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Lemmingue writes "China government is, again, restraining the access to internet. Ars Technica says they are now blocking the Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia. How much time will it take for to Slashdot be blocked?"
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I see. I would have personally attempted to link the rampant growth of the Chinese economy with the low number of Chinese citizens reading Slashdot. In that case, you would be engaging in a logical fallacy, but at least the the individual statements which you would be linking would be factually correct. I find humour to be a bit more humorous when build upon reality rather than fiction disguised as such; then again, what do I know...
Just search google for "http proxy list" and you can find tens of thousands of anonymous proxy servers for those freedom loving Chinese to use. They can't block them all can they?
Apparently they can. I was talking with a computer-literate Mainlander on this subject in the Wikipedia IRC channel. He said that ordinary HTTP proxies are blocked, and that to access Wikipedia now, you need a secure tunnel.
So are secure tunnels looked upon with suspicion, or are there 'legitimate' reasons to have one? ie ecommerce, security, etc.?
Is there some sort of dynamic steganography that could serve a site to look one way unless you have the appropriate software and key on the other side?
How much time will it take for to Slashdot be blocked?
Slashdot *does* criticize Chinese policy, including information control and the like.
However, it's also extremely critical of the current US administration, which China's current administration is not a tremendous fan of.
Also, Slashdot (at least the English slashdot.org) is not in Chinese, limiting the number of people that can read it. Wikipedia is translated to Chinese.
I do agree that this sucks. Technically, China is still communist, and Wikipedia is about as fine an example of the triumph of successful communist principles (community-owned, from according to assets, to according to need) as you could ask for. Seems like a stupid idea on the part of China.
"I do agree that this sucks. Technically, China is still communist, and Wikipedia is about as fine an example of the triumph of successful communist principles (community-owned, from according to assets, to according to need) as you could ask for. Seems like a stupid idea on the part of China." Guess what China has never been a communist country. In fact there has never been a communist country per Marx. China is a not free and seeks to control every aspect of the life of the people that live there.
In fact there has never been a communist country per Marx. China is a not free and seeks to control every aspect of the life of the people that live there.
China would not necessarily have been any freer if it had been "a communist country per Marx." I think it's time that people finally accepted that the Austrian / Chicago school of economic thought is far closer to freedom than any of the garbage Marx, Engels, and Lenin were spewing. Free societies require (at least mostly) free markets; history has s
I never stated that a free market guarantees complete and utter freedom; I merely stated that a free market is closer to freedom than a centrally planned economy, a claim which you did not refute. Given two hypothetical countries, both with brutally despotic rulers and the same amount of rights, with the exception of one being centrally planned, and the other possessing a free market, which country is freer?
My point was "Free societies require (at least mostly) free markets." Rebutting this statement by listing states which possessed a free market and yet were not completely and utterly free does not disprove my point; implying that I stated that societies with free markets are always free and then disproving that point it a straw man fallacy.
Furthermore, there is evidence to support the fact that free market economies eventually lead to the downfall of oppressive regimes (see East Asian Tigers excluding Singapore, etc.). Certainly you will agree that a free market economy is far less hospitable for tyrannical rulers and oppressive regimes than a centrally planned economy.
Perhaps there is a reason why all the countries which "declared themselves to be based off of Marx and Engels have also been one-party dictatorships." Sure, correlation does not imply causality, but given enough examples, perhaps one should begin doubting the divinity of communism. There are certainly enough beliefs within the dogma of communism (must be attained through a revolution, forcefully taking controll from some and giving it to others, etc.) which would be conducive to the sort of "one-party dictatorships" that have historically emerged.
Not understanding what "pompous rhetoric" is proves that you NEVER took Logic 101. He was right, straw man argument -- and I last took logic about 7 years ago.
Given two hypothetical countries, both with brutally despotic rulers and the same amount of rights, with the exception of one being centrally planned, and the other possessing a free market, which country is freer?
