Getting the Best Deal From Dell — Or Not

Nom du Keyboard writes "When The Consumerist published 22 tips for getting the best deal from Dell Computers, according to a self-described former Dell sales manager, Dell fired back with a take-down notice. You might want to look quickly, in the event it does get taken down. The Consumerist's lawyer's initial response was to deny the takedown request."

Well, since it might get taken down...

Full text from http://consumerist.com/consumer/insiders/22-confes sions-of-a-former-dell-sales-manager-268831.php [consumerist.com]
Anon because I'm not a karma whore and because I add nothing to the post. Enjoy :)
***
A former Dell kiosk manager writes us to share helpful tips about doing business with Dell. He has no particular problems with Dell, he just wanted to share some helpful tips for consumers looking to get the best deal. He includes info on getting the best deal from the website, different kinds of promotions the Dell offers, insider details on how the kiosk sales reps are compensated, what coupons and deals they have to offer you to close the deal, the email format for Dell in case you're thinking of launching an EECB, where to take your Dell credit card complaints, which extended warranties to avoid, how to get a domestic tech support rep... and more. It's very comprehensive. Enjoy!

I am a former Spherion rep that later became a Dell Branded Rep (manager) of a Dell kiosk in the Philadelphia, PA region. To work at one is to work at all, and I worked at four different kiosks in the region. I worked from July 2005 until October 2006, but keep regular contact with some of the guys I trained and brought up. Other than the usual complaints, I have no problem with the company.

Things most people know already:

1. Small business is better than home and home office - Small business typically runs a few dollars more than the home office, but you stand a better chance of getting domestic tech support rather than non-native English speakers. As an added perk, small business promotions are occasionally better than home.

2. Play with the web site - There are many different pricing packages for the same product throughout the various sections, typically three or more per segment. If you're buying a Dell soon, configure a unit from a link off the main page, from the product listing on the drop down and from the "As Advertised-Newspaper" drop down. Configure the same system each way at the home, small business and the Direct (kiosk) site (http://www.dell.com/directstore). It is very likely you will end up with nine different prices.

3. Extended warranty for laptops - Do it for as long as you feasibly see using your laptop, and include accidental. Two years is typically the lifecycle from "new product" to "no longer produced/no more refurbs" though YMMV. Once your model is off the refurb site, drop it. Voila! New laptop. The standard warranty will not cover any screen defects.

UPDATE: Current Dell rep says: If a system is no longer shipping a used/refurbished is always sent, though the refurb should be equal or better as far as hardware is concerned. As of this writing if a system is exchanged, via either Complete Care warranty or concession, and the system is still a currently shipping model a new system is to be sent.

4. Extended warranty for desktops - There is nothing in a low end desktop (non XPS) that is worth the price of the warranty should you have to replace it. Only pick it up if you have absolutely no clue what you're doing once the case is open.

5. Tech support phone - If you do go with the home/home office/direct route, tech support is outsourced (duh!). The tech support instant messenger typically provides a calmer, more understandable conversation due to the fact that accents are taken out of the equation. Think back to high school Spanish. It was always easier to translate the foreign language you were reading than if you heard it. Same concept applies here.

6. Tech support web site - If you're having a common problem, hit the product forums (however crippled they may be now). It is very likely your question/problem has been resolved before, and usually a domestic tech rep posted a solution there.

7. Warranty Repairs - On all but the two lowest warranties (90 day and 1 year limited), warranty repairs wi

Re:Well, since it might get taken down...

Dell is on a major decline. Back in the late 90s everyone wanted a Dell although they cost more then then others. But they were good systems... Dell sense has lowered the quality of the systems and made purchasing one a major hassle. Right now Apple is taking Dells spot as Yea it cost a bit more but it is worth it. PC.

wtf?

When The Consumerist published 22 tips for getting the best deal from Dell Computers, according to a self-described former Dell sales manager, Dell fired back with a take-down notice.

When are these companies going to learn that trying to suppress information on the internet just makes it multiply?

Re:wtf?

When are these companies going to learn that trying to suppress information on the internet just makes it multiply?

Yesterday. [direct2dell.com]

Re:wtf?

