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PayPal Freezes the Assets of Wikileaks.org 403

Posted by kdawson
from the thought-money-was-speech dept.
matsh sends word that PayPal has frozen the assets of wikileaks.org. From their Web site: "Paypal has as of 23rd of January 2010 frozen WikiLeaks assets. This is the second time that this happens. The last time we struggled for more than half a year to resolve this issue. By working with the respected and recognized German foundation Wau Holland Stiftung we tried to avoid this from happening again — apparently without avail." The submitter adds: "Hopefully we can pressure PayPal to resolve this quickly, since this seems like a dangerous political decision."
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PayPal Freezes the Assets of Wikileaks.org

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  • Unsurprising (Score:5, Insightful)

    by LightPhoenix7 (1070028) on Saturday January 23, 2010 @05:44PM (#30872798)
    This has been going on for many years, with many different groups. Until people stop using Paypal, or some sort of oversight or audit is performed, it will continue to happen. Mayhap Wikileaks should try and dig up information on Paypal.
    • Re:Unsurprising (Score:5, Insightful)

      by rolfwind (528248) on Saturday January 23, 2010 @06:01PM (#30872944)

      Until people stop using Paypal, or some sort of oversight or audit is performed, it will continue to happen.

      The Government has to step up and declare Paypal a bank. Banks can't take or freeze your money simply because they don't like what you do (which Paypal often does) - only the government can do that if you are in breach of laws.

      Now that the Government found their balls to stand up to China for once, maybe it can do the same with corporations.

      • Re:Unsurprising (Score:5, Insightful)

        by drinkypoo (153816) <martin.espinoza@gmail.com> on Saturday January 23, 2010 @06:05PM (#30872974) Homepage Journal

        Now that the Government found their balls to stand up to China for once, maybe it can do the same with corporations.

        Fail, fail. The government is standing up to China on behalf of a corporation. If our government actually believed in human rights, we wouldn't favor trade with China above all other nations.

        • by Anonymous Coward on Saturday January 23, 2010 @06:21PM (#30873094)

          Fail, fail. The government is standing up to China on behalf of a corporation. If our government actually believed in human rights, we wouldn't favor trade with China above all other nations.

          Why treat China differently than our own country? The Supreme Court just ruled that only corporations have rights.

          Oh, sorry, I jumped ahead. That's the next week's chapter of America's March Back to Plutocracy.

        • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

          by Gerzel (240421) *

          Our government does believe in human rights. It is just that Corporations are more human than any individual citizen.

          • Re:Unsurprising (Score:5, Interesting)

            by ehrichweiss (706417) * on Saturday January 23, 2010 @10:00PM (#30874636)
            Here's a thought for everyone: Corporations were demanding the same rights as individuals, right? How about we demand they have the same *repsonsibilities* as individuals, like being jailed for your crimes. I mean if the corps really want to move in that direction then let's give them enough rope to hang themselves. We've had to live with their laws so perhaps they're asking for this as well.
            • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

              I'm a complete free marketer and I agree 100%. There's nothing free market about special corporate legal protections.

        • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

          by Darkness404 (1287218)
          Trade and wealth are essential for preserving peace which is needed to transition to a more free government without massive loss of life.
          • Re:Unsurprising (Score:4, Insightful)

            by publiclurker (952615) on Saturday January 23, 2010 @07:19PM (#30873580)
            I take it that's the current bullet point explanation that is used to prevent you from having to say "It's cheaper over there and we don't have to give a damn who gets hurt because of it"?
          • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

            What koolaid did you drink?

            The only reason the U.S. is so in bed with China is that the Chinese own a large portion of the U.S. debt. Congress over spends by huge margins and then sells the loans to China, who then threatens to call it in if they don't get favorable trade deals.

            It's a brilliant plan, interest on the money, control in government and every manufacturing contract and associated I.P. the U.S. has.

      • Re:Unsurprising (Score:5, Insightful)

        by ArsenneLupin (766289) on Saturday January 23, 2010 @06:12PM (#30873038)

        Banks can't take or freeze your money simply because they don't like what you do (which Paypal often does)

        It's actually worse than that... they can take and freeze your money because they don't like what one of your business partners does...

        Now that the Government found their balls to stand up to China for once, maybe it can do the same with corporations.

        It's not the government that found a new pair, but Google!

