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Man Ordered At Gunpoint To Hand Over Phone For Recording Cops 983

Posted by Soulskill
from the don't-shoot-or-we'll-shoot dept.
HungryHobo writes with this excerpt from a story at Pixiq: "Miami Beach police did their best to destroy a citizen video that shows them shooting a man to death in a hail of bullets on Memorial Day. First, police pointed their guns at the man who shot the video, according to a Miami Herald interview with the videographer. Then they ordered the man and his girlfriend out of the car and threw them down to the ground, yelling, 'you want to be f****** paparazzi?' Then they snatched the cell phone from his hand and slammed it to the ground before stomping on it. Then they placed the smashed phone in the videographer's back pocket as he was laying down on the ground."
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Man Ordered At Gunpoint To Hand Over Phone For Recording Cops

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  • by Scareduck (177470) on Saturday June 04, 2011 @05:07PM (#36338374) Homepage Journal
    the cops could have avoided all that trouble [patentlyapple.com], and then it would just be a he-said/she-said scenario. Neat. Clean.
  • Bad cop, no donut (Score:5, Interesting)

    by russotto (537200) on Saturday June 04, 2011 @05:08PM (#36338380) Journal
    By the time our porcine "protectors" figure out that smashing up the instrument rarely destroys the recording, we'll all have real-time internet-connected video cameras.
  • by sethstorm (512897) on Saturday June 04, 2011 @05:15PM (#36338426) Homepage

    If there's enough of the phone to recover images, then the cops have made their situation worse. It looks like that's the case, but it's from an SD card, not a SIM card - given how Sprint's phones work.

    Another point - how about apps that instantly stream to an offsite location? The cops would still be thwarted, and still have to pay.

    Hopefully the cops end up paying tons of cash to replace the phones, along with whatever criminal penalties come from their actions.

  • by Zerth (26112) on Saturday June 04, 2011 @05:16PM (#36338428)

    Record it online, not on your phone. Although I suppose it won't be long before cops carry cell jammers as a regular thing.

  • Re:Ahhh crime. (Score:2, Interesting)

    by Anonymous Coward on Saturday June 04, 2011 @05:18PM (#36338450)

    It's going to continue until people start shooting assholes, regardless if they're cops or not.

    I mean really, how long are thugs allowed to continue their... thuggery, until they get shot?

  • by hduff (570443) <hoytduff&gmail,com> on Saturday June 04, 2011 @05:20PM (#36338458) Homepage Journal

    Another point - how about apps that instantly stream to an offsite location? The cops would still be thwarted, and still have to pay.

    That's how the Camden police thugs got caught.

  • Re:how how? (Score:4, Interesting)

    by jago25_98 (566531) <jago25_98@@@hotmail...com> on Saturday June 04, 2011 @05:23PM (#36338480) Homepage Journal

    I thought this too. Looking into it though, how do we actually do it? The only way I can think of that's convenient on a Symbian phone is stickam, then viewing it on a computer already running somewhere... which isn't great. You want the whole thing to be as quick as pressing one button

  • by brillow (917507) on Saturday June 04, 2011 @05:30PM (#36338530)

    Don't think this couldn't be done optically, or with RFID, or wifi, or NFC.

    The idea itself is powerful, an obvious weakness in a pathetic implementation does not weaken it.

    Of course, this will never happen as long as consumers refuse to buy technology which disobeys them. Oh wait, damn...

  • Lawlessness (Score:5, Interesting)

    by hackus (159037) on Saturday June 04, 2011 @05:37PM (#36338570) Homepage

    Since I was born in this country I have never seen so much lawlessness by financial institutions, politicians and law enforcement.

    If this continues the USA will break up. If the USA becomes politically unstable we could see civil war.

    There are already indications of this as state legislatures ignore their constituents and yield to the criminals in Washington.

    We have states desperate to save the currency Washington is destroying, by declaring new issues of monetary and economic rules in their own states.

    Meanwhile you have Federal powers trying to make it illegal to put anything other than Federal Reserve notes and arresting anyone who dares try.

    A confrontation is coming between those who have looted and stole everything in this country and those who have been stolen from.

    Be sure you pick the correct side when the crap hits the fan, because it is going to get very very ugly.

    -Hack

  • Re:Any laywers here? (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Arker (91948) on Saturday June 04, 2011 @05:59PM (#36338736) Homepage

    It's not legal.