They are equally unfree. Simply because a person is free to own a factory in one land does not make it more free than a land where a person is forbidden from owning a factory. The fact that a person is free to accumulate great wealth in this scenario has nothing to do about the freedom to speak out against the crimes of the Government.
My point was "Free societies require (at least mostly) free markets." Rebutting this statement by listing states which possessed a free market and yet were not completely and utterly free does not disprove my point
I probably misread your comment. You also wrote: I think it's time that people finally accepted that the Austrian / Chicago school of economic thought [emphasis added] is far closer to freedom than any of the garbage Marx, Engels, and Lenin were spewing. Thus, I assumed you considered economic and societal freedom, if not causal, at least correlational. I was simply trying to point out that Free Markets do not require Free Societies; thus, a Free Society could easily slide into a non-Free one, whilst the market still went about its work.
Certainly you will agree that a free market economy is far less hospitable for tyrannical rulers and oppressive regimes than a centrally planned economy.
I agree it is far less hospitable than other forms of economic systems. Just it is also not wholy inhospitable. After all, a dictator could easily permit a free market for anyone who does not oppose the regime.
given enough examples, perhaps one should begin doubting the divinity of communism. There are certainly enough beliefs within the dogma of communism (must be attained through a revolution, forcefully taking controll from some and giving it to others, etc.) which would be conducive to the sort of "one-party dictatorships" that have historically emerged.
I think this is more a result of having nearly all Communist countries that lasted any appreciable length of time outside the U.S.S.R. modeled their development after the U.S.S.R. This means that the Coup d'Etat launched by Lenin often termed the October Revolution provided the effective base for single-party governance, as the Coup was mainly Bolshevik in character, and the following Civil War effectively quashed the other parties. Then Uncle Joe Stalin (or, as I prefer to call him, Tsar Josif) took over after Lenin's death, and squashed any rights which interfered with his outlook on how the country should be run (N.B.: this included economic rights. Lenin established the New Economic Policy, which broke up Government owned industries into different sections, which were then ordered to compete along pseudo-Free Market Lines; also, the ownership of small factories and of small stores of under, iirc, ten people was also legalized. Stalin made an alliance with the Old Bolsheviks promising to keep the NEP if he is installed into power instead of Trotsky, who vowed to rid the U.S.S.R. of the NEP. Then, after gaining power, Stalin did away with the NEP and the Old Bolsheviks both.) Then, when other forms of authoritarian Communists were trying to gain power, they followed the way that had worked in the U.S.S.R.
Brutally despotic rulers are not much favored by most people. So I think your set up was a bit artificial. But let us suppose we have some brutal and despotic rulers and also that public stock corporations were discrimated against by the brutal despotic rulers, let us say by high taxes and heavy regulation. Compare that to brutal despotic rulers who let the corporations run wild, break unions, monopolize, cook the books, rig prices, etc. etc.
Now it seems to me given your free trade ideology you would pr
There are no free market countries that I know of. U.S. industries are so heavily protected and subsidized by taxpayers it's ridiculous to think we have anything approaching a free market. Our aerospace industry is subsidized to a stunning degree by taxpayers, as is the communications sector, agriculture, and the energy sector. The U.S. steel, auto, and tech sectors are receiving, or about to receive, huge anti-competitive protections that go against all free trade theories. People in the U.S. don't wan
That is hardly a sound argument. A few counterexamples does not prove that something can not exist.
I expect that you are also applying your middle class perspective on how free a society is. I would too. But how free do you really think the lower class is in capitalist society? Just because the pressures against them are more subtle and indirect doesn't mean they don't exist.
Roosevelt in a speech in January 1941 talked about the four freedoms. They have very little to do with economics. It is much more simple and human than Marx.
"In the future days which we seek to make secure, we look forward to a world founded upon four essential human freedoms.
The first is freedom of speech and expression --everywhere in the world.
The second is freedom of every person to worship God in his own way
-- everywhere in the world.
The third is freedom from want
--everywhere in the world.
The fourth is freedom from fear,
--everywhere in the world."
