Catch up on stories from the past week (and beyond) at the Slashdot story archive

 


Forgot your password?
Close
typodupeerror
×
Microsoft Government The Courts Your Rights Online News

Microsoft Agrees to Stop Hijacking Music-Shopping 382

Posted by michael from the mozilla-all-the-way dept.
ScottSpeaks! writes "CNN , ABC, and others are reporting that Microsoft has agreed to fix Windows XP so that it no longer launches IE (instead of the user's chosen default browser) when the user selects the "Shop for Music Online" option in Windows XP. MS isn't admitting that it's a violation of the consent decree they signed to get the DoJ to drop the anti-trust suit against them, but threats to take them to court over it are what prompted the move."
This discussion has been archived. No new comments can be posted.

Microsoft Agrees to Stop Hijacking Music-Shopping More

Microsoft Agrees to Stop Hijacking Music-Shopping

Comments Filter:

  • I'm seeing... (Score:5, Insightful)

    by JamesP ( 688957 ) on Friday January 16, 2004 @10:46AM (#7997595)
    Microsoft has agreed to fix Windows XP so that it no longer launches IE (instead of the user's chosen default browser) when the user selects the "Shop for Music Online" option in Windows XP

    Pops up Mozilla... "This site requires IE 6.0 to be viewed".

    C'mon, it's not that difficult...
    • Interesing point. They can fix the automatic hijack but with IE's noncompliant HTML you are still required to use it for some sites.

      An alternative is Opera since your can pose as IE but this has it's own problems. The page won't render or operate quite the same though in some cases.

      • Re:I'm seeing... (Score:3, Informative)

        by mark_lybarger ( 199098 )
        moz can pose as ie also, that's not what most sites do. they'll use java script or a server side preprocessor to determine your browser and lock you out w/o ie browser. posing even w/ moz gets around this.

    • Why should MS have to change? (Score:4, Interesting)

      by mj2k ( 726937 ) on Friday January 16, 2004 @11:19AM (#7997906)
      First of all I don't like MS's approach to software development (particularly the activation garbage you have to go through now) but I don't see that anyone has a right to force MS to stop using IE (yeah they technically weren't forced but the lawsuit threat initiated their response). Take Apple for example - practically everthing on a Mac is proprietary Apple software and you don't see the Mac people going ballistic over it. Forcing MS to make changes to their OS for anything other than privacy violations/blatant security holes isn't right. To illustrate the absurdity of the DOJ policy consider this: I do some scientific programming myself and I usually use the excel plugins for C to generate tables/graphs - if MS is forced to change their OS why shouldn't someone be able to force me to write a program in such away as to force me to generate charts using openoffice/staroffice or even Corel's wordperfect suite? If people don't like MS's software change to linux/freeBSD/MacOS where you can do whatever you want - it just isn't equitable to MS to force them to change stuff in their OS just because a group of people dislike IE (for gosh sakes if you didn't like MS why would you spend the $100+ to use their software?).
      • > practically everthing on a Mac is proprietary Apple software

        > why shouldn't someone be able to force me to write a program in such away

        Because neither Apple nor YOU are monopolies.

      • Re:Why should MS have to change? (Score:5, Insightful)

        by Maarek_1 ( 740578 ) on Friday January 16, 2004 @11:32AM (#7998039)
        First off, Apple does not hold over 90% of the desktop market. If it wants to be propriatary it isn't killing competition. When MS does it however, they manage to lock out other companies from the 90+% of the market that they are targeting. The fact of the matter is this, if MS continues to use no-complient HTML in their browser and also continues to forces the use their IE browser in windows, then people can't choose to use linux/free BSD/Mac OS unless they use a MS based browser (which they don't always keep updated). "Why?", you ask, because if 90% of the people use one OS with one browser, then many sites will be written to comply to that non-complient code and you get the errors that we see today: "This Page Requires I.E. 6.0 to view." Then you no longer base your choice on preference, but on the ability of the other browsers to function (since the DMCA causes problems with trying to emulate functionality).

        And that is why it is bad for MS to be allowed to force their Browser upon their Windows XP.