Mr. Dell has realized that big business companies cannot compete in the computer field. I'd swear that he's been reading Toffler, and is trying to change direction of the monstrous ship called Dell. It's slow and ponderous, but it seems to be happening. Other than IBM, no other major computer company has made as public a commitment to Linux and Open Source as Dell has. HP will have to do something soon, if only to keep mindshare.

HP is going to be at a disadvantage because it has the same corporate setup that it has always had, no one person can step on and change the direction of the company like Jobs and Dell have done. In a world where change happens hourly, a bureaucratic organization is always going to be slower to change than a company where a person with a vision can cause change. It happened at Apple, and hopefully, it is happening at Dell.

ttyl
          Farrell

-----
FLIEGENDE KINDERSCHEISSE!

Re:wtf?

My favorite part in the take-down notice is this:

Thank you. Note, though, it has been almost nine hours since we made the request, yet the posting is still up, with the number of hits growing logarithmically.

I think what they meant to say was exponentially. Logarithmic growth means it is slowing down really fast.

Note: Seems whenever a take-down notice is given, the number of hits grows... exponentially.

Re:wtf?

When are these companies going to learn that trying to suppress information on the internet just makes it multiply?

This is already well documented as the Streisand Effect [wikipedia.org]. If I were Michael Dell, I would fire whomever sent the take-down notice. The outcome was quite predictable by anyone with half a brain (especially after the very recent AACS fiasco).

Re:wtfraud?

I'm goig to buck the slashdoxy and defend Dell. Please read the full post before modding down.

Doesn't #3 bother anyone else? It is explicit instructions on how to commit insurance fraud. If I were Dell management, I'd want it taken down for that reason alone. ( How would you feel if someone posted your bank password on the net, thus enabling any reader to defraud you? )

Re:wtfraud?

As you say, other parts of the same paragraph may indeed offer advice on what insurance to buy or not buy, but quoting from item #3 of the website in question: "Once your model is off the refurb site, drop it. Voila! New laptop."
This looks pretty clear to me. On a certain date, deliberately damage the merchandise, and the insurance that you bought will get you a new one. This part is advice on how to commit fraud. Surrounding it with other advice doesn't change that.

Dell already apologized

...approximately.

http://direct2dell.com/one2one/archive/2007/06/16/ 18397.aspx [direct2dell.com]

nice try

good idea because take down notices sure do work well. 09 F9 11 02 9D 74 E3 5B D8 41 56 C5 63 56 88 C0

keeping people honest

Oh the Tragedy!

Somebody lets the cat out of the bag about the crap and value within a company product suite, and they go back to DMCA and takedowns.

We are reaching the middle of the sigmoid on information exchange - until now many have still been in the old model, and moving forward there will be more activity in the new (open free information exchange) model. Old-style enterprises are pissed off by the new model. How DARE they tattle on where they make some extra money at te expense of their cusotmers. This will only increase and radically change the nature of business activity for the better, so long as people really can continue to exchange information and know who each other really are.

Stop smoking your hippie dust

FTFA:

3. Extended warranty for laptops - Do it for as long as you feasibly see using your laptop, and include accidental. Two years is typically the lifecycle from "new product" to "no longer produced/no more refurbs" though YMMV. Once your model is off the refurb site, drop it. Voila! New laptop. The standard warranty will not cover any screen defects.

That's not "keeping people honest," that's encouraging fraud and abuse of the warranty system. Also see their suggestion on how to get Dell reps to steal printer ink for you ("offer cash")

Best Dell trick I found was...

Get the 1 year return to base support when you buy the PC.

About 2 weeks after you receive the system, you'll get a phone call and an offer to upgrade to the full 3 year on-site support for around £30 ($60). That worked out at about a third of the price than if I'd bought it.

Insurance Fraud

I'm all for trying to get the best deal you can on any purchase. However one of the recommendations is:

3. Extended warranty for laptops ...Once your model is off the refurb site, drop it. Voila! New laptop.

So, basically, the recommendation is to purposefully destroy your laptop, and then file a claim under the "accidental damage" provision of Dell's extended care insurance. The insurance, by the way, does not cover purposeful damage to the property. So basically this 'tip' is "commit insurance fraud."

Will this work? Yes. I knew a guy who did this with Dell's plan... got a nice upgrade for "free." I'm not convinced, however, that insurance fraud is really such a great idea. Nor am I convinced that this guy should be encouraging people to commit crimes.

