Fighting TSA Harassment of Disabled Travelers 525
An anonymous reader writes "A man with a neurological disorder is currently pushing the TSA to release a full list of its policies and procedures after a series of incidents in which he was harassed while trying to fly. His condition requires medical liquids and causes episodic muteness, and the TSA makes his encounters very difficult. From January: 'Boston Logan TSA conducted an illegal search of my xray-cleared documents (probably motivated either by my opting out or by my use of sign language to communicate). They refused to give me access to the pen and paper that I needed to communicate. Eventually they gave it to me, but then they took it away in direct retaliation for my using it to quote US v Davis and protest their illegal search (thereby literally depriving me of speech). They illegally detained me for about an hour on spurious, law enforcement motivated grounds (illegal under Davis, Aukai, Fofana, Bierfeldt, etc). ... TSA has refused to comply with the ADA grievance process; they are over a month beyond the statutory mandate for issuing a written determination.'"
An important lesson (Score:3, Interesting)
The importance of stories such as these, are that they open peoples eyes to a fundamental truth: The protections you think you have as an American, are only in force so long as it is convenient to those who are in power. In reality, we live in a state every bit as totalitarian as the USSR or North Korea...only that totalitarianism is selectively, and irratically enforced.
Re:My answer (Score:3, Interesting)
Same here - my family actually used to own property in the US but we all sold up and left due to the actions and policies of the TSA and DHS.
One thing though: I find it very tricky to search for flights between Europe and America while excluding all hits that require a transfer in the US. Currently, I have to do it "old-school" (ie: visit a human travel agent who does the search for me) but it would be a lot easier if there was a search engine that allowed this kind of filtering.
Does anyone know of a flight search engine that allows you to do this ?
Re:My answer (Score:5, Interesting)
I totally agree. The TSA consists of a bunch of mindless idiots following stupid rules. There is nothing that those TSA idiots did that ever stopped a terrorist attack. The only thing the TSA is good for is wasting money and pissing of Americans and foreigners.
Wrong.
The modern TSA is a way to legally funnel government funds to contractors in the United States.
In addition, it gives the airlines and government a shield in case anything DOES happen. "Well, we at least TRIED to stop it."
The combination of the two means that it will never stop, and it will never get better.
Re:My answer (Score:4, Interesting)
Indeed a friend of mine traveling from NL to Mexico with transfer in US was asked to produce transit visa in US (this was in 1998 I believe so even before TSA). He is Polish so the traditional friendship between the great nations of Poland and US cost him hours of stress and missed flight to Mexico. He also needed to buy a new ticket to Mexico and arrange for a new no-US transfer flight back to Europe because he was put on some sort of special list for terrorists and other persona non grata. This was as said before TSA and I see the situation 'improved' a lot since then.
Not sure what does it do except proves that US authorities behave like assholes towards anybody because they can - it certainly does not improve security. I guess US is a federation i.e. there are really progressive states nice to visit and maybe even work but I would never know because at this time even if I personally do not have to have a visa to travel there I would only go if they really pay well say with the rates used when you travel to war zone which is unlikely. Even if they paid well I would consider twice before going. I am considered conservative and pro-US by majority of my friends so go figure.
It's the TSA. (Score:3, Interesting)
What do you expect from the Terrorist State Agency?
9/11 was the final battle against the terrorists. The terrorists won.
Re:Yawn (Score:5, Interesting)
I'm normally not one for coarse language and insults, but, given that the atypical neurogenic tic disorder that the individual suffers from can lead to both life-threatening asphyxia and tachycardia, I would have to say that you are a massively apathetic twat. I hope that you never become afflicted by any debilitating condition, let alone wind up in a similar situation and encounter someone insouciant who denies you access to medicine or necessary sustenance, as I doubt you'd have the fortitude to stand up to your ilk.
Fortunately, your pococurante attitude served some purpose beyond broadcasting your own inadequacies: it spurred me to pledge several thousand dollars for this guy's legal fund.
Re:My answer (Score:5, Interesting)
I did travel to the USA last year and experienced no unfriendliness by TSA officers. Near the end of my trip my visa was extended without hassle so I could complete medical treatment after I had an emergency hospital visit. I was quite impressed and pleased with the US authorities really.
Regardless, do you really make a trip decision based on the few minutes of interaction you may have with the border authorities? I've been traveling extensively the last 7 years and most problems I encounter occur once I'm inside the country, not at the border. I'd rather have someone ask me the purpose of my visit and send me on my way than deal with hotel staff about a broken airco or having to return a rental because they gave me a car where one of the tires needs inflating every 3 days.
