Interview: Jon Johansen of deCSS Fame (UPDATED) 385
This week's interview guest, Jon Lech Johansen, has been all over the news (and all over Slashdot) lately. He's the guy behind the whole deCSS thing. Jon has been getting interviewed all over the place, but I'm sure you have questions for him that the "straight" media people would never ask. So go for it! One question per post, please. 10 - 15 chosen questions will be forwarded to Jon Tuesday, and his answers are scheduled to appear Friday.
Update: 01/31 14:52 by michael : Several people have pointed out that LinuxWorld ran an interview with Johansen today. So, rather than repeat the same questions that LinuxWorld asked, people should check out that interview and see what questions they still have about the situation...
What was taken? (Score:2)
[OT] Linus and teenaged girls (Score:3)
Poor Linus
BTW if someone can find a link to the exact quote, I'd appreciate it
Age and hacking and perspective.... (Score:3)
- What got you started down the road to geekdom and when?
- At 16 you've ignited a powder keg of controversy on issues ranging from property ownership, censorship, software platform independence and the need for greater separation of business and state. How does it feel to have such fame and how are you handling the pressures? Any tricks up your sleeve before you hit adulthood (18 y. o. here in the US)?
- How is your family handling this? Are they supportive? Not so? Be sure to sit them down and let them know, in very clear terms, that you have a huge community of the brightest minds supporting you and that regardless of consequneces, you have done a Good Thing (tm).
-
Bart G
Re:What're you going to do? (Score:3)
Re:Why Windows? (Score:4)
meant to be helping the Linux development, but
more to help making "backups" of DVDs on VideoCDs.
This may sound unfair, but it is the harsh truth. In fact this guy here even denied giving out the sourcecode of DeCSS for helping the Linux Community (yes, its true) - he gave it only to *one* person under a special license.
All the 'we just wanted to play DVDs unter linux' is nothing more than a well-working PR campaign to help protecting some people who just wanted to break copyright.
Although i don't think that Jon should be threatened as hard as he is now by the MPAA, he shouldn't on the other don't made a saint without questions like the one above.
Its true, DeCSS was windows and binary only. This couldn't help linux. Face the truth: There is only one reason for reading out DVDs under Windows: Recompressing it as MPEG1/VCD and burn it on a CD, and this is what 99.9% of all DeCSS-Users are doing.
Lessons learned (Score:5)
With that in mind, I'm curious about what lessons we all can learn from this. Specifically, assuming that someone were about to do something similar, what would be the best way to avoid being prosecuted?
The easy and obvious answer is to do so anonymously (which begs the question of the best anonymous means to do so). But I'm wondering about the situation where one didn't want to do so anonymously. Are there any viable defensive strategies here?
Finally, thanks for your efforts. We are all in debt to you.
Is there a legal defense fund? Can I contribute? (Score:5)
Exactly what were you charged with (Score:5)
Very important question regarding CSS (Score:5)
Gregory Maxwell made a very interesting comment on the LiViD mailing list last week:
> Just because wired said it happend one way, that doesn't indicate that it
> didn't occure some other way entirely.
>
> A few days (perhaps a week or so) after the Xing CSS and key codes were
> cracked, someone released a no-player-key-needed method of finding CSS
> title keys and thus deriving all the player keys without ever knowing one.
>
> If you believe such an ingenious feat of cryptoanalysis occured in such a
> short time, I believe I have a bridge to sell you.
>
> The 'xing' crack was irrelevent. Because of inherit weeknesses in CSS
> (beyond it's 40bit key, which are too technical to discuss here now) we
> needed zero player keys.
>
> The CSS code has been out there for well over a year. I think people were
> waiting for the right time to make it public (i.e. cryptoanalysis that
> defeated the need to have a master key at all; and the death of DIVX),
> some moron decided to jump the gun about two weeks too earlier, and
> released the Xing player key to make it work.
>
> Had they waited another week the cryptoanalysis would have been done and
> NO vendors player key would have been required.
>
> As it stands, the Xing key may have been artificially derrived (say from
> the IBM key) and it was coincidental (or worse) that the key turned out to
> be Xings.
