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The Courts Government News

Smutty E-Mail Legal In Australia 128

Posted by timothy from the that's-na-dingo-that's-me-wife dept.
spam-it-to-me-baby writes: "Welcome to Australia. Over the course of a few months, Aussies now can't gamble online locally, you soon may not be able to serve p0rn from a website, we have what could be the world's greatest luddite for an IT minister, but now we find there's nothing wrong legally with spreading a bit of bestiality via e-mail. Is something upside down Down Under?"
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Smutty E-Mail Legal In Australia More

Smutty E-Mail Legal In Australia

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  • Please, for the love of God, tell me that this story marks the end of the complete avalanche of inanity that was the April 1 slashdot experience. PLEASE , I beg you, tell me that it will be at least one more year before we have to live through that again. Is April 1 finally done with? Please? Please?? PLEASE, IN THE NAME OF ALL THAT IS GOOD AND HOLY, TELL ME THAT OUR LONG DARK NIGHT HAS COME TO AND END!

  • Australia and America (Score:1)

    by Anonymous Coward
    Australia is America's lapdog, why dont some of you make some more noise.. our PM listens to you guys more than the weasel listens to us.

    There are a plethora of dodgey/contradictorary laws here (www.dumblaws.com [dumblaws.com]) and this is a fine example of government hipocrasy. The article mentioned online gambling.. but forgot to mention the minister who enacted this owns a pub full of pokies.

    At least you septics have a constitution! I think its still against the law to defame the queen, that bitch ;) -Auslander

  • Some moderators have a sarcastic sense of humor... but don't worry,we metamoderators will take care of this.
  • he it the nail in the head, a post well balanced and respectful.

    This is what makes /. a wort reading.
  • You should value more your free speech, that's one of the reasons that make people risk their lives to emigrate to USA, along the better quality of life. You're free to choose your morals, but you can't force your morals onto others more than what they can force their own on you. On a side note, I didn't know about the existence of child pornography until the media uproar against it in 1998-1999, but now any uneducated pervert know that in "the internet" they could find child porn. That's backfire, isn't it?

    About gambling, mmh... I don't think that banning it is a good idea. Instead of legal casinos, you will end with illegal casinos in the hands of the Mafia, like many other things. Making something illegal will just let it be only in the hands of the illegal, and just by being illegal makes something more attractive to some folks. I know a lot of idiots that smoke pot just because it is illegal, and by doing so they are becoming the greatest rebels on town (at least in their stupid logic -_-)

    I find laughable the sexual harassment laws of the USA. I remember a documentary by John Stossel in ABC's 20/20 about it, and how you must sign special contracts in the case you wanted to date a coworker, and how the harassment comes from the impression in the demandant, not by the intention of the demanded. With this kind of barriers to start a meaningful relationship (remember that a lot of couples meet in the workplace). I doubt that should come as a surprise the high popularity of pornography; maybe Americans need a study about the (just a theory, ok?) correlation between pornography's consume and strong sexual harassment laws.

    And you shouldn't forget that jails work thanks to taxpayers, do you want to pay a pervert's roof and food?
  • Insurance is simply betting- I bet that I might get sick and require expensive care.

    How this ever got from bestiality to insurance no one will ever know... but I doubt very much anyone buying insurance is betting on getting sick and requireing expensive care. I mean, such things are very easily arranged, and a bet of this nature would be trivial to win. If you ever bought insurance you'd know that you're betting on _not_ getting sick, and buy the thing _in case_ you do, not _hoping_ to; it's not like it's all fun and games laying in a hospital bed with all your bones broken and tunes sticking out every which way, insurance funded or not.

  • Uh, ok, so you sent this message to the entire company... and what did you expect? The least of the problems here is that not everyone shares your sense of humour, and some people will find it deeply offensive (aren't all jokes made at _someone's_ expense?). The issue here is one of tact... you don't just fire off a message to everyone you know and don't know written in the same tome you'd use with a close friend. As much as you may hate protocol and etiquette it is quite required to effectively communicate with other people.
  • And what the hell is the US's obsession with calling us "down under"?!

    You'll turn the world upside down if you call US down under!
  • No doubt officials in Sacramento will be pleased to let the federal government take the fall for what California did to itself.

  • I tried living in other places (various parts of USA and Europe)... no where is any better ;).

    the entire world is fucked

  • So a person gets his salary docked for sending a legal e-mail depicting a women with a german shephard using government facilities.

    I don't know about you, but some amusing images about what happens inside government facilities are running through my head...


  • Or perhaps they coherently present a story, with good use of hyperlinks to referenced material, and anyone semi-intelligent reading the words instead of just trying to click randomly on links can easily see that the link to bestiality is indeed the main one of the story.

    And it's rare that I'll get to say that on /.

    ~Cederic

  • Get a clue. Timothy (or, more accurately, spam-it-to-me-baby) is merely pointing out some factual information about Australian laws relating to the Internet.

    It's not their fault that your country (which you love so much) has such a screwed set of laws. Face it, your government is rapidly becoming the laughing stock of the internet, and on-line ridicule like this can only help you in reversing such silly laws.

    ~Cederic
  • Sorry Tim, but that's bullshit.

    Any company/government agency that has an adequate Terms of Use statement regarding the use of their email system is covered.

    Any company/government agency that does not is in trouble, as they cannot take actions to prevent its misuse and potentially open themselves up to hefty sexual harrassment lawsuits.

    Further, as usual the predominantly US based slashdot crowd are quick to hold Australia and Australians up as the culprit for all things evil in IT related matters.

    Take a look in your own backyard... DCMA, RIAA, MPAA, software patents are all US creations.
    Its the governments that are fucked, not the people, on both sides of the pond.