    The problem is that we have a fascist minority in the populace, and a fascist majority in government, who believe that government employees, police in particular, are above the law. For a shockingly high percentage of the population, the whole concept of law and order is absent or incomprehensible, and instant subservience and obedience to the uniform is substituted instead.

    This belief is, unsurprisingly, strongest amongst the police themselves. So they break the law, what are you going to do? Call the police?

    You cant even get a prosecutor to file charges against them with clear proof of the crime. I remember one prosecutor that did try to discharge her duties faithfully by prosecuting a cop, and found herself unable to function in her position at all because the entire damn police force made a point to louse up her cases and refuse to work with her. Every time someone says 'it's just a few bad apples' I have to think back to her. It seems closer to the truth, today, to say as Adam Kokesh recently did "it's a few bad apples that give the other 5% of cops a bad name."

    Now to be fair, police pay is relatively low, and the ability to kill and/or abuse their fellow citizens with impunity is the only clearly exceptional perk they get. Given that, it shouldnt be a surprise that the bad-apples come to outnumber the good ones over time.

    I've known some very good people who were cops - note the past tense. They had a very rough time of it. I also knew a guy that told everyone he was going to join the police so he could kill someone and get away with it when he was in high school. Last I saw him he was wearing a blue uniform and a big smile.

    Getting rid of bad cops is probably going to continue to be an intractable problem until and unless we as a nation realise that police should, yes, be held to very high standards - but they should also be paid commensurately for their services. No, poor pay in no way justifies lawlessness in the uniform - but if the police were actually held to the law, most of them would be in prison in short order and the people that we really want to take their place will be somewhere else, making more money and dealing with less stress.

  • Re:Bad cop, no donut (Score:5, Interesting)

    by s0litaire (1205168) on Saturday June 04, 2011 @06:03PM (#36338758)

    Already here!
    QIK.com
    Online realtime streaming and archiving from your cell/mobile phone.
    Been around for years!
    Had it on my old Nokia N95 worked a treat!!

  • by Professr3 (670356) on Saturday June 04, 2011 @06:09PM (#36338780)
    Regular Joes who carry are actually on average much better shots than the cops. We're also statistically less likely to commit a crime than a police officer, and all the other firearm carriers I've met have a much better understanding of their state laws than the police (at least in the areas of law that have come up during conversations with police).
  • Re:No. (Score:3, Interesting)

    by MagusSlurpy (592575) on Saturday June 04, 2011 @06:46PM (#36338960) Homepage
    I will be very impressed if you can elucidate the "privacy laws" he violated.
  • Re:Ahhh crime. (Score:5, Interesting)

    by cgenman (325138) on Saturday June 04, 2011 @06:47PM (#36338966) Homepage

    Does anyone know of an iphone or android app that automatically uploads video to a remote server while it is being taken? Therefore things like smashing a phone would be useless, as it would already be publicly available.

  • Qik (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Kral_Blbec (1201285) on Saturday June 04, 2011 @07:32PM (#36339198)
    Its events like this that are the reason I have Qik on my phone. I've never used it, but give me 15 seconds to get started and I'll be uploading live video to a remote server. Go ahead and take my phone. Its already in the cloud.
  • Re:Lawlessness (Score:5, Interesting)

    by gehrehmee (16338) on Saturday June 04, 2011 @08:30PM (#36339460) Homepage

    Let's do the math.

    Assume 5% inflation per year.

    Every year, the dollar is worth 95% of what it was worth the previous year. That's 0.95*(value of previous year).

    After 100 years, the value of a dollar is equal to (original price)*0.95^100. 1*0.95^100 = 0.00592052922, or about 0.6% of what it was worth originally.

    It's funny how exponential trends work, and how counterintuitive the results are. But inflation really is the opposite of the classic "double the amount of rice on every square of the chessboard" analogy. Yes, "mild" inflation CAN mean you lose over 99% of your value in 100 years.

  • Re:Ahhh crime. (Score:5, Interesting)

    by Opportunist (166417) on Saturday June 04, 2011 @09:51PM (#36339836)

    The problem is: Where to go?

    That's also the reason why you're still free to go wherever you want. There's nowhere to run. Back when the Soviet Union still existed, the US had to keep up the facade of a liberal, free country where you may be what and how you want to be, where your privacy and your rights are protected by the government and not trampled on. Which of course meant that whoever could rub two brain cells together in the East wanted out, towards the free West. That way, as odd as it may sound, the Soviet Union protected us from our own government. Because the very last thing any country could want is that its best and brightest have nothing in their mind than plotting how to leave.