Re:Insurance Fraud

Agreed, and it makes me wonder if The Consumerist read the article carefully. They're pretty aggressive about bad behavior [consumerist.com] by companies [consumerist.com]. So it's OK if a consumer steals for personal gain?

Re:Insurance Fraud

I can see it now...... Some honest people with laptops that are broken will be hassled more while trying to get a replacement as safeguards are increased to try to remedy this.

And yes. The price of insuring your laptop may very well go up. Insurance companies aren't in the business of losing money. At the end of the day the of insurance fraud will be paid for by honest people.

obligatory IAALIA

(I am a licensed insurance agent)

You're right. It's called a moral hazard.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moral_hazard#Moral_Ha zard_in_Insurance [wikipedia.org]

The writer of this article needs to apologize publicly for encouraging this.

Why I hate buying PCs from Dell

It's such a hassle to get a good deal from Dell. Between their rebates, coupons, instant discounts, and special offers the entire process is like buying a car!

If dell is trying to figure out why its market share is declining, it is likely because of the difficulty in knowing what you are buying is the best price. I don't think HP makes people go through all this nonsense.

Oh and also the whole small business vs. home office crap. What an annoyance how they both contain the exact same machines with just very slight differences.

SLASHDOT IS LATE. Dell already apologized yesterda

Lionel Menchaca at Dell says, "Ok, we goofed. We shouldn't have sent a notice". Find his full blog entry at:
http://direct2dell.com/one2one/archive/2007/06/16/ 18397.aspx [direct2dell.com]

Obligatory Coral cache

Just in case, coral cache of the article here [nyud.net].

Apple?

Thanks for that.

Can we have one of these only for Apple?

As another poster has already pointed out,

Dell already apologized: http://direct2dell.com/one2one/archive/2007/06/16/ 18397.aspx [direct2dell.com]

And this article was posted to Slashdot AFTER that happened, and there is STILL no "Update: Dell actually apologized before we posted this article, 'cause we're dumb."

You're doing them a huge disservice by letting this stand uncorrected, kdawson.

this is exactly why i dont buy anything from dell

the 16 different prices for the same thing depending on how you get to the item.

digging around the internet for working dell coupon codes...bah...

I just hate the amount of fucking around necessary to not get hosed trying to buy something from them.

Dell needs to quit the shell-game.

Being cagey about their pricing only pisses off the customers and makes dell look like a fly-by-night operation.

-jcr

No GAL within Dell???

4. Dell corporate email - As of December 2006, everybody (save Michael Dell) working for Dell U.S. has the same form of email address: [e-mail]. Michael Dell's does not follow this pattern and is changed immediately whenever the current one is discovered by lower-level employees or the public.

Interesting. Why would a company shield certain email addresses from others? I work at a fortune 500 pharmacutical company and any employee or contractor can see any email address, all the way to the CEO.

For laptops, go with the longest warranty possible

That advice was given in the article. I'd add to that: check your states lemon laws.

I bought a Dell Inspiron 8200 when they first came out. I bought the extended warranty (3 years) and was very glad I did. Dell laptops are going to break. I had the little clip which holds the battery on break three times, the hard drive fail twice (and then the pins broke on the replacement hard drive, counting as a third breakage), I had it serviced for LCD-related issues three times, and there's some other problem I forgot about. This all happened over 3 years, and Dell was very quick on the gun to get my stuff fixed, usually sending replacement parts in 24 hours. I would have been screwed if I hadn't gotten the extended warranty.

As my warranty period came up, I started to get worried. The laptop was going to break again, and I'd be out in the cold. Turns out, in CA, if you get a computer serviced 3 or more times for the same problem, you can demand your money back. After some arguing with the Dell guys, they sent me an 8500 (refurb). My 3 year warranty expired the next week.

Point is: Paying the extra couple hundred bucks for the warranty saves you from buying a new laptop. After a feeling of joy, I felt a bit guilty about getting 2 laptops for the price of one. Then again, Dell chose to make laptops which fail constantly, not me...

Maybe some trouble for the lawyer.

