To Curb Truancy, Dallas Tries Electronic Monitoring 462
The New York Times is reporting that a school district in Texas is trying a new angle in combating truancy. Instead of punishing students with detention they are tagging them with electronic monitoring devices. "But the future of the Dallas program is uncertain. Mr. Pottinger's company, the Center for Criminal Justice Solutions, is seeking $365,000 from the county to expand the program beyond Bryan Adams. But the effort has met with political opposition after a state senator complained that ankle cuffs used in an earlier version were reminiscent of slave chains. Dave Leis, a spokesman for NovaTracker, which makes the system used in Dallas, said electronic monitoring did not have to be punitive. 'You can paint this thing as either Big Brother, or this is a device that connects you to a buddy who wants to keep you safe and help you graduate.'"
Really... (Score:5, Insightful)
I wonder which of these two conclusions the students will come to.
Not big brother? (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Really... (Score:5, Insightful)
Jokes come true (Score:5, Insightful)
The alternative is much worse (Score:5, Insightful)
* The kids in the program were on the verge of being sent to the Texas Youth Commission, aka Juvenile Detention.
* Once you're in the TYC, you're likely to be beaten, raped, and held indefinitely [washingtonpost.com].
When the choice is between being treated *like* a criminal, versus learning to *be* a criminal in Texas highly successful Criminal Conversion System, I think it's pretty obvious why any judge would choose to give the kid an ankle shackle instead of condemning him to (eventual) death.
Of course, the "choice" is mind-numbingly stupid. Now that the story of the TYC abuses has finally broken [capitolannex.com], maybe the next legislature will do something about the broken system that turns minor offenders into hardened criminals. Not likely, of course, because nobody ever got voted out of office for putting *too many* men, women, or children in jail.
Doublespeak? (Score:4, Insightful)
What's next? Tattoos on the backs of the necks of the little snowflakes? Where are these kids parents, why aren't they getting involved and paying attention to what their kids are doing?
Re:Not big brother? (Score:5, Insightful)
Big Brother (Score:3, Insightful)
However, I don't, and I did quite fine all by my self. The government can't even keep track of laptops, how are they supposed to keep track of kids?
It's total bull, just like airport security, only more intrusive. Why do all these "tracking" programs get tested on school kids? Just to get them used to the idea so by the time they're adults, they don't know any better...
It's shameful.
Re:Not big brother? (Score:5, Insightful)
Give him a shovel and have him work for a living.
Forcing an extended artifical childhood on people is highly unnatural and
only leads to an obvious conflict between authority and instinct. If people
don't want to go to school then don't force them. Schools should be places
were those interested can get ahead, not some sort of prison. Treating schools
as prisons and daycare just undermines their alleged goal.
If you can't keep the truant interested than the school has failed to be relevant.
Must parents agree? (Score:5, Insightful)
I was going to say that I have a problem with it no matter what, but on second thought, I think the question should go to the parents. Minors have limited rights, and if the parents want to monitor them using tools the state provides, in order to keep them in school, maybe that's OK. (Personally, if it were my kid, I would consider this a very desperate measure - it certainly doesn't foster mutual trust and respect.)
On the other hand, if this is forced on students without parents' consent, then it's a big problem.
Consider this: parents have a right to know where their kid is at all times; the school should only be concerned about that during school hours. When is the tracking turned off?
Re:Really... (Score:5, Insightful)
We know someone, somewhere will develope and sell this or similar technology and we need to know how we are going to answer back. Lobby congress to allow jaming technology? Doubtful that will happen. Create scanners so we can atleast know when we are being tracked? More likely, but only a partial solution.
Hopefully someone smarter than me can think of a solution to what I think is an inevitable problem.
Re:I live in Dallas (Score:3, Insightful)
you haven't been to deep ellum recently, have you?
Re:I live in Dallas (Score:5, Insightful)
Totalitarianism comes one small step at a time, never in one giant sweep.