  • Actually that's Cockney Rhyming Slang.., i.e. from south London. You Aussies didn't invent shit. ;)

    --
    Delphis
  • It's funny to read every few weeks about another stupid move from the Australian government. But at the end of the day, after years of stupid laws - what has changed?

    Nothing.

    The net is as free (as in speech) as it was 5 years ago. None of these laws have made any difference. Those that actually get off the drawing board go through so many committees and are so ludicrous they are easily circumvented.

    Look at the Australian Internet censorship laws - in the first six months since they came into effect, how much porn has the government erradicated? All of it? Half? 1%? No, just 93 web pages [dcita.gov.au]! That's like shooting a hundred cows in England and declaring Foot and Mouth disease cured.

  • The sad thing is that I'm so used to Australia banning internet stuff that it took me a while to realize that heading said legal instead of illegal. The first few times I read it, I thought I SAW illegal.

    It's sad that a country could build up a track record that strong.

  • What a pointless article to discuss at Slashdot. Did someone in editorial think this was an April Fools joke?
  • States can ignore Federal laws (by passing their own variants)

    You are incorrect. According to the Constitution of Australia, if a State has a law that is in conflict with a Federal law, the Federal law overrides the State law. If you're Australian, remember the recent mandatory sentencing debate? There are also some areas where states are constitutionally prohibited from passing laws. States cannot have their own armed forces, for example.

    --

  • Australia is not really a federation ... (Score:4)

    by LL ( 20038 ) on Monday April 02, 2001 @12:58AM (#321336)
    ... precisely the same way that the US states are subserviant to the federal government. Each Australian State is effectively a sovereign entity (think of it as economic block) while the federal system tries to centralise certain activities (cough*taxes*cough). This creates some rather interesting political dynamics (e.g. vertical fiscal imbalances) in that States can ignore Federal laws (by passing their own variants) or create enough hue and cry that the federal government ends up back-pedelling. The good point is that there's diversity in the system, if you don't like laws in one state you can fairly easily relocate to another, or even Christmas Island which is a separate territory (which has fewer taxes). The downer is that some shanghinans get perpetuated, for example one premier (equivalent of US State Governor) in Queensland went straight to the Queen when trying the national hobby of rocking the boat.

    What this means is that usually the government is too busy trying to sort out the mess in its own backyard to really bother the people that much (except for the recent introduction of GST which they've botched badly) so you can get away with some odd things. I believe someone mentioned that one of the world's biggest purchasers of SGI gear running a porn site is in Queensland which coincidenctally has one of the country's most conservative voters. Given the legal and economic stability and access to technology (some nice software hot spots around) it is not actually not a bad place to do IT work provided you focus on the export market and ignore the silly buggers down in the capital city.

    LL

  • Yes, it is correct actually. The mandatory sentencing debate would have been the same if it had WA, Vic, Qld, or and other state in Australia.
  • loose another IT dude that can bring the country another couple of hundred grand a year You wish....
  • I just searched the Vic govt web site. Victorian Labor Senator Jacinta Collins does not exist.
    hehe
    Ms Jacinta Marie Allan is the only Jacinta.
  • If Beastialty (or depictions thereof) are not illegal in a particular locale then passing it around is not. HOWEVER, if it is against the stated Terms of Use of the particular system it is passed on then administrative action would be neccessary, according to whatever diciplinary provisions that are made.

    With all the latest hoopla about AU, it seems that the transition from Penal Colony to Modern Utopia is almost complete

  • Smear campaign by New Zealand...... (Score:5)

    by Barbaq ( 31353 ) on Monday April 02, 2001 @01:09AM (#321341)
    Trying to portay Australia as the home of bestiality.

  • Re:And they say the US is weird? (Score:4)

    by s390 ( 33540 ) on Monday April 02, 2001 @01:10AM (#321342) Homepage
    Government (and Utility, but this may change soon in California) workers are _very_ hard to fire. They basically have strict due process (called "Civil Service") protections against unfavorable personnel actions (like, i.e., firing). It's the same in most first-world countries, including the UK, the EU, the US, Canada, Australia, NZ, Japan, etc.

    All they have to do is show up for their shift (not discernably drunk or stoned), stay awake (mostly) for eight hours, and they're guaranteed to keep their jobs, pretty much.

    In the US, somewhere around 40% of employees work for Local, State, or Federal governments. Scary, isn't it? Most of them vote, too, which is one reason it's so hard to pass meaningful tax reductions. In the UK, EU, etc., the percentage is probably even higher. Of course the idiot kept his job. H*ll, he'll probably get a raise this year! You have to be around "civil servants" for a while to figure out that they aren't motivated by the same incentives that lead most enterprise employees to be useful, productive, effective, and efficient. Public workers usually evince none of these characteristics. (But exceptions do exist.) For the most part though, "civil service" rules need changing.
  • Told me I was the only one!

    *sob, sniffle*
  • Ok, so someone was using work computers to send personal email.... If there were rules about not sending personal email, you give the person a warning and move on. What was the big deal?
  • Kellogs Corn Flakes

    Maybe replace with "The Warner Brother's Film Studio"....
  • Expensive equiptment, waste, corporate welfare.
  • "In the US, somewhere around 40% of employees work for Local, State, or Federal governments."

    This is obviously bogus. Think about your friends - do anywhere near 40% of them work for the gov't? Do even 10%? No. This wasn't even true during the world wars - there had to be many people producing war materials for each person on the front (and war materials were produced largely by private companies). Think before you post.

  • this can be solved... (Score:3)

    by DanThe1Man ( 46872 ) on Monday April 02, 2001 @12:24AM (#321348)
    you soon may not be able to serve p0rn from a website....but now we find there's nothing wrong legally with spreading a bit of bestiality via e-mail.

    So does that mean that all the Austrilan porn sites will now have to switch their servers from http to POP3?