What a world it could be. But China is not it. It is not even close. The US is not living up to this totaly but at least a lot of people in the US know where it should be going. I get sick to my stomach when I see all the idiots on Slashdot hold up the right to download kiddie porn and swap mp3s as freedoms. There are places where you can not teach your children about God if you do beleive in God with out worrying that your door will get kicked down and no one ever see you again! I do not care if a country is capitalist or not if they do not at least try for those four freedoms they are HELL. I know that some people belive trading with China will help it become free someday. I pray that they are right. Start with those four freedoms and then we can work on which system of ownership works the best!
Nope it really doesn't seem to but if it bugs you the final paragraph should drive you right over the edge.
"This nation has placed its destiny in the hands, heads and hearts of its millions of free men and women, and its faith in freedom under the guidance of God. Freedom means the supremacy of human rights everywhere. Our support goes to those who struggle to gain those rights and keep them. Our strength is our unity of purpose.
To that high concept there can be no end save victory." So go nuts. Most l
Ummmmmmmm...Please understand I'm speaking for NO ONE ELSE BUT ME....Now that I've made that clear, Please discontinue ALL religious rhetoric when discussing technical and information issues. Reference President Roosevelt's comments for clarity, should you need to do so.
Believe it or not I do agree with you. How ever the freedom of religion is such a fundamental freedom that to talk of freedom and not bring religion up is next to impossible. It does not matter if it is the moron in California that shoots up a jewish kindergarten, Nazis, the Klan, the USSR, modern China,or the idiots that want to ban Darwin from the schools the freedom to think and to wonder about the universe and about nature of God are fundamental freedoms and they are tightly tied together Hitler did not
I think **reason|logic** doesnt speak here. The government will block whatever it deems right and its ourselves who invent those various reasons why why why.
do agree that this sucks. Technically, China is still communist, and Wikipedia is about as fine an example of the triumph of successful communist principles (community-owned, from according to assets, to according to need) as you could ask for. Seems like a stupid idea on the part of China.
Agreed, communism isn't as great as democracy (although, it (communism) may have some hidden advantages), and I don't know enough about Communism in general to make a statement about this.
"Slashdot *does* criticize Chinese policy, including information control and the like."
Additionally, Slashdot rarely reports the news error free, then it drives so many people to any given site thus blowing it out of existence. Maybe Slashdot isn't blocked because the Chinese gov't is saying "Heh, we don't have to worry about them learning anything new there."
Hehe but that's the draw back of living in a communist country, you never get to live arround or experience all your communist benefits. I hear a lot of people glorifying the communist ideals, even holding the authors of modern communism higher than the likes of Reagan, Lincoln, and Washington. Everything that you espoused as a benefit of communistic ideals is a part of "all" governments:
"community-owned" (I don't know of a country that doesn't say it's community owned.)
"from according to assets" (every p
Technically, China is still communist, and Wikipedia is about as fine an example of the triumph of successful communist principles (community-owned, from according to assets, to according to need) as you could ask for.
Huh? Get yer head out yer ass - wikipedia is a voluntary organization of people brought together for a common purpose. Communism is the introduction of force to redistribute wealth and prosperity "from those according to their abilities, to those according to their needs". The difference
We need to develop tools to share and distribute information securely, anonymously, and efficiently. Government control in these matters is not in our best interests, and in the best interests of the rest of the world. Sure this sounds like your normal "information wants to be free" rant, but when the government here in the United States tries to send someone to jail on trumped up Terrorism Charges [slashdot.org] for running a website... well it's quite clear that freedom of speech and the rights I hold dear mean nothing to those in power. "Even" in the "freeset nation on earth".
Sure there's freenet and what have you, but when it comes to oppressive governments I'd rather not have anyone know I'm functioning as a freenet node and a relay for certain information.
check out i2p... maybe it's exactly what you're looking for. if you're really impressed, and you can, please contribute! we need this network functional and -used- as soon as possible, given the state of politics worldwide and the necessity for free speech.