        I could be wrong however.
        • The fact of the matter is this, if MS continues to use no-complient HTML in their browser and also continues to forces the use their IE browser in windows, then people can't choose to use linux/free BSD/Mac OS unless they use a MS based browser (which they don't always keep updated).

          I'm sorry, but IE does use "complient HTML", it just adds some special features to certian things (mainly CSS). All browers have their own DDT built into them for HTML... this allows them to recognise the tags that people thro

      • Re:Why should MS have to change? (Score:5, Informative)

        by nolife ( 233813 ) on Friday January 16, 2004 @11:33AM (#7998055) Homepage Journal
        why shouldn't someone be able to force me to write a program in such away as to force me to generate charts

        The rules are different when a court determines your business is a monopoly [psu.edu]. This change would not have happened if that was not the case.
      • Under Mac OS, if you set IE or Camino or whatever as your default browser, then all invocations of a browser URL will launch that browser and not Apple's proprietary Safari.

        Nobody is saying that MS can't use IE as it chooses. The issue here was that there was a feature built into the OS that forced the user to use the IE browser even if s/he had explictly told the OS that another browser was the default. That is using the OS monopoly to create a browser monopoly, and that is exactly what Microsoft was fo

      • Re:Why should MS have to change? (Score:5, Insightful)

        by calyphus ( 646665 ) on Friday January 16, 2004 @12:20PM (#7998571) Journal
        practically everthing on a Mac is proprietary Apple software and you don't see the Mac people going ballistic over it

        Mac users have options, and unlike IE, Mac browsers actually follow standards.

        Your plugins for Excel example is off the point. When it comes to MS forcing its browser on users, the problem is that they are trying to defeat and close open standards. The WWW was never supposed to require any platform. It is supposed to be an Open Standard. Everytime some lazy coder caters to the anti-standard functions of MS tech, the universality of the web shrinks. If MS actually followed web standards, browser detection could be a thing of the past. They continue to require developers to cater to their crap. Through their quirks they've usurped the universal, open nature of the web and mad significant portions of it closed to anyone not choosing their crap platform.

        MS should have to change to adapt to the world, not the world adapt to MS. Picture a four-lane highway. Some Canyonero driver is straddling the line, forcing traffic to stay behind it. The road was built for two lanes of traffic going in each direction. A standard was established, but one driver, just because he can, keeps it from working as designed. Shouldn't the cops get that driver off the road?

      • Breaking the law (Score:3, Insightful)

        by RahoulB ( 178873 )
        It's not the fact that they're a monopoly - it's a remedy for them previously ABUSING their monopoly position. Apple doesn't have a monopoly position to abuse.

        It's like ruling that a burglar is not allowed to carry a crowbar in the street and the burglar's riposte being "I should be allowed to carry whatever I want". Well, ordinarily you can, but you broke the law and this is the remedy to prevent you doing it again.

    • Change which browser you use... (Score:5, Informative)

      by Otto ( 17870 ) on Friday January 16, 2004 @11:22AM (#7997932) Homepage Journal
      Or at least which browser you claim to use.

      Just add this to your user.js file (create the file in the same dir as prefs.js if it doesn't exist yet):

      user_pref("general.useragent.override", "Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 6.0; Windows NT 5.1)");

      That'll fake it so the site thinks you're using IE 6 on an XP box. Usually, unless the site has something really extraordinary on it, it'll work reasonably okay anyway.
      • Exactly. And an even better solution is to use PrefBar [mozdev.org]. It is small, not intrusive (Press F8 to show or hide it) and very convenient.

        You can change the user-agent, remove flash animations, turn on/off images etc. Give it a try...

      • worse overall impact (Score:5, Insightful)

        by mattdm ( 1931 ) on Friday January 16, 2004 @12:05PM (#7998431) Homepage
        If you do this, *please* make sure to e-mail the maintainers of the website. Tell them you use Mozilla, and what you had to do -- and whether or not their site actually *does* work with standards.

        Otherwise, the fake user agent string just continues to tell them "everyone uses IE anyway, so we're doing the right thing by ignoring those losers".

  • Lovely spin (Score:4, Insightful)

    by grub ( 11606 ) <slashdot@grub.net> on Friday January 16, 2004 @10:47AM (#7997605) Homepage Journal

    [from the CNN article:] .. available to customers by February or March in the form of a Windows update that it will offer for download, the department said.