  • Fuck I hate you Tim. Why dont you think before you post this shit? Beastiality ok in Australia? You're a prick.. this is my country you're talking about. Someone finally stands up and says people have a right to say whatever they want to each other whether it be over government computers or not and you post it as being backward. Grow up.
  • See there seems to be this assumption, be it whether you're talking about my government or you're talking about Microsoft, that there is one hive mind collective that is making these things happen. There isn't, there is a whole bunch of different people with different opinions fighting for some middle ground. Some folk would have it that anyone who read porn get dragged out into the street and killed. Others would just prefer to lock them all up. Still others would prefer to regulate the companies that provide services to porn merchants. Others would prefer to classify but not censor. Still others would prefer that there was no regulation at all. Is there any suprise that there is a difference of opinion? There's no hypocracy here because the government is not an individual. So the reporting of this story (should it need to be reported here) could simply have said "wow, a win for freedom" or "xyz inquiry decent against censorship laws" but no, we're supposed to think that there's some fundimental flaw in the logic that what is banned on tv should be banned on the internet because the government cant agree with itself. In the mean time, Timothy just keeps on baggin' .au instead of doing anything to sway the opinion of law makers.
  • But it's good beer man :) Exactly, so bascially Timothy should put his nose back up his arse and stop raggin' on our government.
  • see, if you thought about that you could have come up with a better insult. One that exemplified your knowledge of statistics.. see the correct insult is "that's because they didn't poll you".. think about it.
  • nuke the whales.
  • Think about your friends - do anywhere near 40% of them work for the gov't? Do even 10%?

    Well if you count the military and govt. contract work, yes. Just because you might not think you know anyone who fits that description doesn't mean it isn't accurate. I live in the middle of one of the largest military areas in the nation and I'd say a lot more than 40% of the folks I know are paid by the govt. one way or another.


    "Smear'd with gumms of glutenous heat, I touch..." - Comus, John Milton
  • "Unfortunately Australia seems intent on preserving it's 1930s economy for the forseeable future."

    Yep, this country needs a Sir Donald for the 00's. Sport seems the only thing the Aussies have going for them ATM.
  • OK, Oz may be weird, but God bless our tribunals and courts for protecting us from the excesses of our legislatures!
  • Don't move, stay and help vote the fscker out!
  • ...goatse.cx should put up a mail server.

  • Re:Umm...okay (Score:3)

    by bobv-pillars-net ( 97943 ) <bobvin@pillars.net> on Monday April 02, 2001 @04:32AM (#321359) Homepage Journal
    ...depicting a women with a german shephard using government facilities...

    And exactly what government facilities were the woman and her german shepherd using?

    duck!

    (Yes, I read the story; just poking fun.)

  • Ludicrous (Score:3)

    by cafelatte ( 99544 ) on Monday April 02, 2001 @12:50AM (#321360)
    I'm an Australian and have known about this for about a week now. This is not going to stop Australians from gambling, only they're going to gamble on sites overseas. The wierd thing is, Australian gambling sites may allow only overseas gamblers to gamble and not Australians. Where's the logic in that? This was the exact point made by one of the owners of an Australian gambling site. He also said that it''s not going to make much difference because about 90% of his revenue comes from outside Australia. I'm glad theregister said what they said.

  • April Fools? (Score:3)

    by cperciva ( 102828 ) on Monday April 02, 2001 @12:37AM (#321361) Homepage
    Are we still in April Fools day mode? I mean, looking at the date evidently isn't enough, based on earlier stories today...
  • Australian citizens have much worse things to worry about. For instance, the roving bands of unwashed wild dogs which rove the countryside, attacking tourists.

    (What? Those are the citizens?)

    --

  • haha :)

    Informative? Didn't anyone get the joke?

  • Oddly (or not) enough, there's already a bestiality-themed parody of "Tie me kangaroo down, sport", entitled "Bestiality's Best (Fuck a Wallaby)" [beachrugby.net]. Best sung on your way to a drunken a stupor ... the chorus refering to the toad always cracked me up for some reason :)
    --
  • Is something upside down Down Under?
    Yes, it is called "SOCIALISM", and history has granted us with a bit of scientific proof that this is exactly what happens when government is given the power to legislate what is appropriate for the peasants. More importantly, the lesson that history teaches us, is that this over-reach of power often is just a bastardization of what was initially intended perform other 'protective acts'. Many well-meaning folks backed up by their supported 'Power Hungry, but aware of the impact of telling fools what they want to hear' politicians push through laws and regulations intended to 'help save us from ourselves', yet when it backfires later (I am actually saying backfire in the sense of what the law evolves into, not the fact that said laws and regulations are innefective at their primary task and actually cause more problems by their very nature)... when it backfires later, the institutors that created/backed it do a number of interesting things:

    Blame the original opponents, especially if what has happened is exactly what was predicted by said opponents

    Ignore it (or many aspects of it) due to both ego and willful ignorance of reality

    Pile even more fluff on top of the existing law/regulation in attempt to 'put out fires with fuel'

    Act suprised that this happened, and forms a multimillion dollar 'Task Force' to look into the matter, usually ending with results that resemble the other results listed above

    I for one, think I am able to protect myself and my family from what I consider not appropriate. If my government wants to assist me, then they should provide access to education (the enemy of ignorance and bigotry) and access (not to be confused with forcing companies to provide said service) to methods/products to perform said protection... but then again, that is what the founding fathers of the United States would want. And through misquoting and misrepresentation and hidden agendas of hate and personal vendetas, this country is NOT very free anymore. It would be solved however, if everyone would stop with the feuding behavior and look at the common denominators of problems, not the superficial instances of it, and then hypocritically attacking only those things that it is trendy to attack.

  • silly thing is.. there is theory and then reality. I have often wondered why people would say the NAZI'ism was right winged while Communism/socialism was left. I guess with a magnifying glass they are. But they are like identical twins... both only being able to be differentiated by those VERY familiar with them.

