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Napster Gags University Over Fees 199

Posted by simoniker from the one-trillion-dollars dept.
A. S. Bradbury writes "The Register reports that Napster is trying to prevent Ohio University from discussing details of its contract (such as the price). In order to gauge interest for the service, Ohio University posted a survey asking if students would be willing to pay $3 a month in order to opt-in to the service. Sean O'Malley, spokesman Communication Network Services at OU says "Napster called us today and said we should not publicize the details or discuss our contract." Penn State and the University of Rochester both currently have a contract with Napster, but are paying for the service with money that could be used elsewhere, rather than allowing students to opt in."
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Napster Gags University Over Fees More

Napster Gags University Over Fees

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  • Do I smell a rat? (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Killjoy_NL ( 719667 ) <slashdot&remco,palli,nl> on Thursday May 13, 2004 @02:43AM (#9136530)
    Somehow I don't really trust what Napster is doing now, is it normal for companies to make this kind of information public or not?

    The story makes it sound like Napster has something to hide that when known could cause all kinds of trouble for them.
    • I don't understand what these kids are so upset about, if the price is similar per student to the other university its only $3 out of the 160 dollars they pay, which at a population 30,000 (the last number I saw) amounts to $90,000, thats alot of money but only 1.87% out of 4,800,000.

      I would be thankful that my college is allowing me to legally download music for free so i don't have to go out and buy CDs, for only $3, or worry about the RIAA suing my ass.
      I mean it would be better if they could opt out bu

      • Re:Do I smell a rat? (Score:3, Interesting)

        by Annoying ( 245064 )
        The problem is they would not be buying the music. The students would be renting it for the duration of their college education. After which time they would have to pay 99 cents a song to actually 'buy' it. Three bucks a month and you still have to buy the CDs in the end.

      • Re:Do I smell a rat? (Score:2, Interesting)

        by tdemark ( 512406 )
        It could be more than just the $90,000. Much more.

        I would imagine that there are a significant number of alumni from the mid 90s onward that will stop donating (or never donate) to the school because of this.

        I personally have told several Lion Link operators that I will not give to Penn State as long as they are supporting the RIAA via Napster.

        - Tony

    • Re:Do I smell a rat? (Score:5, Interesting)

      by cgenman ( 325138 ) on Thursday May 13, 2004 @04:21AM (#9136873) Homepage
      In Napster's defence, they're probably counting on giving steep discounts to drive adaptation, then raising the price to a less-steep discount when they have (lol) legitimacy. If the discounted price they gave to the initial colleges is known, everyone will want that price, and they will all be bargaining from a position of power. This kind of information is normal for companies to try and hide from the public.

      Not that I'd shed a tear for the New Napster, but this doesn't sound nefarious to me.

      • Exactly - in a related story yesterday [theregister.co.uk] on the reg - it mentions exaclty that as the reason.

        From the story linked above:
        "This fact eludes numerous media members who have been attracted to Napster's deals with Penn State and the University of Rochester. The two schools provide Napster at no cost to students, giving them unlimited access to tethered downloads or 'rented music.' (The students have to pay 99 cents per song to burn music onto a CD, put it on an MP3 player or keep it after their university tim

    • Time for Ohio U. to tell crapster where to stick it.

    • University Tells Napster To Fuck Off.

    • one of the things that really amuses me about this is that my uni (i am a rather recent grad) is getting in the news yet again because someone thinks something happening here is negative.

      we're a real rebel culture, alright. a nearly city-wide halloween "block" party that resembols mardi gras on acid, several unofficial street parties a year, time change "riots" (blown well out of proportion by the media). why so many parties? because we work just as hard (if not harder) as we play (believe it or not, it
    • At my university, one of the first to sign an exclusive soda contract (with Coca Cola), there is a battle brewing over the renewal of the 10 year contract this summer (it's no coincidence that it was signed, and will be resigned, when students are away from campus). It didn't help that the university and Coke refused, for ten years, to discuss specifics of the contract, where money was going, etc. The Napster deal is pretty bad, but it's fairly sickening to have your school turn into a marketing arm of Coca
      • I don't know what my university's soda contracts are like, but I know my dining hall has both coke and pepsi products. I don't drink either of them, but but they are there if I ever want them. We also have coke, pepsi, and 7up vending machines.
    • The answer is no. Students won't pay $3 when they can just fire up Kazaa or eMule for free. Piracy is that much of an epidemic. People simply want things for free, and it has nothing to do with culture movements, anti-RIAA movements, or any other justifications pirates give.
      • You're insane. $3 a month for downloads? That's so cheap you'd be crazy not to pay.