>
> So to be clear: Xing's players weaknesses (was it actually weak, or are we
> taking MoREs word for it) is irrelevent. CSS code was out before that
> player existed. The CSS algo is fundmentally broken (no playerkey
> required key recovery in 2^16 operations in 2^26 bytes memory) well beyond
> it's short key legnth.
>
> It would have been possible for someone to use such an attack (or another,
> say IBM's player key) and generate that Xing key without ever analyzing
> Xing itself.
( see entire comment at: http://livid.on.openprojects.net/pipermail/livid-
Do you have any response to this? The crux of the lawsuit in California is that they claim it is illegal to reverse engineer a program if a dialog box tells you not to. They claim that Xing was reverse engineered because their player key was supposedly the first one found.
In the light of Gregory's e-mail, is this true? Was Xing involved at all? Or is that an unsubstantiated lie from the DVDCCA?
Were you a "moron" for releasing your program before the means to decode CSS without ANY player keys was discovered?
Motivations? (Score:2)
In other words, are they more worried about forbidding the illegal copies, or are they more worried about forbidding the technology itself from citizens?
Fill us in on a personal detail- (Score:2)
The Slashdot Defense Makes No Sense! (Score:3)
Man, if I was the other lawyer in that case, I'd read a few "Naked and Petrified" comments and destroy that "Anonymous Coward" guys testimony.
No, I know, they could just look at my user number, and make me an "expert witness"!
I guess my question for Jon would be "Do you think tactics like using posts from one user, out of context, from an online forum should be allowed as testimony to represent the views of the community at large?"
Geez, I like DNA testing much better compared to this crap. With DNA testing, I'm 99.9999% certain as to someone's identity. With Slashdot, I've got the other 0.0001% certain about their identity, that they mean what they say, that they have any idea what they're talking about... etc., etc.
---
pb Reply or e-mail; don't vaguely moderate [152.7.41.11].
Do you still want a DVD player? (Score:2)
XMovie it is (Score:2)
Actually a player worsens matters (Score:2)
Re:Wrong. (Score:2)
Is this legal? In the US, this would be classified as illegal exhibition of copyrighted works. Bars/restaurants in the US can't just go rent movies from the local Blockbuster and play them for their customers.
Do countries in Europe just not have similar laws?
Re:yup - illegal in UK (Score:2)
I'm sure that's how it's interpreted in the UK too, even if the law is technically phrased to prohibit what you suggest.
Re:Wrong. (Score:2)
Not trying to start an argument or anything, but this would still be illegal. Bars are commercial establishments, and even if they just provided the TV and player and "let" customers bring in their own movies, it's still illegal, except now the person bringing the movie can be prosecuted along with the bar.
Now I'm not saying a bar couldn't get away with doing something like this, but once the MPAA (or whoever) caught on, you can bet they'd take action.
A quick question (Score:5)
Do you feel that your case is being handled in a particularly unusual way and, if so, how so?
Re:DeCSS and MPAA (Not a question) (Score:5)
It's this type of weighted question that really irks me about Slashdot readers. It's analogous to Jim Gray's line of questioning towards Pete Rose at the annoucement of the Century Team (where he basically tried to pressure Rose into admitting he was guilty or apologizing for something Rose doesn't think he's guilty of).
The MPAA is making this out to be a piracy issue because to them it is a piracy issue. It doesn't matter to them that you or any other Slashdot reader doesn't think it's a piracy issue. To them it is a piracy issue, because whether or not the program was intended to do so, the fact remains that it does make piracy easier. There's no getting around that. Now it's up to the courts to decide whether it really is a piracy issue and whether or not the MPAA has a valid complaint. You can argue that all you want.
I'm sorry, I don't want to answer questions that are going to someone else, but honestly, this is completely weighted. You're asking a question that automatically prejudges an answer and also requires that the person take a side they may or may not agree with. Jon may have a different answer than me, but I'm still of the opinion that blatant "leading" such as this should be pointed out immediately, especially since they get pushed up so high by moderators who share many of the same biases.
And that's before we get to the fact that your asking Jon to shed light on motives that he has had no part in shaping.
