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Persistence Pays Off With Israel's First Windows Refund
Posted by
timothy
on Wed Dec 03, 2008 04:54 PM
from the paving-the-way dept.
from the paving-the-way dept.
As Niv Lilian reports at Ynet News, Haifa (and the Haifa Linux Club)'s Zvi Devir just preferred to run Linux rather than the pre-installed Windows on his newly bought Dell computer, and didn't want to pay for the unwanted Windows system. Now Devir has prevailed, after a fight in Israeli small-claims court, to become the first Israeli to obtain a Windows refund (also in Hebrew), winning the $137 that Windows added to the cost of his machine and escaping the nondisclosure agreement that Dell had wanted him to abide by as a condition. Perhaps others will follow his lead. Update: 12/03 23:02 GMT by T : Zvi Devir wrote with an update: "BTW, the settlement was out of court, before any court sessions took place."
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Technology: Amazon UK Refunds Windows License Fee, With Little Hassle 194 comments
christian.einfeldt writes "Alan Lord, a FOSS computer consultant based in the UK, has announced that Amazon UK honored his request for a refund of the Microsoft license fee portion of the cost of a new Asus netbook PC that came with Microsoft Windows XP. Lord details the steps that he took to obtain a refund of 40.00 GBP for the cost of the EULA, complete with links to click to request a refund. Lord's refund comes 10 years after the initial flurry of activity surrounding EULA discounts, started by a blog post by Australian computer consultant Geoffrey Bennett which appeared on Slashdot on 18 January 1999. That Slashdot story led to mainstream press coverage, such as stories in CNN, the New York Times Online, and the San Francisco Chronicle, to name just a few. The issue quieted down for a few years, but has started to gain some momentum again in recent years, with judges in France, Italy, and Israel awarding refunds. But if Lord's experience is any indication, getting a refund through Amazon might be as easy as filling out a few forms, at least in the UK, without any need to go to court."
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The Gates Are Now Open (Score:3, Insightful)
Re: (Score:2)
What, you think getting a refund for a Windows license is new [linux.com]?
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Oh god, I am seriously fearing the flood that is to come. This will set a precedent(if only a small one), that could change the way computers are sold, as well as if windows will be considered "standard" software for much longer.
In Israel.
Re: (Score:2)
Well yes. But if one thing is true of Israelis, it's that they do not give half a shit about copyright. The ones who don't actually want to run Linux will all claim Windoze refunds so they can install Windows with the pirate disk they bought at the market.
If the Israeli courts keep requiring that these refunds be issued, suddenly you will see all of Israel "running Linux".
Re: (Score:2, Insightful)
Why are you fearing that? Why should windows be considered "standard" software? Not all of us want to run windows on our computers so why should we be required to pay for a windows license as part of the cost of a new computer? Particularly an OEM license that we can't legally use on any other hardware?
If the cost of a windows license bundled with a new computer is $150 then why not sell machines at the normal price and allow the user to choose to get a machine with windows pre-installed, adding $150 to
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Yes, it might last longer than 40 days and 40 nights... ;)
What about the manufacturers? (Score:2)
When I mailed and asked some time, probably to Microsoft though, may had been a bad idea, I got the impression that one wouldn't be able to return only Windows but would have to return the whole machine.
Rather obvious that Microsoft would prefer it that way but ..
Is this true? Makes somewhat reasonable sense for the manufacturer to be able to set up rules like that.
Re: (Score:3, Informative)
Depends what country you're in, probably.
Canada and the US have laws against bundling - requiring the purchase of one product to purchase another product.
So the manufacturer can't require you to buy Windows if you buy the computer hardware.
How it is in other countries, I have no idea.
Read the article. (Score:5, Informative)
This doesn't have to do with Windows as much as it has to do with Dell.
Basically, Dell said (in the EULA) that they would refund money if you don't agree to the terms. So that's what the guy did.
If anything, this just shows how few people read license agreements than anything else. And shows that, once again, 'customer support' still stinks :)
Isn't that a Macintosh? (Score:5, Funny)
The laptop in the stock photo [ynetnews.com] for the article sure looks like didn't come with Windows in the first place.
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What's even more funny is the guy in that picture looks a lot like Wil Wheaton.
Somebody tag it (Score:2)
Good on him, and boo to Dell (Score:4, Insightful)
...for trying to wiggle out of their contractual agreement. Now, I'm not sure a click-through EULA is in fact a contract, but then that's DELLs to decide. Either it is or it isn't.
This Is Wonderful But . . . (Score:3, Interesting)
I am of course overjoyed at the fact that there is someone who managed not to be forced to pay for Windows, but I still have to ask this question: Did Dell take the loss or did MS?
Aside from saving money, refusing to grant an undesirable vendor money is another reason to refuse a purchase. If Dell still paid MS, then MS is still insulated from market forces. How can customers choose against MS if MS gets paid even when those customers do not purchase MS software?
I hope the next time this happens, Dell will supply a written document certifying that it has refused payment to MS for the copy in question.
Not even implied (Score:5, Insightful)
Parent
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Re:Not even implied (Score:4, Informative)
You are absolutely right. However, may I note that Zvi is a very traditional Jewish male name. It means "deer".
Parent
Re:Not even implied (Score:5, Funny)
Well true, but all humans are cheap and like to avoid paying for anything anyway.
There, corrected that for you.
Parent
Re: (Score:2, Informative)
Sure there is no label on this that says "Jew", however, based on contextual evidence can conclude that the person responsible for this likely practices Judaism.
Since you want to talk statistics, 37% of Israelis are atheist or agnostic [google.com]. That suggests to me that they don't "practice" Judaism at least in a religious, worship the supernatural way, although many may identify culturally/ethnically with Judaism and still maintain their traditionally Jewish lifestyles, ethical values, and heritage.
It's a witch! (Score:2)
Does this bird weigh as much as a duck?
Re:Not even implied (Score:5, Insightful)
Parent
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Re:blablabla (Score:2, Insightful)
Re: (Score:3, Interesting)