    [from the ABC article:] Microsoft has agreed to make changes in its Windows XP operating system to satisfy US government concerns [...] "Without necessarily agreeing with the Department's position, Microsoft has agreed to remove the override of the user's default browser..

    Why is it that whenever these crooks are forced to follow the rules of any legal settlement it's spun in such a way as to appear like they're doing the consumer a favour? "offer [the patch] for download" and "Microsoft has agreed"?!

    [sarcasm]Thank you so very much, Bill.[/sarcasm]

    • Why would they admit doing something illegal if they don't have to? Why would a company risk getting sued or fined for doing something if they don't have to?

      This is the way the legal system, plea bargins, ect work. Both sides end up getting something that's better than the alternative if the other side wins - the DOJ gets what they want, and MS doesn't lose a bunch of money. Both sides would rather have the certainty of that outcome than a partial chance of total victory.

  • Is this really MS? (Score:5, Interesting)

    by ruiner13 ( 527499 ) on Friday January 16, 2004 @10:47AM (#7997609) Homepage
    Since when is it Microsoft's policy to implement changes without an actual lawsuit? Granted this is probably nothing more than a registry change, but does this signal a new non-court driven Microsoft? I tend to think not. In this case, they probably calculated that it would be cheaper to change the link than to spend years in court feeding their legal team.

    • Re:Is this really MS? (Score:3, Interesting)

      by nologin ( 256407 )
      Hmm, I suppose that Microsoft realizes that in their last anti-trust suit (in which they were found 'guilty'), their 'slap on the wrist' was a compliance order.

      Now that they have been threatened with a lawsuit with respect to a violation of their compliance order, the likelyhood that MS would win is minimal. Contempt of court is not something to be taken lightly, especially when it comes to orders issued by a court of law.

  • Interesting.... (Score:3, Interesting)

    by The One KEA ( 707661 ) on Friday January 16, 2004 @10:48AM (#7997612) Journal
    Does it say anywhere how MS was preventing these programs from honoring the default browser setting?

  • MSN? (Score:5, Interesting)

    by loconet ( 415875 ) on Friday January 16, 2004 @10:49AM (#7997621) Homepage
    Some recent versions of MSN messenger used to do this as well. The latest version I've downloaded uses my default browser.
    • Lots of programs have oversights where they assume I.E. is your default browser. Dreamweaver, for example, can be told to preview in Netscape, whereby it goes to Netscape, or in Internet Explorer, whereby it goes to your default browser (Opera).

  • Coolness factor.... (Score:5, Insightful)

    by BWJones ( 18351 ) * on Friday January 16, 2004 @10:50AM (#7997630) Homepage Journal
    MS isn't admitting that it's a violation of the consent decree they signed to get the DoJ to drop the anti-trust suit against them, but threats to take them to court over it are what prompted the move."

    So, ........without turning this whole thing into an anti-Microsoft rant, (I fear this will happen) we hear this kind of thing again and again from Microsoft. Microsoft violates (again) the terms of the anti-trust trial and says "ooops, my mistake." and agrees to change its behavior (barely). How do they keep getting away with it? I don't really have an answer for it but, they appear to have a somewhat schizophrenic relationship with their potential markets.

    The issue here is manifold: 1) Microsoft is a monopoly (not necessarily bad), 2) Microsoft leverages that monopoly against other markets (bad). The problem is that they really can't help themselves because their shareholders (disclaimer: I own some Microsoft stock) demand greater returns on their investment and they really don't know how to do anything differently. Microsoft is maturing and recently has paid out dividends (about time), but they seem to be continuously stumbling over their own feet in various markets. Microsoft has some smart folks there (including a few friends of mine), but as a whole the company has the appearance of a bunch of malicious geeks who are smart, but are not very creative, resulting in a desperate desire to be cool and seen as cool. This could be a result of marketing management keeping the programmers etc... under control, but Microsoft as a whole lacks that essence of coolness that gives them an edge. Therefore the predatory nature of the monopoly as they gobble up every concept that could be seen as giving Microsoft some degree of edge. It also might be that they are so big, they really don't have the ability to move very quickly or be objective in their analysis of markets. I would bet that if they broke themselves into a number of different companies (that even had the possibility of competing with each other), they would be much more competitive and would prove a much better return on investment.