        • Re:Unsurprising (Score:5, Insightful)

          by Minwee (522556) <dcr@neverwhen.org> on Saturday January 23, 2010 @06:28PM (#30873152) Homepage

          It's actually worse than that... they can take and freeze your money because they don't like what one of your business partners does...

          I think you're being overly generous. PayPal can take and freeze your money because they feel like it.

          • Re:Unsurprising (Score:5, Informative)

            by no-body (127863) on Saturday January 23, 2010 @07:35PM (#30873700)

            > "they feel like it"

            Most of it is automated. They are running risk rules on transactions and if one hits a score, the account is frozen - they call it "limited".

            Can be anything - they sure won't publish their algorithms.

            And:

            Prohibited Activities

            You may not use the PayPal service for activities that:

            violate any law, statute, ORDINANCE or REGULATION

            (emphasis mine)

            • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

              by rolfwind (528248)

              You may not use the PayPal service for activities that:

              violate any law, statute, ORDINANCE or REGULATION

              Yeah, I have a paypal account. Another rule is that you may not use it for any item that is prohibited by ebay because it's an ebay company - even if it's perfectly legal and the transaction outside ebay.

              I didn't sell such an item, but someone I did some small transaction with told Paypal that the item he recieved was against ebay regulations. My account was frozen, eventually the money from that transa

        • Re:Unsurprising (Score:5, Insightful)

          by Anonymous Coward on Saturday January 23, 2010 @06:30PM (#30873166)

          It's actually worse than that... they (banks) can take and freeze your money because they don't like what one of your business partners does...

          Or they can simply hold the country's economy for ransom, take your money by government payout, issue themselves enormous bonuses, lend nothing and tell you to go fuck yourselves.

          At least the French knew when it was time for revolution.

        • Re:Unsurprising (Score:5, Informative)

          by houstonbofh (602064) on Saturday January 23, 2010 @06:36PM (#30873216)

          Banks can't take or freeze your money simply because they don't like what you do (which Paypal often does)

          It's actually worse than that... they can take and freeze your money because they don't like what one of your business partners does...

          They can screw you for just about anything, and have. http://www.paypalsucks.com/ [paypalsucks.com] Old news, but for some reason, no one knows.

      • Re: (Score:3, Interesting)

        paypal is a bank in europe

      • Re:Unsurprising (Score:5, Interesting)

        by MindlessAutomata (1282944) on Saturday January 23, 2010 @11:04PM (#30875070)

        Who the fuck do you think hates wikileaks the most? The fucking government. People, quit relying on your goddamn governments to save the world and realize they are run by men, not angels.

    • Re:Unsurprising (Score:5, Interesting)

      by Anonymous Coward on Saturday January 23, 2010 @06:03PM (#30872966)

      Interestingly this is only a problem in US and western countries. Russia and Eastern Bloc almost fully uses WebMoney [wmtransfer.com]. There is no problems with locking accounts, transactions fees are really low and you can pay your phone, internet or tv bill with it (along with countless of other services). Cards to put money in to account are sold in every kiosk. Security is better too, if you require they send you one-time auth sms or you can have keyfiles to login.

      Paypal is shit.

      • Re:Unsurprising (Score:5, Insightful)

        by GaryOlson (737642) <slashdot@ g a r y olson.org> on Saturday January 23, 2010 @07:12PM (#30873536) Journal
        Although this may be interesting, a little financial homework is required.
        wmtransfer.com domain is registered by SMP Bank, Moscow. From Moody's bank rating service, [smpbank.com]

        ...SMP Bank's currently limited franchise (which is in Moody's view to a substantial extent reliant on the bank's shareholders), high credit risk concentrations, low diversification of the bank's funding base and potentially volatile profitability

        . [google.com]

        AS “SMP Bank” (until 17 June 2008 AS “Multibanka” – the Bank) was incorporated in the Republic of Latvia as a joint stock company “Multibanka” in 1994, in Riga and is licensed as a bank offering a wide range of financial services to enterprises and individuals. The address of the Bank’s registered office is Elizabetes iela 57, Riga, Latvia. The Bank has a branch in Liepaja and 12 offices in Riga, an office in Ventspils and Olaine, two offices in Daugavpils and representative offices in Moscow

        Once you read the financial statement, disbursement of profits, and this web of bank ownership, do you really want to use wmtranser.com?

