stuff by OSM or that 'g'whatever guy.

    This was just sad. No one was fooled by that, no one

    [ c h a d o k e r e ] [dhs.org]
  • I saw it also. I think they did it on purpose. If they claim the parody aspect. they more than likely will get away with it. Too bad they;re being so flamboyant, betcha it'll come back to haunt them.
  • I would like to know if this site that everyone and their mother dhas been fighting, screaming, and crusading about is interesting or not?
    I hdard it was some kind of fring art groupf however I would like to hear the straight dope (no flames or troll moderation thankyou)
  • And what better way to break it in then with the good ol' fashioned Slashdot effect =)

    Let's hope that this is REALLY all over now.
  • Has anyone figured out why NSI was being so childish about not giving back the domain even after the lawsuit was dropped? And why they took it in the first place even when they didn't have to? One would think with all the bad press they've already received that they would try as hard as possible to get back in the public's good graces... Guess not.

    (IIRC, the court order simply said that etoy couldn't use it, not that they couldn't own it.)

    _________________

  • It's legal crap like this that almost makes me sick - people contorting the truth for their own benefit and screwing with others' lives. Can't we all just get along? Well, most of us, with the small exception of murderers, rapists, serial killers . . . Well, I'm sure the LAWYER is not the epitome of the american citizen the founding fathers had in mind . . .
  • doesn't look like it will be for long....
  • I'm guessing that the NSI didn't give it back to them after the lawsuit was dropped was due to the fact that NSI is seriously screwed up internally. I spoke with one of their employees at LWCE and he seemed pretty cool but he said that the tech support people there were morons. He also told ne that he registered his domains with register.com so go figure.
  • I wondered the same myself. When the article was first posted on /. that etoy had "won," I pointed Netscape over to their site to see how things were going. I half expected some sort of party going on. I was disappointed, however, when I found out that their site was down... what's the deal with this? Can etoy sue for something like this? I'm not advocating going off and suing everyone that is bad/gets in your way, but heck, I figure that if they're going to make a point, they need to make it.

    Just my $0.0000002 worth.
  • What's the big deal with etoy being back up? eToys wanted to squash them long enough to get through the Christmas season, and they succeeded. Now that (A) everyone knows the difference between etoy and eToys, and (B) Christmas is over, eToys doesn't care, and *let* etoy have their domain back (though lawyers and supporters may claim the credit for the "victory").

    Megacorp always wins.

    *sigh*

    ICQ: 49636524
    snowphoton@mindspring.com

  • But the way they're celebrating on the site is just a bit over-pretentious, don't you think? There's no need for the military theme, and absurdly-loud looping "Yankee Doodle" in the background, and the bit about keeping the site up for a while damn week.

    Come on, etoy; you're supposed to be the good guys; no need to gloat. I know it feels good, especially after this long of a battle, but honestly, this is just tasteless.
  • read the fine print, if it was submitted by someone before me it would say "bag 'o donuts writes...."
  • Now, thanks to the /. effect, they're having a relapse:

    "There was no response. The server could be down or is not responding."
    -Netscape
  • Agreed, totally. Etoy.com does own its own name. Etoys.com would have stolen it given the chance, but thankfully the courts ruled for justice (a nice change).

    Umm, no they didn't. Etoys dropped the suit in the face of public pressure, the courts did nothing but grant the injunction AGAINST etoy.

    No ruling for justice here. The US courts maintain their current status of "money talks".

  • Read a great article in Telepolis http://www.heise.de/tp/english/inhalt/te/5843/1.ht ml

  • E-Toys managed to shutdown etoy.com through the holiday season. My guess is that that is all they wanted. They probably knew that they had no chance before they filed the lawsuit. But they knew that they could create a temporary disturbance.

    Of course, they aren't the first ones to do this. The RIAA has been doing this sort of thing for years. They had no legal grounds on which to sue Diamond, yet Diamond was eventually forced to incorporate the RIAA's copy-protection features into the Rio because they did not have the money to continue the lawsuit. The MPAA is also fond of this sort of strategy.

    We need to stop this bullshit. It seems that corporations have been gaining way too much power lately. If we don't do something, I fear that this will continue until we are living in a virtual dictatorship, with the real government completely under the control of the big corporations. Call me paranoid, but it seems to be the trend everywhere outside the Open Source community.


    ------
    -Everything has a cause
    -Nothing can cause itself
    -You cannot have an infinite string of causes

  • considering that their stock dropped from $65 to less than $20, I wouldn't say they won...


    If you can't figure out how to mail me, don't.
  • I agree, I clicked the link to see the site and get a feel for what they really did prior to all the legal noise, but the site was just a "We Beat City Hall" flag. Granted they did, to an extend, but I left rather than dig down into the site because of the rah rah stuff..
  • Isn't this just great? A gang of European homosexuals and drug abusers steals (yes, steals) the "good name" of an honest company, and the tort monster chews them up and spits them out. "Sorry guys! You don't own your own name any more!"

    Um, have you even read any of the stories on the topic? etoy owned the name years before etoys even existed

    ========
    +++For-pay Internet distributed processing. [processtree.com]+++

  • Has anyone figured out why NSI was being so childish about not giving back the domain even after the lawsuit was dropped? And why they took it in the first place even when they didn't have to? One would think with all the bad press they've already received that they would try as hard as possible to get back in the public's good graces... Guess not.

    (IIRC, the court order simply said that etoy couldn't use it, not that they couldn't own it.)