Re:Not big brother? (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:The alternative is much worse (Score:3, Insightful)
While I support education in all it's forms, I fail to see how forcing someone by law to be somewhere involuntarily for 6 hours / day 5 days / week 39 weeks / year for about 12 years can not be considered a form of imprisonment.
These cuffs sound like a natural progression of forced education. And of course only the children who resist will be subject to them. There's no need to impose more force on someone who choses to cooperate with their incarceration voluntarily.
Re:Not big brother? (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:Not big brother? (Score:5, Insightful)
Give him a shovel and have him work for a living.
Forcing an extended artificial childhood on people is highly unnatural and
only leads to an obvious conflict between authority and instinct. If people
don't want to go to school then don't force them. Schools should be places
were those interested can get ahead, not some sort of prison. Treating schools
as prisons and daycare just undermines their alleged goal.
If you can't keep the truant interested than the school has failed to be relevant.
If the truant students would stay out of class, my kids could get a decent education. But no, they force these disinterested, undisciplined kids in to an already over crowded class room - and nobody learns anything. The teacher is there just to make sure everyone stays alive.
If they really want to scare these kids back into the class room - make them get a job from 8a-3p during school. After a few weeks of flipping burgers or shoveling cow shit - these kids might take school a little more seriously. And in the mean time they'll be paying taxes on their wages.
Profit!
Or like an actual PARENT (Score:5, Insightful)
If parents would actually PARENT, maybe we wouldn't need so much of a "Nanny" state. But until that happens, comparisons to 1984esque totalitarianism is absurd.
"Big Brother"'s original purpose... (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Not big brother? (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:"Big Brother"'s original purpose... (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:Really... (Score:5, Insightful)
The students in the program were given the option of either submitting to GPS monitoring, or being placed in Juvenile Detention.
Whether or not you agree with the concept of house arrest, this seems like a logical extension of that concept to troubled youths.
Personally, I think this seems to have a much greater possibility of actually working than sticking all of the troubled students together in a prison-like environment.
At the very least, it's better than any of the other alternatives on the table.
Re:Sounds about right (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Not big brother? (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Not big brother? (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:I hope... (Score:2, Insightful)
As for the parent/family member part, they usually have a decent idea where their kids live, so they don't need a map to find them.
The cost of uneducation (Score:1, Insightful)
It might seem hard for some to believe, but society really is better off if that minimum wage landscaper knows how to read and even how to type. It helps a lot when the 7-11 clerk has a basic understanding of economics. It helps if the lady changing the sheets at the local hotel knows algebra. It helps when the lawn mower mechanic knows something about world history.
There are some large scale issues that require a cooperative effort on a very large scale. Sure, bright, educated people can take the lead on most of these issues. But society will advance much quicker if the average man on the street can grasp the implications of the problem and the possible solutions. If smart people could spend more time thinking up solutions and less time explaining to the "dumb" people why and how to implement those solutions, society could advance more quickly. "Go fill out an application" is much more efficient than "Let me drive you over and fill out an application for you."
Imagine if a postal worker, or say a patent clerk, was capable of applying their education to solve difficult problems. What if a truck driver had enough education to streamline their operations and reduce fuel consumption? Or what if they used their elementary physics education and their hours on the road to conceive new ideas for the ball bearings in their 18 wheels?
Would that help somebody besides themselves?
This just reinforces the message that... (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:Really... (Score:5, Insightful)
This is an option, its when truancy gets to the point that the student is going to be taken to juvenile detention. I would much rather see the kids restricted to their own home and school rather than sent to kiddy jail. The environment there is NOT going to help them much. If anything, its going to further warp their view of authority and government and they will be worse coming out than they were going in.
As someone born, raised, and schooled in Dallas, I'm 100% supportive of this program.
Re:Or like an actual PARENT (Score:5, Insightful)
There is certainly educational value in "taking your lumps" as you put it, however I think this type of learning is more appropriate for older age groups. For example, skipping class has potential consequences potentially decades away. By the time they figure out they've screwed up, it's too late to do anything about it. In the worst case, their "screw up" turns into a burden on society later on. As the saying goes, spanking your kid when he's four will save the penal system from doing it when he's forty.