    • by houstonbofh (602064) on Saturday January 23, 2010 @06:38PM (#30873238)
      Still amazed that no one at wikileaks has seen http://www.paypalsucks.com/ [paypalsucks.com] yet. No way I would trust paypal with anything, ever.
      • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

        by dgatwood (11270)

        Agreed. Having been the buyer in a transaction that PayPal froze (which was only resolved quickly because one of the other people who was getting screwed knew one of their VPs), I can't imagine why any nonprofit organization trusts them as far as they can throw them. There are plenty of real credit card processors that don't act like thugs. I would urge Wikileaks to pick one and terminate their relationship with PayPal ASAP.

    • Re:Unsurprising (Score:4, Insightful)

      by PopeRatzo (965947) * on Saturday January 23, 2010 @06:46PM (#30873316) Homepage Journal

      Until people stop using Paypal

      Absolutely right. I keep cash on paypal in order to make purchases online. I will withdraw all of it immediately and let them know that their freezing wikileaks' assets is the reason.

      It probably won't make a difference to them, but it makes a difference to me.

      Paypal is poison.

      They need to unfreeze wikileaks' account right now.

      If corporations are going to play in politics, then it's got to be up to us to show them the consequences.

    • Re:Unsurprising (Score:4, Insightful)

      by Dan541 (1032000) on Saturday January 23, 2010 @08:12PM (#30873960) Homepage

      The article is a twitter post.

      Why is this even on /.? Is twitter considered a credible source?

    • Re: (Score:3, Interesting)

      by MikeFM (12491)
      I stopped using PayPal when they froze thousands of dollars of my assets and started giving away refunds to customers for which I provided valid tracking numbers proving their orders had been delivered. They put me out of business. They made it so it was a nightmare trying to prove they were screwing me because they controlled the records. They started freezing the accounts of my friends and family or anyone they had any reason knew me. Now after several years they have the nerve to send me a bill saying I
  • Burnt twice? (Score:4, Insightful)

    by MichaelSmith (789609) on Saturday January 23, 2010 @05:44PM (#30872804) Homepage Journal

    TFA (such as it is, < 140 chars):

    The SCUMBAGS at PayPal have frozen the assets of http://www.wikileaks.org/ [wikileaks.org] ! I'll withdraw all my money from PayPal as soon as I can!

    So don't deal with the scumbags at PayPal. I suppose they have it for taking donations. Maybe they should have a second bank account.

    • Re:Burnt twice? (Score:4, Insightful)

      by Entropy98 (1340659) on Saturday January 23, 2010 @05:55PM (#30872876) Homepage

      Unfortunately Paypal is really the only option for a lot of smaller sites for whom a merchant account is too much hassle and expense.

      • Re:Burnt twice? (Score:5, Informative)

        by houstonbofh (602064) on Saturday January 23, 2010 @06:41PM (#30873272)

        Unfortunately Paypal is really the only option for a lot of smaller sites for whom a merchant account is too much hassle and expense.

        Uh... No... http://www.screw-paypal.com/alternatives/alternatives.html [screw-paypal.com] Also, having your account frozen and cash pulled from you bank is a bit of a hassle too. http://www.paypalsucks.com/ [paypalsucks.com] Never trust PayPal.

        • Re:Burnt twice? (Score:5, Informative)

          by Entropy98 (1340659) on Saturday January 23, 2010 @07:14PM (#30873540) Homepage

          Have you actually tried any of those? Do you do any sort of serious business online?

          I've tried a few of those and they all have serious limitations.

          From the very article you linked: "No one service can match PayPal alone -- but all of these services exceed PayPal in the customer relations department. With skillful use of two or more of these services, buying and selling on eBay without PayPal is NO problem."

          With skillful use of two or more? The more difficult you make it for your customers to order from you the less money your going to make.

          From the list you linked to:

          Allpay.net -- Recommended for U.K. Only
          BidPay.com -- Out Of Business 2 Years
          CertaPay -- Recommended for CANADA Only
          Checkfree -- NOT RECOMMENDED
          HyperWALLET -- NOT RECOMMENDED
          Moneybookers -- Recommended for ALL
          Nochex -- Recommended for U.K. Residents and Certain Others
          Ozpay.biz -- Out Of Business 3+ Years
          Paymate -- Recommended for Australia & New Zealand
          ProPay -- Recommended for U.S. Sellers
          Xoom -- NOT RECOMMENDED

          So out of that entire list there are only 2 that will let a US seller sell worldwide and are not listed as "Not Recommended". Moneybrokers and Propay.

