IBM, Intel Set Up $10m SCO Defense Fund 300
An anonymous reader writes that the "NY Times reports that a group of companies, led by I.B.M. and Intel, plans to announce today that it is setting up a $10 million legal defense fund to help pay for the litigation costs of corporate users of the popular GNU/Linux operating system if they are sued. ZDnet also has a story on this." otisaardvark points out that "The fund is to be administered by OSDL (Open Source Development Labs) and so, amongst other things, could bankroll legal costs for Linus."
Ah what it is to have friends (Score:5, Insightful)
Of course, IBM and Intel aren't doing this out of the kindness of their hearts, but it's still a nice gesture, 'cos it works for us (well, them, I'm not a kernel contributor
Simon
Re:Ah what it is to have friends (Score:5, Insightful)
If SCO goes after google, a well recognized name outside tech circles and gets thumped in it's first big, real court battle... it may force the "SCO Get Rich Train" right off the tracks before it really gets started.
I'm not a kernel developer either, but if Linux costs me $799 per proc to run, Windows and Apple become the cheaper alternative.
Re:Ah what it is to have friends (Score:5, Insightful)
Why else do you think MS told SCO to set it at that price point?
Partner Link (Score:5, Informative)
new direction sought (Score:2, Insightful)
Re:new direction sought (Score:4, Insightful)
Well, given the cash reserves and market share of MS, 'floundering' seems a malapropism.
OTOH, since Intel's compiler now does the Linux kernel, clearly they perceive some market growth in the penguin direction.
In other news, SCO swears up and down that it lost the winning lottery ticket...
Re:new direction sought (Score:2)
Re:new direction sought (Score:4, Interesting)
Floundering may seem like a premature word.
I recently saw an employee get fired and worse from a client of mine. The employee seemed invincible as he was a serious suck-up to the owner. He used slime tactics, and would stab anyone in the back to get ahead. I knew he would get his just reward - yet even then I dispaired that it would happen in my lifetime.
This went on for 3-4 years!
About six months ago, though, it caught up to him.
So, yes, MS isn't dead, yet. But I know that their kind of behavior eventually costs. And it will cost MS. And I think the cracks are starting to show now.
So, yes, I think "Floundering" is appropriate. Perhaps a bit visionary or ahead of it's time, but not wrong.
Cheers,
Greg
Re:Ah what it is to have friends (Score:2)
Re:What if... (Score:5, Insightful)
Imagine if Microsoft was doing team-ups like this. Slashdotters would be all over them for the "unfairness" of it all."
Microsoft already HAS "teamed up" and is intimately involved in this thing, or at the very least encouraging it.
$8 million dollars to SCaldera for licenses they didn't need, for one thing...
You can bet Microsoft will _NEVER_ "team up" with anyone fighting a cause for FOSS... The whole reason they are funding SCO's FUD driven pump n dump is because of the fact that the GPL is "Kryptonite" to their Embrace, Extend, Extinguish business model that they have used thus far to maintain their monopoly.
I forgive IBM for past transgressions because it seems they LEARNED from the mistakes they made in the 1980's. If they hadn't, it's likely IBM would have gone the way of Digital and other former dominant players...
Microsoft could crush Linux forever tomorrow... If they released Windows complete with source under the GPL. Won't ever happen.
An old proverb comes to mind. (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:An old proverb comes to mind. (Score:2, Interesting)
Re:An old proverb comes to mind. (Score:3, Insightful)
Remeber when the term "FUD" was invented, that it was in reference to IBM. Remember that IBM agressively takes advantage of the lax patent system, procuring IP whenever and wherever possible. Just because the Gaint is stepping on our enemies doesn't mean he'll won't accidentally (or not) step on us later.
Re:An old proverb comes to mind. (Score:3, Insightful)
Just like Bin Laden?
Just like Noriega?
Just like Ferdinand Marcos?
Just like Pinochet?
(Man, that "Proverb" must have come from the inverse of Solomon.)