    Seems like when socialism is brought up, people get very nasty. The point is, regardless of what you call it, it is socialism. Just because you switch some special interest group with a corporation doesn't really matter as far as results go. When government has the power to dictate to teh people how to live, what to like, what to dislike, how to think, who they should hire, etc... that is socialism and history has shown it does more harm than good.

    The AC that said that it is conservatism and the line about GWB is not actually correct. First (and this is another example of fact overrulling theory), it should be noted that in the US, the majority of censoring/filtering and things like the ratings system for various forms of entertainment have been children of Democrats and their spouses. Just look at what the Clinton administration handed down, then look at what he signed, then look at bills author's or at the committe sponsors. What you find is a paper trail of dem's restricting your rights. If you just point at Republican's and especially if you take blame from the real culprits and put it on the Republicans to make it easier for you, you are dooming yourself.

    I for one don't trust either of them and NEVER have. But I do observe reality and notice the dem's stripping away all my rights at a much higer rate than the republicans have. Hopefully GWB won't follow the dem's lead in that, but who knows.

    Again, like you said... labels seem to be very misleading... just like political parties. I see Democrats who sell out land to be destroyed by developers, then not only looking the other way, but helping them (and themselves) to the profits it generates. Democrats that claim to be 'for the people' but only those people that will give them power. Democrats that spread lies and deceit instead of educating the public with facts. Then I see the army of supporters that not only defend them, but actually place blame on the Republican's. Just call it like it is, don't let the media or little angry men tell you how and what to think.

    To the AC, I believe you need to get your facts straight on what the Republicans and Democrats have really been doing. If you choose to label it as conservatism, yet ignore the socialism inherent in it, that is your right. Whatever you choose to call it, it is control. If you excuse one sort of control because it doesn't 'effect' you yet, or because it only effects those whom you do not LIKE or AGREE with,then you are no different then the evil that you rage against. Put down the picket sign, and grap your phone or computer. Call the idiots that put this into place (in this case if you are an Australian) and make a difference. Don't rally to replace one evil with an even more intrusive and historically proven inneffective one.

  • The Kyoto protocol is flawed and is designed to punish succesful countries

    Excuse me if I'm wrong, but if a group of countries with less than 30% of the world's population use 90% of the world's resources (which are depleting at a rapid rate), then don't they deserve to be "punished" (where being punished is actually just being told to decrease their resource use)?

    According to conservative estimates, we have thirty years to halve the world's resource use, otherwise we will descend into an ecological nightmare.

    Basing you pollution credits on population is fundamentally flawed

    This is incorrect, basing pollution credits on GNP is the only way to do it. The "North" (First World countries) was the one pushing for these measures, and in order to convince the reluctant "South" (developing nations) that the measures are reasonable, they will have to live with far smaller per-capita resource consumption. Could you imagine convincing a country like India that despite its' massive population, it has to live with a pollution quota smaller than that of the US because it has a low GNP? This would make industrial development impossible (because of the low pollution quota), and would result in India slipping even further behind the nations of the "North".

    As an example of the vast difference between resource consumption in the "North" and "South", the resource consumption of an average German is ten times that of an average Argentinean. Basing the pollution quotas on population will cause the wasteful nations of the "North" to invest in resource-efficient solutions, and it may be possible to avoid an environmental disaster.

    If you think that resource-efficiency on this scale isn't possible, I suggest you read "Factor Four", a report by the Club of Rome, it clearly demonstrates that fourfold increases in resource productivity are both possible and profitable.

    Also, just to clear up a final point, you talk about socialist third world countries. This is a common mistake: First World countries are allied with the North-America/Europe/Japan bloc, Second World countries are those allied with the ever-shrinking Communist bloc, and Third world countries are those that are neutral. Thus, you should have said socialist second world countries.

    Sorry this is getting off-topic, but I wanted to point out the flaws in the above post.

  • Face it, your government is rapidly becoming the laughing stock of the internet

    Australia is only becoming a laughing stock because people make a big deal about these stories which would go unnoticed if they were about any other country. For example, the "illegal e-mail forwarding" story was a beat-up about a clueless article in a tabloid newspaper (and it has since been confirmed to be false by the Australian Attorney General). And if the Internet Censorship law was ever actually enacted, I sure haven't noticed... looking around the public library I'm sitting in now, half the people using the Web are looking at hard-core porn.

    Most people I talk to see the US as the laughing stock... people can't believe the stupidity of the DMCA, and the Napster decision is baffling (what's next - banning FTP bacause you can get mp3s on it?).

    Basically, I'm saying that while I can't wait for the Conservative Coalition to be beaten at the next election, Australia's track record on the Internet really isn't as bad as Americans pretend it is. From what I've heard, you can't get hard-core porn via the Internet in American public libararies :-)

  • When I read stupid comments like these from Americans, I wonder if a lot of schizophrenia genes got spread about as a result of the country being founded by religious freaks.
  • * Australian voter turnout is 99.8%, compare that to the USA.
    * Student politics is a vibrant, and crucial area of studies, much more so than in the US.
    * Most Australians are overworked, the burn-out rate (and suicide rate) is the highest in the world.

    So, I can't see how your comment about Australians being lazy is justified.
  • It's easy to see why Australian laws -should- be expected to suck...

    The preferencial voting system facilitates (read: requires) a waste of time - used either negotiating or debating (e.g. in the media) the trade-off's of doing this or that "preference" deal with another political party...

    The fact that the gov't can decide -when- to hold their next election (i.e. rather than "every 2 (or 4) years") makes similar time-/space-demands on medium.

    RESULT: Less time to cover the implications of actual decisions on political issues.

    People expend their energies discussing non-content issues like preferential voting alternative and/or when the next election should be held.