          I sell software on the internet and I've looked for alternatives to Paypal after having my account frozen.

          Moneybrokers wanted some proof or license or something (I don't remember exactly this was years ago) to show that I had the right to sell my software. After a few less than helpful email exchanges I gave up on them.

          Paypro, from their website, says you have to pay $60 a year to be able to accept all credit cards and you can only receive $3000 a month. This can be increased with a review of your credit and merchant history (if you have any). You can only accept Visa and $1000 a month with their regular plan.

          I guarantee you if you get enough problem transactions any merchant is going to freeze your account and hold your funds for a few months to make sure they don't get screwed.

          • Re: (Score:3, Interesting)

            by bloodhawk (813939)
            Very few people, especially smaller sites actually require all the features of paypal, pick one of them that has the features you need and go with it, they are pretty much all better than paypal (with the exception of paymate, not sure why they would be listed there as if anything they are worse than paypal).
          • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

            by haruharaharu (443975)
            Hmm, what about amazon's checkout service? They seem a bit more trustworthy than paypal, but they'd have to be criminal to be less so.
          • Re:Burnt twice? (Score:4, Interesting)

            by NatasRevol (731260) on Saturday January 23, 2010 @10:17PM (#30874718) Journal
            How about Google freaking Checkout???
          • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

            by the_womble (580291)

            As I mentioned in another comment, Moneybookers no longer allows anyone outside the US to sell to the US.

            Also, WTF is with the comment on Xoom. First they say the fees are too high (are they still that high, I thought not.) The comes:

            On the other side a huge list of shady countries like Bangladesh, the Dominican Republic, Jamaica and Sri Lanka.

            Shady countries? Why? I find that very offensive.

            Essentially they think that the service is used by people working in developed countries to send money to families on

  • Is it too much to hope that this will bring Pay Pal to the attention of the US Government and finally get PayPal regulated as the bank it clearly is?
    • by MickyTheIdiot (1032226) on Saturday January 23, 2010 @05:50PM (#30872850) Homepage Journal

      Yes. It is too much. As of Thursday [is.gd] our government is owned by the huge corporations. No one there is going to care if individuals are treated correctly or even if corps follow through their contracts.

  • Paypal is just a horrendous disaster area. Just please DO NOT use paypal, either as merchant, or as purchaser. If a service only supports payments by paypal, just tell them that your sorry but you will not buy their service.

  • More info, please (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Dorsai65 (804760) <dkmerriman@@@gmail...com> on Saturday January 23, 2010 @05:48PM (#30872830) Homepage Journal
    Why is PayPal freezing the account? What happened the first time, and what agreement was reached to thaw the account?
    • +1. I really think the editors jumped the gun putting this through. Most worthwhile stories get submitted to the fire-hose multiple times, so why not wait for a submission that actually gives a bit of background, rather than just linking to a twitter post that was obviously written in the heat of the moment?

      In addition to your questions, I'd like to know what PayPal has told them, if anything. It's all well and good to scream, "censorship!", but if this is just a bureaucracy stuff up, then this is not rea

    • Re: (Score:3, Interesting)

      by LoverOfJoy (820058)
      I don't have the answer to your question, but this site [hostingprod.com] suggests their problems may be from not jumping through proper hoops to prove it is a non-profit.

      PayPal usually suspends non-profit organisations, because PayPal have to comply with local taxation laws involving the tax exempt status of such organisations, and with the world wide anti-money laundering red tape and bureaucracy.

      You end up having to send them details of your charitable status, or, failing that, proof that you have a bank account in the

  • by ravenspear (756059) on Saturday January 23, 2010 @05:48PM (#30872836)
    If your organization used Paypal and they froze your assets once, and you "struggled for more than half a year" to resolve it, why the fuck would you STILL be using Paypal?
  • Unacceptable (Score:5, Interesting)

    by s-whs (959229) on Saturday January 23, 2010 @05:48PM (#30872840)

    Paypal's behavious is unacceptable in many ways and it happens to many people.