In this specific case, truancy, I feel it's either school or GED + vocational training. School or job, in other words. Either way they're a lot less likely to end up being useless later in life.
=Smidge=
I call BS (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:I live in Dallas (Score:3, Insightful)
Sure it does, just not in this case.
The problem is the left is blaming the right, and the right is blaming the left... the truth is that it happens at both extreme ends of the spectrum, and each side allows little bits at a time that jive with their perspective.
Of course, anyone that wants the government to stop and go back to it's size and scope from 100 years ago is labeled "lunatic fringe" and detractors don't even have to counter all the valid arguments, they just have to call you "crazy" to marginalize your campaign...
a better application of this technology... (Score:1, Insightful)
Re:Or like an actual PARENT (Score:5, Insightful)
I am the parent of a teenager who, if we lived in Texas, might be subjected to this idiocy. The likely outcome if it were applied to her would be more resistance to authority, more risky behavior and a greater likelihood of catastrophic consequences, including inappropriate escalation of repression by dim-witted authorities.
Fortunately we live in a less pig-ignorant part of the country, so we were able to make other arrangements. They involved giving her more personal responsibility rather than imposing more restrictions and privacy invasions. For her this solution has worked. Another thing to keep in mind is that kids are different and what's medicine for one could well be poison for another. I don't trust a committee of state employees to be able to make this kind of assessment, and I trust them even less to make timely corrections if the approach isn't working.
What's lacking in all layers of the US government is adherence to the principle that people should be left alone unless they are doing something violent or predatory. Micromanagement like this is a symptom of deep pathology on the part of those doing the micro-managing. These idiots should be driven out of office and humiliated.
Re:Really... (Score:1, Insightful)
Some of us kids just didn't like going to class. It's not a new concept.
Re:I live in Dallas (Score:5, Insightful)
TFA clearly states that this is being used for kids with very serious truancy problems. It's not for some kid who's late a couple times. And if the kid prefers to wear the transmitter and go to school, great. And if not, he is detained under more traditional circumstances. At no time is the school system sneaking up on kids and tagging their ears -- this is a choice given to the kid and his family.
In theory, I agree with others around here that if it gets to this level, the parents relinquished control at some point. But be that as it may, until the kids are 16 they're not only the parents' responsibility, but the community's as well. You may take issue with the laws surrounding that issue, but that's not the point. The point is to make the child comply with existing attendance laws, and this seems to me to be a better way than locking them up with other kids who have screwed up their lives in whatever widely varying ways.
what will they learn? (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:Or like an actual PARENT (Score:1, Insightful)
That would only work if society were willing to let them reap what they sow. It seems that the do-gooders in this world will work very hard to prevent this. These kids can screw up and then when the chickens come home to roost, when the seeds of their foolishness begin to sprout, there are those who want to force the society, ie. the taxpayers, to bail the miscreants out of their self made predicaments.
It used to be that people were more or less responsible for their own actions, but nowadays many will blame everyone and everything but themselves for their troubles. If possible they will look for someone to sue or to the government, that is the tax payers to help them out of the holes they have dug for themselves.
Re:Or like an actual PARENT (Score:5, Insightful)
And if the government is going to be held responsible for the welfare of the children, and if the government is later responsible for supporting those children when they become unemployed adults, then they really ought to be permitted to use this kind of method to help. After all, being responsible for all of the children in the nation is a big task. They need some sort of tool for identifying, tracking, and measuring the status of each one.
Of course, if this is not the sort of thing you want the government doing, then put the responsibility back on the parents. Don't make "no child left behind" the issue that decides your vote. Don't vote for candidates who support widespread welfare programs. Because this is the natural result of that sort of thinking.
Re:Really... (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:Jokes come true (Score:5, Insightful)
Don't be silly, prison is nothing like school;
In prison, you don't have to ask permission to use the toilet.
In prison, you have free time when you can think.