    What we need today is a US for us. Some place to go to.

  • Re:Any laywers here? (Score:5, Interesting)

    by jaypifer (64463) on Saturday June 04, 2011 @10:26PM (#36339926)

    No, poor pay in no way justifies lawlessness in the uniform - but if the police were actually held to the law, most of them would be in prison in short order and the people that we really want to take their place will be somewhere else, making more money and dealing with less stress.

    Poor pay?? I will never understand why this misconception cannot be stamped out. That concept was true decades ago, but not today. Many Miami Police Beach Patrol Officers make well over $100K [miamibeachexposed.com].

  • Re:Ahhh crime. (Score:5, Interesting)

    by JWSmythe (446288) <.jwsmythe. .at. .jwsmythe.com.> on Sunday June 05, 2011 @12:28AM (#36340438) Homepage Journal

        I'm sure they'll wrap it in a better sounding decision, but essentially, yes.

        The job itself isn't really all that fun. You're dealing with people from the beginning of your shift, to the end of your shift, who all hate you. Everyone from traffic cops writing tickets, to special crime units, their job is to enforce the law, which means someone you encounter is going to get the shit end of the stick.

        I have never heard anyone sincerely say "Well thank you for stopping me officer. I wasn't aware that I was going 5 miles per hour over the speed limit. I really appreciate it that you have given me this $150 reminder to slow down. Have a beautiful day." Nope, it's more like (either verbalized or in your mind) "Fuck you, I wasn't speeding, if I wasn't running late already, I'd back my car over you, but I don't want to have to stop again to wash the blood off."

        And that's the easy shift.

        Try showing up to do a preliminary interview on a murder suspect.

        If they're innocent of the murder, they may cooperate. They may say "fuck you, call my lawyer", or shoot you, because you might find the 100 kilos of heroin in the spare bedroom being sorted and bagged by illegal aliens you had smuggled into the country for just that purpose. But the crime doesn't always resemble the reaction. They may just shoot because there's an outstanding speeding ticket that wasn't ever paid. And, that's just the innocent people.

        If they're guilty, that changes the playing field, sort of. Some think they can talk their way out of anything. Some don't. And when they realize that the conversation is going towards "you have the right to remain silent", out comes Uncle Glock to finish the conversation.

        I, by no means, am implying that any of it is right. Law enforcement, rent a cops, and ... well, whatever the TSA is suppose to be (we are not law enforcement, but we are the government, and you surrendered your rights the moment you thought about buying a plane ticket, you terrorist scum). They all pick and choose the laws the enforce. And frequently enough to make the news every day if you look for it, they just plain make up the laws. Yes, you are allowed to film on a public street. You need model releases if it's for commercial purposes. And no, anyone at any level (outlined at the beginning of this paragraph) cannot just decide "Fuck you, you can't do that. I'm going to smash your shit and arrest you for whatever I feel like, after I get done kicking you and your girlfriend a few dozen times. That'll teach you to talk back to me." Ok, they may not say all those words, but by about the 5th swift kick into your ribs, or trying to kick your head like a soccer ball, the implication is there.

        And no, nothing that we can say or whine about is going to make a bit of difference. There's one route that will change it, and that is significant change. But I am not advocating the change that can be implied, because those who start it will not survive to see the end of it.

  • by hairyfeet (841228) <.bassbeast1968. .at. .gmail.com.> on Sunday June 05, 2011 @03:08AM (#36340918) Journal

    Yes because how dare they bring medical supplies and food to help out them niggers...err I mean Arabs, whom the sky bully says must be kept under boot or else Jebus won't come back, praise Jebus! Funny how the right wing wouldn't care if the Israelis had them an old fashioned lynching party for them poor bastards on the strip as long as there remains a Jew standing there to fulfill that "when the Jews return to Zion" line which IIRC wasn't even in the King James version. Don't you think it is kinda sad that our ME peace policy is based on a line written on a sheepskin by a 1800 year dead goat herder about a 2000+ year dead mystical figure?

    As for TFA, as someone who still has a scar on the back of his head from a cop who said, and I quote "Fucking niggers and God damned hippies, i don't which makes me more sick" I can tell you that most cops I have encountered touring the south has been roid raged bastards going out of their way to start shit.

