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Finland Is Crowdsourcing Its New Copyright Law 103

Posted by samzenpus
from the power-to-the-people dept.
An anonymous reader writes "Internet activists in Finland, upset with the country's strict copyright laws, are ready to take advantage of the country's promise to vote on any citizen-proposed bill that reaches 50,000 signatures. Digital rights group Common Sense in Copyright has proposed sweeping changes to Finland's Lex Karpela, a 2006 amendment to the Finnish copyright law that more firmly criminalized digital piracy. Under it, 'countless youngsters have been found guilty of copyright crimes and sentenced to pay thousands, in some cases hundreds of thousands, of euros in punitive damages to the copyright organizations.' The proposal to fix copyright is the best-rated and most-commented petition on the Open Ministry site."
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Finland Is Crowdsourcing Its New Copyright Law

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  • by Anonymous Coward on Thursday January 24, 2013 @06:52AM (#42678779)

    They can fix and improve and change as much as they want. The moment it is out and the US doesnt like it, starts accusing Finland of "theft" and threatens painful trade sanctions, they will have to revert it back or face consequences more severe than putting up with the current copyright.

    Copyright is simply too valuable for the few influential stakeholders to be allowed to be decided democratically.

    • by c0lo (1497653) on Thursday January 24, 2013 @07:07AM (#42678829)

      They can fix and improve and change as much as they want. The moment it is out and the US doesnt like it, starts accusing Finland of "theft" and threatens painful trade sanctions, they will have to revert it back or face consequences more severe than putting up with the current copyright.

      Copyright is simply too valuable for the few influential stakeholders to be allowed to be decided democratically.

      What more US can do that has not already done to Finland? I mean, look... isn't enough they pushed Elop as the Nokia head? (grin: it's Obama's fault, isn't it?)

      With a AAA [guardian.co.uk] credit rating, the only nasty thing would scare the Finnish people would be the Russian to cut their gas [energydelta.org] (100% dependence on Russia).

      • by Anonymous Coward on Thursday January 24, 2013 @07:29AM (#42678905)

        With a AAA [guardian.co.uk] credit rating, the only nasty thing would scare the Finnish people would be the Russian to cut their gas [energydelta.org] (100% dependence on Russia).

        And Russia is rather unlikely to do this just because USA wants it. Anything that distances Finland from the west and brings closer to Russia is going to be perfectly fine for the Russians.

      • by Anonymous Coward

        With 5 nuclear plants, Finland is not at all dependent on Russian gas.

        • by bfandreas (603438) on Thursday January 24, 2013 @07:40AM (#42678947)
          It is. Gas is also used for heating. Amongst other things.
          Europe is also highly dependant on Gazprom. And they have been known to throttle their pipelines in winter if something wasn't to their liking.
          • Re: (Score:2, Informative)

            by Anonymous Coward

            10% of total energy consumption ( http://www.maakaasu.fi/sisalto/statistics ) is hardly "being dependent".

          • by Donwulff (27374)

            This thread of conversation seems to already have gone down the tubes, and I don't mean gas-tubes. I think most people meant it as jokes, but when future schoolchildren will Google it up they'll find this Slashdot discussion, and then update Wikipedia accordingly (Think of the children!), so to try to put the record straight on a few things...

            Finland has 4 operating energy production reactors, one research/medical reactor that's in the process of being shut down (Turns out using nuclear power for good [www.vtt.fi] is to

        • by c0lo (1497653)

          With 5 nuclear plants, Finland is not at all dependent on Russian gas.

          It's not depending 100% on electric energy.
          But, you know, it's quite hard to make rubber from uranium, even harder to become the highest profitable tyre manufacturer [wikipedia.org] in the world.

          • by Viol8 (599362) on Thursday January 24, 2013 @07:58AM (#42679013)

            "it's quite hard to make rubber from uranium,"

            Its not particularly easy to make it from methane.

            • by c0lo (1497653)

              "it's quite hard to make rubber from uranium,"

              Its not particularly easy to make it from methane.