        If I could pay $10-$15 a month right now for unlimited (or some high limit, like 100+ per month) downloads of legal MP3s - pure, no DRM - I'd sign up in a heartbeat. And that's just for 128kbit cheapies. I'd pay more for higher quality.

        The students will pay for this. It's too cheap to say no.
        • eMusic does around what you want. MP3, no DRM, VBR, around 1MB/minute. $10/month for 40 tracks. $20 will get you 90 tracks.

          I just signed up after reading a post about 'em the other day. I'm happy with the service, even though in order to download full albums you have to download their file manager. I don't really blame them - beats having to host the content twice (once in mp3, once in "zip" or similar).

  • Freedom of information and accountability (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 13, 2004 @02:43AM (#9136531)
    Aren't the contracts that public universities enter supposed to be public information anyway? They are, after all, funded in part by tax dollars.

    Every citizen should have the right to know exactly what their hard earned money is being spent on.

    • "New American University" then some OT (Score:5, Insightful)

      by Triumph The Insult C ( 586706 ) on Thursday May 13, 2004 @03:25AM (#9136673) Homepage Journal
      maybe a few years ago, but not anymore. once universities learned how to get around laws about being not-for-profit, stuff like this (unis going into asshanded contracts) started to become more and more commonplace.

      now for some OT which i'm sure will get mod'd down

      it's pretty pathetic that the "academic tradition" of openness at universities (i'm speaking of public state schools, not private unis which can do whatever they want for all i care) is slowly being pushed to the wayside. universities are no longer run like places of education, but more like businesses. business has no place in education.

      my state's Constitution states that (state college/uni) education must be affordable. in the past 2.5 years since we got stuck with a new president, tuition has consistently gone up. 5 new buildings have been built or are currently under construction, only one of which is used (partially) for teaching. the rest are completely dedicated to research.

      the kicker is that this research is almost always funded by gov't grants (read: my and yours $$). yet, if i want to use technology developed on those grants, i have to pay for a license to use it ... i pay twice.

      if a researcher here finds a cure for cancer, the uni's corporate arm will take ownership, and license it. that's damn sad. the days of places of higher education putting out freely available innovations are long gone thanks to the almighty ustpo, and the sad state of using patents to stifle innovation. i can only imagine the american forefathers are rolling in their graves.

      • it's pretty pathetic that the "academic tradition" of openness at universities (i'm speaking of public state schools, not private unis which can do whatever they want for all i care) is slowly being pushed to the wayside. universities are no longer run like places of education, but more like businesses. business has no place in education.

        Funding at state universities is problematic.

        This year the University of Maryland - College Park gets more money from research grants (> $300M) than it does from t

        • it doesn't need to be problematic, that's the thing

          the uni president here has pushed and pushed to get tuition increases every semester since he's been here. and he's been successful. yet, with all this money that he has said will be pegged for "better teaching", not much has gone that route. there have been 5 new buildings either built or being built since he got here. 1 building has 10 60 student halls in it. the other 4 are purely for research.

          it'd be one thing if that money was 'soft' grant money,
          • Research is needed to establish the idea that the university is keeping up with current trends in various subject areas. Without it, they have no way of attracting top-tier students and no way to afford to stay in business at a reasonable cost, due to overhead from faculty and facilities.

            What is needed is some way to siphon money from the football and basketball programs back into the academic areas, since these two sports are usually overfunded, in comparison to real academic disciplines.
            • no

              what's needed is a change in mentality on the parts of university administrators and legislators that ultimately control university budgets

              university administrators: run .edus like a business, neglecting education and focusing on research -> make the university experience the best experience possible *FOR THE STUDENT*

              legislators: .edu is a money sink. don't give them any more money -> education has, is, and always will be a money sink, but education should be the most important. here is mor
              • The counter-argument is simple: personal results are not quantifiable.

                1. Legislators want quantifiable results so they can have something to wave around at election time.
                2. The people demand quantifiable results from the legislators for actions taken on their behalf.
                3. Quantifiable results determine whether policy is effective or not, and therefore justifiable.

                The change in mentality has to come from the public side before it can come from the university admin side, if for no other reason than legislature
      • universities are no longer run like places of education, but more like businesses.

        Don't you mean daycare centers?
      • it's pretty pathetic that the "academic tradition" of openness at universities (i'm speaking of public state schools, not private unis which can do whatever they want for all i care) is slowly being pushed to the wayside. universities are no longer run like places of education, but more like businesses. business has no place in education.

        Business has a significant role in a college, as those are the prospective employers for graduates. Without having some business in a school, you end up teaching a lot

  • FOIA (Score:3, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 13, 2004 @02:46AM (#9136544)
    Somebody should start drafting the Freedom of Information Act request for this information tomorrow.