    The most annoying thing is when you couple it to ebay, and anoying buyers file a not-received or not-as-described claim when it's clear they couldn't have received it yet, or you told them it was delayed because you were, say ill. As has happened with me.

    The bad thing is that this partly or wholly freezes your business section that depends on that. Unacceptable.

    Paypal and Ebay were once pretty good, the former because payments via bank transfer for small amounts internatioanlly were so expensive, but all that is gone now and the fees for large sums are also far too high...

    I suggest everyone use bank tranfers in EURO countries. IBAN/BIC payments are free if done with shared-cost.

  • by Anonymous Coward on Saturday January 23, 2010 @05:49PM (#30872848)

    I doubt this is political. Paypal is notorious for freezing accounts based on some internal drone's mistake or a some programmed tripwire. There are countless horror stories about this: http://www.paypalwarning.com/ http://www.paypalsucks.com/frozen-accounts.shtml When you outsource all your employees and pay them 5 cents an hour or whatever slave wage they pay foreign workers, you get what you pay for.

    If it is political, then Paypal, as an organization is of unfathomable stupidity.

  • it's not like there is no alternative to pay pal. Just use something else.
  • by Anonymous Coward on Saturday January 23, 2010 @05:51PM (#30872856)

    Paypal has a long history of doing this sort of thing to people.

    In addition to that, they have a history of requiring personal information from people (due in large part to US law)

    I believe it's time for an alternate, non-US based payment processor to take the place of paypal, the problem is there are so many to choose from. I like pecunix for their security (and the fact they aren't US based.. and use a market-maker approach, which helps to create competition in the exchange rates)

    But what about others? how come we're held hostage to paypal when other systems exist?

    • Re: (Score:3, Funny)

      by thestudio_bob (894258)

      I believe it's time for an alternate, non-US based payment processor to take the place of paypal

      I agree, I have a very rich uncle in Nigeria that has a large sum of money and we need a bank account to get this up and running. If you don't mind posting you full name, DOB, SSN and bank account info then we will get started right away.

      We'll gladly pay you $40,000,000US for the inconvenience and helping us out!!

  • by Anonymous Coward on Saturday January 23, 2010 @06:00PM (#30872928)

    It seems that there is a image from "alainfishing" on wikileaks main page. Read this interesting article about this:

    https://p10.secure.hostingprod.com/@spyblog.org.uk/ssl/wikileak/2010/01/paypal-suspends-donations-to-wikileaksorg-who-then-web-bug-their-own-website.html

  • Why? (Score:3, Insightful)

    by pitterpatter (1397479) on Saturday January 23, 2010 @06:03PM (#30872958) Journal

    I'd like to see some indication of what prompted Paypal to do this. Not that it would make a lot of difference, but "because we could" would lead to a different attitude on my part than "because they were a source of malware that kept making unauthorized deposits into their account."

    Not that I think either of those is likely to be their public explanation.

  • by knarf (34928) on Saturday January 23, 2010 @06:11PM (#30873028) Homepage

    ...is to empty the account every day. There is no sense in keeping any amount of money within their graps as they have shown time and time again they will freeze access without real cause or warning.

    I was part of the collective to buy i-Opener [wikipedia.org] machines from the failed Netpliance company. We used Paypal to collect fund from participants as that seemed to be the best way at the moment... How wrong we were... Paypal froze access to the account once it had accumulated enough money for them to be profitable to draw interest from. Of course they did NOT block payment into the account, just access to the funds. They had no real reason to freeze the account and ignored their own rules in both freezing and unblocking the account. They just sat on the money for a month or two, drawing interest from it. When they finally unblocked the account - again without giving any reason whatsoever - the deal with Netpliance had almost bounced.

    Paypal is not a bank. Don't treat it as a bank. Don't entrust them with your money. Don't give them access to a debit account, only to a credit card.

    Paypal, in short, can not be trusted. Use it at your own peril, only use credit cards so you can reverse the transaction. Never ever accumulate any real amount of money on a Paypal account.

    • Re: (Score:3, Informative)

      by houstonbofh (602064)

      ...is to empty the account every day. There is no sense in keeping any amount of money within their graps as they have shown time and time again they will freeze access without real cause or warning.

      Also, clean out your bank account. They have the right to go in and take money back out of your bank account. In some cases they can even overdraft you, so make sure you do not have overdraft "protection."