Cheers,
Greg
Nice (Score:5, Interesting)
timing (Score:4, Insightful)
Re:timing (Score:2, Interesting)
Re:timing (Score:5, Informative)
Re:timing (Score:5, Informative)
Here's hoping.
Re:timing (Score:2)
Re:timing (Score:5, Interesting)
Now look what's happening here. OSDL is indemnifying linux users against legal action (more than an MS EULA can do, by the way), and SCO is... what's that? they're making noises about suing their own UNIX licensees?
Hypocrites!
Re:timing (Score:5, Insightful)
Cheers,
Craig
Covers end users, too (Score:5, Interesting)
This announcement should add a new dimension to SCO's nonsense about indemnification.
Re:Covers end users, too (Score:5, Interesting)
Re:Covers end users, too (Score:3, Interesting)
Re:Covers end users, too (Score:4, Informative)
Of course, IANAL, and it is Monday morning...
Re:Covers end users, too (Score:4, Insightful)
It seems to me that SCaldera is trying to retroactively change their license terms (ie: contract) with their customers to make it a violation to use Linux if you licensed OpenServer or UnixWare.
Legally, I'd think that (IANAL) unless such language was SPECIFICALLY already there when the customer signed, it's an extremely weak claim.
Such language would also almost certainly be illegal in some, if not most jurisdictions, as it's anti competitive.
If anyone wanted confirmation that SCaldera's business plan is a MS funded FUD machine stock "pump n dump", the fact that they are DIRECTLY attacking their own customers, their SOLE source of ongoing revenue should do it.
SCaldera isn't a business, unless you count shilling for Microsoft and Barratry as legitimate business practices.
Re:Covers end users, too (Score:3, Insightful)
Yeah, I'm kinda hoping (Score:4, Insightful)
If they're going after 800lb gorillas...
Re:Yeah, I'm kinda hoping (Score:3, Funny)
Well, yeah, they have the most bananas to take.
Re:Covers end users, too (Score:2)
although, I'm not sure how different 'developers' and 'users' are. since the source code is open. It's the same thing isn't it?
redhat's press relese:
The purpose of the fund will be to cover legal expenses associated with infringement claims brought against companies developing software under the GPL license and non-profit organizations supporting the efforts of companies developing software under a GPL license.
Sco isn't attacking us lil guys, th
So what will it be? (Score:3, Funny)
But... they are wasting $10 million on a legal defense fund to help Linus! YAY MEGACORPS!
Re:So what will it be? (Score:5, Interesting)
As for why IBM is doing this, that's obvious. Intel and the others? I'd say that being on the list of contributors for that is probably the best PR money can buy with the hacker community. If you are a tech company, the hacker community are your customers. They probably just redirected a few mil from advertising. Intel needs good PR right now with the hacker community to help them compete with the AMD Opteron.
This may be one of the last nails in the SCO coffin, since $10 mil can buy a lot of legal representation and SCO likely can't match that. SCO does not have the cash to bankroll fifty lawsuits. If the legal battle really got ugly, I'm sure the fund could solicit at least another few mil from Linux users.
Re:So what will it be? (Score:5, Funny)
Interesting enough then, that Activision, the one megacorp that would actually be thanked for bringing us Doom (well... Doom 3 anyways), seems unable to do so.
I believe Ambrose Bierce.. (Score:3, Interesting)
CORPORATION, n.
An ingenious device for obtaining individual profit without individual responsibility.
In short; whatever the acronym, they're all in it for the green and the Holy Ego.
Is that a good thing or a bad thing? (Score:3, Interesting)
It's set up to pay for legal defense (Score:3, Insightful)
Re:Is that a good thing or a bad thing? (Score:3, Insightful)
On of there PR thingys was indemnification, by creating this fund IBM is showing that they don't believe SCO will win.
They are also making sure that whoever SCO is going to target can defend itself properly. Nothing could be worse than some linux user getting sued and loosing due to lack of funds and setting a precedent.
Jeroen
Re:Is that a good thing or a bad thing? (Score:2, Insightful)
It's not agreeing they're guilty and paying their consumers a compensation, is just helping their consumers don't get harrassed by SCO litigation spree.