  • Poor little Napster. (Score:5, Insightful)

    by grepistan ( 758811 ) <duncan_c@[ ].com.au ['tpg' in gap]> on Thursday May 13, 2004 @02:47AM (#9136545)

    They've gone a long way, from being one of the trailblazers in filesharing, to a co-opted bully doing business through the RIAA sue-your-own-customers model.

    It sounds like the admission of their discounted price is not going to please their subscribers either. Whoever they are. Anyone around here use it? I don't think they can really compete, to be honest. But I will continue to watch the online music wars with interest.

    • Not to sound flippant, but how is this scheme of providing discounts to universities any different than the volume discounts available in the retail or commodities sectors?

      Would this be any different if, say, Apple provided iTunes service to all the employees oforg x (say for the law firm that represents them) at a significant, volume discount?

      • I don't think that's flippant at all... it is pretty much the same kind of volume discount used everywhere else. I just think that regular napster customers might be a little annoyed about the apparent arbitrariness of the pricing system of what is essentially an intangible product. Sure, there is something being transferred here, but it's not like in wholesale/retail markup for example, where the discount actually reflects the decreased overheads in terms of packaging, handling and the like. It's probably

    • Uh, if the RIAA is suing you, it's because you are illegally infringing their copyright, and they have full right to sue you. How are you one of their customers if you're not paying for their content?

      The RIAA doesn't sue customers, it sues pirates who are avoiding paying for their copyrighted materials, violating copyright holder rights. If you're a customer, you've legally paid for the material in some way and aren't on Kazaa ripping artists off.
      • The RIAA doesn't sue customers, it sues pirates who are avoiding paying for their copyrighted materials, violating copyright holder rights. If you're a customer, you've legally paid for the material in some way and aren't on Kazaa ripping artists off.

        You're right, the RIAA has never made the mistake of sueing someone who didn't trade files [bbc.co.uk]. ;)

        Although it's not been tested as far as I know, what if I purchase an RIAA CD, but it's at home and I'm at work. Am I infringing on copyright by downloading a copy
      • Technically this correct. Perhaps a more accurate way people probably should be putting is: "Sue your own market base" or "Sue your products own consumers" or perhaps "doing an SCO" and "doing an RIAA" are simply interchangeable synonyms.

        Anyone with even a passing understanding of sales knows this isn't much better for one's long term economic prospects as it has a direct impact on both your products' marketability (it gives strong incentives for selecting substitutes like DVD or video games or stealth

  • Depending on the nature of the contract, Napster may have every right to ask them to not disclose that information. It would seem a little awkward though that the schools are paying an apparently flat fee, regardless if the students opt in or not.

    • Re:Well (Score:5, Interesting)

      by belmolis ( 702863 ) <billposer@a[ ].mit.edu ['lum' in gap]> on Thursday May 13, 2004 @02:58AM (#9136585) Homepage

      Ohio University doesn't yet have a contract with Napster; they're thinking about it. From the survey:

      Ohio University is considering forming a partnership with Napster...
      The purpose of their survey is to help them decide whether to enter into a contract. Hence Napster has no legal ability to enforce confidentiality. They just don't like the fact that the university's survey gives an idea of what the costs would be. It sounds like a scam to me. Do you think that the cost of water, electricity, or food services is a deep, dark secret?
      • The likely angle here is that they don't want their similar already established contracts to rethink their current contracts based upon student response at Ohio University or anywhere else.

        Can't say I blame them as they are likely on shakey ground considering their past exploits, and are doing all they can to save their skin...

        Chances are this will have nothing but a negative effect... Gawd knows college students have plenty of time to read /. *points to self*
      • You can have terms for the discussions entered, one of which may be confidentiality. THis happens all the time with big business, you approach them for a good deal and everything from then on is covered under pre agreement terms. You dont know what the Ohio University have signed, just that they HAVENT signed the actual agreement, therefor they can be discussing things under pre agreement terms, which are permissable in court. In the airline business, one company does not know how much their rivals paid

        • Re:Well (Score:2)

          by joib ( 70841 )
          You're correct, but I don't think this applies here. Secrets have a habit of leaking, especially if you tell the entire student body about it.
      • of the ones who will actually be PAYING for the service, then they should just tell Napster to go piss up a rope.

        OU: We are going to find out what our students think of this. After all, they're the ones affected.

        N: No! You can't do that! It's a secret!

        OU: We're not sure we like that...

        N: Tough luck. We don't want those numbers out there.

        OU: Well then, we regret to inform you that signing up with your service is not in our best interests. Don't let the door hit you on the way out...

  • Access to full catalog? (Score:5, Interesting)

    by spacefight ( 577141 ) on Thursday May 13, 2004 @02:50AM (#9136559)
    Right!