      Or just don't use the cheating bastards.

      • Re: (Score:3, Insightful)

        by WarlockD (623872)

        Banks CANNOT Freeze your assets for no reason! [lawyers.com]

        Stop trolling. I have been hit when they released debit cards for the first time. Getting a -$200 balance for just a few under $5 purchase made me scream, but it was clearly listed in the fine print and the "fees and schedule's" document. I keep track now and haven't had an overdraft since.

        As long as you have a balance in the bank you have the right to go to that bank and take out all the money and close the account. Unless a COURT ORDER was obtained to free

  • Don't use PayPal (Score:5, Insightful)

    by v(*_*)vvvv (233078) on Saturday January 23, 2010 @06:20PM (#30873086)

    This is really the fault of the person who decided to keep their assets in a PayPal account. And this isn't the first time? Well, they just don't learn do they.

    PayPal can freeze accounts for any number of reasons, of which very few have to do with the owner of the account. If someone pays you with a stolen card or from an account that is suspected to have been compromised, that can trigger a freeze. Their support is notoriously bad, and their instructions for re-enabling your account are always overcomplicated.

    Let this be a lesson to anyone who receives money with PayPal.

    Money received => withdraw immediately

    NEVER HOLD A PAYPAL BALANCE.

    Always be ready to redirect payments to a backup account.

    • by clintp (5169) on Saturday January 23, 2010 @06:49PM (#30873356)

      Too bad it's +5, this should be +6 Insightful.

      Treat PayPal like the liquor store down the street that sells money orders and does Western Union wires. Sometimes they're a necessary evil to get money from point A to B. But you sure as hell don't keep your retirement money and the cash assets of your business in the store's cash register.

  • by Eric Freyhart (752088) on Saturday January 23, 2010 @07:19PM (#30873582) Journal
    My horror story with Paypal starts many years ago. I had a personal account with them since something like the late 90s, and never once had an issue with them. That was before I went into business for myself, and converted the account over to a business account around the year 2000. What a mistake.

    Now, let me just state the following:

    - We sold books, novels, and prints.
    - We sold works that were NOT adult.
    - We sold works that we clearly had the copyright on.
    - We were an independant publisher.

    I learned oneday that the account had been closed due to a violation of the Acceptable Use Policy. Well, we were in the business of self publishing, things like science fiction novels and fantasy books. We sold online through our own website and through Amazon.com. I contacted Paypal and got a nice lady on the phone who went over our online web site with me on the phone and could not find what would have been a violation. So the account was re-activated...

    Oh, then a few months later same thing. Account closed. This time with this message...

    In accordance with PayPal's User Agreement and Acceptable Use Policy, we have closed your account. Your funds may be held for 180 days from the date of your last transaction. After 180 days, you will be able to access your funds by requesting an online bank transfer or, if applicable, a check from PayPal. Please update your address or bank information as we cannot be held responsible for checks issued to an incorrect address. We do ask that you please remove reference(s) to PayPal from your site.

    I tried for over a month to get the account back in good standing, but was constantly told that the decision was final and there was nothing I could do. We sold everything on our main website through Amazon.com also (who never had any issue with the books we printed), and they also accepted Paypal as a payment method. Still to this day I have not been told a reason, nor given any information on why this action was taken. We simply gave up on Paypal and converted the site over to a real merchant account.

    3 years ago I sold the company and the assets to another publishing firm. I started a new enterprise under a new LLC and opened a Paypal account again. No problems, no issues. Oh, I must have been an idiot to think Paypal was not going to do it to me again...

    Well, my new account is now closed. It seems that Paypal has not blocked the company from using the account, but they did blacklist me. As soon as we went in to convert the account over to a business account I entered my SSN and wham! Account closed due to the original violation from over 3 years ago.

    Now, I was under the assumption in the United Stated that you could not blacklist a person from your business unless there was a dam good legal reason. And why won't they tell me what in the world I did to violate their user agreement? Its like being tried, convicted, and sentenced without as much as a ray of hope to prove your not guilty.

    I had a service rep fom Paypal (a manager) go over our new website (we sell clothing) and could not find a single thing that could possible violate any policies from Paypal, nor could he find any reason for this decision. But it is final, and over with.