    Come on Bill, how would you like to be the principal of five or six big companies? One company can only get you so far you know.....? :-)

    • The old saw "it's easier to get forgiveness than permission". The only difference is that they are getting a little more savy (or conservative) as to when to pull back before the lawsuit actually starts. What do they have to lose by trying- the undying love of the geek community?

    • Re:Coolness factor.... (Score:2, Insightful)

      by Anonymous Coward
      Actually, it's even worse. Microsoft's response isn't "ooops, my mistake" it's "well, if you insist". They don't admit that they've done -anything- that violates the anti-trust settlement!!
    • ... I mean, a lot of the computer scientists who work for Microsoft very definitely have an agenda and if its not so much of a social agenda, I don't know what it is.

      It is naive to think that computing sciences is stagnant or not going anywhere, because it is: in big ways, and small ways, and all kinds of ways. Moores law, and the fundamental principles of computer science, all lead to a heck of a lot more advances in very short periods of time, in ways which fundamentally change our culture. Look at the
    • Big business isn't into cool. They can't afford it. It's one of the signals that indicate when your business has shifted from being a small company to a large company.

      It's pretty simple, really.

      A new, small company comes up with a really cool product that nobody ever thought of, or at least never bothered to try to sell. The company is innovative, smart, hip, and all those happy adjectives.

      They continue improving their spiffy product, making it easier to use, better, stronger, faster, able to brush yo

      • Re:Coolness factor.... (Score:3, Interesting)

        by dustman ( 34626 )
        The company will continue to try to improve their products, but they won't generally stray too far away from their core product, because they often have too many investors who expect that core to provide them with a return for their investment. Plus, they've spent so much time and effort grasping that domain, they can't easily or quickly move the company in another direction.

        I think you are wrong here. There are lots of bright people, and lots of bright people running companies, that aren't going to expe

  • Outlook does this too (Score:3, Interesting)

    by Oliver Wendell Jones ( 158103 ) on Friday January 16, 2004 @10:51AM (#7997639)
    If I receive a non-HTML/RTF formatted e-mail that contains a URL, Outlook will convert it to a link and when clicked it launches IE rather than my preferred browser.

  • That makes sense... (Score:5, Insightful)

    by andih8u ( 639841 ) on Friday January 16, 2004 @10:51AM (#7997640)
    So the user can install a different browser on their own but have to rely on the "shop for music online" button? I don't know where this "feature" is, but is this something that redirects people to one of Microsoft's sites that's designed to work with IE? If so, I'd hijack the link as well.

    • Re:That makes sense... (Score:2, Insightful)

      by falxx ( 456915 )
      I think the real problem actually relies there, not with the use of IE, but the use of constantly using MS-services, not that anyone really cares about that. Whenever the user will see that there are other and better options (itunes pour example) he/she will consider it, but they never do. When there isn't really options available to the user right there and then, the problem continues...

  • Poor code quality as an excuse (Score:4, Funny)

    by salimma ( 115327 ) * on Friday January 16, 2004 @10:51AM (#7997643) Homepage Journal
    ... I was about to suggest MS would use 'we did not do this intentionally, our code is just of poor quality', but I guess their 'Trusted Computing' initiative kinds of shoots the argument down :)

  • What's the big deal? (Score:5, Insightful)

    by chefbb ( 691732 ) on Friday January 16, 2004 @10:51AM (#7997645)
    Maybe I'm being dense, but what's the big deal with Microsoft launching their browser for their music shopping service? If they'd used a browser control on their own app, would anyone have complained? It's not like there aren't 1000 other places online to buy music.

    Really, perhaps the issue should be the existance of a "buy music online" selection in XP at all. I hate all those pre-loaded ads that come disguised as usability enhancements.

  • Whilst they are at it ... (Score:4, Interesting)

    by Mr_Silver ( 213637 ) on Friday January 16, 2004 @10:52AM (#7997652)
    ... maybe they could stop MSN Messenger and Outlook firing up IE (over my default browser) too.