LOL, never noticed that... whoops. I find it odd that they have a publicly available website, complete with domain, if they want it to be "kept private"... I guess in retrospect, I'm sorry I posted the link, but it never occurred to me not to.:)
Thanks bloody slashdotters! You knocked the test engine [harvard.edu] down!:)
Anyway, slashdot.org is not officially blocked [harvard.edu] or restricted in China - YET. If your China friends found it difficult to access/. from China it might due to some self-disciplinary measures by individual ISP.
I thought it was interesting - but not terribly surprising - that the access was cut off just prior to the anniversary of the Tianenmen Square massacre. It's odd to be able to access a Chinese site from the US that is blocked there... (Or has the block been lifted?) In any case, I was poking around and found their page on Tianenmen [wikipedia.org]. Some of the pictures are familiar - I wonder how many people in China would find them as familiar as I do? Too bad they can't see them.
Still, I think this is a stopgap measure at best. The wikipedia is an easy target because it's a clearing house for links to information, but as long as there is any internet, there will be a way for this information to be passed around. A better model for disseminating information underground would be a highly decentralized system - harder to navigate, but more robust.
I also thought it was odd that there were only 100 regular contributors, out of a country of 1 billion+ people. Is it lack of computer access? Or fear of reprisals? I have to have admiration for the people who put the zh.wikipedia together in the first place.
At first, zh was blocked in and around Berlin a couple of days before the anniversary; this block has since expanded to cover most of our IPs, and our whole set of DNS domains, and being blocked throughout China, from what word we have had passed on.
All Wikimedia servers are hosted in Florida, so life is unaffected for the rest of the world. Sadly, this is not the case for our Chinese brethren.
Having a look at the article text is states "Ten days ago the Chinese government blocked Internet access to the Chinese version [wikipedia.org] of the Wikipedia".
To me that seems to imply that the English version of the site has not been blocked. Can anyone confirm if this is true?
I find it particularly ironic that many people call the Chinese Firewall the "Great Firewall of China". The Great Wall of China did not do its specified task very well.
Most of the Great Wall that we see, know, and love today was made under the Ming Dynasty [wikipedia.org], which ruled from 1368 to 1644 [wikipedia.org]. They probably did this in order to keep out the Mongols [wikipedia.org] again. Of course, when the Ming fell, they were taken over by the Qing, or Manchu Dynasty [wikipedia.org], which attacked across the wall, and conquered all of modern-day China, and t
Yes, but the second dynasty conquered China, by attacking through the Great Wall. As this was a dynasty of Non-Han Chinese, they had no need for the Great Wall, as their Home Province (Manchuria) was on the other side of it.
Likewise, the Ming Dynasty was the one that put most of what we currently consider the Great Wall up. Thus, they went to this extreme expense for nothing.
All governments rely on the consent (or at least aquiesence) of the governed. As soon as the majority really BELIEVE that there is something better possible, it's all over.
> All governments rely on the consent (or at least aquiesence) of the governed. As soon as the majority really BELIEVE that there is something better possible, it's all over.
Depends who's holding the guns. I'm sure a great percentage of folks living in Stalinist USSR believed there had to be something better - getting that without getting killed or shipped off to Siberia, that's a different problem.
Any subversives looking for information to undermine the Communist regime would instead find themselves posting inane posts about dead operating systems, hot grits and beowulf clusters.
How much time will it take for to Slashdot be blocked?
We just have to liberally sprinkle lots of pro-China comments in our messages to ensure that our geeky breathern in the Far East can continue to enjoy the scintillating, intellectual banter found everyday on this great site.
Lucas should have cast Jet Li as Jango Fett!
I'll bet the upper levels of Starfleet Command are all Chinese. That's why you never see them on the Enterprise. They're too important to be in harm's way.
We just have to liberally sprinkle lots of pro-China comments in our messages to ensure that our geeky breathern in the Far East can continue to enjoy the scintillating, intellectual banter found everyday on this great site.
Given the political leanings and the level of historical knowledge of a large portion of Slashdot'
s posters (just like most of Western civilization's inhabitants), this will probably occur naturally.