  • When I read about Australian gov't decisions, I wonder if a lot of schizophrenia genes got spread about as a result of being a former prison colony.

  • And then make mad, passionate love to it...
  • The Australian Democrats, who currently have the balance of power in the Senate, have said that they're not going to support this law. Also, the Labor Party has said that they don't want to support this law, because the Liberal Party thought of it. Therefore, we shouldn't really worry too much.

  • Jacinta Collins is noisy enough that you would have heard of her if you ever read a newspaper.

    How about you look at the federal government site [aph.gov.au]?

    Sure the article described her as "Victorian Labor Senator Jacinta Collins", which is a little ambiguous. In this instance, they meant "Senator for Victoria", not "Member of the Legislative Assembly in Victoria" nor even "Labor Senator during Queen Victoria's reign".

  • "In the US, somewhere around 40% of employees work for Local, State, or Federal governments."

    This is obviously bogus. Think about your friends - do anywhere near 40% of them work for the gov't? Do even 10%? No. This wasn't even true during the world wars - there had to be many people producing war materials for each person on the front (and war materials were produced largely by private companies). Think before you post.

    There is a very simple explanation for that. Government employees don't have friends. They probably aren't even born from natural human parents. Didn't I read a slashdot story about the government fabricating them to reduce training costs?

  • "The worker who sent out the e-mail, a middle manager, has had his salary docked"

    Excuse me? This person still works for the Austrailian government?

    There is something VERY wrong with this picture.

    DanH
    Cav Pilot's Reference Page [cavalrypilot.com]
  • I cant decide if a) I'm livid or b) I just want to move out. This is one of the most absurd articles about IT down under. So the proles cant have webiste flashing a few wobbly bits and yet some jerk can send bestiality crap and get away with it. Whats wrong with that picture? What next, legalised child porn?

    I totally agree we have twat as a IT minister. The Howard goverment knows NOTHING about how IT works and it sure as hell knows nothing about the Internet. Is it any wonder that most of the gob smacking WTF? arctiles about rights online are coming from here?

    Dont expect it to get any better. The other bunch we could elect in are just as bad and the other choices dont even bear thinking about. Cant we have politicians with a clue for a change?

    Oh wait. If that ever happened, the world would end.
  • The point is, under the Workers Anti-Discrimination act, that type of email is illegal and can result in criminal charges being bought agains the company in question. As this is the Australian Public Service, before you get in, your work terms explicitly prohibit sending this type of stuff. In fact, if I remember correctly, 16 workers at Telstra (Australian Telco) were sacked ofr having porn.

    What we have here is a double standard. On one hand, yuo have a governmet frothing at the mouth to get rid of all Evil On The Internet In The Name Of A Good Cause (Dunno what that is they cry, we will work that out later) and the people paid to enforce such laws, well, they are the worst offenders.

    Usually, if I get a emial from a co-worker with something I dont like, I send back a fairly ppinted reply, requesting not to get similar again. That tends to work. Why cant we just have that and just move along as there is nothing to see here?
  • Mod this guy up. I agree with him

    And MR Troll modder: This is actually something I've been wanting to say for a while. Moding someone down for getting Irate for having his country bagged is plain unfair. Hey We don't all live in the states, and some of us just happen to like our countries. Yes Our govt can be pricks at times, but if someone gets upset at someone bagging the country he loves, don't mod him as a troll. That's an abuse of the mod system and it's unfair.
  • Hell yeah. I think alot of us in Aust don't really understand the implications of these laws, and kinda don't care. It's sad. BUT, in the scheme of things, this is part of a wider scenario where the Govt is trying to push some wierd 1950's conservative happyland agenda on a modern forward thinking nation. The liberal conservative party is definately heading for a poll. The exit's and straw polls are polling the libs reeeal bad. Labor in WA has been full on kicking ass now there in and fixing all sorts of conservative rubish. Let's take that national.
  • Ok it's cheap to do a word substitution gag when the grammar of the original post is funny enough, but .....
    So the gov tries to limit rights, so what - i can't see how that is a bad thing in a country with far to much rights (and if you don't believe aust has to much rights their is something wrong with you). Sure, maybe people can just go to overseas sites but one liberty i would like to take is that some won't. And even if only 1 person does not gain freedom than cannot afford than that is a victory. An addicted rights-activist with access to an oline site is quite scary. Self regulation does not work, slashdot is not very good at turning people away. Perhaps if various austyralian state goverments with an eye on easy living had not allowed such an explosion of rights in the last 10 years (here in queensland it is rediculess how much in the last 10 years) than it would not be such a problem. [snip blah blah]
    ergo: get a life.
  • Well said.

    And what the hell is the US's obsession with calling us "down under"?!
  • lol, obviously not!

    I saw the rating and was thinking "Informative? wtf?!" :)
  • You're an American, right?

    I've never understood your problem with taxation.

    You're forgetting that you also get something like good universal health care and public transportation for your tax money -- even to those who otherwise couldn't afford it (and unlike you Ayn Rand fanatics would like to believe not all of them are simply "lazy").

    I had a tumour surgically removed from my stomach at a university hospital. I was admitted four days after I was diagnosed, had a smooth operation and got excellent care for two weeks at the ward. The immediate cost? $200. At a private clinic this would have cost me at least $5000, which I could not have afforded at this stage of my life (I've spent all my personal budget surplus on computers and stocks).

    "Get an insurance. It's unfair that I have to pay for someone else's operation", you say? The problem with the health insurance is that it can severely restrict the way the doctors can treat you. It also promotes social inequality as only the rich can get proper treatment.

    In the finaly analysis, yes I feel the 28% income tax is worth it. That way we get good services for everybody, which in itself makes me feel good.