              You reckon? Care to google for "BuNa rubbers"? Zy germanz used to make it back in 1935 - granted, they started from coal, which made the thing a bit harder.

              • by Viol8 (599362)

                I said not easy , I didn't say impossible.

                • by c0lo (1497653)

                  I said not easy , I didn't say impossible.

                  Well, I guess that's almost settles it. 'Cause I was let to understand that making rubber from natural gas is on the same order of difficulty as making rubber from uranium.

                  • by Viol8 (599362)

                    You can make long chain hydrocarbons from gas and once you have them then you can use them in the same way as oil for manufacturing. Unfortunately its highly energy inefficient.

        • by gl4ss (559668)

          With 5 nuclear plants, Finland is not at all dependent on Russian gas.

          yeah of course not. we can just offset the energy consumption from the lost gas with electricity bought from russian nuclear plants!
          we could import more coal, oil and whatever to offset it in reality though.. but those five nuclear plants don't really cover all that much.. btw don't order any french generators if you want them on time.

          and before usa could demand any sanctions.. eu would need to kick finland out before that and they damn well wouldn't do it over any copyright stuff.

          usa isn't the largest poss

      • by Anonymous Coward

        They can fix and improve and change as much as they want. The moment it is out and the US doesnt like it, starts accusing Finland of "theft" and threatens painful trade sanctions, they will have to revert it back or face consequences more severe than putting up with the current copyright.

        Copyright is simply too valuable for the few influential stakeholders to be allowed to be decided democratically.

        What more US can do that has not already done to Finland? I mean, look... isn't enough they pushed Elop as the Nokia head? (grin: it's Obama's fault, isn't it?)

        With a AAA [guardian.co.uk] credit rating, the only nasty thing would scare the Finnish people would be the Russian to cut their gas [energydelta.org] (100% dependence on Russia).

        Yes, all gas is coming from Russia, but You failed to notice that gas is only a minor player in Finnish energy production. 9.6 % of Finnish energy comes from gas. It can also easily be replaced with other sources if need be.

        • by c0lo (1497653)

          Yes, all gas is coming from Russia, but You failed to notice that gas is only a minor player in Finnish energy production. 9.6 % of Finnish energy comes from gas. It can also easily be replaced with other sources if need be.

          So, are you saying the Finnish people are stupid and buy the rest of 90.4% of gas with no reason, 'cause they actually don't need it at all?

    • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

      by Anonymous Coward

      Do you really think the US would trade sanction an EU state? I doubt it. They may face pressure from the EU itself but the last thing the EU needs is to start pissing off the states that actually pay their own way.

      • by Anonymous Coward

        Probably not, they'd just skip ahead to the invasion.

    • The best way to assure that things will go down the drain quickly is to keep from pushing back when the stakeholders try to push their way because of a misguided sensation of futility.

      The possibility, high as it may be, that fighting back won't be enough is no justification to stay put and let things burn.
    • I still applaud the initiative, it is passing laws for the nation, by the nation and finland has some very smart folks, i dont think they will change the law in a contra-productive way and if the 'almighty uncle sam' doesnt like it but finland pushes forward maybe its because they can do without the US, this is not a couple dozen guys dictating laws, this is thousands of people
    • I still applaud the initiative, it is passing laws for the nation, by the nation and finland has some very smart folks, i dont think they will change the law in a contra-productive way and if the 'almighty uncle sam' doesnt like it but finland pushes forward maybe its because they can do without the US
    • by Reziac (43301) *

      In fairness, shouldn't such trade sanctions apply only to U.S.-copyrighted works? Since otherwise it's really none of our business. "No, Finland, you can't have any more of our Hollywood movies.... what's that cheering noise??"

  • by bfandreas (603438) on Thursday January 24, 2013 @06:52AM (#42678781)
    If this is even remotely successful then a lot of lobbyists will get their knickers in a twist.
    The chances of this being ratified should be rather slim due to:
    -international treaties
    -legality of the law without having to rewrite other laws
    -being watered down in parliament
    ...