Why are there so many anti-Israeli protesters and yet so few Free Tibet protesters.
Confusious Says:
Even the greatest of whales is helpless in middle of desert.
What will they do now without wikipedia, I know devolop there own language and have no need for english... OOps too late
This issue has been raised on wikipedia-l mailing list and there were some opinions [wikipedia.org] that they should try to resolve things quietly before making headlines. Posting on the Slashdot at this point of time sure won't help anyone (OK, so people have the right to know).
Speaking of blocking... (Score:5, Funny)
How much time will it take for to Slashdot be blocked?"
Slashdot is already blocked in China and India. Geeks are still productive overseas. This is the main reason for the offshore outsourcing frenzy.
How soon can Slashdot be blocked in North America.
Re:Speaking of blocking... (Score:1, Redundant)
By the way, most of the programming jobs are being outsorced to India, with extremely few going to China (manufacturing is a different matter).
Three words. (Score:3, Insightful)
Humor, artistic license
Re:Three words. (Score:2)
Re:Three words. (Score:1)
Re:Speaking of blocking... (Score:2)
Just wait...
Re:Speaking of blocking... (Score:2)
Re:Speaking of blocking... (Score:3, Informative)
Re:Speaking of blocking... (Score:2)
Is there some sort of dynamic steganography that could serve a site to look one way unless you have the appropriate software and key on the other side?
Re:why flamebait? (Score:2)
Re:Speaking of blocking... (Score:2)
Like us? I think you need to understand your audience. Most of "us" aren't students, in the traditional sense.
Slashdot not going to be blocked (Score:5, Insightful)
Slashdot *does* criticize Chinese policy, including information control and the like.
However, it's also extremely critical of the current US administration, which China's current administration is not a tremendous fan of.
Also, Slashdot (at least the English slashdot.org) is not in Chinese, limiting the number of people that can read it. Wikipedia is translated to Chinese.
I do agree that this sucks. Technically, China is still communist, and Wikipedia is about as fine an example of the triumph of successful communist principles (community-owned, from according to assets, to according to need) as you could ask for. Seems like a stupid idea on the part of China.
Re:Slashdot not going to be blocked (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Slashdot not going to be blocked (Score:3, Insightful)
China would not necessarily have been any freer if it had been "a communist country per Marx." I think it's time that people finally accepted that the Austrian / Chicago school of economic thought is far closer to freedom than any of the garbage Marx, Engels, and Lenin were spewing. Free societies require (at least mostly) free markets; history has s
Re:Slashdot not going to be blocked (Score:3, Insightful)
Free Markets like Singapore? or Pinochet's Chile? Or how about Revolutionary France, with guarantees to property? [hrcr.org]
I know none of these are perfect examples, but simply because a place has free markets, does not make them inherently free.
I believe many people should remember that all countries which have declared themselves to be based off of Marx and Engels have also been one-
Re:Slashdot not going to be blocked (Score:4, Insightful)
My point was "Free societies require (at least mostly) free markets." Rebutting this statement by listing states which possessed a free market and yet were not completely and utterly free does not disprove my point; implying that I stated that societies with free markets are always free and then disproving that point it a straw man fallacy.
Furthermore, there is evidence to support the fact that free market economies eventually lead to the downfall of oppressive regimes (see East Asian Tigers excluding Singapore, etc.). Certainly you will agree that a free market economy is far less hospitable for tyrannical rulers and oppressive regimes than a centrally planned economy.
Perhaps there is a reason why all the countries which "declared themselves to be based off of Marx and Engels have also been one-party dictatorships." Sure, correlation does not imply causality, but given enough examples, perhaps one should begin doubting the divinity of communism. There are certainly enough beliefs within the dogma of communism (must be attained through a revolution, forcefully taking controll from some and giving it to others, etc.) which would be conducive to the sort of "one-party dictatorships" that have historically emerged.
Re:Slashdot not going to be blocked (Score:2)
Not understanding what "pompous rhetoric" is proves that you NEVER took Logic 101. He was right, straw man argument -- and I last took logic about 7 years ago.