    Annoys the hell out of me.

  • What about Windows Update (Score:5, Interesting)

    by aflat362 ( 601039 ) on Friday January 16, 2004 @10:52AM (#7997653) Homepage
    I use XP Pro at home (Your condolences are not necessary) Mozilla Firebird is my default browser. I despise IE. The only time I see IE launch is when I do windows update. I wonder if there's any way microsoft could be convinced to program Windows update in a way that it could be accessed by other (standards compliant) browsers.

    • Re:What about Windows Update (Score:5, Informative)

      by SumDog ( 466607 ) on Friday January 16, 2004 @10:59AM (#7997726) Homepage Journal
      Here is a better question: should windows update even be run through a browser? No! Windows Update should be a completely standalone program. It has no business even being done through a web browser.

      Let's look at the other operating systems. Redhat uses rpm/yum/up2date which are all command line with a couple of gtk front-ends you don't need to use. Debain used apt. Gentoo uses emerge/portage. Not sure about OSX, but I'm willing to be that it's update tool isn't connected to Safari.

      Binding the update tool to the web browser seems to be one of those ploys Microsoft started years back to try to prove IE was essential to their operating system and couldn't be removed. Bad design dictated by bad politics. Here is a better question: should windows update even be run through a browser? No! Windows Update should be a completely standalone program. It has no business even being done through a web browser.

      • Re:What about Windows Update (Score:4, Insightful)

        by andih8u ( 639841 ) on Friday January 16, 2004 @11:08AM (#7997809)
        doesn't that annoying little windows update tool that lives in the systray and pester the crap out of you work outside of the browser? How windows update is accessed is a moot point anyway given that your average user never uses it.

      • Re:What about Windows Update (Score:4, Interesting)

        by ad0gg ( 594412 ) on Friday January 16, 2004 @12:58PM (#7999122)
        Umm IE engine is essential to windows, do you not notice that explorer windows in XP are HTML pages with some extensions? You can customize it however you want if you know html. If you don't like it, don't use MS products. People complain so much Microsoft, here's a big hint, Don't support them with your money. I use Macs, and everything that I need is on the mac. My parents use macs, and I recently just setup my uncle and aunt on a cheap eMac. My college used Linux.

    • Re:What about Windows Update (Score:4, Funny)

      by NineNine ( 235196 ) on Friday January 16, 2004 @11:32AM (#7998038)
      I wonder if there's any way microsoft could be convinced to program Windows update in a way that it could be accessed by other (standards compliant) browsers.

      I'm sure they would, as soon as other browsers supported Active X.

  • Litigous Society (Score:4, Insightful)

    by IamGarageGuy 2 ( 687655 ) on Friday January 16, 2004 @10:54AM (#7997663) Journal
    Is software at the point in it's evolution that any major changes only happen when there is a lawsuit involved? This is not only a microsoft phenomenon but I am starting to see it in all new software. WHEN DID THE DAMN LAWYERS START DICTATING WHAT THE SOFTWARE SHOULD DO ???? If GNU was not around to prove that software does not have to be created by committee this world would be a lot worse place than it is now. IMHO the open source community is becoming more than just about software and more about what is wrong with society as a whole.

  • There really isn't much to say here... (Score:5, Insightful)

    by Darken_Everseek ( 681296 ) on Friday January 16, 2004 @10:54AM (#7997669)
    I think the only real surprise to me here is that someone bothered to call MS on the rule-breaking.
    That's good to see.

    I wonder how many people will bother to download the patch though; I doubt many people keep up to date on that sort of thing. Sneaky on the part of MS, really. By the time someone noticed that they were breaking the rules, it was too late for the vast majority of Windows users.

  • WMP shopping (Score:3, Insightful)

    by Anonymous Coward on Friday January 16, 2004 @10:54AM (#7997673)
    As I understand it, the purchase music stuff is a button in Windows Media Player. If you use Windows Media Player to purchase music, don't you expect that it will send you to whomever Microsoft wants you to purchase music from?

    Seriously, this complaint is equivalent to asking Apple to send you to Napster when you shop for music with iTunes. It's utterly stupid, and the only reason Microsoft has to worry about it is that they are very unpopular with some government agencies right now.

