Heart Monitors In Middle School Gym Class? 950
An anonymous reader writes "My son brought home an order form from his middle school. Apparently the 7th (his grade) and 8th graders are being asked (required?) to purchase their own straps for the heart monitors they're to wear during gym class. I know nothing yet of the device in question, but have left a voice-mail with the assistant principal asking him to call me so I may ask some questions about the program and the device. My tinfoil-hat concern is that the heart rate data will be tied to each child, then archived and eventually used for/against them down the road when applying for insurance, high-stress jobs, etc. 'I see you had arrhythmia during 7th grade pickle ball? No insurance for you' Has anyone heard of such a program, or had their child(ren) take part in it? Does the device transmit to the laptop the overweight gym teacher will be watching instead of running laps with the kids? Perhaps data is downloaded from the device after the class? Or am I just being paranoid? Thanks for any insight."
Well (Score:3, Informative)
Heart Rate testing in middle school... (Score:4, Informative)
Re:You're just being paranoid (Score:5, Informative)
Re:Paranoid (Score:5, Informative)
If only this is what a capability of the heart rate, it could make sense. You are thinking something like an EKG/EEG. A heart rate monitor that they are most likely referring to would be something like one sold by http://www.polarusa.com/us-en/ [polarusa.com] where the basic model just tells you your current heart rate. Nothing about detecting rhythm, etc. Its just how many beats/minute your heart is pumping.
Re:You're just being paranoid (Score:2, Informative)
HIPAA only covers medical practitioners, insurance companies, and the like.
http://www.privacyrights.org/fs/fs8a-hipaa.htm#3 [privacyrights.org]
A little lower indicates that school nurses visits explicitly don't count.
According to the Supreme Court, FERPA doesn't allow individuals to sue.
[privacyrights.org]http://www.privacyrights.org/fs/fs29-education.htm [privacyrights.org]
Ask the teacher (Score:2, Informative)
Why not ask the teacher what it's being used for? I can think of a couple of things.
Just find out what they are using it for. If you are really paranoid, get the principal to sign some slip saying that can only use it for those purposes.
Not everything has to be sinister. This doesn't seem like any real invasion of privacy. Would you be worried if the kids were running on fancy treadmills that already do this anyway?
Knowing your heart rate can be an important thing in exercising.
Re:Holy shit? (Score:5, Informative)
US health insurance is KILLING US competitiveness abroad(not to mention the insanely top-heavy structure of US businesses, but thats another conversation). The sheer amount of cost(both for the insurance and the staff to administer it) about nullifies the cost advantages US workers have over European workers(who have higher taxes associated with them, but no health insurance), and makes Canadian workers look extremely attractive(health insurance is covered, but unlike Europeans they can actually be fired without spending massive amounts of time and money filling out pointless paperwork to get rid of a paperweight).
Re:Paranoid (Score:3, Informative)
It's the kind of thing that will help identify that baseball and kickball aren't good workouts while basketball, soccer, and field hockey are.
Seth
Re:Holy shit? (Score:5, Informative)
I'm betting it's not even that and it's just a heart rate monitor to improve the quality of aerobic exercise. Sounds like a pretty good program to me; if kids are going to not do physical activities willingly and do the bare minimum in gym class, monitoring heart rate might be a necessary evil to ensure they get enough exercise.
I use a HRM all the time while running or biking. Its a good way to give you feedback on your exertion level, and will allow the kids to learn more about max heart rate, threshold level etc. I would want my own band also, rather than some sopping wet band from the previous gym class. Unless they spring for the higher end moniors, the data is not downloadable and is not in any fashion similar to an EKG that would be able to determine an arrythmia.
Paranoia on your part? (Score:3, Informative)
Heart rate monitors cannot detect heart defects. They're simple pieces of athletic equipment that are used to get good aerobic exercise. I think it's great that PE is introducing kids to the concept.
One of the signs of paranoia is a tendency to spin fanciful tales off the slimmest of evidence...it's not to look up what these things are if you're not familiar.