    I would guess a lot of lawyers will work on this thing. So chances are this might be the best written piece of legislation never to be signed.

    the common democratic illness is that we vote for politians based on how well they look in a suit, how loud they shout their simple truths and how long ago they had their last sex scandal. Should be credibility, competence and merit. Oh well.
    • by Apotekaren (904220) on Thursday January 24, 2013 @07:03AM (#42678807)

      As for the watering down, if the proposal (a complete law text) passes the 50,000 vote mark, the Finnish parliament has to vote on it AS IS.

      • by bfandreas (603438)
        It has to? Wow! What kind of majority is needed to pass it? Is there even a slim chance for that?
        Now the question is if the general population will even care why they turn it down. If the vote is "no" and not enough people really care then all this is in vain.
        • by Anonymous Coward

          Europe is not USA.
          You say no - you get crowds on the streets. You say no to crowds - you get Riots.

          • Europe is not USA.
            You say no - you get crowds on the streets. You say no to crowds - you get Riots.

            That's more of a southern Europe thing. Finns are actually quite mild what comes to demonstrations or riots. We might rant a bit and then inoffensively accept the government decisions.

        • by Kjella (173770) on Thursday January 24, 2013 @11:14AM (#42680231) Homepage

          Well, Finland is only 5.4 million people so if they can hit the 50k mark it already means 1% of the population cares. That said it looks like the site has just recently opened and the highest vote is slightly over 1k now, so a long way to go.

          • by bfandreas (603438)
            I really hope this has at least some sort of result. That should send at least some ripples through the EU.
      • by mjwalshe (1680392)
        so if its a flawed motion which take no regard of the consequentials eg

        -international treaties
        -legality of the law without having to rewrite other laws

        Its going to get voted down or even removed as invalid - people need to read and understand Citrine, Roberts or erskine and may to understand how parliamentary systems work.
        • Odds are the language in the treaties will be along the lines of "must have copyright laws." If the country continues to have copyright laws but these laws have sane punishments built in (eg, steal a song that is available from itunes for a Euro, be fined 3 Euros. Distribute a song 10 times that is available from itunes for a Euro be fined 3 x 10 Euros)

          The general gist of the law they are proposing is to make the punishment fit the crime. There may be a wishlist for shortened copyright periods and regist

    • by Pecisk (688001) on Thursday January 24, 2013 @07:14AM (#42678855)

      International treaties is the key. Why do you think all copyright legislation has started as treaties? Because no voter in sane mind would force such law upon it's country. But voter doesn't understand, doesn't bother him - at least it's regular thinking of politicians these days. So they agree to treaty, then just come home and say "we done anything we could, but this must be a law now".

      • by bfandreas (603438)
        They are the back door how many bad ideas concerning copyright laws have been pushed throughout the world. Most of them came from the US.
        Like the insane UK extradiction treaties one has to wonder WHY the national parliaments actually do such an unneccessary thing. The US certainly is not at fault to ask other countries for such thing. But parliaments of these countries certainly are at fault when acting against the interests of their own people.

        Depending on your lawgiving constitution it may be that nati
        • It is not surprising though. The only thing the US leads the world on now is IP, so they want the world to protect it. Back when they were a fledgling state they were quite happy to steal IP from Europe and designed their laws accordingly (i.e. they refused to recognise European patents for quite a few years).

          The mystery is why everyone else is colluding with the US on IP laws. The power they have is that of a school yard bully. The moment someone stands up to them it is all over since it is paid for with o

      • You join a treaty. You leave a treaty. Simple. Only politicians hide behind these simple facts.

        • by Pecisk (688001)

          And there comes in that phrase "it's not that simple", because, frankly, it isn't. Usually agreement with these IP treaties are binded with other trade treaties. For example, US say - "hey, you have nice steel export to us. That would be a shame if tariffs went up suddenly, wouldn't it". Because exports are practically only way how countries can repay their debts and imports. So US uses it's "biggest consumer" card now and then to force IP regime around the world.

          Surprisingly while I don't see it as good th

          • US does what they think is right for them

            It's not that simple either.

