More Music File-Sharing Lawsuits in Europe 227
rfunches writes "The New York Times is reporting that 20,000 cases in 10 countries were brought against file-sharers in Europe, according to the International Federation of the Phonographic Industry (IFPI). '...Users targeted for legal action included a Finnish lumberjack, a British postman, a Czech IT manager and a German judge,' according to the article. More than 70 computers were seized in Italy by authorities investigating illegal file-sharing. IFPI targeted both those who
'illicitly downloaded music' as well as uploaders serving copyrighted material on file-sharing networks. Total music sales were down 3% in 2005 according to the IFPI, with the decline in physical media (e.g. CDs) countered by 'soaring' digital music sales."
Sales down? (Score:2, Funny)
Re:Sales down? (Score:4, Insightful)
Because there are enough people that Don't Like Porn that somewhere in the judicial process you'll get assigned Judge Michael Holywater and that'll be the end of your case.
More realistically, most porn webmasters are probably sensible people and not the mindless horde running the music/movie corporations. They may realize that a large part of the population can't/won't buy pornography and that it doesn't hurt their business model in the slighest for these people to get the product for free.
Re:Sales down? (Score:2)
This does indeed seem to be the case. Porn is one of the most profitable industries operating on the net, possibly the most profitable -- even though there's so much free porn readily av
Re:Sales down? (Score:2)
Any Pony porn out there? OMG Ponies!!!
The War On Drugs = The War on Downloading (Score:5, Insightful)
If the assholes would just realize the problem is them charging $20 for a CD that 20 years ago they promised would eventually be cheaper than cassettes and vinyl ever were. If CD's cost something more commesurate with their value and production cost downloading wouldn't be an issue beyond the fringe.
AE
Re:The War On Drugs = The War on Downloading (Score:5, Insightful)
You assume "they" are interested in winning.
I propose that they aren't. Many more involved parties profit more from the ongoing conflict than from its resolution. That includes especially the lawyers, but also law enforcement, a large number of institutes, think-tanks, industry associations, etc. and of course the media which gets a fairly reliable source of news every now and then.
That's true for both, the war on drugs and the copyright war.
Re:The War On Drugs = The War on Downloading (Score:5, Insightful)
War on drugs, war on terror, war on downloading -- it's just a boot, stomping on the face of humanity. Forever.
Re:The War On Drugs = The War on Downloading (Score:4, Insightful)
When are people going to real;ise that a war is something which will end, which has a resolution. Terrorism, copyright infringement, taxes...these are things which are ongoing states of affairs; the only way to mitigate them is to take away root causes instead of fighting the symptoms, and even then they won't stop.
War on Wars (Score:2)
Re:The War On Drugs = The War on Downloading (Score:3, Interesting)
Solution: Go to a used CD/DVD store, most CDs are fairly unscathed and you can get really good deals there. (CDs and DVDs for $5-$10) And, if there are duplicates, some are usually cheaper than others.
Re:The War On Drugs = The War on Downloading (Score:2)
Re: (Score:2)
Re:The War On Drugs = The War on Downloading (Score:3, Insightful)
"If the assholes would just realize the problem is them charging $20 for a CD that 20 years ago they promised would eventually be cheaper than cassettes and vinyl ever were."
Do you have a citation for this promise? The only place I've ever heard it is on Slashdot.
Anyway:
Typical price for a CD in 1985: $18.99. That's $33.70 in 2005 dollars.
Average price of a new CD today in the USA: around $13 [com.com].
Typical price of an LP in 1985: about $8.00. That's about $14.20 in 2005 dollars. I was often paying
Re:The War On Drugs = The War on Downloading (Score:3, Insightful)
Come on fanboy that is the the most fanboist comment I have read in a while.
While you link to an illegal file (and I agree in that, downloading a copy of OSX that you do not own is Illegal), there is nothing illegal in patching your owned copy of OSX or whatever software I BUY. It is stupid, you know, I bought Windows XP, and I have notepad.exe and I cracked it to make it display the cursor line number [nikse.dk].
I did it just for fun, not because I am a pira8ter. So what if peop
Re:The War On Drugs = The War on Downloading (Score:2)
Re:The War On Drugs = The War on Downloading (Score:3, Informative)
While cool, it's a bit pointless as described. From the link
To edit my code i like to use Note-pad. But one disadventage of Notepad is that it doesn't show linenumbers. So when the compiler gives an error with linenumber, i have to load another editor to find the line with the error.