    • this complaint is equivalent to asking Apple to send you to Napster when you shop for music with iTunes.

      If Apple had 90% of all installed "client" computers, such a complaint would be valid. As it is, Microsoft has a strangle-hold on the computer industry. Want to make hardware? Either play the Microsoft Ballgame, or forget over 90% of the end users out there. Same with software. Microsoft uses this leverage to push competition (e.g. BeOS, DR-DOS, Netscape, Real) out.

      the only reason Microsoft has t

    • "If you use Windows Media Player to purchase music, don't you expect that it will send you to whomever Microsoft wants you to purchase music from?"

      The problem isn't with the site that it connects to, but the browser used to do the connecting. If I set Mozilla as my default browser, I expect to use that as my browser for everything web-related (except perhaps windows update, as that uses ActiveX and I don't think there is a plug-in for any browser, but I don't run windows, so I'm not sure on that).

  • Another turn of events (Score:5, Funny)

    by Sklein382 ( 615377 ) * on Friday January 16, 2004 @10:55AM (#7997680)
    In another suprising turn of events, terrorists have also agreed to stop hijacking airplanes.

  • Doesn't anyone think (Score:5, Interesting)

    by tr0llb4rt0 ( 742153 ) on Friday January 16, 2004 @10:58AM (#7997715) Homepage
    it's a bit odd that they have a specific button in XP that says *Shop Online for Music*?

    Granted they've now allowed folks to browse their music retailing partners web site in a different browser.

    But I wonder what business deal has been done with the music retailer(s) so they can have a ready made market of Windows XP users sent direct to their door(s).

  • They better fix it (Score:5, Interesting)

    by emilng ( 641557 ) on Friday January 16, 2004 @10:59AM (#7997717)
    Considering...

    "Windows is about choice, you can mix and match all of this stuff," David Fester, general manager of Microsoft's Windows digital media division, told the New York Times. "We believe you should have the same choice when it comes to music services."

  • Microsoft software (XP) has an option to buy music from a Microsoft Site, and it uses a Microsoft product (IE) to connect to that site...this is bad, evil, monopolistic.

    Apple software (iTunes) has an option to buy music from an Apple site ("Music Store"), and it uses an Apple software (iTunes) to connect, and not my default browser (IE)

    This is different how?

    • The difference is that iTunes doesn't use the system's default browser to accomplish its goal, whereas Microsoft is not ging to let another browser anywhere near its own music app. The issue at hand is that third-party apps like MusicMatch, Kazaa and others were forced to use IE, despite any default browser setting otherwise. It is this that Microsoft has so kindly decided to remove.

    • Re:What's good for the goose... (Score:5, Informative)

      by irix ( 22687 ) on Friday January 16, 2004 @11:08AM (#7997810) Journal

      This is different how?

      Apple is not a convicted monopolist [usdoj.gov].

    • This is different because under Mac OS X, you can use any browser to purchase music from any site at any time. You're not compelled into using the iTMS (iTunes Music Store).

      If you point IE for Mac (or Opera, OmniWeb, Safari, whatever) to Napster with the intent to purchase music, the Mac OS doesn't launch iTunes and stuff you back to the iTMS.

      It's about leaving the decision up to the user. It's about not using the OS to redirect choice.

    • The difference is right here:

      Microsoft software (XP)...uses a Microsoft product (IE)

      Apple software (iTunes)....uses an Apple software (iTunes)

      In otherwords, XP uses IE (overriding the user's default settings) where as iTunes uses itself and is an application you chose to launch.

  • IRC, torrents... (Score:3, Funny)

    by Nadsat ( 652200 ) on Friday January 16, 2004 @11:04AM (#7997774) Homepage
    Who wants to shop for music anyway?

  • MS Coders Must be Dufuses (Score:4, Interesting)

    by moehoward ( 668736 ) on Friday January 16, 2004 @11:08AM (#7997811)
    The funny thing is that is not the only MS software that forces IE on you. There are others (especially in VS .NET).

    And while I'm on the topic of IE being foisted upon me...