            While bashing the US is popular on Slashdot, those with a more balanced perspective understand that real situations almost never come down to a question of USA vs. The Rest of The World.

            The organizations that make money from copyright have stockholders and / or owners that are citizens of many different countries. Further, in all likelihood, as is the case with other big corporations, many of the employees of these organizations will come from countries other than the USA.

            Wealthy

      • by c0lo (1497653) on Thursday January 24, 2013 @07:45AM (#42678969)

        International treaties is the key. Why do you think all copyright legislation has started as treaties? Because no voter in sane mind would force such law upon it's country. But voter doesn't understand, doesn't bother him - at least it's regular thinking of politicians these days. So they agree to treaty, then just come home and say "we done anything we could, but this must be a law now".

        And? If, by popular demand, the law is amended so that gets incompatible with the signed treaty, you think is impossible for the country to walk back from that treaty? Think again [duhaime.org]

        Another important distinction between a treaty and a conventional contract is that a treaty lacks any enforcement teeth.

        It is not like [wikipedia.org] US never [yahoo.com] broke [huffingtonpost.com] a treaty [wikipedia.org].

        • by Pecisk (688001)

          They can. But there will be consequences. Unfortunately US is one of biggest consumers and no politician in it's right mind would want to piss off it and face problems with exports to US. But exports gives you jobs and allows you to repay debt you took to finance roads, schools, etc.

          It's not that simple.

          • by c0lo (1497653) on Thursday January 24, 2013 @08:45AM (#42679217)

            They can. But there will be consequences. Unfortunately US is one of biggest consumers and no politician in it's right mind would want to piss off it and face problems with exports to US. But exports gives you jobs and allows you to repay debt you took to finance roads, schools, etc.

            It's not that simple.

            Uh, oh. Does it wake you up that US markets makes 4.9% of Finland's export [wikipedia.org]? Comparing with the exports to Russia of 9.2%, Germany of 10% and Sweden to 11.8%, it seems quite low.

            Also, did you know that Finland has less population than New York City? I don't know why I feel all of them will survive quite well to an upset US.

            • by jamstar7 (694492)

              Uh, oh. Does it wake you up that US markets makes 4.9% of Finland's export [wikipedia.org]? Comparing with the exports to Russia of 9.2%, Germany of 10% and Sweden to 11.8%, it seems quite low.

              Also, did you know that Finland has less population than New York City? I don't know why I feel all of them will survive quite well to an upset US.

              Til somebody claims there's oil under Finland, you mean. Course, it'll be like Iraqi WMDs. Just a claim...

              • by c0lo (1497653)

                Uh, oh. Does it wake you up that US markets makes 4.9% of Finland's export [wikipedia.org]? Comparing with the exports to Russia of 9.2%, Germany of 10% and Sweden to 11.8%, it seems quite low.

                Also, did you know that Finland has less population than New York City? I don't know why I feel all of them will survive quite well to an upset US.

                Til somebody claims there's oil under Finland, you mean. Course, it'll be like Iraqi WMDs. Just a claim...

                You suggest the US is stupid enough to go to war for whatever "piracy" may be caused by 5.3 millions people?
                'Cause Finland still exists after Winter War [wikipedia.org]

                The Soviets possessed more than three times as many soldiers as the Finns, thirty times as many aircraft, and a hundred times as many tanks.

        • by mjwalshe (1680392)
          I think the employees of legal poker sites in the UK who got arrested in transit through the US would disagree
    • by Anonymous Coward on Thursday January 24, 2013 @07:50AM (#42678981)

      Actually, I read though the proposal (and signed it). It seems to make a lot of sense, and it's really well thought out.

      If this is even remotely successful then a lot of lobbyists will get their knickers in a twist.

      The chances of this being ratified should be rather slim due to:

      -international treaties

      This isn't some teenage hacktivism, this is actually really well thought out modifications. The changes aren't huge, but still significant. The proposal also takes into account internation treaties and works within their restrictions.

