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Cryptome to be Terminated by Verio/NTT
Posted by
CmdrTaco
on Sun Apr 29, 2007 10:33 AM
from the is-this-the-whole-story dept.
from the is-this-the-whole-story dept.
George Maschke writes "Cryptome, a website concerned with encryption, privacy, and government secrecy, has received two weeks' notice from Verio that its service will be terminated for unspecified "violation of [its] Acceptable Use Policy." Cryptome has a history of making publicly available documents and information that governments would rather keep secret. For the notice, and a public response by Cryptome webmaster John Young, see Cryptome Shutdown by Verio/NTT."
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Already down - thanks slashdot (Score:5, Funny)
and get it shut down in minutes.
Re:Already down - thanks slashdot (Score:5, Informative)
and get it shut down in minutes.
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Re:Already down - thanks slashdot (Score:5, Informative)
Cryptome and its affiliated sites will continue with another ISP, in the US or elsewhere. Or if necessary, underground, or via means not easily shuttered, or by way of whatever is invented for opposing technologies of information control (credit to Steven Wright, author of The Technologies of Political Control: http://cryptome.org/stoa-atpc.htm [cryptome.org]).
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Oer the land of the unfree and the home of weasels (Score:4, Interesting)
Come on America, we all used to look up to you as the beacon of freedom, but now your country is being turned into a Tudor monarchy, within a few years there will be no freedom left, will the last one out please turn off the lights when you leave.
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Re:Oer the land of the unfree and the home of weas (Score:2)
Re:Oer the land of the unfree and the home of weas (Score:5, Insightful)
I don't think that's what happened. I suspect what happened was that someone in the US government saw something they didn't like, and sent a National Security Letter or other such silliness to Verio. Verio of course can't legally disclose that, but given that Verio had been always been very forthright with John Young in the past but is being tight-lipped about the situation now, I think it's quite possible that something like this is behind Verio's actions.
Gotta love living in a nation where the government makes you do their own damn police work against someone else against your will, and then threatens you with jail if you say anything about it.
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Evil, evil brits! (Score:3, Funny)
First they invent global warming as an issue (Margaret Thatcher, of all people). Then they give us bad intel, embroiling us in an unwinnable quagmire of a war. Now they attempt to close down our only source for rea
any good soul? (Score:4, Interesting)
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Re:any good soul? (Score:5, Informative)
I was able to read all of the pages peviously withdrawn with the exception of one (the Irish injunction) in minutes without going to cryptome. The rest of the site can also be found in the usual places.
If people are dumb to know about things like this I suspect we sholdn't go out of our way to tell them.
Here's an excerpt from a document withdrawn in 2001:
UNDERSTANDING AND HELPING INDIVIDUALS WITH HOMOSEXUAL PROBLEMS
Copyright 1995
LDS Social Services
USE OF THE DOCUMENT
This training document has been prepared for the exclusive use of LDS Social Services to assist staff, interns, and contract providers in their work with individuals having homosexual problems. Because the document is approved only for "in house" use, it should not be reproduced nor distributed to others outside of LDS Social Services.
UNDERSTANDING AND HELPING INDIVIDUALS WITH HOMOSEXUAL PROBLEMS
HISTORICAL PERSPECTIVE
For more than 100 years homosexuality has been a topic of scientific and psychotherapy inquiry and debate. Freud and his contemporaries viewed homosexuality as a deviation or "inversion" of natural psychosexual development, the causes of which being as varied and numerous as the theorists espousing them. According to Freud, the deviation resulted primarily from a distorted parent-child relationship which led the child to reject his or her own gender role and identify with the opposite~sexed parent. This view received considerable empirical support later in this century through studies by Irving Bieber and a number of other researchers (Siegelmm, 1987).
But! These things hang by a thread. I would posit that people who want them archived should post them to usenet. A lot. In a world where news postings are routinely made into "google ad blogs" there'll be lots of copies on many servers around the world.
Some people think you can delete things off the Internet. They are fools.