    Limitations

    # To burn to CD or MP3 player, you must purchase tracks separately

    * $0.99 per track or $9.95 per album (You only pay this if you want to burn to CD or MP3 player.)
    * Purchased tracks have no restrictions - unlimited copying, no expiration # Cannot download new tracks during summer or winter breaks * Tracks already downloaded still playable during breaks

    What a joke!

  • Same deal different company (Score:5, Informative)

    by StormyWeather ( 543593 ) on Thursday May 13, 2004 @02:54AM (#9136577) Homepage
    As far as I know almost all colleges enter into secret backroom deals with software and operating system companies. This has two good effects for the colleges.

    A: They don't have to explain to alumni why they spent a million rupees on frivolous software.
    B: The people making the purchases don't get lynched for all the stupid mistakes they make.

    What really stinks is that most colleges are at least partially state funded, and they protect these records from public scrutiny. It's a sucky deal, but no more sucky than the books that won't even be used that students are told to buy.

    On an off topic note, does it make anyone else sick seeing the amount of IT classes that are taught through power point presentations rather than proffessor insight. If I never see a piece of crap programming book with by Thompson again it will be too soon!
    • On the other hand, those backroom deals usually save them a *lot* of money over retail.

      For instance, my old University (Michigan) had a site license deal with MS. I don't know what they paid for it, but I know it was less per seat than the price they would allow students and alums to purchase a copy at ($36 per copy). So, minimum 66% discount, and probably significantly better.

      Don't knock the backroom deals; they're keeping your tuition from growing even faster than it already is.
      • I don't think anyone here disagrees with Universities saving money. What I think most folks dislike is university secrecy. The small college I started at for instance had an entire lab full of brand new dells with Windows XP on them. All of those machines had 1 purpose, and that was to connect to the as400 system so students could learn COBOL. I asked the department head what those systems cost the school and he told me that the information was part of a secret deal with dell.

        I am of the thinking tha
        • If the college receives any Federal funding, file a Freedom of Information Act discovery. Depending on the state, you may also have similiar rights even if it doesn't get Federal money.
        • Cost of a new Dell at Educational discount prices - 200 - $400. These will come with your custom built image pre installed and 3 years next day on site repair.

          Cost of old keyboards to be sterilised (health and safety) plus technician hours installing and configuring OS, plus technician hours repairing that dodgy hard drive on PC #6 and the bent RGB pin on PC # 17 and replacing that failed PAT power supply on PC # 19, and replaced monitor on image burnt CRT #12 and...and ... and.... well you hopefully ge

    • Re:Same deal different company (Score:5, Funny)

      by pyrrhonist ( 701154 ) on Thursday May 13, 2004 @03:23AM (#9136662)
      They don't have to explain to alumni why they spent a million rupees on frivolous software.

      Then again, $22,177.87 barely shows up on the alumni radar at larger universities.

    • Re:Same deal different company (Score:2, Insightful)

      by Anonymous Coward
      FWIW, i have worked with sales people in a software company before.
      The policy for sales to acedemia was to; Quote 50% of the commerical price (which was insanely out of a universities reach). Then just as the would be purchaser is about to walk away from the deal grovel to them how having the software being used in classes is a great asset to the company in the future and simply ask them 'what can you afford?'

      It was claimed that in general you got the most amount of money from the buyer as possible. Someti

  • Brrraaaainssss... (or lack thereof) (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Soko ( 17987 ) on Thursday May 13, 2004 @02:57AM (#9136583) Homepage
    "On the plus side, Napster users at the school would be able to download as much music as they like for $3 per month - Windows users only, of course.

    Of course! I mean, those iPod/Mac yuppies already have iTunes, and share music with those Communist Loonix weirdos? No way.

    Sadly, the DRM restrictions with Napster run high. Users can only make 3 copies of a song before the files become unplayable. In addition, students must pay 99 cents per song to move the file from their computer onto a CD or music playing device.

    3 copies? 99 cents to move a song across some copper wires? Well, until the DRM is cracked, anyway.

    Students would also only be able to download songs while they are on the school network. Once they leave school their music disappears.

    Suuuuure. (See above about the DRM)

    Has renting culture ever been more fun?"

    *sigh* That statement is sooo true. It's a shame that the Napster name is still attached to this. In it's heyday, Napster showed a hint what a free culture could be - this is just stupid. I can't see thier service surviving in the same market as iTunes, not to mention thier total reliance on DRM to force money out of people. DRM is like balloon - once it's breached, it disappears - forever.

    Napster is a zombie - it's already dead, it just doesn't know it yet.