    The only Web site that I have problems browsing is microsoft.com. Well, that and MSNBC.com. So much relies on IE. Why are MS coders in such a manic rush to make themselves look so stupid? "Uh, we only know how to write code for IE." I can view multimedia content at every news site except MSNBC, which requires IE and related crap.

    OK. Yes. I know why they do it. But, my god. Pick some other way to annoy people in to using your products. That, or actually release a browser that is as good as Firebird. Firebird is in freaking Alpha and it's better than a 10 year old IE. Innovation my ass.
    • The only Web site that I have problems browsing is microsoft.com. Well, that and MSNBC.com. So much relies on IE. Why are MS coders in such a manic rush to make themselves look so stupid? "Uh, we only know how to write code for IE." I can view multimedia content at every news site except MSNBC, which requires IE and related crap.

      I use Mozilla most of the time, but some sites that I need only use IE (like banking, etc.),i.e. I must use IE frequently, which really sucks.

      Makes me wonder if M$ has deals wit

    • I think the major problem is that most windows programming documentation, tutorials and sample code on how to launch a url actually hardcodes a call to IE! so most programmers just get used ot it and accept it

  • Does media understand? (Score:4, Insightful)

    by gr8_phk ( 621180 ) on Friday January 16, 2004 @11:18AM (#7997896)
    Do the RIAA and MPAA understand that MS wants to become the middle-man? Whoever controls the keys to DRM would effectively be the funnel through which all protected content must flow. Witness XBox and other consoles business models. I suspect these two organizations are aware of this, but haven't got the technical ability to produce an alternative. At least they're running with Apple on the music side - probably find them less threatening than MS. I suppose this is slightly off-topic :-)

  • IE defaults (Score:2, Informative)

    by sasca ( 669193 )
    I'm actually suprised by this - M$ has a long history of choosing defaults for me that I don't want.

    Now if only they could ship Windows with the "Launch every application in an Internet Explorer Window" turned off by default. I just _love_ having an excel spreadsheet open up in explorer instead of Excel.

    btw, you can turn this off for any file type, see http://ask-leo.com/archives/000041.html [ask-leo.com] for instructions.

  • And CD burning software? (Score:3, Interesting)

    by Ubi_NL ( 313657 ) <joris.benschop@gmaiCOUGARl.com minus cat> on Friday January 16, 2004 @11:31AM (#7998032) Journal
    How about this:

    Drag a link of EasyCDcreator to the SENDTO folder.
    Now use the SendTo link to Burn some files.
    Watch MS-CDburner fire up

  • Maybe I'm changing..... (Score:4, Interesting)

    by preclose ( 718515 ) on Friday January 16, 2004 @11:32AM (#7998043)
    I used to look at this sort of thing and be glad MS was changing or doing something right for a change. But lately I can't help but but enjoy when Microsoft screws people. The reason is that there are so many people I know of who claim MS sucks and whatnot. Yet these same people are unwilling to try the alternatives. I hope there are more worms that attack windows. I hope people have to call Microsoft and wait on hold for 2 hours to activate a product they purchased legally. I'm glad MS removed support for win 98. The only way to get through to people is to hit them. So rather than try to stop MS from doing it I'll stand in the corner and laugh. I guess I'm beginning to believe that legal intervention won't change things. The only way for things to change is to let people get screwed by MS enough times (30-40 roughly) then they may begin to start to see some of the problems so many /.ers have with MS. Then they'll either try a new OS or they'll keep bitching and just keep on taking it. (In my experience people tend to do the later) People will get what they deserve.....maybe that's a bad way to look at it but oh well....I'm tired of waiting on hold to explain why I have to reinstall my wintendo again.

  • if i click "premium services" or "subscriptions" or "media guide" it uses its embedded MSIE to take me to windowsmedia.com where i can purchase music (a bit like iTunes) or other music related products, i cannot navigate away from their site as r-click and url control has been disabled

    are they going to remove that ? after all this is exactly like having a copy of iTunes and their own store on every windowsXP install in existence, if thats not unfair practice i dont know what is

    also if i click on a movie/m
    • Don't use windows media player? There were lots of other choices out there, last time I checked.