In prison, you can get time off for good behavior. If you do well in school, they give you extra work.
If they make you work in prison, they have to pay you.
If you escape from prison, the law comes after you. If you escape from school, the law comes after your family.
If prisoners get into fights, the guards separate them.
There are organizations dedicated to monitoring conditions in prisons, and keeping them from being inhumane.
Re:Really... (Score:4, Insightful)
If I lived in that school district and they tried to put one of those Lo-Jack things on my kid, I would wield the ACLU and smite the school district with them while shouting "SMITE" (Bard's Tale fans rejoice!)
Do they have any idea what this sort of douche-baggery would do to someone psychologically? They put electronic tethers on convicts for crying out loud. These are OUR CHILDREN! Maybe there is a reason that children are fleeing our public schools in record numbers... and maybe that reason should be looked for somewhere other than the children!
Fuck School Kids (Score:2, Insightful)
They are only free to screw up (Score:3, Insightful)
I think school was much better when the fear of punishment (the oppressive state) did very well in encouraging you to behave. The simple fact is, some of these people need to be whacked up side the head. They need a "big brother" though the government isn't the best option.
Here is the question, do you want to pay to keep them from screwing up in the first place or pay for them for the rest of their lives.
and all because we put more value on their "rights" than the rights of the society that has to tolerate and pay for them
Re:The cost of uneducation (Score:2, Insightful)
is immense and you have the right of it in pointing out that a failure to have a sufficient portion of a society educated is going to result in a non-sustainable society.
BUT:
As others have pointed out, one of the costs of forcing the "at risk" (PC speak for "lost cause") kids into the regular classroom is the downward pressure they will exert (via disruptive behavior etc) of the marginal kids (the one's who really are "at risk") as well as those who might excell, but instead experience immense "peer" pressure (including violence) to underperform. And that is just the direct negative influence. The extra time and resources required from the teachers to try and simply maintain order and make minimal test scores means neglect of the more talented students.
So, I'd go one better than DISD and put those truant kids that accept the tracking device in separate classes - at a different location. This would help the beancounters recognize the real costs of dealing with the most disruptive "students" and allow the regular teachers some room to work with the students that are not actively hostile to learning.
The lessons for the truants could be considerably simpler with the consequences for both failure and sucess more immediately apparent. I don't know what sort of consequences should be involved (though I have a gut feeling electric shocks and candy bars would not get the desired result), but kids who ditch school a lot are not going to be big on the concept of deferred gratification and expecting otherwise is foolish.
Re:Or like an actual PARENT (Score:3, Insightful)
Neither do adults.
For children you have three paths. The first is to help them realize that cooperating with those around them and being productive is the most effective long-term strategy for pursuing their happiness. The second is to convince them that the entire world is a bunch of screw-ups that are only vaguely kept in order through threat of violence. The third is to let them screw up and take their lumps.
You have the same three paths for adults.
Of the three, the second is actually the one most likely to result in violent, oppressive, and harmful adults.
Funny that it's also the closest to the truth.
Re:Or like an actual PARENT (Score:3, Insightful)
Potentially, but in reality almost never. And if there are consequences to it, they are artificially inflated by those in authority, just to teach a kid that obeying orders is the most important thing.
Re:Fuck School Kids (Score:3, Insightful)
You are, however, highly qualified to flip burgers.
Re:You left something out (Score:1, Insightful)
The screw up only has a right to be a screw up until it begins to effect someone else. Then they're screwing up society at which point society has a right to do something about it.
It might not have the racism or militarism of the Nazi flavor of fascism, nor the more corporate efficiency of Mussulini's flavor. But, the appeal that society is more important than the individual is a strong fascist tennet.
Re:Really... (Score:2, Insightful)
If the kids don't want to go to school and the parents aren't able to make them go to school...
Then they don't effing go to school.
We wouldn't have to worry with NCLB, because the kids in school would either a) want to be there or b) actually have parents who are capable of parenting. Everybody there will be interested (of their own accord or because their parents demand it) in doing the school work and furthering their education instead of bringing the class to a halt so they don't get "left behind"...