Dell's attorney (Tracy Holland) was told that he would be contacted by the attorney representing Consumerist. This indicates that Consumerist is represented by counsel. In most states, the bar rules prohibit an attorney from directly communicating with represented opposing parties.

those dumb categories

"1. Small business is better than home and home office "

This is one prime reason why I never order online from dell. I just have this deep feeling that they shouldn't care about why I'm buying this computer... just give me the best deal, which frankly, ain't gonna very that much whether I'm a big company or joe blow. (Yes, I know bulk purchasers et bulk discounts, but still)

So that, plus, call me old fashioned, but if it's a model I don't know, I need to touch and feel the formfactor first hand, especially for laptops.

Micro Center in Cambridge ahoy!

#6 in the kiosks...

#6 in the kiosks section is my favorite: "Don't be surprised if the salesman asks really base/borderline-insulting questions if you act interested. They think you're a secret shopper."

Nothing like pissing off legit customers so you can score a little higher on a phony performance score. A store I worked at dropped the mystery shopper crap while I worked there, but never explained the reason. I strongly suspect it was because the test isn't grounded in reality, but in the random chance of a single shopper once a month. They replaced it with a survey system, which is probably almost as bad... Surveys only get the best and the worst answer... Why would someone take the time to fill out a 'I got pretty normal service' answer? They don't, even if you offer $$$ prizes randomly.

Dell already apologized...

As posted on Arstechnica 6 hours before this was posted on Slashdot, Dell already apologized for overreacting. The apology can be read here: http://direct2dell.com/one2one/archive/2007/06/16/ 18397.aspx [direct2dell.com]

A Few More Points

Dell's business sales reps work on quarterly quotas. The closer you get to the end of the quarter, the more they're willing to give you. The trick is, their quarters are shifted by one month. Instead of Jan-Feb-Mar, their quarter is Feb-Mar-Apr. So if you can get quotes in the first week of April, then hold off until the last week, they'll call you and offer all sorts of incentives to close the deal.

Same goes for July, Oct and Jan.

* * *

ALWAYS check the website for deals. Probably 1 in every 5 times I've gotten quotes from our Small Business Sales rep I've found better deals online. Tell them and they'll match or beat it.

* * *

Get your Small Business Sales Rep to set you up a custom page with the equipment you normally order, INCLUDING ADD-ONS. For over a year I was able to purchase 15K RPM SCSI drives off of the custom page for 1/3 the price quoted on the normal site. Ditto for rack rails, RAID kits and extra CPUs.

Much of this I consider to be common sense

...the rest might be garnered from experience and understanding of how their business model works.

I didn't realize, however, that there would be a noticable difference in cost depending on which type of shopping you do. I will keep that tip in mind.

As for the warranty stuff? Definitely. And *USE* the warranty. I must say, I feel a little guilty if I were to intentionally break my laptop at the end of the warranty. That's just plain abusive and dishonest. But on the other hand, if I have an actual accident, I like knowing I can get it fixed. That said, I bought my current Dell laptop some time ago and I had forgotten that I had any warranty at all. When I realized that I was good until 2009, I called support and told them my keyboard needs to be replaced. Okay, so not really... I mean it's "worn" but it was functional. (Except when I've been playing UT2004... then sometimes the keyboard doesn't seem so responsive... but maybe that's me.) But I ordered a new one anyway. I do think my processor cooling fan is making a bit more noise than it did when it was new so I will probably make another warranty call some time before the warranty is out as well. And I ask myself once more... would I really "drop it" to get a new laptop? No... I just can't bring myself to even think about it. It's sorta sacriligeous doncha think? Who knows... I might change my mind when the time comes.

Lately, I have found that the last few calls I have made to Dell support has gone through central America and their accents were more than acceptable. I was very pleased with Dell's selection. I mean I'd prefer that Dell hired college kids for their support... fairly bright and fairly inexpensive. But I could barely detect much of an accent from the central Americans that I heard and they also had no difficulty understanding me.

Dell's service and pricing options are good especially when consumers know about it. Frankly, even though it's a guide to abusing Dell's good faith, it still shows Dell in pretty good light since they do offer these kinds of options for people. After all, even at the cost of giving bad people good service, it still offers good value to good people and I want to believe good people are in the majority.

dell deals on things besides CPUs

I was shocked when I was shopping for a new digital camera and found the best deal at Dell. This was for a Canon PowerShot S3 IS. Everyone and their dog was selling it for between $300 and $400. Then out of the woodwork comes Dell, $239.