Obviously he wasn't aware that (ctrl)+g brings up a dialog box where you can enter the line number that you want t
Re:The War On Drugs = The War on Downloading (Score:2)
Re:The War On Drugs = The War on Downloading (Score:2)
If you run a w4r3z3d OSX on a PC don't blame Apple when it goes Pete Tong.
Re:The War On Drugs = The War on Downloading (Score:2)
In fact, they will have gained a customer. I like OS X, but I HATE, repeat HATE their hardware. The hardware may be very, very compatible with OS X, but the reliability? Sorry, I see WAY too many G5 tower and iMac failures to respect the quality argument.
Sure, their cases (well, some of them) are the best-looking in the market (now that SGI has turned their cases into gamer-box-looking atrocities), but their powe
Re:The War On Drugs = The War on Downloading (Score:2)
>they set on their Intellectual Property - yet people in the "hacking"
>community continue to abuse their trust.
COuld you give any examples? What "conditions" do you refer to? Are you saying that copyright law itself is not reasonable? If not so, why would there need to be any extra conditions to make it reasonable?
Re:The War On Drugs = The War on Downloading (Score:3, Informative)
"The rest of the cost is all in the content, and the music publishers pretty much charge whatever they think we'll pay for. But they were right, the CD's are cheaper than cassettes and vinyl ever were, and they're lining their pockets with the difference."
Are you sure about that? In the computer peripheral industry, we have to deal with:
Seriously... (Score:3, Insightful)
Does file sharing stop? No.
Re:Seriously... (Score:2)
Well, it's been going on since at least the 1800s, so probably not soon. Eli Whitney actually lost money inventing the cotton gin because he had to bring so many people to court for violating his patent. An invention can be so valuable as to be worthless to the inventor.
Re:Seriously... (Score:2)
Re:Seriously... (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:Seriously... (Score:2, Informative)
Just in case you get into an argument with a lawyer:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malum_in_se [wikipedia.org]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malum_prohibitum [wikipedia.org]
Re:Seriously... (Score:3, Funny)
Neither does bad analogies. Should we stop? Yes.
feh (Score:5, Interesting)
FTBlurb
IFPI targeted both those who 'illicitly downloaded music' as well as uploaders serving copyrighted material on file-sharing networks.FTA
The IFPI's legal proceedings were aimed not at people who illicitly downloaded music but ``uploaders'' who put copyrighted music onto file-sharing networks.so which is it?
Re:feh (Score:5, Interesting)
As copyright law concerned, it's uploaders who are infriging. Uploading is distribution. If you want to distribute something - you have to acquire a permission from copyright holder.
Case for downloader is much simpler: downloader has acquired something for personal use. As long as file in question isn't used for anything what's prohibited by copyright law - downloader is clear. "Listening to mp3" is not there. "Distributing" and "profiting" is there.
I probably oversimplify the situation, but that the view I have formed after reading Lessig's blog - http://lessig.org/blog/ [lessig.org] And c'mon - it's slashdot
Re:feh (Score:3, Insightful)
How does that work?
Re:feh (Score:2)
Re:feh (Score:5, Interesting)
And if the record company set up a P2P app full of their music and sue whoever attempts to download it, they're on shaky ground. The music is, after all, theirs to distribute. They put it on P2P themselves. Surely there's no infringement of copyright when the copyright holder themselves is putting the stuff online?
Things might be different with BitTorrent, though. With that, if you're downloading something you're also making it, or parts of it, available to upload as you do so. In that case you're visible to the record company or their grasses.
Re:feh (Score:2, Informative)
Generally, yes, in Sweden, no. According to a recent law (last July), downloading without a license is also illegal. Thus Piratpartiet [piratpartiet.se].
This law is supposed to be an implementation of a EU directive, so it will be "interesting" to see what the other countries make of it...
Re:feh (Score:2)
Same thing in Finland, since 1st January 2006. The new law also includes the DMCA-style ban on breaking an "efficient copy protection" even for fair use purposes... is that included in Sweden as well?
Re:feh (Score:3, Informative)
It is correct that uploaders infringe on the distribution right.