Re:Slashdot not going to be blocked (Score:4, Informative)
Re:Slashdot not going to be blocked (Score:2)
Now it seems to me given your free trade ideology you would pr
Mod parent up! (Score:1)
Re:Slashdot not going to be blocked (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:Slashdot not going to be blocked (Score:1)
I expect that you are also applying your middle class perspective on how free a society is. I would too. But how free do you really think the lower class is in capitalist society? Just because the pressures against them are more subtle and indirect doesn't mean they don't exist.
Big freaking clue (Score:5, Insightful)
"In the future days which we seek to make secure, we look forward to a world founded upon four essential human freedoms.
The first is freedom of speech and expression --everywhere in the world.
The second is freedom of every person to worship God in his own way
-- everywhere in the world.
The third is freedom from want
--everywhere in the world.
The fourth is freedom from fear,
--everywhere in the world."
What a world it could be. But China is not it. It is not even close. The US is not living up to this totaly but at least a lot of people in the US know where it should be going. I get sick to my stomach when I see all the idiots on Slashdot hold up the right to download kiddie porn and swap mp3s as freedoms. There are places where you can not teach your children about God if you do beleive in God with out worrying that your door will get kicked down and no one ever see you again!
I do not care if a country is capitalist or not if they do not at least try for those four freedoms they are HELL. I know that some people belive trading with China will help it become free someday. I pray that they are right. Start with those four freedoms and then we can work on which system of ownership works the best!
Re:Big freaking clue (Score:2)
"This nation has placed its destiny in the hands, heads and hearts of its millions of free men and women, and its faith in freedom under the guidance of God. Freedom means the supremacy of human rights everywhere. Our support goes to those who struggle to gain those rights and keep them. Our strength is our unity of purpose.
To that high concept there can be no end save victory."
So go nuts. Most l
Re:Big freaking clue (Score:1)
Re:Big freaking clue (Score:2)
Re:Slashdot not going to be blocked (Score:1)
if i say u down , u down
Re:Slashdot not going to be blocked (Score:1)
Agreed, communism isn't as great as democracy (although, it (communism) may have some hidden advantages), and I don't know enough about Communism in general to make a statement about this.
Re:Slashdot not going to be blocked (Score:2)
Additionally, Slashdot rarely reports the news error free, then it drives so many people to any given site thus blowing it out of existence. Maybe Slashdot isn't blocked because the Chinese gov't is saying "Heh, we don't have to worry about them learning anything new there."
Re:Slashdot not going to be blocked (Score:1, Redundant)
"community-owned" (I don't know of a country that doesn't say it's community owned.)
"from according to assets" (every p
Re:Slashdot not going to be blocked (Score:1)
Huh? Get yer head out yer ass - wikipedia is a voluntary organization of people brought together for a common purpose. Communism is the introduction of force to redistribute wealth and prosperity "from those according to their abilities, to those according to their needs". The difference
Just another reason why... (Score:5, Insightful)
Sure there's freenet and what have you, but when it comes to oppressive governments I'd rather not have anyone know I'm functioning as a freenet node and a relay for certain information.
Re:Just another reason why... (Score:4, Interesting)
http://www.i2p.net/
Re:Just another reason why... (Score:2)
From the very page you linked: "Please keep the www.i2p.net url private as before, no Slashdot links"
So, I take it that, for some reason, you dislike this project and want to kill it young, via a Slashdotting?
Re:Just another reason why... (Score:1)
They are so fragile (Score:4, Interesting)
Re:They are so fragile (Score:1)
Is slashdot.org blocked in China? (Score:4, Interesting)
Re:Is slashdot.org blocked in China? (Score:4, Interesting)
Anyway, slashdot.org is not officially blocked [harvard.edu] or restricted in China - YET. If your China friends found it difficult to access
zh.wikipedia on Tianenmen (Score:5, Interesting)
Still, I think this is a stopgap measure at best. The wikipedia is an easy target because it's a clearing house for links to information, but as long as there is any internet, there will be a way for this information to be passed around. A better model for disseminating information underground would be a highly decentralized system - harder to navigate, but more robust.