      -legality of the law without having to rewrite other laws

      The suggestion specifically refers to other laws, and how the changes make it more compliant than the current version. They also seem to have touched upon points that have to have modifications.

      -being watered down in parliament ...

      ok, this I just learnt from the comment below, so credit wher credit is due

      As for the watering down, if the proposal (a complete law text) passes the 50,000 vote mark, the Finnish parliament has to vote on it AS IS.

      I would guess a lot of lawyers will work on this thing. So chances are this might be the best written piece of legislation never to be signed.

      the common democratic illness is that we vote for politians based on how well they look in a suit, how loud they shout their simple truths and how long ago they had their last sex scandal. Should be credibility, competence and merit. Oh well.

      I agree that politics can be too populistic, but in general I think it's works quite well here. As for the proposal, I'm very positively suprised at the quality, the moderation and the execution of it.

    • -international treaties -legality of the law without having to rewrite other laws

      Hmm. Care to elaborate why these two should pose a problem?

  • No way in hell (Score:4, Insightful)

    by qbast (1265706) on Thursday January 24, 2013 @07:04AM (#42678817)
    Sure, you can crowdsource and gather signatures all you want - have fun, at least you will feel more in control. All you get is to submit your proposition for parliament to vote on. At which point the same lobbyists and paid politicians as usual make the decision. There is no way in hell this is going to pass.
    • Re: (Score:2, Interesting)

      by Anonymous Coward

      Then we know who to not vote for in the next elections.

      Finland is a small country and change can happen quickly here. Look at our last elections, True Finns became 3rd largest party, putting stop to old parties "good brother" clubs.

    • Re: (Score:2, Insightful)

      by Anonymous Coward

      Yeah, we should just stop making the world a better place, because there's no way in hell that'll ever happen.

      In fact, we should just curl up and die right now.

      • by jamstar7 (694492)

        Yeah, we should just stop making the world a better place, because there's no way in hell that'll ever happen.

        In fact, we should just curl up and die right now.

        Naw. Just do a Snake Plissken [imdb.com] and hit the reset button.

  • There is an citizen's initiative to change the law and if they manage to gather 50000 signatures, the parliament must vote on it. No crowdsourcing (at least any more) and slim change of this initiative passing through the parliament and actually becoming a law.
  • by Anonymous Coward on Thursday January 24, 2013 @07:15AM (#42678859)

    Finnish copyright law has very flexible permissions for private use.

    1) Few copies of legally obtained copyrighted material can be copied for private use
    2) Private use includes family members and best friends.
    3) In court the "few copies" has been seen to be 10 copies
    4) You are allowed to outsource the copying if needed (you can give copyrighted material to third party what copy them for you and give original and all copies back).
    5) Downloading from Internet isn't illegal, it is just admonished, but sharing (uploading) is criminalized.
    6) You can brake the DRM if it is necessary to get music to be heard, video to be seen or text to visible (etc)
    7) You can transform content to another if it is required to get content available. (meaning you can make a copy of DVD as VHS if other has only VHS player. Or transcode WMA to MP3 if only having a MP3 player).
    8) If original media is destroyed, stolen or lost, all copies needs to be destroyed.
    9) You can not make new copies from copies or release them to any other third party (non-family members, not best friends)

    In Finland you are allowed to borrow a CD music from library and make those 10 copies for you, to your family members and best friend. Any of those copies can be a version in MP3 files, a CD or WMA etc, as long the amount is same.
    You can as well buy a latest movie/music from store with your 4 friends, make 3 copies and divide the music price by 4. Meaning 20 euros music is just 5 euros for each of one.
    You can as well rent a movie for few euros and make a copy of that for private use.
    You are allowed to record movies and shows from TV and make few copies of them as well for private use.

    But all this has a cost.
    You need to pay a small tax in every empty CD, DVD, HDD, SSD and now on memory sticks as well. It is about 15 euros from HDD what is bigger than 750GB
    About a 15 cent on empty DVD and about 10 cent on empty CD.
    Every importer is demanded by law to pay that and that is transferred to device/media prices.