(Note the invalid copyright notice on the above document. You have to say who it's copyrighted by, not just a date. Of course as an excerpt here for academic purposes it's covered by fair use under US copyright law).
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Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
Don't be like that. Those are the people who need the most help. They really can't help it. It was part of their conditioning as they grew up. It actually is very difficult to overcome. Believe me, I know. We all need help more than ever now.
Some people think you can delete things off the Internet.
We show them otherwise and problem solved. But we must show them, however graphically as necessary and by what
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Haha. Longer than that. There was a CIA study in the 1970s about this that concluded as long as there are modems and phone lines nothing about the network can be controlled. But who reads those things anyway?
I understand very well the implications of the US adopting the Berne convention rules on copyright on Jan 1 1990, I was just pointing out that a badly formed copyright notice looks foolish. With a
wrong. (Score:5, Informative)
if you want to go after somebody with a DMCA notice on something with no notice and no registration, you can easily register the copyright years later, then go after them.
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Re:any good soul? (Score:5, Insightful)
Now one can argue that as soon as the owner places a work on a publicly accessible location, such as a blog or on Slashdot, that you implicitly grant others the right to copy that work. That may be a stretch, and would depend on the situation. If the acceptable use policy of the site says that all submissions are reproducible that is much different than if you have a site in which you have to login and pay a fee in order to retrieve documents or other works (think DRM free pay music sites). However, just because some information is "leaked" one way or another, such as the LDS document sited, it does not mean that the owner of the work gave the permission or relinquished their rights. Hence, even the "fair use" of a small part of their work may not pass muster. One could argue that their internal documents on how they treat homosexuality are not only copyrighted, but in fact Trade Secrets, and there is no fair use of Trade Secrets. As long as they took reasonable steps to protect those items the leaking of them does not change their status. So it could be said that the web site should not have published the documents has they done something as simple as read the beginning which indicated they were confidential internal documents.
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explination (Score:2, Interesting)
No, that only applies in a democratic country (Score:2, Insightful)
That was quite some time back though.
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Yesterday I couldn't find my goddamned keys anywhere; I put them right there on the side and the next day they were gone..
Bush won't think twice about shorting your car battery, rusting your bike chain or cutting holes in the bottom your pockets; he's just that evil. My co-workers say I need to stop ranting about Bush and that I should get back to work.. Clearly a violation of
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Unless you're about to "go postal" you should be thinking 1st Amendment, not 2nd.
More on-topic - maybe they should look into moving to ibiblio.
Re:No, that only applies in a democratic country (Score:4, Funny)
Which is why he gave orders that all US bullets should be coated in pig fat.
Not only does it stop them from rusting but it also sends your enemies to hell if they are Jews or Moslems or Christians (and it happens to be a Friday).
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Banter aside, I'll make the argument simple for you.
1. A leader of a country conducting a war of aggression [wikipedia.org] against another has committed a crime against humanity.
2. George Bush has conducted a war of aggression against another country.
C. George Bush has committed a crime against humanity.
We are looking at 600,000 dead [mit.edu] between 2002-2006 as the result. Not to mention the thousands of maimed and dead U.S. soldiers. If the 600,000 people that died were people that lived in the U.S., would you be talking
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"Bush" is not a synonym for "American foreign policy" or "the American government" or "the Bush administration" as you seem to think it is. If the government requested that the site be taken down, and the site actually didn't violate any of the terms of service, that's fine and I'm interested to hear it.
My only point was that it's not "Bush", it's the FBI/whatever organization/bureau/agency. People who think everything bad the government does can be attributed to the pr
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Long Term Ramifications (Score:5, Insightful)
Good way to restrict 'evil' information dissemination to the masses.
What is next, 'hate' sites being cut loose? Or 'independent freedom talk' being removed from the digital landscape?
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The problem here is not the ISP but with the laws that cause those fears. The blacklisting is done with laws, not AUPs.