Slashdot strikes again (Score:4)
There have been articles on Slashdot about the increasing use of Slashdot for mainstream articles, looks at the open source movement, etc. Apparently that has yet to sink in. Believe it or not, someone actually reads your posts, and when you say "fuck the law", that can (and has) been used against you.
I think the DVD case (among others) will be very important for the future of the Internet. It will decide reverse-engineering, home use, encryption, the reach of major companies (with major lobbying power), and the rights of consumers. And I would like to see strong encryption, the freedom to reverse-engineer, etc. But, this will only come if we play it smart. Support your cause without turning into 9 year old potty mouths. Don't give the opposition ammo.
Norway or the US? (Score:2)
Re:you've taken a lot heat because of this.. (Score:2)
What is your opinion of the MPAA and the United States DVD Copy Control Association?
What motivated you do this? (Score:2)
I chanced upon a guy in #linux who claims to run a software shop in Norway where you applied for a job and he flatly rejected you. Basically, he said that anyone who was dumb enough to risk a lifetime blacklist was too dumb to work for him. I have no idea about the verity of this story, but the rationale behind what he said makes sense - people who display a callous disregard for "the rules" don't often fit into the corporate culture. My questions are whether or not you have felt any of the backlash like that described above, and also if you now regret undertaking this project. Sure, you will live in infamy as the guy who cracked CSS, but at the same time you may have jeopardized your employment possiblities in your home country - and you're only 16.
--
clarification... (Score:5)
in another interview you were asked why decss was written for windows when the idea was to make a player for windows. you stated it was made for windows while linux's ability to deal with the dvd fs was being sorted. why didn't you just copy the vob file? (not enough disk space?) did the computers the police took have linux versions of the decss code?
lastly i think it would be good to get a bitof tech clarification since i know next to nothing about dvd's. say a person was able to decrypt the vob. what exactly could they do with the resulting file? just watch the movie? or are the value added features on dvd's contained in the vob? perhaps a quick run through of dvd tech,or a link to it would be enlightening to those of us not up on dvd.
Re:Why not pay the licensing fees? (Score:2)
First of all, the license fee is not $5000. In fact, we don't know what the license fee is, because DVD CCA refuses to disclose that information to parties they don't regard as "credible."
Second: Taking apart your lawfully obtained, personal property and figuring out how it works is perfectly lawful and ethical. Period. Shrinkwrap "licenses" are monsterously unethical and have no legal force. No amount of posturing or whining by wealthy media executives will change this.
Finally, I would urge you to read the Hoy Reply document [cryptome.org], which contains as Exhibit B the full text of DVD CCA's contract. I think you'll agree that such terms as they demand are an anathema to the Open Source ethic.
Schwab
Re:Will you keep going, or cut a deal? (Score:2)
Assuming Norways legal system works as in Sweden, this is simply not possible. "Deals" are explicitly disallowed in Swedish law. You can't get any "favours" by cooperating, because it is assumed that the same crime should always give the same punishment ("everybody is equal to the law", something like that).
Although I hear lately that the courts have been found to do this kind of stuff in semi-secret, even though it's illegal. There is an investigation going on, don't know what they will find, though.
Mirroring (Score:3)
It's not a question of erasing all copies of the source - that is impossible. Rather what do you think the reprecussions of this mirroring will be? As of yet, nobody has knocked on my door asking me to stop mirroring...
DeCSS and MPAA (Score:5)
Do you have any plans to talk to media outlets that will listen to your side of the story? Do you KNOW of any such outlets? I believe the word needs to spread to everyone who has ever touched a DVD movie, the net, or even a computer. The only problem with that is it is SO SEXY to portray people like you in a mischevious light, and to make you out to be the bad guy. WE know that's not the case, but every medium and their company (save Slashdot) paints this as a "they-want-to-copy-movies" situation. How do you think we should educate the masses, and through which mediums?
-- Give him Head? Be a Beacon?
Re:DeCSS and MPAA (Not a question) (Score:3)
Your response is no less weighted: "The MPAA is making this out to be a piracy issue because to them it is a piracy issue." We know this is their public position, but it seems hard to put together even a compelling prima facie argument for this position. Digitally-distributed content (as CDs) have been around for a while, and the music companies are richer than ever. Ditto software, despite minimal copy protection. Why are movies different? The MPAA has yet to answer this question, even in a cursory way.