    Soko

  • I'm proud to pay for your music (Score:5, Insightful)

    by PCM2 ( 4486 ) on Thursday May 13, 2004 @03:03AM (#9136597) Homepage
    Yeah, that's great. What are the chances that Napster is hosting a single band that I'm interested in listening to? Well, thanks to my tuition funds, some freshman kid somewhere can listen to his Limp Bizkit. Awesome. And to think, if I had done a little worse on my SATs, I would have been deprived the privilege of helping society in this way.
    • I tried to find a student radio station at Ohio University, but all I found was an NPR rebroadcaster. If I'm in error about this, please let me know.

      I really hope that the University of Maryland system doesn't consider this. We've got our radio station at UMBC (WMBC), and the (admittedly more significant) one at College Park. Our draw is that you can be exposed to all sorts of new music that's more interesting and less expensive than what you hear on commercial radio, and its made by artists who actuall
  • I'm waiting for the day when the iTMS give educational discount (never)

  • lunacy (Score:5, Insightful)

    by spiritraveller ( 641174 ) on Thursday May 13, 2004 @03:05AM (#9136602)
    This would make some sense if it were part of on-campus housing fees. It would be similar to cable television and other services provided as part of room and board.

    But to include it as part of a mandatory technology fee for ALL students is absurd. Not all students will even have internet access at home...

    And that's just the point... This is a service that people would use at home. It has nothing to do with academics, or the health or social life of the students.

    The administration at these universities must really have their heads up their asses to try a stunt like this.

    • This would make some sense if it were part of on-campus housing fees. It would be similar to cable television and other services provided as part of room and board.

      You got cable with your room and board? Shit, I had to pay for cable, phone, Internet access, and electricity!!! YES, it was on campus.

      • There was free cable to the Lounges in my dorm, and it was easy enough to steal cable for those few that bothered to have a tv in thier room. Most people didn't as it was too easy to get stolen. The Local Phone service was free. Long Distance needed a phone card. Most of the dorms didn't even have private bathrooms.

        I also don't remember watching too much TV except Twin Peaks. That turned into a regular event for the entire floor.
    • Ha! Spoken like someone who believes there is anything outside of the University's walls. Of course students are utterly dependent on the University to supply their every need. Why, let me show you....

      [FX: window blinds being drawn]

      Yikes! Where did that city of a million souls come from?

  • Here's a simple solution (Score:5, Interesting)

    by ZuperDee ( 161571 ) <zuperdee @ y a h o o . c om> on Thursday May 13, 2004 @03:06AM (#9136603) Homepage Journal
    If you people hate the RIAA that much, why not do something about it, such as boycott them [boycott-riaa.com], and make a point of buying only non-RIAA music?

    Seriously, it really is incredible how many people there are here who blindly endorse P2P sharing, regardless of whether what they are sharing is legal or not, and then suddenly complain when the RIAA starts suing people. It is especially incredible when you consider that there was once a time when people here were saying, "Let the RIAA go ONLY after those folks who are pirating, rather than try to shut down a P2P network that has other uses besides piracy." Well, the RIAA is now doing EXACTLY that, and yet people are now continuing to complain.

    For crying out loud: by now, nobody in their right mind can say that the RIAA has not given fair warning before suing people. I say, put up, or shut up. If you don't like the RIAA's policy, don't buy their stuff. It's that simple.

    I realize this may be slightly off-topic, but the fact of the matter is this: I believe the RIAA has a legitimate case for going after piracy. However, the flip side to this is that piracy might not be such a huge problem from them if it were not for the fact that the RIAA and its members are basically overcharging for their mediocre products, and treating the artists unfairly.

    If they were to treat the artists more fairly, lower their prices CONSIDERABLY, and give us better products than Britney Spears, they might have a better chance with me... But unfortunately, they have now shown that they are all shady crooks, and I for one am now making it a point NOT to use any RIAA-approved services like Napster, and I am also making a special point not to buy any RIAA CDs.

    • Re:Here's a simple solution (Score:5, Insightful)

      by slothman32 ( 629113 ) <pjohnjackson@noSPAm.gmail.com> on Thursday May 13, 2004 @03:30AM (#9136693) Homepage Journal
      I do agree about boycotting but that doesn't work in a country of 300 million. Even if every loyal Slashdotist never buys RIAA or MPAA or whatever international product the company won't see a significant drop in sales. And they'll probably blame it on priacy anyways. We need laws now. Or at least assemblies. Capitalism only works on small groups Captain Boycott wouldn't care if the boycotters were only 0.001% of his sales.
      • And they'll probably blame it on priacy anyways.

        One of the big factors in a successful boycot is letting the company that your boycotting know that your doing it to them.

        However I, sadly, have to agree with you that a boycot of any meida in the US will most likely fail. We simply live for our meida right now and the arguments are too complex for Joe Sixpack and Suzy Homemaker to understand.
      • Laws for what?

