Judge Says You Can't Know If Google Spies For NSA 197
witherstaff writes "A federal judge has ordered that whether Google is spying for the National Security Agency or not, you have no right to know. EPIC, which brought the lawsuit, says the NSA can neither confirm nor deny any relationship with Google. EPIC is worried the 'NSA is developing technical standards that would enable greater surveillance of Internet users.'"
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Re:Misleading (Score:5, Insightful)
I interpreted the grandparent post as meaning that there is a distinction to be drawn between what information we, in principle, should have access to, versus the actual state of what we do have access to. In other words, we do have an intrinsic right to know--it is simply that this right is not recognized by the government.
Not all "rights" are those that are defined and granted by law. The US Constitution attempts to be as broad as possible in codifying certain basic rights, but as we have seen throughout history, that doesn't mean every right we do have is actually allowed to be exercised in practice. That comes down to the subjective interpretations of nine fallible old people, many of whom are beholden to personal biases and political interests. And quite often, the way they rule does in fact deny people of their actual rights on a very fundamental level.
As nice as it may sound to have a state that is of the people, by the people, for the people...that is not what the US actually is, nor has it ever been. The government has always been of itself, by itself, and for itself, and the people are merely a source of money and labor for the powerful to exploit. It's a lie on the same level of communist propaganda. All government exists to rob power from the individual to concentrate it for the few.
Re:Sooooo (Score:3, Insightful)
The NSA doesn't need google to watch all of your internet traffic. They are already on the backbones. Google can certainly add value to the spooks with their search-related technologies but do you really think any US corporation isn't going to role over when the guys-in-black come calling? We allowed the Patriot Act, among other forfeitures of our civil rights, what did you expect?
So, google got big because they did it best. Isn't that what the market is supposed to do? They did it before there were high barriers to entry and when there actually was a little bit of free in that particular marketplace. Even now, when the barriers to entry to search are much higher, they are mostly technical barriers, not ones put up by lobbyists and lawyers. I can live with that. The next search engine should be one that comes up with something fundamentally new, not the one with the best patent portfolio.
What irritates me most is people who are complaining about privacy who won't take any responsibility for protecting it. You can't expect privacy on the internet even if you don't use google. If you want privacy, start using encryption. There are free and open tools for every platform. Worried about traffic analysis? Wow, you must be doing something really interesting with your pron collection but, stil, there are tools for you to use to mask you traffic. Use them.
Use the time spent complaining about your loss of privacy and take it back. Make a personal threat model and respond to it.
Re:The general public might not have the right, (Score:2, Insightful)
if your share is above 50% you cannot only phone and ask him, you can grab his char!
Always depends on the numbers....
You definitely have the right to be informed before the general public about important changes and business decisions for the year.
Why is it confirmed? (Score:5, Insightful)
Isn't it legal speak for "hmmm... but... if we deny this, won't you just keep asking the same thing about all companies until we say that we can't comment?"
Re:But don't worry (Score:5, Insightful)
The race is over. We won!
When I was a teenager, after the wall fell down, a Russian scientist looking to hawk his invention moved in with my family. He was great, and taught me a lot, especially how to drink vodka. But one thing he said will always stick with me - "America and Russia always competed to see who was first. America built first nuclear submarine. Russia build first space rocket. America built first moon rocket. Eventually we had nothing to compete for, so we raced to see who spend money fastest. Russia won!"
Re:They do not need to confirm it (Score:4, Insightful)
Your third-party vote is a wasted vote.
Also, that you ever believed Obama in the first place is funny. The man broke his promises right from the beginning when he didn't use public campaign funds like he said he would, so it was obvious that he was nothing but an empty celebrity politician riding a wave of hype. I'll never understand how former Obama supporters can be surprised about the current state of affairs when it was obvious from the beginning. His policies have damaged the economy so greatly and raised the debt so astronomically that it will take decades to recuperate.
Re:Misleading (Score:5, Insightful)
You can't find out if they won't tell you. There is no difference.
You're buying right into what they're doing. They're skirting around the issue of right to public knowledge by simply not saying anything. "Oh, it's not that you don't have a right to know. We just don't have to tell you when you ask. Therefore, we're not violating your right to know."
That's complete bullshit.
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