OTOH, the encryption system that is virtually useless for combatting all but the most unlikely piracy is very effective at controlling the market for players. And there are boatloads of compelling financial motives for the movie publishers to want control of a market besides content distribution. They have read the writing on the music industry's wall -- the business of packaging content physically for distribution and selling those units is going to be a lot less profitable in the coming years.
Assuming that the MPAA believes it's own position is assuming that the MPAA is stupid, which I'm not yet willing to do. It even further beggars belief to suggest that their system for "protecting against piracy," while pitifully ineffective at curbing piracy, is "accidentally" a cunningly effective system for controlling the DVD player market. It had to be by design.
So, it is "clear" that this is not "a piracy issue". The issue is where the rights of the consumers lie in using products they have purchased, and where the rights of the intellectual property owners end. You may argue that the poster's question is self-evident, or a waste of Mr. Johanssen's interview time, but it is not weighted. It is self-evident to anyone who reviews the facts.
phil
Re:Your dad... (Score:3)
I've seen an interview with both Jon and his dad, so I can espond to this..
Yes. His father agrees with him. He understands the situation; that DeCSS was neccessary to make it possible to view DVDs on Jon's computer.
He didn't mention Linux in particular, but he said that it should be possible to view the DVDs on ones own computer.
DVD Island (Score:2)
You have had already some "experience"
DeCSS/pirate video (Score:3)
--
Re:no-player-key-needed crypto attack on CSS (Score:2)
However, you will notice that the information, which I will repeat here at a default score of "2", was posted anonymously. Anonymous Coward posts default to a score of 0: the post was not moderated down by anyone.
The links he referred to (NOT hyperlinked, merely reported as plain text as is, for now, still my constitutional right in this country (the US):
people.a2000.nl/mwielaar/dvd-css/csspaper/css.htm
www.lemuria.org/DeCSS/crypto.gq.nu/
www.derfrosch.de/decss/
Re:apology (Score:2)
What exactly was your contribution to deccs? (Score:3)
------------------
Re:Slashdot strikes again (Score:2)
Most people, including journalists, do not know much about the issues at stake when it comes to information technology. They are thus prone to be influenced by clever propaganda from influential groups with good public relation staff. They are also prone to judge on apparences and to make amalgams.
The mainstream media has said that Slashdot is the place where typical "hackers" and Linux-users discuss. If journalists or readers come to Slashdot, they are more likely to consider it as a place where young, spoilt idiots use rude words they would not say in front of their parents than a place where serious discussion is made on technical and ethical issues.
Re: (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
ABC Interview? (Score:2)
When is the ABC interview going to be on? Is it going to be on the nightly news, or on 20/20 or Nightline or something?
We heard ABC was coming to see Johansen last Thursday [slashdot.org], but I didn't see anything about it on the nightly news.
Now the Linuxworld article made it sound like ABC was coming yesterday (Monday). So what's the deal? When can we expect to see this on TV?
Re:What do you think their real fear is? (Score:2)
Nothing to do with it.
Their immediate goal is make sure the artificial barriers in the DVD market stay in place. i.e. Currently, you can't watch a U.S. DVD on a player that was built for the Japanese market. Jack Valenti and his band of merry movie execs divided the world into six regions. By releasing the same movie at different times to different regions, they can maximize profit and minimize pirating (so... Hong Kong gets movies last)
Their longer term goal is to tell you when and where you can watch your media by controlling every play back technology. They want to take away your right to format-shift your media. They want to undo fair use.
Jon... whatever you do, don't admit to any wrong-doing. If you allow them to bully you into signing something that isn't true, it could be serious blow to us here in the U.S.
-- Kinesis, Defendant #2 in the DVD CCA case.
what about windows dvd rippers? (Score:2)
So Jon, do you feel that the industry is after you just because you made your findings and source freely available on the net?
How long did it take you? (Score:2)
How long did it take you to reverse engineer CSS?
---
probably xmovie.. (Score:2)
Legal Question (Score:2)
Your dad... (Score:4)
Did he know that you put DeCSS on his server, and what that software did?