    I have found for every decent cop you got a half a dozen or more roid raging, crooked, vicious, nasty, all around mean motor scooters. That is what happens when your police for cares more about its code of silence than it does in keeping out the dirty and the mean, but what truly makes them dangerous is they know they can get away with murder and that a good 95%+ of the time the laws simply won't apply to them. I know in my own area they actually got the coroner to testify that two teens that died by being hit by a train had passed out 'due to marijuana intoxication' even though the engineer said repeatedly that the kids were covered by a police tarp BEFORE he hit them and that neither body lying under the tarp so much as twitched even with the horn blowing full blast, and that the same coroner testified a year later a body found under a bridge in the same area belonged to someone who 'committed suicide'. Yeah he beat, shot, stabbed, AND strangled himself before jumping off a bridge in an area where it is pretty common knowledge that most of the cops are running meth.

    So frankly is anyone surprised? When folks take videos of the cops acting like SA what does the prosecutors do? Oh yeah go out of their way to arrest the one who took the pics while the cops get a small suspension WITH pay, if they get anything at all. Funny how some many on the right scream that we are becoming 'socialists' when it actuality we are becoming (I would argue we are already there for the most part) fascist totalitarian.

    But if anyone thinks this is shocking they should watch The Largest Street Gang in America [youtube.com] and see how 'aggressive looking for a fight SA style' intimidation and oppression are the SOP for the blue shirts.

  • Re:What experience? (Score:3, Interesting)

    by swalve (1980968) on Sunday June 05, 2011 @08:16AM (#36342082)
    When the only people you interact with on a daily basis are scumbags and your fellow officers, you are going to start believing that the world only consists of scumbags and police officers. Especially when you are trained to "not get killed" on a constant basis, and your trainers, pals and cop-only internet message boards constantly publish real and phoney stories about any cop in the world that gets killed. When your pals, the media and the law reinforces the idea that your life is worth more than other people's.

    Policing can be dangerous, but it isn't even in the top 10 of dangerous occupations. But, when a logger, truck driver, fisherman, etc., gets killed in the line of duty, you don't see every one of them in the city stuff themselves into their dress uniforms and engage in a mile long funeral procession. Nor do they get to blame scumbags for their loss.

    It is easy to see how it happens.
  • by Ungrounded Lightning (62228) on Sunday June 05, 2011 @10:24AM (#36342738) Journal

    The real trick is to post everything directly to "The Cloud". ... Destroying the device doesn't destroy the data, and you also have a record of the destruction.

    This is what happened at the Democratic Convention protests in Chicago in 1968.

    Chicago was a machine-run city and the police were able to keep pictures of their misdeeds out of the newspapers by seizing and/or smashing the photographers' cameras. In preparation for the convention (and the pre-announced protests) the machine's unions had prevented the stringing of video cabling to likely protest sites.

    But this was the first serious deployment of the "minicam" by the three networks' news operations. It was a massive shoulder-mounted camera, feeding a backpack full of electronics and batteries, radio-linked to a truck full of equipment within a block or two that relayed it to the studio. But it worked. And Chicago was a main switching/mixing/studio center for all three networks' transcontinental feeds.

    So the police, with orders to keep things out of the media, did their standard smash-the-camera number (like they did when the local newsies got ouf-of-line and tried to report on them). And when the police batons smashed a camera lens the image, from the lens' viewpoint, was already out of the camera and into living rooms nationwide.

    With the improvements in video camera technology - first the personal portable video camera, then the inclusion of cameras and video-record functionaltiy in most modern cellphones - the bulk of the population has been in a position to play Chicago News Cameraman. "Who watches the watchmen?" can now be answered "All of us!" Since the Rodney King incident the police have been hunting for ways to suppress this coverage. And this bunch seems to have settled on the pre-minicam Chicago Police approach. In this case the camara man managed to extract and protect the "film". But the real solution is the same as it was in '68: Real time upload to external archive and/or live publication. You hit it dead-on.

    Fortunately the pieces of that are now available as stock products (minor assembly required). Smartphone plus applet for live streaming to archive and/or social-network/video publication. The readers' letters attached to TFA name at least two such applets: QIK (and QIK Plus) and Ustream.

The reason that every major university maintains a department of mathematics is that it's cheaper than institutionalizing all those people.

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