Re:My answer (Score:4, Interesting)
Try Schiphol, Amsterdam. I found leaving Amsterdam much more tedious than leaving Dallas (both recent flights.) Same silly body scanners and security procedures but in Dallas I didn't have to wait and staff was reasonably friendly while in Amsterdam the lines were long and staff arrogant. They actually called a little girl stupid for forgetting to remove her water bottle.
More to the point: how can you know the TSA is so horrible if you didn't go there for a decade? I don't want to defend the TSA, I'm sure incidents happen and some airports in the US suck, but I get the feeling most people at many airports experience no real issues.
Finally, I do totally agree with regards to Asian airports. People still treat you like the well paying customer that you are instead of cattle that needs processing. Very refreshing.
Re:My answer (Score:5, Interesting)
You had a good experience. Either that, or you're more tolerant of invasive scanning, searching, and questioning.
I'm terribly intolerant of being questioned, felt up, irradiated, or justifying my presence and/or my travel plans. Meeting just one asshole who thinks it his right to grope me, or to push me around, or even to be overly disrespectful could cost much, much more than the trip is worth.
I've not flown since before 9/11/01, and probably won't again.
Re:My answer (Score:4, Interesting)
The exact same thing happened to me, just replace Poland with Croatia, Mexico with Finland and USA with Belgium. The asshole border police at the Bruxelles airport let me fly to Finland finally, but admonished me that "I am not allowed to come to Belgium for the next 10 years". This was 15 years ago and I now have a Finnish citizenship and have traveled all around the world, visited four different continents. But funnily enough, by pure chance I never went to Belgium again. Maybe it wasn't chance, maybe the bad experience made me put Belgium in the "fuck that country"-category.
Re:My answer (Score:2, Interesting)
I had a very bad experience a couple of years back. I went to the US and on the way out the airline did not pull the green card that they
staple to the passport. I did not think anything of it. When back a couple of months later (flying into LA). They pulled me out and said
that the fact that the paper was still in my passport was proof that I had left the country without using an official exit and that I would have to
prove that I had left the country in time. It took a monstrous amount of paperwork over a year to get back to normal status- copies of
paychecks, proof that I gave my classes back in Europe. Major headache due to a mess by the airline.
Re:My answer (Score:0, Interesting)
Tel Aviv is also quite creative ... but to be honest although the process is extensive, long and obviously boring it always felt more or less reasonable
I think the main reason being that on one hand the agents really feel they are personally responsible for the security of their country
and on the other hand seem to have enough autonomy to be able to use their brain.
For example, once I was detained, looking nervous, haggard, sweating a lot, in short looking very suspicious, but when I explained the agent that I just ran all the lengh of the aeroport with a heavy carry along bag because my flight had be rescheduled, and was worrying that I would miss it because I was expected at an important business meeting in two hour after my landing... he said: yep that seems coherent: have a nice flight and let me through, even assisted me to jump part of the line to make sure I would be in time for boarding...
Re:My answer (Score:5, Interesting)
I'm an Arab professor. I look like an Arab and have an accent. I travel to the US all the time. Aside from my experiences in 2002, I have never had a problem getting into the US for conferences. The TSA/border control people are always very nice and polite. Maybe I've been lucky.
Re:My answer (Score:5, Interesting)
I love visiting the US, but almost every time I've been put off by the unpleasant and agressive attitude of the people on the immigration desk. In my view they're much worse than the TSA on departure.
I'll put up with being photographed and fingerprinted (though I think it's downright daft), but my experience at immigration last time just took the piss.
I had made some trivial omission on my visa waiver form — I probably forgot to tick the box to say that I wasn't a spy, saboteur or Nazi war criminal (yes, this tick box really exists) — and I amended the form right there in two seconds, but the officious drone showed great pleasure in sending me to the back of the long queue like a naughty schoolboy.
Then when I got to the front of the queue again — this time to a different drone — I was accused of "abusing the visa waiver" because I had the temerity to visit the US twice in one year (once to San Francisco, that time to NYC, both fairly long visits). It was insinuated that I wasn't welcome back for some — unspecified — period of time. The visa waiver FAQ specifically states that there are no limits to the number of visits in any given period of time.
I guess the government is only interested in promoting tourism when it means handing out billions of dollars to the airlines.
I decided at the time that I would never go back to the US, but time heals all wounds and I'm starting to think I can put up with the necessary humiliation again.