Its ok, relax (Score:3, Informative)
I appreciate your concern, but honestly it's nothing to be worried about, millions of people around the world use heart rate monitors without any issue. I actually have to give kudos to your kids' school as well. Learning about proper anerobic/aerobic zones is pretty important when it comes to exercise. Further, be glad they're having your child purchase the strap, as opposed to using someone else's which could lead to ringworm, and a bunch of other gross fungal problems.
Mod Parent Up! (Score:1, Informative)
Re:Holy shit? (Score:5, Informative)
It isn't monitoring their health status, it is monitoring their excertion level. The purpose of gym class is and always has been to keep kids active by forcing all students into activity and by teaching them about those activities (in the hope that they continue them later in life). That has been and should be the purpose. Teaching kids about maintaining heartrate and the proper level of excertion is 100% in line with those goals.
Re:Holy shit? (Score:3, Informative)
I worked at an alternative school where one of our students DID have a peanut allergy -- severe enough where just smelling peanuts from someone who walked by eating a PB&J was enough to set off an allergic reaction.
While we didn't outright ban peanut butter and jelly sandwiches, there was a fairly large portion of the campus designated as a 'peanut-free zone'. But this was at a school that had a large amount of parent involvement (and thus parents supervising their own kids.) I can certainly imagine a regular public school banning PB&J sandwiches to avoid causing a reaction if someone with extreme peanut allergies was in attendance.
Re:Holy shit? (Score:5, Informative)
I'm betting it's not even that and it's just a heart rate monitor to improve the quality of aerobic exercise. I concur.
I worked as a technical writer for a place that made HRMs. We sold to pro athletes, gyms, personal trainers, Navy seals, fitness enthusiasts of every stripe... we even had a version of the product made especially for training race horses. It was pretty cool.
I was surprised at what a difference using one of those things made in my *own* ability to exercise. I'm an overweight writing nerd, but man: there's nothing like beeping, booping technology to get my interest. Using an HRM is like keeping score on a video game. Or playing the tomagotchi game with your body as the avatar. Or something.
Something fun and trackable, anyway.
The HRM went a long way toward getting me off my butt and dropping pounds because it provided metrics and feedback that I could understand and affect. That's more than my "hustle! hustle! hustle!" school coach ever managed to do.
All this being said: I doubt that the information on your kid is going to be recorded for more than 9 weeks, honestly. There are, like, serious LAWS about that information getting off campus, too. Anybody who is into selling kids' info to Nefarious Businesses Incorporated is going to have access to a lot more dirt than just a weird blip on your child's HRM.
That HRM, by the way, is certainly *not* medically diagnostic in quality. I'd be surprised if it did more than note the heart rate at 1 second intervals and track the changes over time. It *might* try to estimate a general sense of fitness on the heart, but it will, at best, give you a meaningless number on a scale from "is this thing on?" to "cybernetically enhanced athlete trained atop the Himalayas from birth."
No need to worry. The poster's school's coach is probably just trying to do a great job at keeping the kids in his care interested in physical fitness. I applaud him/her for it.
Re:You're just being paranoid (Score:3, Informative)
Except that they are an educational institution and thus subject to FERPA rules, which also prohibit disclosure of health information to third parties.
Re:holy stupid, batman (Score:1, Informative)
There is no computer saving the data when I check my pulse with my finger.
Who said there is? A watch like device to record heart rate can cost at least $150. multiply by 30 kids and you have a big investment. Then consider that middle schools will naturally steal and break stuff and you'd be stupid to have that equipment.
A device that could record 30+ kids a a gym? I'd like to see that. My experience with Heart rate monitors is a range of about 10 ft.
I'm guessing you buy the strap so it's your own sweet and not the 10 kids before you and a wrist watch like this. http://heartratemonitors.com/fs1.htm Then they can add a bit of technology to the classroom, which is all the rage these days.
PS. check out that site to see what recording/download heart monitors cost.
Re:A HRM is a really REALLY valuable exercise aid. (Score:3, Informative)
The heart rate monitor is actually a fun thing to have.
I usually only wear it when I'm on my bike, and I do find it quite fun to see just for how long I can keep my heart rate at 170+, 175+ and 180+. I'm 32, so my target should really be around 160, but I'm still in really bad shape, so I'm constantly above that if I want to feel like I'm doing something.