        What has the RIAA done wrong by suing downloaders? And artists willingly sign their contracts. Nobody is holding a gun to their heads.

        It's just become accepted truth that the RIAA is evil around here. People assume it's true because others assume it's true, and others before them. Sure, there are cases where artists get unhappy with their contracts, but that happens in any industry centered on contracts, and it's not the norm.

      • This whole scenario is a perfect demonstration of the laziness and lack of self-discipline that has crept into the ethos of the average American. It's not the number involved, it's the mentality that relies so heavily on immediate gratification. It's also the fact that music has acquired such an addictive quality- like a bad crack habit. If you drop the habit, you regain control.
    • Heres what I did. Every RIAA cd I owned I copied and Handed out. And now If I have a RIAA CD it's copied. Fuck them all.

    • How many labels are on that list?

      Yeah, right, I'm gonna stand in the middle of Virgin or HMV with that list and compare it against every CD I look at ... duh. The staff will think I'm stocktaking ... or casing the joint for a midnight "visit".

      Hm, well I could always dedicate a couple of days to memorising the list, I guess - or I could spend a couple of days watching paint dry. Tough choice.

      I suppose the implication is that we're supposed to research the CDs before we go buy them. That's sad dude.

    • Companies are huge, diversified and rarely need to do more than lip service to boycotters. Many times you're boycutting one product they make while buying two others, because they have dozens of brand names, partnerships, licencing agreements etc.

      Most of them seem to have taken the stance "If we don't give a shit now, we'll have less problems in the future because would-be boycotters know it won't change anything". That's the long-run result.

      Short-term, they simply need to tire them out. It's the same rea
    • It's really, really simple. Slashdotters try to justify piracy as some sort of movement, but when things like the RIAA suits happen they get up in arms. It just goes to show you the real concern is just getting things for free. As you pointed out, Slashdotters were saying the RIAA should do that very thing, sue individual downloaders, then they do and suddenly that's evil too--protecting your own copyrights.

      I'll remember that the next time a GPL violation article gets posted, and some company is accused

  • Helpful against piracy? (Score:5, Interesting)

    by i love pineapples ( 742841 ) on Thursday May 13, 2004 @03:09AM (#9136612) Homepage
    I'm sure a lot of universities are agreeing to this in the hopes that it will keep students from "pirating" music and thus keep the RIAA off their backs, but seeing as the students will still have to pay for the songs if they want to burn them to CD or listen to them on a mobile device, just how useful will this be?

  • I've got a better idea (Score:4, Insightful)

    by ValourX ( 677178 ) on Thursday May 13, 2004 @03:09AM (#9136613) Homepage

    Instead of paying to access the University network and paying to access Napster... why not just BYOA, download LimeWire and be free of the following evils:

    • DRM
    • University BOFHs with snoopware
    • Lawsuits from University-sniffing RIAA investigators
    • Your roomate and his/her illegal online activities

    On the other hand, I never went to University. I know that the U of R is in excess of $30k per year, though, and their student Internet access is a very slow broadband that everyone complains about.

    -Jem
    • Instead of paying to access the University network and paying to access Napster... why not just BYOA, download LimeWire and be free of the following evils:

      Because most people are not using Macintoshes. The rest of us are using Kazaa.

      LK

      • With all that spyware? Christ almighty.

        LimeWire is cross-platform. You can use it on Windows, GNU/Linux, FreeBSD, or OS X.

        I shiver to think that someone would believe that a Macintosh "computer" would own me.

        -Jem
        • With all that spyware? Christ almighty.

          Not at all. When KazaaLite was killed off Clean KMD took its place. No spyware here baby!

          LimeWire is cross-platform. You can use it on Windows, GNU/Linux, FreeBSD, or OS X.

          Of course it is, but I have yet to meet anyone in person who uses Limewire and is not a Mac user.

          LK
      • Using kazaa is just asking the RIAA to scan your illegally shared files. Why haven't people figured it out yet. Once they sue all the people sharing over 1,000 files it will be $500.

        I personally stopped pirating music (partly because I had run out of things to download a long time ago and few newer releases are worth it). I also believe in supporting artists for the music they make even if the company representing them is greedy, I have friends who are starving artists and need every penny their music coul
      • Comment removed based on user account deletion
    • I know that the U of R is in excess of $30k per year, though, and their student Internet access is a very slow broadband that everyone complains about.