      • yeah you could say that about MSIE with this "shop for music" just close MSIE right ? you have the choice right ?

        but they had to include the facility to deactivate it (MSIE) because of anti-trust, there is no such facility to remove the media sidebar or the integrated callbacks

        its all about default settings, not choice, unless you can talk joe schmoe or your grandma into finding,downloading,installing,configuring another media player, that will play .asx mms:// and all the other windows media player speci

  • Just once... (Score:4, Insightful)

    by phillymjs ( 234426 ) <slashdot@stanTWAINgo.org minus author> on Friday January 16, 2004 @11:52AM (#7998294) Homepage Journal
    ..I'd like Microsoft to have to admit to wrongdoing when they stop doing something wrong.

    This "We didn't do it, and we promise to never do it again" shit is getting old.

    ~Philly

  • What OS feature? (Score:3, Insightful)

    by 87C751 ( 205250 ) <sdot AT rant-central DOT com> on Friday January 16, 2004 @12:47PM (#7998982) Homepage
    A quick look at my XP testing box shows no such "Shop For Music Online" feature anywhere, even in folders with music files. This is a Windows Media Player-installed shell extension, isn't it?

    "You won't know where applications end and the operating system begins." Ick!

  • MS programs well; they lack a cultural insight (Score:3, Insightful)

    by mactari ( 220786 ) <rufwork.gmail@com> on Friday January 16, 2004 @01:21PM (#7999433) Homepage
    For all you that think MS coders are idiots, no, they're not. Look, from a programming standpoint, wouldn't you rather be calling an API from a controller environment that you *know* works that hoping a third-party library works the way it's "supposed to"? You'd better. One might nearly rightly complain I'm showing some of the "ferocious Not Invented Here complex" [faqs.org], but there's some reasoning behind the madness. If you want your program to work right, you use what is, in your opinion, the most reliable means to make that happen.

    But before you rightfully flame me out of existence, what MS has to understand is that they're not in a position to "do things right" here. There are cultural reasons -- not programming/techincal ones -- that they have to keep in mind. They've been, with reason, found to have leveraged their vast dominance over the desktop OS market into the Internet browser market as well. That's unfair. MS *has* to open up their apps to allow a user's choice or they're, once again, arguably illegally abusing monopoly status.

    The lesson here, and it's what most everyone not calling MS hackers a bunch of idiots (which they obviously aren't. I've never seen a better set of ideas come from one company -- at least before they're run though the MS Profit Maximization Machine, (c) 198x) is arguing, whether they know it or not: These cultural lessons aren't being taught to their programmers. Here, MS is culpable, and the people responsible should be held accountable.

  • How about a RECALL of all Windows XP systems? (Score:3)

    by Locutus ( 9039 ) on Friday January 16, 2004 @01:50PM (#7999756)
    Even though XP is not flying off the shelves, alot of damage is already done. Notice this is an optional download and not a required patch/fix. No fines or penalties were brought against them, just a "you have to stop that from now on". They can probably bury the patch and obfuscate the name so nobody ever installs it. This is the same practice that killed of the browser competition. Too little, too late...

    IMHO, they should be required to recall all XP boxes and pay for a qualified technician to install the patch. If anything breaks, Microsoft again pays the bill of fixing it.

    Microsoft was found guilty of a federal crime and agreed to abid by the terms of a settlement. This shows that they can break the terms of the settlement and just get a verbal scolding. Exactly the reason why they needed to get busted into tiny pieces. IMHO.

    BTW, don't you just love that stuff Microsoft is spewing about how Apple is limiting choice in online music? And how Microsoft is all about choice. These guys lyed on the stand and they have no problem lying to the public, press, investors, etc.

    LoB

  • OH MY GOD! (Score:3, Insightful)

    by inteller ( 599544 ) on Friday January 16, 2004 @09:51PM (#8004468)
    People are making a big deal over THIS!?!?!?!?! If you are so stupid that the only way to find music for sale online is by following this link then you need to be banned for computers. I had to hunt high and low before I found this very obscure link. If you are so fucking upset that your preferred browser doesnt load this stupid link, you need to step away from the computer and get a life. Is this the best FUD you can come up with against Microsoft these days? this isn't a flame....this is the motherfucking truth.

Slashdot Top Deals

"No matter where you go, there you are..." -- Buckaroo Banzai

Close