Spammers being okay with Verio/NTT, what we see here is an illustration of the kinds of behavior the relevant laws were meant to circumscribe. It's harder to make a legal and business case for a political speech site than it is to send people fake ads.
mirrors (Score:5, Informative)
http://cryptome.quintessenz.org/mirror/cryptome-s
Yet, VERIO.NET are happy to host spammers (Score:5, Insightful)
http://www.spamhaus.org/sbl/listings.lasso?isp=ve
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Of course, it's VERIO's network, they're free to have whomever they like as customers. I just find it dubious that they're TOS'ing Young for abuse or violations of their AUP when they simultaneously decide to host spamming scum:
http://www.spamhaus.org/sbl/listings.lasso?isp=ver io.net [spamhaus.org]
I think they might be, actually - in several of the emails in the linked conversation between Verio and Cryptome, it warns them that people repeatedly receiving DMCA notices are in violation of the AUP. Doesn't sound like it matters whether the notices are fair or unfounded.
Freedom to dissent? (Score:5, Insightful)
We don't allow this kind of dissent in Soviet Amerika. If your not with us your a terrorist.
Ok so that's a bit over the top but really what's this coming to? Where do we draw the line on Police state America?
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I'm going to assume from "you're" (har har) comments that ya'are a Republican. Its that or you'r just a spelling natsi.
So at what point do you think we are safe enough? How many freedoms must we loose? Will you allow the government to post guards in shopping malls and nigh
Argh! This sucks (Score:5, Insightful)
It's also a sad day in it's message that there is now, ultimately, no genuine free speech left on the net. If the state really really wants to suppress your message, it can do so. It's slow, labour intensive, and expensive for them to do this, so they don't usually bother; but when they need The System to function, it does.
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As industry becomes the defacto policy-maker by blithely re-establishing the rule of cartels and monopolistic reach, purchasing political loyalty or even installing their own CEOs to government posts, then they will be judged by governmental standards. One of those standards is censorship.
The function of government in the USA has been subverted by a political class of corporatists who, more often than not, literally write the bills they expect thei
Pcik a new ISP (Score:4, Interesting)
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Personally, I think the energy should be spent finding better hosting. That is one problem with the activist types - any setbacks become a part of a larger conspiracy. Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.
And sometimes a cigar will cause a president to get impeache
Re:Pcik a new ISP (Score:5, Interesting)
> ISP. So friggin' what? Pick a different ISP.
Cryptome IS watched by various intelligence, counterintelligence, and law enforcement agencies. Young posted a funny exchange he had once with the "duty officer of the day" at a TLA; the guy told him that a certain document had been released accidently; could it please be withdrawn? Young of course said no, so the guy then said "I guess it is too late for this conversation not to be posted too?" - making it clear that he knew very well how Young runs Cryptome.
So it may be very difficult for him to find another ISP. Maybe one related to Qwest will take him on, but they ISP has to know they WILL come under additional law enforcement pressure just as a result of hosting that site.
sPh
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Re: (Score:3, Insightful)
Yes it is, and so now the burning question is which document of the
thousands on Cryptome caused someone at one of those agencies to turn
some powerful-enough screws to make Verio pull the plug without
breathing a word about which document it might be.
We must find what the government wishes to keep hidden and shine a
spotlight on it, because that's how free and open nations remain so.
archive.org (Score:2, Funny)
archive.org wayback machine cache [archive.org] is my friend.
well with that kind of use policy.. no wonder (Score:4, Informative)
Move to NearlyFreeSpeech.net (Score:3, Informative)
My only relation is a happy, new customer. It may not be the best fit for Cryptome, but there are at least hosting providers that do give a shit about not bowing down to the status quo.
Why he stays in USA (Score:3, Interesting)
This should be done BEFORE making his site.
Re:SIX (6) Years Old (Score:4, Insightful)
No everything on the page is not six years old.
Go back a reread it.
There is a whole email chain included, on the mirrordot link, stretching back to 2001 (and probably further I did not read the whole chain)
I doubt cryptome will have trouble finding hosting, honestly I'm sort of surprised that they use Verio/NTT
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Re:Every day... (Score:5, Insightful)
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