      The U of R has at least 2 OC3s (Internet2 might be on a third OC3). ResNet is all 100Mbit switches and I believe they use packet shaping on those networks to keep the P2P traffic to a dull roar (they don't port block them). I'm not on ResNet but I find the University's Internet service to be excellent. If students do complain (I have no reason to believe yo
  • What's the big deal? Ohio U. are just trying to figure out if the deal would be worthwhile to its students before jumping in. It's much better than what Penn State and the University of Rochester did. I'd be pissed if I discovered that I was being charged for yet another service which I don't want or use.

  • Oh well..... (Score:5, Insightful)

    by poofyhairguy82 ( 635386 ) on Thursday May 13, 2004 @03:21AM (#9136655) Journal
    Schools have a habit of shoving tons of fees on the kids anyway. Instead of a couple kids getting screwed for downloading stuff at a given school, the schools buy "protection." Just like the Mafia.

    Oh well. At least they are just dealing with Napster; my student fees go to Microsoft [tamu.edu].

    • Nobody's buying "protection." They're buying a download service so that the students don't go illegally pirating artists' materials and rip them off, and can instead download music legally where people get compensated for their works (gasp, the horror!).

      Your obvious implication is that the RIAA is like the Mafia. What propaganda.
      • no, it's protection money. Software companies like MS leared this years ago.. the RIAA is just looking for the same deal. Years ago the software companies went after Unis for illegal software posessed by students, shared on the network. The "compromise" was that the Unis would all buy massive site licenese enough to cover all their students and faculty...then the students are "entitled" to buy said software products at a reduced rate "legally". It also has the side effect of putting the Unis in an all-o

  • i2hub.com (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Anonymous Coward on Thursday May 13, 2004 @03:25AM (#9136676)
    Both universities are on i2hub.com [i2hub.com] ;-) Why pay the industry when i2hub has everything you want?
    • Unfortunately, an email was sent in early April from someone on I2 to the RIAA and the MPAA. Since then, or possibly since i2hub was posted on Slashdot [slashdot.org], both organizations have had spiders running on the networks. A good friend of mine at my university recently recieved a letter from the network admins telling him that the MPAA had given them a list of illegal material (TV shows aren't illegal, are they?) that he was sharing. They asked him to stop sharing it and he said he did. That was about 2 weeks ago.

  • Students? (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Lord_Dweomer ( 648696 ) on Thursday May 13, 2004 @03:29AM (#9136686) Homepage
    Ok, so I'm sure we have some people who attend this school, lets hear from you guys. Is this a big debate on campus? Are the majority of students even aware of the situation/potential scumminess of Napster?

    What sorts of student organizations exist to help get word out about this issue, and what have they done thus far?

    If students start making a lot of noise about wanting this information disclosed, and the faculty tells Napster that the students want to know or they won't use the service, perhaps it might convince Napster to give the info.

    I just hope someone cracks the stupid DRM scheme Napster uses now and puts them in their place.

    • So, mistake of thinking a university home to free-spirited debate. Reading this over fresh orange juice in the morning, a cuppa.

      I'z a recent graduate of UR. Not living in the hell-hole campus (sites stop short of trimmed shrubberies). Open your eyes. Education the beaurocracy of minors and young academic B1FFs.

      Try informing an aspiring politician or, say, professional accountant of fair use. Wrong. Or a wealthy young upper middle class fraternity drone while he politely waits for the next shot down

  • Universities' goal is to cover their ass (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Douglas Simmons ( 628988 ) on Thursday May 13, 2004 @03:33AM (#9136710) Homepage

    One source of ulcers for school administrators is the threat of being sued by the **AA or a major software vendor. That liability towers over bandwidth costs. If a university were to engage in some kind of contract with a company to fill student computer entertainment demands in a legal manner, the unversity would be somewhat legally shielded as they have appeared to have made a good faith attempt to curb piracy. Even if students start figuring out proxying methods to still get their P2P through the school's gateway, a DA would be less inclined to whipe out their endowment.

    Drexel Univserity [drexel.edu], for example, made a deal with Microsoft years back to let them hand out CDs to students packed with often-pirated software. This was not to save money on bandwidth from inevitable piracy, it was not a decision influenced by ethics; rather it was purely a cover-your-ass legal rhetorical maneuver because they did not want to get sued one day. An investment at a bargain price.

    And what's with the title of this article anyway, talking about a company's non-disclosing pursuits, when the jist of the article addresses whether or not this should be an opt-in or general budget thing? Would anyone complain if their university comped everyone free HBO during this last Sopranos season? I doubt it, because this internet piracy thing is the incendiary hot button water-cooler thing whereas everybody knows HBO is a Good Thing (and that it is not TV).