  • Knowing how most politicians are, I enjoyed myself by going to his website and submitting the following email. Let's see how sharp he is and how many times he has to re-read it before he catches on. :) "Just wanted to congratulate you on the award that you received. I feel that no person deserves it more than you do. The award I am referencing is here at http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/6/17941.html You are absolutely the most qualified person to receive this achievement and you can be sure that I will gladly nominate you for it next year and in the following years to come, which should be as long as you hold office. Your achievements are on a par with Richard Nixon, Theodore Bundy, George W. Bush, and others. You can rest assured that you are in a singular group of individuals."
  • Better than Yanks, try Seppo's.
    it goes like this: Seppo=short for 'Septic Tank'
    'Septic Tank'=rhymes with 'Yank'
    'Yank'=slang for 'Anyone from the USA'

    gotta love Aussie Surfie Slang. All that salt water must do something to their brains.

    GEV.

  • you're free to shop around to get the best coverage for your money

    Until, god forbid, you actually get sick and use your insurance for what you purchased it for in the first place.

    Good luck renewing your insurance should you ever find yourself in such dire straits. Medical insurance is a scam. It amounts to private companies taxing the public. They provide even worse service than government bureaucracies.

  • I couldn't agree more. Taxes pay for roads, airports, waste facilities, etc. They provide the infrastructure for the Universities, even private ones (albeit indirectly), which provide the private sector with educated graduates. Anti-tax proponents always try the "bad apple spoiling the barrel" argument, but this is truly a poor characterisation of the reality of taxes.

    Landlords love tax reduction. Their tenants can pay more rent for the same real estate!

  • Your ignorance of Australian culture is impressive...

  • Ah, yes, Melbourne, one of the world's great cities. The restaurants on Lygon Street are fantastic. The Italian food is great, but don't forget the culinary contributions of the Thais, Indonesians, Malaysians, Turks, Indians, Greeks, and dare I say, Brits.

    Australian and American cultures are similiar in many respects. They both honor self-reliance. They both have great literary traditions. However, the cultures differ in (at least) two fundamental ways. Australians are not as obsessed with money. Success is recognized in many forms. For example, the Wallabies is the Australian national rugy union team (rugby union as opposed to rugby league). This is a semi-pro team that boasts long, proud careers and garners international acclaim. Secondly, Australians are more inclusive and honor contributions to the community. A national motto is, "Everyone gets a fair go." Fred Hallows [achievers-odds.com.au] was a great Australian.

    Notably, Australians have higher patronage rates of libraries, gallaries, museums, and stage productions. Here are some other bits and pieces:

    • Dame Joan Sutherland, widely recognized as the 20th century's premier diva, is Australian.
    • Architecture: Sydney Opera House and the Sydney Harbour Bridge.
    • JJJ [abc.net.au], alternative music radio.
    • The Australian Digger [kmike.com]
    • The literary offerings of David Malouf, Peter Carey, and Patrick White.
    • Australian aborignal painting.
    • Cinema, including Picnic at Hanging Rock, Walkabout, Priscilla: Queen of the Desert, The Castle and even Mad Max.
    • Comedy, including the D-gen, Roy and HG, and Dame Edna.
    • The National Art Museum, with works by Marcel Duchamp and Jackson Pollack (purchased back in the seventies, probably when you but a gleam in your father's eye).
    • Horse racing and camel racing (no less).
    • Yacht racing, including the world famous Sydney to Hobart.
    • And finally, a mentality that loves larrikinsm, improvisation, and good-natured humour in the face of adversity.

    The list goes on and on. I suggest you're quite mistaken about the nature of Australian culture.

    Oh yes, let's not forget that it was the Australian culture that gave us the 2000 Summer Olympic Games, arguably one of most memorable games of the modern Olympic movement.

  • As an American living in a hi tech area on the east coast (RTP), we are getting taxed heavily, don't have health care paid for by the taxation, and the public transportation we do have is pathetic.

    Some argue that the public transportation is pathetic because everyone takes cars, I believe everyone uses the car because the public transportation doesn't run to convenient locations on a convenient reliable schedule. But none of that matters,

    because we're still taxed into 'barely getting by' status, and not seeing either of the benefits that you mention to justify such taxation.

    Insurance works when your work provides it as a benefit, and if it doesn't, you're free to shop around to get the best coverage for your money. If you weren't taxed so heavily, you could afford better insurance. If the insurance companies wanted your business they'd invent a plan that fit into your budget. It's called lessaiz-faire economics, go and learn it. No one owes you these things, least of all a government funded on the backs of everyone else.

    A host is a host from coast to coast, but no one uses a host that's close
  • Insurance is simply betting- I bet that I might get sick and require expensive care. The insurance company bets I won't and that they'll profit off the bet.

    HMOs are much more sinister, being that they get to choose the doctors and coach the doctors as to what treatments are permissible.

    When I lived in Israel, I noticed that they do have a form of health care for all, but taxation is done far differently. They don't have a sales tax, and state tax/federal taxes don't hit one time a year, but instead are taken monthly from the paycheck and from the monthly property tax.

    Here in the states, I have good medical insurance (and yes, I've had the misfortune of needing to use it, thanks) and of my bi-monthly salary of 2,479.20, I get to take home $1,661.75. And this is without your federal health care and a useless to non-existant public transportation system.
    Thanks but no thanks, I'd like to start seeing more of the money I'm supposedly being paid.

    The title of this thread is "Taxation's not simply bad," to which I answer, while nothing in modern Government is simple, taxation is bad.
    Part of how we got to this position is that the law stopped being used to only make rulings on property and property rights, and began to be used for legislating social change. I contend that while this may have led to a few good results, it has also led to much abuse and distortion of truth. The end does not justify the means.