Does he agree with your stance on DVD encryption, and the need for software players for Linux?
Gerv
When will be first DeCSS-based Linux DVD player? (Score:3)
This is not a "when are you going to complete your player program" question. If I were a coder, I would help. My question is simply when do you see the first player actually being released? What are the remaining technical difficulties to getting DVD playback to work on linux, now that the CSS hurdle has been cleared?
OT, but relevant: hotline@mpaa.org (Score:2)
you've taken a lot heat because of this.. (Score:2)
Re:When will be first DeCSS-based Linux DVD player (Score:3)
DeCSS is not a Windows program, or a Linux program, it's source code. The reason that you have a Windows version is because somebody compiled it under that platform, not because someone wrote for Windows.
And he didn't write a DVD *player* at all, he wrote a tool to decrypt the DVD movie so it could be watched using a seperate player, something that could not be done before.
And you must be some kind of bad-ass k00l m0-f0 if you can copy DVDs using deCSS. The current DVD media won't allow for it, and only one movie would fit on today's hard drives.
So, to sum up. No, it's not a Windows program. No, it doesn't copy DVDs. Yes, it's needed to watch DVDs under Linux. And the court case is still going to be a pain in the ass because of people like you, spewing half-truths and total lies.
Re:Support in Norway? (Score:2)
The support for him in the norwegian media has been POSITIVE. Almost exclusivly positive.
People like Gisle Hannemyr, Tron Oegrim and others (computer-dinosaurs in norway) is supporting his case. EFN (Electronic Frotnier Norway) is supporting his case. People like me has handed out flyers at the university.
My neighbour, which is
In other words, most normal people support him.
--
"Rune Kristian Viken" - arcade@kvine-nospam.sdal.com - arcade@efnet
Re:Is there a legal defense fund? Can I contribute (Score:2)
--
"Rune Kristian Viken" - arcade@kvine-nospam.sdal.com - arcade@efnet
Re:A question of laws in your country. (Score:2)
Therefore, it should really be a non-issue.
--
"Rune Kristian Viken" - arcade@kvine-nospam.sdal.com - arcade@efnet
Re:What are the age limits in your country? (Score:2)
--
"Rune Kristian Viken" - arcade@kvine-nospam.sdal.com - arcade@efnet
Re:Parliament care about Police action? (Score:3)
Have they done anything about the treatement you, and your father received from the Police? Or have they decided to sit on the and let the MPAA run the show of things?
I can answer that question for you. The Norwegian Parliament doesn't bug into police affairs. The case was brought before the parliament - with requests to review the laws. Not to comment on the specific case.
If I understood the press right, The question was if the laws should allow more reverse engineering and more freedom than they already do.
--
"Rune Kristian Viken" - arcade@kvine-nospam.sdal.com - arcade@efnet
Jon did not WRITE the DeCSS algorithm. (Score:2)
Source code release? (Score:2)
On another topic, I have only seen an object code release of DeCSS. In 20-20 hindsight, had you ever thought about releasing the source? A source release of DeCSS would have likely splintered into a couple of hundred ports and versions rendering moot any prosecution of a single individual.
Norwegian Police (Score:4)
What's so special about Norway? (Score:2)
Why is this? Is Norway supposed to be a bastion of free speech or something? I would assume the MPAA has as much power in other countries as it does in America, so I don't really see why this would be so surprising.
___________________
Region codes? (Score:2)
And by the way - what region is Norway in, and what other countries are in the same region.
--
It's October 6th. Where's W2K? Over the horizon again, eh?
Programming background (Score:5)
Regret (Score:3)
I'm sure everybody here is very glad you did, but we don't have to live under such scruitiny. Thanks for keeping up the fight for what's good.
Favorite (Score:2)
Re:DeCSS and MPAA (Not a question) (Score:2)
Let's see. 7 KB/sec means you can get 420 KB/min or 24.6 MB/hour, or 590.625 MB/day so yes, 6 days, 18 hours, 32 mins 22.9 secs. Which is, of course, assuming conditions that never happen.
My apologies for the duff initial maths. Can't see where the problem is - I went over it a few times coming from the other direction, but this is clearly right.