Re:Really... (Score:1, Insightful)
Re:Really... (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:They are only free to screw up (Score:5, Insightful)
First off, I do agree that our school system has gotten weak, and that we don't enforce discipline. Discipline, btw, is the most importance concept in any modern debate involving education. Discipline, means responsibility and consequences, or course, both of which are lessons we are sorely lacking.
When I was in the school system (in the early 90s) far more time was spent telling me that Mexicans and Black people were people too, and that I should respect them, than teaching me math or reading skills (much less "critical thinking" skills), to me this was an unconscionable crime, with the latter the former is obvious, with the former your nothing more than a tolerant, but illiterate, imbecile.
I take affront, though, at your last line. The rights of individuals always trump society, unless those rights conflict with the rights of other individuals. Society, as such, has no rights, it is merely a collective of individuals. Holding society above individuals is the basis of all tyrannies and atrocities.
Just a little nit-pick.
Re:Or like an actual PARENT (Score:3, Insightful)
Many other countries are not like this. Many offer free educations and do not presume to be able to make your choices for you in life. Many require work places to give you a certain amount of vacation, sick days, and free time. Many do not require 50+ hour workweeks with little to no vacation time and breakneck productivity. It's more of a problem with how America works than with how the average person functions if you ask me.
Amazing (Score:3, Insightful)
Anyone who thinks this is a good idea is not only an idiot, but is also the vilest danger to the American way of life I can imagine. First it's criminals. Then it's truant kids. Then it's all kids in school - to protect against child abuse you know. Then it's everyone, and objection to the policy is immediate grounds for suspicion ("Why are you complaining if you've got nothing to hide?").
Funny thing is, when we try to hold our government or corporations or even school boards up to the same transparency, they immediately throw hissy fits and start claiming executive privilege and "losing" emails. Why are they complaining if they have nothing to hide?
Re:Or like an actual PARENT (Score:4, Insightful)
Although there are some useful things to be learned in school, most skills beyond basic reading can be easily learned when one feels the need. I won a national competition in math, but now I remember zilch from high school algebra. I frequently come to work late and sometimes make silly excuses when I miss a meeting, yet I am one of the most productive employees in the team.
So if my daughter occasionally skips classes I don't see it as a grave offense punishable by making her wear a GPS tracking bracelets like convicted felons on probation. I will certainly talk to her and may cut off her entertainment activities for a time, but I will rather move out of the country than allow government to treat her like a criminal. If she just skips a couple of classes per month, I will just chuck it off to her being a kid.
Re:Really... (Score:5, Insightful)
That said, what is the inherent advantage of putting an obvious I-don't-want-to-be-here in a class "dragging everyone else down" (generality used on purpose, relax)? I mean, really?
I only see three options
These are serious questions
Re:Jokes come true (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Or like an actual PARENT (Score:4, Insightful)
Which is why Vocational Education is often treated as a dumping ground...
Don't wonder why the US has a shortage of SKILLED workers such as pipe welders (starting wage often is $20/hr plus per diem!) when physical labor is scorned. Let the droputs who want to VOLUNTEER go to vocational school, but don't inflict losers on the rest of the students who want to learn. It wastes their classmates and instructors time.
Re:Or like an actual PARENT (Score:3, Insightful)
College is another matter. I will agree that college is not for everyone, and may actually sacrifice certain options. However, since it's already difficult (but not impossible) to get a decent job before you're 18 in most places, there really is little harm in staying in school. If anything it just may keep you off the streets.
=Smidge=
harder than it looks (Score:3, Insightful)
I'm lucky that my kids are sane and are doing well in school, but I'm aware that it is partly luck. I've known parents who thought things were okay, and felt that this was to their credit, only to find later that their 8th grader was part of a prostitution ring at school. Suddenly they felt that their own efforts were a little less of a factor, and all of a sudden it was "the culture," etc. We all want to take credit when things go well.