    To make a long story short, I am now blacklisted from ever using Paypal again. No reason, no explanation, no way of proving that I am not guilty, and no way to do anything about it. It has been, to this day, the most horrible experience I have ever gone through. I kept getting the impression from Paypal that I was some sort of pornographer. I feel ashamed and tarnished by this decision, and will have to deal with it for the rest of my life.

    I personally recommend to anyone who asks me to stay away from Paypal. NEVER use this company, as you have NO protection under law from any harm they cause you or your company.

    Get a real merchant account. With a merchant account you deal directly with the credit card companies and
  • by vanyel (28049) * on Saturday January 23, 2010 @07:23PM (#30873610) Journal

    ...especially if they've had the problem before! Although I've been using Paypal for over 15 years with no problems at all, I still don't let the balance there get too high for exactly this reason.

  • by omb (759389) on Saturday January 23, 2010 @07:44PM (#30873776)
    In Europe, at least, Ebay is a Swiss AG, headquartered in Bern, Switzerland

    Helvetiastrasse 15, CH-3005 Bern, Switzerland, Telephone 00 41 31 359 06 59

    and they are, of course, the Beneficial owners of PayPal.

    both of which, used to be a Luxembourg SARL, Luxembourg allows bearer shares.

    Under the Swiss-EU accords, judgements obtained under EU law, in member countries,
    are enforcible in Switzerland and thus in Kanton Bern. You can assume they speak
    EN DE FR IT, but if you want to give legal notice do it in one of the Swiss official
    languages ie DE FR IT

    Thus I suggest you write to the Geshaftsleiter (Ebay|PayPal) at the above address.
  • by linuxtelephony (141049) on Saturday January 23, 2010 @07:50PM (#30873822) Homepage

    Depending on whether or not square [squareup.com] allows its service to be used by websites in addition to the physical swipe of the card, then Square could be going right for PayPal's jugular. Of course there are other variables too - sign up process, fees, etc.

  • by Arancaytar (966377) <arancaytar.ilyaran@gmail.com> on Saturday January 23, 2010 @07:55PM (#30873854) Homepage

    Here's their response to my question:

    Hi,

    we are sure that we will get to the money at some point in time. Direct banking transfers generally are much better for us, as that prevents this issue from happening. If you can reverse it, and want to transfer directly, its fine by us. But cant say how much of a hassel that is.

    Thanks for the support and the solidarity!

    WikiLeaks

    On Sat, Jan 23, 2010 at 11:46:47PM +0000, Arancaytar wrote:
    > > Hello,
    > >
    > > I donated to you via Wau-Holland (using Paypal) on Jan 19. Should I
    > > attempt to reverse this payment in order to make a bank transfer
    > > directly (and is there any chance of that working)?
    > >
    > > Regards,
    > >
    > > --
    > > Arancaytar

  • by jonfr (888673) on Saturday January 23, 2010 @08:57PM (#30874242) Homepage

    PayPal should and needs to be put on oversight from a bank regulator. What it does cannot be left un-regulated as it is today. Abuse of this of part of PayPal is all too common. Use google to find more examples.

    GoogleCash also needs to follow under the same rules as PayPal. However I am yet to hear of this type of case from GoogleCash as I do with Paypal.

    • GoogleCash also needs to follow under the same rules as PayPal. However I am yet to hear of this type of case from GoogleCash as I do with Paypal.

      All valid points, but I just wanted to quickly add that Googlecash is not affiliated with Google. Seems scammy to me.

      -FL

  • by barfy (256323) on Saturday January 23, 2010 @09:12PM (#30874354)

    Paypal and any other donation service needs to be used as a conduit only. Only enough money needs to be kept in the conduit to keep it active.

    All other moneys are swept daily. And placed in normal operations, excess moneys need to be dealt with in order to help defeat single bank actions. Preferably under whatever shells you need..

    If you are at all political, multiple conduits need to have already been investigated, and ready to be set-up in a single days notice.

    Merchant accounts are NOT that expensive.

    They are in talks to change the laws in Iceland. Surely they have somebody bright enough to come up with a way not to get fucked over by paypal again. They should simply not have access to enough cash to take you down.

    SHAME!

  • I considered supported Wikileaks - until they pulled their "we have money to operate, but we're shutting down until we get more" stunt. They don't get another dime from me, as they've proved they can't be trusted.

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