Oh well...
Incidentally, let's look at what that would cost over here. Assuming you find it on an FTP site with resume so can only do this at the weekends when the calls are cheapest, you get charged 1p/min. Premier Line (cost: £6 per quarter) combined with Friends and Family can drop that down to 0.75p/min. There's also BT Together but last time I heard that saved a maximum of 70p a month or something silly so I'm not bothering with that
Anyway, in perfect conditions you're still going to take 9752.4 minutes. By my reckoning you'd have to pay £73.14 for the phone call at the least.
Once again, my apologies for getting the maths wrong, though I did check it, honest... But it's still not even slightly practical, TBH.
Greg
Re:DeCSS and MPAA (Not a question) (Score:2)
We seem to be mostly agreed that this is harassment to maintain a stranglehold over the player market. If these things are out there and NOT being pursued, our case is rather stonger.
How can we bring this to the attention of the EFF to use in their defence?
Greg
Re:Wrong. (Score:2)
The potential problem here, though, is with electricity and output standards. You appear to be in the US - I'm in the UK. If we both bought standalone DVD players then swapped, neither would be usable. You have 525/30 NTSC with 110v AC, we have 625/25 PAL with 240v AC.
Out of interest, what makes region locking globally illegal?
Greg
Re:DeCSS and MPAA (Not a question) (Score:3)
This may well make DVD copying easier. But it's only creating one more avenue.
Let's see. If you can lay your hands on DVD mastering equipment (which seems to be a possibility for a number of firms in Hong Kong) you can just create a bit-for-bit copy. Not protected against in any way.
If you've got a video capture facility - not that uncommon, comes with most TV cards - you can grab the image THAT way and then copy it out however you want. VHS and VCD seem the popular ways. Both are possible, though you may need a descrambler box as they've done some funny things with the data output to try and mess up the equipment.
There seems to be software out there to copy direct to VCD - I've seen it referred to and I once heard someone on another machine in a lab referring to their using it. Can't find a copy to prove it, though.
Theoretically (read I'm told this is possible but research hasn't turned up any links yet) you can write a fake video driver that grabs the data on the way through and can also do what it likes with it.
Then there's DeCSS. Which will, admittedly, produce a decrypted playback stream. But you play that how? You can't burn your own DVD as DVD-R discs are sold with a section pre-burnt blank precisely to stop this. If you can get round this then you really don't need DeCSS as you can just make a bit-for-bit copy, encryption intact. And this can't exactly be traded over the net like an MP3 - the resulting file is GIGABYTES large.
Let's say 4GB for example - well, that's 4096000 KB by my arithmetic. On a 56Kb modem running at maximum possible efficiency you might get 7KB/sec. If I started downloading it now and nothing went wrong on the way, it wouldn't be finished until 23rd March next year! Assume more realistic conditions - my modem normally connects at 31,200 - and I'd be waiting until Christmas 2001.
Somewhere in the film industry there's probably someone who genuinely believes that this is copy protection. They deserve our pity. The only practical purpose this serves is maintaining a stranglehold on who can manufacture players. And I can't see that as defensible.
This suit deserves being laughed out of court. Our perpetuating the MPAA's bogus argument should be avoided, in case we inadvertently give credibility to these individuals.
Disclaimer, before I get accused of being a pirate for researching this: I don't posess a DVD drive of any form. Or any DVDs. Or any pirate VCDs or VHS cassettes I've ripped on friends' computers. I do posess a CD-RW drive, purchased so I can make backups of my work.
Greg
A question of laws in your country. (Score:5)
Hey Rob, Thanks for that tarball!
Public Reception (Score:5)
What, IYHO, is the general reception you have felt about this issue? Have you been able to explain your position and have it understood? What are some of the stranger assumptions you have come up against?
Answering my own questions... (Score:5)
Please have a look at it. It clears up a couple of things...
Will you keep going, or cut a deal? (Score:5)
Considering that you compiled promptly with the original cease and desist order, do you envisage a situatition where you have had enough, and admit "guilt", to get off with a "warning", or will you struggle to be complete exhonerated?