Case for downloader is much simpler: downloader has acquired something for personal use. As long as file in question isn't used for anything what's prohibited by copyright law - downloader is clear. "Listening to mp3" is not there. "Distributing" and "profiting" is there.
Not quite. The main exclusive rights are listed at 17 USC 106. Downloaders infringe on
Re:feh (Score:2)
This was beaten to death many times by Lessig/friends.
First of all, how would I know that the file I download is protected under copyright law? When one obtains something - free or for money - s/he has no way knowing about attached restrictions. The law says it's duty of copyright holder to notify people about their rights.
When you buy book in shop
Re:feh (Score:2)
Who cares? Copyright infringement is a strict liability statute. It doesn't matter what you know, or whether you acted in good faith, or anything other than that you perform the act.
The law says it's duty of copyright holder to notify people about their rights.
No it doesn't. The most relevant section would be 405. It's not terribly relevant anymore, and of course the copies authorized usually do bear notice; the copies
Re:feh (Score:3, Informative)
The New York Times is reporting that 20,000 cases in 10 countries were brought against file-sharers in Europe
FTA:
About 2,000 cases were launched in 10 countries
WTF? This summary is particularly out to lunch.
Full Text (no login) (Score:5, Informative)
By REUTERS
Published: April 4, 2006
LONDON (Reuters) - The music industry launched a new wave of lawsuits and criminal proceedings against file-sharers across Europe on Tuesday, part of its drive to curb online piracy and encourage the use of legal music services.
About 2,000 cases were launched in 10 countries, the International Federation of the Phonographic Industry said, bringing the total to 5,500 people in 18 countries.
That figure does not include the United States, covered by its sister group the Recording Industry Association of America, which has filed about 18,000 lawsuits.
Among the countries targeted was Portugal, where sales of physical formats like CDs have slumped by 40 percent in the past four years amid heavy file-sharing usage, especially by college students.
Other users targeted for legal action included a Finnish carpenter, a British postman, a Czech IT manager and a German judge, the IFPI said.
``A large number of cases involve men aged between 20 and 35 and parents who have not heeded successive education and warning campaigns,'' it stated.
In Italy authorities have seized more than 70 computers in the search for evidence of illegal file-sharing.
The IFPI's legal proceedings were aimed not at people who illicitly downloaded music but ``uploaders'' who put copyrighted music onto file-sharing networks.
The IFPI said last week that digital music sales soared in 2005, but not enough to make up for a continuing decline in physical formats like CDs, sending total sales down 3 percent.
Re:Full Text (no login) (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:Full Text (no login) (Score:2)
Careful there, you're about to get into trouble for copyright infringement.
The article only stating facts, not expressing ideas.
Re:Full Text (no login) (Score:2)
(see: http://www.twincities.com/mld/pioneerpress/141728
Re:Full Text (no login) (Score:2)
And in July, both sides will fight it out in U.S. District Court for the Eastern District of Missouri.
Their assessment of the law has yet to be proven correct.
Re:Full Text (no login) (Score:2)
One of the reasons why you can't simply copy Google's database.
Re:Full Text (no login) (Score:2)
So one would imagine that the more inclusive and logically ordered your research is, the less copyrightable it's prone to be. Google's database is probably not copyrightable due to the
That would be (Score:5, Informative)
The summary is remarkably incorrect, even for a Slashdot story.
Re:That would be (Score:3, Informative)
headline is still incorrect.
Re:That would be (Score:2)
First they came for the file sharers ... (Score:2)
Now they're coming after us people doing fire-sharing.
Oh no no no no, can you cold people come and help us, PLEASE for the love of humanity, don't take away the fire !!!!
Unwittingly apt pun (Score:3, Funny)
Good, the more the better (Score:3, Insightful)
So I am especially pleased when I read that judges and politicians are sued.
Re:Good, the more the better (Score:3, Informative)
What happened to Bernie and Günni? Anyone know?