IBM (Score:5, Interesting)
(I don't work for IBM or have any connections to them other than my Thinkpad T40 (NewEgg has them now for $1600 bucks!)
Re:IBM (Score:2)
Where can I contribute? (Score:5, Funny)
; )
Re:Where can I contribute? (Score:2, Funny)
Re:Where can I contribute? (Score:2)
SCO's new plan. (Score:5, Funny)
SCO claimed that, to defend itself against such charges, it will be making gratuitous use of the OSDL defense fund.
nude mac desktops [mudshark.ath.cx]
Re:SCO's new plan. (Score:2)
Except that it is a fund for end users, and the redhat found is for developers, nothing for distributors apparently.
Intel and IBM won't throw away that much money... (Score:5, Insightful)
We're pretty damn sure that Linux is clean. You can be sure too, because if you get sued we'll pay the legal costs for the time being, but since we know that you (we, Linux) will win in the end, SCO will have to pay and so it won't cost us a dime.
And so our Linux bussiness can roll on. It's more than PR. It's saying we'll win.
Re:Intel and IBM won't throw away that much money. (Score:5, Informative)
For these companies, this is not a lot of money. What they really are putting on the line (and have been for a while) is their prestige and reputation.
Re:Intel and IBM won't throw away that much money. (Score:2)
John Sauter (J_Sauter@Empire.Net)
Re:Intel and IBM won't throw away that much money. (Score:2, Insightful)
Money well spent, called SCO's bluff (Score:3, Insightful)
For what it's worth, if SCO sues and loses, their stock price immediately hits the shitter, and there will be nothing to recover for IBM/Intel. So whatever money they use for defense is lost...if there is any.
That said, it's money well spent because they could e
Bigger promises to bigger fish (Score:5, Interesting)
OS was supposed to be use at your own risk... but it seems they are now going to make promises above and beyond a general GNU contract.
Ummm. (Score:2, Interesting)
Re:Ummm. (Score:2)
Shhhh. Don't tell anyone, Linus has been lying! (Score:2)
Re:Ummm. (Score:4, Interesting)
Caldera released all of that code under the GPL, though.* If not initially, through the contributing developer, then when they published the resulting body of work as OpenLinux.
They still retain copyright, but that doesn't mean they can revoke the use, distribution and modification rights that they've already granted to Linux users.
* (and SCO were still doing so until midway through last year, after this whole kerfuffle started.)
Already reported? (Score:2)
- Brian
check your facts! (Score:5, Informative)
Smart business move: Ring fence the bastards! (Score:5, Interesting)
The idea is simple: Ring fence SCO from accessing customer license fees. Meanwhile, bleed them to death by keeping them entangled in the SCO/IBM, RedHat/SCO suits.
If SCO cannot extract a single license fee because it ends up in another court case, their business model is effectively dead, thus (hopefully!) devaluing their stock!
Zero Hour (Score:3, Informative)
End user contributions?? (Score:4, Interesting)
Donate to groklaw (Score:5, Informative)
PJ is doing some AWESOME unpaid work uncovering and collating all the information about the case and the history of unix, sco, novell, the copyrights etc. Many journalists are looking and linking to groklaw already. If there's one person working against SCO who needs support from the community, it's PJ.
Re:Donate to groklaw (Score:2)
I wonder what Darl would have to say about this (Score:5, Insightful)
Ofcourse, it is yet another news article with SCO's name in it, but it also seems like IBM and Intel think they need a crapload of money to defend people, which in turn suggests that there is something to SCO's claims.
SCO really wants to go to court, but ofcourse they know they don't stand a chance. This amount of money on both sides could make for a spectacular trial.
At the same time, some people, who hadn't figured it out yet, might realise that there is no way on earth SCO is actually going to win.
Besided that, i wonder if IBM and Intel did return-on-investment calculations on this. Maybe they figure the kudos will be worth more than 10M.