    But people are mad about it!
    Many are mad of it because "I pay more about empty media/storage than I should" and many even promote their ideas by saying "I only store my own music and my own photos and videos to those medias". And still most doesn't even understand that spending a few euros a year for that tax, you can make as many copies for private use from legally obtained copyrighted material as you wish.

    Teens usually listen same music with their friends. Instead them needed to buy a own CD (2 x 20 euros) to CD-player and then again MP3 version (2 x 10-15 euros for album) phone/mp3-player, they can together buy just a single CD, make copies of it and transcode music as MP3 files in 20 euros.

    How about lex karpela?
    Lex Karpela was a addition to copyright law what criminalized braking strong DRM. That what was "strong DRM" was not written at all. Later two man went and wanted to test that law in court. Other one made a DVD with a CSS encryption in it. Then borrowed it to friend, what made a copy of that disk by braking the CSS. And then the copyright owned (who borrowed DVD to friend) sued friend to court demanding 5 cent penalties.
    The whole case when to higher court and back, and it was given a judgment criminalizing the friend who broke the encryption because it was not possible "in mistake". The problem was what many doesn't understand, the friend made DVD was not made legally public, it was a personal DVD with DRM.
    The copyright law demands the copyrighted material is published legally. Meaning it is that companies what presents, plays, prints etc media, can not control citizens rights to share information and cultural material.
    But when a private person makes a own media, she or he owns the copyright for it but just by borrowing it to friend, doesn't mean he or she published it. So it isn't legally obtained material in the first place unless you ask permission from your friend "can I make a copy to myself from your made movie what you

    • by Fri13 (963421)

      To add some correction:

      1) Few copies of legally obtained copyrighted material can be copied for private use

      Means getting the material from other sources like a P2P networks, DC hubs and so on, are not from legal sources and they can not be copied, borrowed or given to a other people, not even for your family and friends.

      Of course you can make a own P2P network among your friends or your family and share data with them, as those technologies are not illegal (and copyright law doesn't say they would be) but the actions using those tools illegally is.... illegal. :)

      So as long your source is l

    • by AmiMoJo (196126) *

      5) Downloading from Internet isn't illegal, it is just admonished, but sharing (uploading) is criminalized.

      So Finns should download from Usenet instead of using P2P, or use a hacked BitTorrent client that doesn't upload.

      But all this has a cost.
      You need to pay a small tax in every empty CD, DVD, HDD, SSD and now on memory sticks as well. It is about 15 euros from HDD what is bigger than 750GB
      About a 15 cent on empty DVD and about 10 cent on empty CD.

      How do you get your cut of that? Say you are a random person who picks up a guitar, learns how to play it and releases an album (self published). How do you claim your share of this tax?

      • How do you get your cut of that? Say you are a random person who picks up a guitar, learns how to play it and releases an album (self published). How do you claim your share of this tax?

        You can apply for an exemption [hyvitysmaksu.fi] on the tax for whatever media you decide to publish your work on. This assumes that the media would be used exclusively for works you own, such as CD or DVD, and you'd avoid the few cents of tax on each (at least, on -R media, but obviously not on -RW media).

        If you were to distribute digitally via the net or on pre-recorded memory sticks or suchlike, then you'd have to join one of these organizations [hyvitysmaksu.fi] to get compensated. Note, also, that you'd be unlikely to get very much un

        • by AmiMoJo (196126) *

          So you have to join a private organization to get paid. That is what I always object to about these laws.

    • by shoemilk (1008173)

      But all this has a cost.
      You need to pay a small tax in every empty CD, DVD, HDD, SSD and now on memory sticks as well. It is about 15 euros from HDD what is bigger than 750GB About a 15 cent on empty DVD and about 10 cent on empty CD.

      This is where the law COMPLETELY falls apart. This is absolutely and completely unacceptable. Who decides the breakdown of this collected tax? What about artists not in the golden tax guild, how do they get their share? How do we know it's going to the copyright holders period?