This is silly (Score:5, Insightful)
Re:This is silly (Score:5, Insightful)
And the act of passing such laws which criminalize a large section of the population is usually called "Oppression"
Re:This is silly (Score:2)
Re:This is silly (Score:2)
Re:This is silly (Score:2)
Oppression I would class as something that restricts fundamental human rights such as free speech (and don't claim that sending other peoples' work around is free speech), rights to privacy and, well, for want of a better term the right to not have your door kicked in by the government for a minor indiscretion. Downloading music
Re:This is silly (Score:2)
I'm not trying to claim that "sending other people's work around is free speach". To begin with, you c
Re:This is silly (Score:2)
Re:This is silly (Score:2)
You cannot seriously be likening laws against leeching music off P2P against the wishes of the artists to oppression.
Sure he can, as do a lot of other people. I think one reason the industry is fighting so hard in the US is because they know that Congress could do away with copyrights all together if it so chose.
Re:This is silly (Score:3, Insightful)
When the lobbying groups ask for up to four year prison terms for copyright infringement and the use of covert surveillance and wiretaps to catch infringers, you bet your ass we're calling it oppression.
Re:This is silly (Score:2)
(How could they get jail terms anyway, I thought copyright infringement was a civil offense rather than a criminal one?)
Re:This is silly (Score:2, Insightful)
Ever since I can remember (I'm 23) almost every CD that's come out has at BEST five tracks I actually want to listen to; usually it's two or three. I'm not going to spend much for 10 or 12 minutes of music. Of course if it's an artist I really love, I might be willing to spend $7 or $8; I'd try to find the CD used.
But really, copying anything digital is easily justified if you think about it hard en
Re:This is silly (Score:2)
So it's wrong to watch TV but not the commercials?
So it's wrong to lend a DVD or a book to a friend?
So it's wrong to read a book at the library?
So it's wrong to play a CD on my stereo when an 'unlicensed' person is in the house?
So it's wrong to describe a TV episode to someone else?
In every day life we
Re:This is an oligopoly (Score:2)
So, this is the reason that I like to use the term monopoly. It is the singleness of it. A monopoly will never turn on itself, while (for example) OPEC has had members undercut or (more often) overproduce on a regular basis. There are also countries that don't join OPEC, and they are not only able to thr
Re:This is an oligopoly (Score:2)
So here goes anyways ;-)
Whereas the Oil Cartel (an admitted/explicit cartel) all sell oil that is indistinguishable one from another, Matisyahu's new studio album Youth is
Comment removed (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:why not offer the customer what they want? (Score:2)
My guess is that people will first of all get afraid, then careless again, then share and leech again. What else do you want to do? Buy it? We're talking about 20 for a CD and about 35 for a DVD. Who can afford that? If you want to see one movie a week, it means you'd have to spend about 150 bucks a month on movies alone. Who can set aside 150 a month just for movies? Add in 2-3 CDs a month and you
Re:why not offer the customer what they want? (Score:2)
from parent Sure, they will download them when they're available, hey, if it's free, why not?
Even if the Internet is shut down, people have social circles. My kids are on dial-up (so am I). That only slows them down just a little. Sneaker net is very big in the schools. They bring home lots of stuff that has a parental advisory that I would never let them buy. The social net bypasses all web filters and parental controls. If parents can't contr
Bah, just forget about the labels... (Score:4, Interesting)
Wide variety of material (Score:2)
Re:Wide variety of material (Score:2)
Ah, nice! I probably prefer "before 1600"; but that's interesting nevertheless, they really have some nice medieval/renaissance stuff.
Re:Bah, just forget about the labels... (Score:2)
"illegal fire-sharing" ? (Score:4, Funny)
Must be some new anti-smoking law.
Re:"illegal fire-sharing" ? (Score:3, Funny)
Yes, haha, very funny. Did you know that when you "share" fire you are stealing? That's right! Every time you let someone kindle their fire from yours, you are taking food from the mouths of hard-working match manufacturers. Not to mention the butane industry -- why, it is quite probable that the higher prices we see at the gas pumps are due to offsetting drop in hydrocarbons demand that occurs from "sharing" fire. You see, we all
Well... (Score:3, Funny)
Not here! but probably soon. (Score:2)
I'm sure it will get worse once the new laws begin to be enforced.
I guess it's time to move to Canada!
All together now! (Score:2, Funny)
All together now! take 2 with formatting!! (Score:5, Funny)
I sleep all night and download all day
IFPI: He's a lumberjack and he's not okay
were going to sue him like the RIAA
I pirate songs, I eat my lunch
I go to the Lavatory.