    A host is a host from coast to coast, but no one uses a host that's close
  • "Means south. Please feel free to call them Yanks in exchange."

    no just stupid... they're dumb arses for pullin outta the kyoto protocol

    but we're stupider... we're following them like sheep :)
  • Is it just me or are other Australians embarrassed by our government. I am embarrassed just on IT issues let alone other issues (SORRY see its not that hard). Remember fellow Aussies, it is an election year this year so lets stop being embarrassed and stick it to Little Johnny in te Polls!!!
  • So a person gets his salary docked for sending a legal e-mail depicting a women with a german shephard using government facilities. Does something about this not seem right to other people? I have two questions:

    1) If distributing porn via a web server is illegal in Australia, how come this isn't?

    2) Why does this matter?
  • sorry...I misread something. Question 1) If distributing porn via a web server will be illegal in Australia, why won't this?
  • Ok, this question has been raised before.. but basically never answered..

    Im an Aussie, and im getting sick and tired of these stupid laws that Alston keeps passing to do with the net, and how he never helps internet business...

    So... as soon as I get my uni degree, im outa here.. Where can I move? Somewhere were the government is reltivly intelligent, but not broke or curropt. Somewhere where its not illigal to play my DVD's or backup my cd's to mp3's. Somewhere that embraces IT, and has alot of jobs avaialable..

    Where can I live? I'd like to think it was Australia.. but unless they fix up these stupid laws, not a chance!!
  • but mate, its the entire phylosiphy of the thing.. the government fucks with me, they loose another IT dude that can bring the country another couple of hundred grand a year :)

  • Hmm lets see here...

    • Kellogs Corn Flakes
    • The Owen sub-machine gun
    • The Boomerang
    • Black box flight recorder [defence.gov.au]
    • Polymer bank note
    • The Orbital engine [orbeng.com.au]
    • Hills hoist clothes line
    • Vegemite
    • refrigeration
    • first feature length film - "The Kelly Gang" 1906
    • first movie review - 1907 published in the Bulliten magazine
    • pernament crease trousers (1957)
    • The world's first milk bar opened in Martin Place, Sydney, in 1933, offering "milk shakes" for fourpence (extra for an egg yolk). The idea was taken to Britain by an Australian entrepreneur in 1935
    • the bionic ear
    • the wine cask
    • the torpedo - 1874 Lous Brennen
    • The tank - 1912 Lance de Mole
    • Paper machine gun belt (reduces jamming)
    • the two-stroke lawn mower (victa)
    • The Interscan aircraft landing system
    • atomic absorption spectroscopy
    • in vitro fertilisation and frozen embryo implantation
    • snake bite antivenene
    • The stump jump plough
    • major contributions into the use of Penicillin & anit-biotics
    • The notepad
    • The Xerox photocopying machine (developed using research completed ay Sydney University in 1902)
    • The electric drill
    • Postage stamps
    • First "round-the-world" airline
    • automatic letter sorting machine (1930)
    • Use of Lithium for depression treatment
    • Latex gloves (1945)

    Should I stop now?

  • they aren't motivated by the same incentives that lead most enterprise employees

    If countries were lead by people with the corporate mentality, we'd be really screwed. It'd be a damned police state where everybody would have to fear an execution for not performing well enough (or just because excess population must be "laid off" in order to "cut expenses").

    The fact is that representative democracy does not work. The next best option after being able to really make a difference by voting is to have an inefficient government. The more inefficient the government is, the less chance it has to control our lives. That's why I favour big government. In fact, seeing how "efficient" the UN is, I would welcome even a World Government.

  • >Is something upside down Down Under?
    > Yes, it is called "SOCIALISM", an

    No, No, No - The socialists lost.
    The ruling party is called "Liberal" the same way that East Germany was called a "Democratic Republic" when it wasn't.

    The founder of the party, Sir Robert Menzies (alias Pig-Iron Bob, for selling iron to Japan during the pre-WW2 invasion of Asia) announced in the foundation speech that the profit motive is the highest form of human expression (or similar words). Think of the Republican party, but with a very small membership.
  • >Australians learn to get off their bums and get involved, like Americans do

    I didn't know that all adult US citizens voted!
    Personally I think that it is the duty of all citizens in a democracy to "get off their bums" and vote - and that is something that is enforced in Australia.
  • It's a shame about those bestiality pictures though. I not very familiar with Australian law, but they must not have very strong protections against sexual harrassment.

    I know this is a bit late but what the hell do bestiality pictures have to do with sexual harrassment?

    Any workplace where employees send each other smut is a hostile workplace to women, and the people responsible ought to be sued, if not prosecuted and jailed.

    Whoah! Easy tiger! So obviously porn creates the false idea that women are to be used for sex? ... Oh shit! Thinking about it you might be right!
    Nah! I still disagree because of a couple of points... 1. You're referring to smut in general and you've got to wonder what you think of women if you think that sex with an animal has anything to do with women.
    2. Assuming you were referring to pictures of women - how on earth does a picture of a naked woman make a man hostile to women? You might be extraordinarily beautiful but I'm still going to obey you if you're my boss or order you if I'm your boss. If a man can't handle that then it's his misconception of women and circulating porn isn't going to create that misconception in the same way that circulating pictures of ugly women dressed in suits isn't going to destroy that mis-conception. In the end it's a picture and people who can't handle that (ie you) should get a grip on reality, close their eyes and listen to someone speak for a bit.
    3. Men cannot deny their sex drive. It's like a womans period or a humans urge to protect the young. While we're jailing all the men for being natural why don't we just jail all the women as well? I'm sure that'll solve everything!

    God: You've been accused!
    Man: Off what?
    God: Looking at naked women!
    Man: Well maybe you shouldn't have required us to reproduce.
    God: Well Terri accused you! It wasn't me!

    Bah! What am I wasting my time for?


    Pinky: What are we going to do tomorrow night Brain?
  • Actually, thats New Zealand you are thinking of...
  • So some guy passes around a dirty video because he thinks it is funny. No money changed hands.