As absolutely everybody else I've met in person in the US has been smart, funny and friendly I can only assume that all your assholes work in airports.
Re:TSA (Score:4, Interesting)
Yes, the Cover Your Ass reaction. I see the exact same thing in school discipline cases; everyone needs, as their highest priority, to CYA. We live in a blame-oriented society; there are no accidents, there are no mistakes, someone has to be punished for every negative outcome. Zero tolerance. Our legal system has made us like this. Every TSA agent or school principal who irrationally hassles someone, starts doing that so they're not the one who Let Something Bad Happen.
Of course many people, who've already been made to feel powerless in their own lives, discover this authority allowing them push people around feels good. So they do more of it...
Re:My answer (Score:5, Interesting)
HERE! HERE!! I was gonna mod you up but I decided to comment instead...
I disapprove of everything the TSA does. What they seem to do, more than anything, is to indoctrinate people into being docile toward people in uniform. I'm not a docile individual. Security theater is revolting, and I refuse to participate in any way.
ANYbody who puts up with being groped by the TSA is either a sheep, or is so desperate to get somewhere in a hurry that they ignore the fact that an abortion like the TSA (or the IRS also, for that matter) has NO business in an .. allegedly free .. country like the United States. The tactics these organizations (and MANY others in todays "government") use have NO basis in the Constitution and are sickening to anyone who loves this country and detests where it is headed.. I'm a 63 y/o Vietnam veteran and the last time I flew was in Sept 2003, and based on that experience, I've clearly concluded I'm done with flying on commercial airlines.. My experience was, admittedly, not as bad as the horror stories I've read since then, but it was enough to show me that I'm not going to tolerate ANY abuse from people who have no business in a police-like uniforn, and rather should be peddling hamburgers at McDonalds.. Everytime I hear of someone standing up to these thugs, I feel there may still be *some* hope for America.
Runaway1956, I salute you!!!
Re:An important lesson (Score:2, Interesting)
Oh fucking please.
Oh! Oh! Oh! Yessss!!! fucking please.
Re:My answer (Score:5, Interesting)
I was offered a job in Philadelphia. I turned it down. I also try not to submit to conferences in the US.
I have a common name. There have been several people with my name over the last fifteen years that the US would like to chat with, but the current one seems particularly scary. Generally my crossing the US border goes like this:
Customs: Where are you going? What are you going to do there? Oh shit! You, over there!
After that I usually get interviewed for an hour or so and then they let me go. That applies to transits through the US too, so I have to be careful when booking connecting flights.
Once recently I was driving across the border and ended up getting handcuffed on the hood of my car with thirteen freaked out border guards pointing their guns at me. Then I was hauled off to an isolation cell (left in handcuffs, handcuffs cuffed to the bench). After about half an hour a border guard walked in, said "you aren't black, are you?" and after fingerprinting let me go.
The TSA themselves are pussycats. They seem to be limited to hand searching my bags and I (up to five separate times before boarding a flight).
Yes, I have lots of redress numbers. One customs agent actually read my whole file once and remarked on it. Then said they were still going to want to see me in the special room anyway (she didn't bother to escort me there).
I try not to go to the US, unless I'm with someone I want to scare the hell out of.
Re:My answer (Score:5, Interesting)
Where the hell were you from 2003-2009?
Re:It's not Harassment (Score:4, Interesting)
You left out the part where he quoted the TSA's own policy (that any amount of liquid for a medical condition is allowed once it has been screened), and that he had it screened.
He doesn't expect anyone to "get by" by saying "I need my juice, for medical reasons, I'm not
going to tell you more." - He expects that the TSA will follow its own written and well documented procedure, and the previously determined rulings of the courts over what the TSA is expected to do. They have the means to screen the liquid, and their policy allows an unlimited quantity of it to be taken on board.
In other words, he wants them to follow the law as it is written. They did not do this.
Try reading the article, and also maybe the summary too. I find it helps when commenting on the story so you don't look like a moron.
Re:OP here. (Score:3, Interesting)
Good luck with your FOIA. I have a TSA issued TWIC card and just for fun I decided to get access to the information they have on file related to that card (finger prints, background check results, etc.) by issuing a FOIA request. It took them 11 months to produce a laughably incomplete response which consisted of: a scan of my passport photo and a photocopy of the standard application for the TWIC. The appeal process took about another 4 months but I did eventually get (mostly) what I was looking for.
Your request is considerably more complicated than mine was. Good luck!