  • Answers (Score:2, Interesting)

    by Anonymous Coward
    Here are the correct answers to the survey [slashdot.org]:

    1. Should the University implement this service?

    Answer: NO

    2. Would you subscribe?

    Answer: NO

    3. Do you think other students would subscribe?

    Answer: NO

    4. Do you feel this would be a viable alternative to illegal downloading?

    Answer: NO

    5. On a scale of 1 to 10, how effective would this be in reducing illegal downloads at Ohio University?

    Answer: 1, No Effect.

  • O.U. (Score:1, Funny)

    by Anonymous Coward
    8.1.2...

    somebody had to say it.
  • I think it is incredibly low to ask universities, which contribute an incalculable amount of research and knowledge that goes into making contemporary music and online distribution possible to act in a secretive manner regarding where students' tuition is going.

    I think its totally scummy. Stop screwing around with our ability to make informed decisions. Well informed people make well educated people make people more likely to create value than Napster is obviously capable of.
  • Napster makes me gag every time I look at it. :D

  • The RIAA wants to have it's own tax - Boycott 'em (Score:4, Insightful)

    by rben ( 542324 ) on Thursday May 13, 2004 @06:03AM (#9137267) Homepage

    Essentially, it seems that the RIAA wants to force universities to tax all the students in order to pay for the music listening of those who might otherwise download music illegally off the Internet.

    It's a great deal for the RIAA. They don't have to make quality products, they get paid for every student regardless of the students use of the service. The only choice the students have is to go to another school.

    I would have no objection to an opt-in setup. The FSF has already proposed a very reasonable setup that would allow ISPs to sell unlimited music exchange to customers for a reasonable fee that would go to the recording companies.

    Interestingly enough, the RIAA has refused to consider such a reasonable solution and has recently discussed raising prices. This seems odd behavior for a group trying to gain customer acceptance of a flegling business model.

    It seems to me that by raising the prices for downloading music, the RIAA is going to give new incentive to pirate their music. Doubling their prices, though, allows them to whine to Congress that now they are losing twice as much money as before. Oh no! In response, our congressional representatives will be pushed to create more poorly crafted legistlation that makes more citizens into criminals and assures the RIAA continuous revenue regardless of the quality of music they produce.

    If you object to this kind of treatment, boycott the RIAA the week of July 4th. Don't buy any music. Don't listen to the radio. Show the RIAA that it's bullying behavior has it's consequences.

  • freedom of information (Score:3, Interesting)

    by tid242 ( 540756 ) * on Thursday May 13, 2004 @07:08AM (#9137558) Homepage
    I thought that all monetary aspects of public institutions were available to the public by law. When i was in school in North Dakota (not that ND is the free-information capital of the world or anything) one could go to the library and look up all the professors' salaries and the like because they were all paid with tax dollars.

    Why would napster fees be any different? In light of the scrutiny of the increasing tuition/fees at universities as of late, i would think the people would demand transparency (looks like it's going to be a 14% hike this year at the U of MN, 52% over the past 3 years!)

    -tid242

  • I didn't know........ (Score:3, Interesting)

    by spacefrog ( 313816 ) on Thursday May 13, 2004 @08:12AM (#9137868)
    I wasn't sure who (if anybody) it was appropriate to reply to.

    My fiancee is a dead-head. They don't care who downloads or trades the live recordings, period. Trading/exchanging them is fine as long as it isn't 'for profit'.

    I have a 'small collection' (~7gb) of almost 57 hours of primarily 256Kbb rips of fairly high-quality direct tape captures made over the past (literally) close to 30 years.

    I have only learned to love the dead and their music (with or without Jerry) because of her, but it is their attitude and spirit that I love sooooo much more.

    Thank you, Daeley, I love you so much more then words could ever describe.
  • I'm curious...has anyone ever seen any money spent that could NOT have been used elsewhere?
  • I'll bet that the fees Napster have requested from those first universities are low. Very low. $1 would do it.

    Why would Napster do such a thing? It puts them on the map, and it gives them lots of participants on fast connections who can help seed the network and make it more desirable.

    Obviously Napster wouldn't want that number publicized; they'll want to make money from some of the schools.
  • I always resented being taxed with an "activity fee", since in four years they (whoever it is that gets to spend our money on "activities") never managed to dream up an activity I would pay even one penny for if I had the choice. My favorite composers run from semiretired to dead-for-centuries, and I have a feeling there'd be precious few tracks from any of them included in this service.

    Too bad Napster doesn't want its ratepayers to know what rate they're paying.
  • OSU's handbook has this [osu.edu] to say about public record requests:
    • The Ohio Public Records Act defines a "record" as any document, device, or item, regardless of physical form or characteristic, created or received by, or coming under the jurisdiction of, any public office of the state or its political subdivisions, which serves to document the organization, functions, policies, decisions, procedures, operations, or other activities of the office.

      Such records shall be promptly prepared and made available for

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