But when I started this back in June I could hit a peak of about 180 for maybe a minute before I'd feel like I was dying, and now I can hold 180+ for several minutes. My resting heart rate has dropped from about 80 (!!!) to roughly 65 as well.
I'm using this as a fun toy, and I honestly think that if approached properly in gym, you could get the disinterested kids more interested. If you're giving them grades in gym class (btw, wtf?), don't grade them on how well they play football or whatever, as that'll take away the bad players' motivation. Grade them on how well they've done. If you're already in great shape at the start of the school year and you don't improve, give them an A. If they start in great shape and end up in bad shape, give them a C- or D or something. If they start out in lousy shape and end up in great shape (entirely doable while you're still fat) - give them an A or an A+. Start lousy and keep that - give them a C- or a D.
Re:Heart Rate testing in middle school... (Score:2, Informative)
Re:Paranoid BUT - - (Score:3, Informative)
The straps go around the chest.
The chest of a middle schooler.
A sweaty, pubescent middle schooler.
Running around in the hot sun.
Who is only beginning to understand about the need for personal hygiene.
Yeah. I don't want to keep a collection of those in the same building I work in either. Ew. I think that's an OSHA violation or something.
Re:Holy shit? - What are they Teaching (Score:4, Informative)
We learned to take our pulse in grade school. After that, for me at least, there was nothing new in regards to that.
As an adult, whenever I work out I take a heart rate monitor with me. Martial arts, archery, weight lifting, or running I like to know where I'm at. If I'm running I can back my pace down a bit to keep it at good and safe exercise levels, the same is true of martial arts.
When it comes to weight lifting, I can rest up until my heart rate is back to a lower exertion level between sets. And believe me, when you start moving big weights your heart rate will go up in leaps and bounds during the exercise.
Looking back, for football or other team sports I wish we had been able to use an HRM. It would have provided me the info I needed later in life to avoid putting on a lot of the weight I did (though I've subsequently lost it) since I could have used that info to figure out approximately how many calories I was burning.
Science works (Score:2, Informative)
Re:Holy shit? (Score:4, Informative)
While I understand your point of view I also understand the point of view of parents who's kids have actually died from congenital heart defects which show themselves during physical activity. These heart monitors would alert someone before the kid actually collapsed.
I don't. It's really rare [americanheart.org]. 1.4 per 100,000 death rate means that you have less than 1% chance of seeing it in a given school each year.
I Teach Middle School PE with HR Monitors (Score:2, Informative)
Re:Holy shit? (Score:5, Informative)
Re:Holy shit? (Score:2, Informative)
Keep them prezedents away from my childrenz! I dontz wanna get them too educated nor nothing!
In other words, you're cute when you're wrong.
Re:Holy shit? (Score:3, Informative)
In eight states and the District of Columbia, insurance companies are allowed to deny health benefits to victims of domestic abuse, as it is considered to be a pre-existing condition [seiu.org].
I don't care what side of the table you're on politically. That's just plain wrong (doubly so if you call yourself a Christian)
With regard to TFA, don't forget that all of the usual medical confidentiality laws will still apply, and that it's fairly common for the school nurse to check the blood pressure, pulse, eyesight, and hearing of each student on a yearly basis. Far more information is collected via this "mini-physical" than anything that a HRM can collect. Also don't forget that it seems highly improbable for the school to take the time to archive this data, given that they're forced to run with so little overhead as it is.
(Yes, this was covered on /. yesterday, though many of you might have missed it, given that it was posted to Idle)
Re:Proactive defense from lawsuit (Score:1, Informative)
Or, they could be like this guy and be on trial for manslaughter.
http://www.wkyt.com/home/headlines/57036257.html [wkyt.com]
That fat stupid fuck is the author of his own problems. He cared so much about winning football games that he killed a kid with his callous, hard-ass behavior.
Too bad we still don't have the practice of sentencing people to hard labor in this country. I think 20 to 30 years of backbreaking work breaking rocks into gravel under the desert sun with very infrequent water breaks would do this shithead a world of hurt and do society a world of good.
Re:Holy shit? (Score:2, Informative)
Grammar Police: to serve and correct