I also thought it was odd that there were only 100 regular contributors, out of a country of 1 billion+ people. Is it lack of computer access? Or fear of reprisals? I have to have admiration for the people who put the zh.wikipedia together in the first place.
Re:zh.wikipedia on Tianenmen (Score:5, Informative)
All Wikimedia servers are hosted in Florida, so life is unaffected for the rest of the world. Sadly, this is not the case for our Chinese brethren.
Wikipedia [[User:Jdforrester]].
Re:zh.wikipedia on Tianenmen (Score:1)
Or even in and around Beijing!
Re:zh.wikipedia on Tianenmen (Score:2)
Only Chinese version of Wikipedia? (Score:1, Redundant)
To me that seems to imply that the English version of the site has not been blocked. Can anyone confirm if this is true?
Re:Only Chinese version of Wikipedia? (Score:2)
"This past weekend that block was extended to include other language versions as well."
Re:Only Chinese version of Wikipedia? (Score:2, Informative)
Internet_censorship_in_China [wikipedia.org]
Re:Only Chinese version of Wikipedia? (Score:1)
Most of the Great Wall that we see, know, and love today was made under the Ming Dynasty [wikipedia.org], which ruled from 1368 to 1644 [wikipedia.org]. They probably did this in order to keep out the Mongols [wikipedia.org] again. Of course, when the Ming fell, they were taken over by the Qing, or Manchu Dynasty [wikipedia.org], which attacked across the wall, and conquered all of modern-day China, and t
Great Wall still pretty great (Score:2)
You then go on to say that one dynasty survived behind it for nearly 300 years, the next for c.360. Sounds like a pretty good defensive record to me.
Only hope the great firewall falls much quicker. Can you see their suppression of information from space?
Re:Great Wall still pretty great (Score:1)
Likewise, the Ming Dynasty was the one that put most of what we currently consider the Great Wall up. Thus, they went to this extreme expense for nothing.
Totalitarian societies (Score:5, Insightful)
All governments rely on the consent (or at least aquiesence) of the governed. As soon as the majority really BELIEVE that there is something better possible, it's all over.
Re:Totalitarian societies (Score:3, Insightful)
Depends who's holding the guns. I'm sure a great percentage of folks living in Stalinist USSR believed there had to be something better - getting that without getting killed or shipped off to Siberia, that's a different problem.
Re:Totalitarian societies (Score:2)
Why block Slashdot? (Score:5, Funny)
Hmm... maybe
Wikipedian discussions (Score:4, Interesting)
It had to be said (Score:3, Funny)
Pro-China posting (Score:5, Funny)
How much time will it take for to Slashdot be blocked?
We just have to liberally sprinkle lots of pro-China comments in our messages to ensure that our geeky breathern in the Far East can continue to enjoy the scintillating, intellectual banter found everyday on this great site.
There, I've done my part.
GMD
Re:Pro-China posting (Score:1, Troll)
Given the political leanings and the level of historical knowledge of a large portion of Slashdot' s posters (just like most of Western civilization's inhabitants), this will probably occur naturally.
Why are there so many anti-Israeli protesters and yet so few Free Tibet protesters.
How China Edits /. (Score:4, Funny)
All Chinese accounts read at mod level 6:Confucian.
Re:How China Edits /. (Score:1)
me chinese, me play joke... (Score:3, Funny)
Posting on the /. won't help them either (Score:2, Insightful)
SPAM to the rescue (Score:1)
Spam may end up being useful. The irony alone is compelling
How big is the internet in (Score:1)
All my friends laughed at me when I asked them this question.
Now thanks to the chinese government, they would realise that I am not a fool but a visionary
Tahya al-Moqawama al-Iraqiya! (Score:1)
Fuck the American pigs! Pigfuckers, they all are! Soon we will make all their towering buildings like the World Trade centers!
Death to the American pigs!!
Death to the American pigs!!
Death to the American pigs!!