      Damn right people are mad about it. I'd be pissed, too. America had that tax on blank tapes, too. There are special "music" blank cds that are more expensive because they have that tax as well, but in all frankness, fuck them if they

    • While the parent comment is mostly true, it is very much cherry picking the most positive facts about the copyright issues. It also unnecessarily condecending towards "normal people" who don't understand why things cost and what property is. More than that, the parent post is widely irrelevant to the whole copyright reform, almost offtopic. Those were not the issues being modified (except Lex Karpela).

      The points addressed in the proposal were completely different, one of the points in the proposal was even

    • It was a to compensate losses what artists suffered from people sharing their copyrighted material.

      There a problem with this. They cannot prove that artists suffer due to piracy. It has been shown time and again that sharing people's songs among friends promotes the music and increases the chance that they will buy music in future and/or go to concerts.

    • 8) If original media is destroyed, stolen or lost, all copies needs to be destroyed.

      This strikes me as odd. If you make copies as a backup and then have to destroy the backup with the original... well it's not really a backup is it?

  • by Anonymous Coward

    But hopefully some of my likeminded Finnish brethren can see about some sane wording, like no more than 14 year copyrights for corporations, and 28 year copyrights for individuals.

    An additional worthwhile amendment would be: 'While copyrighted works created locally will be considered expired after 14-28 years, foreign copyrights will be respected up to their legally agreed upon terms, insofar as our locally produced copyrighted works are protected to the same foreign copyright limits.'

    Basically allow your l

    • by Fri13 (963421)

      14 years for corporations would be good... As in that time your material is already done its purpose as cultural addition.
      28 for individuals would be good as if you are artist/photographer/song writer etc you need to have little stronger copyright.

      In 14 years a movie can either come a legendary or just "one of the xxs movie"
      A music can come a legendary what is played after decade it was released and still you get paid for it.
      But why should anyone being paid from something what their parents did and get mone

      • by c0lo (1497653)

        ps. Of course open source needs very strong copyright protection so it can not be turn to closed source.

        No, it does not need more copyright protection then any other creation. If a software doesn't evolve for 7 years, do you think that software worth much? And, if does evolve, you think a 7 years old version entering public domain (and being included in a closed source software) is something to be scared of?

      • Simply add the requirement that the source code of any program has to be made available to the public if you want the program to be covered by copyright.

  • The content mafia will be astroturfing the crowd to the max that they can get away with... they have the software to enable their shills to appear as hundreds of other "citizens". So unless there are identity safeguards to positively identify each contributor as a registered citizen, they'll get the legislation they've always dreamed about...
  • by Stolpskott (2422670) on Thursday January 24, 2013 @07:59AM (#42679017)

    6/7 years ago, the Finnish parliament voted in the current "pussi paskaa" copyright law. Now, assuming that more than 1% of the population adds their names to a poll in favour of that law being amended (probably a racing certainty), the Finnish parliament has to vote yes/no on the question "did we make a huge mistake here?".

    Given that Finland is part of the Euro currency group within the EU, there will probably be significant pressure from political groups within the EU that are backed by the European copyright lobby, as well as significant pressure generated by the RIAA/MPAA. There will also be pressure domestically from the Finnish copyright lobby, which was powerful enough to get the law passed in the first place.

    So unless the number of people signing up for a review of the law exceeds 50% (probably not even then... 75% or even 90% might be needed) of the population of Finland, I doubt there is much chance of a vote on the subject gaining the required parliamentary support to overturn or amend the law.

    • by wvmarle (1070040)

      Not this parliament maybe, but how about the next parliament? After this vote you know which MP or party you should vote for next time. And put this same (or updated) bill up for public poll and subsequent parliamentary vote again.

  • by Anonymous Coward

    Crowd-sourcing political change is a complete waste of time as currently constructed. Instead, a 'kickstarter'-like approach is required, where citizen promise a certain level of financial bribe if a law is passed/modified.

    Modern 'democracies' (which are anything but), based on the British model, reflect only the wishes of powerful pressure groups- groups that actually represent tiny minorities, but minorities that are willing to put money directly into the pockets of bent politicians. And most politicians

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