IMO, It's important to resist, because of the precedent it could set, but it's on thing to talk the talk, and different to walk the walk.
--
DVD's have been pirated for over a year now. (Score:4)
Why do you think that DeCSS was made to be such a big deal. The movie pirating community has been copying DVD's with computers, using software just like yours for over a year now. I personally ahve copies of 3 different peices of software dating to march 99. So, what was all the ruckus over DeCSS?
Parliament care about Police action? (Score:5)
Have they done anything about the treatement you, and your father received from the Police? Or have they decided to sit on the and let the MPAA run the show of things?
What overall is the people's (that are in charge) reaction to your arrest and questioning by the police and the manipulation of the media (somewhat) by the MPAA?
About the cops... (Score:5)
Wrong. (Score:3)
This is not true! We do not know their real reasons, but ANY good analysis of the situation should take into consideration things like region codes and independent film distribution. The relevent facts are:
1) Region codes are illegal (under international law and many national laws), but very few countries enforce these law. The MPAA wants to protect their illegal use of region codes to provide crappy (delayed) releases in Eurpoe and extort additional money from Europeans. The biggest threat that DeCSS represents to the MPAA is that Europeans will buy DVDs legally before they are released in Europe's theaters.
2) The MPAA wants to control distribution. Currently, they have a strangle hold on independent films because they control printing. The real threat to their dominance from independant film would come if people started distributing independant films directly via selling DVDs.
There has been a lot of talk about fighting the MPAA by boycotting movies. I think this is a wonderful idea, but I think we would be more effective if we make it easyer for the masses to boycott movies. How do we do this?
The answer is: open Linux DVD theaters in European resterants and bars! If Europeans start seeing the new releases in bars before they come out in theaters they will be less likely to see the movie in the theater. This in one of the best ways to hurt the MPAA's pocket book, so if you live in Europe you shouldconsider helping you local bar wire up a regionless DVD player or a Linux box to play new releases from America!
And that's before we get to the fact that your asking Jon to shed light on motives that he has had no part in shaping.
This is correct, but it is likely that Jon knows more then the author of the original post.. and can probable provide additional hypothetical incentives (like the above) which are much more realistic then the MPAA's piracy argument.
Jeff
BTW> It would be nice if someone would post the address of a place to order a regionless DVD player.
Re:Why Windows? (Score:3)
Sorry, OT, I know.
Re:Lessons learned (Score:3)
>My suggestion would be to write a program to
>*PLAY* DVDs and not a program to *COPY*
>DVDs.
My suggestion (to you) would be to consider this:
There is some additional backstory which is well known to attentive readers. The industry group that created and implemented CSS did not do it for copy protection - it is very weak in this regard, as copies of all of the data on a DVD can still be made, without descrambling, given the proper hardware. What the scrambling implementation is designed to do really is to prevent you from viewing a DVD movie that the manufacturer doesn't want you to see. This restriction can be based upon where you live (a restriction which is really important to the motion picture industry, as helps preserve or bolster regional distribution monopolies), or possible future restrictions, such as what brand or type of DVD player you have purchased.
CSS is yet another scheme to take power away from consumers through proprietary standards. If you buy a movie on VHS, it will work in your VHS player, regardless of your place of residence, credit rating, hardware manufacturer (generally) - if you buy a DVD that was published using CSS, this is not necessarily true. There are even steps being taken to make sure that movie DVDs can only be played a limited number of times - built-in obsolescence. And now the companies involved are saying that any attempt to allow consumers to use their DVD players in the same way they use their VHS players is piracy? I think the real pirates are on the other side here.
Possibly I am wasting my time with this reply - saw your other post on this story and it was the same mixture of authoritativeness and cluelessness.
Support in Norway? (Score:5)
Re:Why Windows? (Score:3)
The guy being charged, Mr. Johansen never released a Windows program of any sorts. What he *did* release was the source code to decode the encryption.
With the source code, someone else created a Windows program to decode the DVD. While I'm on the subject. He also did *not* write the code to break the encryption, he was merely the one who posted it and stood behind it.
Hope that helps.