Re:I wonder what Darl would have to say about this (Score:5, Insightful)
To me, it seems as if IBM and Intel need a press release to reassure customers, that's all. Not everyone follows every twist and turn in this, and a potential customer might be swayed by some of the SCO press.
To me, this is just IBM and Intel showing that their money is where their mouth is, so customers can look and feel safe in choosing Linux.
Cheers,
Ian
Re:I wonder what Darl would have to say about this (Score:3, Interesting)
Those add-ons qualify as an extension on an operating system that SCO claims is in violation as well, being that one would need a familiarity with a "stolen" product. If anyone profits from it, then by the standards set by the BSA and DMCA, they're guilty.
Needless to say, however, most of these developers make enough to live (relatively comfortabl
Re:I wonder what Darl would have to say about this (Score:2, Informative)
Sued by RedHat Linux? (Score:4, Interesting)
Re:Sued by RedHat Linux? (Score:2)
Re:Sued by RedHat Linux? (Score:5, Informative)
Now that RedHat no longer offers a free desktop version of their product, would it be possible that a Linux-running site could be sued by RedHat for illegally running a 'pirated' copy of Red Hat Advanced Server?
Only if you actually purchased a license do you give Red Hat permission to audit your facilities for license violations. Installing Linux is allowed by the GPL, as many times over as you would like. But you are only entitled to Red Hat services on the machine you paid for. IE NO UPDATES/BUG FIXES.
Would this be any different to Microsoft calling in the BSA to investigate a site running unlicensed copies of Windows?
Not really, you can always get Red Hat workalikes built from the source code available to us all. For Free!
White box Linux [whiteboxlinux.org]
Tao Linux [taolinux.org]
CentOS [caosity.org]
Just to name a few.
What if the RedHat site was running a hybrid type of installation, with portions of the distro taken from the unlicensed 'illegally obtained' version of RHAS, but others, such as package management (apt-get, for example), taken from the free GNU/Debian distro?
Depends on whether the machine is licensed or not. I assume a jacked up installation (debian packages on rh system) would void any warranty or compatability assurances that come with Red Hat.
No affecting end users (Score:3, Interesting)
Encouraging, but... (Score:5, Interesting)
It's encouraging to see that some of those who benefit from Linux are prepared to defend it against predators. But it may mean that they think there is a significant probability that SCOX will not implode before they can file any new lawsuits (as opposed just to threatening to file new lawsuits).
SCO stock going down... (Score:3, Funny)
Re:SCO stock going down... (Score:3, Interesting)
Well (Score:5, Insightful)
That leaves grandmas, 12 year old girls, and nerds in parent's basements out in the cold.
I guess we now know who SCO is going to target next.
Re:Well (Score:3, Insightful)
I keep seeing this, and it makes me think that perhaps the Brits treat a corporation differently. Maybe it's because corporations are different in the UK. However, in the US a corporation is an entity (SCO is a US corporation), and therefore is not treated grammatically as a plural of 'person.'
Intel has more to contribute than money (Score:5, Insightful)
Now if adaptec joins in sco could be in for a ripping the like of which has never been seen
Who is not IANAL wins (Score:3, Insightful)
The future (Score:3, Interesting)
I am just looking forward to the day where this SCO's legal challenge gets thrown out of court...I am interested what would happen to all these companies that setup these defense funds worth millions of dollars. I sure hope thy donate this back into the OS community in some form (eg donations, code contributions, OS marketing) etc etc.
Re:The future (Score:3, Insightful)
As are many others here! Let's hope that IBM's contribution helps get that ball rolling. It takes money to mount enough of a challenge to get SCO's case pitched into the circular file, hopefully with prejudice.
I notice that a lot of folks are questioning IBM's ultimate motive here. Of course, their motive is to make money & defend their interests. But until SCO's spurious claims are properly squashed, nobo
But (Score:5, Insightful)
--rhad
Re:But (Score:2)
linux. (Score:2, Insightful)
This sends a loud and clear message (Score:4, Insightful)
And I for one welcome our new lawyer overlords.