    So he was a little stupid, and he shouldn't have done that because of his office as a government censor.

    I cannot see why this is interesting news. I don't see either how it merits the headline. The headline might just as well read the other way "Poor internet worker gets his salary docked because of writing email. What happens to our rights of free expression ?".

    And anyway, did you know that the dirty email contained de-css source in the lower bits ? ;-)

  • Just more proof that government has no idea what government is doing. While I personally disapprove of porn, ESPECIALLY that involving animals (other than humans) and humans, I do think it is wrong for Government to tell us that if we want to, we cannot watch it.

    I won't ever be watching porn. I find it degrading to the human race, but I don't think government has the right to tell us that we cannot, let alone a government which has no idea what it is doing.

  • Australia - Land of the free choice? (Score:4)

    by SirFlakey ( 237855 ) on Monday April 02, 2001 @03:34AM (#321412) Homepage
    Ok, so I might agree to the stupidety that is associated with the email forwarding stupidety or even the call to filter net content. But from the point of view of someone that might occasionally buy a scratchie (scratch lotto ticket) from the local newsagent the gambling angle is a valid concern. Gambling is pretty widespread in Australia and to limit access to those that can board (a free) Bus to the local casino does not sound unreasonable to me.

    I do however wish that Mr Alston hire someone with a brain before making statements that lead to unenforcable laws. Sh*t even a Marketing drone could tell you some of these laws sound implausible (ok ..maybe not a marketing drone). Australia needs more support for IT companies to whaul themselves out of the crap they have fallen into, not more stupid laws for people to laugh at.
    --

  • IIRC, this isn't quite true. The Labor (left-wing) party will probably vote as a bloc against the bill, true. The sting in the tail comes from the Democrats (centrist) and other party-goers...

    At least one Democrat (whose name escapes me - can anyone clear this up?) has said he'll support the bill, on the grounds that Internet gambling is draining money from the pockets of middle- and lower-class Australia and must be stopped. (I'm not going to *touch* the reasoning behind this.) Bob Brown (Australian Greens: he's IIRC pretty conservative on social issues) may well support the legislation as well. Len Harris (One Nation, hysterically right-wing) I don't know about.

    Let's take a worst-case scenario (from our POV). All of the minority parties vote for the bill, and that unknown Democrat breaks party lines to vote for the bill.

    Doing the math (simple majority, 76 senators)...
    39 votes are needed to pass the bill.
    Liberal(31), National(3), CLP(1) coalition: 35 senators
    Bob Brown (Greens): 1
    Len Harris (PHON): 1
    Brian Harradine (Ind.): 1
    Unknown Democrat: 1

    That's 39 votes in the Senate. The bill passes into law.

    I repeat, I don't know if this is anywhere near fact - but it's a pretty scary theory.
  • At least 40% of my paycheck is going to the government in some way: income tax, social security, state income tax, state sales tax, excise taxes, property tax. If it's not mostly paying for civil serpents, then where is it going?
  • As far as I can tell, the Oz legislature keeps proposing these inane things, they draw all sorts of criticism, then mostly they die in committee. But the idiot notions die very quietly, rather than embarrass the idiot who proposed them. By contrast, in the USA they append stuff like this to an unrelated bill at the end of the session, it gets passed by Senators and Congressmen who haven't even read it, and then six months later there's a public stink about it -- if we're lucky. Seems like the Ozzies might have it over us; even if their legislature often sounds like one of Molly Ivins commentaries on the (incredibly stupid, according to her anyway) Texas legislature, at least the Ozzies get a chance to comment on the BS before it gets voted on...
  • (1) Gambling debts are in no way legally enforceable. (2) Enforce the extortion laws, so they don't do very well at collecting illegally.
  • Or is it that the gov't is still being run by the inbred descendants of the original wardens and large landowners?

  • Suggestion Made from Slashdot Reader (Score:5)

    by Salieri ( 308060 ) on Monday April 02, 2001 @12:48AM (#321421)
    Salieri writes, "Ever notice [dictionary.com] how it's sometimes very difficult [bell-labs.com] to tell which is the real [real.com] or relevant [retrogames.com] link [zeldagames.com] in the article [dcita.gov.au] write-up [slashdot.org]? Perhaps the editors [freshmeat.net] can distinguish where the main attraction [wisc.edu] is." He then clicks preview to make sure the links work.

    --------------------------------
  • Too bad you have to resort to name calling.

    In any workplace people should be allowed to mail stuff to each other, as long as it doesn't eat up too much work time. Public workers are human too, and some of them actually like to mail a joke or a funny picture to a co-worker every once and a while. This even saves time because you can relax a couple of minutes when you have some humor when working, after which you are more productive. If you expect people to work 8 hour (with lunch/coffee break) and expect them to pay full attention/concentration this full period without a minute of fun every once and a while, you start talking about slavery.

    This tax paying thing is just like the typical hypocrite American reaction: we pay taxes and they shouldn't waste it. This is true in essence, but it doesn't mean you can deny a public worker any form of humor. Most programmers like funny stuff in the mail every once in a while, and so do government workers.

    This is my first point. My second point is that the fact that bestiality is mentioned, as if this makes it worse. Also starts to look like the typical Americal reaction: violence is no problem, anything that has to do with sex is wrong/illegal/filthy/etc..

    The person who told this story can A. not see that public workers are human too and B. doesn't see difference between bestiality and really illegal stuff. Therefore I (and any sane person) cannot take him seriously. It's just so clearly a populistic viewpoint ("look: we cannot do this and they can do this other thing which I personally find vulgar and therefore it must be made punishable to do it"). Sad, really.

  • Get a wobbly bit of cardboard out and sing.... Tie me Kangaroo down sport Tie me Kangaroo down.....
    ----------------------------------------------

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