Previous work / experience (Score:3)
Xing EULA (Score:4)
Would you still have done it? (Score:5)
You've obviously witnessed the hoopla the release of the DVD code has created in the movie industry, and it's effects of prosecutions and even your home being raided. Thus said, if before you released the DeCSS code, you knew of all these consequences and controversies that would be created, would you still have released it? Or, knowing these consequences, what other steps may you have taken to release the code to the public?
Why Windows? (Score:5)
Real Life (Score:5)
Re:Question - morality of DeCSS (Score:4)
"Legally, the keys and encryption are (i believe) the intelectual property of the MPAA(or someone related)."
This is meaningless. Everything he worked with was sold to him; those keys were somehow mixed in on the disk and player, which he bought. Figuring out the key on the disk is no different than processing any other legally acquired copyrighted material -- is it against the law for me to count the number of words in the paperpack I just purchased, or otherwise analyze it ?
If I apply some stylometry techniques to some of the junk paperbacks out there and discover that one of those prolific authors is actually four or five, can I be sued for revealing the secret ? No, because if the publisher didn't want me to look at the book, they shouldn't have taken my money and given me the book. If the DVD producer had a secret, then they shouldn't have put it on hardware and disks that they sold all over the world. Instead they wanted to both have a secret and share it, and their math wasn't clever enough. Not our problem.
You say:
"It's like breaking into someone's home (by whatever means, violent or nonviolent) to steal or copy something of theirs that you feel you should have."
It's not like that at all. Some moneyd interests might approve of you saying so, since they want people to feel guilty about cracking those keys, but he didn't go to anyone else's home; he was in his own home, with property he purchased legally. In what way did he steal anything ? Immitation is not stealing.
You say:
"Since they're still the creaters/owners of the encryption, it's their right to determine who has access to the keys."
Setting aside for the moment how you can possibly own an encryption, I'd like to point out they sold him those keys on the disk and hardware.
Now, they didn't count on him being able to read it. But that is simply a bad business break. You can't expect the courts to go around throwing people in jail everytime some little piece of information makes your business plan out of date.
You say:
"And while their not including Linux does suck (i agree!), how do you feel that what you did for DeCSS is justified?"
Why does he have to justify anything ? If he took that damn player out in the woods and blew it to pieces with a shotgun just for jollies, well, it's his player. Instead he looked at it and figured out a bit about how it worked, and told some other people. What's wrong with that ? If the MPAA wants an uncopiable medium, why don't they make one and sell it ? Ok, so they did try, but they missed. Is that reason to take your lumps and try again, or is that reason to run to the government that always takes your soft money campaign contributions and demand that they start throwing people in jail ?
My question (Score:3)
Question (Score:5)
Programming Background (Score:5)
Does the U.S. have too much sway? (Score:5)
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| big bad mr. frosty
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What Should We Do? (Score:5)
As is a (thankfully) usual reaction to such a blatant injustice, the Slashdot community (and many others) have been scrambling to figure out ways to help you and others prosecuted in the name of this whole DeCSS fisasco.
As one (if not the) most persecuted individual as a result of DeCSS, what do you think the rest of the supporting world should do to help you out? What should the people who want to help do, besides the obvious posting of the DeCSS source and the general badmouthing of the MPAA?
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Compromise? (Score:5)
===
-Ravagin
What do you think their real fear is? (Score:3)
Copying DVDs bitwise can be done.
One should suppose the movie business would like DVD going to Linux, opening a new market.
Therefore it's a little strange to see them suieing someone who lets players be more abundant. Do you agree that their real fear might be raw video from DVDs being modified and republished?
Any further developments? (Score:3)
I would be curious to know whether you have any indication from the police of when they might conclude their investigation and either bring charges or return your machines.
-- Eythain
Q for Jon (Score:3)
Bad press. (Score:4)
kwsNI
What can we do to help? (Score:3)
I haven't seen a direct statement from you as to what type of help you need most right now, but I'm sure there are many who would like to assist.
Why? (Score:4)
Anomalous: inconsistent with or deviating from what is usual, normal, or expected
Being from a fairly liberal nation... (Score:5)
What are the age limits in your country? (Score:3)
How do you expect your age to influence the charges against you?
Question for Jon (Score:3)