Say, remember when the Romano-British employed one lot of maurading Saxons to protect them from another lot of maurading Saxons? How did that turn out? As I remember, the Saxons won by default... and then decided to pay one lot of maurading Vikings to protect them from another lot of maurading Vikings...
Tort. Reform. Now.
Re:This sends a loud and clear message (Score:5, Funny)
Say, remember when the Romano-British employed one lot of maurading Saxons to protect them from another lot of maurading Saxons?
I would say you're showing your age there. :P
Ah, those were the days. The sight of a circle of Norsemen huddled around a fire, reciting their ancient sagas... imagine a Beowulf clu... oh, wait.
What do you mean, Off Topic? C'mon, it's more fun than bitching about SCO!
bad (Score:3, Interesting)
I guess this means indemnification (Score:5, Interesting)
This begs a couple thoughts/questions though.
First, $10M US is not that big a pinch really. IBM could throw that kind of cash around without even a blink (kinda like MS throwing $6M to SCO for a "License",) so $10M really shouldn't be too hard to come up with.
In fact, I would like to see a list of people who are contributing to this, and would like to see some big names on that list (hello Red Hat!)
Also, this would be an EXCELLENT time for Novell to step up and put their money where their acquisition is, and back their SuSE purchase by getting in on this as well.
And someone earlier made an excellent comment: where can someone in the general OSS community donate to such a fund? I mean, its one thing for "We the People" to piss and moan about SCO, and then rely on major corps to handle the legal stuff for us (Which is fine for now, but with the way SCO has acted over the last few months, who knows WHO they are gonna sue next), but it would be a much better show of solidarity if we also contributed to this fund, or sone like it, above and beyond the usual contributions to groups like EFF and such.
SCO no longer shows up in Google searches (Score:2, Interesting)
Is the humour lost on everyone?
Re:SCO no longer shows up in Google searches (Score:2, Informative)
Why did this get modded interesting?
Comment removed (Score:4, Interesting)
Hopefully.. (Score:3, Interesting)
Part of a legal strategy, not just being generous (Score:5, Insightful)
It's brilliant (Score:5, Interesting)
IBM comes off looking like a hero, combined with the Linux commercials all over TV this weekend and it's a huge PR win. I'm not easily impressed but this was brilliantly conceived, timing and execution nearly flawless.
With everything else they've done so well one would have to believe that somewhere inside the folds of the cape there is a sword ready to strike the killing blow.
Look at their stock! (Score:3, Interesting)
http://finance.yahoo.com/q/bc?s=SCOX&t=5d&l=on&
SCOX is on a steady downhill slide. Bye Bye Darl!
SCOX dropping like a rock (Score:3, Insightful)
As of this writing:
Last 15.95
Change(%) -1.15 (-6.73%)
High 17.18
Low 15.77
Volume 216,036
It doesn't even bear predicting (because it's a sure thing) that Darl will vomit forth more bombastic FUD today or tomorrow in response to this.
SCOX stock is the only currency they have. They pay their lawyers in it. If it collapses, they are done.
But, their bubble can't have much longer to run though... For all the threats, intimidation, spin, etc, SCaldera has YET to take any action on their copyright claims...
Sooner or later, the Emperor will be exposed for the streaker he is.
Smart move (Score:3, Interesting)
A US-only problem (Score:3, Interesting)
Why can't the US repair it's legal system so as to do what happened in for exemple Germany and Poland where the courts told SCO to "Put up or Shut up", i.e. shut up untill you SHOW the problem.
Regretfully the present situation reflects baldly not only on the flawed US legal system but on a once great nation (and people!) as a whole.
Re:Produced any evidence yet ? (Score:2, Funny)
Re:Produced any evidence yet ? (Score:5, Interesting)
It may just be evidence they give to IBM so that they can then look at the code themselves, in which case we don't get to find out anything yet, but they may also submit evidence to the court, in which case we do get to find out today or soon after
Re:In other news: MS set up SCO defense fund ... (Score:3, Interesting)