On Wednessday I got summonsed
for my acts of pi-rac-ie
IFPI:He pirate songs, He eats his lunch
He goes to the Lavatory.
On Wednessday he got summonsed
for his acts of pi-rac-ie
Chorus: He's a lumberjack and he's not okay
were going to sue him like the RIAA
Re:All together now! (Score:2)
Careful now! (Score:4, Insightful)
At the moment there is a lot of grey area with copyright and the internet (IANAL) - which is why 'legal' music sites like allofmp3.com have disclaimers regarding local laws rather than concrete advice. In my own local jurisdiction the law appears to be clear about importing copyrighted material (and it's quite similiar in most other places) - i.e it's ok for personal/domestic use.
When the rights organisations test these laws the outcome might not be the one they want - and it will send a message to the mainstream users, who up to this point have been terrorised into not downloading music, that it is actually safe to do so.
They are playing with fire - and their time would be far better served coming up with a better business model than trying to defend an outdated one.
Re:Careful now! (Score:2)
Not knowing where you are, I can't speak as to your local laws. In the US however, it's illegal to use allofmp3. This is because
The are going to breed new generation networks (Score:4, Interesting)
Civil suits in Germany -- according to c't (Score:3, Interesting)
Apparently, the law firms have worked out a nice scheme to get the money out of people using p2p for downloading music / movies. It works as follows. Please forgive me my lack of law-related terminology in English.
First, one company tracks down the p2p users and files mass criminal suits against them. The charges get dropped by the court very quickly (unless it concerns someone dealing music / videos big time) -- but now, they have names and addresses, as they are not allowed to inquiry them directly at the provider.
Now what happens is this: some weeks after, a law company representing the big corps sues the user for some $BIGNUM of euros. The given user has a short time in which she or he has to react, contact a lawyer, file a protest etc. -- otherwise, the charges get lawful. Some angry letters later they propose to settle for a moderate amount -- 1-3 kEUR. Most of the people pay it just for the sake of getting out of the situation, and out of fear of having to pay $BIGNUM.
The whole process seems to be almost automatic and pays well off.
j.
A lumberjack (Score:5, Funny)
I can understand arresting the postman, the manager and the judge. But the finnish chap, he's a lumberjack, and he's ok. For sure that was a mistake.
Re:A lumberjack (Score:4, Funny)
and he would never have time to listen to pirated music anyhow, seeing as he sleeps all night and he works all day...
Re:A lumberjack (Score:2)
I-F-P-I... (Score:4, Funny)
All we need is a Spanish construction worker and we'll have the Euro-Village People!
I'm Sorry..... LOL (Score:2)
OH yeah, stop me swapping 4.5gig DVDs!!!! (Score:3, Interesting)
Its quicker to swap a stack of 25 4.5 GIG dvds of MP3s!!!
It takes one day to swap, then 12mins/dvd = 300mins, easy going.
Face it, all 250 years of music is in within easy reach of everyone for zero cost + $12.95 for some blanks.
Sure musicians are artists, but they dont deserve more money than the creator of a cpu or a car. Its only music, its not
a cancer cure.
Re:OH yeah, stop me swapping 4.5gig DVDs!!!! (Score:2)
So let's not give them anything. Because it's not a cure for cancer, or food for hungry people. it's just peoples' work. Let's just give away lots and lots of music for free based on our own value judgement...hey, fuck everyone who put work into that music, it's not a cure for cancer.
Re: (Score:2)
Something comes to my mind (Score:2)
Re:European news by NYTimes? (Score:4, Informative)
Re:Misread organization name (Score:2)
Re:IFPI?! (Score:2)
Re:BBC says only 2000 (Score:2)
Well
Say! I'll bet on the BBC -- what's your wager on the Funch being right?
Re:BBC says only 2000 (Score:2)
Re:Legalize all file sharing - save the courts tim (Score:2)
Re:Not at Any Cost (Score:2)
I think the recording and movie industries are afraid of something more (now than they did years ago), though... if you made massive tape recording copies, quality would usually go downhill - especially those pirates too cheap not to do the copy-of-a-copy-of-a-copy thing... But in the digital age, you can get an exact copy of the first digital copy over and over again without serious or virtual