I have no idea why it was so cheap from Dell but I am not going to complain. I have no intention of ever buying anything with the Dell brand name on it, but I have no problem buying non branded peripherals from them on the cheap. $60 off a normally bottom-dollar-$300 product is quite amazing.

Their printers are garbage though, they are the absolute bottom of the line HPs you see at places like best buy for $59, rebranded Dell.

Text of Dell Apology

Dell's 23 Confessions

Now's not the time to mince words, so let me just say it... we blew it.

I'm referring to a recent blog post from an ex-Dell kiosk employee that received more attention after the Consumerist blogged about it, and even more still after we asked them to remove it.

In this case, I agree with what Jeff Jarvis had to say: instead of trying to control information that was made public, we should have simply corrected anything that was inaccurate. We didn't do that, and now we're paying for it.

I believe in the customer voice--that's why I signed up for this job in the first place. There's simply no cheating the system. When we're on the right track, folks tend to say some good things about us (or at least give us a second chance). When we mess up, they let us know quickly and vocally. Then everyone watches our reaction like a hawk.

Now, if you'll allow me to shift gears just a bit, here's our own 22 23 Confessions list:

1) Ok, we goofed. We shouldn't have sent a notice. To my earlier point, we appreciate the reminder from the community. Point taken. Yesterday, we also responded to a related IdeaStorm idea from user jmxz. To see more, take a look for comments from our own dell_admin1 and my good pal richard_b.

2) An easy way to scope out deals is to go to the Home and Home Office section of Dell.com and click "As Advertised." In other words, click here. You can see what we're currently offering and then chat live with a rep if you like.

3) We have simplified our pricing and promos. We have reduced the number of promotions per product line and the number for a single product. We've also simplified our rebates.

4) Small Business will be different than Home and Home Office soon. There will be a real difference between systems we offer to consumers vs. small business users that goes beyond price. Since these details depend on upcoming changes in both our Inspiron line and our small business systems, I can't share more details just yet, but you will hear more in a few weeks.

5) We are committed to being the greenest technology company on the planet. It's the right thing to do for ourselves, our environment and our customers. See details in the Programs section of this page for more information.

6) When your computer's effective life has ended, we still care about it as much as you do, so we provide free recycling for all consumers worldwide. We can't wait for our competitors to catch up, since we all benefit from improving our environment. Please remind them.

7) We don't think many people get excited when they have to call the Geek Squad, wait around at their house and then fork over cash when you can do the same thing in the comfort of your home on your own schedule for free. Maybe we're crazy, but we think this is more effective. Turns out our customers seem to agree. DellConnect has helped over 5 million consumers for free and has a 93% satisfaction rate in a little over one year of service. Other tools like PC-Tune-Up help automate confusing aspects of system maintenance And new tools like Dell Support Center centralize system-specific information and provide several options for reaching support to make troubleshooting easier.

8) What if you only had to make one click to make a difference in the environment? Well, we do this everyday via our Plant a Tree for Me program. Through it, we empower our consumers to offset their system's carbon footprint by making a small contribution to purchase a tree at the time of purchase or whenever you want. And, Michael Dell is personally matching any contribution you make in June, July and August.

9) We normally wouldn't have said this in the past, but we have some very cool PCs being introduced later this month. Stay tuned and you'll see what we mean. Matter of fact, I've seen some pictures here and here.

10) We have a very great way for all of our customers to share ideas with us at www.ideastorm.

Watch the deals sites

There are lots of sites; I use hot-deals.org [hot-deals.org]. They come up with deals that are hard to find on the site. (For instance, a slim C521 with an Athlon 3600 dual core, 1GB of RAM, 160GB, DVD burner and a fax modem for $219 with free shipping.) They also come up with great ideas I didn't think of (for instance, about a year ago, they configured a normally $2,100 dual-processor mirrored-RAID dual-power-supply server by buying two $600 servers and cannibalizing one for parts.)

Re:pseudo code solution

if i24 evaluates to true then
    call function an infinite number of times
else
    exit immediately