    I have no idea why they kept it this long (that's a load of crap, once it was established that etoy was right and clear with etoys it should have been returned). I do undertstand why they froze it in the first place though. It is standing policy (among most places that are in charge of regulating things like this, not just NSI) that if there is a (serious)legal challenge, they freeze the challenged site until it is resolved. Basically, once the judge ruled in favor of restraining etoy (even temporarily) it was enough of a legal threat for the NSI to freeze the site. IMHO, this is good policy. If there is a dispute that has enough merit to make it into the courts, then the dispute should be settled in the court. They are basically covering their own butt by suspending it (and with as screwed up as NSI is, they need to cover their ass when they can).

  • Boycott? (Score:3)

    by Anonymous Coward on Friday February 18, 2000 @05:27PM (#1260837)
    Is the boycott over? Can I buy my Pokemon stuff now?
  • Ok, didn't Diamond win the suit the RIAA brought against them? How did they get forced into adding copy protection crap into their product?

    Did I miss something of great importance here?
  • Not the posting. But the fact that now we can't tell if the person who is posting this is serious or just a troll.

    I assume it was a troll, but I do value the moments pause (shock) it gave me to read the post. Trolls are a form of performance art. Admitadly, most of them are crappy art, but a few like the above post are really good art (if they are intended as art). The fealing of shock I got by looking at that post was exactly the fealing I get by looking at a strange and interesting piece of art. Now, if someone dose it again it will jsut be lame, but I would like to thank the troll who posted that for posting it.

  • Who stole whose name? (Score:3)

    by Millennium ( 2451 ) on Friday February 18, 2000 @05:29PM (#1260841)
    Isn't this just great? A gang of European homosexuals and drug abusers steals (yes, steals) the "good name" of an honest company, and the tort monster chews them up and spits them out. "Sorry guys! You don't own your own name any more!"

    To put it bluntly, etoy.com didn't rip off the etoys.com name. Quite the contrary; etoy.com was up and running a full two years before etoys.com ever existed. Etoys.com is the real ripoff, not etoy.com.

    And by the way, where did you ever get the idea that the etoy.com crew was "a gang of European homosexuals and drug abusers"? They are European, but I've never seen anything indicating that they were, or weren't for that matter, either gay or drug users. I very much doubt you've got proof either. Or are you just being a prejudiced bastard? The latter seems quite likely.

    By the way, the only way I can see that you'd even get that idea is if you knew what it was they did. In which case, I find it very hard to believe that you wouldn't know that etoy.com had the name long before etoys.com did. Or are you one of those types that believe that those with money should be allowed to plunder those who do not, simply because they have the resources to do so?

    Before I go any further I should state that I am, in fact, a capitalist. So don't go accusing me of being a socialist of any kind.

    If you don't own your own name, what do you own? Not much. Just whatever pittance is left to you by the radical leftists who control the government.

    Agreed, totally. Etoy.com does own its own name. Etoys.com would have stolen it given the chance, but thankfully the courts ruled for justice (a nice change).

    Do they even care what a savage disincentive this is for business?

    What, the fact that you can't steal from someone else? How's that a disincentive for business (well, those businesses that don't involve stealing anyway)?

    "Freedom is slavery and ignorance is strength" quoth the famous Socialist George Orwell

    If you're going to quote, please quote in context. You completely ruin the effect otherwise.

    Yet another irrational outburst of mindless has swept Slashdot.

    Yep. And I feel bad for responding to it, but you've left me little in the way of a choice, since I can't mod this one down.

    By the way, I think the word you were looking for was "mindlessness." "Mindless" is an adjective; "mindlessness" is a noun. You can't have a "wave of mindless."

    Ho, hum. I doubt very much that any of you have any concept of property rights at all.

    You're right; you don't have any concept of property rights at all (and you're certainly a part of "any of you [Slashdotters]"). At least, not as applies to people. You appear to be the type who thinks that a business can take anything owned by an ordinary person with no compensation therefor, simply because as you seem to see it business is always right. Furthermore, you seem to be so ardent in your beliefs that you don't even bother to research the things you argue about, at least not thoroughly enough to make any real arguments. And I haven't even touched on your apparent bigotry yet. But that's for another post.
  • I have just visited etoy.com and there isn't much there. However, there is a link to toywar.com. That site contains lego models which flame etoys.com. I don't know what kind of content was on etoy.com before the court case, but if someone threatened my financial gain using my own ideas, I would be upset, too. As much as I support free speech and business competition, it can be looked at from both ways. You have a company trying to pursue the American dream, or you have a website trying to gain some publicity and flaming the competition. Oh well.
  • Before the lawsuit, who had heard of etoy? I know I hadn't. And was there any chance of such a poorly designed site being mentioned repeatedly in the news? Probably not. etoy.com recieved more publicity from this lawsuit than they could have ever hoped to recieve in any other way. And etoy.com was never even in competition with etoys.com, right? So what was really behind this lawsuit?
  • Sounded pretty damn good to me. Must be my superior sound card. *shrugs*

    WHY IS EVERYONE SO GOD DAMNED NEGATIVE?
  • Not only did they put them down during the critical Holiday season, but they also proved they could do it and not pay any retribution (although I believe they covered Etoy's legal fees - big deal !). All the other big $$$ companies now know they can at least go so far as to shut down a website for a while.

    We won a battle, but Big Brother Corpratism is winning the war.
  • The "parade" at the bottom of the screen has a guy in a green wheelchair which has "eToys" written on its wheel. Not the 's'. If they didn't infringe the trademark before, they do now ;-)
  • Come on, it's so obvious that was a troll. Try being a little more subtle, 80md (at least I think that was you). The "Klinton" part especially gave it away.
  • Add to that being tired and you make lots more errors than usual
  • If they were thinking ahead, they would have trolled for some banner sales to be on thier site when it came back up. When I went to the site earlier there were none. Too bad, they could have re-couped some of those legal expenses just from the /. hits alone.

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